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Re: Paramedic Shortage

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I have to agree on some points

NR is not making it necessarly harder, however is more complicated. It

breaks up the continuiety we have come to expect. It also makes it more

expensive to achieve. It also makes the records keeping more extensive./

As for union? There was a time in this country that unions were absolutely

necessary for labor. The problem is that they now are so large the the cost

to the laborer to keep them is difficult. They have recieved a black eye

from some things that have occured in the past. But mostely the demands are

so high that management will ship jobs over seas rather than pay for them.

I would like to point out that organization is absolutely necessary if we as

a group plan to improve our situation.

It will take organization from the majority of Texas Certified EMS

persosnnel, but we can achieve our goals if we band together and speak with

one loud voice.

Voice of Hope for EMS

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I have to agree on some points

NR is not making it necessarly harder, however is more complicated. It

breaks up the continuiety we have come to expect. It also makes it more

expensive to achieve. It also makes the records keeping more extensive./

As for union? There was a time in this country that unions were absolutely

necessary for labor. The problem is that they now are so large the the cost

to the laborer to keep them is difficult. They have recieved a black eye

from some things that have occured in the past. But mostely the demands are

so high that management will ship jobs over seas rather than pay for them.

I would like to point out that organization is absolutely necessary if we as

a group plan to improve our situation.

It will take organization from the majority of Texas Certified EMS

persosnnel, but we can achieve our goals if we band together and speak with

one loud voice.

Voice of Hope for EMS

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The statement about pay being low because of people who are willing to

" do it for free " is, in my opinion, comparing apples to oranges, and not

really the point. Volunteers, both in EMS and fire service, (such as myself many

years ago in my home town), do it for a sense of community, and other

motivations. The vast majority have another job to support themselves and their

family,

are not the individuals having to deal with the pay issue. These people, by

definition, aren't worried about how much they are getting paid, because, of

course, they are not getting paid.

There are individuals who are working for very low (8-10/hr) wages

right now for some private services and some municipalities. My original point

on

a previous post about the NR being good for pay rates still should hold true.

If there are less people who are paramedic certified, then maybe the

individual medic making the lower rate will see an opportunity to leave for a

higher

rate, or may be able to leverage a higher rate out of their current employer.

It will almost inevitably increase the pay scale if the employers need to

attract paramedic level individuals to hire, and will give incentives to offer

more money per hour so that employer can pick and choose the most qualified of

the applicants. Supply and demand. (Just like OPEC is doing to us right now at

the gas pumps)

Anyway, point is, it really has nothing to do with volunteering, it

has to do with those of us who do it for a living.

Chris

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)

< Anyway, point is, it really has nothing to do with volunteering, it

<has to do with those of us who do it for a living.

Although it's not the point of the entire discussion, it may very well be a

contributing factor.

I'm currently a volunteer paramedic, and have been for almost 20yrs. I have

a master's degree in education, and have taught special ed for many years as

well. To make a long story short.....I love EMS, and I'm good at what I do.

It cant pay me well enough to leave my kids and go off to work....hats off to

those of you who can do it. Education didnt pay very well either, nor does the

fire service(hubby's with a city FD), but many ems salaries are ridiculous.

Even if I managed to find a ft paid position in EMS that paid well, I'd

continue to volunteer within my own community. But, again...to leave my kids

for

24 hrs at a time, for a " pittance " is not worth it.

Kathi

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I live in an area near an all volunteer ems service and the last several day

that is just what happened there was no volunteers to respond and because there

were suppose to be volunteers there were no private services to respond so a

near by area city paid service was asked to respond seems there were no

available units in that city paid or municipal or private to respond I have no

idea what the out come was but let the volunteers worry about it.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Re: Paramedic Shortage

The statements I heard about volunteers was something to the effect

of why pay people to do the job when the volunteers are doing just

fine. Of course this opened up the whole discussion (and joke) about

what if we gave a emergency and nobody came. This was a while back

and I don't remember if it was about the fire dept or EMS.

