Re: picking wrong partner due to upbringing?

[Guest guest]

Hi my4fireflies,

Yes, there are many situations similar to yours. I've experienced one of them.

You may have married another personality disordered individual because that's

what seemed normal to you.

I urge you to get and read " Understanding the Borderline Mother " by Lawson. She

tells about what happens to children in a PD situation. (She also tells about

the different types of - mostly borderline - mothers and how to handle them when

you are an adult!) After you have had a chance to digest that, then I suggest

you read " The Betrayal Bond " by Carnes. I've recently read both of these books

and what an eyeopening I have had!

Once you understand more of the dynamics, you will have a better grasp of your

options.

Cricket

>

> Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the right

direction to find more info....

>

> Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC since

Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking for drama,

but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not stealing the

spotlight 24/7.

>

> I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior to

meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of flamboyant

narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate and wore),

treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with unfaithfulness, lies,

abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of partners was similar to how

nada treated me, they were able to make me feel crazy and manipulate reality

constantly and nada backed them up with statements like " why are you even with

her? She's such a bitch! " or grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my

bf and watching a movie. (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total

opposite. Quiet, reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my

father was a raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I

wanted without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air,

even if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

>

> I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT) and I

am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not been able

to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in his thinking

that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I have been

unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic), the house, live

in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these disabilities means 3x

the work for me. All of his friendships are thru work. Most of our conversations

are about his work. He has absolutely NO connection to the children-and admits

it. He is filled with rage that this is his life and seems completely unable to

cope with our situation.

> He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute to his

emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four kids....I'm lost.

My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I am completely

overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra needs of my oldest

two, run a household alone, and referee between my emtionally crippled husband

and my socially challenged children.

> I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over time

it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust me. I also

thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but surely he could

connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has happened. If I hadn't

had children with him I may have been able to meet his emotional needs or

designed a life that required very little of him. I would like to try to figure

out if there is a name for someone completely devoid of emotion, attachment, and

coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to him, no thoughts of the future, no

responsibility for the outcome of anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a

real star in his company. ????

>

> Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues are

the very thing that creates it.

>

> Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of nada-to a

fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful, totally

loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just feel that my ASD

13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life is getting

increasingly difficult.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I did the same thing as you regarding partner for the most part. Maybe your

husband has Aspergers?

On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 10:29 AM, my4fireflies wrote:

>

>

> Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> right direction to find more info....

>

> Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking

> for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not

> stealing the spotlight 24/7.

>

> I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior

> to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate

> and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of

> partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me feel

> crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a movie.

> (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father was a

> raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I wanted

> without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air, even

> if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

> For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

> remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

>

> I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT) and

> I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not been

> able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in his

> thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I

> have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic),

> the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these

> disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru work.

> Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO

> connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that this

> is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute to

> his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I

> am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra

> needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over

> time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust

> me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but

> surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has

> happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to meet his

> emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I would

> like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely devoid

> of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to

> him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his company.

> ????

>

> Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues

> are the very thing that creates it.

>

> Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of nada-to

> a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful,

> totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just feel

> that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life is

> getting increasingly difficult.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I have considered it. There are some things that fit, and some that really

really don't. I thinking some kind of attachment or avoidance disorder since he

has NO feelings towards most people or situations. He does like me, but in a

very limited and rule oriented way.

>

> >

> >

> > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> > right direction to find more info....

> >

> > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> > since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking

> > for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not

> > stealing the spotlight 24/7.

> >

> > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior

> > to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> > flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate

> > and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> > unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of

> > partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me feel

> > crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> > statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> > grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a movie.

> > (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> > reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father was a

> > raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I wanted

> > without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air, even

> > if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

> > For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

> > remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> >

> > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT) and

> > I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not been

> > able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in his

> > thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I

> > have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic),

> > the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these

> > disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru work.

> > Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO

> > connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that this

> > is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute to

> > his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> > kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I

> > am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra

> > needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> > emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> > connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over

> > time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust

> > me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but

> > surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has

> > happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to meet his

> > emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I would

> > like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely devoid

> > of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to

> > him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> > anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his company.

> > ????

> >

> > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues

> > are the very thing that creates it.

> >

> > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of nada-to

> > a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful,

> > totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just feel

> > that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life is

> > getting increasingly difficult.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Is it possible to ask your husband if you guys could move to a more

populated area so better to take care of your four little ones? I don't know

where your husband works, but if he's commuting to get there, perhaps you

guys could shorten the commute. That way you can get more love and

socialization from others when you can't get it from your husband.

Also, you guys probably should go to couples' counseling. I had to do that

as part of marriage prep in my archdiocese, and it REALLY helped to lay

everything out on the table in a safe environment. So I can vouch for the

beneficial aspects of it.

Otherwise, I might suggest that you make an appointment with your husband,

so to speak, to sit down together and talk. That might go better with the

way he likes things, so he can be prepared for talking about specific

subjects, and not schedule work for during that time. Some couples can start

talking about difficult subjects right away, but other couples like some

advance notification before they sit down and talk about difficult things.

Also, I used to be so afraid of anything difficult that might lead to

arguments, and DH was used to working right through the problem. I needed

frequent breaks, and the ability to say, " I'm getting

frustrated/angry/sad/confused and need a time out. " DH had to learn to give

me that ability to take a break. But we had to agree, then and there,

another time and place to pick up the discussion, so I couldn't just keep on

avoiding the problem, whatever it was.

I hope this helps--but only you and your husband know what's best for you

guys, so do what feels right.

Holly

>

>

> I have considered it. There are some things that fit, and some that really

> really don't. I thinking some kind of attachment or avoidance disorder since

> he has NO feelings towards most people or situations. He does like me, but

> in a very limited and rule oriented way.

>

>

> >

> > >

> > >

> > > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> > > right direction to find more info....

> > >

> > > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> > > since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not

> looking

> > > for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is

> not

> > > stealing the spotlight 24/7.

> > >

> > > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is

> prior

> > > to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> > > flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what

> I ate

> > > and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> > > unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice

> of

> > > partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me

> feel

> > > crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> > > statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> > > grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a

> movie.

> > > (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> > > reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father

> was a

> > > raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I

> wanted

> > > without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air,

> even

> > > if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little

> disconcerting.

> > > For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg.

> He

> > > remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> > >

> > > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT)

> and

> > > I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not

> been

> > > able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid

> in his

> > > thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and

> I

> > > have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are

> autistic),

> > > the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of

> these

> > > disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru

> work.

> > > Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO

> > > connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that

> this

> > > is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute

> to

> > > his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> > > kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable,

> and I

> > > am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the

> extra

> > > needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> > > emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> > > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> > > connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought

> over

> > > time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could

> trust

> > > me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him,

> but

> > > surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie

> has

> > > happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to

> meet his

> > > emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I

> would

> > > like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely

> devoid

> > > of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS

> to

> > > him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> > > anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his

> company.

> > > ????

> > >

> > > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his

> issues

> > > are the very thing that creates it.

> > >

> > > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of

> nada-to

> > > a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful,

> > > totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just

> feel

> > > that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and

> life is

> > > getting increasingly difficult.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I've been researching av (avoidant) pd lately. Seems like a real serious

problem.

----------

Please excuse any typos or terseness, this message was sent from a mobile

device.

Re: picking " wrong " partner due to upbringing?

I have considered it. There are some things that fit, and some that really

really don't. I thinking some kind of attachment or avoidance disorder since he

has NO feelings towards most people or situations. He does like me, but in a

very limited and rule oriented way.

>

> >

> >

> > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> > right direction to find more info....

> >

> > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> > since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking

> > for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not

> > stealing the spotlight 24/7.

> >

> > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior

> > to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> > flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate

> > and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> > unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of

> > partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me feel

> > crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> > statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> > grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a movie.

