Re: Circling back through for feedback...

[Guest guest]

(((((((((Lynnette))))))))))

I guess your nada preferred to live in denial, immersed in the comfortable and

familiar behaviors she'd always known, rather than accept the reality that she

was/is mentally ill and needed to change her behaviors.

My nada was told she had bpd back, I'm guessing, about 35 years ago, when she

dragged dad with her to a marriage counselor who, after one session, told them

he believed that nada had bpd and needed private therapy, that marriage

counseling wouldn't really help. Sister told me this, that nada came back from

that one and only marriage counseling session in a ballistic rage and remained

that way for the rest of the day, screaming that there was nothing wrong with

her and the marriage counselor didn't know what he was talking about, was an

idiot, etc.

So, yeah, mine knew too. This happened after I was grown and on my own, but

still, it would have helped a lot if she'd gotten the right kind of therapy

then. Decades of anguish and tears could have been avoided for dad and Sister

and me, perhaps.

I'm sorry your world is tilting, I hope you get better soon.

If nothing else, I hope this new-found knowledge will completely erase any

inappropriate and misplaced guilt you might feel over protecting yourself from

your nada with firm boundaries, and low contact or no contact (whatever works

for you.)

-Annie

>

> I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life and

maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

>

> Need input.

>

> 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent 20

minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've done

so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a way....I've

been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how badly I messed

you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom but, honestly, I

don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't trust you now. I

love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and teen vulnerable

again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

>

> She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will do

whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

>

> GASP!

>

> Here's where my world stopped spinning.

>

> " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had that... "

>

> Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>

> I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

>

> Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it wasn't

enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

>

[Guest guest]

I think you did the right thing. Saying " Im sorry " for a lifetime of abuse just

doesnt cut the mustard for me. Not that I would ever believe her anyway.

Besides, I think it would take years of therapy before a BP is anywhere near to

being " cured " . Someone being aware of what they do is not the same as being able

to control it.

And hearing my mother say " Oh sorry, yeah someone told me about this long ago " I

think Id ram the phone down her throat. For starters.

>

> I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life and

maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

>

> Need input.

>

> 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent 20

minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've done

so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a way....I've

been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how badly I messed

you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom but, honestly, I

don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't trust you now. I

love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and teen vulnerable

again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

>

> She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will do

whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

>

> GASP!

>

> Here's where my world stopped spinning.

>

> " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had that... "

>

> Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>

> I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

>

> Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it wasn't

enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

>

[Guest guest]

Exactly.

Unfortunately I started to disassociate. Again.

I got off the phone, called SO (his ex wife is bpd, he knows) and just said, " I

need you to talk to me for about 15 minutes. I'm fading. Just talked to Nada. "

He did. Got through it. Pisses me off.

L

> >

> > I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life

and maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

> >

> > Need input.

> >

> > 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent 20

minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've done

so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a way....I've

been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how badly I messed

you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom but, honestly, I

don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't trust you now. I

love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and teen vulnerable

again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

> >

> > She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will do

whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

> >

> > GASP!

> >

> > Here's where my world stopped spinning.

> >

> > " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had that... "

> >

> > Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> >

> > I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

> >

> > Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it

wasn't enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

My dad told me this happened with 3 separate therapists she drug him to find out

what was wrong with HIM. As soon as the therapist called attention to HER she

ran out, screaming and went on rants for days. never to return. It was after

these incidents that she would 'go suicidal' or run the car into the gaurdrail

on the freeway or shoot at him with one of his guns.

Good times.

Lynnette

> >

> > I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life

and maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

> >

> > Need input.

> >

> > 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent 20

minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've done

so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a way....I've

been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how badly I messed

you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom but, honestly, I

don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't trust you now. I

love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and teen vulnerable

again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

> >

> > She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will do

whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

> >

> > GASP!

> >

> > Here's where my world stopped spinning.

> >

> > " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had that... "

> >

> > Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> >

> > I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

> >

> > Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it

wasn't enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Oh gee, she sounds so charming...

