Guest guest Posted October 12, 2011 Report Share Posted October 12, 2011 I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to rethink the whole thing through again. I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't make me sad. Eliza Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2011 Report Share Posted October 12, 2011 (((((Eliza))))) It is very sad to realize that your own mother does not have your best interests at heart and is actively attempting to undermine your self-confidence, your decisions, and your opportunities. Its just truly amazingly sad, but recognizing that reality for what it is, is a first step in overcoming it. My Sister told me a nearly identical revelation she had about our nada, who would make negative judgments about just about every major decision Sister shared with nada RE her plans to, for example, buy some land, design and build her own house, go back to college and finish her Bachelor's, then go for a Masters.... you name it: nada tried to discourage Sister from doing these things. Sister did them anyway; Sister could only conclude that our nada either thought Sister was incredibly stupid and couldn't be trusted with a lit match, or our nada was jealous and envious of Sister and was actually *trying* to sabotage her, treating her own daughter like a rival or like a possession. Sister stopped sharing really important things with our nada; like you (and me) my Sister realized nada was never encouraging or supportive, and although it broke Sister's heart, she decided it was better and safer to only have a very, very superficial / acquaintance-level relationship with our nada from that point on. The saddest part is that we have to figure this sad reality out for ourselves, from the very disadvantaged position of automatically trusting that our own mother loves us and underneath it all does have our best interests at heart... when in the case of a Cluster B mother can be far from reality. We human beings are hard-wired to trust and love our own parents, I think that's why it seems to take most of us a very long time, sometimes into middle age, to realize that the way our bpd or npd/hpd/aspd mothers treat us is not loving. Its damned hard to accept that our own mother or father (or both) does not actually care about us, or want the best for us, and may even be actively undermining our chances at a happy and fulfilling future. Unless there is a relatively sane, empathetic adult in our lives whom we can really trust because he or she really does have our best interest at heart, someone who can give us good advice and encouragement when we are still not-quite-adults... we children of Cluster B mothers (and fathers) are basically screwed. My philosophy is: better late figuring this out, than never. -Annie > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to rethink the whole thing through again. > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't make me sad. > > Eliza > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Eliza, It sounds like you are nothing like your nada and have done an amazing job standing on your own and recognizing her issues. That is a ton of work. Your journey is amazing as it stands, no regrets, no what ifs, you see the forest through the trees and have come out the other side stronger, wiser and for that you can celebrate and be proud. I wish you calm and peace with it all. > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't make me sad. > > > > Eliza > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Eliza, I relate SO much!!! During the course of my life when I made some hard decisions - like to not hang out any more with a group of friends who had stopped caring about academics and instead started smoking tons of week and f*cking in the back of my friends car ALL the time - what did my nada do? she called me a cold bitch and took my place as BFF to these friends. As an adult, when i filed for divorce after 8 horrible horrible years married to an avoidant, withdrawn man who DID NOT LIKE MY PERSONALITY - she called me a " cold bitch " and a slut. Even now when I chose not to invest in someone, and look for safe people I hear her voice saying " cold bitch. " Only a " cold bitch " would do that. I am learning to recognize it and shut it off. I think what she is really saying is " I'm the slimiest person you will ever meet. If you spend your life looking for safe people I will die alone. " And she will. I think she is also just trying to undermine and destroy me. Oh eff, why don't they just go join Gollum in that cave thing and look for the " precious " ring the rest of their lives? they are seriously that week of character, and yet that strong of a destructive force. Here's to fighting back, walking away and saving yourself!!! XOXO Girlscout > ** > > > Eliza, > It sounds like you are nothing like your nada and have done an amazing job > standing on your own and recognizing her issues. That is a ton of work. Your > journey is amazing as it stands, no regrets, no what ifs, you see the forest > through the trees and have come out the other side stronger, wiser and for > that you can celebrate and be proud. > I wish you calm and peace with it all. > > > > > > > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what > it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something > I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has > either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my > nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if > my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it > through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to > rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her > but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. > And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how > many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or > that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from > making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor > of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. > If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she > encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a > roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - > if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have > gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But > I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that > she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't > make me sad. > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 right now I'm so upset with what nada is doing, saying and putting my 7 year old son and I through I almost wish she would just drop dead and leave us all alone. ________________________________ To: WTOAdultChildren1 Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2011 10:24 AM Subject: Re: Re: the one who undermines me Eliza, I relate SO much!!! During the course of my