Re: Dear friends, I need some advice..

[Guest guest]

I know exactly what you mean about this falling to pieces but nobody would

believe me. I can freak out if I feel safe, but when I feel threatened I hide.

After I had my second child and nada was at her worst, acting much like this and

I was in a deep deep depression. I asked my doctor for some medication or

anything to help me. I thought I was maybe suffering from pos partum (now I

realize nada was just really getting to me). The doctor told me you seem very

stable and fine to me.

It wasn't until I was in a clinic at a check up when I got attacked by harassing

phone calls from nada and her lawyers that I had a melt down and got the help I

really needed. I think now it was a blessing in disguises that I was in a " safe

place " when I got the calls and I was able to just melt down completely. I think

the only reason I kept it together so long was the fear.

LB

> > -again, we are used to it, and have the ability to be calm peaceful

(externally) when they are scary and threatening. The police

officer/lawyer/mental health worker looks at you, sees how calm you are, and

intuitively decides nada's behavior couldn't possibly be that bad. SHOW your

fear. SHOW your tears. SHOW how freaked out you are. SHOW them she is

scary--even if you have to fake it!!! If you feel like panicking (or even if

you don't) panic in front of someone. Don't be calm about this anymore. Folks

listen more when you reflect to them how unsafe you are.

>

> Karla, just this one paragraph above is gold to me. I can't begin to tell how

much of a problem my " calm and strong " demeanor has been in getting people to

take seriously that I need help when I do. Even therapists. I can be falling

to pieces, even wanting to die from depression, and yet I can seem calm even as

I tell people. It's very hard to *not* do that. You are right that people

respond to how you seem - much more than the words one says.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I know exactly what you mean about this falling to pieces but nobody would

believe me. I can freak out if I feel safe, but when I feel threatened I hide.

After I had my second child and nada was at her worst, acting much like this and

I was in a deep deep depression. I asked my doctor for some medication or

anything to help me. I thought I was maybe suffering from pos partum (now I

realize nada was just really getting to me). The doctor told me you seem very

stable and fine to me.

It wasn't until I was in a clinic at a check up when I got attacked by harassing

phone calls from nada and her lawyers that I had a melt down and got the help I

really needed. I think now it was a blessing in disguises that I was in a " safe

place " when I got the calls and I was able to just melt down completely. I think

the only reason I kept it together so long was the fear.

LB

> > -again, we are used to it, and have the ability to be calm peaceful

(externally) when they are scary and threatening. The police

officer/lawyer/mental health worker looks at you, sees how calm you are, and

intuitively decides nada's behavior couldn't possibly be that bad. SHOW your

fear. SHOW your tears. SHOW how freaked out you are. SHOW them she is

scary--even if you have to fake it!!! If you feel like panicking (or even if

you don't) panic in front of someone. Don't be calm about this anymore. Folks

listen more when you reflect to them how unsafe you are.

>

> Karla, just this one paragraph above is gold to me. I can't begin to tell how

much of a problem my " calm and strong " demeanor has been in getting people to

take seriously that I need help when I do. Even therapists. I can be falling

to pieces, even wanting to die from depression, and yet I can seem calm even as

I tell people. It's very hard to *not* do that. You are right that people

respond to how you seem - much more than the words one says.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I know exactly what you mean about this falling to pieces but nobody would

believe me. I can freak out if I feel safe, but when I feel threatened I hide.

After I had my second child and nada was at her worst, acting much like this and

I was in a deep deep depression. I asked my doctor for some medication or

anything to help me. I thought I was maybe suffering from pos partum (now I

realize nada was just really getting to me). The doctor told me you seem very

stable and fine to me.

It wasn't until I was in a clinic at a check up when I got attacked by harassing

phone calls from nada and her lawyers that I had a melt down and got the help I

really needed. I think now it was a blessing in disguises that I was in a " safe

place " when I got the calls and I was able to just melt down completely. I think

the only reason I kept it together so long was the fear.

LB

> > -again, we are used to it, and have the ability to be calm peaceful

(externally) when they are scary and threatening. The police

officer/lawyer/mental health worker looks at you, sees how calm you are, and

intuitively decides nada's behavior couldn't possibly be that bad. SHOW your

fear. SHOW your tears. SHOW how freaked out you are. SHOW them she is

scary--even if you have to fake it!!! If you feel like panicking (or even if

you don't) panic in front of someone. Don't be calm about this anymore. Folks

listen more when you reflect to them how unsafe you are.

