Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and LONG POST!

March 5, 2011

My dream was that a mistake was made at the hospital and soon they'd discover

it. People would come and take me to my REAL parents and things would finally

be okay. I hoped that at minimum my father (a total narcissist) wasn't my

father and kept asking my nada to tell me that she cheated on him. I remember

feeling this was as young as five so it must have been a strong feeling because

I don't remember most of my childhood except in bits and pieces.

>

> I use to hope my parents would get killed in a car crash so I could go live

with

> my grandmother. But I didn't feel all that guilty about it. I also

> contemplated running away at the age of 11 or 12, but I was so afraid of what

> nada would do to me if she found me that I never tried. Instead I waited

until

> I graduated from HS, then I moved 1000 miles away and refused to get a

telephone

> so she couldn't call to harass me.

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: WTOAdultChildren1

> Sent: Wed, March 2, 2011 6:05:49 PM

> Subject: Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and LONG

> POST!

>

> Hey that is gross for you, truly truly gross.

> Thing is , at the age of 3, 4, 5, 10, 15...if someone had come along and asked

> us to go for adoption do you think we would have actually done it?

> I used to dream my NADA would die ( and feel super guilty about it) so then I

> used to fantasize about getting adopted!

>

> I have difficulty understanding how a BPD person manages to control all the

ugly

> behaviour so that the outsiders don't see what they do. Surely that is

behaviour

> management ie, they are in control not mentally incapable, so they should be

> bloody well held to ransom for their badness.....grrrrrr!

>

March 6, 2011

My sister and I have talked about this a lot. The fact that all we remember is

bad stuff is very telling. I never remember Christmas, birthday parties...and I

do vaguely remember my dad taking me trick or treating for halloween, but my

sister blew a hole in that memory by telling me my mother did nothing to get us

costumes and she dressed me up as a gypsy with some of her own clothes so we

could go. She could only have been about 12 at the time as she is 7 years older

than me. My mother was about nothing except herself.

Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and LONG

> POST!

>

> Hey that is gross for you, truly truly gross.

> Thing is , at the age of 3, 4, 5, 10, 15...if someone had come along and asked

> us to go for adoption do you think we would have actually done it?

> I used to dream my NADA would die ( and feel super guilty about it) so then I

> used to fantasize about getting adopted!

>

> I have difficulty understanding how a BPD person manages to control all the

ugly

> behaviour so that the outsiders don't see what they do. Surely that is

behaviour

> management ie, they are in control not mentally incapable, so they should be

> bloody well held to ransom for their badness.....grrrrrr!

>

March 6, 2011

, maybe I shouldnt admit this, but your story about your mother not

calling you except to report that something bad happened to the neighbors is

very comforting to me. My nada made almost no effort to speak to me, have a

relationship with me etc. When folks on this group talk about their nadas

stalking them, it kind of hurts my feelings - because at least their nada

cares enough to make an effort. . . . does that make sense????

Hugs, Girlscout

>

> My sister and I have talked about this a lot. The fact that all we remember

> is bad stuff is very telling. I never remember Christmas, birthday

> parties...and I do vaguely remember my dad taking me trick or treating for

> halloween, but my sister blew a hole in that memory by telling me my mother

> did nothing to get us costumes and she dressed me up as a gypsy with some of

> her own clothes so we could go. She could only have been about 12 at the

> time as she is 7 years older than me. My mother was about nothing except

> herself.

>

> Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and

> LONG

> > POST!

> >

> > Hey that is gross for you, truly truly gross.

> > Thing is , at the age of 3, 4, 5, 10, 15...if someone had come along and

> asked

> > us to go for adoption do you think we would have actually done it?

> > I used to dream my NADA would die ( and feel super guilty about it) so

> then I

> > used to fantasize about getting adopted!

> >

> > I have difficulty understanding how a BPD person manages to control all

> the ugly

> > behaviour so that the outsiders don't see what they do. Surely that is

> behaviour

> > management ie, they are in control not mentally incapable, so they should

> be

> > bloody well held to ransom for their badness.....grrrrrr!

> >

March 6, 2011

As infants and children, we genuinely need our parents' concern, care, and

attention in order to simply survive. Rejection by the mother automatically

means death for her infant in the animal kingdom, and in some ways, for human

beings as well.

