Re: What about when not losing is not an option?

[Guest guest]

Hi Jon...

Amen... Im still new here, but I am not willing to let go of the deep desire inside me to be and live healthy; and feel good in my own skin...

I will NEVER FORGET what it felt like to be 200 lbs hating myself and my body each and every day of my life. I know today that attitude about myself was sad and very unhealthy, but also, the "FEELINGS" I felt, and the RESPONSIBILITY I MUST TAKE TODAY to align my ACTIONS with KNOWN OUTCOMES...

Im very grateful my desire to live healthy, feel and look good, and like myself (as the best I can be) is within my responsibility in what choices I make to put which foods in my body... The more I take care of this body, the more I WANT to take care of this body... Even if it means not eating fried food and Chicken Parm...

Sorry if this offends anyone, that certainly is not my intent...

Diane

To: IntuitiveEating_Support From: jkarlen@...Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2010 06:58:54 -0600Subject: What about when not losing is not an option?

Good Morning All,

I’ve had this questioning bouncing around in my head the past few days. I’ve ordered Bacon’s book, have read Intuitive Eating and the various postings on here about accepting our bodies and understanding that we may or may not lose weight. And, for the moderately overweight people around here I applaud that. But what about for the 330lb 31 year old with Type 2 Diabetes? If I don’t lose weight I’m going to die very prematurely. Logic tells me that if I follow this process and live within what my body really wants it’ll make itself very clear that it doesn’t want to be 330lb and request food in quantities that reduces its size. But, knowing I’m living inside of a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than it would if I was just dissatisfied with my appearance. I don’t mean to diminish the concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I know weight is a very emotional issue for many people.

Jon

[Guest guest]

Jon,I don't have all the answers by a long shot... but one thought I have is: what made you get to where you are today? I suspect that dieting is a big part of the problem, though of course I don't know your personal history. But many of us on the group use food for emotional reasons... in essence, food isn't at the heart of the problem; it's just a symptom. But dieting and restricting to try to deal with the symptoms only worsens the underlying problem.

Another thought: Something I have been thinking about today, for myself, is trying to pay closer attention to how certain foods make my body feel. Not exactly restricting, but thinking twice before eating foods that I know make me feel unwell. So getting beyond just " mouth hunger. "  

A third thought: A piece of advice I've read on here recently is trying to eat some protein with every snack. I think this is a good idea, and vague enough that it shouldn't feel too " diety. "

So maybe you could work on eating some protein with your meals, plus thinking about why and what you eat... non-judgementally, but just as a sort of anthropologist. sort of like your journalling. how is that going, by the way? 

i think you could take these steps and they would fit in with IE but also allow you to feel like you are doing something to " work " on your diabetes.  unfortunately, there's no quick fix, no matter how severe the problem. but you already know that finding another diet won't help. so this is the sort of " there's no way around it but through it " approach, i guess? 

just my $0.02. i really am no expert. so use what, if any, of this is helpful.and consider talking to a registered dietician as well. best,

abby

 

Good Morning All,

 

I’ve had this questioning bouncing around in my head

the past few days.  I’ve ordered Bacon’s book, have read

Intuitive Eating and the various postings on here about accepting our bodies

and understanding that we may or may not lose weight.  And, for the

moderately overweight people around here I applaud that.  But what about

for the 330lb 31 year old with Type 2 Diabetes?  If I don’t lose

weight I’m going to die very prematurely.  Logic tells me that if I follow

this process and live within what my body really wants it’ll make itself

very clear that it doesn’t want to be 330lb and request food in

quantities that reduces its size.  But, knowing I’m living inside of

a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than it would if I was

just dissatisfied with my appearance.  I don’t mean to diminish the

concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I know weight is a

very emotional issue for many people.

 

Jon

-- Abigail C. Wolfson, RN, MS, CPNPLICH School Based Health CenterBrooklyn New School & Brooklyn School for Collaborative Studies610 Henry Street, Room 209

Brooklyn, NY 11231 (fax)

[Guest guest]

Keep in mind that all dietitians are different - ask ahead of time about the dietitians approach - is she/he familiar with IE?

