BPD Mother's Relationship with grandchildren

[Guest guest]

I have always wanted a " real " relationship between my children and my BPD Mom. I

keep trying to make the problems in my relationship with my mother stay between

the two of us. I have not been successful at all. When I try to facilitate

this 'normal' grandmother relationship, I have ended up often endangering my

children to some degree. Of course she is very sweet and thoughtful when

talking to the children on the phone and puts them on a pedestal and makes them

feel special etc. Then I find out that during the conversations she says

terrible things about me like " I think your mother is telling you what to say to

me--I don't know how you can stand living with such an incredible control

freak!' During their visits I find out that everything is 'all peaches and

cream' until some situation or something sets her off in to an angery tirade

against someone or something. Worst of all her lack of impulse control will lead

to a dangerous situation like driving really fast or getting in to an argument

with a store clerk or something. I feel really foolish having made bad decisions

about subjecting my children to her when I should know better.I would just like

to know how other people in my situation have handled this-surely I am not the

only one who gets lulled into making bad decisions when things seem good only to

realize how quickly and without provocation she goes from wonderful grandmother

to something completely different. I would love to hear from others about this

situation.

[Guest guest]

My take on your post:

I think you are giving nada too much credit. Your limited contact is because of

HER attitude and actions. She is still the same person, even to the grandkids.

I saw this in my nada. My older son sees grandnada for what she is and won't put

up with her shit. Grandnada know this=doesn't really care if she sees him.

However, my 5-year-old had a pretty tight relationship (do did the older

grandson until he started shaping his own life) so NC the past month has been

really rough on him.

My husband and I took the two kids to see her for a very short visit before she

took her fada (IT is a family cycle!) down south for a visit with his siblings.

She gave my youngest candy and even a gift. My older son got sarcasm and snide

remarks.

Seeing this made me realize that letting the youngest one visit her will only

set him up, unhealthily to become a flying monkey. I held that position for too

many years, not seeing until recently that I played a part for her- was just a

foot soldier and didn't have a real relationship with her.

So- as much as we want our kids to have a great grandparent experience, we are

talking about our NADAS! If WE could have a relationship it would happen.

I see putting my kids in her care/visit as unsafe. It isn't cool she's bad

talking you to your own children. YOU don't deserve it. Your kids don't need it.

I think by telling your kids, in simple terms, that grandma isn't well (Ask them

how it felt to have grandma talk poorly about their mother?) Then tie that into

the larger situation.

Not having a relationship with your grandparents isn't as bad as having an

unhealthy relationship.

That's just my opinion. It isn't easy. I'm sure you love your mom and hope that

one day, things will be different. But just as having children won't save a

marriage, they won't bridge the gap between you and your nada either.

>

> I have always wanted a " real " relationship between my children and my BPD Mom.

I keep trying to make the problems in my relationship with my mother stay

between the two of us. I have not been successful at all. When I try to

facilitate this 'normal' grandmother relationship, I have ended up often

endangering my children to some degree. Of course she is very sweet and

thoughtful when talking to the children on the phone and puts them on a pedestal

and makes them feel special etc. Then I find out that during the conversations

she says terrible things about me like " I think your mother is telling you what

to say to me--I don't know how you can stand living with such an incredible

control freak!' During their visits I find out that everything is 'all peaches

and cream' until some situation or something sets her off in to an angery tirade

against someone or something. Worst of all her lack of impulse control will lead

to a dangerous situation like driving really fast or getting in to an argument

with a store clerk or something. I feel really foolish having made bad decisions

about subjecting my children to her when I should know better.I would just like

to know how other people in my situation have handled this-surely I am not the

only one who gets lulled into making bad decisions when things seem good only to

realize how quickly and without provocation she goes from wonderful grandmother

to something completely different. I would love to hear from others about this

situation.

>

[Guest guest]

I really understand what you are saying. We really crave a " normal " relationship

with our parent. I've had this fantasy all my life. One thing that is constant

is that she will ALWAYS let me down. It's totally unpredictible. The visit might

start out great, and then BAM! My children are grown up, and I have protected

them for the most part, but they weren't raised by her so their relationship is

different. They are able to laugh off most of the behaviors, but at times they

do get upset. They asked me to stop having her for holidays and I did. I

actually felt uneasy because the day was so calm and uneventful. It's been about

15 years since I've had her for any holidays at all.

