Re: Over Some 50 Years, Two Pure Moments

[Guest guest]

I believe that most of the time when my nada was nice to me or gave me

something, it was because it was really for her. I got tap-dancing lessons, for

example, because she'd always wanted them; I didn't even really want to go, but

I did it to please her. (What choice did I have at 4, anyway?)

I suspect I got encouraged to develop one talent because it was a source of

ego-supply for her, something she could brag about, and she felt she had paid

for the right to order me to produce an objet d'art for her on command,

something to give to her friends and gain status.

Just now, I can only think of one instance when I was growing up that I had the

closest thing to the kind of " pure " moment you describe, with my nada. She had

no audience, nothing to gain from it, and it was totally of her own volition,

not a response to a request on my part.

We had had a beautiful cat when I was growing up that I cared for a great deal,

and out of the blue one day, nada gave me a lovely small ceramic cat that

looked just like our beloved pet. That touched me deeply, that she knew how

much I loved that cat and she wanted me to have something to remind me of her.

It was like she really cared about me; she gave me a gift that had real meaning

to me, and without strings attached. Nada hadn't even really liked having a pet

cat, so, that made it even more special.

Miracles can happen, I guess.

-Annie

>

> Did you ever have a truly pure moment that was pure and untouched by BPD in

nada? I had two.

>

> The first one was when I was 15. My nada had been talking about how much her

bones were hurting, and she was going to the doctors to find out what was wrong.

Her sister had died of bone cancer and of course, drama queen nada made it

pretty clear that she thought she had it too.

>

> Nada had some tests done while I was at band camp. Even though she was a nada,

I didn't know it and I was very attached to her. I was afraid to call home

because I couldn't bear to find out while I was at camp that nada was dying. The

whole ride home with dad I didn't ask a thing about it.

>

> Once in the door, nada sort of staggered in pain to the entrance to see me.

She was dressed in her housecoat (tattered and old) and the bandage on her chest

from the the bone test was large and ugly. I started to cry, hysterically,

asking her, did she have bone cancer, was she going to die? She said no. I said,

(to my surprise, even today)... " Are you lying? Are you afraid to tell me that

you're dying? " No no, she said, she wasn't dying. I am full-tilt hysterically

crying now, holding her. (I was already taller that she was.) She started to

cry. I insisted through my hysteria, which was now up and amp or two now that

she was in tears, " You are lying, you're crying! You're dying! " No no she said,

not dying. I countered with: " Then why are you cryin?!!! "

>

> Nada said something you'd never EVER expect to hear from a nada: " I'm crying

because you are. "

>

> Never before or since have my tears had any effect on her. But in that one

pure moment, they did. We cried a little more as she explained she had

osteoarthritis, hence the pain in her bones. She lived another 40 years.

Thinking about it now, I could cry again all these years later, not because she

didn't have cancer, but because she was crying - really sorrowfully - because my

tears touched her. As if she never realized that anyone could love her that

much, perhaps.

>

> The other pure moment came 2 years later. I'd just graduated from high school

(at 17.5), and got dressed for a date. It was a simple outfit, just a skimming

little dress with elastic in the waist. I had a bit of a blush on my face from

sunburn and my hair was long. " How do I look? " I asked. Nada said, " Beautiful. "

>

> " No really, how do I look. " Nada said again, " You look beautiful. "

>

> Thinking back to her conversation with me years ago, when she said I was

" striking " but would never be beautiful, I reminded her of what she'd said. Nada

replied, " I was wrong. " She said it very simply, no bravado, almost softly,

with humility, as if she were taken by how I looked, as if she loved what she

saw at that moment. (By the way, I have a nice pair of eyes and an acceptable

figure but I am not beautiful.)

>

> Sigh. Two pure moments in the 50+ years with her. She had no " audience, " she

had no reason to say those things for effect, show, or power. She didn't need to

say them at all. I know now how rare and unusual they are - didn't at the time

though - but thanks to this group I know.

>

> Did you have anything like this? I ask because for me, it helps to know that

sometimes, nada had a chance to not be so sick, so disordered - and have a few

seconds of " normal. "

>

> Flowers in Oz

>

[Guest guest]

Flowers I remember 2 as well....well maybe 3 I guess

One time when I was 16 I was looking to work at the same law firm my best

friend worked. She often told me stories about how generous this lawyer was

giving her expensive gifts..and more money then he owed her. She told him I

wanted a job too. I went to interview with him and he told me he wasn't

looking for anyone right now but would keep me in mind. When I go home my

mom asked me what was wrong..I burst out crying..I was crying and telling

her how I didn't get the job..and my friend did. She comforted me hugged me

and let me cry...said some comforting words..and some dumb ones too like (we

are just not lucky people nothing good happens to us..other people have all

the luck you need to get used to that now)..come to find out later this guy

was making advances at my tall beautiful nice figured friend..I was short

and heavy..

One time out of the blue..she stoked my cheek and said you are so

beautiful...

My mother would NEVER drive to my house....she has given me every excuse.

One day I had a problem and needed her car..( it may have been that I needed

to take her somewhere)...she drove to my house and showed up in my drive

way..as I was telling her I couldn't believe it I started to cry my mother

has never ever been there for me.. this was totally out of character for

her

Do you think they have moments of sanity?

On Sat, Oct 16, 2010 at 8:20 PM, Flowers

wrote:

>

>

> Did you ever have a truly pure moment that was pure and untouched by BPD in

> nada? I had two.

