Supplements

[Guest guest]

I am giving the glucosamine/chondroitin tablets to one of my

dogs who has developed arthritis in one front leg. It may be

my imagination, but I don't think, after a couple of months

of doing it, that she is limping nearly as badly as she was.

Ellen

rheumatic Supplements

> This is a true story that I thought I would share.

> My daughter raises Appaloosa horses. On her farm was also one very

> elderly shetland pony of about 25 years old. The pony was old and calm

and she used

> him for beginning children who showed a fear of horses. The pony never

went

> over a slow walk and never let noises, other animals etc bother him. A

couple

> of winters ago he started limping and it grew worse. The vet was

consulted

> and various shoes were tried all to no results. The vet after several

visits

> (and the animal could no longer support even the smallest child)

pronounced the

> pony had foundered and should be put down. My grand daughter now three

was

> very upset. I told my daughter that I would pay for the visit of the

> " expensive " horse shoe man that the really big farms used, to take a final

look and

> give his opinion.

> The new farrier came out and took a look. Had the horse walk up and

down

> and shook his head in dismay. The shoes were all wrong and the feet were

> trimmed wrong....he insisted the pain was in her knees and not her hoofs.

We were

> instructed to purchase glucosime sulfate supplements at the farm supply

and he

> re-shod the ponys hoofs. Three months later this pony did not even have a

> limp and could return to work. If it had not been for this supplement,

she

> would have been put down. Evidently in horses that are elderly this has

long been

> a remedy for arthritis. Sometimes these supplements really do work!!!

Martha

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Ellen,

I too give both my german shepherds glucosamine/chondroitin, but not in

response to any symptom, rather as a preventative measure. I've raised and

trained GS all my life, so I'm quite familiar w/ their hip & arthritis

problems. I had researched this thoroughly (maybe you have too), talked to

vets, researchers at UGA vet hospital, people who have used it on their

large breeds, and have found that the research has been extensive and the

evidence overwhelmingly positive. Even dogs w/ advance cases have shown

notable improvement.

If there is any concern, it is w/ the quality of the brand chosen. UGA

people had told me that mercury has been found in some brands due to the

sources used to obtain the glucosamine/chondroitin. This could obviously be

a problem if used as a long term supplement. The brand that was

consistently recommended by UGA and other vets (some who I train w/) is

Cosequin. It was used a lot in the actual research and is formulated

specifically for dogs (its available for other animals too). I imagine the

differences between this and people glucosamine/chondroitin may be subtle.

Another consideration I had heard is that dogs absorb

supplements/medications in pill form even less efficiently than people, so

the liquid form of glucosamine/chondroitin has shown some advantages over

the pills. I understand it can work out less expensive also.

Also, some brands only include glucosamine, and I understand that

glucosamine/chondroitin work synergistically to help the joint fluid. The

optimal dosage seen in much of the research was 400 - 500 mg 2x/day for

large breeds. Improvements in weeks time was not unheard of. Ester C was

also mentioned as beneficial.

Jeff

----Original Message Follows----

From: " EllenMcCool " <ellenmccool@...>

Reply- " EllenMcCool " <ellenmccool@...>

<rheumatic >,<MRSROSE2000@...>

Subject: Re: rheumatic Supplements

Date: Fri, 23 May 2003 13:02:10 -0400

I am giving the glucosamine/chondroitin tablets to one of my

dogs who has developed arthritis in one front leg. It may be

my imagination, but I don't think, after a couple of months

of doing it, that she is limping nearly as badly as she was.

Ellen

rheumatic Supplements

> This is a true story that I thought I would share.

> My daughter raises Appaloosa horses. On her farm was also one very

> elderly shetland pony of about 25 years old. The pony was old and calm

and she used

> him for beginning children who showed a fear of horses. The pony never

went

> over a slow walk and never let noises, other animals etc bother him. A

couple

> of winters ago he started limping and it grew worse. The vet was

consulted

> and various shoes were tried all to no results. The vet after several

visits

> (and the animal could no longer support even the smallest child)

pronounced the

> pony had foundered and should be put down. My grand daughter now three

was

> very upset. I told my daughter that I would pay for the visit of the

> " expensive " horse shoe man that the really big farms used, to take a

final

look and

> give his opinion.