>

> Karla, just this one paragraph above is gold to me. I can't begin to tell how

much of a problem my " calm and strong " demeanor has been in getting people to

take seriously that I need help when I do. Even therapists. I can be falling

to pieces, even wanting to die from depression, and yet I can seem calm even as

I tell people. It's very hard to *not* do that. You are right that people

respond to how you seem - much more than the words one says.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Wow you are all amazing! Your posts are filled with so much knowledge, wisdom

and compassion. I am so overwhelmed by the time spent responding to this. Thank

you so much!

It's been really hard to process the information I have received from the police

and mental health services the past few days and reading your posts has helped

me to make some more sense of it and plan my course of action. I am going to

make sure I document everything and start by making a police report. It sounds

like I need to build some evidence to make a strong case for a restraining order

if I went down that line.

It is like I have to change my whole make up to deal with this.

Karla was so right about how we are so used to protecting them and making

excuses for them and it is quite challenging to change this mind-set!

Even though I feel like I have recently absolved all feelings of responsibility

for her (no easy feat!) I can still feel my instinct to protect her arises when

I'm trying to decide how to handle recent situations.

Even though I know how absolutely disgusting and unacceptable her behaviour is

and every inch of my being wants her no where near me or my family, I can still

feel myself teetering on the edge of normalising and making excuses for the

behaviour.

(My God, a message has just come through from her as I write this- " No need to

reply, I just knocked on Lynda's door to tell her how much I loved her " ).

I wonder why she is referring to me in the third person?? About 26 of the 30 or

so messages were directed at my partner the other night, because he called her

for the first time, so maybe she's still directing them at him. Who knows!

Scary! I'll try and stay focused....

Also when Karla said:

- " We are SO used to insanity, we reflect to the world: " this is okay, isn't it?

is this behavior bad? " and HOPE the lawyers, police officers, etc. will tell us

it's bad and validate us. YOU need to tell THEM how scary it is and how

dangerous she is.-

That is so spot on!! I can really see the need to " ham it up " . I usually present

quite calmly when talking to doctors etc. Sometimes I get the feeling they just

think I'm a brat who has had a fight with my mother and I am dobbing on her! I

am learning to use very strong, specific language. I think I'm going to need to

throw some theatrics into the mix. I do have a performance degree after all. Ha,

ha!

Well, you lovely people, I'm off to start some serious documenting.

This is so hard and I feel utterly sick about the whole thing, but at least

recent events have given me something concrete to work with.

Unlike most of her crazy making, this is a very black and white and the

extremity of her behaviour has shown me what she is truly capable of- the anger

that she has for me lurking behind the surface.

When I look back on all of our interactions, I can see that even when things are

seemingly normal, I have a scaled down feeling of how I am feeling now. Only

usually the feeling is so enmeshed with guilt, doubting my perceptions etc that

I never really validate it because on the surface when she has made me another

casserole and is giving me a bunch of flowers and asking for a five minute

cuddle, I simply feel like a horrible person for being so annoyed and repulsed

by her, when she is being so nice to me and just wanting my love!!

At least now I can validate my feelings. Her extreme behaviour has allowed me to

validate my feelings and gain some strength and courage to make a strong stand.

I think I will be doing a lot of referring back to these posts in the coming

weeks. Thank you all so much again!

I can't tell you how much all of your support means to me and just how much it

is helping me stay strong and get through this.

Much warmth, peace and blessings to you all.

Lynda

[Guest guest]

Wow you are all amazing! Your posts are filled with so much knowledge, wisdom

and compassion. I am so overwhelmed by the time spent responding to this. Thank

you so much!

It's been really hard to process the information I have received from the police

and mental health services the past few days and reading your posts has helped

me to make some more sense of it and plan my course of action. I am going to

make sure I document everything and start by making a police report. It sounds

like I need to build some evidence to make a strong case for a restraining order

if I went down that line.

It is like I have to change my whole make up to deal with this.

Karla was so right about how we are so used to protecting them and making

excuses for them and it is quite challenging to change this mind-set!

Even though I feel like I have recently absolved all feelings of responsibility

for her (no easy feat!) I can still feel my instinct to protect her arises when

I'm trying to decide how to handle recent situations.

Even though I know how absolutely disgusting and unacceptable her behaviour is

and every inch of my being wants her no where near me or my family, I can still

feel myself teetering on the edge of normalising and making excuses for the

behaviour.

(My God, a message has just come through from her as I write this- " No need to

reply, I just knocked on Lynda's door to tell her how much I loved her " ).

I wonder why she is referring to me in the third person?? About 26 of the 30 or

so messages were directed at my partner the other night, because he called her

for the first time, so maybe she's still directing them at him. Who knows!

Scary! I'll try and stay focused....

