Guest guest Posted March 13, 2002 Report Share Posted March 13, 2002 >He sells eggs $1 per dozen so I'm thinking maybe they aren't great >(it's so cheap!). $1 per dozen is what I pay. Crack open an egg and look at the yellow-orange center, is it dark? Just because the food does not cost 4 times the price of grocery store food does not mean it isn't god for us... There are some people who will sell their products at a fair rate than an overpriced rate. Grace, a Augustine I wish you enough sun to keep your attitude bright. I wish you enough rain to appreciate the sun more. I wish you enough happiness to keep your spirit alive. I wish you enough pain so that the smallest joys in life appear much bigger. I wish you enough gain to satisfy your wanting. I wish you enough loss to appreciate all that you possess. I wish you enough ''Hello's " to get you through the final goodbye. --anonymous ----- Original Message ----- From: Barb Carr Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2002 5:23 PM Subject: questions for farmer Hi all, I just found a farmer who sells raw milk close to my house!! I'm very excited ($2.25/gallon, not bad!). I'm not sure what questions to ask him to make sure I'm getting good quality food. The cows are grass fed after May 1st. Until then it is mostly hay, some corn. Is this okay? What do I ask about the chicken feed (he said they eat corn, mash, oats and lay ????) Is there something in particular I should look for in assessing whether these eggs will be good or not? Also, sometimes they have butter but not often. Is it hard to make butter yourself? Thanks, Barb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2002 Report Share Posted March 14, 2002 > > I'm not sure what > > questions to ask him to make sure I'm getting good quality food. > > > *** On this subject, I have been wondering if I should ask the farmers I get my raw milk from if the cows are tested for TB etc? Rather, how should I ask exactly? Should they be tested often? And what should they be tested for? Or should I not worry about it... > > Thanks > Carolyn > >>>>>>>>>Hello Carolyn: I don't know whether cattle can spread TB or not. Since you want to know you could ask the farmers and I'm sure they would answer you completely. For further clarification ask your physician or call a veterinarian. Cattle are routinely tested and also vaccinated for some diseases. Sorry I don't know more about it. Dennis > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2002 Report Share Posted March 14, 2002 BRUCELLOSIS (Undulant fever, Bang's disease) What is brucellosis? Brucellosis is an illness characterized by fever, night sweats, extreme tiredness, anorexia (loss of appetite), weight loss, headache, and arthralgia (pain in the joints). It is caused by an infection with a bacteria of one of the Brucella species. The infection occurs worldwide, and is most common in the Mediterranean countries of Europe and Africa, the Middle East, India, central Asia, Mexico, and Central and South America. Who gets brucellosis? Anyone can get brucellosis if they are infected with a bacteria of one of the Brucella species. Persons at highest risk for brucellosis are those who work with animals that are infected, such as veterinarians and ranchers, and persons who consume raw milk or cheeses made with raw milk. Brucellosis may also be transmitted to humans if they are inadvertently exposed to live brucellosis vaccine by a needlestick or other accident. How is brucellosis spread? Brucellosis is spread to humans through contact with tissues or bodily fluids of animals who are infected with Brucella bacteria. Animals that may be infected with Brucella bacteria include cattle, swine, goats and sheep. Infections may also be found in bison, elk, caribou and some species of deer. There is a special kind of brucellosis, Brucella canis, that may be found in dogs (more commonly in stray dogs than pet dogs) and coyotes. What are the symptoms of brucellosis? Brucellosis is characterized by a fever which may be continuous, intermittent or irregular. Some other possible symptoms include headache, weakness, sweating, chills, arthralgia (pain in the joints), depression, weight loss and generalized aching. This disease may last for days, months, or as long as a year if untreated. How soon after exposure do symptoms appear? This is very variable, but 1-2 months after exposure is the most common. How is brucellosis diagnosed? The laboratory criteria for diagnosis include: *The isolation of bacteria from the Brucella family from a bacterial culture, or *An increase over time in antibodies in the blood that are specific for Brucella, or *The demonstration by immunofluorescence of bacteria from the Brucella family A case of brucellosis is probable when there is a case of disease that is clinically compatible (similar to that described above), and that is linked epidemiologically to a confirmed case. A case may also be probable when there is evidence in the blood of exposure to Brucella. A case of brucellosis is confirmed when a clinically compatible case is also laboratory confirmed. What is the treatment for brucellosis? Doctors can prescribe antibiotics for brucellosis. How can brucellosis be prevented? The most important steps to prevent brucellosis in humans are those necessary to control brucellosis in animals. The Brucellosis Eradication Program was established to eradicate the disease from cattle in the United States. From 1956 to 1998, the number of known brucellosis-affected herds decreased from 124,000 to 15. While brucellosis is rare in the United States, one step everyone can take to prevent possible exposure is to avoid consuming raw milk or cheeses made with raw milk. Where can I get more information? Your personal doctor. Your local health