Theresa

 

Jon,

I don't have all the answers by a long shot... but one thought I have is: what made you get to where you are today? 

I suspect that dieting is a big part of the problem, though of course I don't know your personal history. But many of us on the group use food for emotional reasons... in essence, food isn't at the heart of the problem; it's just a symptom. But dieting and restricting to try to deal with the symptoms only worsens the underlying problem.

Another thought: Something I have been thinking about today, for myself, is trying to pay closer attention to how certain foods make my body feel. Not exactly restricting, but thinking twice before eating foods that I know make me feel unwell. So getting beyond just " mouth hunger. "  

A third thought: A piece of advice I've read on here recently is trying to eat some protein with every snack. I think this is a good idea, and vague enough that it shouldn't feel too " diety. "

So maybe you could work on eating some protein with your meals, plus thinking about why and what you eat... non-judgementally, but just as a sort of anthropologist. sort of like your journalling. how is that going, by the way? 

i think you could take these steps and they would fit in with IE but also allow you to feel like you are doing something to " work " on your diabetes.  

unfortunately, there's no quick fix, no matter how severe the problem. but you already know that finding another diet won't help. so this is the sort of " there's no way around it but through it " approach, i guess? 

just my $0.02. i really am no expert. so use what, if any, of this is helpful.

and consider talking to a registered dietician as well. 

best,

abby

 

Good Morning All,

 

I’ve had this questioning bouncing around in my head the past few days.  I’ve ordered Bacon’s book, have read Intuitive Eating and the various postings on here about accepting our bodies and understanding that we may or may not lose weight.  And, for the moderately overweight people around here I applaud that.  But what about for the 330lb 31 year old with Type 2 Diabetes?  If I don’t lose weight I’m going to die very prematurely.  Logic tells me that if I follow this process and live within what my body really wants it’ll make itself very clear that it doesn’t want to be 330lb and request food in quantities that reduces its size.  But, knowing I’m living inside of a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than it would if I was just dissatisfied with my appearance.  I don’t mean to diminish the concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I know weight is a very emotional issue for many people.

 

Jon

-- Abigail C. Wolfson, RN, MS, CPNPLICH School Based Health CenterBrooklyn New School & Brooklyn School for Collaborative Studies

610 Henry Street, Room 209Brooklyn, NY 11231 (fax)

[Guest guest]

I’m working with a dietitian.  She’s the one who first recommend

the IE book to me.  And I believe in it wholeheartedly.  But some days hearing

the talk about accepting your body and it’s ok if you don’t lose weight does

give me pause because for me no, no it’s not okay if I don’t lose weight.  This

is not a cosmetic issue or a self-esteem issue it’s a legitimate health issue

which will kill me.   I just want to be 100% comfortable in my own mind that

this is an acceptable journey for someone with a serious weight problem to

undertake.  My intuition (no pun intended) feels confident but the “afraid to

die and leave behind a wife and young child” side of my brain is a little concerned.

From:

IntuitiveEating_Support

[mailto:IntuitiveEating_Support ] On Behalf Of Theresa

Gilbert

Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 2:50 PM

To: IntuitiveEating_Support

Subject: Re: What about when not losing is not

an option?

Keep in mind that all dietitians are different - ask ahead

of time about the dietitians approach - is she/he familiar with IE?

Theresa

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 3:44 PM, Abigail Wolfson

wrote:

Jon,

I don't have all the answers by a

long shot... but one thought I have is: what made you get to where you are

today?

I suspect that dieting is a big

part of the problem, though of course I don't know your personal history. But

many of us on the group use food for emotional reasons... in essence, food

isn't at the heart of the problem; it's just a symptom. But dieting and

restricting to try to deal with the symptoms only worsens the underlying

problem.