My mum would fight like a cat in a bag if anyone EVER suggested that she might

have mental issues.

I remember once I told my sister in highschool that she needed " professional

help " . Neither my sister or my mother have ever let me forget that I said such a

hiddeous thing, I certainly got the snot kicked out of me for suggesting that

there was anything wrong with the family.

Batcrap crazy they are, but your mum takes the cake, icing, box and all.

>

> My dad told me this happened with 3 separate therapists she drug him to find

out what was wrong with HIM. As soon as the therapist called attention to HER

she ran out, screaming and went on rants for days. never to return. It was

after these incidents that she would 'go suicidal' or run the car into the

gaurdrail on the freeway or shoot at him with one of his guns.

>

> Good times.

>

> Lynnette

[Guest guest]

A good partner who is happy to listen or give a hug when these things happen is

the best thing in the world.

My guy used to be a sniper in the army. He always offers to go and " quietly

dispose " of whoever in my family is giving me hassle! hehe, that always makes me

feel better, bless his cotton socks!

>

> Exactly.

>

> Unfortunately I started to disassociate. Again.

>

> I got off the phone, called SO (his ex wife is bpd, he knows) and just said,

" I need you to talk to me for about 15 minutes. I'm fading. Just talked to

Nada. "

>

> He did. Got through it. Pisses me off.

>

> L

[Guest guest]

SO is an attorney. Specializes in family law.

Lynnette

> >

> > Exactly.

> >

> > Unfortunately I started to disassociate. Again.

> >

> > I got off the phone, called SO (his ex wife is bpd, he knows) and just said,

" I need you to talk to me for about 15 minutes. I'm fading. Just talked to

Nada. "

> >

> > He did. Got through it. Pisses me off.

> >

> > L

>

[Guest guest]

Wow Lynnette I am sorry she knew and did nothing, but honestly not surprised in

the least. I'm not sure very many BPD people want help.

It sounds like a day at my house too if it makes you feel less alone. After I

left and went n/c my BPD nada (also hypochondriac) wanted to find out what her

latest ailment was so she went to the doctor who diagnosed her with BPD and

conversion reaction disorder, she also flipped out at him. Went home and tried

to hang herself. Not sure what she did with the guns but I am sure it wasn't

pretty. I remember as a child seeing my mom and dad throwing hammers at each

other during a heated fight. I can only imagine what happened in that house when

she was told she was BPD. I would have been afraid to have been a fly on the

wall.

Anyway, I am sorry for you. But like I said I am not surprised I think it sound

like typical BPD. That being said, for your sake, I truly truly hope your mom

gets help. I really do, the world can use a little more sanity and you could use

a mom. Just wait and see because only time will tell. LB

> > >

> > > I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life

and maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

> > >

> > > Need input.

> > >

> > > 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent

20 minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've

done so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a

way....I've been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how

badly I messed you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom

but, honestly, I don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't

trust you now. I love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and

teen vulnerable again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

> > >

> > > She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will

do whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

> > >

> > > GASP!

> > >

> > > Here's where my world stopped spinning.

> > >

> > > " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had

that... "

> > >

> > > Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> > >

> > > I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

> > >

> > > Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it

wasn't enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I agree, an " I'm sorry " doesn't do it for me either. Mainly because my nada was

often like the perp in domestic violence cases. She would go through the " cycle

of violence " with Sister and me over and over again. Nada would have an

explosive tantrum/rage and scream at us and beat us, then nada would either (a)

act like nothing at all had just happened, or ( she would be contrite,

sobbing, remorseful, and beg us to forgive her. Then there would be a

" honeymoon " period where she'd be calm and nice to us, then there would be a

gradual (or sudden) buildup of irritation, criticism, fault-finding, until

something else would trigger another rage/tantrum. (This is in addition to her

just going off on us with no warning at all; we got both behaviors.)

So, I have heard " I'm sorry " from nada so many times in my life that I've

learned that it truly means nothing. Or, it means only that she can't stand the

idea of there being consequences for her negative behaviors, and is frantic to

have everything back to " normal " where she is in control again and can behave in

whatever ugly way she wants to and we have to accept it.

