Re: my mother's shadow on my marriage

[Guest guest]

no wonder you feel alone - you are literally the only one who can understand

her!!!!

First, I wonder what you can choose to do to make this time of year more

fun? See mama less? Hell ya! Wrap fewer gifts - or pay kids to wrap them or

take them to the mall to be wrapped? Serve an Entselman's danish on

Christmas? Whatever you want lady!!! It's your damn holiday.

as for me, i dress my pets up for the holidays like a crazy cat lady, I make

chili on Thanksgiving, I do stupid stuff. we joke (haven't done it yet)

about putting on ridiculous outfits and Halloween carolling the neighbors.

Ha ha, i think it would be uncomfortable for everyone and it makes me laugh.

Anything to get through the reminders that I am alone, I have no extended

family. Its just me, the boyfriend and the dogs. but guess what? its enough!

But its your life, your time and your choice to enjoy it!! Also, checking

with your doc and adjusting your meds might not hurt. I keep standing appts

during the winter months.

Hugs and good luck!

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 7:47 AM, Fiona wrote:

>

>

> Hi everyone,

>

> I really loathe this time of year. It's like a tapeworm inside me, slowly

> eating me and tormenting me.

>

> I've been wondering and ruminating about it: what is it about September to

> December that makes me so unsettled and so unhappy?

>

> Part of it is that I am the gift buyer and wrapper in my family (we have a

> LOT of birthdays in the fall in my family, plus of course, there's the

> holidays). I'm the one that has to make it an " experience " for my kids. They

> MUST smell french toast cooking Christmas morning! If they don't, they'll

> have no special memories to share when they're older. " I drive myself crazy

> with this stuff.

>

> The other part of it is having to see my mother much more than usual.

> She came over yesterday with gifts for my kids' birthdays, which is great,

> but she doesn't let anyone else talk. It's all her, The Mom Show, talk talk

> talk. THEN she starts talking even faster in her native language. My husband

> and kids don't speak it; I do and made no effort to ask her to speak in

> English so they'll understand.

>

> I don't want them to understand. I don't want the worlds to collide.

>

> What I mean by that is, my husband is such a wonderful person but he REALLY

> doesn't get what a hell it is with my mother. Her complete disinterest in

> connecting with me or her grandchildren. Yes, she loves us but love means

> sitting and listening to her prattle on. It means not doing ANYthing that

> will worry her. It means telling her every last detail of my life and

> agreeing with her about everything.

>

> I try not to bring the 2 worlds of her and my immediate family together. I

> don't like it and can't tolerate the discomfort of it.

>

> Anyway, some of you know that my husband and daughter went to Yellowstone

> Park this summer for a week. I didn't tell my mother for my own sanity.

> Yesterday, she came to visit and I accidentally gave her a cup of coffee in

> a Yellowstone mug. (I wonder now if I unconsciously WANT her to know!)

>

> I could not believe it and was hoping to get it from her before she

> noticed. Too late. " Yellowstone, " she said. So my normally wonderful husband

> starts up: " Did you see our vacation pictures, mama? " I was mortified and

> gave him a look. It didn't work.

>

> My mother's response, part fearful-phobic-anxious, part self-absorbed was,

> " oh, no, I wouldn't ever want to go there. Didn't you hear about the

> Argentine couple that was brutally murdered there?? "

>

> So my husband and daughter start laughing and he says, " Hey Molly, don't

> ever go to Yellowstone, ok? " My mother still didn't get it.

>

> THEN my husband says, " hey mama, would you like some more coffee in your

> YELLOWSTONE cup?? "

>

> I don't think I've ever been so pissed at my husband. He was being a real

> jackass. Again, my mother didn't even notice, just blabbing on like someone

> you'd see at a bus terminal. I just pretended to listen to her, laughing

> along with her but inside so upset and feeling betrayed by him. I just let

> her go on in her language, purposefully leaving him out until he got bored

> and left.

>

> I just felt so powerless and really, so stupid...so what if she knew?? It

> was like I was an adolescent again.

>

> But if we'd told her, she would have put on her big, dramatic, tearful

> show...why didn't you TELL me??...it's like I'm not a part of this

> family...you've all been laughing at me...and so on....