> The new farrier came out and took a look. Had the horse walk up and

down

> and shook his head in dismay. The shoes were all wrong and the feet were

> trimmed wrong....he insisted the pain was in her knees and not her hoofs.

We were

> instructed to purchase glucosime sulfate supplements at the farm supply

and he

> re-shod the ponys hoofs. Three months later this pony did not even have

a

> limp and could return to work. If it had not been for this supplement,

she

> would have been put down. Evidently in horses that are elderly this has

long been

> a remedy for arthritis. Sometimes these supplements really do work!!!

Martha

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

what supplements is he on?

bascially if you are giving him a mega b you are punishing his

biochemistry with out of balance food factors

try u are able try cutting down the tablets or using a tiny fraction

of the capsules to give something in accordance with the rda and see

how that goes.

more is not better and balance is a moving target

> Hi all,

>

> I'd appreciate your experience with using mega dose vitamin B for

your kids and hyperactivity following that. How did you all overcome

the hyperactivity associated with mega dose vitamin therapy??

>

> My nearly nine year old autistic son has been on supplements for

the last ten days and he is definitely more hyperactive than usual.

Any input from you all would be helpful.

>

> Thanks,

> S.Nag

>

> SMS using the Messenger;Download latest version.

>

>

[Guest guest]

>>> I'd appreciate your experience with using mega dose vitamin B

for your kids and hyperactivity following that. How did you all

overcome the hyperactivity associated with mega dose vitamin

therapy??

Stop giving the mega-dose. Really, the mega-B is not productive for

most with autism. You can do as andrew suggested and cut the dose

back to somewhere more reasonable maybe around RDA or 10 mg or so

and see how that goes. Bs and other things need to be balanced or it

may cause other different problems. If you are giving enzymes, then

definitely reduce the extra B because it usually isn't needed.

You can also try giving magnesium. Or make sure you are not giving a

synthethic source of B.

.

[Guest guest]

I agree with cutting the mega-doses. I have never been a fan of

that method of treatment. Also, try adding folic acid in to the

diet. 600-800mcg capsules. Just empty the powder in to a drink; it

is completely tasteless, odorless and colorless.

Pam in WA

> Hi all,

>

> I'd appreciate your experience with using mega dose vitamin B for

your kids and hyperactivity following that. How did you all overcome

the hyperactivity associated with mega dose vitamin therapy??

>

> My nearly nine year old autistic son has been on supplements for

the last ten days and he is definitely more hyperactive than usual.

Any input from you all would be helpful.

>

> Thanks,

> S.Nag

>

> SMS using the Messenger;Download latest version.

>

>

[Guest guest]

You can also try giving magnesium. Or make sure you are not giving a

synthethic source of B.

yes, I think as well as dropping the mega doses, its very important

what type of vitamins you are using. Some are definitely more

absorbable and therefore more tolerable/useful than others.

Magnesium has been helpful with my daughter as well.

---

In , " jornmatt " <kjorn@t...> wrote:

> >>> I'd appreciate your experience with using mega dose vitamin B

> for your kids and hyperactivity following that. How did you all

> overcome the hyperactivity associated with mega dose vitamin

> therapy??

>

> Stop giving the mega-dose. Really, the mega-B is not productive for

> most with autism. You can do as andrew suggested and cut the dose

> back to somewhere more reasonable maybe around RDA or 10 mg or so

> and see how that goes. Bs and other things need to be balanced or

it

> may cause other different problems. If you are giving enzymes, then

> definitely reduce the extra B because it usually isn't needed.

>

> You can also try giving magnesium. Or make sure you are not giving

a

> synthethic source of B.

>

> .

[Guest guest]

> Hi all,

>

> I'd appreciate your experience with using mega dose vitamin B for

your kids and hyperactivity following that. How did you all overcome

the hyperactivity associated with mega dose vitamin therapy??

When the high B made my son hyper, I just did not use it.

Now after many rounds of ALA chelation, it no longer makes him hyper

and in fact has been VERY helpful for language and attention.

One thing you *might* want to try, go to your local health food store

and buy " pure " supplements, like JUST vitamin B6 or B12 or whatever

you are trying. Then you will know if it is the actual vitamin

itself, or the additives and fillers of the supplements you are

currently using.