-Annie

> >

> > I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life

and maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

> >

> > Need input.

> >

> > 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent 20

minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've done

so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a way....I've

been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how badly I messed

you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom but, honestly, I

don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't trust you now. I

love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and teen vulnerable

again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

> >

> > She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will do

whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

> >

> > GASP!

> >

> > Here's where my world stopped spinning.

> >

> > " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had that... "

> >

> > Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> >

> > I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

> >

> > Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it

wasn't enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yeah...I have had those times when nada seemed to understand how abusive she was

being and apologized.

I think of those times as the clouds parting for brief periods during, oh, say,

an entire century of Noah's Ark level rain.

Sometimes their brains wake up and fly right...for a few minutes, a few hours,

or a few days. Then...BZZZ!! The malfunction starts again, the static comes

back, and they are right back in the BP land of Oz.

I finally figured out after many years not to take the brief lucid periods very

seriously.

It really is sad that some of these people knew so many years ago and were too

cowardly to put their children first and do the hard work to get well. I'm

sorry to hear it, Lynnette.

--.

[Guest guest]

I wish I could feel something when she 'went there' this time... I really do.

Something. But all I thought was, 'Oh HELL no... I'm NOT falling for this

crap. "

Lynnette

>

> Yeah...I have had those times when nada seemed to understand how abusive she

was being and apologized.

>

> I think of those times as the clouds parting for brief periods during, oh,

say, an entire century of Noah's Ark level rain.

>

> Sometimes their brains wake up and fly right...for a few minutes, a few hours,

or a few days. Then...BZZZ!! The malfunction starts again, the static comes

back, and they are right back in the BP land of Oz.

>

> I finally figured out after many years not to take the brief lucid periods

very seriously.

>

> It really is sad that some of these people knew so many years ago and were too

cowardly to put their children first and do the hard work to get well. I'm

sorry to hear it, Lynnette.

>

> --.

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, what a depth charge!!!

I am willing to bet my personal fortune, all fifty cents, that she never even

considered her BPD impacting anyone else. They're that self-absorbed, you know?

Don't take it personally. Leave the taking of things personally to her... I'm

sure she does it well enough for both of you (and the rest of the planet)

combined. And just know that there's no fixing the past, but for now and the

future you have all of us.

Glad you're still here,

Tina

>

> I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life and

maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

>

> Need input.

>

> 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent 20

minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've done

so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a way....I've

been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how badly I messed

you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom but, honestly, I

don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't trust you now. I

love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and teen vulnerable

again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

>

> She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will do

whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

>

> GASP!

>

> Here's where my world stopped spinning.

>

> " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had that... "

>

> Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>

> I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

>

> Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it wasn't

enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Lynette, Tina and group,

Lynette,

2 years ago my sister was diagonosed as BPD at age 45. She went to my mother

(who is and always was abusive) and shared with her. My mother then disclosed

that she had also been diagnosed. W...T...F.!

Of course, I'm sure she acted even more vehemently crazy to us, her helpless

children, to retaliate in proof that she wasn't crazy. That push back behavior

of how dare you, I'll get you! A few months later my beautiful 16 year old went

into a psych hosp and was also diagnosed BPD. I moved across country to Calf

when I was 20 yrs old. We stopped my moms visits when my daughter was 7. I

only visited twice with my daughter since then. My sister is even more

curtailed.

Unlike many of the parents I'm reading about there has never been any softening

of any issue being on my mothers, sisters and ,I am so sad to say, my daughters

part. Nothing is ever them they are totally inflexible and rigid, they are

incapable of any vulnerability. With the reading I am doing here today, I am

wondering if they are just BPD or Narcissistic or antisocial or something.

Any input?

Sue

[Guest guest]

Sue,

Reading your post is heart wrenching. What a horrible burden to have so many

BPDs in your life--everywhere you look must be crazy making. The guilt involved

with my NADA alone has been horrible--I can't imagine what you've been through

with a sis and a daughter too.