>

> The first one was when I was 15. My nada had been talking about how much

> her bones were hurting, and she was going to the doctors to find out what

> was wrong. Her sister had died of bone cancer and of course, drama queen

> nada made it pretty clear that she thought she had it too.

>

> Nada had some tests done while I was at band camp. Even though she was a

> nada, I didn't know it and I was very attached to her. I was afraid to call

> home because I couldn't bear to find out while I was at camp that nada was

> dying. The whole ride home with dad I didn't ask a thing about it.

>

> Once in the door, nada sort of staggered in pain to the entrance to see me.

> She was dressed in her housecoat (tattered and old) and the bandage on her

> chest from the the bone test was large and ugly. I started to cry,

> hysterically, asking her, did she have bone cancer, was she going to die?

> She said no. I said, (to my surprise, even today)... " Are you lying? Are you

> afraid to tell me that you're dying? " No no, she said, she wasn't dying. I

> am full-tilt hysterically crying now, holding her. (I was already taller

> that she was.) She started to cry. I insisted through my hysteria, which was

> now up and amp or two now that she was in tears, " You are lying, you're

> crying! You're dying! " No no she said, not dying. I countered with: " Then

> why are you cryin?!!! "

>

> Nada said something you'd never EVER expect to hear from a nada: " I'm

> crying because you are. "

>

> Never before or since have my tears had any effect on her. But in that one

> pure moment, they did. We cried a little more as she explained she had

> osteoarthritis, hence the pain in her bones. She lived another 40 years.

> Thinking about it now, I could cry again all these years later, not because

> she didn't have cancer, but because she was crying - really sorrowfully -

> because my tears touched her. As if she never realized that anyone could

> love her that much, perhaps.

>

> The other pure moment came 2 years later. I'd just graduated from high

> school (at 17.5), and got dressed for a date. It was a simple outfit, just a

> skimming little dress with elastic in the waist. I had a bit of a blush on

> my face from sunburn and my hair was long. " How do I look? " I asked. Nada

> said, " Beautiful. "

>

> " No really, how do I look. " Nada said again, " You look beautiful. "

>

> Thinking back to her conversation with me years ago, when she said I was

> " striking " but would never be beautiful, I reminded her of what she'd said.

> Nada replied, " I was wrong. " She said it very simply, no bravado, almost

> softly, with humility, as if she were taken by how I looked, as if she loved

> what she saw at that moment. (By the way, I have a nice pair of eyes and an

> acceptable figure but I am not beautiful.)

>

> Sigh. Two pure moments in the 50+ years with her. She had no " audience, "

> she had no reason to say those things for effect, show, or power. She didn't

> need to say them at all. I know now how rare and unusual they are - didn't

> at the time though - but thanks to this group I know.

>

> Did you have anything like this? I ask because for me, it helps to know

> that sometimes, nada had a chance to not be so sick, so disordered - and

> have a few seconds of " normal. "

>

> Flowers in Oz

>

>

[Guest guest]

My sister says that nada had a few " moments of clarity. " I don't know but it

would be interesting to find out.

Flowers

-----Original Message-----

>

>

>Flowers I remember 2 as well....well maybe 3 I guess

>>Do you think they have moments of sanity?

>

>

[Guest guest]

Flowers,

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but the reality is, nada will never provide

you with the love, attention and nurturing you need. It's just not possible.

It's such a hard way to grow up, to not get that good response from our primary

caretakers, that we are beautiful, good, and meaningful and that we matter. It

is a deep pain, to the core of my being, in my case, to feel like I don't matter

and am not beautiful, and mostly, to not have my triumphs and successess

celebrated. I wish I had received a few more hugs growing up.

I think you are beautiful--your choice of a name tells me that, and that you are

meaningful and a beautiful person because you are on here, and seeking a better

life and healing.

However, I think a lot of my suffering has come from looking for nada and the

FOO to be different than they are. They are limited human beings, and very

emotionally stuck. It's just a reality.

For me, giving up on hope that they would change is really painful but

tremendously freeing. That hope is unrealistic.

I hope I haven't upset you too much, but this is the reality that I have found

to be true.

I wish you the best in your healing and keep posting.

Walked to Happiness.

>

> My sister says that nada had a few " moments of clarity. " I don't know but it

would be interesting to find out.

>

> Flowers

>

> -----Original Message-----

> >

> >

> >Flowers I remember 2 as well....well maybe 3 I guess

> >>Do you think they have moments of sanity?

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I always feel sad when I know that other kids got these moments all the time. We

got a small handful over the entire childhood.

I only have one that I really really think was genuine. Any other moment was

simply mum happy that I was making her look good.

I was 21, I had just had a late miscarriage. I had to call relatives and friends

to let them know, and most of the responses were " Oh, its for the best " " you

were too young anyway " " well it was probably disabled/deformed/ etc be happy

nature took its course " etc, all the types of responses that DONT HELP!!! They

just made me very upset.

I left calling mum til last as she was the one I dreaded talking to. She

actually got sad, and said that she was very sorry, and wished I didnt have to

go through such an awful thing. The sincerity in her voice (the only time I EVER

heard it) I still remember clearly today. Its one of the only good memories I

have of her.

Isnt it pathetic that this is all we get of decent memories? One of the most

traumatic periods of my life, I got 5 minutes of a decent mother.