Guest guest Posted August 13, 2010 Report Share Posted August 13, 2010 *Sometimes, the only way you can win is to not play the game* This pretty much sums it up. At the moment we have no contact but it is not yet a firm decision on my part...I'm still thinking it over. I have reached the point where in order to have contact my boundaries must not be crossed. After the letter we had no contact for 4 months. Then she left a message and sounded calm. I returned the call intent on laying out some boundaries in order to get her back with mu kids(more to give my kids a fair chance to know grandma). I called and she demanded to see my kids. I calmly said " we'll see " She cut me off demanding to know what that means. I explained that due to her behavior we will first need to have an acceptable agreement/boundaries in place. She started yelling that she has never done anything wrong or to hurt me. I brought up the letter and explained how she does not have a right to my kids. She screamed " oh yes I do, I can take you to court for grandparent visitation it's my right to see them " . I explained that only applies in divorce cases. I called her out on being abusive(in hindsight this was a bad idea but I needed to say it). She asked me to explain but then would scream over me and not listen. She then screamed that " you ruined my life, I'm depressed over this " and I hung up. I really didn't plan on typing all that. LOL. But the point was that I was and maybe still am open to her being able to have a limited relationship for my kids sake BUT at the moment it is in her hands because I will not go back to the way it was. The way I feel is if she really wants to see the kids she will respect the boundaries or not see the kids. Her choice. On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 1:22 PM, anuria67854 wrote: > > > I agree. Your nada has projected onto you her own negative behaviors and > motivations in an effort to make herself out to be your victim. > > Its really similar to a toddler who goes over to another child and yanks > his toy away from him, then screams in shocked disbelief when the other > child hits her. How *dare* you set boundaries and defend yourself from her > disrespectful, dangerous, intrusive behaviors? You're just supposed to > knuckle under and do what she wants, when she wants it. After all, you have > *her* property and are keeping it from her: you have HER grand-babies. > > You have done or said nothing to feel guilty about. > > You have all the power, and its your option totally whether you want to > continue to try and get your nada to respect your boundaries, or if you want > to go No Contact, or somewhere in between. > > *IF* you want to try again to have some contact, my suggestion is to ignore > the letter completely. Never even refer to it, to her. " What letter? " I > suggest that you invite her over to your home for a visit on a specific day > and time, and make sure other people are there too, but don't tell nada > that. You've invited nada and a friend or two of yours over to your home for > tea. > > By doing this you have 1. Ignored nada's written " tantrum " , her > manipulative accusations and her demands. 2. You are reinforcing your own > boundaries and 3. You have even escalated your boundaries. Not only does > nada not get access to your children on her own terms, she doesn't get to be > alone with you, anymore, either! 4. You would be making it clear in a public > way that you are willing to have contact with your mother in your home. If > nada makes a scene, then, that's what people will remember. They'll remember > you being calm, rational and gracious, and your mother acting like a crazy > person. > > On the other hand, if you've had it (very understandable) and want to go No > Contact with nada either temporarily or permanently, I'd still ignore the > letter. Keep it, as evidence, but don't respond to it. > > Sometimes, the only way you can win is to not play the game. > > -Annie > > > > > > > I decided to post " the letter " . This is the one my momster delivered the > > day after I came home from the hospital with DD2. It was the first and > only > > time she has seen DD2. I have been told that there is nothing wrong with > > the letter, it is not hurtful, it is not nasty, it is not abusive, and I > am > > overreacting. Here it is: > > > > It's time I have a talk with you. I'm writing because I don't want any > > screaming or yelling. I can't take it anymore. I just have to get this > off > > my chest. Please don't get me wrong, I am not blaming everything on you > and > > (hubby), I am just letting you know what is bothering me. (me), you only > > get one mother in this world. I am sorry you got stuck with me.I don't > know > > what I did to you in life that makes you so hateful towards me. If you > > would like to talk about it I am here for you. I always will be. I have > > been a worry wart