Re: A victory and a defeat

[Guest guest]

Hugs to you... .

>

> I saw nada's T for the second time today. At the first session, I felt like I

was kind of having to clue her into a lot of truths she had not heard, but I got

the impression that she agreed with my diagnosis of nada being BPD. I think she

had figured out that nada was teetering on the edge of reality, but she'd

expected me to be equally or more nuts myself based upon what she had heard.

After our first session, she requested to see me again individually. Nada fought

tooth and nail to be included in the session- even going around the T to email

me and ask if she could join us, but the T held firm and said she needed to see

me one more time individually to decide where to go from here. Well, in between

session 1, Nada's interaction with the T, and my session 2, the T had figured it

all out. It was like we were speaking the same language with this session. She

validated so many of my perceptions not only about nada, but about my sister

(who won't have anything to do with my while nada and I are NC). It felt so

incredibly good to have someone get it that hardly even knows me or my story

from my angle! That was definitely a small victory for me.

>

> Now, on the reverse side of that the T was very honest with me and told me the

possibility of having a healthy relationship with nada did not look good... She

said Nada will not deal well with limited communication even if we manipulate

her into thinking it's her idea. She also pointedly told me that I should not

ever be alone with nada. Wow...the T is actually NADA'S T, and yet she was

insightful enough to know that I'm not the crazy one! So, we may try this

" limited contact " thing, but the T and I are both pretty certain we'll be back

to NC before long and probably for good. The T told me that nada will never be

able to change- period. I guess this really saddens me... It was one thing for

my T, who doesn't even know nada to say there was no hope for change or

improvement, but it's another for nada's own T, the only person who's ever

worked with her and gotten at least partway into her head to tell me there's no

hope. That little girl inside of me has kept the hope alive, but I almost feel

today it's really about to die, and for good. It feels more real today than ever

despite having not even heard her voice in 9 months now. The death of hope is a

sad thing, but better I accept it and deal with it now than keep trying to shove

a square peg into a round hole...

>

> Thanks for listening.

>

[Guest guest]

(((((Anglslh)))))

I think I know what you mean. When my Sister told me the horrible, ugly, mean,

untrue things that nada had said to Sister about Sister, and about me, and about

Sister's son, back about 3 years ago now, it was as though my Sister had told me

that our mother had died.

That was the death of hope, I guess, or perhaps the death of the illusion that

I'd carried for my whole life that my mother did, underneath it all, in spite of

all the verbal and physical abuse, somehow actually love me. What nada said

that day killed that illusion. It was the proverbial " last straw. " Nobody who

actually loved me and knew me, and knew my heart could possibly think such an

ugly thing about me.

So that day I buried that illusion, and it felt like a punch in the stomach,

like a death, and I mourned and grieved like it was a physical death, for days.

I have been in virtually No Contact with my nada ( " nada " = not a mom) ever

since.

I think that is awesome that your nada's therapist is being so open and honest

with you. A very similar situation is what allowed my Sister to feel the

" absolution " or " permission " to let go of the inappropriate feelings of guilt

and responsibility that she was feeling towards our nada. The therapist that

our nada was seeing just happened to be the adult child of a borderline

pd/narcissistic pd mother, so he understood the dynamic quite well. The

therapist, a psychologist, was able to let Sister know that it was OK and in

Sister's best interest to stop trying to " rescue " our nada, and OK to allow more

emotional and physical detachment from nada for Sister's own mental health.

Anyway, I totally empathize with where you are coming from.

-Annie

>

> I saw nada's T for the second time today. At the first session, I felt like I

was kind of having to clue her into a lot of truths she had not heard, but I got

the impression that she agreed with my diagnosis of nada being BPD. I think she

had figured out that nada was teetering on the edge of reality, but she'd

expected me to be equally or more nuts myself based upon what she had heard.

After our first session, she requested to see me again individually. Nada fought

tooth and nail to be included in the session- even going around the T to email

me and ask if she could join us, but the T held firm and said she needed to see

me one more time individually to decide where to go from here. Well, in between

session 1, Nada's interaction with the T, and my session 2, the T had figured it

all out. It was like we were speaking the same language with this session. She

validated so many of my perceptions not only about nada, but about my sister

(who won't have anything to do with my while nada and I are NC). It felt so

incredibly good to have someone get it that hardly even knows me or my story

from my angle! That was definitely a small victory for me.

>

> Now, on the reverse side of that the T was very honest with me and told me the

possibility of having a healthy relationship with nada did not look good... She

said Nada will not deal well with limited communication even if we manipulate

her into thinking it's her idea. She also pointedly told me that I should not

ever be alone with nada. Wow...the T is actually NADA'S T, and yet she was

insightful enough to know that I'm not the crazy one! So, we may try this

" limited contact " thing, but the T and I are both pretty certain we'll be back

to NC before long and probably for good. The T told me that nada will never be

able to change- period. I guess this really saddens me... It was one thing for

my T, who doesn't even know nada to say there was no hope for change or

improvement, but it's another for nada's own T, the only person who's ever

worked with her and gotten at least partway into her head to tell me there's no

hope. That little girl inside of me has kept the hope alive, but I almost feel

today it's really about to die, and for good. It feels more real today than ever

despite having not even heard her voice in 9 months now. The death of hope is a

sad thing, but better I accept it and deal with it now than keep trying to shove

a square peg into a round hole...

>

> Thanks for listening.

>

[Guest guest]

I also understand this feeling. It really does feel like a total loss

(death?). I came to this conclusion when, after numerous attempts at

setting boundaries with how nada was expected to behave around my young

daughter, she trampled every one. Nada demanded to have her right as a

grandnada to unsupervised, overnight visits without respecting our

boundaries. I decided at that point that if she could not consider the

health of an innocent child that she would never get it. It has been about

one year and the only contact she has made has been mail addressed to my

daughters (I had a second daughter that nada has never has a relationship

with). I grieved for quite awhile and still have days where I question if

she can act differently or if I am really the one with the problem. I know,

though, that I cannot keep my babies safe from her unless I continue to keep

NC.

BB