anyone else have ...

[Guest guest]

a BPD parent who pushes them away. When my BPD mother misbehaves and I get

upset and end a conversation or walk away. She then won't speak to me,

punishing me, rather than bombarding me with contact. She does that at other

times. My mom blew up at Christmas and I left. We haven't spoken since b/c

whenever I made small reach out attempts like asking how she was via phone or

email she said that frivilous contact wasn't welcome from me and hung up.

She misbehaves and then punishes me. It makes me feel like I'm crazy or a

naughty 5 year old.

Help! any advice on how to respond to her?

Thanks,

[Guest guest]

-- In WTOAdultChildren1 , " Veetee "

wrote:

> She misbehaves and then punishes me. It makes me feel like I'm crazy or a

naughty 5 year old.

>

> Help! any advice on how to respond to her?

Hi, . You're not crazy. That's just gaslighting/projection at work.

When you walk away--which is the right thing to do, good job!--she feels

abandoned and will do what she can to make herself feel like it is her choice

you aren't there. If she pushes you away first, you can't leave her again.

You might not like this advice, and it's hard to learn, but my suggestion is to

just count it as a blessing that she's giving you a break from contact. You

don't owe her any apologies, and it won't help anything if you go running back

to her trying to make things right or to get her to love you. You haven't done

anything wrong. And nothing you do will ever change her. Just enjoy the period

of no contact, use it to take care of yourself and think about your personal

limits.

[Guest guest]

That's what fada did to me, pushed me away. He didn't like that I moved

out, and when he disowned me, I refused to play by his games. He pushed me

away hoping I would come begging back (to feed the NPD side). He felt

abandoned, but he wanted the blame to be put on me. As my dishrag flying

monkey nada texted me, " The ball's in your court, " meaning, it's all my

fault because I didn't come crawling back when he pushed me away.

Sorry, I'm rambling, I can't think very well right now. But the end of the

story is that is what caused me to be NC with fada and FOO. He instated NC,

and I maintained it to keep my sanity. And I'm enjoying not being

continually abused by fada (though I still worry about my siblings!)

So I second KT, enjoy this time of NC, and heal, and your nada can take care

of herself.

Holly

>

>

>

> -- In WTOAdultChildren1 , " Veetee "

> wrote:

>

> > She misbehaves and then punishes me. It makes me feel like I'm crazy or a

> naughty 5 year old.

> >

> > Help! any advice on how to respond to her?

>

> Hi, . You're not crazy. That's just gaslighting/projection at work.

> When you walk away--which is the right thing to do, good job!--she feels

> abandoned and will do what she can to make herself feel like it is her

> choice you aren't there. If she pushes you away first, you can't leave her

> again.

>

> You might not like this advice, and it's hard to learn, but my suggestion

> is to just count it as a blessing that she's giving you a break from

> contact. You don't owe her any apologies, and it won't help anything if you

> go running back to her trying to make things right or to get her to love

> you. You haven't done anything wrong. And nothing you do will ever change

> her. Just enjoy the period of no contact, use it to take care of yourself

> and think about your personal limits.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

When she's revved up, no response from you is going to be accepted. The only

thing you can do is to protect yourself. If you are 'punished' long enough and

allowed back into her life. Learn some catch phrases to say back to her that

puts the rejection solidly back into her lap. " Oh, no hug goodbye? Oh well,

maybe next time. " " Sorry you feel that way. Maybe next time you will be more

communicative. "

On the other hand, she is getting exactly what she needs from you right now to

her mind: you are pursuing her and she is rejecting you. SHE is withholding her

love from you--you can't change that. The only thing you can change is to stop

your pursuit. Would you be trying so hard if it was anyone else other than a

parent?

You are neither a child nor naughty, and she has no right to make you feel that

way. Do let her.

Mine has been royally pissed at me for 18 months because I never fawned all over

her new house the way she expected me to. She's mad at me because I won't walk

through her master bedroom to use HER bathroom but instead used the one in the

hallway off the living room. She's mad because I inadvertently spilled the beans

about her being diabetic to Dad (she kept it from him for over a year--how was I

supposed to know she hadn't clued him in?). She refuses to call me or return my

calls. If she has to get in touch she has DD do it.