department listed in your telephone directory. The Utah Department of Health, Bureau of Epidemiology (801) 538- 6191. UTAH DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH BUREAU OF EPIDEMIOLOGY August 2001 Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Case definitions for infectious conditions under public health surveillance. MMWR 1997; 46 (No. RR-10):6-7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2002 Report Share Posted March 14, 2002 Hi : Here is what I would be looking for in answers to the questions: > What type of forage would I like to see the farmer growing > in his / her pastures? Good answer from the farmer, " It doesn't matter what type of forage is growing in the pasture. " Bad answer from the farmer, " We are using the newest improved super- duper hybrid recommended by my extension agent and was just proven by the local Ag College to be the greatest yield producer for our soil conditions. > Would I be happy to hear that the farmer added just > about anything to his / her soil in the pastures? Good answer from the farmer, " After a soil analysis, we added a mineral treatment to help correct a mineral shortage. The proposed treatment was tested in a strip in a few pastures and we found the cattle preferred to graze on the treated areas first before grazing the rest of the pasuture. After application, a test revealed an increased amount of methionine in the forage. " Bad answer from the farmer, " After a soil analysis we added an NPK treatment to increase the yield and increase the crude protein content of the forage. " > What volume of milk would I like to see per lactation per cow? Good answer from the farmer, " We don't push our cows for production. " Bad answer from the farmer, " Our cows are some of the highest producers in our local area and we are so proud of that. " The farmer I buy milk from says his cows produce about 4,000 litres per lactation. They don't have their first calf until they are 3 years old. Chi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2002 Report Share Posted March 14, 2002 > I know this remineralization topic has discussed before, but I am > curious....how long of a process is this? Assuming I'm drinking > good, raw milk and taking cod liver oil, when will > my filling fall out? Hi Carmen: Drinking raw milk and taking cod liver oil should not cause a filling to fall out. Price found that when an open cavity remineralized over, the hole in the tooth did not fill in.The nutritional factor that Price found was so important in the prevention of dental caries and in the remineralization over of existing cavities is found in variable amounts in milk. Even in the same herd, this amount of this factor varies during the year, depending on the season. Price never stated what was the minimum daily amount of this factor required for the remineralization to take place. He did show that the phosphate movement between the teeth and the saliva can be measured and in conditions of tooth decay phosphate is moving from the teeth into the saliva, while during the remineralization process the phosphate is moving from the saliva to the teeth. There is no guarantee that just because you are drinking raw milk that the movement of phosphate will be from the saliva to the teeth. There is no guarantee that just because the cows producing the raw milk are on green grass that the movement of phosphate will be from the saliva to the teeth. An indicator of the amount of Price's special activator is how yellow is the butter? Although Price used a butter oil made from a brilliant yellow butter in his clinical tests, it would appear likely that a yellow butter could also be sufficient, although you would need to consume more milk or more butter to get the same amount of the special activator. Price's data showed that a white butter would not have sufficient nutritional value as far as remineralization is concerned, and a pale yellow butter would not suffice either. As to how long the process would take, the experiment with the 27 mission children went at least 6 months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2002 Report Share Posted March 14, 2002 > Hi : > Here is what I would be looking for in answers to the questions: > > > What type of forage would I like to see the farmer growing > > in his / her pastures? > > Good answer from the farmer, " It doesn't matter what type of forage > is growing in the pasture. " > Bad answer from the farmer, " We are using the newest improved super- > duper hybrid recommended by my extension agent and was just proven by > the local Ag College to be the greatest yield producer for our soil > conditions. That certainly makes a lot of sense, but didn't WAP recommend wheat and rye grass for producing butter highest in activator X and soluble vitamins? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2002 Report Share Posted March 15, 2002 Hi thor610 Please accept my apologize. I'm sure their are others who would agree with me that I didn't know you were referring to a cow locked up in a barn. Please remember the old saying " It's not what you say it's how you say it " . There are a few of us out here trying to do the best we can with the best we have to work with and get a little sensitive to some of the ridiculous things ask of us. I'm Sorry thor610 wrote: > Dear Mr/Ms " Let's Get real here " > > Don't accuse me of something, that I never implied. > > I was referring to the person who wrote that she found the cow herd > confined in a barn during the winter. > > I was born, raise and still live on a farm in a farm community and I > know that there are as many types of farmers out there as in anything > else. > > Don't get hostile just because I suggested someone take a look at > goats and their owners. > > Message: 11 > Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 09:52:19 -0800 > From: kelly bruns <kjbruns@...