Its so deeply hardwired into the infant's DNA that we *need* our parents, that a

tiny 18-month old baby will toddle after the adult male (dad?) who just battered

him. (see link to tape, below) The baby's attachment instinct overrides the

baby's reality: that his " care-giver " is actually abusive and potentially

deadly.

To a baby or a toddler, ANY attention, even severe ABUSE, is better than no

attention.

(That's why I can read without being very badly triggered posts where members

sort of wistfully write things like " I wish I'd been beaten " or " I wish I'd been

stalked " by their pd parent, because I know where that wish is coming from: the

abandoned, neglected, rejected toddler inside who craves *any* sign of

recognition by the pd parent, even if its negative attention.)

I'm not sure how we, as adults, can get past that hard-wired empty hole in our

hearts when we've been emotionally neglected and essentially discarded by our

parent(s).

If you are a parent yourself, perhaps giving the love you didn't receive

yourself to your own child can help fill the empty spot.

Maybe it just takes acceptance and moving on; sort of like accepting that your

left hand got severed in an accident, and getting a prosthetic hand, and just

doing the best you can with it.

Or perhaps it has to do with trying to dwell, instead, on what we do have, such

as one non-pd parent, or one non-pd sibling, or relative, or friend, or spouse /

kids who are mentally healthy and who do love us. I am so grateful that I have

my Sister who loves me, and whom I love; we take care of each other and give

each other emotional support and validation.

Here is the link to the battering incident caught on tape. BE WARNED: IT IS

VERY TRIGGERING. I post it because it clearly illustrates that a baby's need

for attachment overrides the baby's reality, and this is what we are up against

in ourselves: a need so deep that it over-rides reality.

If the link doesn't work, the title at YouTube is: " Man beats 2 year old in the

grocery store "

-Annie

> > >

> > > I use to hope my parents would get killed in a car crash so I could go

> > live with

> > > my grandmother. But I didn't feel all that guilty about it. I also

> > > contemplated running away at the age of 11 or 12, but I was so afraid of

> > what

> > > nada would do to me if she found me that I never tried. Instead I waited

> > until

> > > I graduated from HS, then I moved 1000 miles away and refused to get a

> > telephone

> > > so she couldn't call to harass me.

> > >

> > > ________________________________

> > > From: rgbargy68 <rgbargy68@>

> > > To: WTOAdultChildren1

> > > Sent: Wed, March 2, 2011 6:05:49 PM

> > > Subject: Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and

> > LONG

> > > POST!

> > >

> > > Hey that is gross for you, truly truly gross.

> > > Thing is , at the age of 3, 4, 5, 10, 15...if someone had come along and

> > asked

> > > us to go for adoption do you think we would have actually done it?

> > > I used to dream my NADA would die ( and feel super guilty about it) so

> > then I

> > > used to fantasize about getting adopted!

> > >

> > > I have difficulty understanding how a BPD person manages to control all

> > the ugly

> > > behaviour so that the outsiders don't see what they do. Surely that is

> > behaviour

> > > management ie, they are in control not mentally incapable, so they should

> > be

> > > bloody well held to ransom for their badness.....grrrrrr!

> > >

March 6, 2011

I understand how you could feel that way, but I assure you, it's the same pain

just on the flipside of the coin. The thing is, they don't stalk because they

care about their child. They do it because it fulfills some sort of sick need

for attention on themselves and when we try to stand against them, they push

harder. They start lies in the family about you...they talk to neighbors,

co-workers, people in the town you live in. It doesn't stop. They play the

victim. My mother literally came unglued when I went on my honeymoon...she

called the boat to the bahamas as an 'emergency' when my sister went on a trip

and accused her of neglecting her then 12 year old son (who was with his FATHER

incidentally). It is so very tiresome.

My dad has stopped speaking to me and my mom has been dead almost 4 years. I

prefer the not speaking as it keeps the drama on the down low.

Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and

LONG

> POST!

>

> Hey that is gross for you, truly truly gross.

> Thing is , at the age of 3, 4, 5, 10, 15...if someone had come along and

asked

> us to go for adoption do you think we would have actually done it?

> I used to dream my NADA would die ( and feel super guilty about it) so

then I

> used to fantasize about getting adopted!

