stressed and blew up at fada

[Guest guest]

I have been really really stressed lately, I am going through something in my

current life. I recently talked with Fada on the phone, and told him a little

about my situation. The conversation did not go well, as anytime one shows

vulnerability to the BP FOO! He got all anxious and fearful and warned me

about the worst case scenario, which triggered me and I ended up yelling at this

old man things like " you never once cared about my safety, ever, ever in my

life!! " and so forth. I was triggered when he told me " frankly, I don't care " .

How do I move forward? I need to call him about something else, and my FOO has

never had any protocols for apologizing except for me prostrating myself before

their sacrificial altar. There is no way he will acknowledge anything I said, I

bet he has already forgotten the content of what I said, and will just remember

that I showed anger, that emotion forbidden to me all my life because it is the

reason the FOO has issues. Obviously. My anger.

Thanks for any advice!

Walkingto Happiness

[Guest guest]

You need to understand one of the techniques of the BP. They will turn

your conversation or vulnerablity around until it is triggering you in

some way. Once they find your triggers, they will go for them like a

wolf for the throat of his prey. They will ignore the signs of your

increasing agitation, or your requests for them to stop and back off on

what they are doing. They will continue this until you break, and

explode in a rage.

At this point, they have won the encounter. The beat their breast as

the agrieved victim. They feel self satisfied and justified in all they

do or say to you or about you. You will walk away from the encounter

highly agitated. Your emotions will be wound up as tight as they can

get, and your brain chemicals will be maxed out. You will have that

sick fear/rage/anger reaction that will leave you physically weak and

ill. They, on the other hand, will feel a profound emotional release,

acheived at your expense.

This is an advanced FOG technique.

This is the emotional equivalent of " suicide by cop. "

The fact that you feel the need to apologize for having been so used and

manipulated underscores that much more how much you are a KO subjected

to FOG. Apologizing for one of these incidents simply plays into more

of them. I assume this is a repeat of a lifetime of similar such

incidents. It never changes, does it?

Nor will it. How do you move forward? You don t, not with a BP , flying

monkey, or enmeshed FOO. As you say, he will not acknowledge your

words, and will focus on the anger, which he quite deliberately evoked.

He would not have been satisfied with the encounter till you were angry,

and he could then say, " See, you are wrong. You are showing anger. "

The only safe move is not to play. Don t play. Now or ever.

Have you read the book " Safe People " ? If not, I highly suggest it to

you.

What could you possibly have to tell him that is worth this? You know

he won t hear what you need to say. This dysfunctional group is not a

place where you can share things that are on your mind. You need a safe

group of people to whom you can, but this Smchuk is not it.

Doug

[Guest guest]

You are so right, Doug. I experienced that so often with my nada. She'd target

me sometimes, and I observed her targeting dad and my Sister too: nada would

deliberately pick fights. Pick, pick, pick, pick.

She was relentless, and wouldn't stop until she'd gotten an angry response from

her target. Then, when she'd provoked a real verbal altercation, it was like

she'd " won. " I hated it. It would leave me feeling shaken and badly upset,

sometimes for hours. Nada would be all cheerful and perky afterward.

And you're right that the only way to win is to not play. Just leave: walk

around the block, or drive off somewhere. Just hang up the phone. Do not

respond, even if its to defend yourself. That's what I always fell for: nada

would accuse me of some awful thing I hadn't done, hadn't said, or hadn't

thought, and I'd feel *compelled*, nay, *desperate* to explain and defend

myself, to salvage my reputation and regain her good opinion of me. And that

was exactly what she wanted: I'd been hoodwinked into a fight I couldn't win and

left " bloody " and beaten.

It was such a " light-bulb " moment when I realized that I could actually

physically just *leave her presence* when she was picking and picking at me and

trying to start a fight!

It sounds so inane, but I'd been conditioned since babyhood that I had to stand

there and take the verbal abuse and explain myself and defend myself. So when I

finally did just say, " I'm, um, leaving now. Gotta go. I'll talk to you later "

it was like, so ridiculously easy! I felt so stupid for not having figured that

out earlier.