When she gets angry, she acts victimized and treats the target to the cold

shoulder " I don't need YOU " attitude. Reject first is her motto--emotional and

physical. There is no way I can reason with her, surface the problem, even an

apology doesn't work because SHE is hurt/disappointed/angry/whatever, etc. On

the rare occasions she will open up and talk, we have talked everything out to

the point she is smiling and stating how much she missed me and is relieved its

all over, only to find 20 minutes later she is stiff again and answering me in

monosyllables.

Last summer we were in an argument that she started (she drops bombs, and then

refuses to talk about it), she kept saying " I'm done--there is nothing to

discuss. " To which I answered, " If it is really done as you say, then how about

you don't play the victim for the next 2 weeks we are on this trip together? "

Boy, was she angry--I had never called her on playing the victim before, and the

rest of the time together she kept it buried since she was going to be DAMNED

before she proved me right!

Of course, during the trip she played uproar every day. She bitched and shrieked

at my sister and I daily, and we gave it right back to her. So then she cried to

my nephew how mean we were. Of course, he didn't know she had been yelling at

her great-granddaughter (his daughter) earlier that day.

She still tries to bring up that trip to my sister and I, trying to " rewrite "

what occurred. lol, no way!

>

> a BPD parent who pushes them away. When my BPD mother misbehaves and I get

upset and end a conversation or walk away. She then won't speak to me,

punishing me, rather than bombarding me with contact. She does that at other

times. My mom blew up at Christmas and I left. We haven't spoken since b/c

whenever I made small reach out attempts like asking how she was via phone or

email she said that frivilous contact wasn't welcome from me and hung up.

>

> She misbehaves and then punishes me. It makes me feel like I'm crazy or a

naughty 5 year old.

>

> Help! any advice on how to respond to her?

>

> Thanks,

>

>

[Guest guest]

You're sure not alone . My nada tried to punish me for going through

a divorce and moving out of state by not returning my phone calls before I

moved. First of all, she didn't think I should get divorced because, " The

economy is bad " (Nevermind being in a loveless marriage where your spouse is

cheating on you). Then she threw a bloody fit when I filed for divorce and

took MY divorce personally (read: always all about the borderline). Then,

when I found out I was moving, I basically had 3 weeks before I moved. I

called everyone who was excited & happy for me (maybe sad to see me go, but

you get the drift) but I didn't call nada because I knew she'd rain on my

parade. I emailed her. She didn't respond. So then I called, got her

answering machine, left a message that I was moving out of state... no

response. I called one more time telling my now-ex husband, " three strikes

and she's out " . This was after contemplating NC for 2 years anyway. Once

again she did nothing... no response, etc.

Well moving day came, and I moved. about 2 weeks later she & her nada

started calling my ex to find out where I was. He told them he didn't know,

but he called me & let me know they were pissed & looking for me.

It's a mind game (or a mind fuck, if you will... pardon my french). That

" silent treatment " had been used on me before. It's a form of punishment,

just like you said. I was doing something she felt I shouldn't do.. I was

disobeying her. So she was going to punish me when all along she was the

one with the bad behavior & attitude. Well, I moved here almost 2 years

ago. Haven't spoken to her since. All I can say about that is good

riddance.

Sorry you're having such a rough time. It sucks what these people put us

through.

Mia

[Guest guest]

Hmm, interesting Holly. I think in some ways my nada did push me away

by not returning my phone calls for 3 weeks prior to moving out of

state. Then, she sent out the flying monkey (grandnada) to try &

track me down & intimidate my ex husband into giving them my info. Did

she think I'd come groveling for her love? Asking for her forgiveness?

I sure didn't do a damn thing wrong. I am an adult and moved on with

my life. Leaving her behind where she belongs. Was that her

intention? So that she could blame me? I've always suspected that now

she plays the waif when it comes to me... " I just don't know why my

mean old daughter won't talk to me " . Bull shit. Waif is not often

seen in my nada either, but I suspect it.

I've also heard " The ball's in your court " SO MANY TIMES. In fact,

when I read that in your post, I heard it in her voice! *shudder*

Hope you're doing ok too Holly.