Dana

[Guest guest]

>>>but I couldn't find it in the archives. Where can I find a guide

for timming the supplements, like which one shouldn't go at night or

morning, which ones cannot go toghether.

I don't think there is just one program for everyone. Depends on the

supplements, which brand, lifestyle, etc. For example, some probiotic

brands NEED to be taken with food and some NEED to be taken away from

food, and for others it doesn't matter. Same with vitamin

supplements, depends on the formulation.

So if your probiotic says to take away from enzymes by 2 hours, that

is what that brand requires. If it doesn't say, then anytime that is

not at the same time as enzymes is most conservative. Even taking

enzymes at the beginning and probiotics at the end of the meal can

work. I always gave probiotics at bedtime.

Enzymes should be given at the beginning of a meal for best results

because enzymes work on contact. The idea is to allow the most time

for the enzymes to work on food. If you forget to take them at the

beginning, taking them later is better than not at all.

The only other thing that is regularly recommended is to give

magnesium and zinc away from meals for better absorption. With

calcium depends on the form.

.

[Guest guest]

> This brings me to a question I've been trying to figure out since

> I've been learning all of these things. I'm believe that my son could

> benefit from supps/enzymes. How/where can I find a breakdown of what

> symptoms can be treated by what supp, and/or what each supp can do

> for him. Also, how much/when to give him each thing. Or, if there's a

> better way, I'd love some input and advice. I've checked the links

> and files and can't really find what I'm looking for.

I have some supplement info on what I have used for my son here

http://www.danasview.net/chel6380.htm

http://www.danasview.net/myson.htm

Dana

[Guest guest]

First of all, can someone explain to me what " severely apraxic " implies

(as we are in the midst of having our daughter Thea " statemented " in the

UK and it would be nice to understand the different degrees of apraxia

(the health professionals tell us NOTHING).

To answer your email, Kathy, we have been giving Thea FloraVital which

is a liquid form multi vitamin/mineral supplement. We are not sure

whether the improvement is from this or the EFA's but 95% of her morning

shakiness and weakness has gone. This coincided with the start of the

EFAs, vitamins and acidopholus. I am sorry that I cannot be more

specific. Best of luck.

kathyr0806 wrote:

Hello all,

My son is severely apraxic. We have been using ProEFA for 6 months

without any huge improvement. Just the steady kind that comes from lots

of work and therapy

Can anyone suggest another suppliment? It needs to be in liquid form

since he can't take pills yet.

Thanks

-Kathy

[Guest guest]

,

Thanks for the info on FloraVital. I've gotten lots of great tips on

diet but since Max gets 90% of his calories from milk I can't

impliment most of them. I am thinking this is positive since I can

start with the right kind of diet as he begins to chew.

As to the question of " severely apraxic " ...

This is what the developmental pediatrician and speech evaluators

wrote on his assessment. There were three issues that made the

situation " severe " in their minds:

(1) It is global. He has poor motor control in his limbs and hands as

well as the mouth.

(2) He has hypotonia especially in the mouth area. The hypotonia and

motor control issues keep him from eating solids, minimize facial

expression and limit his verbilizations to 5-6 different sounds. His

face still has " infant " like expressions.

(3) His word approximations are very, very poor. Obviously because he

only has a few sounds to use. Basically all you hear is the vowel

sounds and the rythm of the word he is trying to say. Plus speaking is

so difficult that he only tries when highly motivated. So, he won't

imitate a word even though he will imitate some sounds, rythms, etc.

He won't label items either. He will only say " ma " when he can't get

my attention another way like grabbing my hand.

Hope this helps some. Good luck at the eval.

-Kathy

>

> Hello all,

>

> My son is severely apraxic. We have been using ProEFA for 6 months

> without any huge improvement. Just the steady kind that comes from lots

> of work and therapy

>

> Can anyone suggest another suppliment? It needs to be in liquid form

> since he can't take pills yet.

>

> Thanks

> -Kathy

[Guest guest]

Thanks Kathy

I can relate to a lot of what you say. We shall see wrt Thea. She is now

2 3/4 and doesn't say much of anything but I can see that she really

wants to communicate...that much harder for us!!

Regarding the vitamin, just in case you want to use the same brand, it

is more precisely called: Floradix Kindervital.

All the best

PS how old is your son and what is his name?