Also when Karla said:

- " We are SO used to insanity, we reflect to the world: " this is okay, isn't it?

is this behavior bad? " and HOPE the lawyers, police officers, etc. will tell us

it's bad and validate us. YOU need to tell THEM how scary it is and how

dangerous she is.-

That is so spot on!! I can really see the need to " ham it up " . I usually present

quite calmly when talking to doctors etc. Sometimes I get the feeling they just

think I'm a brat who has had a fight with my mother and I am dobbing on her! I

am learning to use very strong, specific language. I think I'm going to need to

throw some theatrics into the mix. I do have a performance degree after all. Ha,

ha!

Well, you lovely people, I'm off to start some serious documenting.

This is so hard and I feel utterly sick about the whole thing, but at least

recent events have given me something concrete to work with.

Unlike most of her crazy making, this is a very black and white and the

extremity of her behaviour has shown me what she is truly capable of- the anger

that she has for me lurking behind the surface.

When I look back on all of our interactions, I can see that even when things are

seemingly normal, I have a scaled down feeling of how I am feeling now. Only

usually the feeling is so enmeshed with guilt, doubting my perceptions etc that

I never really validate it because on the surface when she has made me another

casserole and is giving me a bunch of flowers and asking for a five minute

cuddle, I simply feel like a horrible person for being so annoyed and repulsed

by her, when she is being so nice to me and just wanting my love!!

At least now I can validate my feelings. Her extreme behaviour has allowed me to

validate my feelings and gain some strength and courage to make a strong stand.

I think I will be doing a lot of referring back to these posts in the coming

weeks. Thank you all so much again!

I can't tell you how much all of your support means to me and just how much it

is helping me stay strong and get through this.

Much warmth, peace and blessings to you all.

Lynda

[Guest guest]

Wow you are all amazing! Your posts are filled with so much knowledge, wisdom

and compassion. I am so overwhelmed by the time spent responding to this. Thank

you so much!

It's been really hard to process the information I have received from the police

and mental health services the past few days and reading your posts has helped

me to make some more sense of it and plan my course of action. I am going to

make sure I document everything and start by making a police report. It sounds

like I need to build some evidence to make a strong case for a restraining order

if I went down that line.

It is like I have to change my whole make up to deal with this.

Karla was so right about how we are so used to protecting them and making

excuses for them and it is quite challenging to change this mind-set!

Even though I feel like I have recently absolved all feelings of responsibility

for her (no easy feat!) I can still feel my instinct to protect her arises when

I'm trying to decide how to handle recent situations.

Even though I know how absolutely disgusting and unacceptable her behaviour is

and every inch of my being wants her no where near me or my family, I can still

feel myself teetering on the edge of normalising and making excuses for the

behaviour.

(My God, a message has just come through from her as I write this- " No need to

reply, I just knocked on Lynda's door to tell her how much I loved her " ).

I wonder why she is referring to me in the third person?? About 26 of the 30 or

so messages were directed at my partner the other night, because he called her

for the first time, so maybe she's still directing them at him. Who knows!

Scary! I'll try and stay focused....

Also when Karla said:

- " We are SO used to insanity, we reflect to the world: " this is okay, isn't it?

is this behavior bad? " and HOPE the lawyers, police officers, etc. will tell us

it's bad and validate us. YOU need to tell THEM how scary it is and how

dangerous she is.-

That is so spot on!! I can really see the need to " ham it up " . I usually present

quite calmly when talking to doctors etc. Sometimes I get the feeling they just

think I'm a brat who has had a fight with my mother and I am dobbing on her! I

am learning to use very strong, specific language. I think I'm going to need to

throw some theatrics into the mix. I do have a performance degree after all. Ha,

ha!

Well, you lovely people, I'm off to start some serious documenting.

This is so hard and I feel utterly sick about the whole thing, but at least

recent events have given me something concrete to work with.

Unlike most of her crazy making, this is a very black and white and the

extremity of her behaviour has shown me what she is truly capable of- the anger

that she has for me lurking behind the surface.

When I look back on all of our interactions, I can see that even when things are

seemingly normal, I have a scaled down feeling of how I am feeling now. Only

usually the feeling is so enmeshed with guilt, doubting my perceptions etc that

I never really validate it because on the surface when she has made me another

casserole and is giving me a bunch of flowers and asking for a five minute

cuddle, I simply feel like a horrible person for being so annoyed and repulsed

by her, when she is being so nice to me and just wanting my love!!

At least now I can validate my feelings. Her extreme behaviour has allowed me to

validate my feelings and gain some strength and courage to make a strong stand.

I think I will be doing a lot of referring back to these posts in the coming

weeks. Thank you all so much again!

I can't tell you how much all of your support means to me and just how much it

is helping me stay strong and get through this.

