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Ok--has anyone actually ever tasted Dr. Price's famous butter oil (created by

centerfuging VERY high quality butter)? I'd love to hear more about this stuff

as I am about to start taking Cod liver oil and it is supposedly best if taken

with the butter oil. Why do I think it is produced commercially in New

Zealand...maybe there's something in NT about this...

Thanks!

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There is no raw butter oil produced commercially anywhere - unless

something has recently changed.

Bianca

On Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:21:17 -0500 " " <jc137@...>

writes:

Ok--has anyone actually ever tasted Dr. Price's famous butter oil

(created by centerfuging VERY high quality butter)? I'd love to hear

more about this stuff as I am about to start taking Cod liver oil and it

is supposedly best if taken with the butter oil. Why do I think it is

produced commercially in New Zealand...maybe there's something in NT

about this...

Thanks!

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> Ok--has anyone actually ever tasted Dr. Price's famous butter oil

(created by centerfuging VERY high quality butter)? I'd love to hear

more about this stuff as I am about to start taking Cod liver oil and

it is supposedly best if taken with the butter oil. Why do I think it

is produced commercially in New Zealand...maybe there's something in

NT about this...

>

>

> Thanks!

>

>

> :

>>>>>>>>>>>>what is the recommended daily dose of the butter oil?

I'll make some tomorrow. I'd like to see what the yield is.

Dennis Kemnitz

>

>

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At 07:33 PM 3/26/2002 -0800, Bianca wrote:

>There is no raw butter oil produced commercially anywhere - unless

>something has recently changed. From : Why do I think it is

produced commercially in New Zealand...maybe there's something in NT

about this...

If you perform a search on the Internet you can find many references to

Australia and New Zealand being chief producers of butter oil and related

products. It seems that the butter oil may be only produced for wholesale

use. For example, Anchor brand offers " Butter Oil Mist " spray cans of this

butter oil with and without flavorings (near the bottom of the following

web page).

http://www.grocersreview.co.nz/archives/nov01_7.htm

And the Australian New Zealand Food Authority (ANZFA) lists standards for

the production of the butter oil -- which is alternatively named: Ghee,

clarified butter, butter oil or anhydrous milk fat.

At the Weston A. Price web site are several references - here's one: " Dr.

Price always gave cod liver oil with butter oil, extracted by centrifuge

from good quality spring or fall

butter. " http://www.westonaprice.org/nutrition_guidelines/guide.html

Regards,

-=mark=-

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But ghee is heated, is it not?

So it would lack all the benefits of the Price-like butter oil.

Ramit

_________________________________________________________

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At 10:43 AM 3/27/2002 -0500, Ramit wrote:

>But ghee is heated, is it not?

>So it would lack all the benefits of the Price-like butter oil.

Correct. I want to perform an experiment at home since I don't have a

centrifuge to play around with. I think we mostly all agree that heating

butter up to about 96 degrees or so would be okay to do. Since Ghee is

simply " anhydrous fat " (the water and solids have been removed) it should

be possible to keep the heat at 96 degrees and slowly evaporate the water

from the butter. It should be liquid at that temperature too. Skimming

the solids off or removing them should then be a simple matter. It might

take much longer to evaporate all of the water but theoretically it's possible.

Regards,

-=mark=-

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Wetzel in Nebraska has butter oil (and X-factor oil) available in

season. I think several people on this list have used his butter oil in

the past. He, too, used to be on this list, but I'm guessing he's no

longer around, since he hasn't jumped in on this one...

Can anybody help provide 's email address? He will let us know when

the new butter oil is ready (in the Spring).

Was Weston A. Price's " high-vitamin butter oil " raw or pasteurized? I

don't remember whether Wetz's oil is raw or pasteurized, but it's made from

cows on rapidly-growing grass.

Ramit

<supersugarjunkie@

> cc:

Subject: Re:

Butter oil?

