Re: It feels like my nada is dead to me

[Guest guest]

I think I understand where you're coming from. It was a couple of years ago

(closer to three years now) that my Sister told me about the big blowout that

she'd had with our nada over the things nada said about us, and it affected me

as though it was a hard punch in the stomach. I couldn't breathe; I gasped, I

felt pain, I cried. It was because I'd finally absorbed the reality that a

person who says something like that about me (and Sister and her son) really

doesn't love me, and it was very much like being told my mom had died. It was

my illusion that died, I suppose, or my hope that died, or my belief/fantasy

that there was something there that was like a real mother-daughter

relationship.

I think that in a similar way, your nada has (seemingly) done everything in her

power to push you away from her, but then blame you for it! *Your mother* is

the one who has been deliberately " making a stranger " of *you* all along, yet

she projects her intentions and behaviors onto you! Its so ironic that they do

that, that they *can* do that to their own kids. They reject us and they revile

us and they hurt us (or suck us dry with their unfillable black hole of need)

yet when we finally do pull away out of sheer self-preservation, the bpd mom

will triumphantly screech, " You ingrate! You bad, worthless, rotten child!

You're abandoning your poor old mother! How could you!? " ( " Do you want that

list in triplicate? " would be my answer, now.)

Kids, even adult kids, are so easy to manipulate. We're in a one-down position

of being chemically, genetically, evolutionarily hardwired to trust the

individual who gave birth to us, and we're just s**t out of luck if that

individual turns out to be mentally ill, hostile, rejecting, punitive, uncaring,

negligent, abusive, or otherwise a negative influence on us.

Its sort of like being born to a monitor lizard; you have to just hope that the

monitor lizard doesn't wander back to her nest and start eating her own eggs and

hatchlings.

-Annie

>

> I am in a place of almost no contact with nada. And not necessarily by

> my own design or wishes. I envisioned something quite different. But

> have given up my dream.

>

> I can't heal a relationship in which nada wants me to send everything

> to a PO Box; I find myself completely unmotivated to share anything

> with my parents under those conditions. I am pretty sure that

> inclination is not based on resentment.

>

> In my last communication, I was late in sending her and my mom in

> law's birthday cards (they share the same birthday) and wanted both

> moms to get their cards in time. So, I sent the nada's birthday card

> to her home address.

>

> My nada called me the day before her birthday (she got her card on

> time! Her birthday was Sunday) to complain that she did not want mail

> sent to her home address. I felt my gut wrench and my eyes rolled. I

> immediately put her on speaker phone so that I would not be alone with

> this snippy bitchy voice in my ear. When I could hear her again, I

> almost said, " You called to tell me that? " , but instead I said,

> " You're still there? Your concern today is about mail being sent to

> your PO Box? " She got the drift from my very very gentle upbraid, and

> she changed her tone. " Thank you for your card... it was nice... " of

> course she got back on her track, " I need to have you send mail to

> the PO Box... " I said nothing but was irritated (pointless and just

> aggravating to mention that to nada)...

>

> What I find irritatiing is that I really suspect my mom does not go

> to her po box but once a week. It is over twenty miles from her house

> and she is more and more afraid to drive for being caught by police.

> Since she never responds to the mail I send to her PO box, but she

> will at least call when I send to her home address. If I want my

> letters to be REAL communication, why would I want to send them to a

> black hole .... the PO Box?

>

> I sent a card to my folks' PO Box when we knew we were visiting their

> home state this summer and I never heard PEEP about that letter. Many

> of you may remember that we never saw my folks after 16 years of not

> visiting their home state.

>

> I'm trying though to honor her wishes, just so that I can really see

> the place where the boat rocks. My mom is pointing out just where I

> rock the boat and the lengths she is going to... to make ME behave...

> is really interesting. By following her orders (hard as it is for me

> because I am the rebel) I see that her whole world is loony tunes, and

> that I am not to blame. Nothing I can do to honor her wishes will make

> a difference in how I am treated.

