Re: Does the guilt carry over into other parts of your life?

[Guest guest]

Annie...I know you meant this for someone else but I'm printing out those three

things at the bottom and posting them all over my home. I'm slowly getting

there, but the reminder will help!

Ninera

>

> Subject: Re: Does the guilt carry over into other parts of

your life?

> To: WTOAdultChildren1

> Date: Tuesday, August 24, 2010, 10:09 PM

> Hi birdie,

> I'm no expert, but that topic does seem to crop up from

> time to time.  It appears that there are some of us at

> this Group (and at other support Groups I belong to) that

> describe that people-pleasing, afraid-to-ever-say- " no " kind

> of behavior in the adult children of personality-disordered

> parents.

>

> I suppose that happens with parentified children: the ones

> who are raised to feel responsible for their parents'

> feelings and well-being, and it carries over into adulthood

> with feeling that you're responsible for everyone's

> happiness and well-being.

>

> I think that's also called " being co-dependent. "   As a

> child with no choices or objectivity, you were assigned the

> role of care-giver.  Now you feel like you can't quit

> that " job " or everything will just disintegrate and go to

> hell around you and it will be your fault, OR maybe, you

> can't quit that job because if you do, you will have no

> function or no purpose in life and nobody will like you any

> more because you're not taking care of their needs any

> longer.

>

> What an inappropriate and crappy thing to do to one's own

> child: saddle her with an adult's level of responsibility

> at, like, age 6.  Turning your joyful, innocent little

> child into a 55 year old before her time, when there's no

> actual executive ability, experience or power to carry off

> that level of responsibility.  (Sounds like some jobs

> I've had in my life: " Welcome to our company.  You are

> totally responsible for finishing this project on deadline

> and on budget, but we're not giving you any time or money or

> authority to make any of that actually happen. Have fun! " )

>

> Its really difficult to undo a lifetime's worth of

> brainwashing, but the truth is:

> 1. Other adults are responsible for their own feelings and

> their own happiness and well-being, not you.

> 2. You have value purpose in life aside from being a

> care-giver.

> 3. Care-giving is supposed to be mutual between adult

> friends and relatives and spouses, not just one-way all the

> time.

>

> -Annie

>

>

>

>

> >

> > This was in another post and I felt like it was enough

> to turn into a thread: " as adults we get to say " no "

> sometimes "  

> >

> > Sometimes I find myself carrying over a lot of guilt

> into my life in other ways.  I'm so bad at saying no to

> anyone.  It's like I'm always trying to atone for

> something.  It sometimes gets to the point where I

> become physically ill because I've signed myself up for so

> much stuff - meetings, photo gigs, helping people, school,

> writing, whatever.  I feel like sometimes I do this

> because I want to make everyone happy - because if I say no

> or disagree I'm afraid they'll become unhappy and abusive.

> >

> > Is this normal? Is this a thing that happens when you

> have one of these parents?

> >

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

> **This group is based on principles in Randi Kreger's new

> book The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality

> Disorder: New Tips and Tools to Stop Walking on Eggshells,

> available at www.BPDCentral.com.** Problems? Write @....

> DO NOT RESPOND ON THE LIST.

>

> To unsub from this list, send a blank email to

WTOAdultChildren1-unsubscribe .

>

>

> Recommended: " Toxic Parents, " " Surviving a Borderline

> Parent, " and " Understanding the Borderline Mother " (hard to

> find)

[Guest guest]

Annie...I know you meant this for someone else but I'm printing out those three

things at the bottom and posting them all over my home. I'm slowly getting

there, but the reminder will help!

Ninera

>

> Subject: Re: Does the guilt carry over into other parts of

your life?

> To: WTOAdultChildren1

> Date: Tuesday, August 24, 2010, 10:09 PM

> Hi birdie,

> I'm no expert, but that topic does seem to crop up from

> time to time.  It appears that there are some of us at

> this Group (and at other support Groups I belong to) that

> describe that people-pleasing, afraid-to-ever-say- " no " kind

> of behavior in the adult children of personality-disordered

> parents.

>

> I suppose that happens with parentified children: the ones

> who are raised to feel responsible for their parents'

> feelings and well-being, and it carries over into adulthood

> with feeling that you're responsible for everyone's

> happiness and well-being.

>

> I think that's also called " being co-dependent. "   As a

> child with no choices or objectivity, you were assigned the

> role of care-giver.  Now you feel like you can't quit

> that " job " or everything will just disintegrate and go to

> hell around you and it will be your fault, OR maybe, you

> can't quit that job because if you do, you will have no

> function or no purpose in life and nobody will like you any

> more because you're not taking care of their needs any

> longer.