life when I made some hard decisions - like to not hang out any more with a group of friends who had stopped caring about academics and instead started smoking tons of week and f*cking in the back of my friends car ALL the time - what did my nada do? she called me a cold bitch and took my place as BFF to these friends. As an adult, when i filed for divorce after 8 horrible horrible years married to an avoidant, withdrawn man who DID NOT LIKE MY PERSONALITY - she called me a " cold bitch " and a slut. Even now when I chose not to invest in someone, and look for safe people I hear her voice saying " cold bitch. " Only a " cold bitch " would do that. I am learning to recognize it and shut it off. I think what she is really saying is " I'm the slimiest person you will ever meet. If you spend your life looking for safe people I will die alone. " And she will. I think she is also just trying to undermine and destroy me. Oh eff, why don't they just go join Gollum in that cave thing and look for the " precious " ring the rest of their lives? they are seriously that week of character, and yet that strong of a destructive force. Here's to fighting back, walking away and saving yourself!!! XOXO Girlscout > ** > > > Eliza, > It sounds like you are nothing like your nada and have done an amazing job > standing on your own and recognizing her issues. That is a ton of work. Your > journey is amazing as it stands, no regrets, no what ifs, you see the forest > through the trees and have come out the other side stronger, wiser and for > that you can celebrate and be proud. > I wish you calm and peace with it all. > > > > > > > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what > it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something > I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has > either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my > nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if > my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it > through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to > rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her > but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. > And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how > many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or > that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from > making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor > of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. > If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she > encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a > roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - > if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have > gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But > I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that > she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't > make me sad. > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 ((((())))) Is Low Contact with Boundaries and Consequences not working for you? Is No Contact (either temporarily or permanently) an option for you? -Annie > > > > > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what > > it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something > > I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has > > either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my > > nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if > > my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it > > through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to > > rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her > > but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. > > And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how > > many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or > > that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from > > making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor > > of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. > > If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she > > encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a > > roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - > > if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have > > gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But > > I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that > > she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't > > make me sad. > > > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 a friend who also deals with a bpd parent emailed me this morning and gave me two options to use: mom, its unfortunate you feel the need to sell the house, please understand that I will no longer have as much time to spend with you as I would otherwise as I begin the process or go ahead if that's what you need to do, we will live someplace else (and be sure to be unemotinal and don't apologize). The problem with the first is she'll throw it back at me each time I chose to do something else because i'm not 100% committed to her.  Do you have any other suggestions, please help me wtih the boundaries/consequences. ________________________________ To: WTOAdultChildren1 Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2011 11:33 AM Subject: Re: the one who undermines me  ((((())))) Is Low Contact with Boundaries and Consequences not working for you? Is No Contact (either temporarily or permanently) an option for you? -Annie > > > > > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what > > it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something > > I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has > > either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my > > nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if > > my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it > > through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to > > rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her > > but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. > > And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how > > many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or > > that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from > > making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor > > of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. > > If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she > > encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a > > roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - > > if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have > > gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But > > I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that > > she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't > > make me sad. > > > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Boundaries are for you; they are the behaviors you decide