>

> But he doesn't get that. And it's so hard to explain. He usually will at

> least try to understand but this time, I guess he'd had it.

>

> Anyway, I'm just venting. I feel so alone sometimes dealing with my mother.

> Sometimes I feel like it gets better but then I realize it never changed.

> She still wants to swallow me up.

>

> I had been so optimistic because she found another victim to call 4 times a

> day but this person went on vacation this week and now my mother's back to

> calling me frequently. It really sucks and I can't wait for victim to return

> from vacation.

>

> Thanks for listening.

>

> Fiona

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Fiona,

My mother and I speak a different language then my hubby and kids. I can so

relate with you on not letting the two worlds cross. My kids and hubby know

my mother is crazy but they really have no idea what words come out of this

women's mouth..the insane things she says.

My husband does like yours an usually knows to be quite by the look I give

because like you my mother insist on knowing everything if she doesn't it's

as if we have purposely neglected to tell her..or as she would say trying to

fool her.

For us it's more along the lines of we couldn't go away alone with out

asking my parents to come...God forbid we went somewhere without my parents

I would hear it for weeks. So Some times we would escape and not tell her I

went away..My husband would slip up at times because he was happy to be

going on vacation and he would just come right out and tell her without

realizing that the fact that because we didn't ask her to come would now

cost me months of jabs and guilt trips.

Sometimes my husband doesn't get it like. I tell him you can't tell my

mother things we did when we were teenagers..even though we are older and

married now for many years..she will not find it funny..yes I know I'm 42

but my mother will still have my hide for lying to her or doing things

behind her back...he doesn't seem to understand

Stefanie

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 9:47 AM, Fiona wrote:

>

>

> Hi everyone,

>

> I really loathe this time of year. It's like a tapeworm inside me, slowly

> eating me and tormenting me.

>

> I've been wondering and ruminating about it: what is it about September to

> December that makes me so unsettled and so unhappy?

>

> Part of it is that I am the gift buyer and wrapper in my family (we have a

> LOT of birthdays in the fall in my family, plus of course, there's the

> holidays). I'm the one that has to make it an " experience " for my kids. They

> MUST smell french toast cooking Christmas morning! If they don't, they'll

> have no special memories to share when they're older. " I drive myself crazy

> with this stuff.

>

> The other part of it is having to see my mother much more than usual.

> She came over yesterday with gifts for my kids' birthdays, which is great,

> but she doesn't let anyone else talk. It's all her, The Mom Show, talk talk

> talk. THEN she starts talking even faster in her native language. My husband

> and kids don't speak it; I do and made no effort to ask her to speak in

> English so they'll understand.

>

> I don't want them to understand. I don't want the worlds to collide.

>

> What I mean by that is, my husband is such a wonderful person but he REALLY

> doesn't get what a hell it is with my mother. Her complete disinterest in

> connecting with me or her grandchildren. Yes, she loves us but love means

> sitting and listening to her prattle on. It means not doing ANYthing that

> will worry her. It means telling her every last detail of my life and

> agreeing with her about everything.

>

> I try not to bring the 2 worlds of her and my immediate family together. I

> don't like it and can't tolerate the discomfort of it.

>

> Anyway, some of you know that my husband and daughter went to Yellowstone

> Park this summer for a week. I didn't tell my mother for my own sanity.

> Yesterday, she came to visit and I accidentally gave her a cup of coffee in

> a Yellowstone mug. (I wonder now if I unconsciously WANT her to know!)

>

> I could not believe it and was hoping to get it from her before she

> noticed. Too late. " Yellowstone, " she said. So my normally wonderful husband

> starts up: " Did you see our vacation pictures, mama? " I was mortified and

> gave him a look. It didn't work.

>

> My mother's response, part fearful-phobic-anxious, part self-absorbed was,

> " oh, no, I wouldn't ever want to go there. Didn't you hear about the

> Argentine couple that was brutally murdered there?? "

>

> So my husband and daughter start laughing and he says, " Hey Molly, don't

> ever go to Yellowstone, ok? " My mother still didn't get it.