> > (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> > reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father was a

> > raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I wanted

> > without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air, even

> > if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

> > For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

> > remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> >

> > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT) and

> > I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not been

> > able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in his

> > thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I

> > have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic),

> > the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these

> > disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru work.

> > Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO

> > connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that this

> > is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute to

> > his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> > kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I

> > am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra

> > needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> > emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> > connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over

> > time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust

> > me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but

> > surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has

> > happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to meet his

> > emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I would

> > like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely devoid

> > of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to

> > him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> > anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his company.

> > ????

> >

> > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues

> > are the very thing that creates it.

> >

> > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of nada-to

> > a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful,

> > totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just feel

> > that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life is

> > getting increasingly difficult.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Asperger's - I thought the exact same thing.

On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 1:48 PM, Millicent Kunstler <

millicentkunstler@...> wrote:

> Hi,

>

> I did the same thing as you regarding partner for the most part. Maybe your

> husband has Aspergers?

>

> On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 10:29 AM, my4fireflies <my4fireflies@...

> >wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> > right direction to find more info....

> >

> > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> > since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking

> > for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is

> not

> > stealing the spotlight 24/7.

> >

> > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior

> > to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> > flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I

> ate

> > and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> > unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of

> > partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me

> feel

> > crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> > statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> > grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a

> movie.

> > (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> > reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father

> was a

> > raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I wanted

> > without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air,

> even

> > if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little

> disconcerting.

> > For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

> > remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> >

> > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT)

> and

> > I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not

> been

> > able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in

> his

> > thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I

> > have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic),

> > the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these

> > disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru

> work.

> > Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO

> > connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that

> this

> > is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute

> to

> > his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> > kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and

> I

> > am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the

> extra

> > needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> > emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> > connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought

> over

> > time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could

> trust

> > me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but

> > surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has

> > happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to meet

> his

> > emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I

> would

> > like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely

> devoid

> > of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to

> > him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> > anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his company.

> > ????

> >

> > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues

> > are the very thing that creates it.

> >

> > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of

> nada-to

> > a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful,

> > totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just

> feel

> > that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life

> is

> > getting increasingly difficult.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I may have cracked the case afterall. He has all but one of the characteristics

of schizoid personality disorder. It is usu caused by child abuse. He was

completely emotionally neglected and occasionally physically neglected and left

in the care of his older brother. His bro is only 2 yrs older, was VERY

physically abusive with him (even stabbed him once " as a joke " .) And yet his mom

STILL left him alone with his bro for days at a time. His brotherhas aways been

ill (iwent to elementary and middl school with his bro and feared him greatly)

he most likely has antisocial pd or schizoid typal disorder or something of the

sort.

Now please understand I AM NOT diagnosing my dh or his bro. Just looking for

info to point my dh in the direction of receiving help. I want to save my

marriage. My dh is so dsconnected from life that he is barely aware there is a

problem...even tho I hav shared my feelings and concerns manytimes before. (Pls

excuse typos...sent from droid)

> >

> > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

right direction to find more info....

> >

> > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC since

Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking for drama,

but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not stealing the

spotlight 24/7.

> >

> > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior to

meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of flamboyant

narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate and wore),

treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with unfaithfulness, lies,

abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of partners was similar to how

nada treated me, they were able to make me feel crazy and manipulate reality

constantly and nada backed them up with statements like " why are you even with

her? She's such a bitch! " or grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my

bf and watching a movie. (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total

opposite. Quiet, reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my

father was a raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I

wanted without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air,

even if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> >

> > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT) and

I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not been

able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in his

thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I have

been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic), the house,

live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these disabilities means

3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru work. Most of our

conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO connection to the

children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that this is his life and seems

completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute to

his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four kids....I'm

lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I am completely

overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra needs of my oldest

two, run a household alone, and referee between my emtionally crippled husband

and my socially challenged children.

> > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over time

it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust me. I also

thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but surely he could

connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has happened. If I hadn't

had children with him I may have been able to meet his emotional needs or

designed a life that required very little of him. I would like to try to figure

out if there is a name for someone completely devoid of emotion, attachment, and

coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to him, no thoughts of the future, no

responsibility for the outcome of anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a

real star in his company. ????

> >

> > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues are

the very thing that creates it.

> >

> > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of nada-to

a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful, totally

loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just feel that my ASD

13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life is getting

increasingly difficult.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Maybe you could talk with his doctor about your concerns--and kudos to you

for working hard to save your marriage I think counseling will be

extremely beneficial for you and especially him.

He has a wonderful wife, and your kids have a great mother, and I hope that

things work out for you!

>

>

> I may have cracked the case afterall. He has all but one of the

> characteristics of schizoid personality disorder. It is usu caused by child

> abuse. He was completely emotionally neglected and occasionally physically

> neglected and left in the care of his older brother. His bro is only 2 yrs

> older, was VERY physically abusive with him (even stabbed him once " as a

> joke " .) And yet his mom STILL left him alone with his bro for days at a

> time. His brotherhas aways been ill (iwent to elementary and middl school

> with his bro and feared him greatly) he most likely has antisocial pd or

> schizoid typal disorder or something of the sort.

> Now please understand I AM NOT diagnosing my dh or his bro. Just looking

> for info to point my dh in the direction of receiving help. I want to save

> my marriage. My dh is so dsconnected from life that he is barely aware there

> is a problem...even tho I hav shared my feelings and concerns manytimes

> before. (Pls excuse typos...sent from droid)

>

>

> > >

> > > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> right direction to find more info....

> > >

> > > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking

> for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not

> stealing the spotlight 24/7.

> > >

> > > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is

> prior to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate

> and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of

> partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me feel

> crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a movie.

> (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father was a

> raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I wanted

> without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air, even

> if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

> For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg.

> He remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> > >

> > > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT)

> and I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not

> been able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid

> in his thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work

> and I have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are

> autistic), the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all

> of these disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are

> thru work. Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely

> NO connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that

> this is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute

> to his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I

> am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra

> needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> > > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over

> time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust

> me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but

> surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has

> happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to meet his

> emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I would

> like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely devoid

> of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to

> him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his company.

> ????

> > >

> > > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his

> issues are the very thing that creates it.

> > >

> > > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of

> nada-to a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly

> faithful, totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I

> just feel that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now

> and life is getting increasingly difficult.

> > >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I wrote this in an email to my cousin, who is also a KO. Context: I was doing

something in front of a lot of people and there was a ton of chaos around me. I

specifically asked a friend (I'll call him Bob) to come. For whatever reason, I

needed him there. We aren't super close, but he is very quiet and extremely

reserved.

Anyway, I wrote this: I want Bob there because I find a great deal of comfort

in an emotionally subdued person. That is peaceful to me. I wonder if that is

because my " antennae " with people's emotions are so frickin' fine tuned.

Before I continue, let me say my experience isn't necessarily your experience.

I'm not suggesting your husband is any of these things. I just tell my story to

offer a perspective, validate you, and answer your question. (Yes, I picked the

wrong partner due to upbringing).

Nada is like a sickening emotional roller-coaster all the time. Histrionic

personality disorder should be her middle name. When I met the guy I married,

he was incredibly comforting. Calm, quiet, with no radical mood shifts.

Sadly, he is also highly NPD/BPD. I just didn't pick up on it because he is

dangerously covert. I realized later that he was the " best " of both worlds--I

got to stay comfortable in the BPD world I was accustomed to and also feel

" peace " and " acceptance " because he was never overt with his abuse. Where there

was legitimate blankness in him, I assumed care and kindness and acceptance.

Whoa, was I ever wrong! He is a dark, hateful, and incredibly destructive

person. All behind a pretty face and a quiet, calm, well-groomed persona.