03/27/2002 09:43

AM

Please respond to

But ghee is heated, is it not?

So it would lack all the benefits of the Price-like butter oil.

Ramit

_________________________________________________________

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Can somebody explain (even on a purely theoretical level) what possible

benefit " butter oil " would have over plain old butter? The ONLY reason that

I can come up with would be shelf stability in the absence of a

refrigerator. In other words, in the early 1900s, I can see why it may have

been valuable to make butter oil...so that it could be kept without

degradation for a longer period of time. Given the current availability of

refrigeration, however, what possible benefit could there be to butter oil

over plain old butter??

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-

>Can somebody explain (even on a purely theoretical level) what possible

>benefit " butter oil " would have over plain old butter? The ONLY reason that

>I can come up with would be shelf stability in the absence of a

>refrigerator.

My only guess would be density. I don't know what fraction of butter is

fat and what is water and solids, but perhaps it's possible to consume more

of the fat-soluble nutrients when they're delivered in butter oil. Or

perhaps absorption is easier, particularly under the tongue?

But it's just as likely or more so that the only advantage was the ability

to cart the oil around with him wherever he went without worrying about

spoilage.

-

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It's apparently tolerated by people who cannot tolerate dairy; I believe because

milk proteins are absent. --

Kroyer schrieb:

> Can somebody explain (even on a purely theoretical level) what possible

> benefit " butter oil " would have over plain old butter? The ONLY reason that

> I can come up with would be shelf stability in the absence of a

> refrigerator. In other words, in the early 1900s, I can see why it may have

> been valuable to make butter oil...so that it could be kept without

> degradation for a longer period of time. Given the current availability of

> refrigeration, however, what possible benefit could there be to butter oil

> over plain old butter??

>

>

>

>

>

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> >But ghee is heated, is it not?

> >So it would lack all the benefits of the Price-like butter oil.

>

> Correct. I want to perform an experiment at home since I don't have

a

> centrifuge to play around with. I think we mostly all agree that

heating

> butter up to about 96 degrees or so would be okay to do. Since Ghee

is

> simply " anhydrous fat " (the water and solids have been removed) it

should

> be possible to keep the heat at 96 degrees and slowly evaporate the

water

> from the butter. It should be liquid at that temperature too.

Skimming

> the solids off or removing them should then be a simple matter. It

might

> take much longer to evaporate all of the water but theoretically

it's possible.

>

> Regards,

>

> -=mark=-

>>>>>>>>I made some butter today and it is really bright yellow. So I

will warm to 96F plus or minus 5F, then centrifuge. I can centrifuge

only 50 milliliters (mls)per batch. I'm wondering if 96 is too

warm, so I'll watch the butter closely as it warms on a hot plate.

Dennis Kemnitz

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> -

>

> >Can somebody explain (even on a purely theoretical level) what

possible

> >benefit " butter oil " would have over plain old butter? The ONLY

reason that

> >I can come up with would be shelf stability in the absence of a

> >refrigerator.

>

> My only guess would be density. I don't know what fraction of

butter is

> fat and what is water and solids, but perhaps it's possible to

consume more

> of the fat-soluble nutrients when they're delivered in butter oil.

Or

> perhaps absorption is easier, particularly under the tongue?

>

> But it's just as likely or more so that the only advantage was the

ability

> to cart the oil around with him wherever he went without worrying

about

> spoilage.

>

>

>

> -

>>>I'm thinking the oil would go rancid as quick as the butter would

sour. There may be natural anti-oxidants in the oil, however I doubt

it. You'll have fat soluble vitamins concentrated in the oil,

consuming more vitamins per spoonful. Dennis Kemnitz

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> >But ghee is heated, is it not?

> >So it would lack all the benefits of the Price-like butter oil.