Another thought: Something I have

been thinking about today, for myself, is trying to pay closer attention to how

certain foods make my body feel. Not exactly restricting, but thinking twice

before eating foods that I know make me feel unwell. So getting beyond just

" mouth hunger. "

A third thought: A piece of advice

I've read on here recently is trying to eat some protein with every snack. I

think this is a good idea, and vague enough that it shouldn't feel too

" diety. "

So maybe you could work on eating

some protein with your meals, plus thinking about why and what you eat...

non-judgementally, but just as a sort of anthropologist. sort of like your

journalling. how is that going, by the way?

i think you

could take these steps and they would fit in with IE but also allow you to feel

like you are doing something to " work " on your diabetes.

unfortunately, there's no quick

fix, no matter how severe the problem. but you already know that finding

another diet won't help. so this is the sort of " there's no way around it

but through it " approach, i guess?

just my $0.02. i really am no

expert. so use what, if any, of this is helpful.

and consider talking to a

registered dietician as well.

best,

abby

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 7:58 AM,

Karlen

wrote:

Good Morning All,

I’ve had this questioning bouncing around in my head the past

few days. I’ve ordered Bacon’s book, have read Intuitive Eating and

the various postings on here about accepting our bodies and understanding that

we may or may not lose weight. And, for the moderately overweight people

around here I applaud that. But what about for the 330lb 31 year old with

Type 2 Diabetes? If I don’t lose weight I’m going to die very

prematurely. Logic tells me that if I follow this process and live within

what my body really wants it’ll make itself very clear that it doesn’t want to

be 330lb and request food in quantities that reduces its size. But, knowing

I’m living inside of a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than

it would if I was just dissatisfied with my appearance. I don’t mean to

diminish the concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I know

weight is a very emotional issue for many people.

Jon

--

Abigail C. Wolfson, RN, MS, CPNP

LICH School Based Health Center

Brooklyn New School & Brooklyn School for Collaborative Studies

610 Henry Street, Room 209

Brooklyn, NY 11231

(fax)

[Guest guest]

Just to be devil's advocate... what if I said " you are absolutely right. you need to go ahead and lose some weight. " ... what would you do? if you had a way to do that, a way that would work for you and that was sustainable, you would've already done it, right? 

but for me, at least, and for many of us, we've found that dieting simply does not work. so in a sense, we dont have any other choices! we can learn to understand our bodies, and hope for the best, or we can go on beating ourselves up. 

so my hope is that IE will lead to better mental AND physical health. which starts with learning to love and accept myself now. this doesnt mean that i dont want to ever lose weight. just that i accept that this is where i am at now. and that i deserve love and compassion now. 

i HATE to mention any sort of weight loss things here, but one thing i've found helpful is McKenna's book, I Can Make You Thin. it's not a diet at all, the only thing he focuses on is learning to know when you are hungry and when you are full. this helped me quite a bit for a while, and i still think about it.

for some, though, even thinking about only eating when hungry is too restrictive. i found that i underate while doing it, which led to a backlash. 

 

I’m working with a dietitian.  She’s the one who first recommend

the IE book to me.  And I believe in it wholeheartedly.  But some days hearing

the talk about accepting your body and it’s ok if you don’t lose weight does

give me pause because for me no, no it’s not okay if I don’t lose weight.  This

is not a cosmetic issue or a self-esteem issue it’s a legitimate health issue

which will kill me.   I just want to be 100% comfortable in my own mind that

this is an acceptable journey for someone with a serious weight problem to

undertake.  My intuition (no pun intended) feels confident but the “afraid to

die and leave behind a wife and young child” side of my brain is a little concerned.

 

From:

IntuitiveEating_Support

[mailto:IntuitiveEating_Support ] On Behalf Of Theresa

Gilbert

Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 2:50 PM

To: IntuitiveEating_Support

Subject: Re: What about when not losing is not

an option?

 

 

Keep in mind that all dietitians are different - ask ahead

of time about the dietitians approach - is she/he familiar with IE?

Theresa

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 3:44 PM, Abigail Wolfson

wrote:

 

Jon,

 

I don't have all the answers by a

long shot... but one thought I have is: what made you get to where you are

today? 

