The drama triangle?

June 5, 2011

Hi gang,

My therapist has introduced me to the concept of the drama triangle, and

informed me that I am of course the rescuer and my waif nada is of course the

victim, and in our case my husband is the persecutor. (he is usally the one

that says the color is, in fact blue, when nada demands it is red and I am

trying to figure a way to let her think it is red even though of course it is

blue!)

It was absolutely fascinating to me to discover this system - it made soooo much

sense! Especially that in order to get off the triangle you have to STOP

playing your role, and when you do that, the others on the triangle will

immediately put you into the persecutor role. So I have to STOP playing the

rescuer, and as she said the hard part for me will be tolerating the tension

created by not rescuing. Ahhhhh, soooo true. My husband is perfectly happy

being the persecutor, and my nada thinks he somehow controls me or it is his

fault if I go against her, she cannot accept that I am not the golden child and

would have a mind of my own I guess!

Curious if anyone else has read about the dynamics of the triangle and if and

how it helped you in your recovery as a KO???

Thanks!!

*Star

June 5, 2011

It's a very interesting systems dynamics concept, here is an excerpt from the

Wiki that gives a basic idea...

" TrianglesMain article: Triangulation (psychology)

In family systems theory, whenever two people have problems with each other, one

or both will " triangle in " a third member. Bowen emphasized people respond to

anxiety between each other by shifting the focus to a third person,

triangulation. In a triangle, two are on the inside and one is on the outside.

For example, rather than talk with her husband about and deal with her

frustration with him, a new mother might preoccupy herself with her new child.

In this case, the wife diminishes her anxiety by ignoring its source (the

relationship between her and her husband); the husband is on the outside and the

wife and child are on the inside.

Similarly, in the same situation, instead of talking with his wife about their

marriage and dealing with his frustration with her, the husband might spend more

time at work instead. He would thus be making work as the inside relationship

excluding his wife.

In either example, though anxiety is reduced, neither husband or wife resolve

the source of their anxiety.

Triangles usually have 2 individuals or entities in conflict, and another entity

or individual uninvolved with the conflict is brought in. When tension is not

high the relationship between the first two individuals is desirable. The two

original people of the relationship or conflict are the inside positions of the

triangle. The insiders bond when they prefer each other, but in the case of

conflict, another entity or individual (the outsider) is brought in by one of

the first individuals in effort to either defuse and avoid the situation or team

up against the other insider (see paragraph discussing high levels of tension).

The insiders may actively exclude the outsider when tensions are not low between

the insiders. Being excluded may provoke intense feelings of rejection and the

outsider works to get closer to one of the insiders.

Like musical chairs, the positions are not fixed. If mild to moderate tension

develops between the insiders, the most uncomfortable insider will move closer

to an outsider. The remaining original insider then switches places with the

outsider. The excluded insider becomes the new outsider and the original

outsider is now an insider. Predictably, the new outsider may move to restore

closeness with one of the current insiders.

At a high level of tension, the outside position becomes the most desirable. If

the insiders conflict severely, one insider opts for the outside position by

getting the current outsider to fight with the other insider. If the maneuvering

insider succeeds, he gains the more comfortable position of watching the other

two people fight. When the tension and conflict subside, the outsider will try

to regain an inside position.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murray_Bowen "

My Nada does this constantly. In every capacity she'll find, and attempt to

align, herself with a third person to pull weight against me. Always has,

always will.

My freedome from this nonsence came when I finally walked off. If I didn't hold

my role, as your therapist is suggesting, the triangle ceases to exist. Sure,

there was/is drama over it but really, if I'm not willingly emotionally and/or

physically present, I don't care and it just flows over me.

Took some time - and a lot of PRACTICE - to refrain from jumping back into my

role to ease the tension but I finally got to the point that I realized I would

rather be uncomfortable with doing something healthy for my own being than being

uncomfortable doing something unhealthy for my own being.

Nada hasn't stopped trying, GodBlessHerDedicationToSOMETHING, but she's finding

fewer and fewer 3rd corners to play a role...

You just have to make the decision.

Lynnette

>

> Hi gang,

>

> My therapist has introduced me to the concept of the drama triangle, and

informed me that I am of course the rescuer and my waif nada is of course the

victim, and in our case my husband is the persecutor. (he is usally the one

that says the color is, in fact blue, when nada demands it is red and I am

trying to figure a way to let her think it is red even though of course it is

blue!)

