Re: Re: nada wants to visit but too sick

August 23, 2010

,

Besides the casino visits (as long as she practically has a nurse to take

care of her) amazing me but, that she has managed to get the doctor's office

to come out to her car to give her her shot, is just remarkable to me. It

seems there is nothing she can't get people to do for her. She apparently

just calls when she gets there and they come out to give her her shot. Talk

about being the queen!

MY

On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 1:21 PM, shirleyspawn wrote:

>

> My - Take the boys camping on their birthday weekend. You can rent or

> borrow the equipment and go to a state park where they have all the

> amenities. Some parks even have cabins you can rent, if you don't want to

> fool with the tent. Then call Nada and announce your plans, and say NOTHING

> about her not coming. The boys will enjoy it (assuming they're older than

> 2), and there's no way Nada is going to huff and puff her way up a trail.

>

> We've done a lot of camping over the years (not just as a way to avoid my

> mother - we actually enjoy it) - and my mom used to talk about coming with

> us, renting a Winnebago, etc. It never came to anything. Too much work for

> her, when it comes down to it. If she can't come to my house, demand that I

> wait on her, then complain about everything, it's no fun for her.

>

> By the way - the line about your mom going to the casino struck me funny.

> She's so pitiful she can't leave the house - EXCEPT to go to the casino! And

> I'm assuming that's not a no-smoking zone, right? So her breathing problems

> don't stop her from sitting in a smoky giant bar for hours at a time - but

> they give her a good topic to use in dominating the conversation and

> dictating the terms of her visits. Give me a break, Nada!

>

> > >

> > > My nada usually comes to our house for a weekend for our kids

> birthdays. Her

> > > health has really deteriorated this year and I have been assuming she

> would

> > > not be able to travel to our home for the birthday's this fall. We live

> 300

> > > miles away and she usually takes the train, but the last time we saw

> her in

> > > the summer she could barely walk a few steps without gasping for breath

> > > (some of which I think was real and some of it faked or at least

> exagerated

> > > and she says she currently spends most of her time sleeping. Even when

> she

> > > was doing better healthwise a trip to our house was fairly exhausting

> for

> > > her. - just trying to climb the stairs in our house is significant for

> her.

> > >

> > > Since my kids have been asking if she is coming I thought I would at

> least

> > > have it out in the open so I said to her. " The boys asked me if you

> would be

> > > coming for their birthday, but I am assuming that would be way to big

> of a

> > > trip for you right now. " She surprised me by saying she is thinking

> about

> > > coming!

> > >

> > > This was after she told me about how she had one of her gasping/can't

> breath

> > > episodes trying to walk into a doctor's office that they now come out

> to her

> > > car to give her her shot. And that she won't go to the casino without

> one

> > > particular friend (although others are able/willing to go with her)

> because

> > > this friend takes such good care of her and is like a nurse with her.

> > >

> > > So, no surprise nada has no grip on reality that she actually is not

> well

> > > enough to make a trip like this. I tried to diplomatically talk her out

> of

> > > it and encouraged her to talk to her doctor. She ended up just saying

> she

> > > will think about it and that she would really like to get out of the

> house

> > > (she has not been going much of anywhere because of her health - which

> > > actually is unlike her - she is very, very social and extroverted).

> Well,

> > > for goodness sake, mom, get out of the house by going out to lunch, to

> the

> > > movies, etc. rather than trying to take a 300 mile trip.

> > >

> > > I am reminded that nada is essentially a child in an adult's body and

> is not

> > > capable of making a reasonable decision in this case - more likely a

> selfish

> > > and foolish decision that will have a huge impact on us and likely on

> > > whoever is on the train with her. I really don't want to have the

> stress of

> > > hoping she is not going to have a medical emergency while she is here

> nor

> > > the likely fact that she will require or at least want an enormous

> amount of

> > > care and attention.