Again, these were statements I heard and are not my opinion.

> The statement about pay being low because of people who are

willing to

> " do it for free " is, in my opinion, comparing apples to oranges,

and not

> really the point. Volunteers, both in EMS and fire service, (such

as myself many

> years ago in my home town), do it for a sense of community, and

other

> motivations. The vast majority have another job to support

themselves and their family,

> are not the individuals having to deal with the pay issue. These

people, by

> definition, aren't worried about how much they are getting paid,

because, of

> course, they are not getting paid.

> There are individuals who are working for very low (8-10/hr)

wages

> right now for some private services and some municipalities. My

original point on

> a previous post about the NR being good for pay rates still should

hold true.

> If there are less people who are paramedic certified, then maybe

the

> individual medic making the lower rate will see an opportunity to

leave for a higher

> rate, or may be able to leverage a higher rate out of their current

employer.

> It will almost inevitably increase the pay scale if the employers

need to

> attract paramedic level individuals to hire, and will give

incentives to offer

> more money per hour so that employer can pick and choose the most

qualified of

> the applicants. Supply and demand. (Just like OPEC is doing to us

right now at

> the gas pumps)

> Anyway, point is, it really has nothing to do with

volunteering, it

> has to do with those of us who do it for a living.

>

> Chris

>

>

>

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I live in an area near an all volunteer ems service and the last several day

that is just what happened there was no volunteers to respond and because there

were suppose to be volunteers there were no private services to respond so a

near by area city paid service was asked to respond seems there were no

available units in that city paid or municipal or private to respond I have no

idea what the out come was but let the volunteers worry about it.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Re: Paramedic Shortage

The statements I heard about volunteers was something to the effect

of why pay people to do the job when the volunteers are doing just

fine. Of course this opened up the whole discussion (and joke) about

what if we gave a emergency and nobody came. This was a while back

and I don't remember if it was about the fire dept or EMS.

Again, these were statements I heard and are not my opinion.

> The statement about pay being low because of people who are

willing to

> " do it for free " is, in my opinion, comparing apples to oranges,

and not

> really the point. Volunteers, both in EMS and fire service, (such

as myself many

> years ago in my home town), do it for a sense of community, and

other

> motivations. The vast majority have another job to support

themselves and their family,

> are not the individuals having to deal with the pay issue. These

people, by

> definition, aren't worried about how much they are getting paid,

because, of

> course, they are not getting paid.

> There are individuals who are working for very low (8-10/hr)

wages

> right now for some private services and some municipalities. My

original point on

> a previous post about the NR being good for pay rates still should

hold true.

> If there are less people who are paramedic certified, then maybe

the

> individual medic making the lower rate will see an opportunity to

leave for a higher

> rate, or may be able to leverage a higher rate out of their current

employer.

> It will almost inevitably increase the pay scale if the employers

need to

> attract paramedic level individuals to hire, and will give

incentives to offer

> more money per hour so that employer can pick and choose the most

qualified of

> the applicants. Supply and demand. (Just like OPEC is doing to us

right now at

> the gas pumps)

> Anyway, point is, it really has nothing to do with

volunteering, it

> has to do with those of us who do it for a living.

>

> Chris

>

>

>

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I think the point was not to say that the volunteers are doing it for the

wrong reasons or the wrong motivations. I don't think anyone has ever belittled

individuals for being volunteers. Rather, the point is that if you took all of

the EMS volunteers in the state away, that would in fact create the severe

shortage that you speak of. Of course the effect would be that many, many

communities would be left with no ambulance or first responder coverage (which

noone wants to happen, of course). But I think that is the point of the

statement about volunteers. Supply and demand, why buy the cow when you get the

milk for free, etc.