> > Subject: Re: questions for farmer > > Lets get real here. If you want to upset a farmer just accuse him of > not > taking care of his cows. You obviously haven't looked into a Jersey > cows big > brown eyes before. > > > thor610 wrote: > > > $1 a dozen for farm fresh eggs is the going price around here. If I > > were to try to sell them for more than that, I wouldn't get any > > buyers. There is still the competition of picking them up in the > > grocery store and the low prices there. Only the truly educated would > > be willing to pay more and there are few of them. I have even had one > > person tell me that they preferred the grocery store eggs because the > > yolks were paler! > > > > Also, for anyone looking for raw dairy, try some of the goat owners. > > People with goats tend to have a more personal relationship with > their > > goats than people with a dairy cow herd. Goats are just really cute > > and fun to be around and you just might find them a bit more > > personally tended than a big cow herd because of it. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2002 Report Share Posted March 15, 2002 Hey thor610 Guess I can't talk either. I meant apology not apologize. kelly bruns wrote: > Hi thor610 > Please accept my apologize. I'm sure their are others who would agree with > me that I didn't know you were referring to a cow locked up in a barn. Please > remember the old saying " It's not what you say it's how you say it " . There > are a few of us out here trying to do the best we can with the best we have > to work with and get a little sensitive to some of the ridiculous things ask > of us. > I'm Sorry > > > thor610 wrote: > > > Dear Mr/Ms " Let's Get real here " > > > > Don't accuse me of something, that I never implied. > > > > I was referring to the person who wrote that she found the cow herd > > confined in a barn during the winter. > > > > I was born, raise and still live on a farm in a farm community and I > > know that there are as many types of farmers out there as in anything > > else. > > > > Don't get hostile just because I suggested someone take a look at > > goats and their owners. > > > > Message: 11 > > Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 09:52:19 -0800 > > From: kelly bruns <kjbruns@...> > > Subject: Re: questions for farmer > > > > Lets get real here. If you want to upset a farmer just accuse him of > > not > > taking care of his cows. You obviously haven't looked into a Jersey > > cows big > > brown eyes before. > > > > > > thor610 wrote: > > > > > $1 a dozen for farm fresh eggs is the going price around here. If I > > > were to try to sell them for more than that, I wouldn't get any > > > buyers. There is still the competition of picking them up in the > > > grocery store and the low prices there. Only the truly educated would > > > be willing to pay more and there are few of them. I have even had one > > > person tell me that they preferred the grocery store eggs because the > > > yolks were paler! > > > > > > Also, for anyone looking for raw dairy, try some of the goat owners. > > > People with goats tend to have a more personal relationship with > > their > > > goats than people with a dairy cow herd. Goats are just really cute > > > and fun to be around and you just might find them a bit more > > > personally tended than a big cow herd because of it. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2002 Report Share Posted March 15, 2002 Message: 19 Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2002 17:58:47 -0500 From: " Suze Fisher " <cfisher@...> Subject: questions for farmer >>>I was referring to the person who wrote that she found the cow herd > confined in a barn during the winter. ***Hi, I just want to clarify that I found the care of the cows inhumane, not just because they were shut up in a dark barn for 6-7 months, but because they were all in head locks and could not move, other than to lie down. They could not turn around. They could do nothing but stand, or sit in their small space in the same position and in the dark for months on end. Additionally, one of them had massive inflammation on one of her front leg joints - it looked like a balloon inside her skin. She was lying down. I doubt she could stand without a great deal of pain. I find that disturbing. Can a cow be fed *right* but still be unhealthy due to stress, lack of light, etc? I think the answer is an unequivocal yes! My point was...*proper diet* is not enough...at least for me. For an animal to be truly healthy, IMO, and to provide healthy food (milk, meat) they need to be treated humanely, and live at least a little more closely to what nature designed. Heads locked guillotine-style in a small dark space for extended periods, is not a situation that could produce anything healthy, IMHO. Suze Fisher Web Design & Development http://www.suscom-maine.net/~cfisher/ __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2002 Report Share Posted March 18, 2002 Hi Suze, You don't say a few things here that could be important. What time of day did you visit? Was it early morning or late afternoon, regular milking times? Did the farmer say the cows had been inside through the winter months? You're in Maine? What was the weather that day? How much snow and ice was in the pasture? Guess what I'm trying to say as a New Englander who has lived on a dairy farm is that the stanchions may seem cruel. They're needed for the milking process in larger herds. They are dairy cows that deserve the respect of good food, water, sunlight, exercise and air like any living being but this is New England. If they are being kept in for long periods in winter it is