>

> THEN my husband says, " hey mama, would you like some more coffee in your

> YELLOWSTONE cup?? "

>

> I don't think I've ever been so pissed at my husband. He was being a real

> jackass. Again, my mother didn't even notice, just blabbing on like someone

> you'd see at a bus terminal. I just pretended to listen to her, laughing

> along with her but inside so upset and feeling betrayed by him. I just let

> her go on in her language, purposefully leaving him out until he got bored

> and left.

>

> I just felt so powerless and really, so stupid...so what if she knew?? It

> was like I was an adolescent again.

>

> But if we'd told her, she would have put on her big, dramatic, tearful

> show...why didn't you TELL me??...it's like I'm not a part of this

> family...you've all been laughing at me...and so on....

>

> But he doesn't get that. And it's so hard to explain. He usually will at

> least try to understand but this time, I guess he'd had it.

>

> Anyway, I'm just venting. I feel so alone sometimes dealing with my mother.

> Sometimes I feel like it gets better but then I realize it never changed.

> She still wants to swallow me up.

>

> I had been so optimistic because she found another victim to call 4 times a

> day but this person went on vacation this week and now my mother's back to

> calling me frequently. It really sucks and I can't wait for victim to return

> from vacation.

>

> Thanks for listening.

>

> Fiona

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

This is just my opinion to take or leave, but it seems to me that you ARE still

responding to and relating to your mother as though you are a minor child

instead of an adult. You feel responsible for making her happy, even though

that's really not your job in life. She's programmed you to believe that it is,

but that's a lie she's fed you so often that you've bought into it.

The guilt you feel when your mother is upset with you is inappropriate and

misplaced. Its wrong of your mother to use guilt to manipulate you like that;

she should feel ashamed of herself for doing that to you, but she's mentally ill

and can't or won't accept responsibility for her own feelings and behaviors.

So, you're being played by her and you're agreeing to be played.

You are an adult and its OK for you to have a separate, private life that is not

shared with your mother/parents. It is inappropriate and intrusive for her to

expect to know all your business, where you are, where and when you're going on

vacation, your marital problems, your finances, any of that. Please don't feel

guilty for not sharing everything with your mother, its truly not her business.

That was very courageous of you to decide to not tell her about the Yosemite

trip. Notice how even when the truth came out after the fact *it didn't even

register with her*? That's interesting.

My Sister and I discovered that the " white lie " tactic can work very effectively

with our nada. I wouldn't tell nada when I was arriving in her state so that I

could spend a few blessed, carefree days with Sister and Nephew alone, then I'd

announce that I'd " arrived " and spend time staying with nada. So, yes, I lied.

But it saved me and nada from a miserable three or 4 day visit with her feeling

hurt and left out, complaining bitterly and acting out the whole time (which

from my point of view makes the visit pointless.) In her mind, I was just there

to visit her. So, it was a win-win.

As far as I'm concerned, its OK to cut back on the amount of time we volunteer

to expose ourselves to our toxic relatives. They're going to be pissed off at

us anyway; they will find something to be angry, upset, hurt, disappointed, or

resentful about, so spending more time with them doesn't actually help.

Catering to them only makes them happy temporarily, it doesn't change their

bottom-line unrealistic expectations, their feeling of entitlement or anything

else. In fact it trains them that if they act out, you'll cater to them more.

Bad idea. Thus are bullies created.

So, cut back. Cut way, way back, and do it gradually if you have to. Keep

reminding yourself that you have the right to your own, private, adult life with

YOUR husband and YOUR kids.

Its not your job to make your mother happy.

-Annie

>

> >

> >

> > Hi everyone,

> >

> > I really loathe this time of year. It's like a tapeworm inside me, slowly

> > eating me and tormenting me.

> >

> > I've been wondering and ruminating about it: what is it about September to

> > December that makes me so unsettled and so unhappy?

> >

> > Part of it is that I am the gift buyer and wrapper in my family (we have a

> > LOT of birthdays in the fall in my family, plus of course, there's the

> > holidays). I'm the one that has to make it an " experience " for my kids. They

> > MUST smell french toast cooking Christmas morning! If they don't, they'll

> > have no special memories to share when they're older. " I drive myself crazy

> > with this stuff.

> >

> > The other part of it is having to see my mother much more than usual.