you will not tolerate from your person with bpd. For example, you decide that its not OK for your person with bpd to curse at you. If your nada begins cursing at you, you say something like, " I won't listen to you when you curse at me; that's not OK. I'm hanging up now. We can talk again later. " But if your nada continues to violate your boundary each time you speak with her, you increase the consequence, such as saying something like. " I've said before that its not OK for you to curse at me; so I won't be contacting you again for two weeks. " There are some good books about setting boundaries for yourself, and following through on consequences for boundary violation; Randi Kreger's The Essential Family Guide to BPD, and Stop Walking On Eggshells have good sections on establishing boundaries. There are other good books about setting up and maintaining boundaries at the Reading List at the WTO home website. I know it must be very frustrating for you that your nada is wanting to sell the house you are living in and refuses to sell it to you; but there isn't anything you can do about that if its her property. I hope you can find a way to emotionally distance yourself from this situation, unfair and hurtful as it is. Otherwise you'll drive yourself crazy with impotent rage. If you contact nada's real estate agent and let him or her know that you want the house, perhaps the agent (or your own agent) could broker the deal for you and your nada wouldn't even have to know who is buying it? I hope you find something that works for you. -Annie > > > > > > > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what > > > it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something > > > I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has > > > either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my > > > nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if > > > my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it > > > through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to > > > rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > > > > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her > > > but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. > > > And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how > > > many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or > > > that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from > > > making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor > > > of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. > > > If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she > > > encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a > > > roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - > > > if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have > > > gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But > > > I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that > > > she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't > > > make me sad. > > > > > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Â > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Thank you Anuri67854 for better explaining that. In hindsight I've been dealing with this for 45 years, nada has already completely isolated one sibling and I'm under so much stress at work I barely know my own name at the end of the night. I did contact the broker and he's going to see about putting a blind offer in (like Disney did) I have the Walking on Eggshells book but guess I haven't gotten that far yet. I just don't want her affecting my son. He's been through so much already. He has the right to a sane non drama filled life. ________________________________ To: WTOAdultChildren1 Sent: Thursday, October 13, 2011 2:17 PM Subject: Re: the one who undermines me  Boundaries are for you; they are the behaviors you decide you will not tolerate from your person with bpd. For example, you decide that its not OK for your person with bpd to curse at you. If your nada begins cursing at you, you say something like, " I won't listen to you when you curse at me; that's not OK. I'm hanging up now. We can talk again later. " But if your nada continues to violate your boundary each time you speak with her, you increase the consequence, such as saying something like. " I've said before that its not OK for you to curse at me; so I won't be contacting you again for two weeks. " There are some good books about setting boundaries for yourself, and following through on consequences for boundary violation; Randi Kreger's The Essential Family Guide to BPD, and Stop Walking On Eggshells have good sections on establishing boundaries. There are other good books about setting up and maintaining boundaries at the Reading List at the WTO home website. I know it must be very frustrating for you that your nada is wanting to sell the house you are living in and refuses to sell it to you; but there isn't anything you can do about that if its her property. I hope you can find a way to emotionally distance yourself from this situation, unfair and hurtful as it is. Otherwise you'll drive yourself crazy with impotent rage. If you contact nada's real estate agent and let him or her know that you want the house, perhaps the agent (or your own agent) could broker the deal for you and your nada wouldn't even have to know who is buying it? I hope you find something that works for you. -Annie > > > > > > > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what > > > it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something > > > I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has > > > either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my > > > nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if > > > my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it > > > through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to > > > rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > > > > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her > > > but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. > > > And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how > > > many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or > > > that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from > > > making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor > > > of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. > > > If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she > > > encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a > > > roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - > > > if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have > > > gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But > > > I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that > > > she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't > > > make me sad. > > > > > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2011 