>

> I have difficulty understanding how a BPD person manages to control all

the ugly

> behaviour so that the outsiders don't see what they do. Surely that is

behaviour

> management ie, they are in control not mentally incapable, so they should

be

> bloody well held to ransom for their badness.....grrrrrr!

>

March 6, 2011

Hummingbird - yes my nada does all the lying about me behind my back. She

has my whole life. I had to go NC with the entire community of people who

know her. I can't believe it but people actually believe her. But when it

comes to talking to me she just prefers to spread lies and gossip. I can't

believe that my dad stands there and listens.

Wow, I wonder if I'm suddenly in the grief phase - I haven't felt my

emotions this strongly in years. Holy!

>

> I understand how you could feel that way, but I assure you, it's the same

> pain just on the flipside of the coin. The thing is, they don't stalk

> because they care about their child. They do it because it fulfills some

> sort of sick need for attention on themselves and when we try to stand

> against them, they push harder. They start lies in the family about

> you...they talk to neighbors, co-workers, people in the town you live in. It

> doesn't stop. They play the victim. My mother literally came unglued when I

> went on my honeymoon...she called the boat to the bahamas as an 'emergency'

> when my sister went on a trip and accused her of neglecting her then 12 year

> old son (who was with his FATHER incidentally). It is so very tiresome.

>

> My dad has stopped speaking to me and my mom has been dead almost 4 years.

> I prefer the not speaking as it keeps the drama on the down low.

>

> Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and

> LONG

> > POST!

> >

> > Hey that is gross for you, truly truly gross.

> > Thing is , at the age of 3, 4, 5, 10, 15...if someone had come along and

> asked

> > us to go for adoption do you think we would have actually done it?

> > I used to dream my NADA would die ( and feel super guilty about it) so

> then I

> > used to fantasize about getting adopted!

> >

> > I have difficulty understanding how a BPD person manages to control all

> the ugly

> > behaviour so that the outsiders don't see what they do. Surely that is

> behaviour

> > management ie, they are in control not mentally incapable, so they should

> be

> > bloody well held to ransom for their badness.....grrrrrr!

> >

March 6, 2011

This is why I live an hour from my Nada. I have very limited contact with

family friends. I always have said that Nada has creative memory syndrome.

> > >

> > > I use to hope my parents would get killed in a car crash so I could go

> > live with

> > > my grandmother. But I didn't feel all that guilty about it. I also

> > > contemplated running away at the age of 11 or 12, but I was so afraid of

> > what

> > > nada would do to me if she found me that I never tried. Instead I waited

> > until

> > > I graduated from HS, then I moved 1000 miles away and refused to get a

> > telephone

> > > so she couldn't call to harass me.

> > >

> > > ________________________________

> > > From: rgbargy68 <rgbargy68@>

> > > To: WTOAdultChildren1

> > > Sent: Wed, March 2, 2011 6:05:49 PM

> > > Subject: Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and

> > LONG

> > > POST!

> > >

> > > Hey that is gross for you, truly truly gross.

> > > Thing is , at the age of 3, 4, 5, 10, 15...if someone had come along and

> > asked

> > > us to go for adoption do you think we would have actually done it?

> > > I used to dream my NADA would die ( and feel super guilty about it) so

> > then I

> > > used to fantasize about getting adopted!

> > >

> > > I have difficulty understanding how a BPD person manages to control all

> > the ugly

> > > behaviour so that the outsiders don't see what they do. Surely that is

> > behaviour

> > > management ie, they are in control not mentally incapable, so they should

> > be

> > > bloody well held to ransom for their badness.....grrrrrr!

> > >

March 9, 2011

I am very new to this site, and I just read this post. Goodness. Your parents

are so crazy. Please don't be offended by this, but thank God you're out there

with your nice decorated house living a life even with your insane mom who

leaves hidden craps in your bathroom. I have discovered, since joining this chat

thing, that I am not alone. All of us kids of people with BPD have these like,

shocking shocking stories to tell. I am not surprised about your family. Not

really. The only thing that surprises me is that someone out there has a parent

as crazy as mine. Cheers, and take care.

-Noodle.