Chambers, LP

Re: Re: Paramedic Shortage

> The statement about pay being low because of people who are

> willing to

> " do it for free " is, in my opinion, comparing apples to oranges,

> and not

> really the point. Volunteers, both in EMS and fire service, (such

> as myself many

> years ago in my home town), do it for a sense of community, and

> other

> motivations. The vast majority have another job to support

> themselves and their family,

> are not the individuals having to deal with the pay issue. These

> people, by

> definition, aren't worried about how much they are getting paid,

> because, of

> course, they are not getting paid.

> There are individuals who are working for very low (8-

> 10/hr) wages

> right now for some private services and some municipalities. My

> original point on

> a previous post about the NR being good for pay rates still should

> hold true.

> If there are less people who are paramedic certified, then maybe

> the

> individual medic making the lower rate will see an opportunity to

> leave for a higher

> rate, or may be able to leverage a higher rate out of their

> current employer.

> It will almost inevitably increase the pay scale if the employers

> need to

> attract paramedic level individuals to hire, and will give

> incentives to offer

> more money per hour so that employer can pick and choose the most

> qualified of

> the applicants. Supply and demand. (Just like OPEC is doing to us

> right now at

> the gas pumps)

> Anyway, point is, it really has nothing to do with

> volunteering, it

> has to do with those of us who do it for a living.

>

> Chris

>

>

>

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  • 7 months later...
Guest guest

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

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Guest guest

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

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Guest guest

There in lies the problem. Most of us are starving our families for a career

that we love so much.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

YOU GOT THAT RIGHT, IF THEY DON'T WATCH IT WILL FIND SOMEONE CHEAPER TO FEEL

THERE SEATS... AND COMPANIES WILL FIND THEM SELVES HIRING CERTIFIED FIRST

AID/CPR PERSONELS AS DRIVERS AND ATTENDANCE......MY FULL-TIME JOB (AS PLANT

PROTECTION,EMS FIREFIGHTER) BELIEVES IN PAYING ME FOR WHAT I AM TRAINED FOR AND

I WORK PART-TIME FOR AN AMBULANCE SERVICE AND IT DOES NOT PAY ANYTHING NEAR WHAT

I MAKE HERE AT MY FULL-TIME JOB, SOMETHING IS WRONG HERE......SO NEEDLESS TO SAY

I WORK EMS ON THE SIDE JUST FOR A HOBBY I GUESS..... I WOULD LOVE TO WORK IT

FULL-TIME BUT MY FAMILY AND I WOULD STARVE TO DEATH..................

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

Re: Paramedic Shortage

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

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Share on other sites

Guest guest

There in lies the problem. Most of us are starving our families for a career

that we love so much.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

YOU GOT THAT RIGHT, IF THEY DON'T WATCH IT WILL FIND SOMEONE CHEAPER TO FEEL

THERE SEATS... AND COMPANIES WILL FIND THEM SELVES HIRING CERTIFIED FIRST

AID/CPR PERSONELS AS DRIVERS AND ATTENDANCE......MY FULL-TIME JOB (AS PLANT

PROTECTION,EMS FIREFIGHTER) BELIEVES IN PAYING ME FOR WHAT I AM TRAINED FOR AND

I WORK PART-TIME FOR AN AMBULANCE SERVICE AND IT DOES NOT PAY ANYTHING NEAR WHAT

I MAKE HERE AT MY FULL-TIME JOB, SOMETHING IS WRONG HERE......SO NEEDLESS TO SAY

I WORK EMS ON THE SIDE JUST FOR A HOBBY I GUESS..... I WOULD LOVE TO WORK IT

FULL-TIME BUT MY FAMILY AND I WOULD STARVE TO DEATH..................