 

I suspect that dieting is a big

part of the problem, though of course I don't know your personal history. But

many of us on the group use food for emotional reasons... in essence, food

isn't at the heart of the problem; it's just a symptom. But dieting and

restricting to try to deal with the symptoms only worsens the underlying

problem.

 

Another thought: Something I have

been thinking about today, for myself, is trying to pay closer attention to how

certain foods make my body feel. Not exactly restricting, but thinking twice

before eating foods that I know make me feel unwell. So getting beyond just

" mouth hunger. "  

 

A third thought: A piece of advice

I've read on here recently is trying to eat some protein with every snack. I

think this is a good idea, and vague enough that it shouldn't feel too

" diety. "

 

So maybe you could work on eating

some protein with your meals, plus thinking about why and what you eat...

non-judgementally, but just as a sort of anthropologist. sort of like your

journalling. how is that going, by the way? 

 

i think you

could take these steps and they would fit in with IE but also allow you to feel

like you are doing something to " work " on your diabetes.  

unfortunately, there's no quick

fix, no matter how severe the problem. but you already know that finding

another diet won't help. so this is the sort of " there's no way around it

but through it " approach, i guess? 

 

just my $0.02. i really am no

expert. so use what, if any, of this is helpful.

 

and consider talking to a

registered dietician as well. 

 

best,

 

abby

 

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 7:58 AM,

Karlen

wrote:

 

Good Morning All,

 

I’ve had this questioning bouncing around in my head the past

few days.  I’ve ordered Bacon’s book, have read Intuitive Eating and

the various postings on here about accepting our bodies and understanding that

we may or may not lose weight.  And, for the moderately overweight people

around here I applaud that.  But what about for the 330lb 31 year old with

Type 2 Diabetes?  If I don’t lose weight I’m going to die very

prematurely.  Logic tells me that if I follow this process and live within

what my body really wants it’ll make itself very clear that it doesn’t want to

be 330lb and request food in quantities that reduces its size.  But, knowing

I’m living inside of a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than

it would if I was just dissatisfied with my appearance.  I don’t mean to

diminish the concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I know

weight is a very emotional issue for many people.

 

Jon

--

Abigail C. Wolfson, RN, MS, CPNP

LICH School Based Health Center

Brooklyn New School & Brooklyn School for Collaborative Studies

610 Henry Street, Room 209

Brooklyn, NY 11231

(fax)

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Jon:

I had the same concerns as you and I am 125 pounds overweight and have high

blood pressure. I voiced these concerns here on this list about 8 months ago.

I gained 45 pounds. But 30 of it was rebound weight gain from coming off a

diet. So I really gained 15 pounds if you remove the diet scenerio.

I couldnt afford to gain an extra 15 pounds when I already could barely walk

without popping heavy duty pain pills.

What kept me from turning my back on Intuitive Eating was knowing that I had

nowhere else to turn. I knew that another diet would just mean more humiliation

and continual weight gain. What also kept me from going back to old familiar

ways was knowing that my body was more intelligent than I was giving it credit

for. That tiny inkling of hope and " knowing " kept me going to my counselor

(dietician) when I felt like crap. And I would walk in there and cry and

complain about how I'm still bingeing and gaining and and and and and......and

she would smile and remind me of the progress I was making. And I would feel

really puzzled. And then week after week the self hate started lessening and I

can remember posting here about taking 1 step forward and 3 steps back and just

really wanting to scream!!!

It wont happen overnight. It's not a quick fix. Yeah, you'll probably gain

some weight.

Is it worth it? YES!

My suggestion to you is to listen to what you say " logic tells me that if I

follow this process and live within what my body really

wants it'll make itself very clear that it doesn't want to be 330lb and request

food in quantities that reduces its size "

Eventually you wont have to doubt because it wont be a theory anymore. It will

be a " knowing " within you.