Trying to get free from him almost cost me my life. He never had to lay a hand

on me or speak ugly names or attack overtly. His abuse was so subtle I could

never pin it down or even know it was real. I just knew I sunk into a deep

depression, started having panic attacks, PTSD, was terrified all the time, and

terrified he might leave. (Classic Stockholm's syndrome, where I had bonded

with my " kidnapper " ). He used psychological warfare tactics as naturally as he

breathed. And he recruited people and situations (including a marriage

counselor) to do his gaslighting and abuse for him. Thank God he finally left

and filed for divorce.

Again, I AM NOT suggesting this is your husband--this is my experience, and it

certainly may not be yours.

I just wanted to affirm that yes, growing up in a BPD household absolutely does

affect the partner we choose. And sometimes that goes really poorly.

Overall, I want to encourage you in whatever decision you make. Marriage is a

big deal, and when you have kids you especially need to take it seriously. No

one knows that more than I do! If you are going to therapy, good for you! You

owe it to yourself and to your kids to do everything possible to get the bottom

of what is really going on.

Also, some unsolicited advice (which you are free to ignore if it doesn't

resonate with you) from a war-worn perspective: make sure you have support that

is there for you and only you. You'll need a therapist on your side through

this if you're a KO--otherwise, there are too many triggers and traps you could

fall in to. Learn to advocate for yourself. (Hence the help from your own,

personal therapist). Read the book " Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling

Men " by Lundy. If there are abuse issues, you'll know what they are and how to

combat them. If there are not abuse issues, that book will confirm how

" fixable " this may be!

Wow. That was longer than I intended.

Just know you have support here. I don't know what your path is, but I am

confident you have the " stuff " to overcome it.

Blessings,

Karla

>

> >

> >

> > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> > right direction to find more info....

> >

> > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> > since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking

> > for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not

> > stealing the spotlight 24/7.

> >

> > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior

> > to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> > flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate

> > and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> > unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of

> > partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me feel

> > crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> > statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> > grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a movie.

> > (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> > reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father was a

> > raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I wanted

> > without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air, even

> > if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

> > For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

> > remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> >

> > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT) and

> > I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not been

> > able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in his

> > thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I

> > have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic),

> > the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these

> > disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru work.

> > Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO

> > connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that this

> > is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute to

> > his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> > kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I

> > am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra

> > needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> > emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> > connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over

> > time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust

> > me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but

> > surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has

> > happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to meet his

> > emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I would

> > like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely devoid

> > of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to

> > him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> > anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his company.

> > ????

> >

> > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues

> > are the very thing that creates it.

> >

> > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of nada-to

> > a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful,

> > totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just feel

> > that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life is

> > getting increasingly difficult.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Fireflies:

My experience is similar to Karla's, although I never married. I have had a few

long, committed relationships. My nada is probably a classic. I don't mean to

be cruel here but that grey gardens/what every happened to baby jane environment

is very, very familiar to me. Creepy. My nada dies her hair bright red (used to

be platinum blond), her make-up is thickly applied and her lipstick always puts

an imprint on my cheek. She talks in a high sing-song voice, really loudly. No

room for any other opinions. I wanted desperately to get away from all the

dramachaospaniccrazy nonsense when I was younger. Instead, I did all the work

she didn't want to do, to try to please her. So I believe that's why I have

always been initially attracted to very QUIET, SHY shy partners who have some

underlying disorder not unlike my mother's (and father, who I believe is a

narcissist.) I only realized this very recently. I take on this " helper " role,

but usually my partner reveals their sarcastic, critical, controlling, low

self-esteem persona which is so familiar to me...it was somewhat of a relief,

strangely, to see this. I thought, oh! This is the reason this is happening.

It's familiar.

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Wed, March 2, 2011 9:22:48 AM

Subject: Re: picking " wrong " partner due to upbringing?

I wrote this in an email to my cousin, who is also a KO. Context: I was doing

something in front of a lot of people and there was a ton of chaos around me. I

specifically asked a friend (I'll call him Bob) to come. For whatever reason, I

needed him there. We aren't super close, but he is very quiet and extremely

reserved.