Much warmth, peace and blessings to you all.

Lynda

[Guest guest]

People tell you it is someone elses problem so they don t have to deal

with it. Getting mental health to intervene is really tough.

Her behavior is absolutely criminal and abusive. You do not need the

police to get a restraining order. Go to whichever court, usually

magistrate court, and file the papers. They will have a hearing.

DOCUMENT DOCUMENT DOCUMENT each and every event. Call the police every

time she comes to your home and does that kind of stuff. Have her

arrested. Press charges. Eventually they will tell you to get a

restraining order.

I assure you, one incident like you described would get you a TRO for 90

days here. Ask for the order. Consult an attorney, not a cop, on how

to get it. When you get it , and she violates it, AND SHE WILL, call

the police. Have her arrested for violating the TRO. Then the judge

will be the one to impose consequences.

Doug

>

> I'll try and summarise this time! Here goes...

> After two months of attempted failed boundary setting and her

eventually telling me she was divorcing me and was glad to be finally

free of me, she messaged me out of the blue last night.

> It wasn't a nice message. Soon after, she knocked on my door. I was

shaky and upset from her message and I didn't answer. A while after she

left I went outside expecting to find a letter. Instead I saw pots

thrown around and ripped out plants strewn across my garden.

> My partner called her to say it wasn't on (first time her has got

involved) She told him to F off in an especially nasty tone and told him

to prove it. She denied it and told him to prove it.She sent about 30

sms messages and left a few messages on my home phone. You can imagine

the nature of these- nasty, cutting, skewed sense of reality, bizarre,

unrelated things brought up from the past. In short, absolutely crazy!

> I phoned a mental health service three times across the course of the

night. They told me they would intervene if she was an immediate threat

to herself or others. I didn't know what to say. A close friend who has

known me forever and has always been an impartial observer with the odd

attack aimed at her was alarmed that her behaviour had changed. The

pattern was the same- the nasty phone calls and messages, but she has

never expressed her anger towards me with a violent act.

> I eventually decided at 1.00 in the morning when the messages were

still happening that perhaps she did pose an immediate threat. This

behaviour was also new. Usually, she would have stopped by that time and

taken herself off to bed. At 1.30, the house phone called and my mobile.

She wasn't happy to be contacted by a mental health service- " You have

no right " " I am being looked after by someone higher than you " ie. God

etc.

> I need to do something about it. I have had enough. I have tried

everything!

> Today I went to the police station about getting a restraining order-

prospect is very confronting- being in a courtroom with her etc. They

told me it would be better to pursue it through a mental health avenue.

I went to a local psychiatrist who informed me it was a legal matter!!

It seems the situation has to be more severe for them to intervene- an

attempted suicide attempt or a direct intention to harm me.

> The nature of the borderline deems it very hard for either the legal

or the mental health systems to deal with. As she has periods of

" normal " behaviour- I can just imagine how cool and calm she was on the

phone when they called her last night- there cannot be any intervention

from the mental health system as she more or less needs to be in a

permanent state of psychosis.

> Similarly, I can't imagine a restraining order working. On the

contrary I can see it triggering her further as she clearly has no sense

of other's boundaries and simply will not leave me alone after many

requests.

> Does anyone have an experience of getting a restraining order or

intervention from the mental health system?

> Does anyone think that this new violent behaviour will be her new

benchmark and that it will escalate from here?

> I have a baby to protect. I am scared and nervous and don't know what

she will do next.

> I really need to act on this to stop her from contacting me.

> Any advice would be much appreciated.

> Exhausted.

> Lynda

>

[Guest guest]

People tell you it is someone elses problem so they don t have to deal

with it. Getting mental health to intervene is really tough.

Her behavior is absolutely criminal and abusive. You do not need the

police to get a restraining order. Go to whichever court, usually

magistrate court, and file the papers. They will have a hearing.

DOCUMENT DOCUMENT DOCUMENT each and every event. Call the police every

time she comes to your home and does that kind of stuff. Have her

arrested. Press charges. Eventually they will tell you to get a

restraining order.

I assure you, one incident like you described would get you a TRO for 90

days here. Ask for the order. Consult an attorney, not a cop, on how

to get it. When you get it , and she violates it, AND SHE WILL, call

the police. Have her arrested for violating the TRO. Then the judge

will be the one to impose consequences.

Doug

>

> I'll try and summarise this time! Here goes...

> After two months of attempted failed boundary setting and her

eventually telling me she was divorcing me and was glad to be finally

free of me, she messaged me out of the blue last night.