>

> Some of you know the NADA+FOO have been visiting for 2 months from 12,000

miles away...they went home 2 weeks ago and we are still finding odd traces of

them in our house. Not your usual lost-socks or spare toothbrush, but weird

items that appear to have been 'placed' for intentional meaning...it makes me

feel like that even tho they've all left they are still trying to control us

after the fact...

>

> Tell me if this is my imagination or are these 'plants' to cause us crazyness?

> 1 - two new towels appeared in bathroom - bright green towels - (our house is

edwardian period...the bathroom is blue and white and art-deco

styling....there's a point to this...) I excused it as my NADAs terrible colour

sense but then we don't need any new towels as I bought brandnew BLUE ones for

their visit - hubby then tells me the day before NADA had lectured/inquired for

like an hour as to why we chose the blue colour, how did we choose, how do we

know about colour matching, blah blah blah blah - he thought she was making

small talk re his previous job as a fashion designer...now I think more

sinisterly that she was making it obvious she knew we had a blue bathroom and

the new towels are her way of saying WE ARE WRONG (!?)NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO CHOOSE

OUR OWN COLOURS!

> 2- In thE exact center of their bedroom a flat 3-sheets of handwritten notes

by NADA - I was cleaning the room and scanned it to see if it was rubbish or

Important....words Like " FAMILY " " GOD " " SHAME " " SIN " " GRIEF " " DEATH "

" forgiveness " " names of FOO... " etc etc all floated into the air. I quickly put

the papers down. I thought I DO NOT WANT TO KNOW THE EVIL AND TORRID CONTENTS OF

HER SICK AND TWISTED MIND!!!! Hubby said she left it deliberately for me to read

like a confessional to make me feel her pain so i would be guilty about the

terrible way that i APPAREntly (!) TREAT HER!!!!Now I don't know whether to burn

it or return it to her, or print copies and distribute them to all the people

who think she's such an amazing warm and giving christian woman!!!!

> 3- i KEEP MY BOOKS very neat as I love to read. ( A posititve family trait -

we have been brought up to respect books ( more than people!!!!) and NEVER

destroy damage or borrow any one elses books - a cardinal sin is to lose someone

elses books! ) - SHE has rifled thru the books and not just messed up the

shelves but has removed half a dozen books from a specific section - the

christian life books - and along with ANNA KARENINA (which I know she heartily

disapproves of) has REMOVED them from my home!!!!!AAAHHHH!!!

> 4 - THE FINAL STRAW - yesterday I found a very strange thing in my bathroom

while cleaning - about 10foot above the ground on top of the mirrored cabinets

where the artdeco SPECIAL STUFF IS ON DISPLAY ...a small round dried out little

ball of POO...yes! POO! It is the most bizarre thing yet! She spent the last

week of teh visit telling us she had a psychic-like sense of being able to smell

if anyone had cancer adn that she smelt the special cancer smell in our bathroom

and that we should get checked out urgently (this was not easy to laugh offeven

tho it was ridiculous. I pointed out to her that cancer lives in cells not

bathrooms, so she wouldnt be able to smell it off a room even if she had the

magical ability. SHe insisted the smell was especially prsent if my husband ever

went into the bathroom for any reason (she's trying to make me worry about my

husband).I asked her if we should do a line-up so she can come along and sniff

us to see which one had the cancer - she refused of course rather indignantly.

So now she's gone and I found that she has put a piece of poo high up in our

bathroom to make us smell a wierd smell and make us think we are sick and dying.

What a freak. Either that or it just symbolises that our BLUE colour choice

amounts to a pile of CRAP!!!!!

>

> So what do you all think? Is that what you call gaslighting when they set up a

situation to make us look crazy?

>

March 9, 2011

I remember hearing about that, Annie. Sickening.

Mia

------------

If the link doesn't work, the title at YouTube is: " Man beats 2 year old in

the grocery store "

-Annie

March 9, 2011

Welcome. It is obvious you are new to the site, or you would not worry

that a KO would be offended by " your parents are so crazy " . Yea, we

know. All of us.

Doug

> >

> > Some of you know the NADA+FOO have been visiting for 2 months from

12,000 miles away...they went home 2 weeks ago and we are still finding

odd traces of them in our house. Not your usual lost-socks or spare

toothbrush, but weird items that appear to have been 'placed' for

intentional meaning...it makes me feel like that even tho they've all

left they are still trying to control us after the fact...