> > >

> > > I've been trying to think of a way to tell her she simply can not come

> -

> > > it's foolish and I will not have her come when it is obviously not

> something

> > > she is capable of health wise. But I can't think of a way to approach

> it

> > > that does not either trigger her by her hearing that we don't want her

> to

> > > come (which she was already starting to claim last night when I was

> trying

> > > to talk her out of even considering it) or her becoming obstinate i.e.

> " You

> > > can't tell me what to do. " and trying to come just to be contrary. This

> is

> > > common with her and also another way she is like a child - if you tell

> her

> > > she can't do or have something, she is likely to be darn sure to prove

> you

> > > wrong or do it anyway.

> > >

> > > Fortunately, my boys will be having their birthday parties the weekend

> > > before she is thinking of coming - so she at least can not negatively

> impact

> > > these.

> > >

> > > Any advice or input is always appreciated.

> > >

> > > MY

> > >

August 23, 2010

,

Besides the casino visits (as long as she practically has a nurse to take

care of her) amazing me but, that she has managed to get the doctor's office

to come out to her car to give her her shot, is just remarkable to me. It

seems there is nothing she can't get people to do for her. She apparently

just calls when she gets there and they come out to give her her shot. Talk

about being the queen!

MY

On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 1:21 PM, shirleyspawn wrote:

>

> My - Take the boys camping on their birthday weekend. You can rent or

> borrow the equipment and go to a state park where they have all the

> amenities. Some parks even have cabins you can rent, if you don't want to

> fool with the tent. Then call Nada and announce your plans, and say NOTHING

> about her not coming. The boys will enjoy it (assuming they're older than

> 2), and there's no way Nada is going to huff and puff her way up a trail.

>

> We've done a lot of camping over the years (not just as a way to avoid my

> mother - we actually enjoy it) - and my mom used to talk about coming with

> us, renting a Winnebago, etc. It never came to anything. Too much work for

> her, when it comes down to it. If she can't come to my house, demand that I

> wait on her, then complain about everything, it's no fun for her.

>

> By the way - the line about your mom going to the casino struck me funny.

> She's so pitiful she can't leave the house - EXCEPT to go to the casino! And

> I'm assuming that's not a no-smoking zone, right? So her breathing problems

> don't stop her from sitting in a smoky giant bar for hours at a time - but

> they give her a good topic to use in dominating the conversation and

> dictating the terms of her visits. Give me a break, Nada!

>

> > >

> > > My nada usually comes to our house for a weekend for our kids

> birthdays. Her

> > > health has really deteriorated this year and I have been assuming she

> would

> > > not be able to travel to our home for the birthday's this fall. We live

> 300

> > > miles away and she usually takes the train, but the last time we saw

> her in

> > > the summer she could barely walk a few steps without gasping for breath

> > > (some of which I think was real and some of it faked or at least

> exagerated

> > > and she says she currently spends most of her time sleeping. Even when

> she

> > > was doing better healthwise a trip to our house was fairly exhausting

> for

> > > her. - just trying to climb the stairs in our house is significant for

> her.

> > >

> > > Since my kids have been asking if she is coming I thought I would at

> least

> > > have it out in the open so I said to her. " The boys asked me if you

> would be

> > > coming for their birthday, but I am assuming that would be way to big

> of a

> > > trip for you right now. " She surprised me by saying she is thinking

> about

> > > coming!

> > >

> > > This was after she told me about how she had one of her gasping/can't

> breath

> > > episodes trying to walk into a doctor's office that they now come out

> to her

> > > car to give her her shot. And that she won't go to the casino without

> one

> > > particular friend (although others are able/willing to go with her)

> because

> > > this friend takes such good care of her and is like a nurse with her.

> > >

> > > So, no surprise nada has no grip on reality that she actually is not

> well

> > > enough to make a trip like this. I tried to diplomatically talk her out

> of

> > > it and encouraged her to talk to her doctor. She ended up just saying

> she

> > > will think about it and that she would really like to get out of the

> house

> > > (she has not been going much of anywhere because of her health - which

> > > actually is unlike her - she is very, very social and extroverted).