> It wasn't a nice message. Soon after, she knocked on my door. I was

shaky and upset from her message and I didn't answer. A while after she

left I went outside expecting to find a letter. Instead I saw pots

thrown around and ripped out plants strewn across my garden.

> My partner called her to say it wasn't on (first time her has got

involved) She told him to F off in an especially nasty tone and told him

to prove it. She denied it and told him to prove it.She sent about 30

sms messages and left a few messages on my home phone. You can imagine

the nature of these- nasty, cutting, skewed sense of reality, bizarre,

unrelated things brought up from the past. In short, absolutely crazy!

> I phoned a mental health service three times across the course of the

night. They told me they would intervene if she was an immediate threat

to herself or others. I didn't know what to say. A close friend who has

known me forever and has always been an impartial observer with the odd

attack aimed at her was alarmed that her behaviour had changed. The

pattern was the same- the nasty phone calls and messages, but she has

never expressed her anger towards me with a violent act.

> I eventually decided at 1.00 in the morning when the messages were

still happening that perhaps she did pose an immediate threat. This

behaviour was also new. Usually, she would have stopped by that time and

taken herself off to bed. At 1.30, the house phone called and my mobile.

She wasn't happy to be contacted by a mental health service- " You have

no right " " I am being looked after by someone higher than you " ie. God

etc.

> I need to do something about it. I have had enough. I have tried

everything!

> Today I went to the police station about getting a restraining order-

prospect is very confronting- being in a courtroom with her etc. They

told me it would be better to pursue it through a mental health avenue.

I went to a local psychiatrist who informed me it was a legal matter!!

It seems the situation has to be more severe for them to intervene- an

attempted suicide attempt or a direct intention to harm me.

> The nature of the borderline deems it very hard for either the legal

or the mental health systems to deal with. As she has periods of

" normal " behaviour- I can just imagine how cool and calm she was on the

phone when they called her last night- there cannot be any intervention

from the mental health system as she more or less needs to be in a

permanent state of psychosis.

> Similarly, I can't imagine a restraining order working. On the

contrary I can see it triggering her further as she clearly has no sense

of other's boundaries and simply will not leave me alone after many

requests.

> Does anyone have an experience of getting a restraining order or

intervention from the mental health system?

> Does anyone think that this new violent behaviour will be her new

benchmark and that it will escalate from here?

> I have a baby to protect. I am scared and nervous and don't know what

she will do next.

> I really need to act on this to stop her from contacting me.

> Any advice would be much appreciated.

> Exhausted.

> Lynda

>

[Guest guest]

People tell you it is someone elses problem so they don t have to deal

with it. Getting mental health to intervene is really tough.

Her behavior is absolutely criminal and abusive. You do not need the

police to get a restraining order. Go to whichever court, usually

magistrate court, and file the papers. They will have a hearing.

DOCUMENT DOCUMENT DOCUMENT each and every event. Call the police every

time she comes to your home and does that kind of stuff. Have her

arrested. Press charges. Eventually they will tell you to get a

restraining order.

I assure you, one incident like you described would get you a TRO for 90

days here. Ask for the order. Consult an attorney, not a cop, on how

to get it. When you get it , and she violates it, AND SHE WILL, call

the police. Have her arrested for violating the TRO. Then the judge

will be the one to impose consequences.

Doug

>

> I'll try and summarise this time! Here goes...

> After two months of attempted failed boundary setting and her

eventually telling me she was divorcing me and was glad to be finally

free of me, she messaged me out of the blue last night.

> It wasn't a nice message. Soon after, she knocked on my door. I was

shaky and upset from her message and I didn't answer. A while after she

left I went outside expecting to find a letter. Instead I saw pots

thrown around and ripped out plants strewn across my garden.

> My partner called her to say it wasn't on (first time her has got

involved) She told him to F off in an especially nasty tone and told him

to prove it. She denied it and told him to prove it.She sent about 30

sms messages and left a few messages on my home phone. You can imagine

the nature of these- nasty, cutting, skewed sense of reality, bizarre,

unrelated things brought up from the past. In short, absolutely crazy!

> I phoned a mental health service three times across the course of the

night. They told me they would intervene if she was an immediate threat

to herself or others. I didn't know what to say. A close friend who has

known me forever and has always been an impartial observer with the odd

attack aimed at her was alarmed that her behaviour had changed. The

pattern was the same- the nasty phone calls and messages, but she has

never expressed her anger towards me with a violent act.

> I eventually decided at 1.00 in the morning when the messages were

still happening that perhaps she did pose an immediate threat. This

behaviour was also new. Usually, she would have stopped by that time and

taken herself off to bed. At 1.30, the house phone called and my mobile.

She wasn't happy to be contacted by a mental health service- " You have

no right " " I am being looked after by someone higher than you " ie. God

etc.