Makes me think there is definitely a genetic component to all this. And thank

God we have the clarity to see the illness for what it is.

*HUGS* -- you are not alone!

>

>

>

>

> Dear Lynette, Tina and group,

> Lynette,

> 2 years ago my sister was diagonosed as BPD at age 45. She went to my mother

(who is and always was abusive) and shared with her. My mother then disclosed

that she had also been diagnosed. W...T...F.!

> Of course, I'm sure she acted even more vehemently crazy to us, her helpless

children, to retaliate in proof that she wasn't crazy. That push back behavior

of how dare you, I'll get you! A few months later my beautiful 16 year old went

into a psych hosp and was also diagnosed BPD. I moved across country to Calf

when I was 20 yrs old. We stopped my moms visits when my daughter was 7. I

only visited twice with my daughter since then. My sister is even more

curtailed.

> Unlike many of the parents I'm reading about there has never been any

softening of any issue being on my mothers, sisters and ,I am so sad to say, my

daughters part. Nothing is ever them they are totally inflexible and rigid,

they are incapable of any vulnerability. With the reading I am doing here

today, I am wondering if they are just BPD or Narcissistic or antisocial or

something.

> Any input?

> Sue

>

[Guest guest]

Again Sue, 3 BPD's in 3 generations including your daughter has to be hard

beyond imagining. HUGS seem inadequate but sending them your way. You said you

wondered about NPD and antisocial. I have some experience with those as well.

To me the difference is that the NPD & Antisocial folks are in control of

themselves, vastly self-centered and manipulative, but in control. They are

cold where as BPD is hot - emotionally speaking. Also self-harm and suicide

attempts are more known to BPD issues though it's always possible for a person

to have more than one PD - it's not an exact science and these are labels for

disorders on a continuum. Hope that helps some.

>

>

>

>

> Dear Lynette, Tina and group,

> Lynette,

> 2 years ago my sister was diagonosed as BPD at age 45. She went to my mother

(who is and always was abusive) and shared with her. My mother then disclosed

that she had also been diagnosed. W...T...F.!

> Of course, I'm sure she acted even more vehemently crazy to us, her helpless

children, to retaliate in proof that she wasn't crazy. That push back behavior

of how dare you, I'll get you! A few months later my beautiful 16 year old went

into a psych hosp and was also diagnosed BPD. I moved across country to Calf

when I was 20 yrs old. We stopped my moms visits when my daughter was 7. I

only visited twice with my daughter since then. My sister is even more

curtailed.

> Unlike many of the parents I'm reading about there has never been any

softening of any issue being on my mothers, sisters and ,I am so sad to say, my

daughters part. Nothing is ever them they are totally inflexible and rigid,

they are incapable of any vulnerability. With the reading I am doing here

today, I am wondering if they are just BPD or Narcissistic or antisocial or

something.

> Any input?

> Sue

>

[Guest guest]

Lynnette, sorry to hear about this too - I'm glad you had your ex-SO to help you

undissociate(probably not a word). Like there have been a few moments

when my nada seemed to understand but that clarity faded away and got rewritten.

I don't think they can bear to accept the knowledge of what having BPD really

means for them. So they leave it for those in their life to bear it instead.

[Guest guest]

Tina,

" Depth Charge " is the PERFECT word for it.

It's been a week since she told me this. I've gone completely cold. My

therapist told me to just be prepared to ride out all the emotions that ere

going to come flooding on me. I'm making little decisions right now other than

day-to-day stuff. I've informed my inner circle cause there is no way in H#$$%

I'm going this alone.

So last night I spoke with her again. She said her current therapist said,

" Well, I'm not sure of a definitive diagnosis without full testing. Are you

willing to take the tests? " My nada said, " yes. " They will do this next week.