>

> Correct. I want to perform an experiment at home since I don't have

a

> centrifuge to play around with. I think we mostly all agree that

heating

> butter up to about 96 degrees or so would be okay to do. Since Ghee

is

> simply " anhydrous fat " (the water and solids have been removed) it

should

> be possible to keep the heat at 96 degrees and slowly evaporate the

water

> from the butter. It should be liquid at that temperature too.

Skimming

> the solids off or removing them should then be a simple matter. It

might

> take much longer to evaporate all of the water but theoretically

it's possible.

>

> Regards,

>

> -=mark=-

>>>>>>>the oil is mostly on top of the tube after warming in 96F

waterbath for about 15 minutes. Butter was at 76F going into the

waterbath. The oil is going to solidify after and not before it comes

out of the centrifuge I hope. I'm taking oil to centrifuge at 105 F.

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> >But ghee is heated, is it not?

> >So it would lack all the benefits of the Price-like butter oil.

>

> Correct. I want to perform an experiment at home since I don't have

a

> centrifuge to play around with. I think we mostly all agree that

heating

> butter up to about 96 degrees or so would be okay to do. Since Ghee

is

> simply " anhydrous fat " (the water and solids have been removed) it

should

> be possible to keep the heat at 96 degrees and slowly evaporate the

water

> from the butter. It should be liquid at that temperature too.

Skimming

> the solids off or removing them should then be a simple matter. It

might

> take much longer to evaporate all of the water but theoretically

it's possible.

>

> Regards,

>

> -=mark=-

>>>>>>>the oil is mostly on top of the tube after warming in 96F

waterbath for about 15 minutes. Butter was at 76F going into the

waterbath. The oil is going to solidify after and not before it comes

out of the centrifuge I hope. I'm taking oil to centrifuge at 105 F.

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> > >But ghee is heated, is it not?

> > >So it would lack all the benefits of the Price-like butter oil.

> >

> > Correct. I want to perform an experiment at home since I don't

have

> a

> > centrifuge to play around with. I think we mostly all agree that

> heating

> > butter up to about 96 degrees or so would be okay to do. Since

Ghee

> is

> > simply " anhydrous fat " (the water and solids have been removed) it

> should

> > be possible to keep the heat at 96 degrees and slowly evaporate

the

> water

> > from the butter. It should be liquid at that temperature too.

> Skimming

> > the solids off or removing them should then be a simple matter.

It

> might

> > take much longer to evaporate all of the water but theoretically

> it's possible.

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > -=mark=-

>

>

>

>

> >>>>>>>the oil is mostly on top of the tube after warming in 96F

> waterbath for about 15 minutes. Butter was at 76F going into the

> waterbath. The oil is going to solidify after and not before it

comes

> out of the centrifuge I hope. I'm taking oil to centrifuge at 105

F.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I posted the paragraph above earlier without signing.

Dennis Kemnitz

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>As for this post:I can't tell whether there should be

three or four fractions from the butter meltdown. So I can't determine

the yield of butter oil at this point. It's very yellow and comprises

around two-thirds of the butter. Dennis Kemnitz

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top. I just carefully poured off the oil afterward. Hey - that

was

easy.

>

> Regards,

>

> -=mark=-

This butter oil I made has solidified at room temp (70F). Did yours?

What you going to do with the oil? Dennis Kemnitz

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> >This butter oil I made has solidified at room temp (70F). Did

yours?

> >What you going to do with the oil? Dennis Kemnitz

>

> Yes - mine solidified. <snip>

>

> Since I have no troubles with whole, raw milk I will use the butter

oil

> (slightly hydrogenated still) as I normally do - as raw fat in my

> diet. How about you?

>

> Regards,

>

> -=mark=-

Mark:

Maybe I'll use mine when I'm in a rush as a matter of convenience,

like when the butter's too hard to spread or I don't have any bread.