Better late than never, though, I suppose!

-Annie

>

>

> You need to understand one of the techniques of the BP. They will turn

> your conversation or vulnerablity around until it is triggering you in

> some way. Once they find your triggers, they will go for them like a

> wolf for the throat of his prey. They will ignore the signs of your

> increasing agitation, or your requests for them to stop and back off on

> what they are doing. They will continue this until you break, and

> explode in a rage.

>

> At this point, they have won the encounter. The beat their breast as

> the agrieved victim. They feel self satisfied and justified in all they

> do or say to you or about you. You will walk away from the encounter

> highly agitated. Your emotions will be wound up as tight as they can

> get, and your brain chemicals will be maxed out. You will have that

> sick fear/rage/anger reaction that will leave you physically weak and

> ill. They, on the other hand, will feel a profound emotional release,

> acheived at your expense.

>

>

>

> This is an advanced FOG technique.

>

>

>

> This is the emotional equivalent of " suicide by cop. "

>

> The fact that you feel the need to apologize for having been so used and

> manipulated underscores that much more how much you are a KO subjected

> to FOG. Apologizing for one of these incidents simply plays into more

> of them. I assume this is a repeat of a lifetime of similar such

> incidents. It never changes, does it?

>

> Nor will it. How do you move forward? You don t, not with a BP , flying

> monkey, or enmeshed FOO. As you say, he will not acknowledge your

> words, and will focus on the anger, which he quite deliberately evoked.

> He would not have been satisfied with the encounter till you were angry,

> and he could then say, " See, you are wrong. You are showing anger. "

>

> The only safe move is not to play. Don t play. Now or ever.

>

> Have you read the book " Safe People " ? If not, I highly suggest it to

> you.

>

> What could you possibly have to tell him that is worth this? You know

> he won t hear what you need to say. This dysfunctional group is not a

> place where you can share things that are on your mind. You need a safe

> group of people to whom you can, but this Smchuk is not it.

>

> Doug

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, Doug. It's so nice to hear someone articulate how that works. It's exactly

what my nada does to me. She digs at me until I explode. And that justifies her

treating me as the " all bad " person in her life and insists that I'm " sensitive "

or even " crazy " .

She asked me the other day if she'd said anything to upset me at our last visit.

Of course she did. But I didn't reply. The fact that she had to ask, the fact

that she doesn't understand *at all* that what she said was abhorrent was just

too horrible to even discuss with her. I won't be picking up the phone for

awhile when she calls. Thank god for caller ID.

[Guest guest]

Hmmmm, how urgent is it that you call him about the " something else " ? No

matter what I'd say don't apologize and if you have to talk to him don't even

mention it. If it's going to come up make him mention it...see if he's got the

guts and then you just stay cool. It'll make him crazy and you'll feel better

too I bet.

>

> I have been really really stressed lately, I am going through something in my

current life. I recently talked with Fada on the phone, and told him a little

about my situation. The conversation did not go well, as anytime one shows

vulnerability to the BP FOO! He got all anxious and fearful and warned me

about the worst case scenario, which triggered me and I ended up yelling at this

old man things like " you never once cared about my safety, ever, ever in my

life!! " and so forth. I was triggered when he told me " frankly, I don't care " .

>

> How do I move forward? I need to call him about something else, and my FOO

has never had any protocols for apologizing except for me prostrating myself

before their sacrificial altar. There is no way he will acknowledge anything I

said, I bet he has already forgotten the content of what I said, and will just

remember that I showed anger, that emotion forbidden to me all my life because

it is the reason the FOO has issues. Obviously. My anger.

>

> Thanks for any advice!

> Walkingto Happiness

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks... yet again, this group has helped me, yet again. I really appreciate

all of you and your advice. Yes, it is a cycle. Yes, I need to focus on finding

Safe People. Yes, I need to read that book.

