it seems impossible to help from the outside

[Guest guest]

A friend of a friend is strange. My friend has complained to me about her

often. I met the friend of my friend on occasions, and met her young son as

well, who has been diagnosed with a lot of different health conditions. My

friend says she suffers from Munchhausen disease (the mother gets her whole

identity from her child being so sick and needy). We both doubt that the child

has anything wrong.

My friend has ceased to communicate with this other friend, because some very

strange things happened that scared her.

We recently talked about this family, and we realized in our conversation that

the mother probably has BP. I did not see it before, because my nada is mainly

a Witch (a rager) with waif tendencies. This woman seems to be more of a Queen

with Waif tendencies. Her behavior looks really different than that of my nada.

We don't know what we could possible to do to help the child. We have

brainstormed but can't come up with any possible way to help him. Maybe the

intention to " help " is misguided. Maybe there is absolutely nothing we can do.

We could call child services, but how to prove abuse?

We can't contact him, because the BP would make sure he didn't receive mail,

calls, and he doesn't have his own phone.

[Guest guest]

Factitious disorder by by proxy (Munchausen's by proxy) is a very controversial

and difficult-to-prove condition.

Here's an excerpt from an article about it at Wikipedia:

Warning signs of the disorder include:

A child who has one or more medical problems that do not respond to treatment or

that follow an unusual course that is persistent, puzzling and unexplained.

Physical or laboratory findings that are highly unusual, discrepant with

history, or physically or clinically impossible.

A parent who appears to be medically knowledgeable and/or fascinated with

medical details and hospital gossip, appears to enjoy the hospital environment,

and expresses interest in the details of other patients' problems.

A highly attentive parent who is reluctant to leave their child's side and who

themselves seem to require constant attention.

A parent who appears to be unusually calm in the face of serious difficulties in

their child's medical course while being highly supportive and encouraging of

the physician or one who is angry, devalues staff, and demands further

intervention, more procedures, second opinions, and transfers to other, more

sophisticated, facilities.

The suspected parent may work in the health care field themselves or profess

interest in a health-related job.

The signs and symptoms of a child's illness do not occur in the parent's absence

(hospitalization and careful monitoring may be necessary to establish this

causal relationship).

A family history of similar or unexplained illness or death in a sibling.

A parent with symptoms similar to their child's own medical problems or an

illness history that itself is puzzling and unusual.

A suspected emotionally distant relationship between parents; the spouse often

fails to visit the patient and has little contact with physicians even when the

child is hospitalized with serious illness.

A parent who reports dramatic, negative events, such as house fires, burglaries,

or car accidents, that affect them and their family while their child is

undergoing treatment.

A parent who seems to have an insatiable need for adulation or who makes

self-serving efforts for public acknowledgment of their abilities.

Prevalence by gender

One study showed that in over 90 percent of cases of MSbP, the mother is the

abuser.[26] In other cases, the MSbP abuser is often another female caregiver.

Fathers have been the perpetrators in a handful of professional reports. The

female preponderance may be attributed to socialization patterns that encourage

females to seek the sympathy and assistance of others. Neuropsychological

testing of perpetrators has shown either normal results or nonspecific

abnormalities.

MSbP may also be attributed to another prevalent socialization pattern, which

places females in the primary care-taking role. A psychodynamic model of this

kind of maternal abuse exists.[27]

These symptoms may be more prevalent in the parents of those with a learning

difficulty or mental incapacity, and as such the apparent patient could in fact

be a grown adult. "

***

Me personally, I think its better to err on the side of being over-cautious. In

my own personal opinion its better to report suspected Munchausens-by-Proxy to

Child Protective Services and be wrong, than to not report it and expose a

helpless child to more horrific parental abuse.

But that's just me. You must decide for yourself what feels right to you.

-Annie

>

> A friend of a friend is strange. My friend has complained to me about her

often. I met the friend of my friend on occasions, and met her young son as

well, who has been diagnosed with a lot of different health conditions. My

friend says she suffers from Munchhausen disease (the mother gets her whole

identity from her child being so sick and needy). We both doubt that the child

has anything wrong.

>

> My friend has ceased to communicate with this other friend, because some very

strange things happened that scared her.

>

> We recently talked about this family, and we realized in our conversation that

the mother probably has BP. I did not see it before, because my nada is mainly

a Witch (a rager) with waif tendencies. This woman seems to be more of a Queen

with Waif tendencies. Her behavior looks really different than that of my nada.

>

> We don't know what we could possible to do to help the child. We have

brainstormed but can't come up with any possible way to help him. Maybe the

intention to " help " is misguided. Maybe there is absolutely nothing we can do.

>

> We could call child services, but how to prove abuse?

> We can't contact him, because the BP would make sure he didn't receive mail,

calls, and he doesn't have his own phone.

>

[Guest guest]

Three thoughts. First, I sometimes wonder how my life would have been different

if someone had reported my parents to CPS. There were many people who suspected

or knew about the hell that was my home and I still have angry feelings about

them for not stepping up.