Anyway, I wrote this: I want Bob there because I find a great deal of comfort

in an emotionally subdued person. That is peaceful to me. I wonder if that is

because my " antennae " with people's emotions are so frickin' fine tuned.

Before I continue, let me say my experience isn't necessarily your experience.

I'm not suggesting your husband is any of these things. I just tell my story to

offer a perspective, validate you, and answer your question. (Yes, I picked the

wrong partner due to upbringing).

Nada is like a sickening emotional roller-coaster all the time. Histrionic

personality disorder should be her middle name. When I met the guy I married,

he was incredibly comforting. Calm, quiet, with no radical mood shifts.

Sadly, he is also highly NPD/BPD. I just didn't pick up on it because he is

dangerously covert. I realized later that he was the " best " of both worlds--I

got to stay comfortable in the BPD world I was accustomed to and also feel

" peace " and " acceptance " because he was never overt with his abuse. Where there

was legitimate blankness in him, I assumed care and kindness and acceptance.

Whoa, was I ever wrong! He is a dark, hateful, and incredibly destructive

person. All behind a pretty face and a quiet, calm, well-groomed persona.

Trying to get free from him almost cost me my life. He never had to lay a hand

on me or speak ugly names or attack overtly. His abuse was so subtle I could

never pin it down or even know it was real. I just knew I sunk into a deep

depression, started having panic attacks, PTSD, was terrified all the time, and

terrified he might leave. (Classic Stockholm's syndrome, where I had bonded

with my " kidnapper " ). He used psychological warfare tactics as naturally as he

breathed. And he recruited people and situations (including a marriage

counselor) to do his gaslighting and abuse for him. Thank God he finally left

and filed for divorce.

Again, I AM NOT suggesting this is your husband--this is my experience, and it

certainly may not be yours.

I just wanted to affirm that yes, growing up in a BPD household absolutely does

affect the partner we choose. And sometimes that goes really poorly.

Overall, I want to encourage you in whatever decision you make. Marriage is a

big deal, and when you have kids you especially need to take it seriously. No

one knows that more than I do! If you are going to therapy, good for you! You

owe it to yourself and to your kids to do everything possible to get the bottom

of what is really going on.

Also, some unsolicited advice (which you are free to ignore if it doesn't

resonate with you) from a war-worn perspective: make sure you have support that

is there for you and only you. You'll need a therapist on your side through

this if you're a KO--otherwise, there are too many triggers and traps you could

fall in to. Learn to advocate for yourself. (Hence the help from your own,

personal therapist). Read the book " Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling

Men " by Lundy. If there are abuse issues, you'll know what they are and how to

combat them. If there are not abuse issues, that book will confirm how

" fixable " this may be!

Wow. That was longer than I intended.

Just know you have support here. I don't know what your path is, but I am

confident you have the " stuff " to overcome it.

Blessings,

Karla

>

> >

> >

> > Wondering if anyone has had a similar experience or can point me in the

> > right direction to find more info....

> >

> > Now that all the crud with nada has been more or less squared away (NC

> > since Oct=BLISS!!!!) I am examining other aspects of my life. Not looking

> > for drama, but some things are moving to the forefront now that nada is not

> > stealing the spotlight 24/7.

> >

> > I very purposely and deliberately picked my partner. What I mean is prior

> > to meeting my dh there was a lot of drama with nada AND my choice of

> > flamboyant narcissistic partners who called all the shots(down to what I ate

> > and wore), treated me like crap, and made for a lot of drama with

> > unfaithfulness, lies, abusive language, manipulations, etc. My choice of

> > partners was similar to how nada treated me, they were able to make me feel

> > crazy and manipulate reality constantly and nada backed them up with

> > statements like " why are you even with her? She's such a bitch! " or

> > grounding me to my room, then hanging out with my bf and watching a movie.

> > (I was young 16-21) When I met dh he was the total opposite. Quiet,

> > reserved, hated being the center of attention, rarely drank (my father was a

> > raging alcoholic for 25+ yrs) and let ME do pretty much whatever I wanted

> > without criticisms or manipulation. He was like a breath of fresh air, even

> > if his lack of converstation or repsonse to me was a little disconcerting.