> Well,

> > > for goodness sake, mom, get out of the house by going out to lunch, to

> the

> > > movies, etc. rather than trying to take a 300 mile trip.

> > >

> > > I am reminded that nada is essentially a child in an adult's body and

> is not

> > > capable of making a reasonable decision in this case - more likely a

> selfish

> > > and foolish decision that will have a huge impact on us and likely on

> > > whoever is on the train with her. I really don't want to have the

> stress of

> > > hoping she is not going to have a medical emergency while she is here

> nor

> > > the likely fact that she will require or at least want an enormous

> amount of

> > > care and attention.

> > >

> > > I've been trying to think of a way to tell her she simply can not come

> -

> > > it's foolish and I will not have her come when it is obviously not

> something

> > > she is capable of health wise. But I can't think of a way to approach

> it

> > > that does not either trigger her by her hearing that we don't want her

> to

> > > come (which she was already starting to claim last night when I was

> trying

> > > to talk her out of even considering it) or her becoming obstinate i.e.

> " You

> > > can't tell me what to do. " and trying to come just to be contrary. This

> is

> > > common with her and also another way she is like a child - if you tell

> her

> > > she can't do or have something, she is likely to be darn sure to prove

> you

> > > wrong or do it anyway.

> > >

> > > Fortunately, my boys will be having their birthday parties the weekend

> > > before she is thinking of coming - so she at least can not negatively

> impact

> > > these.

> > >

> > > Any advice or input is always appreciated.

> > >

> > > MY

> > >

August 23, 2010

,

Besides the casino visits (as long as she practically has a nurse to take

care of her) amazing me but, that she has managed to get the doctor's office

to come out to her car to give her her shot, is just remarkable to me. It

seems there is nothing she can't get people to do for her. She apparently

just calls when she gets there and they come out to give her her shot. Talk

about being the queen!

MY

On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 1:21 PM, shirleyspawn wrote:

>

> My - Take the boys camping on their birthday weekend. You can rent or

> borrow the equipment and go to a state park where they have all the

> amenities. Some parks even have cabins you can rent, if you don't want to

> fool with the tent. Then call Nada and announce your plans, and say NOTHING

> about her not coming. The boys will enjoy it (assuming they're older than

> 2), and there's no way Nada is going to huff and puff her way up a trail.

>

> We've done a lot of camping over the years (not just as a way to avoid my

> mother - we actually enjoy it) - and my mom used to talk about coming with

> us, renting a Winnebago, etc. It never came to anything. Too much work for

> her, when it comes down to it. If she can't come to my house, demand that I

> wait on her, then complain about everything, it's no fun for her.

>

> By the way - the line about your mom going to the casino struck me funny.

> She's so pitiful she can't leave the house - EXCEPT to go to the casino! And

> I'm assuming that's not a no-smoking zone, right? So her breathing problems

> don't stop her from sitting in a smoky giant bar for hours at a time - but

> they give her a good topic to use in dominating the conversation and

> dictating the terms of her visits. Give me a break, Nada!

>

> > >

> > > My nada usually comes to our house for a weekend for our kids

> birthdays. Her

> > > health has really deteriorated this year and I have been assuming she

> would

> > > not be able to travel to our home for the birthday's this fall. We live

> 300

> > > miles away and she usually takes the train, but the last time we saw

> her in

> > > the summer she could barely walk a few steps without gasping for breath

> > > (some of which I think was real and some of it faked or at least

> exagerated

> > > and she says she currently spends most of her time sleeping. Even when

> she

> > > was doing better healthwise a trip to our house was fairly exhausting

> for

> > > her. - just trying to climb the stairs in our house is significant for

> her.

> > >

> > > Since my kids have been asking if she is coming I thought I would at

> least

> > > have it out in the open so I said to her. " The boys asked me if you

> would be

> > > coming for their birthday, but I am assuming that would be way to big

> of a

> > > trip for you right now. " She surprised me by saying she is thinking

> about

> > > coming!