>

> What an inappropriate and crappy thing to do to one's own

> child: saddle her with an adult's level of responsibility

> at, like, age 6.  Turning your joyful, innocent little

> child into a 55 year old before her time, when there's no

> actual executive ability, experience or power to carry off

> that level of responsibility.  (Sounds like some jobs

> I've had in my life: " Welcome to our company.  You are

> totally responsible for finishing this project on deadline

> and on budget, but we're not giving you any time or money or

> authority to make any of that actually happen. Have fun! " )

>

> Its really difficult to undo a lifetime's worth of

> brainwashing, but the truth is:

> 1. Other adults are responsible for their own feelings and

> their own happiness and well-being, not you.

> 2. You have value purpose in life aside from being a

> care-giver.

> 3. Care-giving is supposed to be mutual between adult

> friends and relatives and spouses, not just one-way all the

> time.

>

> -Annie

>

>

>

>

> >

> > This was in another post and I felt like it was enough

> to turn into a thread: " as adults we get to say " no "

> sometimes "  

> >

> > Sometimes I find myself carrying over a lot of guilt

> into my life in other ways.  I'm so bad at saying no to

> anyone.  It's like I'm always trying to atone for

> something.  It sometimes gets to the point where I

> become physically ill because I've signed myself up for so

> much stuff - meetings, photo gigs, helping people, school,

> writing, whatever.  I feel like sometimes I do this

> because I want to make everyone happy - because if I say no

> or disagree I'm afraid they'll become unhappy and abusive.

> >

> > Is this normal? Is this a thing that happens when you

> have one of these parents?

> >

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

> **This group is based on principles in Randi Kreger's new

> book The Essential Family Guide to Borderline Personality

> Disorder: New Tips and Tools to Stop Walking on Eggshells,

> available at www.BPDCentral.com.** Problems? Write @....

> DO NOT RESPOND ON THE LIST.

>

> To unsub from this list, send a blank email to

WTOAdultChildren1-unsubscribe .

>

>

> Recommended: " Toxic Parents, " " Surviving a Borderline

> Parent, " and " Understanding the Borderline Mother " (hard to

> find)

[Guest guest]

I hear ya.

I've started saying " no " more often and sure...there ARE people who are upset,

but those are ALSO the people who never ever reciprocate and who have been using

me to begin with.

Case in point: a friend of mine who calls me her " sister " ...I was labor

coach/support for her and her husband for the birth of their son, " Auntie " and

godmother to both of their children, and so on. She was upset with me that I

wasn't able to make it to any of her son's t-ball games this year...of course,

no recognition of the fact that they all took place on a day of the week when I

have another commitment to an organization I run. She also relies on me as her

sole back up child care provider when her mother is unavailable, for free.

Granted, it isn't often that I'm called upon for that, but God forbid I not be

available, you know? Well, a couple of weeks ago I was given a rather

significant statewide award for the various volunteer and leadership roles I do.

The awards ceremony was on a weekend when her husband and children were out of

town. I offered her a free ticket and to stay with me in my hotel room

(free...it was provided to me). Did she

come? Nope...just didn't feel like it, was her excuse.

This weekend I need help with *my* kids...(I am a professional nanny, rarely

ever have to work weekends but my employers have a family funeral that is over 2

hours away on Saturday). All I need is someone to sit in the house for a couple

of hours with napping 3 year old twins while I run their brother to his best

friend's bday party. Seriously...all these mom friends of mine who never

hesitate to demand free childcare from me and I offer them a couple of PAID

hours to sit and...read, knit, watch TV, nap themselves, play around online,

whatever...while the little ones sleep and...nope. Not a one is

willing...though several are AVAILABLE, they are not WILLING.

Guess their free childcare days from me are OVER. I'm done flipping MY schedule

around just to help them out when it is just patently clear that reciprocity

will never happen.

Ninera

>

> >

> >

> > Hi birdie,

> > I'm no expert, but that topic does seem to crop up

> from time to time. It

> > appears that there are some of us at this Group (and

> at other support Groups

> > I belong to) that describe that people-pleasing,

> afraid-to-ever-say- " no "

> > kind of behavior in the adult children of

> personality-disordered parents.

> >

> > I suppose that happens with parentified children: the

> ones who are raised

> > to feel responsible for their parents' feelings and

> well-being, and it

> > carries over into adulthood with feeling that you're

> responsible for

> > everyone's happiness and well-being.