Kathy wrote:

,

Thanks for the info on FloraVital. I've gotten lots of great tips on

diet but since Max gets 90% of his calories from milk I can't impliment

most of them. I am thinking this is positive since I can start with the

right kind of diet as he begins to chew.

As to the question of " severely apraxic " ...

This is what the developmental pediatrician and speech evaluators wrote

on his assessment. There were three issues that made the situation

" severe " in their minds:

(1) It is global. He has poor motor control in his limbs and hands as

well as the mouth.

(2) He has hypotonia especially in the mouth area. The hypotonia and

motor control issues keep him from eating solids, minimize facial

expression and limit his verbilizations to 5-6 different sounds. His

face still has " infant " like expressions.

(3) His word approximations are very, very poor. Obviously because he

only has a few sounds to use. Basically all you hear is the vowel sounds

and the rythm of the word he is trying to say. Plus speaking is so

difficult that he only tries when highly motivated. So, he won't imitate

a word even though he will imitate some sounds, rythms, etc. He won't

label items either. He will only say " ma " when he can't get my attention

another way like grabbing my hand.

Hope this helps some. Good luck at the eval.

-Kathy

[Guest guest]

Clare,

I am truly looking forward to hearing what the seminar had to offer. Please

let us know what you learned.

Joyce Cerulo

Medway, MA

[ ] supplements

>

>

> We only eat fish that comes from the ocean and since my husband

is a

> lobster man we do eat lobster more often. We also eat clams too. Our son

> does take a multi vit. I think it is Fred Flintstone. I have learned a

lot

> from everyone on this list and if anyone has any IEP questions feel free

to ask

> me. My mom and I are going to an apraxia conference that Dr. Velleum is

> speaking at tomorrow. I will share with everyone what she has to say. My

thoughts

> are if I can use a little bit of this and a little bit of that my son will

> have to best of all worlds. I have never been against any form of

medicine or

> alt. approaches to things. I have seen many things that can't be

explained why

> it worked. -Clare

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> I know this has been posted before, but can someone tell me what

> supplements, dosages and brands seem to work well. I'm talking adult,

> here.

It depends on your issues and what might work specifically for you. I

have tried several different brands and types of supplements for

myself, and I found what works for me. Unfortunately, it is a lot of

experimentation, at least it was for me.

Dana

[Guest guest]

> Hi Andy

>

> I have read all your supplementation posts for advice, and am abit

> confused about why you advise that magnesium and zinc must be given

> during chelation days.

Because I actually know something about the chemistry and physiology

of chelation, and mineral handling in the body.

> Surely this means that the chelator would waste time chelating

> magnesium and zinc instead of toxic metals??

Nope.

> Please could you explain your rationale.

The blood levels of the minerals are not changed much by oral dosing,

so there is no significant effect on binding by chelators once they

are in the body no matter what the details of the chelation are.

The actual facts are that the chelators don't bind the magnesium much

at all, and only bind zinc a little, and since this is happening in

the intestine it is probably helpful as the neutral bound complex most

likely absorbs better than the ionic minerals and chelators anyway.

either way, the equilibrium favors a reasonable amount of free

chelator, and absorption (and toxin binding) are unaffected.

> Regards,

> Joy

[Guest guest]

> coconut oil

Anti-viral

> flax oil

I use this for EFAs.

Dana

[Guest guest]

>

> Hello,

>

> I would truly appreciate it if I can get a feedback from somebody

who

> tried the following supplements on their kids. My baby is 21

months old

> and she was prescribed the following

>

> HLC Mind Linx (Probiotic) 1/2 teaspoon per day (divided into

two)

> Intestimend Brainchild 4 teaspoons per day (divided into

two)

> Monolaurin 2 Caps per day = ==

> Allicilin 1 Cap per day

> Calcium Magnesium 1/2 teaspoon perday

> B12 subligual 1 ml (16,667% daily allowance)

> Cod Liver Oil 1 Teaspoon per day

> Zinc Cream

>

I'm not comfortable with the Mind Linx recommendation, as it

contains strains (the two L. Acidophilus) which are not D-Lactate

free, to the best of my knowledge. I have read that this has been a

problem for some kids, where L. Acidophilus overgrows and produces

toxins, resulting in acidosis.