Second, as a teacher and required reporter, that means I have to report if I

even SUSPECT abuse or neglect. (I wish everyone would think of themselves as

required reporters!) I can tell you that the process is simple, you can probably

do it online and they will not tell the person who made the report. They will

investigate and do follow-ups. You can continue to report as often as new things

happen.

Third, I have noticed that after being investigated, some parents change their

behavior for the better. Not always, but sometimes. I even had one family THaNK

me for making the report because they were glad to know someone was looking out

for their kid. (They knew it was me bc I was the only adult the child talked

to.) The abuser has been removed from the home and they've made a lot of other

changes.

You have to follow your conscience, but as someone who doesn't get to follow my

conscience on the matter, just the law, I say report it.

> >

> > A friend of a friend is strange. My friend has complained to me about her

often. I met the friend of my friend on occasions, and met her young son as

well, who has been diagnosed with a lot of different health conditions. My

friend says she suffers from Munchhausen disease (the mother gets her whole

identity from her child being so sick and needy). We both doubt that the child

has anything wrong.

> >

> > My friend has ceased to communicate with this other friend, because some

very strange things happened that scared her.

> >

> > We recently talked about this family, and we realized in our conversation

that the mother probably has BP. I did not see it before, because my nada is

mainly a Witch (a rager) with waif tendencies. This woman seems to be more of a

Queen with Waif tendencies. Her behavior looks really different than that of my

nada.

> >

> > We don't know what we could possible to do to help the child. We have

brainstormed but can't come up with any possible way to help him. Maybe the

intention to " help " is misguided. Maybe there is absolutely nothing we can do.

> >

> > We could call child services, but how to prove abuse?

> > We can't contact him, because the BP would make sure he didn't receive mail,

calls, and he doesn't have his own phone.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

It never occurred to me to report anything, and years later, I knew that if I

did, no one would have believed me. You see all those forensic shows where the

police officer or the pastor or other upstanding citizen was abusing their

families, but no one would believe it, as the things they did in public were

wonderful and good. That was the way things were with my stepmom. She has

lived in the same community for over 60 years, and everyone sees her as a

wonderful, Christian person. And, if an adult had believed me, all she had to

do was say that I was angry about my parents divorcing and my dad remarrying

her, and I was taking it all out on her. It is a very logical and believable

explanation, and would have been accepted without question. That's why I

really don't talk about the situation with people I knew back in high school.Â

I don't talk about the situation with very many people at all. Â

JanetÂ

 Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own

understanding.

 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

 Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.

 It shall be health to thy navel, and marrow to thy bones.

Proverbs 3:5-8

From:kimberj103

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Saturday, June 4, 2011 7:16 AM

Subject: Re: it seems impossible to help from the outside

Â

Three thoughts. First, I sometimes wonder how my life would have been different

if someone had reported my parents to CPS. There were many people who suspected

or knew about the hell that was my home and I still have angry feelings about

them for not stepping up.

Second, as a teacher and required reporter, that means I have to report if I

even SUSPECT abuse or neglect. (I wish everyone would think of themselves as

required reporters!) I can tell you that the process is simple, you can probably

do it online and they will not tell the person who made the report. They will

investigate and do follow-ups. You can continue to report as often as new things

happen.

Third, I have noticed that after being investigated, some parents change their

behavior for the better. Not always, but sometimes. I even had one family THaNK

me for making the report because they were glad to know someone was looking out

for their kid. (They knew it was me bc I was the only adult the child talked

to.) The abuser has been removed from the home and they've made a lot of other

changes.

You have to follow your conscience, but as someone who doesn't get to follow my

conscience on the matter, just the law, I say report it.

> >

> > A friend of a friend is strange. My friend has complained to me about her

often. I met the friend of my friend on occasions, and met her young son as

well, who has been diagnosed with a lot of different health conditions. My

friend says she suffers from Munchhausen disease (the mother gets her whole

identity from her child being so sick and needy). We both doubt that the child

has anything wrong.

> >

> > My friend has ceased to communicate with this other friend, because some

very strange things happened that scared her.

> >

> > We recently talked about this family, and we realized in our conversation

that the mother probably has BP. I did not see it before, because my nada is

mainly a Witch (a rager) with waif tendencies. This woman seems to be more of a

Queen with Waif tendencies. Her behavior looks really different than that of my

nada.

> >

> > We don't know what we could possible to do to help the child. We have

brainstormed but can't come up with any possible way to help him. Maybe the

intention to " help " is misguided. Maybe there is absolutely nothing we can do.

> >

> > We could call child services, but how to prove abuse?

> > We can't contact him, because the BP would make sure he didn't receive mail,

calls, and he doesn't have his own phone.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Even if you do not or cannot report this family, little drops of love and

normalcy from people not PD can make a world of difference to a child growing up

in this. Imagine how you would have felt if some normal adult took you to visit

or babysat you, or made time for you in their day. You would have gotten a

window on normal life, and realized that not all parents are this way, and maybe

it wasn't just you.

So even if you can't report the parents, there may still be a lot you could do

to help.

--LL.