>

> So actually I don't get her motivation for trying to control my

> communications with her. I've come to suspect my nada is trying to

> make me an outsider. She is giving support to my brother at this time

> (and that is fine by me; if he lives close to her and puts up with

> her, he deserves some pay backs), and so I think she wants to make me

> out as undeserving of help. She's decided I wasted money by going to

> college because I did not get a scholarship. She is all the time

> suspecting I am going to go to the psychiatric hospital because I am

> not home to answer her calls... she wants me to have problems of my

> own making... that are undeserving of her help... that I am totally to

> blame for. That way she can justify cutting me out of the family circle.

>

> I have a spiritual belief that sustains me, and I am fairly certain

> that I was spared that visit with nada and my dad when we were on our

> vacation in July. I think the visit would have hurt and hindered me,

> and my higher power helped us to pass by like ships in the night.What

> is wonderful is I was transparent about our visit. I was not sneaking

> around. I was out in the open enjoying great visits with people that

> love me, and know what love MEANS.

>

> Nada may find her way to blame me for not putting out more effort to

> see her. But darn, if someone is not wanting you to write to their

> home address, how much would they like a surprise visit from you at

> their doorstep? I am not that much of a rebel, nor do I revel in

> masochism enough to do that! So, I did not go to " any length " to see

> her, and I am quite sure she has some snide story to tell about that.

> Interestingly, she does not dare tell that story to me. If she is

> insisting on telling that story to my father, then I give up on both

> of them!

>

> Of course, I don't know that my speculations are true, and the best

> thing for me is to be happy where I am.

>

> Fact is, I am totally powerless over getting what I want. But I think

> it would be good for me to write down what I want from family and see

> where it IS possible to get what I NEED. Then pray for and take steps

> myself towards getting my needs met.

>

> At first that bugged me that my mom marginalized me. I wanted to

> fight back, make the truth known. Call her cards. All of that, is

> actually just wasted effort, like pissing into the wind. I end up wet

> and smelly and feeling bad .

>

> My brother suggested when he was in his late twenties (he's a father

> of three now, and in his mid-40's), that I " throw in the towel " way

> back then (on my last visit 16 years ago!). Oh I resisted. Now I

> realize the analogy that works for me, the fighter: Let go and let

> God do the fight for me.

>

> Today, I am in greater peace, knowing I don't have the power to change

> the situation. Only by my prayers can I change my perceptions and

> change the world that is in my sphere of influence. Um, living where I

> live, in the Southeast, my sphere of influence just does NOT extend to

> Puget Sound.

>

> From my distant seat, far far from the stage, I feel like I am

> being given the chance to experience my nada's death, even to prepare

> for that eventuality.

>

> In fact, my nada told me early on, " You're going to grow up and become

> a stranger. " I think she told me that as I entered puberty. Well, my

> secret struggle was that I was not going to let that prophesy come

> true. I was so afraid of being blamed, that I fought that prophesy my

> entire adult life. When I shared my secret mission with my husband he

> told me, " She is the one who made you a stranger. " Those words were

> the ones that really felt true, really felt like they might heal me.

> The only person who can be healed in our relationship.

>

> Just for today I have peace with ME healing ME, because I know I did

> my best to redeem her and it is not possible. My best is good enough

> for me and I have nothing more to prove. My dad, who some might call

> a dishrag, gave me that second mantra when I was in college doing math

> that was not my calling. He said, " You have nothing to prove. " I apply

> those words to all kinds of situations, where my best efforts avail me

> nothing. If he only knew, I am certain he would be proud of me.

>

> My dad, despite his quietness, is a realist. He gave me what he

> could, and I have made that better life. Moving on,

>

> Oh, to be sure, I am bound to have set backs, but I can see a clearer

> road ahead, even as I prepare for challenges.

>

> Thanks " invisible " dad for that powerful thought. And bigger thanks to

> my husband for being the kind of man who WILL stand up to my nada, on

> my behalf. Invisible dad would never do that within eyeshot or earshot

> of nada.