Subject: BPD Mother's Relationship with grandchildren

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Date: Saturday, February 12, 2011, 10:40 PM

 

I have always wanted a " real " relationship between my children and my BPD Mom. I

keep trying to make the problems in my relationship with my mother stay between

the two of us. I have not been successful at all. When I try to facilitate this

'normal' grandmother relationship, I have ended up often endangering my children

to some degree. Of course she is very sweet and thoughtful when talking to the

children on the phone and puts them on a pedestal and makes them feel special

etc. Then I find out that during the conversations she says terrible things

about me like " I think your mother is telling you what to say to me--I don't

know how you can stand living with such an incredible control freak!' During

their visits I find out that everything is 'all peaches and cream' until some

situation or something sets her off in to an angery tirade against someone or

something. Worst of all her lack of impulse control will lead to a dangerous

situation like driving

really fast or getting in to an argument with a store clerk or something. I

feel really foolish having made bad decisions about subjecting my children to

her when I should know better.I would just like to know how other people in my

situation have handled this-surely I am not the only one who gets lulled into

making bad decisions when things seem good only to realize how quickly and

without provocation she goes from wonderful grandmother to something completely

different. I would love to hear from others about this situation.

[Guest guest]

I was stockholmed for a long time into believing that it was my " duty " to make

my parent's happy - which included allowing them to see their grandchildren

whenever they wanted. My false beliefs, fear of repercussions and lack of

boundaries led to nada and fada showing up unannounced at my door, 3 times a

week, for 25 years. I never felt my children were endangered physically, and

nada seemed far nicer to my boys than she ever was to me, but her nastiness did

rise up time and time again. She'd try shaming my kids for not wanting to hug

or kiss her, she'd accuse them of stealing things that were misplaced, and I

learned early on NEVER to ask her to babysit when it wasn't her idea....for

there was always repercussions for me and my kids.

The worst of it came once my kids reached adulthood. They are now 28 and 23 and

nada is 80. My older son married a bpd, just like nada. Now I have two of them

to deal with instead of one. Nada has also dragged my oldest son into the

middle of issues that were between myself and nada and both my bpd nada and my

bpd daughter-in-law have tried turning my son against me.

I can't help but feel that exposure to nada at a young age helped influence my

son to be attracted to a bpd. When I was first married I lived out of

state....part of why I moved back was so my parents could be closer to their

grandkids. BIG MISTAKE and I REGRET IT!

I'm sorry to sound so bitter, but I hope there is a special place in hell

reserved for bpds!

>

> I have always wanted a " real " relationship between my children and my BPD Mom.

I keep trying to make the problems in my relationship with my mother stay

between the two of us. I have not been successful at all. When I try to

facilitate this 'normal' grandmother relationship, I have ended up often

endangering my children to some degree. Of course she is very sweet and

thoughtful when talking to the children on the phone and puts them on a pedestal

and makes them feel special etc. Then I find out that during the conversations

she says terrible things about me like " I think your mother is telling you what

to say to me--I don't know how you can stand living with such an incredible

control freak!' During their visits I find out that everything is 'all peaches

and cream' until some situation or something sets her off in to an angery tirade

against someone or something. Worst of all her lack of impulse control will lead

to a dangerous situation like driving really fast or getting in to an argument

with a store clerk or something. I feel really foolish having made bad decisions

about subjecting my children to her when I should know better.I would just like

to know how other people in my situation have handled this-surely I am not the

only one who gets lulled into making bad decisions when things seem good only to

realize how quickly and without provocation she goes from wonderful grandmother

to something completely different. I would love to hear from others about this

situation.

>

[Guest guest]

My fiance's ex wife is likely BPD as well. So I know how you feel having

another one in your life, trust me. I also understand what you are saying

about being " stockholmed " . I also felt the same way for a long long time

that it was my job to make my nada happy. I also think fiance is in a very

deep FOG/stockholmed when it comes to his ex.

I'm so glad I have no kids of my own and live out of state where she

(probably) can't find me. I do not want my nada in my life, and I certainly

would not allow fiance's kids around her. They have enough to deal with

when it comes to their own nada. Of course, they are young and don't know

or understand there's anything wrong at this point... or if they do, they

don't say anything to us. We're just doing what we can for them and

fiance's saving to retain a lawyer. When he drops that bomb, it will be so

not fun & horrifying for all of us.

Too many issues there with the kids' nada to get into now, but trust me,

it's not good.

I can only hope one day the kids will see their nada for what she really is.

Selfish, lazy & very sick.

Mia

>

>

> I was stockholmed for a long time into believing that it was my " duty " to

> make my parent's happy - which included allowing them to see their

> grandchildren whenever they wanted. My false beliefs, fear of repercussions

> and lack of boundaries led to nada and fada showing up unannounced at my

> door, 3 times a week, for 25 years. I never felt my children were endangered

> physically, and nada seemed far nicer to my boys than she ever was to me,

> but her nastiness did rise up time and time again. She'd try shaming my kids

> for not wanting to hug or kiss her, she'd accuse them of stealing things

> that were misplaced, and I learned early on NEVER to ask her to babysit when

> it wasn't her idea....for there was always repercussions for me and my kids.