all my life, It drove me nuts when you kids were > little. > > I can't change, you will just have to accept it. I accept the way you > are. > > There are things I don't agree with you about. But I don't yell at you > like > > you do me. You and (hubby) both treat me like shit. I have to walk on > > eggshells every time I come to your house. I am so afraid of saying or > > doing something wrong. In fear that you will yell at me. That's not the > > way it's supposed to be. You are my daughter, I should feel very > > comfortable in your house. And the fact that you won't let me watch your > > kids, just puts a knife right through my heart. I have been watching > > (neice) since she was born. And I do a hell of a job with her. It gives > us > > time to bond together. You won't give me that chance to bond with (DD1) > and > > I'm sure the same with (DD2). What does (hubby)'s mother have that I > > don't? She gets to keep (DD1) overnight every week. Why can't I? You have > > never given me an honest answer. I really need to know. And the fact that > > you called me 20 minutes before (DD2) was born, is just proof you did not > > want me there. A very important moment in my life, to be there when my > > granddaughter was born, you took that away from me. But I see (best > friend) > > was there. You must have called me last. Another stab in the heart. > > Honey, I don't want to go on like this, I want us all to get along. (me), > > this is the hardest thing I ever had to do in life, but I have to do it. > > Until you and (hubby) start treating me with respect, I can no longer > come > > to your house. However, I hope you can find it in your heart to bring the > > kids over to see me. I love all three of my grand babies more than life > > itself > > > > Mom > > > > First, " if you would like to talk about it I am here for you " --I tried > when > > I called her to discuss boundaries and how she has hurt me. She screamed > > over me and would not listen. > > > > " I don't yell at you like you do me " --most times she doesn't yell but has > > other family gang up on me or pushes something over and over until I > cave. > > She does scream at the top of her lungs at times. > > > > As for me yelling at her it has only been 4 times in 18 months. 1)DD1's > > first Christmas when I spent all day cooking and she showed up and > demanded > > I leave the meal to sit and get cold because she wanted to see my 4 month > > old open gifts. She freaked out and I yelled at her to leave. 2) DD2's > > second Christmas when she called 2 weeks before and demanded I abandon > all > > my plans so she could have her " right " to have Christmas at her house. > > 3)The day I went into labor with DD2 when she ignored my request to stop > > interfering with DD1 5 TIMES in less than an hour. 4) When I was in late > > labor and about to deliver she whined to me about all the ways I could > die > > in the hospital. > > > > " The fact that you won't let me watch your kids... " --This is because with > my > > niece she leaves her alone with 2 mean dogs, refuses to use a safe and > > properly installed carseat, and smokes in a closed car with her and then > > asks people not to tell my brother. > > > > " You have never given me an honest answer " --We have discussed it several > > times. > > > > " You won't give me the chance to bond with DD1--She was at our house for > > hours one a week and often invited herself over without asking other > times. > > > > That I did not want her at the birth was true but also she told me she > did > > not want to be there and I called her all night and her phone was out of > > order. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2010 Report Share Posted August 13, 2010 Wow, that's a great analysis. My fada was always in the " She's sick group. " Like just because she's sick she has a right to mistreat smaller, more helpless people. And then almost everyone else I have ever met is in the " honor thy mother. " I have to believe that it is just ignorance that makes them believe this - they have such tender feelings toward their own mother that they can't empathize with someone whose mother was abusive. And then as for supporters, I have this group and my boyfriend. I've never met anyone else. i hope to meet many more. But for the most part I'm very secretive about my family situation, because I don't want to be judged as a bad daughter and a sinner who doesn't honor her mother. . . EEEEEW! But you have us!!!! On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 12:01 PM, Simpson wrote: > > > *Someone who didn't know the dynamics of your > > relationship could easily paint you as the bad guy, which is probably > why some have told you that you are overreacting* > > This exactly! I have been able to pinpoint 4 distinct outlooks that people > in my life take. 3 of them don't get it. They are: > > - The " honor thy mother, she's your mother no matter what " group. They > beleive that giving birth to me automatically solidifies a lifelong > relationship NO MATTER WHAT. If she will not be reasonable, respect me, or > even listen to me I still must continue the relationship for no other > reason > than she's my mother. If she will not take responsibility for her part than > I must shoulder all the responsibility for carrying on the relationship. If > I do not I will regret it forever and ever after she passes.