Mia

On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 12:24 PM, Holly Byers

wrote:

> That's what fada did to me, pushed me away.  He didn't like that I moved

> out, and when he disowned me, I refused to play by his games. He pushed me

> away hoping I would come begging back (to feed the NPD side). He felt

> abandoned, but he wanted the blame to be put on me. As my dishrag flying

> monkey nada texted me, " The ball's in your court, " meaning, it's all my

> fault because I didn't come crawling back when he pushed me away.

[Guest guest]

When you mention waif, Mia, reminds me of how my aunt mentioned in passing

how sad my mom is that we're not talking. I'm sure fada is playing the waif

card, too, " she hates me and won't talk to me. " Your nada sounds a lot like

my fada.

and geez, mom said that so many times, " ball's in your court. " My bada said

that, too. I gave them the rundown of what happened and said, the ball's in

FADA's court, not mine, once, and my mom twisted it around to make it sound

like my fault in order to guilt me into talking to my fada again. re: go

begging to him for forgiveness.

Bullshit. I was too stubborn to apologize for what I didn't do. And I'm glad

I didn't compromise that.

I'm glad you moved and moved on, though the baby momma drama can't be fun

>.<

I'm doing somewhat better today. Not great, but I actually do have energy to

work, which is really something. Hope you're doing better too, Mia!

Holly

>

>

> Hmm, interesting Holly. I think in some ways my nada did push me away

> by not returning my phone calls for 3 weeks prior to moving out of

> state. Then, she sent out the flying monkey (grandnada) to try &

> track me down & intimidate my ex husband into giving them my info. Did

> she think I'd come groveling for her love? Asking for her forgiveness?

> I sure didn't do a damn thing wrong. I am an adult and moved on with

> my life. Leaving her behind where she belongs. Was that her

> intention? So that she could blame me? I've always suspected that now

> she plays the waif when it comes to me... " I just don't know why my

> mean old daughter won't talk to me " . Bull shit. Waif is not often

> seen in my nada either, but I suspect it.

>

> I've also heard " The ball's in your court " SO MANY TIMES. In fact,

> when I read that in your post, I heard it in her voice! *shudder*

>

> Hope you're doing ok too Holly.

>

> Mia

>

> On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 12:24 PM, Holly Byers

> wrote:

> > That's what fada did to me, pushed me away. He didn't like that I moved

> > out, and when he disowned me, I refused to play by his games. He pushed

> me

> > away hoping I would come begging back (to feed the NPD side). He felt

> > abandoned, but he wanted the blame to be put on me. As my dishrag flying

> > monkey nada texted me, " The ball's in your court, " meaning, it's all my

> > fault because I didn't come crawling back when he pushed me away.

>

>

[Guest guest]

That's so sad Holly, that your mom is giving in to his destructive

behavior & learning his ways. I was reading the post about the

childhood memories and the ones you posted of your mom sounded happy.

I'm so so so sorry that your fada had to come between you two.

And no, the baby momma drama's not fun. I had therapy today and was

talking to my T about how BM reminds me of nada. Maybe that's why BM

scares me, because nada terrifies me! Nada was dangerous, and I

wouldn't put it past BM to be violent towards me or fiance either.

Then again, even if BM is BPD... she's NOT nada. But she does so many

things that are similar, it's so hard for me to deal with. It dredges

up PTSD stuff. =\

This might sound cruel, but can't we just do something similar to the

history of Australia? I believe it was England... they sent all the

prisoners there or something along those lines. Can't we just find an

island to put all the BPDs on? Maybe even help them establish homes &

a good economy then just say, " SEE YA! " lol. Let them put up with

themselves. Oy oy oy.

Mia

[Guest guest]

Yes, the icy silent treatment. My husband always referred to it as punishment -

as in " she's punishing you. " When she was feeble and alone and I needed to check

in to make sure she wasn't lying on the floor with a broken hip she would take

her phone off the hook.

When Dad was still alive she would do that too. Take the phone off the hook when

she was " wronged. "

I have no advice just commiseration.

> a BPD parent who pushes them away. When my BPD mother misbehaves and I get

upset and end a conversation or walk away. She then won't speak to me, punishing

me, rather than bombarding me with contact. She does that at other times. My mom

blew up at Christmas and I left. We haven't spoken since b/c whenever I made

small reach out attempts like asking how she was via phone or email she said

that frivilous contact wasn't welcome from me and hung up.