> > For the 1st time in my life I felt free to just BE.

> > Fast forward two years, very much to our surprise we find out I am pg. He

> > remains withdrawn....through 4 children and 13 years of marriage.

> >

> > I am pretty much compelely alone in this relationship. He works (A LOT) and

> > I am left alone to do EVERYTHING for the house and children. I have not been

> > able to have a job for our entire relationship because he is so rigid in his

> > thinking that all he thinks about is work, work, work and more work and I

> > have been unable to find a way to take care of the kids (2 are autistic),

> > the house, live in a rural area, AND work. My plate is full-all of these

> > disabilities means 3x the work for me. All of his friendships are thru work.

> > Most of our conversations are about his work. He has absolutely NO

> > connection to the children-and admits it. He is filled with rage that this

> > is his life and seems completely unable to cope with our situation.

> > He had a somewhat traumatic and neglectful childhood, which I attribute to

> > his emtional disconnect. But now, nearly 15 years later, and four

> > kids....I'm lost. My children are suffering, my husband is miserable, and I

> > am completely overwhelmed trying to meet the needs of my 4 kids, the extra

> > needs of my oldest two, run a household alone, and referee between my

> > emtionally crippled husband and my socially challenged children.

> > I truly did not understand that a person could be completely DEVOID of

> > connection to people. I saw my husband as slightly aloof, but thought over

> > time it would get better as we became closer and found that he could trust

> > me. I also thought that he may have issues with those that HURT him, but

> > surely he could connect with an innocent baby... Instead the oppostie has

> > happened. If I hadn't had children with him I may have been able to meet his

> > emotional needs or designed a life that required very little of him. I would

> > like to try to figure out if there is a name for someone completely devoid

> > of emotion, attachment, and coping skills. His just lets life HAPPENS to

> > him, no thoughts of the future, no responsibility for the outcome of

> > anything, no motivation-except for work-he's a real star in his company.

> > ????

> >

> > Picking him was to REDUCE the drama I had in my life, but now his issues

> > are the very thing that creates it.

> >

> > Has anyone picked a partner like this? One that was the OPPOSITE of nada-to

> > a fault? Is there any way to stay married? He is incredibly faithful,

> > totally loyal to me, and a decent provider, so he's not all bad. I just feel

> > that my ASD 13 yos and he are emotionally at the same level now and life is

> > getting increasingly difficult.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, can I relate to this. I've not married and likely never will, but the man

I was involved with for more or less 10 years fit the profile you are

discussing. He was reserved, quiet, elegant even. I could get my feelings

out, rant about something and he'd listen (or so I thought)...he felt like an

anchoring rock. Before that I always got involved with people where I was the

rock, and they sure weren't elegant with all that belching the alphabet and

tacky shirts (lol) - I was the one in a solid nurturing type female role. But

this guy seemed to demand so little from me. I didn't feel the burden of

dealing with his excessive emotions or feel smothered by him.

In time I came to learn that his silences were not filled with listening

compassion. They were filled with disinterest at best, disdain, and criticism

of me. This came out in super-covert passive-aggressive moves. I learned that

he wasn't undemonstrative yet rich with love inside like I hoped - the love

wasn't ever in there to give. I learned that his restraint and elegance hid a

cold heart and he took advantage of my willingness to wait and try and try to

warm him up. He also felt superior to me which fed is narcissistic ego - I was

the frumpy one he was gracing with his presence while he waited for his trophy

wife to come along. I think in his mind *I* was the one belching the alphabet.

Millicent, your situation sounds really tough. My first thought reading about

your guy is that he might have Asperger's. Especially since two of your

children have autism. Is this possible? Based on my experience with my guy

above I'd say the most important thing is to determine what's in his heart - is

there real love in it for you? for your kids? If there is therapy and efforts

to change may help, if there is not you are best away. If this real love is in

his heart, there has to be ways for him to express it to you and your children

that you can feel and know - otherwise it's all moot.

Good luck,