> I need to do something about it. I have had enough. I have tried

everything!

> Today I went to the police station about getting a restraining order-

prospect is very confronting- being in a courtroom with her etc. They

told me it would be better to pursue it through a mental health avenue.

I went to a local psychiatrist who informed me it was a legal matter!!

It seems the situation has to be more severe for them to intervene- an

attempted suicide attempt or a direct intention to harm me.

> The nature of the borderline deems it very hard for either the legal

or the mental health systems to deal with. As she has periods of

" normal " behaviour- I can just imagine how cool and calm she was on the

phone when they called her last night- there cannot be any intervention

from the mental health system as she more or less needs to be in a

permanent state of psychosis.

> Similarly, I can't imagine a restraining order working. On the

contrary I can see it triggering her further as she clearly has no sense

of other's boundaries and simply will not leave me alone after many

requests.

> Does anyone have an experience of getting a restraining order or

intervention from the mental health system?

> Does anyone think that this new violent behaviour will be her new

benchmark and that it will escalate from here?

> I have a baby to protect. I am scared and nervous and don't know what

she will do next.

> I really need to act on this to stop her from contacting me.

> Any advice would be much appreciated.

> Exhausted.

> Lynda

>

[Guest guest]

I can relate to this. I can be outwardly very calm but going to pieces inside.

One time, I was under a lot of stress at work; I was worried about being laid

off, but at the same time I really did NOT get good vibes from the new

management & felt my new boss didn't like me at all. I wanted badly to just

leave but it seemed there was no place for me to go.

Feeling both trapped and persecuted was affecting my health; I wasn't sleeping

well and I felt jittery and shaky. I went to the doctor, who took my blood

pressure and pulse and said I was one step away from having a heart attack or a

stroke. My blood pressure was through the roof and I was having irregular

heartbeats.

I was immediately put on anti-anxiety meds and felt much, much calmer, but like

I was sort of in a diving suit at the bottom of the ocean: everything was slowed

down and took more effort to achieve. Weird!

Thank goodness a job opening that suited me came up in another department in my

division; I got myself transferred over there, and then " magically " I didn't

need the anti-anxiety meds anymore: my blood pressure and heart rate and sleep

patterns returned to normal.

Our psychological state, our mental well-being can really affect our bodies, I

really subscribe to that!

-Annie

> > > -again, we are used to it, and have the ability to be calm peaceful

(externally) when they are scary and threatening. The police

officer/lawyer/mental health worker looks at you, sees how calm you are, and

intuitively decides nada's behavior couldn't possibly be that bad. SHOW your

fear. SHOW your tears. SHOW how freaked out you are. SHOW them she is

scary--even if you have to fake it!!! If you feel like panicking (or even if

you don't) panic in front of someone. Don't be calm about this anymore. Folks

listen more when you reflect to them how unsafe you are.

> >

> > Karla, just this one paragraph above is gold to me. I can't begin to tell

how much of a problem my " calm and strong " demeanor has been in getting people

to take seriously that I need help when I do. Even therapists. I can be

falling to pieces, even wanting to die from depression, and yet I can seem calm

even as I tell people. It's very hard to *not* do that. You are right that

people respond to how you seem - much more than the words one says.

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I can relate to this. I can be outwardly very calm but going to pieces inside.

One time, I was under a lot of stress at work; I was worried about being laid

off, but at the same time I really did NOT get good vibes from the new

management & felt my new boss didn't like me at all. I wanted badly to just

leave but it seemed there was no place for me to go.

Feeling both trapped and persecuted was affecting my health; I wasn't sleeping

well and I felt jittery and shaky. I went to the doctor, who took my blood

pressure and pulse and said I was one step away from having a heart attack or a

stroke. My blood pressure was through the roof and I was having irregular

heartbeats.

I was immediately put on anti-anxiety meds and felt much, much calmer, but like

I was sort of in a diving suit at the bottom of the ocean: everything was slowed

down and took more effort to achieve. Weird!

Thank goodness a job opening that suited me came up in another department in my

division; I got myself transferred over there, and then " magically " I didn't

need the anti-anxiety meds anymore: my blood pressure and heart rate and sleep

patterns returned to normal.

Our psychological state, our mental well-being can really affect our bodies, I

really subscribe to that!

-Annie

> > > -again, we are used to it, and have the ability to be calm peaceful

(externally) when they are scary and threatening. The police

officer/lawyer/mental health worker looks at you, sees how calm you are, and

intuitively decides nada's behavior couldn't possibly be that bad. SHOW your

fear. SHOW your tears. SHOW how freaked out you are. SHOW them she is

scary--even if you have to fake it!!! If you feel like panicking (or even if

you don't) panic in front of someone. Don't be calm about this anymore. Folks

listen more when you reflect to them how unsafe you are.