Not a big deal, but I doubt there's water in the oil. Try freezing a

little and look for ice crystals before thawing and watch for weeping

as it thaws. The oil I had on top layer solidified at room temp. and

looks like coconut oil I've seen years ago (at room temp.), without

the yellow color of course. Dennis Kemnitz

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>

> > Hi Guys

> > Not sure if it helps but the temperature of a cow is from 101 to

102 degrees

> > F. It may rise as high as 103 on a hot day. Seems to me that the

nutrients

> > would not be compromised heating milk at least that warm ??

> > s

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Thanks for the thought. I wanted to write back to

ask whether he thought the gov would let us sell raw butter oil. With

campylobacter and coliform as possible contaminants I now know that

answer. What are symptoms of campylobacter food poisoning? Bacteria

wouldn't grow nor thrive in 100% oil, I don't think, but one fraction

of the butter oil I made has milk solids in it tooso that's of

concern. Thanks again and get plenty of rest to stay ahead of that

lawsuit. Dennis kemnitz

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> I must warn you of heating to low temps on milk & milk products.

make sure your

> source is clean, campylobacter thrives at 85to116 degrees, as well

as E=coli

<<<<<<<< apparently you'd recommend chilling raw butter at 40F. We

don't always refrigerate ours. Dennis

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>

> > Hi Guys

> > Not sure if it helps but the temperature of a cow is from 101 to

102 degrees

> > F. It may rise as high as 103 on a hot day. Seems to me that the

nutrients

> > would not be compromised heating milk at least that warm ??

> >

> >

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<Sorry about the double no-message post last night. By

the time I finished " snipping " I thought I was ready to send. Any

way thank goodness it's a new day. So when did the dairy industry

start testing for Campylobacter? I studied food microbiology and

quality control for dairy foods in 1976 and '77 and we didn't test for

them then. Further at Mid-Am there was not any routine testing for

Campylobacter in 1977,78 or 79 cause I worked at their lab then. What

disease does Campylobacter cause or is there just some sort of food

poisoning associated with Campylobacter? We did test for coliforms,

total plate count, and antibiotics in incoming raw milk and on some

producer samples. Of course we checked butterfat routinely on

producers and added water occassionally on tankers and producers. On

grade A co-mingled we tested every tanker for antibiotics. We did not

test for E coli or any specific strains of E coli. Manufacturing

grade milk was used at our plant to manufacture mozzarrella cheese

and powdered lactose food and de-lactosed whey feed. Since then I've

worked more with powdered products 'cause, actually, QC of dairy is

complicated. It's a rich food that microorganisms love and therefore

cause many complications prior to, during and after manufacture.

It's best consumed almost immediately (fresh) in my opinion for so

many reasons. So the rest of you folks could get a cow to go along

with those two chickens in your yard! It doesn't HAVE to be a Jersey!

There may be some for sale and I figure a good fair price for what

they offer in nutrition yearly to a family should be around 5000

dollars a piece. Afterall it takes nearly 4 years to humanely get one

into production. Don't wait!

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> > >>>>>>>>I made some butter today and it is really bright yellow.

So I

> >will warm to 96F plus or minus 5F, then centrifuge. I can

centrifuge

> >only 50 milliliters (mls)per batch. I'm wondering if 96 is too

> >warm, so I'll watch the butter closely as it warms on a hot plate.

>

> Hi Dennis - you may be right. I spent all day keeping a test pot

warm

> (about 95 degrees F.) with butter in it (using a light bulb). The

milk

> solids obligingly fell to the bottom in a few hours and the oil

stayed on

>

> top. I just carefully poured off the oil afterward. Hey - that was

> easy.

>

>>>>>>>>>>>>I used a centrifuge we use here in the lab. It's ancient

and we have no manual for it so I can't tell you the RPM's or the

g's I used. The oil (at 105F) cooled rather quickly (probably 2 min.)

in the centrifuge in a room which was probably 68F. I'd recommend

warming the room and using as many g's as possible to get a complete

separation of the solids and oil within 2 min. It sounded like Mark

had good luck pouring off the top. Good luck. Dennis

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  • 4 months later...