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

Re: Paramedic Shortage

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

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Share on other sites

Guest guest

There in lies the problem. Most of us are starving our families for a career

that we love so much.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

YOU GOT THAT RIGHT, IF THEY DON'T WATCH IT WILL FIND SOMEONE CHEAPER TO FEEL

THERE SEATS... AND COMPANIES WILL FIND THEM SELVES HIRING CERTIFIED FIRST

AID/CPR PERSONELS AS DRIVERS AND ATTENDANCE......MY FULL-TIME JOB (AS PLANT

PROTECTION,EMS FIREFIGHTER) BELIEVES IN PAYING ME FOR WHAT I AM TRAINED FOR AND

I WORK PART-TIME FOR AN AMBULANCE SERVICE AND IT DOES NOT PAY ANYTHING NEAR WHAT

I MAKE HERE AT MY FULL-TIME JOB, SOMETHING IS WRONG HERE......SO NEEDLESS TO SAY

I WORK EMS ON THE SIDE JUST FOR A HOBBY I GUESS..... I WOULD LOVE TO WORK IT

FULL-TIME BUT MY FAMILY AND I WOULD STARVE TO DEATH..................

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

Re: Paramedic Shortage

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

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Guest guest

What they're referring to is the big air traffic controller strike

during the Regan administration. Alot of them were given a choice:

come back to work at a lower rate, or don't work at all, because their

position was going to be filled regardless. Needless to say, alot of

them went back to their original jobs at a substantially lower salary.

-Alfonso R. Ochoa

> AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR

STRESS MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

>

> TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

>

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Guest guest

, I understand where you are coming from. However, have you looked at the

number of paramedics in the state of Texas? Not very many. Even if you add up

all of the medics from ECA to LP.... it still isn't much. Especially when you

think that in houston alone there are over 2 million in population. If the

government or companies think we can be replaced.....I would LOVE to see them

try. Obviously if we have jobs especially in a 911 system, we do have a duty.

One I will not refuse to do. Also, I do recall why I chose this job. However,

the whole world has changed since then. Life has become much more expensive to

live. Our pay has not caught up to the cost of living. Why should medics

have to work 2 or 3 jobs to have enough money to be broke?

I am glad to see this issue finally getting some attention. I had kinda lost

hope for a while.

Steve Gann

McGee wrote:

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

, I understand where you are coming from. However, have you looked at the

number of paramedics in the state of Texas? Not very many. Even if you add up

all of the medics from ECA to LP.... it still isn't much. Especially when you

think that in houston alone there are over 2 million in population. If the

government or companies think we can be replaced.....I would LOVE to see them

try. Obviously if we have jobs especially in a 911 system, we do have a duty.

One I will not refuse to do. Also, I do recall why I chose this job. However,

the whole world has changed since then. Life has become much more expensive to

live. Our pay has not caught up to the cost of living. Why should medics

have to work 2 or 3 jobs to have enough money to be broke?

I am glad to see this issue finally getting some attention. I had kinda lost

hope for a while.

Steve Gann

McGee wrote:

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

, I understand where you are coming from. However, have you looked at the

number of paramedics in the state of Texas? Not very many. Even if you add up

all of the medics from ECA to LP.... it still isn't much. Especially when you

think that in houston alone there are over 2 million in population. If the

government or companies think we can be replaced.....I would LOVE to see them

try. Obviously if we have jobs especially in a 911 system, we do have a duty.

One I will not refuse to do. Also, I do recall why I chose this job. However,

the whole world has changed since then. Life has become much more expensive to

live. Our pay has not caught up to the cost of living. Why should medics

have to work 2 or 3 jobs to have enough money to be broke?

I am glad to see this issue finally getting some attention. I had kinda lost

hope for a while.

Steve Gann

McGee wrote:

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

WELL THATS MAKES SENSE, I HAVE ONLY BEEN A PILOT FOR ABOUT 5 YEARS NOW, AND NOW

YOU MENTIONED THE REAGAN ADMIN, I REMEMBER THAT. THANKS FOR THE GREAT HISTORY

REMINDER

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

Re: Paramedic Shortage

What they're referring to is the big air traffic controller strike

during the Regan administration. Alot of them were given a choice:

come back to work at a lower rate, or don't work at all, because their

position was going to be filled regardless. Needless to say, alot of

them went back to their original jobs at a substantially lower salary.