> >

> > Tell me if this is my imagination or are these 'plants' to cause us

crazyness?

> > 1 - two new towels appeared in bathroom - bright green towels - (our

house is edwardian period...the bathroom is blue and white and art-deco

styling....there's a point to this...) I excused it as my NADAs terrible

colour sense but then we don't need any new towels as I bought brandnew

BLUE ones for their visit - hubby then tells me the day before NADA had

lectured/inquired for like an hour as to why we chose the blue colour,

how did we choose, how do we know about colour matching, blah blah blah

blah - he thought she was making small talk re his previous job as a

fashion designer...now I think more sinisterly that she was making it

obvious she knew we had a blue bathroom and the new towels are her way

of saying WE ARE WRONG (!?)NOT EVEN ALLOWED TO CHOOSE OUR OWN COLOURS!

> > 2- In thE exact center of their bedroom a flat 3-sheets of

handwritten notes by NADA - I was cleaning the room and scanned it to

see if it was rubbish or Important....words Like " FAMILY " " GOD " " SHAME "

" SIN " " GRIEF " " DEATH " " forgiveness " " names of FOO... " etc etc all

floated into the air. I quickly put the papers down. I thought I DO NOT

WANT TO KNOW THE EVIL AND TORRID CONTENTS OF HER SICK AND TWISTED

MIND!!!! Hubby said she left it deliberately for me to read like a

confessional to make me feel her pain so i would be guilty about the

terrible way that i APPAREntly (!) TREAT HER!!!!Now I don't know whether

to burn it or return it to her, or print copies and distribute them to

all the people who think she's such an amazing warm and giving christian

woman!!!!

> > 3- i KEEP MY BOOKS very neat as I love to read. ( A posititve family

trait - we have been brought up to respect books ( more than people!!!!)

and NEVER destroy damage or borrow any one elses books - a cardinal sin

is to lose someone elses books! ) - SHE has rifled thru the books and

not just messed up the shelves but has removed half a dozen books from a

specific section - the christian life books - and along with ANNA

KARENINA (which I know she heartily disapproves of) has REMOVED them

from my home!!!!!AAAHHHH!!!

> > 4 - THE FINAL STRAW - yesterday I found a very strange thing in my

bathroom while cleaning - about 10foot above the ground on top of the

mirrored cabinets where the artdeco SPECIAL STUFF IS ON DISPLAY ...a

small round dried out little ball of POO...yes! POO! It is the most

bizarre thing yet! She spent the last week of teh visit telling us she

had a psychic-like sense of being able to smell if anyone had cancer adn

that she smelt the special cancer smell in our bathroom and that we

should get checked out urgently (this was not easy to laugh offeven tho

it was ridiculous. I pointed out to her that cancer lives in cells not

bathrooms, so she wouldnt be able to smell it off a room even if she had

the magical ability. SHe insisted the smell was especially prsent if my

husband ever went into the bathroom for any reason (she's trying to make

me worry about my husband).I asked her if we should do a line-up so she

can come along and sniff us to see which one had the cancer - she

refused of course rather indignantly. So now she's gone and I found that

she has put a piece of poo high up in our bathroom to make us smell a

wierd smell and make us think we are sick and dying. What a freak.

Either that or it just symbolises that our BLUE colour choice amounts to

a pile of CRAP!!!!!

> >

> > So what do you all think? Is that what you call gaslighting when

they set up a situation to make us look crazy?

> >

>

March 9, 2011

My nada house guest messing with my mind story... does not involve poo hidden in

secret places, but in your face craziness. While she was visiting, my nada took

the clean face cloths from the bathroom and used them to clean the greasy dishes

in the kitchen sink, even though there was a dishwasher there. She did it over

and over, even though I said stop it. I told her brother, hey uncle, what's up

with the clean face cloths and the dirty dishes? He said to me, what's the

matter D, don't you want a nice greasy rag in your face? I thought wow, he

totally got it...her brother knows she's a nut case. P.S. rgbargy68 - What's

with this towel thing??

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Wed, March 9, 2011 5:22:08 PM

Subject: Re: Is this gaslighting? -warning - ODD and LONG

POST!