> > >

> > > This was after she told me about how she had one of her gasping/can't

> breath

> > > episodes trying to walk into a doctor's office that they now come out

> to her

> > > car to give her her shot. And that she won't go to the casino without

> one

> > > particular friend (although others are able/willing to go with her)

> because

> > > this friend takes such good care of her and is like a nurse with her.

> > >

> > > So, no surprise nada has no grip on reality that she actually is not

> well

> > > enough to make a trip like this. I tried to diplomatically talk her out

> of

> > > it and encouraged her to talk to her doctor. She ended up just saying

> she

> > > will think about it and that she would really like to get out of the

> house

> > > (she has not been going much of anywhere because of her health - which

> > > actually is unlike her - she is very, very social and extroverted).

> Well,

> > > for goodness sake, mom, get out of the house by going out to lunch, to

> the

> > > movies, etc. rather than trying to take a 300 mile trip.

> > >

> > > I am reminded that nada is essentially a child in an adult's body and

> is not

> > > capable of making a reasonable decision in this case - more likely a

> selfish

> > > and foolish decision that will have a huge impact on us and likely on

> > > whoever is on the train with her. I really don't want to have the

> stress of

> > > hoping she is not going to have a medical emergency while she is here

> nor

> > > the likely fact that she will require or at least want an enormous

> amount of

> > > care and attention.

> > >

> > > I've been trying to think of a way to tell her she simply can not come

> -

> > > it's foolish and I will not have her come when it is obviously not

> something

> > > she is capable of health wise. But I can't think of a way to approach

> it

> > > that does not either trigger her by her hearing that we don't want her

> to

> > > come (which she was already starting to claim last night when I was

> trying

> > > to talk her out of even considering it) or her becoming obstinate i.e.

> " You

> > > can't tell me what to do. " and trying to come just to be contrary. This

> is

> > > common with her and also another way she is like a child - if you tell

> her

> > > she can't do or have something, she is likely to be darn sure to prove

> you

> > > wrong or do it anyway.

> > >

> > > Fortunately, my boys will be having their birthday parties the weekend

> > > before she is thinking of coming - so she at least can not negatively

> impact

> > > these.

> > >

> > > Any advice or input is always appreciated.

> > >

> > > MY

> > >

August 23, 2010

Hi Annie,

Thanks for the idea. Unfortunately a train ride to visit her for the

afternoon is not really feasible as it takes 7 hours one way and driving

about 4 1/2 - 5 hours one way. So, it would have to be at least one night

overnight, more likely two given my kids lack of love for riding in the car.

Also, the part I did not include in my original message was that although we

had settled into a pattern of visits with nada that our family could live

with since knowing about BPD (we went there a few times a year and she came

her a few times a year usually working out to 4 -5 times a year total in

seeing each other this was down from 6-7 times before we knew about BPD and

started setting some boundaries), as her health has deteriorated and

traveling more difficult, I was actually not at all sad to have the number

of times we see nada this year essentially cut in half. No one particular

visit is horrible with her, but the more I have time and distance from her

(I'm now talking to her only once a week for about 30 - 40 minutes - down

from everyday) the less I want to be with her or talk to her and time with

her seems to me more stressful and draining to me. So, I was actually not

minding at all that we would likely not see her for the kids birthdays

(which means a September trip and November trip from her usually) - though

it is a bit tricky with my kids as they genuinely like to see her for their

birthdays.

Two years ago she was not well enough to make it for the boys birthdays and

we did end up going to see her the weekend after as she and the boys were

really disappointed about her not coming. Again, nothing was horrible. But

although we did not know about BPD at the time, my husband and I agreed

afterward that we would not do that again. She went so overboard in trying

to appear like the loving, generous grandma that she went and planned this

party for the boys where she had ponies in the backyard and invited some of

her friends, a cake big enough for 3 x's the number of people, the whole

nine yards. The thing is, she was doing so poorly healthwise that she was

very limited - so my husband and I and a neighbor ended up doing all of the

work both beforehand and the day of the party while she took all the credit.