>

> The worst of it came once my kids reached adulthood. They are now 28 and 23

> and nada is 80. My older son married a bpd, just like nada. Now I have two

> of them to deal with instead of one. Nada has also dragged my oldest son

> into the middle of issues that were between myself and nada and both my bpd

> nada and my bpd daughter-in-law have tried turning my son against me.

>

> I can't help but feel that exposure to nada at a young age helped influence

> my son to be attracted to a bpd. When I was first married I lived out of

> state....part of why I moved back was so my parents could be closer to their

> grandkids. BIG MISTAKE and I REGRET IT!

>

> I'm sorry to sound so bitter, but I hope there is a special place in hell

> reserved for bpds!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Comments below...

>>>

> I have always wanted a " real " relationship between my children and my BPD Mom.

I keep trying to make the problems in my relationship with my mother stay

between the two of us.

Have you realized yet that the reason your relationship with your mother is

strained is that SHE IS DISORDERED? This isn't just some interpersonal rift;

this is behavior that she carries with her into ALL of her relationships. You

cannot make her be a " normal " grandmother. It's hard to realize our parents

aren't the parents we needed, but sometimes we also have to grieve for the fact

that they're not the grandparents our children need, either. I can relate to a

lot of those feelings; I definitely have tried everything I can think of to

make a relationship with my parents that I can live with so that my children can

know their grandparents. But more on that later.

>>>> Then I find out that during the conversations she says terrible things

about me like " I think your mother is telling you what to say to me--I don't

know how you can stand living with such an incredible control freak!'

That would be absolutely unacceptable to me. What did you do after that

conversation? Do you continue to allow her to speak to them on the phone? I do

not let my parents talk to my children unless they are on speakerphone. If my

mother said something like that, I would take the phone away, tell her " That is

inappropriate to say to my child, goodbye. " and hang up.

>>>>During their visits I find out that everything is 'all peaches and cream'

until some situation or something sets her off in to an angery tirade against

someone or something. Worst of all her lack of impulse control will lead to a

dangerous situation like driving really fast or getting in to an argument with a

store clerk or something.

If this concerns you, then don't let her drive them anywhere. I haven't left my

children alone with my parents in nearly 4 years. It sounds like your mother

has given up her right to unsupervised visits.

The safety of your children is your top priority. Your mother's behavior is

unstable and abusive. If you were looking for a babysitter, and you were

looking at a candidate whose references told you: yells, hits, calls names,

drives erratically, and says disparaging things about the parents to the

children, WOULD YOU HIRE HER? I bet not. You would want to keep that kind of

person as far away from your children as possible. So why does your mother get

to do those things?

I know you want to give them a " normal " grandmother. But their grandmother JUST

ISN'T " NORMAL. " You cannot make her into something she isn't. Your children

need you to protect them from her negative behavior. You are the adult now.

You have a right to do whatever it takes to keep your kids healthy and safe.

Even if that means upsetting your mother. If she really cared about them, she'd

support you in that decision because she'd want to protect them, too.

I mentioned it has been almost 4 years since I told my parents I don't trust

them alone with my children. I have not left them alone with my mother for even

a minute. She has still tried to whisper manipulative things that she knew went

against my wishes, and I heard her and put a stop to it. I don't speak to her

often on the phone, and when she does call it's usually not when the kids are

awake or home, but if I let them speak to her it's ALWAYS on speakerphone so

that I can make sure the conversation ends immediately if she says something

inappropriate.

But it is exhausting. I'm worn out from having to watch her like a hawk. It's

too much work to try to preserve whatever there is that's good in that

relationship, and it wears me down. I know I'm not supervising " just in case "

she acts out, but " WHEN " she acts out. My parents know I don't trust them, but

they aren't willing to change their behavior in order to regain my trust. And

I'm no longer willing to sacrifice my sanity over it.

My mother has already behaved her way out of meeting us in public, I'm not

willing to travel to see her, and the only place left I've been willing to see

them is my home. I've thought a lot about personal limits and realized it's

best for us if we just don't see them at all this year. It's not worth it. My

kids deserve real grandparents, but my parents are never going to be that. I'll

be chunking whatever they send in the mail. I will probably either speak to

them once briefly on the phone or send them a letter to tell them not to contact

us. And it's sad...but I can't tell you what a relief it is. I know it's the

right thing. I can't make my parents into people they aren't, and I can't give

my children something that isn't really there.