Now, I'm not sure if I believe any of this is real or she's just upping her game

1.000%. What I do know is this... I'm not afraid to tell her I don't believe

her. I'm not afraid to say, " This is inappropriate " (she's still in bizarro

land with her match.com man). I'm not afraid to say, " No. " I guess those are

all huge progressive steps. I mean, in all honesty, I'm a 42 year old Dr.,

mother, engaged, adult woman. What's she gonna do to me? Ground me? Hardly.

I will only accept responsibility for me.

Lynnette

> >

> > I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life

and maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

> >

> > Need input.

> >

> > 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent 20

minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've done

so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a way....I've

been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how badly I messed

you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom but, honestly, I

don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't trust you now. I

love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and teen vulnerable

again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

> >

> > She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will do

whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

> >

> > GASP!

> >

> > Here's where my world stopped spinning.

> >

> > " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had that... "

> >

> > Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> >

> > I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

> >

> > Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it

wasn't enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Well that's a special kind of hell!

What a twisted house of mirrors you grew up with... and now to watch your dd go

through it... I'm so sorry!

I've found that with Nada and her 9:9 BPD traits (the ONE area she's

overachieved in, wtg!) there is a fluidity of personality. By that I mean she

dips in the pool of narc, anti-social, etc. - in addition to the bpd consistent

inconsistencies - when 'the mood' strikes. I think it's because I no longer

respond to her bpd-ness so she has to try different 'tactics.' What she doesn't

seem to get at the core is that I'm done period. Crying, screaming, ranting,

raving, suicide stuff, whatever - I'm not moved to react. I may think - I may

ponder - but I'll DIE before I'll ever react to another of her wacko unregulated

drama-O-thons.

As to teenagers... I have one. He was recently diagnosed with exercise induced

asthma and pronated feet. We realized his mood swings were due to lack of sound

sleep and pain. With treatment, his moods are so much more under control. But

he's still a teenager so anything that is 'over the top' gets blamed on the Dr.

Sweet. He'll get through it... eventually. I'm only telling you this because

we spent the last 4 months in mood swing hell, with 2 therapists, full

bloodwork, etc. etc. and no one could find a 'why'.... I was terrified it was

BPD but he tested negative. Finally we figured it out. I wonder, just for your

own benefit, if seeing if there are other issues with your dd. Since most

mental health diagnosis don't occur til after 18 (and she's 16) I would explore

other avenues. It could be something relatively simple.

Lynnette

>

>

>

>

> Dear Lynette, Tina and group,

> Lynette,

> 2 years ago my sister was diagonosed as BPD at age 45. She went to my mother

(who is and always was abusive) and shared with her. My mother then disclosed

that she had also been diagnosed. W...T...F.!

> Of course, I'm sure she acted even more vehemently crazy to us, her helpless

children, to retaliate in proof that she wasn't crazy. That push back behavior

of how dare you, I'll get you! A few months later my beautiful 16 year old went

into a psych hosp and was also diagnosed BPD. I moved across country to Calf

when I was 20 yrs old. We stopped my moms visits when my daughter was 7. I

only visited twice with my daughter since then. My sister is even more

curtailed.

> Unlike many of the parents I'm reading about there has never been any

softening of any issue being on my mothers, sisters and ,I am so sad to say, my

daughters part. Nothing is ever them they are totally inflexible and rigid,

they are incapable of any vulnerability. With the reading I am doing here

today, I am wondering if they are just BPD or Narcissistic or antisocial or

something.

> Any input?

> Sue

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Lynette,

There's no question as to ET's(my daughter) diagnosis.  We had thought she was

ADD until at 15.5 yrs.  She imploded with behaviors.  Major Depressive

disorder,

anorexia. Generalized Anxiety, maybe more they come and go.  And yes doctors

don.t like to diagnosis BPD before 18 yrs.  However, if it's full fledge

absolutely clear Personality disorder they do.  She needed to be hospitalized

for a good diagnosis. 

I have lung disease.  Get your son a sleep test.  Asthma occurs during the

night

and you have no idea.  My brain wasn't even telling my body to take a

breathe. 