And, this email helps particularly. Fada has a way of making it seem urgent.

Everything is always urgent in the FOO!

I will be on email an djust ask him for this info I need, and not mention the

conversation. Let him be perplexed.

Thanks!!

> >

> > I have been really really stressed lately, I am going through something in

my current life. I recently talked with Fada on the phone, and told him a

little about my situation. The conversation did not go well, as anytime one

shows vulnerability to the BP FOO! He got all anxious and fearful and warned

me about the worst case scenario, which triggered me and I ended up yelling at

this old man things like " you never once cared about my safety, ever, ever in my

life!! " and so forth. I was triggered when he told me " frankly, I don't care " .

> >

> > How do I move forward? I need to call him about something else, and my FOO

has never had any protocols for apologizing except for me prostrating myself

before their sacrificial altar. There is no way he will acknowledge anything I

said, I bet he has already forgotten the content of what I said, and will just

remember that I showed anger, that emotion forbidden to me all my life because

it is the reason the FOO has issues. Obviously. My anger.

> >

> > Thanks for any advice!

> > Walkingto Happiness

> >

>

[Guest guest]

LOL.

I used to get a recurrant call from nada. I need to talk to you about

something really important. Then, when I made the time for it, she

wanted to ask " Why did you throw away my dresses and my electric

skillet? "

This had been years before, when my cousin and I cleaned her apartment

due to her hoarding. She just never let it go, and each time she wanted

to berate me about it, it was urgent.!

Doug

> > >

> > > I have been really really stressed lately, I am going through

something in my current life. I recently talked with Fada on the phone,

and told him a little about my situation. The conversation did not go

well, as anytime one shows vulnerability to the BP FOO! He got all

anxious and fearful and warned me about the worst case scenario, which

triggered me and I ended up yelling at this old man things like " you

never once cared about my safety, ever, ever in my life!! " and so forth.

I was triggered when he told me " frankly, I don't care " .

> > >

> > > How do I move forward? I need to call him about something else,

and my FOO has never had any protocols for apologizing except for me

prostrating myself before their sacrificial altar. There is no way he

will acknowledge anything I said, I bet he has already forgotten the

content of what I said, and will just remember that I showed anger, that

emotion forbidden to me all my life because it is the reason the FOO has

issues. Obviously. My anger.

> > >

> > > Thanks for any advice!

> > > Walkingto Happiness

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Doug - that sounds so like my nada. I, too, get frequent calls like that from

her. In fact, I have caller ID and I rarely answer calls from her anymore for

that very reason. I prefer to let her leave a voicemail and then call her back.

She usually leaves long, rambling voicemails that seem to have no reason (some

of them have been up to 5 min. long!). Most of them start out the same way - " I

really need to talk to you, it's really important " . She likes to throw in a

little drama just to make it sound like life or death, so I'll call her back

sooner. I used to take the bait and call her back right away fearing the worst,

but it was never the dire emergency that she made it out to be. So, now I call

her back when I get around to it. Most of the time, the " emergency " is really a

ploy to get me over to her house to do things for her, or a play for sympathy so

I will drive her to the doctor. Although she does have some legitimate health

problems, she is a reasonably healthy 65 year old. There is no reason why she

can't drive or do things for herself, but she invents excuses as to why she

can't, and then expects me to ignore my responsibilities to my own family, drop

everything, and come help her.

I also found it very interesting that you said your nada is a hoarder. My nada

is a hoarder too! Her house is so cluttered you can hardly move in there, and

it's so nasty that my daughter doesn't want to go over there. Nada has 2 cats

and rarely cleans up after herself, much less after them, so you can imagine the

smell. She leaves dirty dishes in the sink sometimes for weeks, and her house is

infested by cockroaches. My brother and I have cleaned her house several times

in the past, but she junked it up again in no time. Both of us get accused all

the time of stealing her stuff (like who would want that sh**)?

