Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by putting green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new thread. When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that broke my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a certain style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at me that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King Lear, and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. I'm the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on time for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! She was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more hours late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a kid to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has allowed me to explore it. Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your core personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed and pretend you were someone else? It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, my favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she didn't even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling to explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white bathroom is a perfect example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 I don't think I ever really existed for my nada as a separate, unique, individual human being. I was supposed to be a reflection of her. She considered and pronounced the things about me that were different from her to be " weird " , alarming and/or disgusting, except for a talent I inherited from my dad and his side of the family. She was happy with that aspect of me, and promoted and encouraged me to develop that talent. Its close to being the only good thing she's done for me as a parent. Otherwise she made a goal out of erasing my individuality, humiliating and shaming me for any variations from what she considered ideal, and forcing me into a mold shaped like her perfect self as much as possible. -Annie > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by putting > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > thread. > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that broke > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a certain > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at me > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King Lear, > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. I'm > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on time > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! She > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more hours > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a kid > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > allowed me to explore it. > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your core > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed and > pretend you were someone else? > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, my > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she didn't > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling to > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 I think my nada saw me the opposite - she wanted me to be nothing like her, not have the same interests etc, or if I did, she had to be better at it and she would compete with me constantly. I think this was fed by my emotionally incestuous relationship with my dad. Nada refused to do the things a wife and mother often does, like dishes, helping planning a family get together, buying gifts for a wedding or baby shower, grocery shopping, cleaning the house (except for certain special days where she would fly into a cleaning frenzy) basically everything. So I ended up filling in, being my dad's best friend, confidant and co-pilot. I think my close relationship with my dad made her jealous and it tipped the family triangle over - I became the wife and mother in the family and she was the bratty child. But at the same time she was a bratty child with mega jealousy and competition issues - kind of like Fatal Attraction melded with a preschooler. I think a major concern of hers was that I might be prettier, thinner, sexier, have more boyfriends etc. Guess what, sorry but I am all those thing compared to her. I mean she has the physical and emotional attraction of Jabba the Hut!!!!! And she hated me for it. Is that normal in a mother/daughter relationship? She did everything she could to make me unattractive from not buying me decent clothes to refusing to do my laundry to chopping my hair to refusing to show me or allow me to do make up or shave my legs. I was so behind on girl stuff after I left home. It took my like 15 years to figure it out and catch up to my peers. I remember my college roommates were always teasing me that I just showered and then left the house - they would stand in front of the mirror and do their hair and makeup for an hour - I had no idea how to do that. . . Finally some girlfriends showed me in college and later as an adults. But I was lost - and I'm a total girly girl so its really weird. Wow, that was almost a lost memory. Weird as hell. On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 9:25 AM, anuria67854 wrote: > > > I don't think I ever really existed for my nada as a separate, unique, > individual human being. I was supposed to be a reflection of her. She > considered and pronounced the things about me that were different from her > to be " weird " , alarming and/or disgusting, except for a talent I inherited > from my dad and his side of the family. She was happy with that aspect of > me, and promoted and encouraged me to develop that talent. Its close to > being the only good thing she's done for me as a parent. Otherwise she made > a goal out of erasing my individuality, humiliating and shaming me for any > variations from what she considered ideal, and forcing me into a mold shaped > like her perfect self as much as possible. > > -Annie > > > > > > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by > putting > > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > > thread. > > > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that > broke > > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a > certain > > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at > me > > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King > Lear, > > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. > I'm > > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on > time > > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! > She > > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more > hours > > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a > kid > > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > > allowed me to explore it. > > > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your > core > > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed > and > > pretend you were someone else? > > > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, > my > > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she > didn't > > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling > to > > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 I think the underlying theme is that the borderline pd mother is not connected to reality enough to perceive her child as a child: a living, feeling, individual human being who is abjectly dependent on her. Over and over again, it seems that the personality-disordered mother believes that even her infant has adult-level thoughts, motives and goals. ( " The baby hates me. " , " You're doing that deliberately to piss me off, aren't you? " said to a two-year-old, etc.) The bpd mother can only project her own inner distorted thoughts and beliefs onto her innocent, bewildered child; nada is incapable of relating to her child in a normal way. Instead, the borderline pd mother assigns a role or roles to her child: an artificial state that has nothing to do with the reality of the child's individuality: Her child is viewed as nada's own idealized self (the golden child), or as her hated rival, or as her own parent, or as her substitute spouse, or as an inanimate object (a dolly), or as all the things she hates about herself (the scapegoat) etc... never simply as her child, who is a unique little individual that needs her love and guidance. So instead of being a real-world nurturer, guide, protector, role-model to her child, the bpd parent is instead living inside a kind of fantasy world of her own making, a play she is directing, and her child is just assigned a role in that play. Our innocence and utter dependence exploited for nada's purposes without us really comprehending it. Its kind of the opposite of parenting. In a way, we all raised ourselves; we didn't really have a mother in the nurturing sense of the word. We had a user. This inability to relate to her infant and child in a normal way is one of the reasons I believe that those with bpd and other severe mental illnesses should not be raising children. Such anti-parenting can do more harm than good. -Annie > > > > > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by > > putting > > > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > > > thread. > > > > > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that > > broke > > > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > > > > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > > > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a > > certain > > > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > > > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at > > me > > > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > > > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King > > Lear, > > > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > > > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > > > > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. > > I'm > > > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on > > time > > > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > > > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > > > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! > > She > > > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more > > hours > > > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > > > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a > > kid > > > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > > > allowed me to explore it. > > > > > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your > > core > > > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed > > and > > > pretend you were someone else? > > > > > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, > > my > > > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > > > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she > > didn't > > > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > > > > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling > > to > > > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > > > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 When I was 5 years old we moved into a new house, and my room had this awesome yellow flowered wall paper, and was so sunny and happy, and I loved it. My mom insisted on painting the walls pepto-bismal pink and putting up this old-fashioned rose trimmed wall paper and making my room super girly. I told her that I like it yellow. And she just said, " no, it's too bright " . So then I ended up with this awful pink drenched room with a daybed and pink comforter and pink duvet and pink pillows and pink drapes, and...you get the idea. From that day on, my favorite color was pink, according to her. She even says shit like: oh, remember how you had your room all pink when you were little? And I'm like, um, do you really think a 5 year old can paint and wallpaper a room to be pink? I like yellow. Green and yellow are my favorite colors, but she would never know that. That story is just the tip of the ice berg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 With the exception of the college thing (nada wanted to leave step dad and come to school WITH me) I could have written this entire post. I know EXACTLY how you're feeling here.... Right down to the organization, rarely to never late, etc. My therapist said it's my way of making sure that the world doesn't explode at nada's 'watch'... but sometimes it's a bummer being the one always driving the ship when someone else is perfectly capable... SO is teaching me about that... Lynnette > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by putting > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > thread. > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that broke > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a certain > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at me > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King Lear, > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. I'm > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on time > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! She > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more hours > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a kid > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > allowed me to explore it. > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your core > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed and > pretend you were someone else? > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, my > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she didn't > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling to > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 Annie the word " individuality " exactly sums it up - she didn't respect or allow or appreciate my individuality. To this day I have MEGA problems with people who don't allow me to be an individual - usually its my job trying to force me to be someone I " m not, or a shallow version of who I am in a navy suit. I can't stand it. It's because of nada. . . My ex-husband and his mother both also did the same thing to me. , that is so weird - when I was about 6 nada let me pick out wallpaper and bed spread and things for my room. I chose yellow. Next thing I knew, she had covered my room in rust colored hearts with peach accents. I had absolutely no say and no choice - and I'd already picked everything out. But she went behind my back and changed everything. She didn't even tell me until after it was all installed. WTH!!!!!! I don't have kids, and this is really dumb, but whenever I give my dogs a treat, a toy or put a shirt or bandana on them, I pick out a few options and then I let them make the final choice. Its so funny because they REALLY do choose. I do it often enough that they understand they only get to pick one. It is so cute to see that even dogs have preferences- for instance, Cowboy likes the dog treats that are more like cookies with peanut butter or ginger flavors while Loki likes the meaty ones. Nada never did that for me. She tried to force her choices down my throat. And then when she realized I had my own opinions, she just abandoned me saying 'You are not my daughter " and having very little to do with me from there on out. Gaaaaaah On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 10:34 AM, yp_lynnette_cameron_park < h_l_maston@...> wrote: > > > With the exception of the college thing (nada wanted to leave step dad and > come to school WITH me) I could have written this entire post. I know > EXACTLY how you're feeling here.... Right down to the organization, rarely > to never late, etc. My therapist said it's my way of making sure that the > world doesn't explode at nada's 'watch'... but sometimes it's a bummer being > the one always driving the ship when someone else is perfectly capable... SO > is teaching me about that... > > Lynnette > > > > > > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by > putting > > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > > thread. > > > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that > broke > > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a > certain > > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at > me > > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King > Lear, > > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. > I'm > > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on > time > > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! > She > > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more > hours > > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a > kid > > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > > allowed me to explore it. > > > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your > core > > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed > and > > pretend you were someone else? > > > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, > my > > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she > didn't > > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling > to > > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 So in a sense, our mothers were not *pretending* to " not get " us, they were genuinely incapable of " getting " us. (Again, like expecting a 2-year-old to have the desire and the skills to care for a weanling puppy properly, with absolutely no supervision. The poor puppy is doomed.) Or, perhaps, my nada's narcissistic traits made her simply not care that my needs or feelings or tastes might be different than hers. Or maybe she saw my diverging ideas, feelings, tastes, etc. as rejection or as disrespect. I was expected to respect and admire and appreciate her individuality, but have none of my own. And following along with the role I was assigned, I also believe there is/was a sense of ownership involved; my nada acted as though she owned me. I, her child, was simply an object that she owned, just another one of her possessions, like a rather defective toy that didn't work properly, and that gave her the right to constantly criticize me, tell me what to think and do and say instead of allowing me to express my individuality. If there had been such a thing as a " parenting aptitude and skills evaluation test " given to prospective parents, I don't think my nada would have passed. She'd have to have attended and passed " remedial parenting class 101 " before getting pregnant with me. -Annie > > Annie the word " individuality " exactly sums it up - she didn't respect or > allow or appreciate my individuality. To this day I have MEGA problems with > people who don't allow me to be an individual - usually its my job trying to > force me to be someone I " m not, or a shallow version of who I am in a navy > suit. I can't stand it. It's because of nada. . . My ex-husband and his > mother both also did the same thing to me. > > , that is so weird - when I was about 6 nada let me pick out wallpaper > and bed spread and things for my room. I chose yellow. Next thing I knew, > she had covered my room in rust colored hearts with peach accents. I had > absolutely no say and no choice - and I'd already picked everything out. But > she went behind my back and changed everything. She didn't even tell me > until after it was all installed. WTH!!!!!! > > I don't have kids, and this is really dumb, but whenever I give my dogs a > treat, a toy or put a shirt or bandana on them, I pick out a few options and > then I let them make the final choice. Its so funny because they REALLY do > choose. I do it often enough that they understand they only get to pick one. > It is so cute to see that even dogs have preferences- for instance, Cowboy > likes the dog treats that are more like cookies with peanut butter or ginger > flavors while Loki likes the meaty ones. Nada never did that for me. She > tried to force her choices down my throat. And then when she realized I had > my own opinions, she just abandoned me saying 'You are not my daughter " and > having very little to do with me from there on out. Gaaaaaah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 Yeah, I think my nada thought motherhood would be this magical thing that would bring her authority, respect, and a fun little doll to play with that she could dress up. Turns out that you have to earn respect, and the doll is alive! AAAAAH! Imagine the shock! On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 11:39 AM, anuria67854 wrote: > > > So in a sense, our mothers were not *pretending* to " not get " us, they were > genuinely incapable of " getting " us. (Again, like expecting a 2-year-old to > have the desire and the skills to care for a weanling puppy properly, with > absolutely no supervision. The poor puppy is doomed.) > > Or, perhaps, my nada's narcissistic traits made her simply not care that my > needs or feelings or tastes might be different than hers. Or maybe she saw > my diverging ideas, feelings, tastes, etc. as rejection or as disrespect. I > was expected to respect and admire and appreciate her individuality, but > have none of my own. > > And following along with the role I was assigned, I also believe there > is/was a sense of ownership involved; my nada acted as though she owned me. > > I, her child, was simply an object that she owned, just another one of her > possessions, like a rather defective toy that didn't work properly, and that > gave her the right to constantly criticize me, tell me what to think and do > and say instead of allowing me to express my individuality. > > If there had been such a thing as a " parenting aptitude and skills > evaluation test " given to prospective parents, I don't think my nada would > have passed. She'd have to have attended and passed " remedial parenting > class 101 " before getting pregnant with me. > > -Annie > > > > > > > Annie the word " individuality " exactly sums it up - she didn't respect or > > allow or appreciate my individuality. To this day I have MEGA problems > with > > people who don't allow me to be an individual - usually its my job trying > to > > force me to be someone I " m not, or a shallow version of who I am in a > navy > > suit. I can't stand it. It's because of nada. . . My ex-husband and his > > mother both also did the same thing to me. > > > > , that is so weird - when I was about 6 nada let me pick out > wallpaper > > and bed spread and things for my room. I chose yellow. Next thing I knew, > > she had covered my room in rust colored hearts with peach accents. I had > > absolutely no say and no choice - and I'd already picked everything out. > But > > she went behind my back and changed everything. She didn't even tell me > > until after it was all installed. WTH!!!!!! > > > > I don't have kids, and this is really dumb, but whenever I give my dogs a > > treat, a toy or put a shirt or bandana on them, I pick out a few options > and > > then I let them make the final choice. Its so funny because they REALLY > do > > choose. I do it often enough that they understand they only get to pick > one. > > It is so cute to see that even dogs have preferences- for instance, > Cowboy > > likes the dog treats that are more like cookies with peanut butter or > ginger > > flavors while Loki likes the meaty ones. Nada never did that for me. She > > tried to force her choices down my throat. And then when she realized I > had > > my own opinions, she just abandoned me saying 'You are not my daughter " > and > > having very little to do with me from there on out. Gaaaaaah > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 Wow. Gaslighting at it's most extreme! As a friend of mine used to say when I defended BPD's gaslighting behavior: " Nobody is that stupid. " If she truly didn't see your core nature, then how did she know what to attack??? Her purpose wasn't to " get " or " not get " you. Her purpose was to undermine you and destroy your own sense of self. It must have made her too nervous, given that she doesn't have one of her own! Somehow, and I'm not sure I can express this well . . . one of the most painful, lasting trauma's I've dealt with is the pain of not being seen. It still triggers the heck out of me. Being made invisible isn't just a lack of attention--it cuts at the very core of your survival and your psyche. It's psychologically damaging to have someone " look " at you and then reflect back to you that you are something entirely different. Just ugly, nasty, traumatizing crazymaking. Yuck. And . . . you know? Not knowing your child is leaving for college until she actually steps out of your front door? That isn't just insane. (And it is highly insane). That's neglect. Wow. I hope I haven't sounded too negative here. I get it. And the towels story is a great representation of this whole dynamic. Just wanted to affirm--this is a big deal. Blessings, Karla > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by putting > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > thread. > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that broke > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a certain > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at me > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King Lear, > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. I'm > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on time > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! She > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more hours > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a kid > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > allowed me to explore it. > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your core > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed and > pretend you were someone else? > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, my > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she didn't > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling to > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2011 Report Share Posted March 1, 2011 Wow Karla - you totally get it. I was invisible to the point I was actually surprised when people noticed me in a room, meeting, class etc. . . Your not too negative - that's the truth. A mother is supposed to mirror you to help you find who you are. When they show you something opposite it does deep damage. Thanks for that thanks for understanding. On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 2:00 PM, kyjohnson40days wrote: > > > Wow. Gaslighting at it's most extreme! As a friend of mine used to say when > I defended BPD's gaslighting behavior: " Nobody is that stupid. " If she truly > didn't see your core nature, then how did she know what to attack??? Her > purpose wasn't to " get " or " not get " you. Her purpose was to undermine you > and destroy your own sense of self. It must have made her too nervous, given > that she doesn't have one of her own! > > Somehow, and I'm not sure I can express this well . . . one of the most > painful, lasting trauma's I've dealt with is the pain of not being seen. It > still triggers the heck out of me. Being made invisible isn't just a lack of > attention--it cuts at the very core of your survival and your psyche. > > It's psychologically damaging to have someone " look " at you and then > reflect back to you that you are something entirely different. Just ugly, > nasty, traumatizing crazymaking. Yuck. > > And . . . you know? Not knowing your child is leaving for college until she > actually steps out of your front door? That isn't just insane. (And it is > highly insane). That's neglect. > > Wow. I hope I haven't sounded too negative here. I get it. And the towels > story is a great representation of this whole dynamic. Just wanted to > affirm--this is a big deal. > > Blessings, > Karla > > > > > > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by > putting > > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > > thread. > > > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that > broke > > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a > certain > > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at > me > > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King > Lear, > > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. > I'm > > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on > time > > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! > She > > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more > hours > > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a > kid > > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > > allowed me to explore it. > > > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your > core > > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed > and > > pretend you were someone else? > > > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, > my > > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she > didn't > > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling > to > > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2011 Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 Okay, this is kinda crazy, but when I was four or five my nada asked how I wanted my room decorated. I *distinctly* remember thinking to myself " She's not going to get me what I want anyway, " so I dreamt up the craziest theme I could think of at the time, which was Wizard of Oz wallpaper with bright yellow carpet. And wouldn't you know, that was one of the few times I got precisely what I asked for. Then I was upset with myself for not asking for what I actually wanted, but now that I reflect on it, isn't that kind of screwed up? > > > > > > So 's thread about her art deco bathroom and nada's slap by > > putting > > > green towels in it struck a chord with me. But I wanted to start a new > > > thread. > > > > > > When I was in my teens and twenties, the thing that my nada did that > > broke > > > my heart into a million pieces is she just pretended not to " get " me. > > > > > > For instance, if I loved wearing black (and I still do) she would buy me > > > clothes in floral pink patterns 3 or 4 sizes too big. If I loved a > > certain > > > style of music or composer, she would buy me a gift of the opposite style > > > and then criticize me for not liking it. Even to the point of raging at > > me > > > that I was ungrateful. Her favorite was to scream " more bitter than a > > > serpant's tooth it is to have a thankless child. " Uh, I've read King > > Lear, > > > and he says that about his only genuinly loving child. I guess she forgot > > > that even though she was a pseudointellectual English major. > > > > > > One thing she really critiqued in me is my structured approach to life. > > I'm > > > the type of person who sits down and makes goals, is almost always on > > time > > > for appointments, I keep a calendar, I make deadlines, if we have guests > > > coming at 6, I clean the house the day before and then I start dinner at > > > least 2 hours in advance of their arrival. Nada HATED this about me!!! > > She > > > was always trying to throw me off my game, she would show up 2 or more > > hours > > > late for everything, and then critisize me and call me inflexible, left > > > brained etc. I am actually probably right dominant, but I learned as a > > kid > > > to hide my creative nature so she couldn't attack it. Only going NC has > > > allowed me to explore it. > > > > > > Anyway, I guess I'm wondering - did your nada's attack or pretend your > > core > > > personality was just plain flawed - or ignore the fact that it existed > > and > > > pretend you were someone else? > > > > > > It hurt me so so so bad to have my nada unable to name my favorite color, > > my > > > favorite class in school, my favorite song to play on the piano, my best > > > friend's name etc. In fact, she wrote me off to the degree that she > > didn't > > > even know where I was going away to college until the day I left. > > > > > > Anyone anyone? I'd love to have words to express this, but I'm struggling > > to > > > explain. But the green towels in a beautifully decorated blue and white > > > bathroom is a perfect example. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2011 Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 Hey Girlscout, I just caught your quote about having a " thankless " child. Boy, did that ring bells!!! fada was sooooo fond of quoting it, as though Shakespeare really gave the accusation the ring of truth as it applied to ME. I'll never forget the day I opened one of fada " poison pen " letters and there was the quote. I was stabbed right in the heart. But you know what I learned from it? I learned that people who have a talent for writing have to be very careful with how they use it. The writer has been given a powerful tool, and it can be used for good, or it can cut like a sword. Here's the full measure from King Lear, the " thankless child " quote is almost at the end. LEAR: It may be so, my lord. Hear, nature, hear; dear goddess, hear! Suspend thy purpose, if thou didst intend To make this creature fruitful! Into her womb convey sterility! Dry up in her the organs of increase; And from her derogate body never spring A babe to honour her! If she must teem, Create her child of spleen; that it may live, And be a thwart disnatured torment to her! Let it stamp wrinkles in her brow of youth; With cadent tears fret channels in her cheeks; Turn all her mother's pains and benefits To laughter and contempt; that she may feel How sharper than a serpent's tooth it is To have a thankless child! Away, away! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2011 Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 HA HA my nada didn't even get the quote right. She said more bitter not more thankless. What an asshat! On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:38 AM, awayfromborderland < awayfromborderland@...> wrote: > > > Hey Girlscout, I just caught your quote about having a " thankless " child. > Boy, did that ring bells!!! fada was sooooo fond of quoting it, as though > Shakespeare really gave the accusation the ring of truth as it applied to > ME. > > I'll never forget the day I opened one of fada " poison pen " letters and > there was the quote. I was stabbed right in the heart. But you know what I > learned from it? I learned that people who have a talent for writing have to > be very careful with how they use it. The writer has been given a powerful > tool, and it can be used for good, or it can cut like a sword. Here's the > full measure from King Lear, the " thankless child " quote is almost at the > end. > > LEAR: > It may be so, my lord. > Hear, nature, hear; dear goddess, hear! > Suspend thy purpose, if thou didst intend > To make this creature fruitful! > Into her womb convey sterility! > Dry up in her the organs of increase; > And from her derogate body never spring > A babe to honour her! If she must teem, > Create her child of spleen; that it may live, > And be a thwart disnatured torment to her! > Let it stamp wrinkles in her brow of youth; > With cadent tears fret channels in her cheeks; > Turn all her mother's pains and benefits > To laughter and contempt; that she may feel > How sharper than a serpent's tooth it is > To have a thankless child! Away, away! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2011 Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 Er I mean sharper. Sorry I'm mutlitasking. On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 12:00 PM, Girlscout Cowboy < girlscout.cowboy@...> wrote: > HA HA my nada didn't even get the quote right. She said more bitter not > more thankless. > > What an asshat! > > On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:38 AM, awayfromborderland < > awayfromborderland@...> wrote: > >> >> >> Hey Girlscout, I just caught your quote about having a " thankless " child. >> Boy, did that ring bells!!! fada was sooooo fond of quoting it, as though >> Shakespeare really gave the accusation the ring of truth as it applied to >> ME. >> >> I'll never forget the day I opened one of fada " poison pen " letters and >> there was the quote. I was stabbed right in the heart. But you know what I >> learned from it? I learned that people who have a talent for writing have to >> be very careful with how they use it. The writer has been given a powerful >> tool, and it can be used for good, or it can cut like a sword. Here's the >> full measure from King Lear, the " thankless child " quote is almost at the >> end. >> >> LEAR: >> It may be so, my lord. >> Hear, nature, hear; dear goddess, hear! >> Suspend thy purpose, if thou didst intend >> To make this creature fruitful! >> Into her womb convey sterility! >> Dry up in her the organs of increase; >> And from her derogate body never spring >> A babe to honour her! If she must teem, >> Create her child of spleen; that it may live, >> And be a thwart disnatured torment to her! >> Let it stamp wrinkles in her brow of youth; >> With cadent tears fret channels in her cheeks; >> Turn all her mother's pains and benefits >> To laughter and contempt; that she may feel >> How sharper than a serpent's tooth it is >> To have a thankless child! Away, away! >> >> >> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2011 Report Share Posted March 2, 2011 Yeah . . . I got Bible verses thrown at me, so I get it!! And . . . when I grew up and read the Bible several times, cover-to-cover, I found out many of the " verses " he quoted didn't exist in the Bible! Ugh . . . > > Hey Girlscout, I just caught your quote about having a " thankless " child. Boy, did that ring bells!!! fada was sooooo fond of quoting it, as though Shakespeare really gave the accusation the ring of truth as it applied to ME. > > I'll never forget the day I opened one of fada " poison pen " letters and there was the quote. I was stabbed right in the heart. But you know what I learned from it? I learned that people who have a talent for writing have to be very careful with how they use it. The writer has been given a powerful tool, and it can be used for good, or it can cut like a sword. Here's the full measure from King Lear, the " thankless child " quote is almost at the end. > > LEAR: > It may be so, my lord. > Hear, nature, hear; dear goddess, hear! > Suspend thy purpose, if thou didst intend > To make this creature fruitful! > Into her womb convey sterility! > Dry up in her the organs of increase; > And from her derogate body never spring > A babe to honour her! If she must teem, > Create her child of spleen; that it may live, > And be a thwart disnatured torment to her! > Let it stamp wrinkles in her brow of youth; > With cadent tears fret channels in her cheeks; > Turn all her mother's pains and benefits > To laughter and contempt; that she may feel > How sharper than a serpent's tooth it is > To have a thankless child! Away, away! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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