Re: To: Re: AA & Catholicism & religion in general

[Guest guest]

Hello

It's Ray. I wrote a few days ago, telling you about a fundamentalist church

where members testify how Jesus saved them from alcoholism. That was the

Seventh-Day Adventist Church. That church as policy discourages alcohol

consumtion, even ceremonial by those without any drinking problem at all.

They also discourage jewelery and dancing as un-Christian. They are very

hard core. Yet, the churches administrators recognized that the church had

substance problems with it's members, in particular at it's high schools and

colleges just like the rest of the society, and they wanted to do something

about it. They had some Pastors who had prior AA experience and the idea of

bringing AA into the SDA community was born, and then rejected and then

ultimately altered for precisely the same reasons you listed...Jesus saves,

not the doorknob that we choose to call our higher power. , I'm going

to digress and offer the following background on this church as I witnessed

it, as I think you might be interested. If not, just skip it.

Digression

In the SDA church, this sort of problem isn't supposed to exist. When one

chooses Jesus as one's personal savior, earthly passions are supposed to

disappear. So, judgement of addicted members ( " he's not really saved " ), to

community prayer, to unannounced visits to a members home to pray for and

with him to resist Satan, the real source of addiction, which Satan uses to

mock Christ...this is how the church was responding to the substance problem.

A typical adventist family or group will hold hands, bow and say grace

before a meal in a resteurant. They study and attempt to live the bible. In

my opinion and experience and based on an actual give and take I witnessed on

an airplane, I would say a typical adventist teenager has a keener

understanding of the bible than an exceptional Catholic priest. I don't mean

bible thumping, I mean history, study of the authors and the society and

context in which they wrote, connection of passages, use of a concordance

etc. Just over 100 years old, this church has numerous medical schools and

teaching hospitals. In a typical Catholic parish there might be 2 or 3 MD's.

In a typical adventist church (I've seen them all over the country), I'd

guess 20% were physicians, 20% in other health related professions like

dentists or nurses, 20% were teachers in adventist schools, 10% other

scholarly or business persuits, the final 30%, other blue or white collar

labor. With the exception of the final 30%, the choice of profession

(doctor,nurse,teacher) is deeply connected to their religion. Jesus was a

healer and a teacher which is why they become healers and teachers. They

strictly keep the sabbath...not Sunday, but Friday sundown to Saturday

sundown...just like Jews, and for the same biblical reason. They give the

seventh day to the Lord with prayer, meditation, worship, services and

fellowship. They do not come home after services and put on the football

game. They would rather get fired then work on the Sabbath...I witnessed it

several times. Those in the healing professions are allowed to work on the

Sabbath because Jesus healed on the Sabbath. They try not to, but if they

must, many will work and donate their wages for the day to the church. This

is in addition to their tithing (10%) of their income, which as the bible

instructs, they give to the church where it is used primarily for spreading

the word or helping poorer churches, or foreign missions and charities as

opposed to for example, buying a million dollar pipe organ. Because they

believe the body is a temple and a gift, anything that hurts it or

disrespects it is frowned upon. I didn't meet even one adventist smoker,

entire families exercise, vegetarianism is oficially endorsed and widely

practiced and studies have shown adventists to be in general, healthier than

the norm in almost every measure. In general, this is a very Christian

church where Christianity is lived by the members all the time in a

community...it's an all-encompassing experience and

self-identification...just like AA! Yet, they have their

problems..............Digression Ended

The SDA church wanted AA with a Christ focus and a general attack on

addiction that was biblical. There was also the problem of introducing

addiction, AA, what to do, and other modern " concepts " to the churches who,

on this issue , were in the stone age. They formed a group called

Regeneration to accomplish this...it is AA for the Christian...or at least

the adventist Christian. I happen to have the complete Regeneration manual

somewhere. It's probably 15 years old. If you're interested and I could

find it, I'd be glad to send it to you, curious, interested agnostic that you

are. By the way, I have the Franway book and I'm casually reading it. I'll

read your story today.

In my opinion, those stone-age adventists who believe addiction is a sin of

self-indulgence are closer to the truth than the modern disease touting

adventists. May God help them! No matter what AA says of itself...it is a

religion...a bad one and a bogus one...but a religion none-the-less. It is a

lying religion because it asserts that it isn't one. To those who say " it's

spiritual " consider: " God grant me the serenity " or " made a decision to turn

our will and our lives over to the care of God " or " God could and would if he

were sought " or during his drug induced hallucinations, reverend Bill

thought " So this is the God of the Preachers " . If it looks like a duck,

walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...it ain't a car

Regards,

Ray