>

> I am very very grateful for the gifts I was given. I am outliving the

> legacy of my nada and her mother. May my nada rest in peace. She is

> beginning to do so in my heart, TODAY. That peace is my " revenge "

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

From the title of the e-mail, I felt the same way about my nada after my dad

passed away, anything good left her and she became completely evil.

proflaf

Subject: Re: It feels like my nada is " dead " to me

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Date: Saturday, September 4, 2010, 1:50 PM

 

I think I understand where you're coming from. It was a couple of years

ago (closer to three years now) that my Sister told me about the big blowout

that she'd had with our nada over the things nada said about us, and it affected

me as though it was a hard punch in the stomach. I couldn't breathe; I gasped, I

felt pain, I cried. It was because I'd finally absorbed the reality that a

person who says something like that about me (and Sister and her son) really

doesn't love me, and it was very much like being told my mom had died. It was

my illusion that died, I suppose, or my hope that died, or my belief/fantasy

that there was something there that was like a real mother-daughter

relationship.

I think that in a similar way, your nada has (seemingly) done everything in her

power to push you away from her, but then blame you for it! *Your mother* is

the one who has been deliberately " making a stranger " of *you* all along, yet

she projects her intentions and behaviors onto you! Its so ironic that they do

that, that they *can* do that to their own kids. They reject us and they revile

us and they hurt us (or suck us dry with their unfillable black hole of need)

yet when we finally do pull away out of sheer self-preservation, the bpd mom

will triumphantly screech, " You ingrate! You bad, worthless, rotten child!

You're abandoning your poor old mother! How could you!? " ( " Do you want that

list in triplicate? " would be my answer, now.)

Kids, even adult kids, are so easy to manipulate. We're in a one-down position

of being chemically, genetically, evolutionarily hardwired to trust the

individual who gave birth to us, and we're just s**t out of luck if that

individual turns out to be mentally ill, hostile, rejecting, punitive, uncaring,

negligent, abusive, or otherwise a negative influence on us.

Its sort of like being born to a monitor lizard; you have to just hope that the

monitor lizard doesn't wander back to her nest and start eating her own eggs and

hatchlings.

-Annie

>

> I am in a place of almost no contact with nada. And not necessarily by

> my own design or wishes. I envisioned something quite different. But

> have given up my dream.

>

> I can't heal a relationship in which nada wants me to send everything

> to a PO Box; I find myself completely unmotivated to share anything

> with my parents under those conditions. I am pretty sure that

> inclination is not based on resentment.

>

> In my last communication, I was late in sending her and my mom in

> law's birthday cards (they share the same birthday) and wanted both

> moms to get their cards in time. So, I sent the nada's birthday card

> to her home address.

>

> My nada called me the day before her birthday (she got her card on

> time! Her birthday was Sunday) to complain that she did not want mail

> sent to her home address. I felt my gut wrench and my eyes rolled. I

> immediately put her on speaker phone so that I would not be alone with

> this snippy bitchy voice in my ear. When I could hear her again, I

> almost said, " You called to tell me that? " , but instead I said,

> " You're still there? Your concern today is about mail being sent to

> your PO Box? " She got the drift from my very very gentle upbraid, and

> she changed her tone. " Thank you for your card... it was nice... " of

> course she got back on her track, " I need to have you send mail to

> the PO Box... " I said nothing but was irritated (pointless and just

> aggravating to mention that to nada)...

>

> What I find irritatiing is that I really suspect my mom does not go

> to her po box but once a week. It is over twenty miles from her house

> and she is more and more afraid to drive for being caught by police.

> Since she never responds to the mail I send to her PO box, but she

> will at least call when I send to her home address. If I want my

> letters to be REAL communication, why would I want to send them to a

> black hole .... the PO Box?

>

> I sent a card to my folks' PO Box when we knew we were visiting their

> home state this summer and I never heard PEEP about that letter. Many

> of you may remember that we never saw my folks after 16 years of not

> visiting their home state.

>

> I'm trying though to honor her wishes, just so that I can really see

> the place where the boat rocks. My mom is pointing out just where I

> rock the boat and the lengths she is going to... to make ME behave...

> is really interesting. By following her orders (hard as it is for me

> because I am the rebel) I see that her whole world is loony tunes, and

> that I am not to blame. Nothing I can do to honor her wishes will make

> a difference in how I am treated.