Thank-you for your comments I need to hear that what I was going thru was shear

unrelenting craziness.  Until 2 yrs. ago when my sister told me she was diag.

and that my mother had said she had been told she's BPD.  I was the target, the

scapegoat.  They were fine, it was me who caused all problems.

By the way my daughter is 18 now.

Sue

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Fri, October 29, 2010 8:50:35 AM

Subject: Re: Circling back through for feedback...

 

Well that's a special kind of hell!

What a twisted house of mirrors you grew up with... and now to watch your dd go

through it... I'm so sorry!

I've found that with Nada and her 9:9 BPD traits (the ONE area she's

overachieved in, wtg!) there is a fluidity of personality. By that I mean she

dips in the pool of narc, anti-social, etc. - in addition to the bpd consistent

inconsistencies - when 'the mood' strikes. I think it's because I no longer

respond to her bpd-ness so she has to try different 'tactics.' What she doesn't

seem to get at the core is that I'm done period. Crying, screaming, ranting,

raving, suicide stuff, whatever - I'm not moved to react. I may think - I may

ponder - but I'll DIE before I'll ever react to another of her wacko unregulated

drama-O-thons.

As to teenagers... I have one. He was recently diagnosed with exercise induced

asthma and pronated feet. We realized his mood swings were due to lack of sound

sleep and pain. With treatment, his moods are so much more under control. But

he's still a teenager so anything that is 'over the top' gets blamed on the Dr.

Sweet. He'll get through it... eventually. I'm only telling you this because we

spent the last 4 months in mood swing hell, with 2 therapists, full bloodwork,

etc. etc. and no one could find a 'why'.... I was terrified it was BPD but he

tested negative. Finally we figured it out. I wonder, just for your own benefit,

if seeing if there are other issues with your dd. Since most mental health

diagnosis don't occur til after 18 (and she's 16) I would explore other avenues.

It could be something relatively simple.

Lynnette

>

>

>

>

> Dear Lynette, Tina and group,

> Lynette,

> 2 years ago my sister was diagonosed as BPD at age 45. She went to my mother

>(who is and always was abusive) and shared with her. My mother then disclosed

>that she had also been diagnosed. W...T...F.!

>

> Of course, I'm sure she acted even more vehemently crazy to us, her helpless

>children, to retaliate in proof that she wasn't crazy. That push back behavior

>of how dare you, I'll get you! A few months later my beautiful 16 year old went

>into a psych hosp and was also diagnosed BPD. I moved across country to Calf

>when I was 20 yrs old. We stopped my moms visits when my daughter was 7. I only

>visited twice with my daughter since then. My sister is even more curtailed.

> Unlike many of the parents I'm reading about there has never been any

softening

>of any issue being on my mothers, sisters and ,I am so sad to say, my daughters

>part. Nothing is ever them they are totally inflexible and rigid, they are

>incapable of any vulnerability. With the reading I am doing here today, I am

>wondering if they are just BPD or Narcissistic or antisocial or something.

> Any input?

> Sue

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Lynette,

How terribly, terribly sad. I am heartbroken for you. I have often thought that,

given the overwhelming evidence, that my mom would have to think maybe the

problem was hers. But, she never really does. She just does what others have

said - either pretends nothing happened or has some maudlin, -worthy

declaration of remorse - and then it all just starts over. If I foud out that my

mother really, truly KNEW she was BPD and had done nothing?!?...it's just

unimaginable. I already ask myself several times a day as I raise my own little

one how on this good earth could ANY human being do what my mother did to their

OWN CHILD. I'm glad I don't understand and I don't want to because that might

mean I was ONE of THEM. I am so, so sorry. Even though she tells you she's doing

the tests, etc. I still wouldn't trust her as far as I could throw her - they

are so good at faking it and never, ever changing and we are always the ones who

end up paying the price for their tantrums. You don't owe her one tiny frigging

thing. Not even a 7343rd chance.

> > >

> > > I've been away for some time from the board... dealing with a normal life

and maining LC with nada... until 48 hours ago.

> > >

> > > Need input.