[Guest guest]

It is something that I have struggled with over the years. Kept thinking that

she would be a normal grandmother. But that is beyond her capabilities. As the

kids get older, they will naturally not want to be around her. It is just

another loss that we have to grieve. No mother and no grandmother for our kids.

Â

Felicia Ward

Remember that people often have different perceptions of the same reality. You

can both be right, and no one has to be wrong, if each of you is willing to let

the other person have his or her perceptions and if both of you are willing to

compromise.Â

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Sat, February 12, 2011 2:40:08 PM

Subject: BPD Mother's Relationship with grandchildren

Â

I have always wanted a " real " relationship between my children and my BPD Mom. I

keep trying to make the problems in my relationship with my mother stay between

the two of us. I have not been successful at all. When I try to facilitate this

'normal' grandmother relationship, I have ended up often endangering my children

to some degree. Of course she is very sweet and thoughtful when talking to the

children on the phone and puts them on a pedestal and makes them feel special

etc. Then I find out that during the conversations she says terrible things

about me like " I think your mother is telling you what to say to me--I don't

know how you can stand living with such an incredible control freak!' During

their visits I find out that everything is 'all peaches and cream' until some

situation or something sets her off in to an angery tirade against someone or

something. Worst of all her lack of impulse control will lead to a dangerous

situation like driving really fast or getting in to an argument with a store

clerk or something. I feel really foolish having made bad decisions about

subjecting my children to her when I should know better.I would just like to

know how other people in my situation have handled this-surely I am not the only

one who gets lulled into making bad decisions when things seem good only to

realize how quickly and without provocation she goes from wonderful grandmother

to something completely different. I would love to hear from others about this

situation.

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Yes, I often hope for the same thing, for some kind of closeness between my kids

and my mother. My husband's parents are gone, as is my father, so it's the

magical thinking that " the kids need to have a relationship with their granma;

she's the only one they have left and they'll be so close! "

And sometimes it IS nice. Sometimes, they have a sweet visit. Especially when

it's a short visit. [seriously.]

My mother is very sweet to my kids and dotes over them and I see her mood

visibly improve after she's been with my kids. Especially my little one. My

older one is kind of " onto her. " I mean she's aware she can't be authentic

around my mother and really hardly talks to her. My mother gets offended but

doesn't get it, that it's not that my daughter doesn't love her, it's that my

mother doesn't even give her a chance to talk. My little one is young enough

yet that she's not aware of my mother's fears, anxieties, phobias, and

overdependence on other people, you know what I mean?

My mother doesn't drive, so for me, leaving my kids with her is stressful in

that my mother will pump them for information, esp my younger one. And she'll

say things that put fear in them. " This is bad, that is bad, don't ever do this

or that. " And so on.

I know it's never going to happen, a real relationship. A while back, my older

daughter was crying about a crush she had that had been made public at school

and she was very embarrassed, devastated. She was telling me about it and said,

" I wish Nana (my husband's mother) was still alive. I want to talk to her about

it. " It made me sad that she doesn't have that with my mother, but they (my

mil and my mother) are such different personalities.

Do you still take your kids to your mother's? Maybe your visits from now on

will have to include you. What she's saying to your kids isn't appropriate and

I'm sure it's confusing your children. And the speeding in the car, wow, that

would be the end for me. Too scary.

I know how you feel. I don't know why I thought my kids could have with my

mother what I never did.

Fiona

>

> I have always wanted a " real " relationship between my children and my BPD Mom.

I keep trying to make the problems in my relationship with my mother stay

between the two of us. I have not been successful at all. When I try to

facilitate this 'normal' grandmother relationship, I have ended up often

endangering my children to some degree. Of course she is very sweet and

thoughtful when talking to the children on the phone and puts them on a pedestal

and makes them feel special etc. Then I find out that during the conversations

she says terrible things about me like " I think your mother is telling you what

to say to me--I don't know how you can stand living with such an incredible

control freak!' During their visits I find out that everything is 'all peaches

and cream' until some situation or something sets her off in to an angery tirade

against someone or something. Worst of all her lack of impulse control will lead

to a dangerous situation like driving really fast or getting in to an argument

with a store clerk or something. I feel really foolish having made bad decisions

about subjecting my children to her when I should know better.I would just like

to know how other people in my situation have handled this-surely I am not the

only one who gets lulled into making bad decisions when things seem good only to

realize how quickly and without provocation she goes from wonderful grandmother

to something completely different. I would love to hear from others about this

situation.

>

[Guest guest]

[she'd try shaming my kids for not wanting to hug or kiss her...]

: my mother does this ALL the time. Ugh...

Fiona