>

> So actually I don't get her motivation for trying to control my

> communications with her. I've come to suspect my nada is trying to

> make me an outsider. She is giving support to my brother at this time

> (and that is fine by me; if he lives close to her and puts up with

> her, he deserves some pay backs), and so I think she wants to make me

> out as undeserving of help. She's decided I wasted money by going to

> college because I did not get a scholarship. She is all the time

> suspecting I am going to go to the psychiatric hospital because I am

> not home to answer her calls... she wants me to have problems of my

> own making... that are undeserving of her help... that I am totally to

> blame for. That way she can justify cutting me out of the family circle.

>

> I have a spiritual belief that sustains me, and I am fairly certain

> that I was spared that visit with nada and my dad when we were on our

> vacation in July. I think the visit would have hurt and hindered me,

> and my higher power helped us to pass by like ships in the night.What

> is wonderful is I was transparent about our visit. I was not sneaking

> around. I was out in the open enjoying great visits with people that

> love me, and know what love MEANS.

>

> Nada may find her way to blame me for not putting out more effort to

> see her. But darn, if someone is not wanting you to write to their

> home address, how much would they like a surprise visit from you at

> their doorstep? I am not that much of a rebel, nor do I revel in

> masochism enough to do that! So, I did not go to " any length " to see

> her, and I am quite sure she has some snide story to tell about that.

> Interestingly, she does not dare tell that story to me. If she is

> insisting on telling that story to my father, then I give up on both

> of them!

>

> Of course, I don't know that my speculations are true, and the best

> thing for me is to be happy where I am.

>

> Fact is, I am totally powerless over getting what I want. But I think

> it would be good for me to write down what I want from family and see

> where it IS possible to get what I NEED. Then pray for and take steps

> myself towards getting my needs met.

>

> At first that bugged me that my mom marginalized me. I wanted to

> fight back, make the truth known. Call her cards. All of that, is

> actually just wasted effort, like pissing into the wind. I end up wet

> and smelly and feeling bad .

>

> My brother suggested when he was in his late twenties (he's a father

> of three now, and in his mid-40's), that I " throw in the towel " way

> back then (on my last visit 16 years ago!). Oh I resisted. Now I

> realize the analogy that works for me, the fighter: Let go and let

> God do the fight for me.

>

> Today, I am in greater peace, knowing I don't have the power to change

> the situation. Only by my prayers can I change my perceptions and

> change the world that is in my sphere of influence. Um, living where I

> live, in the Southeast, my sphere of influence just does NOT extend to

> Puget Sound.

>

> From my distant seat, far far from the stage, I feel like I am

> being given the chance to experience my nada's death, even to prepare

> for that eventuality.

>

> In fact, my nada told me early on, " You're going to grow up and become

> a stranger. " I think she told me that as I entered puberty. Well, my

> secret struggle was that I was not going to let that prophesy come

> true. I was so afraid of being blamed, that I fought that prophesy my

> entire adult life. When I shared my secret mission with my husband he

> told me, " She is the one who made you a stranger. " Those words were

> the ones that really felt true, really felt like they might heal me.

> The only person who can be healed in our relationship.

>

> Just for today I have peace with ME healing ME, because I know I did

> my best to redeem her and it is not possible. My best is good enough

> for me and I have nothing more to prove. My dad, who some might call

> a dishrag, gave me that second mantra when I was in college doing math

> that was not my calling. He said, " You have nothing to prove. " I apply

> those words to all kinds of situations, where my best efforts avail me

> nothing. If he only knew, I am certain he would be proud of me.

>

> My dad, despite his quietness, is a realist. He gave me what he

> could, and I have made that better life. Moving on,

>

> Oh, to be sure, I am bound to have set backs, but I can see a clearer

> road ahead, even as I prepare for challenges.

>

> Thanks " invisible " dad for that powerful thought. And bigger thanks to

> my husband for being the kind of man who WILL stand up to my nada, on

> my behalf. Invisible dad would never do that within eyeshot or earshot

> of nada.