> >

> > I think that's also called " being co-dependent. " As a

> child with no choices

> > or objectivity, you were assigned the role of

> care-giver. Now you feel like

> > you can't quit that " job " or everything will just

> disintegrate and go to

> > hell around you and it will be your fault, OR maybe,

> you can't quit that job

> > because if you do, you will have no function or no

> purpose in life and

> > nobody will like you any more because you're not

> taking care of their needs

> > any longer.

> >

> > What an inappropriate and crappy thing to do to one's

> own child: saddle her

> > with an adult's level of responsibility at, like, age

> 6. Turning your

> > joyful, innocent little child into a 55 year old

> before her time, when

> > there's no actual executive ability, experience or

> power to carry off that

> > level of responsibility. (Sounds like some jobs I've

> had in my life:

> > " Welcome to our company. You are totally responsible

> for finishing this

> > project on deadline and on budget, but we're not

> giving you any time or

> > money or authority to make any of that actually

> happen. Have fun! " )

> >

> > Its really difficult to undo a lifetime's worth of

> brainwashing, but the

> > truth is:

> > 1. Other adults are responsible for their own feelings

> and their own

> > happiness and well-being, not you.

> > 2. You have value purpose in life aside from being a

> care-giver.

> > 3. Care-giving is supposed to be mutual between adult

> friends and relatives

> > and spouses, not just one-way all the time.

> >

> > -Annie

> >

> >

> >

> > >

> > > This was in another post and I felt like it was

> enough to turn into a

> > thread: " as adults we get to say " no " sometimes "

> > >

> > > Sometimes I find myself carrying over a lot of

> guilt into my life in

> > other ways. I'm so bad at saying no to anyone. It's

> like I'm always trying

> > to atone for something. It sometimes gets to the point

> where I become

> > physically ill because I've signed myself up for so

> much stuff - meetings,

> > photo gigs, helping people, school, writing, whatever.

> I feel like sometimes

> > I do this because I want to make everyone happy -

> because if I say no or

> > disagree I'm afraid they'll become unhappy and

> abusive.

> > >

> > > Is this normal? Is this a thing that happens when

> you have one of these

> > parents?

> > >

> >

> > 

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I hear ya.

I've started saying " no " more often and sure...there ARE people who are upset,

but those are ALSO the people who never ever reciprocate and who have been using

me to begin with.

Case in point: a friend of mine who calls me her " sister " ...I was labor

coach/support for her and her husband for the birth of their son, " Auntie " and

godmother to both of their children, and so on. She was upset with me that I

wasn't able to make it to any of her son's t-ball games this year...of course,

no recognition of the fact that they all took place on a day of the week when I

have another commitment to an organization I run. She also relies on me as her

sole back up child care provider when her mother is unavailable, for free.

Granted, it isn't often that I'm called upon for that, but God forbid I not be

available, you know? Well, a couple of weeks ago I was given a rather

significant statewide award for the various volunteer and leadership roles I do.

The awards ceremony was on a weekend when her husband and children were out of

town. I offered her a free ticket and to stay with me in my hotel room

(free...it was provided to me). Did she

come? Nope...just didn't feel like it, was her excuse.

This weekend I need help with *my* kids...(I am a professional nanny, rarely

ever have to work weekends but my employers have a family funeral that is over 2

hours away on Saturday). All I need is someone to sit in the house for a couple

of hours with napping 3 year old twins while I run their brother to his best

friend's bday party. Seriously...all these mom friends of mine who never

hesitate to demand free childcare from me and I offer them a couple of PAID

hours to sit and...read, knit, watch TV, nap themselves, play around online,

whatever...while the little ones sleep and...nope. Not a one is

willing...though several are AVAILABLE, they are not WILLING.

Guess their free childcare days from me are OVER. I'm done flipping MY schedule

around just to help them out when it is just patently clear that reciprocity

will never happen.

Ninera

>

> >

> >

> > Hi birdie,

> > I'm no expert, but that topic does seem to crop up

> from time to time. It

> > appears that there are some of us at this Group (and

> at other support Groups

> > I belong to) that describe that people-pleasing,

> afraid-to-ever-say- " no "

> > kind of behavior in the adult children of

> personality-disordered parents.

> >

> > I suppose that happens with parentified children: the

> ones who are raised

> > to feel responsible for their parents' feelings and

> well-being, and it

> > carries over into adulthood with feeling that you're

> responsible for

> > everyone's happiness and well-being.