> >

> > Karla, just this one paragraph above is gold to me. I can't begin to tell

how much of a problem my " calm and strong " demeanor has been in getting people

to take seriously that I need help when I do. Even therapists. I can be

falling to pieces, even wanting to die from depression, and yet I can seem calm

even as I tell people. It's very hard to *not* do that. You are right that

people respond to how you seem - much more than the words one says.

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I can relate to this. I can be outwardly very calm but going to pieces inside.

One time, I was under a lot of stress at work; I was worried about being laid

off, but at the same time I really did NOT get good vibes from the new

management & felt my new boss didn't like me at all. I wanted badly to just

leave but it seemed there was no place for me to go.

Feeling both trapped and persecuted was affecting my health; I wasn't sleeping

well and I felt jittery and shaky. I went to the doctor, who took my blood

pressure and pulse and said I was one step away from having a heart attack or a

stroke. My blood pressure was through the roof and I was having irregular

heartbeats.

I was immediately put on anti-anxiety meds and felt much, much calmer, but like

I was sort of in a diving suit at the bottom of the ocean: everything was slowed

down and took more effort to achieve. Weird!

Thank goodness a job opening that suited me came up in another department in my

division; I got myself transferred over there, and then " magically " I didn't

need the anti-anxiety meds anymore: my blood pressure and heart rate and sleep

patterns returned to normal.

Our psychological state, our mental well-being can really affect our bodies, I

really subscribe to that!

-Annie

> > > -again, we are used to it, and have the ability to be calm peaceful

(externally) when they are scary and threatening. The police

officer/lawyer/mental health worker looks at you, sees how calm you are, and

intuitively decides nada's behavior couldn't possibly be that bad. SHOW your

fear. SHOW your tears. SHOW how freaked out you are. SHOW them she is

scary--even if you have to fake it!!! If you feel like panicking (or even if

you don't) panic in front of someone. Don't be calm about this anymore. Folks

listen more when you reflect to them how unsafe you are.

> >

> > Karla, just this one paragraph above is gold to me. I can't begin to tell

how much of a problem my " calm and strong " demeanor has been in getting people

to take seriously that I need help when I do. Even therapists. I can be

falling to pieces, even wanting to die from depression, and yet I can seem calm

even as I tell people. It's very hard to *not* do that. You are right that

people respond to how you seem - much more than the words one says.

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I agree about the " cycle of domestic violence " similarities. My nada would

alternate (in a kind of " Jekyll and Hyde " way) between being normal and motherly

to me, and then being cruel and abusive, and then nice again. So pretty early

on I began to grasp the concept of what being a " whore " must mean: the idea of

being paid to take abuse. Its as though I was being paid off to quietly accept

it when she decided to tear into me and kick me around and call me vile, hurtful

names. Then, she'd be nice again for a while; I'd get attention and sweetness

from her, then she'd shame, humiliate and degrade me again. Mean/sweet,

mean/sweet, mean/sweet, over and over.

Good training for a child to teach her to take physical and emotional abuse from

a husband, sez I. Maybe that's why I shied away so from the idea of ever

marrying. I didn't want that kind of treatment to continue after I'd left home.

-Annie

> > >

> > > I'll try and summarise this time! Here goes...

> > > After two months of attempted failed boundary setting and her

> > eventually telling me she was divorcing me and was glad to be finally

> > free of me, she messaged me out of the blue last night.

> > > It wasn't a nice message. Soon after, she knocked on my door. I was

> > shaky and upset from her message and I didn't answer. A while after she

> > left I went outside expecting to find a letter. Instead I saw pots

> > thrown around and ripped out plants strewn across my garden.

> > > My partner called her to say it wasn't on (first time her has got

> > involved) She told him to F off in an especially nasty tone and told him

> > to prove it. She denied it and told him to prove it.She sent about 30

> > sms messages and left a few messages on my home phone. You can imagine

> > the nature of these- nasty, cutting, skewed sense of reality, bizarre,

> > unrelated things brought up from the past. In short, absolutely crazy!

> > > I phoned a mental health service three times across the course of the

> > night. They told me they would intervene if she was an immediate threat

> > to herself or others. I didn't know what to say. A close friend who has

> > known me forever and has always been an impartial observer with the odd

> > attack aimed at her was alarmed that her behaviour had changed. The

> > pattern was the same- the nasty phone calls and messages, but she has

> > never expressed her anger towards me with a violent act.