>

> I am very very grateful for the gifts I was given. I am outliving the

> legacy of my nada and her mother. May my nada rest in peace. She is

> beginning to do so in my heart, TODAY. That peace is my " revenge "

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I very much agree with the feeling that we are programmed to love our parents.

It can be the hardest thing in the world to let go of that and allow yourself to

cut ties.

> >

> > I am in a place of almost no contact with nada. And not necessarily by

> > my own design or wishes. I envisioned something quite different. But

> > have given up my dream.

> >

> > I can't heal a relationship in which nada wants me to send everything

> > to a PO Box; I find myself completely unmotivated to share anything

> > with my parents under those conditions. I am pretty sure that

> > inclination is not based on resentment.

> >

> > In my last communication, I was late in sending her and my mom in

> > law's birthday cards (they share the same birthday) and wanted both

> > moms to get their cards in time. So, I sent the nada's birthday card

> > to her home address.

> >

> > My nada called me the day before her birthday (she got her card on

> > time! Her birthday was Sunday) to complain that she did not want mail

> > sent to her home address. I felt my gut wrench and my eyes rolled. I

> > immediately put her on speaker phone so that I would not be alone with

> > this snippy bitchy voice in my ear. When I could hear her again, I

> > almost said, " You called to tell me that? " , but instead I said,

> > " You're still there? Your concern today is about mail being sent to

> > your PO Box? " She got the drift from my very very gentle upbraid, and

> > she changed her tone. " Thank you for your card... it was nice... " of

> > course she got back on her track, " I need to have you send mail to

> > the PO Box... " I said nothing but was irritated (pointless and just

> > aggravating to mention that to nada)...

> >

> > What I find irritatiing is that I really suspect my mom does not go

> > to her po box but once a week. It is over twenty miles from her house

> > and she is more and more afraid to drive for being caught by police.

> > Since she never responds to the mail I send to her PO box, but she

> > will at least call when I send to her home address. If I want my

> > letters to be REAL communication, why would I want to send them to a

> > black hole .... the PO Box?

> >

> > I sent a card to my folks' PO Box when we knew we were visiting their

> > home state this summer and I never heard PEEP about that letter. Many

> > of you may remember that we never saw my folks after 16 years of not

> > visiting their home state.

> >

> > I'm trying though to honor her wishes, just so that I can really see

> > the place where the boat rocks. My mom is pointing out just where I

> > rock the boat and the lengths she is going to... to make ME behave...

> > is really interesting. By following her orders (hard as it is for me

> > because I am the rebel) I see that her whole world is loony tunes, and

> > that I am not to blame. Nothing I can do to honor her wishes will make

> > a difference in how I am treated.

> >

> > So actually I don't get her motivation for trying to control my

> > communications with her. I've come to suspect my nada is trying to

> > make me an outsider. She is giving support to my brother at this time

> > (and that is fine by me; if he lives close to her and puts up with

> > her, he deserves some pay backs), and so I think she wants to make me

> > out as undeserving of help. She's decided I wasted money by going to

> > college because I did not get a scholarship. She is all the time

> > suspecting I am going to go to the psychiatric hospital because I am

> > not home to answer her calls... she wants me to have problems of my

> > own making... that are undeserving of her help... that I am totally to

> > blame for. That way she can justify cutting me out of the family circle.

> >

> > I have a spiritual belief that sustains me, and I am fairly certain

> > that I was spared that visit with nada and my dad when we were on our

> > vacation in July. I think the visit would have hurt and hindered me,

> > and my higher power helped us to pass by like ships in the night.What

> > is wonderful is I was transparent about our visit. I was not sneaking

> > around. I was out in the open enjoying great visits with people that

> > love me, and know what love MEANS.

> >

> > Nada may find her way to blame me for not putting out more effort to

> > see her. But darn, if someone is not wanting you to write to their

> > home address, how much would they like a surprise visit from you at

> > their doorstep? I am not that much of a rebel, nor do I revel in

> > masochism enough to do that! So, I did not go to " any length " to see

> > her, and I am quite sure she has some snide story to tell about that.