One more thing. Well, actually two more things. I toyed with the idea of

gastric bypass as a last chance quick fix. And those times when I would get so

frustrated I would consider it. And what stopped me was knowing that it really

was just another form of dieting - just really drastic. It still would not fix

what is messed up in my head. The other thing was what the list owner on this

group had mentioned that was very helpful - once your body does start to

regulate itself, even a small amount of weight lost will positively affect your

health. This was helpful to me because I always was picturing myself having to

be thin to have health and less knee pain. It turns out this is not true.

I hope that you can trust what your body already knows. you just need to be

still and listen to it. trust.

Hugs to you,

Deb

>

> Good Morning All,

>

>

>

> I've had this questioning bouncing around in my head the past few days.

> I've ordered Bacon's book, have read Intuitive Eating and the various

> postings on here about accepting our bodies and understanding that we may or

> may not lose weight. And, for the moderately overweight people around here

> I applaud that. But what about for the 330lb 31 year old with Type 2

> Diabetes? If I don't lose weight I'm going to die very prematurely. Logic

> tells me that if I follow this process and live within what my body really

> wants it'll make itself very clear that it doesn't want to be 330lb and

> request food in quantities that reduces its size. But, knowing I'm living

> inside of a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than it

> would if I was just dissatisfied with my appearance. I don't mean to

> diminish the concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I

> know weight is a very emotional issue for many people.

>

>

>

> Jon

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Jon,

Me again! I'm on a roll tonight! What can I say, I'm snowed in here in PA!

Here is the answer to what you have written below.

Once you begin to start accepting your body, it frees you! Yes, we all want

health and to be at a healthy weight. Accepting your body right now does not

mean you are giving up on your good health. What it means is what I had

mentioned before in my post - this change in mindset will " catapult " you into a

new way of thinking about yourself - of caring for yourself - of wanting health

- on your terms. It's a way to be gentle and self-loving. You already have

expressed the desire to care for yourself. So there is no way it will not

happen!

Keep going to that dietician and keep asking for help. Post when things are

good and more importantly post when things are not so good. Life just IS.

We're here to help support you!

Hugs to you,

Deb

>

> I'm working with a dietitian. She's the one who first recommend the IE book

> to me. And I believe in it wholeheartedly. But some days hearing the talk

> about accepting your body and it's ok if you don't lose weight does give me

> pause because for me no, no it's not okay if I don't lose weight. This is

> not a cosmetic issue or a self-esteem issue it's a legitimate health issue

> which will kill me. I just want to be 100% comfortable in my own mind that

> this is an acceptable journey for someone with a serious weight problem to

> undertake. My intuition (no pun intended) feels confident but the " afraid

> to die and leave behind a wife and young child " side of my brain is a little

> concerned.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I so know how you feel. While I am not diabetic, diabetes runs rampant in my

family, both my Mom and my Uncle have the disease. I am only 5ft and weigh

around 250 lbs. When I started IE about 3 years ago I was probably around 220

lbs. I also have high blood pressure. I am extremely concerned about my weight

and how it impacts my health.

When I started IE and started adding in foods that I had forbidden most of my

life and made myself so wrong and bad for eating when I did eat them I at first

gained weight. And I freaked out (just ask Gillian!) My clothes were getting

tighter and tighter. And I didn't feel good. My first step for me I think was

to go out and get clothes that fit me in the here and now and I felt really

attractive in them. I really worked on just loving my body and talking really

nicely to it. And I came up with my own mantras like " I am beautiful just the

way I am because God created me " . I really started to believe it. I started to

see myself as a beautiful, sexy, attractive woman. Once I did all that, I

stopped freaking out and I stopped gaining weight. I have been able to maintain

my weight now for over 6 months. I cannot tell you how huge this was for me to

stay the same weight for 6 months! I had always fluctuated - lost weight,

gained weight - you know the yo-yo syndrome.

Now I believe I might be starting to drop some weight. I don't know for sure

because I refuse to step on scale except when I go in for my BP checks. I am

guessing by how I feel and how my clothes feel.