-----Original Message-----

From: Kroyer [mailto:skroyer@...]

Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 1:51 PM

Can somebody explain (even on a purely theoretical level) what possible

benefit " butter oil " would have over plain old butter? <snip> Given the

current availability of refrigeration, however, what possible benefit could

there be to butter oil

over plain old butter??

--

I know this is old...but when I read the replies, I didn't see my idea

posted:

I thought one of the points to taking butter oil is that it is a highly

concentrated source of fat soluble vitamins. So the benefit would be " more

bang for the buck. " Price was putting it and cod liver oil under the tongues

of dreadfully ill people...I think the idea is that it is as concentrated

and potent as possible, and easier for a sick person to absorb just a little

under the tongue than getting the equivalent amount of vitamins by eating

enough regular butter.

I got some butter oil from the guy in Nebraska (ordered through Radiant

Life) and cod liver oil and have been taking a 1/2tsp each every morning

with a 1/2tsp of virgin coconut oil for good measure. I've found that

swallowing it quick and chasing it with a mouthful of kombucha helps me

avoid the horrific taste of the cod liver oil.

Now, I just got Henry Bieler's book Food is Your Best Medicine and he is

squarely against cod liver oil as a processed, " evil smelling " snake oil.

I don't feel any more or less healthy since I started taking these oils, so

I don't know who's right.

Jill Nienhiser

Webweaver

www.westonaprice.org

www.realmilk.com

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At 10:48 AM 8/21/02 -0400, you wrote:

>Now, I just got Henry Bieler's book Food is Your Best Medicine and he is

>squarely against cod liver oil as a processed, " evil smelling " snake oil.

>Jill Nienhiser

I'm about halfway through FIYBM. When I saw about cod liver oil it made me

think of a National Geographic show (if I remember correctly) I saw a few

months ago. Was a tribal woman from a northern latitude saying she was told by

her ancestors not to eat the fish livers except in winter as you would get

sick. Likely because of sunshine or possibly some other lost knowledge.

In FIYBM I'm where tuberculosis patients are typed for survival and its cut

and

dried. Not a mix like me in his typing. Maybe serious illness does this. Other

parts are fascinating. Go figure!

Wanita

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  • 8 years later...

>

> Worth the hype?

>

> Hellooo Bee. I would like to know how one can make butter oil. With high

inflation soon to hit supermarket shelves, the idea of making your own food just

became a little more clever.

>

+++Hi LukeC,

Are you sure you mean " butter oil " since it is made from raw milk, by a non-heat

extraction process. The raw milk is only from cows eating fresh green grass in

the Spring - see this:

http://www.greenpasture.org/retail/?t=products & a=line & i=butter-oil

Here's my article on Butter Oil:

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/butter1.php

You can make ghee yourself, which is called clarified butter, that is cooked in

the oven in order to remove the proteins that some people cannot tolerate very

well:

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/butter2.php

The best, Bee

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I have decided to use your Ghee recipe in place of butter oil (too costly).

Is is *that* important to have it placed in the oven???

Luke.C.

> >

> > Worth the hype?

> >

> > Hellooo Bee. I would like to know how one can make butter oil. With high

inflation soon to hit supermarket shelves, the idea of making your own food just

became a little more clever.

> >

> +++Hi LukeC,

>

> Are you sure you mean " butter oil " since it is made from raw milk, by a

non-heat extraction process. The raw milk is only from cows eating fresh green

grass in the Spring - see this:

> http://www.greenpasture.org/retail/?t=products & a=line & i=butter-oil

>

> Here's my article on Butter Oil:

> http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/butter1.php

>

> You can make ghee yourself, which is called clarified butter, that is cooked

in the oven in order to remove the proteins that some people cannot tolerate

very well:

> http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/butter2.php

>

> The best, Bee

>

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