With regards to Intestimend - it contains NAC and MSM, which may not

be appropriate for some kids.

[Guest guest]

> Monolaurin 2 Caps per day = ==

Watch for yeast overgrowth with this.

> B12 subligual 1 ml (16,667% daily allowance)

My son did not tolerate B12 without lots of folic acid, and one of my

kids did not tolerate more than 1000mcg, and that was only after I

worked up to that amount very slowly. My son was age 6 at the time.

Start slow, with folic acid.

Dana

[Guest guest]

my son was on intestimed by brainchild. supposed to help with leaky gut issues.

i didnt see any differences. my son is currently taking monolaurin and

lauricidin they are one in the same and anti virals.

vicki

booshkazoom <booshkazoom@...> wrote:

>

> Hello,

>

> I would truly appreciate it if I can get a feedback from somebody

who

> tried the following supplements on their kids. My baby is 21

months old

> and she was prescribed the following

>

> HLC Mind Linx (Probiotic) 1/2 teaspoon per day (divided into

two)

> Intestimend Brainchild 4 teaspoons per day (divided into

two)

> Monolaurin 2 Caps per day = ==

> Allicilin 1 Cap per day

> Calcium Magnesium 1/2 teaspoon perday

> B12 subligual 1 ml (16,667% daily allowance)

> Cod Liver Oil 1 Teaspoon per day

> Zinc Cream

>

I'm not comfortable with the Mind Linx recommendation, as it

contains strains (the two L. Acidophilus) which are not D-Lactate

free, to the best of my knowledge. I have read that this has been a

problem for some kids, where L. Acidophilus overgrows and produces

toxins, resulting in acidosis.

With regards to Intestimend - it contains NAC and MSM, which may not

be appropriate for some kids.

=======================================================

[Guest guest]

I feel like there are so many supplements I should have my daughter on, could

someone tell me the ones that they found most important for their child?

Thanks--

Digest Number 4460

[Guest guest]

It would be helpful if you could describe what behaviors, etc. you are

trying to eradicate to be able to tell you what worked best for us...

-GA

Re: supplements

>I feel like there are so many supplements I should have my daughter on,

>could someone tell me the ones that they found most important for their

>child?

>

> Thanks--

>

>

[Guest guest]

ProEFA, by Nordic Naturals, immediate help with speech....Coromega

helped some, too, until we found the ProEFA. May be ordered from

www.shop-in-service.com or elsewhere.

Houston Nutraceuticals enzymes, Zyme Prime and AFP Protease chewables

Sea Buddies multiple vitamins, or another multiple

Juice Plus chewables

That's just our experience,sure somebody else will have a different

list.

Peace,

Kathy E.

On Mar 21, 2006, at 9:44 PM, jjcox22@... wrote:

> I feel like there are so many supplements I should have my daughter

> on, could someone tell me the ones that they found most important

> for their child?

>

> Thanks--

>

>

> Digest Number 4460

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> I feel like there are so many supplements I should have my daughter

on, could someone tell me the ones that they found most important for

their child?

I have general supplement info here

http://www.danasview.net/supps.htm

I wrote what helped my kids with certain issues here

http://www.danasview.net/issues.htm

What are your child's issues?

Dana

[Guest guest]

That's a tough question . I wrote a file on supplements. You

can find it at autism treatment in the Files section. It is intended to

give introductory information, part of which is what supplements might

help what problems. One part of the file is a link to the ARI website

where you can find supplements ratings (from parents). This might be

of help to you also.

Best wishes,

Anita

>

> I feel like there are so many supplements I should have my daughter

on, could someone tell me the ones that they found most important for

their child?

>

> Thanks--

>

>

> Digest Number 4460

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>> Sometimes when I give a whole bunch of supplements at

> the same time, my son immediately has a BM. Does this

> mean that the supps. are not getting absorbed?

Not really. When you start to eat, the body begins the process of

digestion which includes generating pancreatic enzymes and pushing

stuff out to make room for the new stuff coming in (this is the non-

scientific version, LOL). Taking lots of supplements probably kick

starts this process. The supplements themselves would be beginning the

process of being absorbed.

My son would play for hours. then as when I said,'Time for dinner,' he

would sit down for a few minutes then jump up and say, 'I have to go to

the bathroom.'

.