> > > I eventually decided at 1.00 in the morning when the messages were

> > still happening that perhaps she did pose an immediate threat. This

> > behaviour was also new. Usually, she would have stopped by that time and

> > taken herself off to bed. At 1.30, the house phone called and my mobile.

> > She wasn't happy to be contacted by a mental health service- " You have

> > no right " " I am being looked after by someone higher than you " ie. God

> > etc.

> > > I need to do something about it. I have had enough. I have tried

> > everything!

> > > Today I went to the police station about getting a restraining order-

> > prospect is very confronting- being in a courtroom with her etc. They

> > told me it would be better to pursue it through a mental health avenue.

> > I went to a local psychiatrist who informed me it was a legal matter!!

> > It seems the situation has to be more severe for them to intervene- an

> > attempted suicide attempt or a direct intention to harm me.

> > > The nature of the borderline deems it very hard for either the legal

> > or the mental health systems to deal with. As she has periods of

> > " normal " behaviour- I can just imagine how cool and calm she was on the

> > phone when they called her last night- there cannot be any intervention

> > from the mental health system as she more or less needs to be in a

> > permanent state of psychosis.

> > > Similarly, I can't imagine a restraining order working. On the

> > contrary I can see it triggering her further as she clearly has no sense

> > of other's boundaries and simply will not leave me alone after many

> > requests.

> > > Does anyone have an experience of getting a restraining order or

> > intervention from the mental health system?

> > > Does anyone think that this new violent behaviour will be her new

> > benchmark and that it will escalate from here?

> > > I have a baby to protect. I am scared and nervous and don't know what

> > she will do next.

> > > I really need to act on this to stop her from contacting me.

> > > Any advice would be much appreciated.

> > > Exhausted.

> > > Lynda

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

you actually can give her a no trespass order without police there, I have done

so with the ex of an ex who was doing drive-bys on my road and had shown up at

my work and was acting in general crazy. This was in the U.S., in my state you

have to write a letter saying 'you are not welcome at this address', and have it

registered, as soon as she receives it she is on tresspass notice and if she

shows up on your property she can be arrested, I highly recommend this, it

worked very well in my case (which is wholly different) but something about the

scent of handcuffs really quieted down the whole affair. She continued to act

the fool with regards to the ex but she never came near me, my residence, my

work, or called my phone again after that.

>

> Legal would be the better route. Document as much evidence as you can.

> Some ideas hubby has given me:

>

>

> - We are purchasing wireless web cams(you can get wired ones but would be

> harder to install) and placing them around the outside of the house. If

she

> shows up acting crazy or damages anything we will have it on video to

> prosecute.

> - If you call the police as soon as she arrives they may get there before

> she leaves. If you make it clear that she is not welcome on your property

> they can give her a no trespassing order. If she comes onto your property

> again she can be arrested. Not as strong as a restraining order but still

> good.

> - Since she is family you can try to report any incidents as domestic

> violence. Most places now have laws that someone always gets arrested, at

> least for the night, in domestic violence situations.

> - As stated before, if all else fails, you may have to consider moving.

>

> I can only imagine how hard this is. It has been years since nada showed up

> at my door uninvited and acted up. Now she is escalating and we are just

> waiting...

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

you actually can give her a no trespass order without police there, I have done

so with the ex of an ex who was doing drive-bys on my road and had shown up at

my work and was acting in general crazy. This was in the U.S., in my state you

have to write a letter saying 'you are not welcome at this address', and have it

registered, as soon as she receives it she is on tresspass notice and if she

shows up on your property she can be arrested, I highly recommend this, it

worked very well in my case (which is wholly different) but something about the

scent of handcuffs really quieted down the whole affair. She continued to act

the fool with regards to the ex but she never came near me, my residence, my

work, or called my phone again after that.

>

> Legal would be the better route. Document as much evidence as you can.

> Some ideas hubby has given me:

>

>

> - We are purchasing wireless web cams(you can get wired ones but would be

> harder to install) and placing them around the outside of the house. If

she

> shows up acting crazy or damages anything we will have it on video to

> prosecute.

> - If you call the police as soon as she arrives they may get there before

> she leaves. If you make it clear that she is not welcome on your property

> they can give her a no trespassing order. If she comes onto your property

> again she can be arrested. Not as strong as a restraining order but still

> good.

> - Since she is family you can try to report any incidents as domestic

> violence. Most places now have laws that someone always gets arrested, at

> least for the night, in domestic violence situations.

> - As stated before, if all else fails, you may have to consider moving.

>

> I can only imagine how hard this is. It has been years since nada showed up

> at my door uninvited and acted up. Now she is escalating and we are just

> waiting...

>

>

>

>

>