-Alfonso R. Ochoa

> AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR

STRESS MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

>

> TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

WELL THATS MAKES SENSE, I HAVE ONLY BEEN A PILOT FOR ABOUT 5 YEARS NOW, AND NOW

YOU MENTIONED THE REAGAN ADMIN, I REMEMBER THAT. THANKS FOR THE GREAT HISTORY

REMINDER

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

Re: Paramedic Shortage

What they're referring to is the big air traffic controller strike

during the Regan administration. Alot of them were given a choice:

come back to work at a lower rate, or don't work at all, because their

position was going to be filled regardless. Needless to say, alot of

them went back to their original jobs at a substantially lower salary.

-Alfonso R. Ochoa

> AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR

STRESS MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

>

> TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

WELL THATS MAKES SENSE, I HAVE ONLY BEEN A PILOT FOR ABOUT 5 YEARS NOW, AND NOW

YOU MENTIONED THE REAGAN ADMIN, I REMEMBER THAT. THANKS FOR THE GREAT HISTORY

REMINDER

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

Re: Paramedic Shortage

What they're referring to is the big air traffic controller strike

during the Regan administration. Alot of them were given a choice:

come back to work at a lower rate, or don't work at all, because their

position was going to be filled regardless. Needless to say, alot of

them went back to their original jobs at a substantially lower salary.

-Alfonso R. Ochoa

> AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR

STRESS MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

>

> TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Thank you all for this health exchange, and thanks for the history lesson. I

knew it happened, just couldn't remember when.

I know, like the rest of us, we need to stick togather on this issue. Most

issues in general, but we must on this issue if we are ever to get ahead of the

curve. As a profession, we stick togather and help one another. On the flip

side we should also be responsible for sanctioning or correcting each other when

errors occur.

McGee

Steve Gann wrote:

, I understand where you are coming from. However, have you looked at the

number of paramedics in the state of Texas? Not very many. Even if you add up

all of the medics from ECA to LP.... it still isn't much. Especially when you

think that in houston alone there are over 2 million in population. If the

government or companies think we can be replaced.....I would LOVE to see them

try. Obviously if we have jobs especially in a 911 system, we do have a duty.

One I will not refuse to do. Also, I do recall why I chose this job. However,

the whole world has changed since then. Life has become much more expensive to

live. Our pay has not caught up to the cost of living. Why should medics

have to work 2 or 3 jobs to have enough money to be broke?

I am glad to see this issue finally getting some attention. I had kinda lost

hope for a while.

Steve Gann

McGee wrote:

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Thank you all for this health exchange, and thanks for the history lesson. I

knew it happened, just couldn't remember when.

I know, like the rest of us, we need to stick togather on this issue. Most

issues in general, but we must on this issue if we are ever to get ahead of the

curve. As a profession, we stick togather and help one another. On the flip

side we should also be responsible for sanctioning or correcting each other when

errors occur.

McGee

Steve Gann wrote:

, I understand where you are coming from. However, have you looked at the

number of paramedics in the state of Texas? Not very many. Even if you add up

all of the medics from ECA to LP.... it still isn't much. Especially when you

think that in houston alone there are over 2 million in population. If the

government or companies think we can be replaced.....I would LOVE to see them

try. Obviously if we have jobs especially in a 911 system, we do have a duty.

One I will not refuse to do. Also, I do recall why I chose this job. However,

the whole world has changed since then. Life has become much more expensive to

live. Our pay has not caught up to the cost of living. Why should medics

have to work 2 or 3 jobs to have enough money to be broke?

I am glad to see this issue finally getting some attention. I had kinda lost

hope for a while.

Steve Gann

McGee wrote:

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Thank you all for this health exchange, and thanks for the history lesson. I

knew it happened, just couldn't remember when.

I know, like the rest of us, we need to stick togather on this issue. Most

issues in general, but we must on this issue if we are ever to get ahead of the

curve. As a profession, we stick togather and help one another. On the flip

side we should also be responsible for sanctioning or correcting each other when

errors occur.