(My aunt/her > sister has actually said to me that I will regret how I treat her and I am > depriving my children of a grandma IN SPITE OF that fact that she knows my > mother puts my niece in danger.) > - The " it must be you " group. These are the people who do not see the > behind closed doors treatment I receive. They see only that my mother > spoils me. Buying excessive(also cheap, unwanted) gifts = good mother. > Since I am so spoiled I must be overreacting and therefore all the horrible > things my mother says about me must be true. They either join my mother in > putting me down and telling me how horrible of a daughter I am or feel > sorry > for my mother and give her advice such as having me arrested, punishing me > severely, or getting me the mental help that I need(which I do/did but not > for the reasons they thought and my mother would never take me to therapy > because that would out her) > - The " your mother is sick in the head " group. This is the group of > people who recognize that my mother has issues but instead of realizing > that > a child should not be treated this way they take the opinion of " your > mother > is sick and therefore we must just tolerate her, if she had cancer you > wouldn't abandon her and this is no different. Effectively, they also make > my mother's issues my responsibility. I hear things like " it's just how she > is " from them. > - The " supporters " group. These are the few people in my life who > beleive me wholeheartedly, support me in my decisions regarding my > relationship with mom, and understand that it is not my fault and I have no > obligation to take her crap. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2010 Report Share Posted August 13, 2010 This is the kind of letter I would get. And it hasn't been until the last year that I would realize how manipulative it is. No wonder I feel so bad sometimes..... Felicia Ward CPA  " To laugh often and much; > to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; > to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false > friends; > to appreciate beauty; > to find the best in others; > to leave the world a bit better, whether by a healthy child, a garden patch, > or a redeemed social condition; > to know even one life has breathed easier because you lived. > This is to have succeeded. " > -Harry Emerson Fosdick   > > > > > > > Ugh. I think every single one of us here either HAS a version of this > > letter or has been told these things in person / on the phone. > > > > You're not alone. You're not without peers... and... as a KO (fortunately > > for you) you're NOT special ;o) > > > > Lynnette - so KO it's sickening > > > > > > > > > > I decided to post " the letter " . This is the one my momster delivered > the > > > day after I came home from the hospital with DD2. It was the first and > > only > > > time she has seen DD2. I have been told that there is nothing wrong > with > > > the letter, it is not hurtful, it is not nasty, it is not abusive, and > I > > am > > > overreacting. Here it is: > > > > > > It's time I have a talk with you. I'm writing because I don't want any > > > screaming or yelling. I can't take it anymore. I just have to get this > > off > > > my chest. Please don't get me wrong, I am not blaming everything on you > > and > > > (hubby), I am just letting you know what is bothering me. (me), you > only > > > get one mother in this world. I am sorry you got stuck with me.I don't > > know > > > what I did to you in life that makes you so hateful towards me. If you > > > would like to talk about it I am here for you. I always will be. I have > > > been a worry wart all my life, It drove me nuts when you kids were > > little. > > > I can't change, you will just have to accept it. I accept the way you > > are. > > > There are things I don't agree with you about. But I don't yell at you > > like > > > you do me. You and (hubby) both treat me like shit. I have to walk on > > > eggshells every time I come to your house. I am so afraid of saying or > > > doing something wrong. In fear that you will yell at me. That's not the > > > way it's supposed to be. You are my daughter, I should feel very > > > comfortable in your house. And the fact that you won't let me watch > your > > > kids, just puts a knife right through my heart. I have been watching > > > (neice) since she was born. And I do a hell of a job with her. It gives > > us > > > time to bond together. You