> >

> > I think that's also called " being co-dependent. " As a

> child with no choices

> > or objectivity, you were assigned the role of

> care-giver. Now you feel like

> > you can't quit that " job " or everything will just

> disintegrate and go to

> > hell around you and it will be your fault, OR maybe,

> you can't quit that job

> > because if you do, you will have no function or no

> purpose in life and

> > nobody will like you any more because you're not

> taking care of their needs

> > any longer.

> >

> > What an inappropriate and crappy thing to do to one's

> own child: saddle her

> > with an adult's level of responsibility at, like, age

> 6. Turning your

> > joyful, innocent little child into a 55 year old

> before her time, when

> > there's no actual executive ability, experience or

> power to carry off that

> > level of responsibility. (Sounds like some jobs I've

> had in my life:

> > " Welcome to our company. You are totally responsible

> for finishing this

> > project on deadline and on budget, but we're not

> giving you any time or

> > money or authority to make any of that actually

> happen. Have fun! " )

> >

> > Its really difficult to undo a lifetime's worth of

> brainwashing, but the

> > truth is:

> > 1. Other adults are responsible for their own feelings

> and their own

> > happiness and well-being, not you.

> > 2. You have value purpose in life aside from being a

> care-giver.

> > 3. Care-giving is supposed to be mutual between adult

> friends and relatives

> > and spouses, not just one-way all the time.

> >

> > -Annie

> >

> >

> >

> > >

> > > This was in another post and I felt like it was

> enough to turn into a

> > thread: " as adults we get to say " no " sometimes "

> > >

> > > Sometimes I find myself carrying over a lot of

> guilt into my life in

> > other ways. I'm so bad at saying no to anyone. It's

> like I'm always trying

> > to atone for something. It sometimes gets to the point

> where I become

> > physically ill because I've signed myself up for so

> much stuff - meetings,

> > photo gigs, helping people, school, writing, whatever.

> I feel like sometimes

> > I do this because I want to make everyone happy -

> because if I say no or

> > disagree I'm afraid they'll become unhappy and

> abusive.

> > >

> > > Is this normal? Is this a thing that happens when

> you have one of these

> > parents?

> > >

> >

> > 

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I do some people pleasing sometimes, because I hate having attention drawn to me

and when someone asks me to do something i try to get it over as quickly as

possible.

I was the target child of a narcissist so whenever we went out in public (as

well as at home) he not only monopolized all conversations and every event we

went to but he was always putting me down, mocking my speech, trying to knock me

off balance and make me unsure of myself. So I tend to have the opposite problem

of always wanting to be alone and never wanting to go anywhere or do anything

with other humans because of all the bad experiences of him hanging over every

outing like a dark cloud when i was young. I learned to be somewhat reclusive

and just keep to myself. I probably need to say 'yes' more.

>

> This was in another post and I felt like it was enough to turn into a thread:

" as adults we get to say " no " sometimes "

>

> Sometimes I find myself carrying over a lot of guilt into my life in other

ways. I'm so bad at saying no to anyone. It's like I'm always trying to atone

for something. It sometimes gets to the point where I become physically ill

because I've signed myself up for so much stuff - meetings, photo gigs, helping

people, school, writing, whatever. I feel like sometimes I do this because I

want to make everyone happy - because if I say no or disagree I'm afraid they'll

become unhappy and abusive.

>

> Is this normal? Is this a thing that happens when you have one of these

parents?

>

[Guest guest]

I have this problem.

I was always the one bending over backwards for other people, saying yes to

everything. Never wanting to upset other people.

Took me a REALLY long time to say " no " . Even longer to be able to say it without

guilt.

Hell, even now I feel the need to justify saying " NO " with excuses and reasons.

Maybe it's because we grew up having no choice to say no.

My kids get that choice, it's nice to see them developing their own sense of

self.

>

> This was in another post and I felt like it was enough to turn into a thread:

" as adults we get to say " no " sometimes "

>

> Sometimes I find myself carrying over a lot of guilt into my life in other

ways. I'm so bad at saying no to anyone. It's like I'm always trying to atone

for something. It sometimes gets to the point where I become physically ill

because I've signed myself up for so much stuff - meetings, photo gigs, helping

people, school, writing, whatever. I feel like sometimes I do this because I

want to make everyone happy - because if I say no or disagree I'm afraid they'll

become unhappy and abusive.

>

> Is this normal? Is this a thing that happens when you have one of these

parents?

>