> > Interestingly, she does not dare tell that story to me. If she is

> > insisting on telling that story to my father, then I give up on both

> > of them!

> >

> > Of course, I don't know that my speculations are true, and the best

> > thing for me is to be happy where I am.

> >

> > Fact is, I am totally powerless over getting what I want. But I think

> > it would be good for me to write down what I want from family and see

> > where it IS possible to get what I NEED. Then pray for and take steps

> > myself towards getting my needs met.

> >

> > At first that bugged me that my mom marginalized me. I wanted to

> > fight back, make the truth known. Call her cards. All of that, is

> > actually just wasted effort, like pissing into the wind. I end up wet

> > and smelly and feeling bad .

> >

> > My brother suggested when he was in his late twenties (he's a father

> > of three now, and in his mid-40's), that I " throw in the towel " way

> > back then (on my last visit 16 years ago!). Oh I resisted. Now I

> > realize the analogy that works for me, the fighter: Let go and let

> > God do the fight for me.

> >

> > Today, I am in greater peace, knowing I don't have the power to change

> > the situation. Only by my prayers can I change my perceptions and

> > change the world that is in my sphere of influence. Um, living where I

> > live, in the Southeast, my sphere of influence just does NOT extend to

> > Puget Sound.

> >

> > From my distant seat, far far from the stage, I feel like I am

> > being given the chance to experience my nada's death, even to prepare

> > for that eventuality.

> >

> > In fact, my nada told me early on, " You're going to grow up and become

> > a stranger. " I think she told me that as I entered puberty. Well, my

> > secret struggle was that I was not going to let that prophesy come

> > true. I was so afraid of being blamed, that I fought that prophesy my

> > entire adult life. When I shared my secret mission with my husband he

> > told me, " She is the one who made you a stranger. " Those words were

> > the ones that really felt true, really felt like they might heal me.

> > The only person who can be healed in our relationship.

> >

> > Just for today I have peace with ME healing ME, because I know I did

> > my best to redeem her and it is not possible. My best is good enough

> > for me and I have nothing more to prove. My dad, who some might call

> > a dishrag, gave me that second mantra when I was in college doing math

> > that was not my calling. He said, " You have nothing to prove. " I apply

> > those words to all kinds of situations, where my best efforts avail me

> > nothing. If he only knew, I am certain he would be proud of me.

> >

> > My dad, despite his quietness, is a realist. He gave me what he

> > could, and I have made that better life. Moving on,

> >

> > Oh, to be sure, I am bound to have set backs, but I can see a clearer

> > road ahead, even as I prepare for challenges.

> >

> > Thanks " invisible " dad for that powerful thought. And bigger thanks to

> > my husband for being the kind of man who WILL stand up to my nada, on

> > my behalf. Invisible dad would never do that within eyeshot or earshot

> > of nada.

> >

> > I am very very grateful for the gifts I was given. I am outliving the

> > legacy of my nada and her mother. May my nada rest in peace. She is

> > beginning to do so in my heart, TODAY. That peace is my " revenge "

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Joe, Stefanie, Annie, and EVERYONE who commented on my share.

It helps so much to have witnesses as I continue to do the work of

" passing over " to the other side.

At times it has been frustrating, to see my story always twisted by

nada. Here, I get to see that everything does hang straight. And when

I am still crooked, I get told where *I* can fly right. Really fly

right, without having to pretend I have a broken wing, so as not to be

attacked.

I get stronger and stronger, even as I know I am hard-wired to love

the parent who can be so harmful to me. But with better tools I make

sure I stay out of harm's way.

It is OK for her to be dead to me. I mean, I don't need to feel

guilty and try to take back a responsibility that is not mine. Even if

I COULD fix our relationship, nada wouldn't let me! She would still

find a way to get black paint all over my face and then say, " see I

knew you were black! "

I think nada's have to " die " in order to lose their power. The subject

of separate identity that has been brought up here is a very helpful

one. If we don't separate fully from our nada/fada, then we allow them

to live in our heads and that exactly where they CAN drive us crazy

(even if we are no contact)!

Sighing,

smithvictoria@...