And we nor the boys even wanted a party - just some time with grandma and

maybe a birthday cake. Now knowing about BPD, the whole thing makes more

sense (at least in BPD crazy land), but even when we had no lens to make

sense of it, we didn't want to have a repeat of that particular birthday

hoopla. We generally keep the kids birthdays low key. If nada can't come,

she can't come as far and my husband and I are concerned.

Anyway, sorry for way more details and specifics than you were likely

looking for

MY

On Mon, Aug 23, 2010 at 11:20 AM, anuria67854 wrote:

>

> Maybe you and the boys can hop on the train and go visit nada at nada's

> home for the afternoon, the Saturday after their birthday parties?

> -Annie

>

> >

> > My nada usually comes to our house for a weekend for our kids birthdays.

> Her

> > health has really deteriorated this year and I have been assuming she

> would

> > not be able to travel to our home for the birthday's this fall. We live

> 300

> > miles away and she usually takes the train, but the last time we saw her

> in

> > the summer she could barely walk a few steps without gasping for breath

> > (some of which I think was real and some of it faked or at least

> exagerated

> > and she says she currently spends most of her time sleeping. Even when

> she

> > was doing better healthwise a trip to our house was fairly exhausting for

> > her. - just trying to climb the stairs in our house is significant for

> her.

> >

> > Since my kids have been asking if she is coming I thought I would at

> least

> > have it out in the open so I said to her. " The boys asked me if you would

> be

> > coming for their birthday, but I am assuming that would be way to big of

> a

> > trip for you right now. " She surprised me by saying she is thinking about

> > coming!

> >

> > This was after she told me about how she had one of her gasping/can't

> breath

> > episodes trying to walk into a doctor's office that they now come out to

> her

> > car to give her her shot. And that she won't go to the casino without one

> > particular friend (although others are able/willing to go with her)

> because

> > this friend takes such good care of her and is like a nurse with her.

> >

> > So, no surprise nada has no grip on reality that she actually is not well

> > enough to make a trip like this. I tried to diplomatically talk her out

> of

> > it and encouraged her to talk to her doctor. She ended up just saying she

> > will think about it and that she would really like to get out of the

> house

> > (she has not been going much of anywhere because of her health - which

> > actually is unlike her - she is very, very social and extroverted). Well,

> > for goodness sake, mom, get out of the house by going out to lunch, to

> the

> > movies, etc. rather than trying to take a 300 mile trip.

> >

> > I am reminded that nada is essentially a child in an adult's body and is

> not

> > capable of making a reasonable decision in this case - more likely a

> selfish

> > and foolish decision that will have a huge impact on us and likely on

> > whoever is on the train with her. I really don't want to have the stress

> of

> > hoping she is not going to have a medical emergency while she is here nor

> > the likely fact that she will require or at least want an enormous amount

> of

> > care and attention.

> >

> > I've been trying to think of a way to tell her she simply can not come -

> > it's foolish and I will not have her come when it is obviously not

> something

> > she is capable of health wise. But I can't think of a way to approach it

> > that does not either trigger her by her hearing that we don't want her to

> > come (which she was already starting to claim last night when I was

> trying

> > to talk her out of even considering it) or her becoming obstinate i.e.

> " You

> > can't tell me what to do. " and trying to come just to be contrary. This

> is

> > common with her and also another way she is like a child - if you tell

> her

> > she can't do or have something, she is likely to be darn sure to prove

> you

> > wrong or do it anyway.

> >

> > Fortunately, my boys will be having their birthday parties the weekend

> > before she is thinking of coming - so she at least can not negatively

> impact

> > these.

> >

> > Any advice or input is always appreciated.

> >

> > MY

> >

August 23, 2010