> > She came over yesterday with gifts for my kids' birthdays, which is great,

> > but she doesn't let anyone else talk. It's all her, The Mom Show, talk talk

> > talk. THEN she starts talking even faster in her native language. My husband

> > and kids don't speak it; I do and made no effort to ask her to speak in

> > English so they'll understand.

> >

> > I don't want them to understand. I don't want the worlds to collide.

> >

> > What I mean by that is, my husband is such a wonderful person but he REALLY

> > doesn't get what a hell it is with my mother. Her complete disinterest in

> > connecting with me or her grandchildren. Yes, she loves us but love means

> > sitting and listening to her prattle on. It means not doing ANYthing that

> > will worry her. It means telling her every last detail of my life and

> > agreeing with her about everything.

> >

> > I try not to bring the 2 worlds of her and my immediate family together. I

> > don't like it and can't tolerate the discomfort of it.

> >

> > Anyway, some of you know that my husband and daughter went to Yellowstone

> > Park this summer for a week. I didn't tell my mother for my own sanity.

> > Yesterday, she came to visit and I accidentally gave her a cup of coffee in

> > a Yellowstone mug. (I wonder now if I unconsciously WANT her to know!)

> >

> > I could not believe it and was hoping to get it from her before she

> > noticed. Too late. " Yellowstone, " she said. So my normally wonderful husband

> > starts up: " Did you see our vacation pictures, mama? " I was mortified and

> > gave him a look. It didn't work.

> >

> > My mother's response, part fearful-phobic-anxious, part self-absorbed was,

> > " oh, no, I wouldn't ever want to go there. Didn't you hear about the

> > Argentine couple that was brutally murdered there?? "

> >

> > So my husband and daughter start laughing and he says, " Hey Molly, don't

> > ever go to Yellowstone, ok? " My mother still didn't get it.

> >

> > THEN my husband says, " hey mama, would you like some more coffee in your

> > YELLOWSTONE cup?? "

> >

> > I don't think I've ever been so pissed at my husband. He was being a real

> > jackass. Again, my mother didn't even notice, just blabbing on like someone

> > you'd see at a bus terminal. I just pretended to listen to her, laughing

> > along with her but inside so upset and feeling betrayed by him. I just let

> > her go on in her language, purposefully leaving him out until he got bored

> > and left.

> >

> > I just felt so powerless and really, so stupid...so what if she knew?? It

> > was like I was an adolescent again.

> >

> > But if we'd told her, she would have put on her big, dramatic, tearful

> > show...why didn't you TELL me??...it's like I'm not a part of this

> > family...you've all been laughing at me...and so on....

> >

> > But he doesn't get that. And it's so hard to explain. He usually will at

> > least try to understand but this time, I guess he'd had it.

> >

> > Anyway, I'm just venting. I feel so alone sometimes dealing with my mother.

> > Sometimes I feel like it gets better but then I realize it never changed.

> > She still wants to swallow me up.

> >

> > I had been so optimistic because she found another victim to call 4 times a

> > day but this person went on vacation this week and now my mother's back to

> > calling me frequently. It really sucks and I can't wait for victim to return

> > from vacation.

> >

> > Thanks for listening.

> >

> > Fiona

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Girlscout: I love, love, love your ideas. THAT'S what I'd like out of the

holidays...just something different. And you said exactly what my therapist has

been saying to me: " Redefine the holidays for yourself. " She's right and you're

right. It's time; I just can't be miserable anymore.

Stefanie: that's funny, like you, I'm 42. Yes, my kids know my mother's crazy,

too. Esp my older daughter is very aware - without me saying anything specific -

of the very tense relationship I have with my mother. My daughter will say, " I

love granny but she doesn't listen to me when I talk or she'll talk over me. "

it's really sad.

Annie: You might be right. I don't know (if I still respond to my mother as if I

were a kid). I'm sure I do to an extent. But I look at my attempt to keep

things from her more as self-preservation, and not as being adolescent, you know

what I mean? I definitely felt embarrassed in front of my husband that I was

keeping the Yellowstone trip from her. I DID feel kind of dumb, BUT it would've

been my headache and not his, when she found out. I don't really feel guilty for

keeping it from her. I feel more dread for when she finds out, just the hassle

of watching her perform her Poor Old Me routine. Thanks for your post!