Anway, I thought it was such a coincidence that you get the same calls. Thought

I was the only one.

> > > >

> > > > I have been really really stressed lately, I am going through

> something in my current life. I recently talked with Fada on the phone,

> and told him a little about my situation. The conversation did not go

> well, as anytime one shows vulnerability to the BP FOO! He got all

> anxious and fearful and warned me about the worst case scenario, which

> triggered me and I ended up yelling at this old man things like " you

> never once cared about my safety, ever, ever in my life!! " and so forth.

> I was triggered when he told me " frankly, I don't care " .

> > > >

> > > > How do I move forward? I need to call him about something else,

> and my FOO has never had any protocols for apologizing except for me

> prostrating myself before their sacrificial altar. There is no way he

> will acknowledge anything I said, I bet he has already forgotten the

> content of what I said, and will just remember that I showed anger, that

> emotion forbidden to me all my life because it is the reason the FOO has

> issues. Obviously. My anger.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for any advice!

> > > > Walkingto Happiness

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Me three, , I grew up in a hoarders nest. Its just so weird to me

that the neighbors never said anything - I mean my family was plainly and

obviously off base - yet they just went on playing their harps and bleaching

their hair so they looked more angelic. . .

On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 6:53 AM, juspeachyinga wrote:

>

>

> Doug - that sounds so like my nada. I, too, get frequent calls like that

> from her. In fact, I have caller ID and I rarely answer calls from her

> anymore for that very reason. I prefer to let her leave a voicemail and then

> call her back. She usually leaves long, rambling voicemails that seem to

> have no reason (some of them have been up to 5 min. long!). Most of them

> start out the same way - " I really need to talk to you, it's really

> important " . She likes to throw in a little drama just to make it sound like

> life or death, so I'll call her back sooner. I used to take the bait and

> call her back right away fearing the worst, but it was never the dire

> emergency that she made it out to be. So, now I call her back when I get

> around to it. Most of the time, the " emergency " is really a ploy to get me

> over to her house to do things for her, or a play for sympathy so I will

> drive her to the doctor. Although she does have some legitimate health

> problems, she is a reasonably healthy 65 year old. There is no reason why

> she can't drive or do things for herself, but she invents excuses as to why

> she can't, and then expects me to ignore my responsibilities to my own

> family, drop everything, and come help her.

>

> I also found it very interesting that you said your nada is a hoarder. My

> nada is a hoarder too! Her house is so cluttered you can hardly move in

> there, and it's so nasty that my daughter doesn't want to go over there.

> Nada has 2 cats and rarely cleans up after herself, much less after them, so

> you can imagine the smell. She leaves dirty dishes in the sink sometimes for

> weeks, and her house is infested by cockroaches. My brother and I have

> cleaned her house several times in the past, but she junked it up again in

> no time. Both of us get accused all the time of stealing her stuff (like who

> would want that sh**)?

>

> Anway, I thought it was such a coincidence that you get the same calls.

> Thought I was the only one.

>

>

>

>

>

> > > > >

> > > > > I have been really really stressed lately, I am going through

> > something in my current life. I recently talked with Fada on the phone,

> > and told him a little about my situation. The conversation did not go

> > well, as anytime one shows vulnerability to the BP FOO! He got all

> > anxious and fearful and warned me about the worst case scenario, which

> > triggered me and I ended up yelling at this old man things like " you

> > never once cared about my safety, ever, ever in my life!! " and so forth.

> > I was triggered when he told me " frankly, I don't care " .

> > > > >

> > > > > How do I move forward? I need to call him about something else,

> > and my FOO has never had any protocols for apologizing except for me

> > prostrating myself before their sacrificial altar. There is no way he

> > will acknowledge anything I said, I bet he has already forgotten the

> > content of what I said, and will just remember that I showed anger, that

> > emotion forbidden to me all my life because it is the reason the FOO has

> > issues. Obviously. My anger.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks for any advice!

> > > > > Walkingto Happiness

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

>

>