>

> It was absolutely fascinating to me to discover this system - it made soooo

much sense! Especially that in order to get off the triangle you have to STOP

playing your role, and when you do that, the others on the triangle will

immediately put you into the persecutor role. So I have to STOP playing the

rescuer, and as she said the hard part for me will be tolerating the tension

created by not rescuing. Ahhhhh, soooo true. My husband is perfectly happy

being the persecutor, and my nada thinks he somehow controls me or it is his

fault if I go against her, she cannot accept that I am not the golden child and

would have a mind of my own I guess!

>

> Curious if anyone else has read about the dynamics of the triangle and if and

how it helped you in your recovery as a KO???

>

> Thanks!!

> *Star

>

June 5, 2011

>> Took some time - and a lot of PRACTICE - to refrain from jumping back into my

role to ease the tension but I finally got to the point that I realized I would

rather be uncomfortable with doing something healthy for my own being than being

uncomfortable doing something unhealthy for my own being.

>

OMG, yes, this! Thank you Lynnette!! Now that nada has moved out (in a giant

drama of course) and we've been basically NC for a couple of weeks, I have

gotten a much clearer head. It reinforces my decision, to step away... from the

triangle... I had to go NC to even get in touch with my emotions.

I have witnessed some of the same patterns in my dealings in my business with

clients, but I really don't get sucked in and have managed not to get in trouble

there. I am not actually the rescuer type that I can tell, but the complication

of it being my mother really adds to my feelings of FOG. Add to it that all of

my grandparents have passed, my father died when I was 17, my amazing MIL died 5

years ago, and my DH doesn't talk to his fada... I end up feeling like I have to

do everything humanely (and beyond) possible to salvage my one parental

relationship!!! Ridiculous task. :-p Sigh.

Thanks again for the great quote.

*Star

June 5, 2011

Definitely see this happening with my nada, my husband and I (same roles).

Thanks for introducing the thread. Gives me some context for my interactions and

something to watch for!

> >> Took some time - and a lot of PRACTICE - to refrain from jumping back into

my role to ease the tension but I finally got to the point that I realized I

would rather be uncomfortable with doing something healthy for my own being than

being uncomfortable doing something unhealthy for my own being.

> >

>

> OMG, yes, this! Thank you Lynnette!! Now that nada has moved out (in a giant

drama of course) and we've been basically NC for a couple of weeks, I have

gotten a much clearer head. It reinforces my decision, to step away... from the

triangle... I had to go NC to even get in touch with my emotions.

>

> I have witnessed some of the same patterns in my dealings in my business with

clients, but I really don't get sucked in and have managed not to get in trouble

there. I am not actually the rescuer type that I can tell, but the complication

of it being my mother really adds to my feelings of FOG. Add to it that all of

my grandparents have passed, my father died when I was 17, my amazing MIL died 5

years ago, and my DH doesn't talk to his fada... I end up feeling like I have to

do everything humanely (and beyond) possible to salvage my one parental

relationship!!! Ridiculous task. :-p Sigh.

>

> Thanks again for the great quote.

>

> *Star

>

June 6, 2011

Wow your nada's like mine. Saaaame thing. If I made any independent decision,

she'd tell me what a puppet I was for my husband. How I couldn't make any

decisions apart from him. Now I get that she wanted me to continue being HER

puppet. She hated losing that gig!

I remember, way before being aware that my mother had serious psychological

issues, reading about triangulation. When I saw it described, I realized that

was my family.

The center of the triangle was my mother. No one could talk to my father, or

really anyone else, without her knowing what was said.

Even now, she will ask me in an accusatory tone if I have spoken to my brother

during the week. Kind of, as if doing so would be going behind her back.

I'd say my triangle was much like yours, Star. I was the rescuer, the pleaser,

the smoother-over. My mother, though controlling of all communication, was the

victim and hurt one.

She can take no responsibility for her feelings. It's everyone else's fault. If

I call her later than I said I would, " oh! you don't know the anguish I feel

when you don't call on time! My heart feels like I'm going to have an attack. "

I ignore her and tell her to have a good day. OR, " I can't help being so

worried. You know I'm the nervous type! " (after she's ripped someone's head off

for a small infraction)

The other day my daughter (6 years old) was upset with my husband and asked ME

to tell him how she felt. I sat her down and we had a good talk about how

important her very own feelings are to us. That I didn't want to try to describe

to dad how she herself was feeling, and that even if it was through a letter,

she should tell him. I was really glad I did that. I don't want to continue a

sick pattern.

Best wishes in recovering from rescuing, girl! You're on your way!

Fiona