I know that another gal who was recently diagnosed with diabetes on here has had

tremendous success with incorporating IE with the Schwarzbein Principle. Might

be something you want to check out. I myself am working at just eating more all

natural foods - staying away from pre-packaged, pre-processed foods. I have to

say I feel soooooo much better when I eat this way. I don't all the time, but

that's what I strive to do 80% of the time.

Whatever you decide to do, just remember you don't have to be 100% perfect.

Work at paying attention to how your body reacts to sugar, carbs, grains, milk

products,fruit, alcohol etc. Anything that turns to sugar (glucose) rather

quickly in the body. I think if you do that your body will tell you what foods

raise your blood sugar. I believe using a glucose meter can also help you to do

so. My Mom has learned that white rice will raise her sugar levels higher than

anything. For my uncle it's milk products. I think the key with diabetes is

learning to listen to you body and knowing what foods drive up the blood sugar

but otherwise incorporating a balanced, all-foods-in-moderation attitude.

I wish you lots of luck on this endeavor. I know how scary it can be. Try to

relax and just listen to your body. It really does know and will guide it if

you let it. And then remember that you were created uniquely and beautifully.

You are special, regardless of your body size.

Alana

>

> Good Morning All,

>

>

>

> I've had this questioning bouncing around in my head the past few days.

> I've ordered Bacon's book, have read Intuitive Eating and the various

> postings on here about accepting our bodies and understanding that we may or

> may not lose weight. And, for the moderately overweight people around here

> I applaud that. But what about for the 330lb 31 year old with Type 2

> Diabetes? If I don't lose weight I'm going to die very prematurely. Logic

> tells me that if I follow this process and live within what my body really

> wants it'll make itself very clear that it doesn't want to be 330lb and

> request food in quantities that reduces its size. But, knowing I'm living

> inside of a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than it

> would if I was just dissatisfied with my appearance. I don't mean to

> diminish the concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I

> know weight is a very emotional issue for many people.

>

>

>

> Jon

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Jon,

I have acid reflux, osteopenia (precursor to osteoporosis, which both

my mom and my younger sister have), and a genetic propensity towards

heart disease because my father is Indian (South Asians have the

highest incidence of heart disease in the world). I'm also a good 90

lbs. over a healthy weight for me. There are some things I really

can't eat or drink at all and some I have to be moderate about. With

the acid reflux, it's pretty easy because if I eat something I

shouldn't, I physically don't feel well. With the other, it's less

simple. I do try to be conscious of healthy eating and to have plenty

of choices around that are healthy, and a lot of times that's what I

want to eat, but not always. For me, if I'm not binging then I feel

it's OK.

As far as the weight loss goes, if I'm truly eating intuitively and

allowing my body to choose the right foods for it, I will lose weight

at some point. I know my body well enough to know that it will happen,

so I can relax a little about it even though part of me wants to lose

weight and lose it Right Now. Learning to eat intuitively and reduce

the binging is where most of the work is for me. After 40 years of

being on a diet/binge cycle, I *know* dieting will never work for me.

Knowing it and learning to let go of it are two different things. I

understand your fear, as it has often pushed me back onto the diet

track, but don't let the fear take over.

Sohni

Karlen wrote:

Good Morning All,

I’ve had this questioning bouncing around in my

head

the past few days. I’ve ordered Bacon’s book, have read

Intuitive Eating and the various postings on here about accepting our

bodies

and understanding that we may or may not lose weight. And, for the

moderately overweight people around here I applaud that. But what

about

for the 330lb 31 year old with Type 2 Diabetes? If I don’t lose

weight I’m going to die very prematurely. Logic tells me that if I

follow

this process and live within what my body really wants it’ll make

itself

very clear that it doesn’t want to be 330lb and request food in

quantities that reduces its size. But, knowing I’m living inside of

a ticking time bomb makes it harder to accept my size than it would if

I was

just dissatisfied with my appearance. I don’t mean to diminish the

concerns of those who are less overweight than me because I know weight

is a

very emotional issue for many people.

Jon