more than likely for the cow's protection from getting hurt on ice or in snow crust. Cows will lay in manure outside. Stanchion to gutter length is so the manure should go in the gutter. There are chains on the stanchions that allow side to side movement. The inflammation was likely from laying on the barn floor without sufficient shavings underneath. If all of them had this I'd be worried. New England winters are hard on all that live here. If you have livestock that overwinter its hard morally and financially just like it is for us who live here year round. Freedoms need to be compromised for safety and survival. Wanita At 03:33 PM 3/15/02 -0800, you wrote: >***Hi, I just want to clarify that I found the care of >the cows >inhumane, >not just because they were shut up in a dark barn for >6-7 months, but >because they were all in head locks and could not >move, other than to >lie >down. They could not turn around. They could do >nothing but stand, or >sit in >their small space in the same position and in the dark >for months on >end. >Additionally, one of them had massive inflammation on >one of her front >leg >joints - it looked like a balloon inside her skin. She >was lying down. >I >doubt she could stand without a great deal of pain. > >I find that disturbing. Can a cow be fed *right* but >still be unhealthy >due >to stress, lack of light, etc? I think the answer is >an unequivocal >yes! > >My point was...*proper diet* is not enough...at least >for me. For an >animal >to be truly healthy, IMO, and to provide healthy food >(milk, meat) they >need >to be treated humanely, and live at least a little >more closely to what >nature designed. Heads locked guillotine-style in a >small dark space >for >extended periods, is not a situation that could >produce anything >healthy, >IMHO. > >Suze Fisher >Web Design & Development ><http://www.suscom-maine.net/~cfisher/>http://www.suscom-maine.net/~cfisher/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2002 Report Share Posted March 18, 2002 I agree with you Wanita! We are grazers, and our cows get out every chance they can. But, there are days that it's just too darn nasty outside to let them out of the barn. We would rather have them in the dry barn, tied up, than outside where they could get frozen teats or filthy dirty. On those days we do let them out for excercise for about an hour (while we clean barn), but they spend much of the day in the barn where they're safe. We don't like this ourselves, and can imagine how the cows feel about it. But, we have no choice here in Wisconsin either! Our winters can be rather nasty here - and protecting the animals is our number one goal. We're so looking forward to spring here........ Hugs, Janet Hi Suze, You don't say a few things here that could be important. What time of day did you visit? Was it early morning or late afternoon, regular milking times? Did the farmer say the cows had been inside through the winter months? You're in Maine? What was the weather that day? How much snow and ice was in the pasture? Guess what I'm trying to say as a New Englander who has lived on a dairy farm is that the stanchions may seem cruel. They're needed for the milking process in larger herds. They are dairy cows that deserve the respect of good food, water, sunlight, exercise and air like any living being but this is New England. If they are being kept in for long periods in winter it is more than likely for the cow's protection from getting hurt on ice or in snow crust. Cows will lay in manure outside. Stanchion to gutter length is so the manure should go in the gutter. There are chains on the stanchions that allow side to side movement. The inflammation was likely from laying on the barn floor without sufficient shavings underneath. If all of them had this I'd be worried. New England winters are hard on all that live here. If you have livestock that overwinter its hard morally and financially just like it is for us who live here year round. Freedoms need to be compromised for safety and survival. Wanita At 03:33 PM 3/15/02 -0800, you wrote: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2002 Report Share Posted March 19, 2002 I'm sorry but I have to hear this plain....are you really saying that if you do this, your fillings will fall out????!!! I have tons of fillings - deep ones. What can I expect? C. ----- Original Message ----- From: r_rom Sent: Monday, March 18, 2002 7:39 PM Subject: Re: questions for farmer Bianca, What's the average amount of time it's taken your patients remineralization to occur? Is it months, years, ...? Can only small cavities remineralize? Roman > > ME: The method that Doctor Price used in remineralizing teeth involved > butter oil (not just butter) mixed with cod liver oil. The mixture was > probably much stronger in its nutrient profile than what you are > currently using. > > As for me personally, I had people remineralize their teeth using butter > and fish livers mixed together in smoothies. Despite the enthusiasm for > cod liver oil by Sally, and others I have always been very leery of > it and remain so to this day (as well as flax oil). Remineralization > ALWAYS went faster when patients were eating animal products raised on > very high quality forage. > > Most of the time though people were able to remineralize their teeth on a > diet that was largely raw animal foods and consisted of copious amounts > of milk, fish and butter. This usually took much longer but was okay > since it usually was only one of many goals for the person involved. > Further, they had their fillings removed in advance rather than waiting > for them to fall out. > > hope that helps, > > Bianca > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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