McGee

Steve Gann wrote:

, I understand where you are coming from. However, have you looked at the

number of paramedics in the state of Texas? Not very many. Even if you add up

all of the medics from ECA to LP.... it still isn't much. Especially when you

think that in houston alone there are over 2 million in population. If the

government or companies think we can be replaced.....I would LOVE to see them

try. Obviously if we have jobs especially in a 911 system, we do have a duty.

One I will not refuse to do. Also, I do recall why I chose this job. However,

the whole world has changed since then. Life has become much more expensive to

live. Our pay has not caught up to the cost of living. Why should medics

have to work 2 or 3 jobs to have enough money to be broke?

I am glad to see this issue finally getting some attention. I had kinda lost

hope for a while.

Steve Gann

McGee wrote:

Do you remember the strike they were in? Do you remember that the government

ordered them back to work or be replaced and most didn't.

McGee

FIREFIGHTERTWR@... wrote:

AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS WERE EITHER FIRED OR THEY QUIT DUE TO POOR STRESS

MANAGEMENT, WHERE DID THE GOVERNMENT THING COME FROM?

TERRY W.RICHARDSON,FF/EMT/PILOT

"

Re: Paramedic Shortage

Think about what happened to the air traffic controlers, they thought the same

way, and the government proved them wrong and they all ended up out of work.

All I am saying, is let's not try to get rich overnight, but I strongly believe

that we do need to unite (union maybe???) and be all on the same page.

McGee

Brown wrote:

" .............then they(companies and the government) will find someone else

to do it cheaper. "

Who? Hell, there is a shortage now......who are they gonna get for less

money? There aren't THAT many vollies out there.

magnetass sends

Re: Paramedic Shortage

>

> Exactly. Why do plumbers and truck drivers make more then we do? Do they

> go through more training? Do they earn more respect from the general

> public? I think not, and by the way I am not picking on plumbers or truck

> drivers, I was a long haul driver for 6 years, but the answer is that they

> have stuck togather, collectivly and refused to work for less money. But

> remember that is a double-edged sword. If we ask for too much more, then

> they(companies and the government) will find someone else to do it

> cheaper. We need to be united but fair, and remember the REAL reason we

> chose this field in the first place.

>

> McGee

>

> " lwd7734@... " wrote:

>

> Steve,

>

> I agree with you on this issue and we have discussed it many times. One of

> the reasons that Paramedics get paid what we do is because we love what we

> do and we will accept the position at that pay. First everyone needs to

> agree there is a paramedic shortage. I have seen that debated many times.

> Second we need to unite and and make our voices heard. Should we join a

> union? How long will that take to prove that we are a force to be reckoned

> with. I believe that would take many years to accomplish and get

> recognized. There is the IAFF, however, there many goal seems to be taking

> over EMS and minimum staffing on fire engines. Going through my posts, it

> seems that this topic go little attention.

>

> I would like to hear more opinions on this topic because I believe there

> really is a paramadic shortage. With that said, paramedics should be

> commanding better pay.

>

> Larry D.

>

> ___________________________________________________________________

> Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

> Now includes pop-up blocker!

> Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

>

>

>

> ---------------------------------

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Even though I work for I fire department, I feel comfortable saying that there

are many FD's without EMS trying their hardest to get their hands on the

business. They have already proven that they can handle emergencies and they are

already established.

Larry D.

___________________________________________________________________

Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

Now includes pop-up blocker!

Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Even though I work for I fire department, I feel comfortable saying that there

are many FD's without EMS trying their hardest to get their hands on the

business. They have already proven that they can handle emergencies and they are

already established.

Larry D.

___________________________________________________________________

Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

Now includes pop-up blocker!

Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Even though I work for I fire department, I feel comfortable saying that there

are many FD's without EMS trying their hardest to get their hands on the

business. They have already proven that they can handle emergencies and they are

already established.

Larry D.

___________________________________________________________________

Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand.

Now includes pop-up blocker!

Only $14.95/month -visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today!

Link to comment
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