>

> She misbehaves and then punishes me. It makes me feel like I'm crazy or a

naughty 5 year old.

>

> Help! any advice on how to respond to her?

>

> Thanks,

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

lol - My mom is BPD and we think my sister-in-law is as well (she's definitely

got SOMETHING up with her personality) I say all the time that putting my mom

and sister in law trapped together on a desserted island and make them have to

work together would be an insanely crazy and entertaining reality show - but

they couldn't know they were being filmed...

>

> That's so sad Holly, that your mom is giving in to his destructive

> behavior & learning his ways. I was reading the post about the

> childhood memories and the ones you posted of your mom sounded happy.

> I'm so so so sorry that your fada had to come between you two.

>

> And no, the baby momma drama's not fun. I had therapy today and was

> talking to my T about how BM reminds me of nada. Maybe that's why BM

> scares me, because nada terrifies me! Nada was dangerous, and I

> wouldn't put it past BM to be violent towards me or fiance either.

> Then again, even if BM is BPD... she's NOT nada. But she does so many

> things that are similar, it's so hard for me to deal with. It dredges

> up PTSD stuff. =\

>

> This might sound cruel, but can't we just do something similar to the

> history of Australia? I believe it was England... they sent all the

> prisoners there or something along those lines. Can't we just find an

> island to put all the BPDs on? Maybe even help them establish homes &

> a good economy then just say, " SEE YA! " lol. Let them put up with

> themselves. Oy oy oy.

>

> Mia

>

[Guest guest]

For putting all the BPs on an island, don't forget we have to sterilize

them!

Good Lord, that would be incredibly entertaining to watch.

Holly

On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 3:24 PM, Veetee wrote:

>

>

>

> lol - My mom is BPD and we think my sister-in-law is as well (she's

> definitely got SOMETHING up with her personality) I say all the time that

> putting my mom and sister in law trapped together on a desserted island and

> make them have to work together would be an insanely crazy and entertaining

> reality show - but they couldn't know they were being filmed...

>

> >

> > That's so sad Holly, that your mom is giving in to his destructive

> > behavior & learning his ways. I was reading the post about the

> > childhood memories and the ones you posted of your mom sounded happy.

> > I'm so so so sorry that your fada had to come between you two.

> >

> > And no, the baby momma drama's not fun. I had therapy today and was

> > talking to my T about how BM reminds me of nada. Maybe that's why BM

> > scares me, because nada terrifies me! Nada was dangerous, and I

> > wouldn't put it past BM to be violent towards me or fiance either.

> > Then again, even if BM is BPD... she's NOT nada. But she does so many

> > things that are similar, it's so hard for me to deal with. It dredges

> > up PTSD stuff. =\

> >

> > This might sound cruel, but can't we just do something similar to the

> > history of Australia? I believe it was England... they sent all the

> > prisoners there or something along those lines. Can't we just find an

> > island to put all the BPDs on? Maybe even help them establish homes &

> > a good economy then just say, " SEE YA! " lol. Let them put up with

> > themselves. Oy oy oy.

> >

> > Mia

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks to everyone who commented, glad I'm not the only one but sad that any of

us are going through this. I get so mad b/c everything I say she immediately

twists and does a mind f**k on me, so over the years I've learned to not say

anything so that it can't be used against me. Now she can say " you always just

shut down you never communicate with me " and it's true dang it! but it's not my

fault, she's just so manipulative and i'm so afraid of her that i hate to engage

her in conversation b/c it always winds up that i'm terrible or wrong or

something else. so I shut down and don't talk to her and give her fodder to say

that I don't communicate.

My T says I need to assert myself with her and I'm going to, the next time we

talk, but I don't want to talk to her...

>

> > a BPD parent who pushes them away. When my BPD mother misbehaves and I get

upset and end a conversation or walk away. She then won't speak to me, punishing

me, rather than bombarding me with contact. She does that at other times. My mom

blew up at Christmas and I left. We haven't spoken since b/c whenever I made

small reach out attempts like asking how she was via phone or email she said

that frivilous contact wasn't welcome from me and hung up.

> >

> > She misbehaves and then punishes me. It makes me feel like I'm crazy or a

naughty 5 year old.

