Faith-Based programs (was: RDwoney Jr., GWBush)

[Guest guest]

> > On a separate note, I've notices some unease about Bush and his

> >faith-based programs and I think it deservers a few words: Bush's

> >faith-based programs are an attempt to get the Federal government out

> >of people's private lives. He (rightly) believes that much of what

> >the government does could be done more efficiently and with better

> >resultes, at the private level. I understand many on this list are

> >uneasy with the idea of government working with churches in any way,

> >but I don't see this as an attempt to force Christianity (Or the 12

> >steps) down anyone's throat.

>

> It will be if attendance at these things is made compulsory. The way I

> see it, ppl will be forected to attend these things *or* XA, and they

> will say its ok becasue XA is their as an alternative and " isnt

> religious " . It can only make religious freedom from XA harder to

> achieve imo.

>

---------------------

I agree completely, Pete -- " faith-based " programs should not be getti=

ng ANY government support.

Here is an example of a court-ordered religious " alternative to incarc=

eration " that never should have

been authorized (especially pertinent excerpts snipped below):

http://promotions.nypost.com/01012001/20253.htm

 

'REBORN' EX-JET LET OUT OF JAIL TO TACKLE REHAB

Monday,January 1,2001

By JESSICA GRAHAM

Former Jet star Mark Gastineau says he's a new

man who is " sacking Satan " in a Christian drug

treatment program - but prosecutors and others are

furious that the admitted wife-beater isn't in jail.

It had looked like Gastineau would be locked up

for at least a year.

" I have given you beyond a second and third

chance, " Manhattan Criminal Court Judge A. Kirke

Bartley told the ex-football star when he sentenced

him to an 18-month stay on Rikers Island on Sept. 13.

But 10 days ago, just three months after he was sentenced, the once-re=

vered member of the New York

Sack Exchange was released and installed in a Christ-based, residential dru=

g-treatment program - infuriating those who say the game he plays best has

been avoiding jail time.

In a lounge at Teen Challenge, the Suffolk County rehabilitation cente=

r where he lives with 25 other recovering addicts, Gastineau, 43, told The P=

ost

last week that he's a changed man who has found Jesus.

" When I was sacking the quarterback, I was serving myself, " said the o=

nce-fearsome defensive lineman who still holds the league record for 22 sack=

s in a single season. " Now I'm serving God and I'm sacking Satan.

" I thought that Mark Gastineau was God, for a while, "

he said. " Now I'm learning to put the Lord first, my

wife second and money third. "

In January 1999, a Manhattan Supreme Court

justice sentenced Gastineau to probation and ordered

him to enroll in a domestic-violence counseling

program for the attack on his wife.

Gastineau failed to finish the program and was ordered to serve a 60-d=

ay sentence on weekends. But prosecutors said he failed to show up for many =

of his three-day stints at Rikers.

Another judge then ordered him to spend a year

at the Hope Christian Center in The Bronx - warning

that he'd lock him in jail if he " failed the program

in any respect. "

**********

~Rita

[Guest guest]

interesting how this christian program and AA both have a

mission of serving god, and now making oneself believe they

arent god or in control. why do peopel say aa is relgious agian, i

dunno.

bill wilson (AA):

" Instead of regarding ourselves as intelligent agents,

spearheads of God's ever advancing Creation, we agnostics and

atheists chose to believe that our human intelligence was the

last word, the alpha and the omega, the beginning and end of

all. Rather vain of us, wasn't it? "

Mark Gastineau (Hope Christian Center):

" Now I'm serving God and I'm sacking Satan.

" I thought that Mark Gastineau was God, for a while, "

bill wilson (AA):

We found, too, that we had been worshippers. What a state of

mental goose-flesh that used to bring on! Had we not variously

worshipped people, sentiment, things, money, and ourselves?

Mark Gastineau (Hope Christian Center):

" " Now I'm learning to put the Lord first, my

> wife second and money third. "

[Guest guest]

interesting how this christian program and AA both have a

mission of serving god, and now making oneself believe they

arent god or in control. why do peopel say aa is relgious agian, i

dunno.

bill wilson (AA):

" Instead of regarding ourselves as intelligent agents,

spearheads of God's ever advancing Creation, we agnostics and

atheists chose to believe that our human intelligence was the

last word, the alpha and the omega, the beginning and end of

all. Rather vain of us, wasn't it? "

Mark Gastineau (Hope Christian Center):

" Now I'm serving God and I'm sacking Satan.

" I thought that Mark Gastineau was God, for a while, "

bill wilson (AA):

We found, too, that we had been worshippers. What a state of

mental goose-flesh that used to bring on! Had we not variously

worshipped people, sentiment, things, money, and ourselves?

Mark Gastineau (Hope Christian Center):

" " Now I'm learning to put the Lord first, my

> wife second and money third. "

[Guest guest]

interesting how this christian program and AA both have a

mission of serving god, and now making oneself believe they

arent god or in control. why do peopel say aa is relgious agian, i

dunno.

bill wilson (AA):

" Instead of regarding ourselves as intelligent agents,

spearheads of God's ever advancing Creation, we agnostics and

atheists chose to believe that our human intelligence was the

last word, the alpha and the omega, the beginning and end of

all. Rather vain of us, wasn't it? "

Mark Gastineau (Hope Christian Center):

" Now I'm serving God and I'm sacking Satan.

" I thought that Mark Gastineau was God, for a while, "

bill wilson (AA):

We found, too, that we had been worshippers. What a state of

mental goose-flesh that used to bring on! Had we not variously

worshipped people, sentiment, things, money, and ourselves?

Mark Gastineau (Hope Christian Center):

" " Now I'm learning to put the Lord first, my

> wife second and money third. "