> > >

> > > 48 hours ago I spoke to Nada for the first time sinc July 11. She spent

20 minutes on, 'Im sorry.. I've been horrible to you your whole life... I've

done so much damage... I'm sorry... I love you.... Please let's find a

way....I've been seeing a therapist 2x a week for 4 months and know now how

badly I messed you up " etc. etc. etc. I held boundaries firm. " Thank you mom

but, honestly, I don't believe " I'm sorry " fixes or changes things. I don't

trust you now. I love you but you've done too much damage for me to make me and

teen vulnerable again wihtout demonstrating sincere and tangible change.... "

> > >

> > > She didn't rage. She didn't waif. She said, " I understand that and will

do whatever it takes. " I then mentioned BPD.

> > >

> > > GASP!

> > >

> > > Here's where my world stopped spinning.

> > >

> > > " I've heard of that. 15 years ago another therapist told me I had

that... "

> > >

> > > Fellow KO's...... SHE KNEW????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> > >

> > > I've spoken to my therapist. Am told to expect a whole lot of anger.

> > >

> > > Lynnette - feeling like a wounded fool. She knew. She knows. But it

wasn't enough to keep her from acting up on me or her grandchild. Now what?

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

That's great that you are so much stronger that your nada's bpd manipulations

can't send you into a dissociative state any more, that is awesome progress on

your part!

A major component of personality disorder is that the person with pd does not

feel distressed by her own behaviors, plus the pd individual tends to have

cognitive distortions (skewed thinking, interpreting reality rather

inaccurately) and relies on manipulation as a standard way of relating to other

people.

Me personally, I would not trust that what your mother tells you that her

therapist said is true. Its more likely that she's just telling you her version

of some fragment of what her therapist said, if indeed she actually has a

therapist. (Maybe she went to a therapist for two or three sessions, at some

point in the past.)

Just my 2cents worth.

-Annie

>

> Thanks, Kinberly...

>

> As recently as yesterday, when I stood up for myself (I've spoken with her 2x

since this whole thing came to light a couple of weeks ago) she said, " Now

honey.... we must MOVE ON. There is no sense in looking back at what happened.

My therapist wants me to only move forward. "

>

> Ahem.

>

> I've been in therapy for 2 1/2 years because of her... I can tell you the #1

thing my therapist would NEVER do is give a crazy person a free pass to ignore

the past they created. This sounds so Nada-ish I'm seriously doubting all of

it. Is she really in therapy? Is there even a therapist? What is really

happening? I think it's just another Holiday pre-Amble...

>

> The only thing I know is a yaer ago this would have sent me in a DID

phase...right down the Rabbit Hole... now I simply think, " Ah #$% it. "

>

> Lynnette

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Annie... this hit home, " A major component of personality disorder is

that the person with pd does not

feel distressed by her own behaviors, plus the pd individual tends to have

cognitive distortions (skewed thinking, interpreting reality rather

inaccurately) and relies on manipulation as a standard way of relating to other

people. "

No distress, distortions and manipulation. Pretty much sums it up. Wish I had

the words, or inclination, to go deeper here but really... there is a point when

you just 'get there' and realize - " Yep, here I am. "

Lynnette

> >

> > Thanks, Kinberly...

> >

> > As recently as yesterday, when I stood up for myself (I've spoken with her

2x since this whole thing came to light a couple of weeks ago) she said, " Now

honey.... we must MOVE ON. There is no sense in looking back at what happened.

My therapist wants me to only move forward. "

> >

> > Ahem.

> >

> > I've been in therapy for 2 1/2 years because of her... I can tell you the #1

thing my therapist would NEVER do is give a crazy person a free pass to ignore

the past they created. This sounds so Nada-ish I'm seriously doubting all of

it. Is she really in therapy? Is there even a therapist? What is really

happening? I think it's just another Holiday pre-Amble...

> >

> > The only thing I know is a yaer ago this would have sent me in a DID

phase...right down the Rabbit Hole... now I simply think, " Ah #$% it. "

> >

> > Lynnette

>