won't give me that chance to bond with (DD1) > > and > > > I'm sure the same with (DD2). What does (hubby)'s mother have that I > > > don't? She gets to keep (DD1) overnight every week. Why can't I? You > have > > > never given me an honest answer. I really need to know. And the fact > that > > > you called me 20 minutes before (DD2) was born, is just proof you did > not > > > want me there. A very important moment in my life, to be there when my > > > granddaughter was born, you took that away from me. But I see (best > > friend) > > > was there. You must have called me last. Another stab in the heart. > > > Honey, I don't want to go on like this, I want us all to get along. > (me), > > > this is the hardest thing I ever had to do in life, but I have to do > it. > > > Until you and (hubby) start treating me with respect, I can no longer > > come > > > to your house. However, I hope you can find it in your heart to bring > the > > > kids over to see me. I love all three of my grand babies more than life > > > itself > > > > > > Mom > > > > > > First, " if you would like to talk about it I am here for you " --I tried > > when > > > I called her to discuss boundaries and how she has hurt me. She > screamed > > > over me and would not listen. > > > > > > " I don't yell at you like you do me " --most times she doesn't yell but > has > > > other family gang up on me or pushes something over and over until I > > cave. > > > She does scream at the top of her lungs at times. > > > > > > As for me yelling at her it has only been 4 times in 18 months. 1)DD1's > > > first Christmas when I spent all day cooking and she showed up and > > demanded > > > I leave the meal to sit and get cold because she wanted to see my 4 > month > > > old open gifts. She freaked out and I yelled at her to leave. 2) DD2's > > > second Christmas when she called 2 weeks before and demanded I abandon > > all > > > my plans so she could have her " right " to have Christmas at her house. > > > 3)The day I went into labor with DD2 when she ignored my request to > stop > > > interfering with DD1 5 TIMES in less than an hour. 4) When I was in > late > > > labor and about to deliver she whined to me about all the ways I could > > die > > > in the hospital. > > > > > > " The fact that you won't let me watch your kids... " --This is because > with > > my > > > niece she leaves her alone with 2 mean dogs, refuses to use a safe and > > > properly installed carseat, and smokes in a closed car with her and > then > > > asks people not to tell my brother. > > > > > > " You have never given me an honest answer " --We have discussed it > several > > > times. > > > > > > " You won't give me the chance to bond with DD1--She was at our house > for > > > hours one a week and often invited herself over without asking other > > times. > > > > > > That I did not want her at the birth was true but also she told me she > > did > > > not want to be there and I called her all night and her phone was out > of > > > order. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2010 Report Share Posted August 13, 2010 This is the kind of letter I would get. And it hasn't been until the last year that I would realize how manipulative it is. No wonder I feel so bad sometimes..... Felicia Ward CPA  " To laugh often and much; > to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; > to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false > friends; > to appreciate beauty; > to find the best in others; > to leave the world a bit better, whether by a healthy child, a garden patch, > or a redeemed social condition; > to know even one life has breathed easier because you lived. > This is to have succeeded. " > -Harry Emerson Fosdick   > > > > > > > Ugh. I think every single one of us here either HAS a version of this > > letter or has been told these things in person / on the phone. > > > > You're not alone. You're not without peers... and... as a KO (fortunately > > for you) you're NOT special ;o) > > > > Lynnette - so KO it's sickening > > > > > > > > > > I decided to post " the letter " . This is the one my momster delivered > the > > > day after I came home from the hospital with DD2. It was the first and > > only > > > time she has seen DD2. I have been told that there is nothing wrong > with > > > the letter, it is not hurtful, it is not nasty, it is not abusive, and > I > > am > > > overreacting. Here it is: > > > > > > It's time I have a talk with you. I'm writing because I don't want any > > > screaming or yelling. I can't take it anymore. I just have to get this > > off > > > my chest. Please don't get me wrong, I am not blaming everything on you > > and > > > (hubby), I am just letting you know what is bothering me. (me), you > only > > > get one mother in this world. I am sorry you got stuck with me.I don't > > know > > > what I did to you in life that makes you so hateful towards me. If you > > > would like to talk about it I am here for you. I always will be. I have > > > been a worry wart all my life, It drove me nuts when you kids were > > little. > > > I can't change, you will just have to accept it. I accept the way you > > are. > > > There are things I don't agree with you about. But I don't yell at you > > like > > > you do me. You and (hubby) both treat me like shit. I have to walk on > > > eggshells every time I come to your house. I am so afraid of saying or > > > doing something wrong. In fear that you will yell at me. That's not the > > > way it's supposed to be. You are my daughter, I should feel very > > > comfortable in your house. And the fact that you won't let me watch > your > > > kids, just puts a knife right through my heart. I have been watching > > > (neice) since she was born. And I do a hell of a job with her. It gives > > us > > > time to bond together. You won't give me that chance to bond with (DD1) > > and > > > I'm sure the same with (DD2). What does (hubby)'s mother have that I > > > don't? She gets to keep (DD1) overnight every week. Why can't I? You > have > > > never given me an honest answer. I really need to know. And the fact > that > > > you called me 20 minutes before (DD2) was born, is just proof you did > not > > > want me there. A very important moment in my life, to be there when my > > > granddaughter was born, you took that away from me. But I see (best > > friend) > > > was there. You must have called me last. Another stab in the heart. > > > Honey, I don't want to go on like this, I want us all to get along. > (me), > > > this is the hardest thing I ever had to do in life, but I have to do > it. > > > Until you and (hubby) start treating me with respect, I can no longer > > come > > > to your house. However, I hope you can find it in your heart to bring > the > > > kids over to see me. I love all three of my grand babies more than life > > > itself > > > > > > Mom > > > > > > First, " if you would like to talk about it I am here for you " --I tried > > when > > > I called her to discuss boundaries and how she has hurt me. She > screamed > > > over me and would not listen. > > > > > > " I don't yell at you like you do me " --most times she doesn't yell but > has > > > other family gang up on me or pushes something over and over until I > > cave. > > > She does scream at the top of her lungs at times. > > > > > > As for me yelling at her it has only been 4 times in 18 months. 1)DD1's > > > first Christmas when I spent all day cooking and she showed up and > > demanded > > > I leave the meal to sit and get cold because she wanted to see my 4 > month > > > old open gifts. She freaked out and I yelled at her to leave. 2) DD2's > > > second Christmas when she called 2 weeks before and demanded I abandon > > all > > > my plans so she could have her " right " to have Christmas at her house. > > > 3)The day I went into labor with DD2 when she ignored my request to > stop > > > interfering with DD1 5 TIMES in less than an hour. 4) When I was in > late > > > labor and about to deliver she whined to me about all the ways I could > > die > > > in the hospital. > > > > > > " The fact that you won't let me watch your kids... " --This is because > with > > my > > > niece she leaves her alone with 2 mean dogs, refuses to use a safe and > > > properly installed carseat, and smokes in a closed car with her and > then > > > asks people not to tell my brother. > > > > > > " You have never given me an honest answer " --We have discussed it > several > > > times. > > > > > > " You won't give me the chance to bond with DD1--She was at our house > for > > > hours one a week and often invited herself over without asking other > > times. > > > > > > That I did not want her at the birth was true but also she told me she > > did > > > not want to be there and I called her all night and her phone was out > of > > > order. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 13, 2010 Report Share Posted August 13, 2010 This is the kind of letter I would get. And it hasn't been until the last year that I would realize how manipulative it is. No wonder I feel so bad sometimes..... Felicia Ward CPA  " To laugh often and much; > to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; > to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false > friends; > to appreciate beauty; > to find the best in others; > to leave the world a bit better, whether by a healthy child, a garden patch, > or a redeemed social condition; > to know even one life has breathed easier because you lived. > This is to have succeeded. " > -Harry Emerson Fosdick   > > > > > > > Ugh. I think every single one of us here either HAS a version of this > > letter or has been told these things in person / on the phone. > > > > You're not alone. You're not without peers... and... as a KO (fortunately > > for you) you're NOT special ;o) > > > > Lynnette - so KO it's sickening > > > > > > > > > > I decided to post " the letter " . This is the one my momster delivered > the > > > day after I came home from the hospital with DD2. It was the first and > > only > > > time she has seen DD2. I have been told that there is nothing wrong > with > > > the letter, it is not hurtful, it is not nasty, it is not abusive, and > I > > am > > > overreacting. Here it is: > > > > > > It's time I have a talk with you. I'm writing because I don't want any > > > screaming or yelling. I can't take it anymore. I just have to get this > > off > > > my chest. Please don't get me wrong, I am not blaming everything on you > > and > > > (hubby), I am just letting you know what is bothering me. (me), you > only > > > get one mother in this world. I am sorry you got stuck with me.I don't > > know > > > what I did to you in life that makes you so hateful towards me. If you > > > would like to talk about it I am here for you. I always will be. I have > > > been a worry wart all my life, It drove me nuts when you kids were > > little. > > > I can't change, you will just have to accept it. I accept the way you > > are. > > > There are things I don't agree with you about. But I don't yell at you > > like > > > you do me. You and (hubby) both treat me like shit. I have to walk on > > > eggshells every time I come to your house. I am so afraid of saying or > > > doing something wrong. In fear that you will yell at me. That's not the > > > way it's supposed to be. You are my daughter, I should feel very > > > comfortable in your house. And the fact that you won't let me watch > your > > > kids, just puts a knife right through my heart. I have been watching > > > (neice) since she was born. And I do a hell of a job with her. It gives > > us > > > time to bond together. You won't give me that chance to bond with (DD1) > > and > > > I'm sure the same with (DD2). What does (hubby)'s mother have that I > > > don't? She gets to keep (DD1) overnight every week. Why can't I? You > have > > > never given me an honest answer. I really need to know. And the fact > that > > > you called me 20 minutes before (DD2) was born, is just proof you did > not > > > want me there. A very important moment in my life, to be there when my > > > granddaughter was born, you took that away from me. But I see (best > > friend) > > > was there. You must have called me last. Another stab in the heart. > > > Honey, I don't want to go on like this, I want us all to get along. > (me), > > > this is the hardest thing I ever had to do in life, but I have to do > it. > > > Until you and (hubby) start treating me with respect, I can no longer > > come > > > to your house. However, I hope you can find it in your heart to bring > the > > > kids over to see me. I love all three of my grand babies more than life > > > itself > > > > > > Mom > > > > > > First, " if you would like to talk about it I am here for you " --I tried > > when > > > I called her to discuss boundaries and how she has hurt me. She > screamed > > > over me and would not listen. > > > > > > " I don't yell at you like you do me " --most times she doesn't yell but > has > > > other family gang up on me or pushes something over and over until I > > cave. > > > She does scream at the top of her lungs at times. > > > > > > As for me yelling at her it has only been 4 times in 18 months. 1)DD1's > > > first Christmas when I spent all day cooking and she showed up and > > demanded > > > I leave the meal to sit and get cold because she wanted to see my 4 > month > > > old open gifts. She freaked out and I yelled at her to leave. 2) DD2's > > > second Christmas when she called 2 weeks before and demanded I abandon > > all > > > my plans so she could have her " right " to have Christmas at her house. > > > 3)The day I went into labor with DD2 when she ignored my request to > stop > > > interfering with DD1 5 TIMES in less than an hour. 4) When I was in > late > > > labor and about to deliver she whined to me about all the ways I could > > die > > > in the hospital. > > > > > > " The fact that you won't let me watch your kids... " --This is because > with > > my > > > niece she leaves her alone with 2 mean dogs, refuses to use a safe and > > > properly installed carseat, and smokes in a closed car with her and > then > > > asks people not to tell my brother. > > > > > > " You have never given me an honest answer " --We have discussed it > several > > > times. > > > > > > " You won't give me the chance to bond with DD1--She was at our house > for > > > hours one a week and often invited herself over without asking other > > times. > > > > > > That I did not want her at the birth was true but also she told me she > > did > > > not want to be there and I called her all night and her phone was out > of > > > order. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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