> >

> > Help! any advice on how to respond to her?

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I used to have this fantasy of putting all the people I knew who had the same

annoying habit in a room together, locking them in, and seeing what happened.

Such as, put all the irritating " know-it-alls " in a room together, or all the

people who are compulsive non-stop talkers and never let anyone get a word in

edgewise together in a room. LOL!

Yes, an episode of " Survivor " featuring an all-malignant-narcissist cast would

be... different. I don't think they'd last more than a few days, actually.

They'd all want to be the leader and it would just stop there, nothing would get

done. Then they'd all engage in stealing each other's food and wrecking each

other's camps; then they'd all rage and scream at each other until they were

hoarse, then they'd all just glare sulkily at each other until the time was up.

Yeah, must-see TV!

-Annie

>

>

> lol - My mom is BPD and we think my sister-in-law is as well (she's definitely

got SOMETHING up with her personality) I say all the time that putting my mom

and sister in law trapped together on a desserted island and make them have to

work together would be an insanely crazy and entertaining reality show - but

they couldn't know they were being filmed...

[Guest guest]

I agree with your therapist RE being more assertive, but I wouldn't want to talk

to her either.

If you do find yourself unavoidably having to speak with your nada, and if she

has a lot of narcissistic traits, you may be able to divert or deflect her

questions about yourself by getting her to talk about herself. You can then nod

and say " Hmmm! " or " Really? " or make other confirming noises as she talks about

herself, and it will seem that you are engaging with her. Other

question-deflectors are, " I can't discuss that right now, maybe later. " or the

all-time political favorites, " I don't remember, " " I don't know, " " I wasn't

there " , " I was just following orders, " or " Define " xyz " for me " (as in President

Clinton's " What is the meaning of the word " is " . " Good question-deflecting, Mr.

President!)

Basically, you have to give up the idea that nada will change, or wants to

change, or can change. She is the way she is.

Nada discovered a long time ago that she can put you and others in " no-win "

situations, and that is a good strategy for her. No matter what you choose, you

lose and she wins. So, just shrug your shoulders and do what you feel the most

comfortable doing, because no matter WHAT you choose to do, you can't win. At

least, as far as nada is concerned.

Me personally, I'd choose to be labeled " uncommunicative " rather than to share

actual, genuine, important feelings or issues with nada. The unfair label is

just annoying, the second option could be truly dangerous.

-Annie

>

> Thanks to everyone who commented, glad I'm not the only one but sad that any

of us are going through this. I get so mad b/c everything I say she immediately

twists and does a mind f**k on me, so over the years I've learned to not say

anything so that it can't be used against me. Now she can say " you always just

shut down you never communicate with me " and it's true dang it! but it's not my

fault, she's just so manipulative and i'm so afraid of her that i hate to engage

her in conversation b/c it always winds up that i'm terrible or wrong or

something else. so I shut down and don't talk to her and give her fodder to say

that I don't communicate.

>

> My T says I need to assert myself with her and I'm going to, the next time we

talk, but I don't want to talk to her...

[Guest guest]

For a moment I had a glimpse of some joke material...

" So a borderline, a narcissist and sociopath walk into a bar... "

Anyone got the punchline? lol.

- I also agree that you should try to be assertive, but I don't blame

you one little bit for not wanting to talk to her right now! And being

assertive with your abuser is so much easier said than done. Hopefully

through therapy & connecting with us other KOs you can (we can) learn to

cope better & be more assertive together.

Mia

[Guest guest]

> For a moment I had a glimpse of some joke material...

>

> " So a borderline, a narcissist and sociopath walk into a bar... "

> Anyone got the punchline? lol.

>

> " So a borderline, a narcissist and sociopath walk into a bar... "

Bartender says: " Can I get you a drink, sir? "

Em

[Guest guest]

LOL Em! Perfect =)

>

>

>

>

>

> > For a moment I had a glimpse of some joke material...

> >

> > " So a borderline, a narcissist and sociopath walk into a bar... "

> > Anyone got the punchline? lol.

>

> >

> > " So a borderline, a narcissist and sociopath walk into a bar... "

> Bartender says: " Can I get you a drink, sir? "

>

> Em

>

>