Report Share Posted October 14, 2011 Thanks so much Annie - you really understand how it is. And good for your sister for not letting your nada derail her life plans! What you said here... " The saddest part is that we have to figure this sad reality out for ourselves, from the very disadvantaged position of automatically trusting that our own mother loves us and underneath it all does have our best interests at heart... when in the case of a Cluster B mother can be far from reality. " really speaks to me. It also makes me think of how many times in my life when I've come close to this revelation I've had friends who would say stuff like " oh she really means the best for you " or " but she's your mother! " and it makes it that much harder to have and hold the realization that she doesn't care because it is treated as a forbidden thought by everyone around who isn't a therapist or a KO. I found out more information yesterday about why my nada was derailing me. In a way it puts me in a colder and sadder place than thinking she was undermining me. It turned out that she had a personal negative reaction to my hard decision (as if it was her situation which it is not) and supporting me or undermining me literally had NO PLACE in her mind at all. All that mattered was her feelings and her emoting them...because after all that's all there is in the universe she and I share. The way in which she has neglected me or negated me my whole life has rarely been aggressive of violent like some nadas, but it is persistent and pervasive. It's like I matter but only in reference to herself. Bah, enough of this for now...thanks for reading. Eliza > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't make me sad. > > > > Eliza > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2011 Report Share Posted October 14, 2011 Thanks for the encouragement - I feel like I've done a lot of work sometimes and other times like there's many more miles to go before I sleep to borrow a phrase. Calm and peace to you as well. Eliza > > > > > > I've had to make a very hard and sad decision recently - can't say what it is because it would be too identifying unfortunately. But it's something I feel is the best choice for me and those concerned. Everyone I've told has either been accepting at least or actually supportive. But then there's my nada... She immediately starts to come up with other solutions acting as if my decision were somehow not already made, as if I hadn't thought it through. Just making it that much harder for me. All the sudden having to rethink the whole thing through again. > > > > > > I'm getting my balance back again after being off the phone with her but it just still stuns me how much she just automatically undermines me. And I wonder what the cost is to me over my whole life? I wonder about how many things I needed to do for my future or my well-being that were hard or that I was afraid of that she provided that extra influence to keep me from making the best decision for me. I remember in high school I had the honor of an invitation to attend a special gifted school in a city two hours away. If I had gone there it would have rocket-launched my education - but she encouraged me to feel scared of how it would be socially, of having a roommate. And I didn't accept and stayed home. I look back now and think - if I had left home at 16, wow! How different would my path have been to have gotten other social influences totally away from my FOO at that age? But I'll never know and this is the life I have now, so I try to remember that she's not really looking out for me. And I don't know when that ever won't make me sad. > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2011 Report Share Posted October 14, 2011 Girlscout, interesting you should mention Gollum. Those movies really made me think a lot about my family...like what is the Precious, what is the thing that they hold on to that consumes and distorts them over the years? What is it that they would save and hold dear even as they would destroy all around them including themselves? I come up with different answers to that at different times. Right now it feels to me like it is the IDEA of who they are that is the precious. About the " cold bitch " ...I guess that's just her words for describing your HEALTHY behavior! I'm " ungrateful and selfish " when attempting to do healthy things. Crazy world. Thanks for the validation! Eliza > > > ** > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2011 Report Share Posted October 14, 2011 Do you think " precious " might be ego/self esteem? They def are looking for it. Maybe its narcissistic supply. . . On Fri, Oct 14, 2011 at 10:05 PM, eliza92@... < eliza92@...> wrote: > ** > > > Girlscout, interesting you should mention Gollum. Those movies really made > me think a lot about my family...like what is the Precious, what is the > thing that they hold on to that consumes and distorts them over the years? > What is it that they would save and hold dear even as they would destroy all > around them including themselves? I come up with different answers to that > at different times. Right now it feels to me like it is the IDEA of who they > are that is the precious. > > About the " cold bitch " ...I guess that's just her words for describing your > HEALTHY behavior! I'm " ungrateful and selfish " when attempting to do healthy > things. Crazy world. Thanks for the validation! > > Eliza > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2011 Report Share Posted October 14, 2011 Well my nada flips out when she feels remotely criticized in any way, so I guess that's would fit with the threat to the ego. It's like she instantly feels attacked and attacks back no matter how gently something is said to her that is very important. Things like " You shouldn't eat food cooked on a stove with roaches crawling on it - it's not healthy or safe " because how dare I imply that she's done anything wrong or would not want to eat food she cooked. Eliza > > Do you think " precious " might be ego/self esteem? They def are looking for > it. Maybe its narcissistic supply. . . > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 That's very sad, but in my opinion if that is the situation: if your nada is living in filth, if her kitchen (and probably the rest of her home as well) is swarming with cockroaches, if she is no longer taking care of herself properly by not preparing food in minimally clean, sanitary conditions, then its possible that your nada has more than " just " bpd; she may no longer be rational. It could be that she is in the early stages of dementia. You may want to make an appointment just for yourself to consult with Social Services, or have a consultation with your nada's doctor, or even your own doctor or therapist, and discuss your concerns with them and learn what your nada's options are. But I agree with you; I wouldn't be eating any food prepared by nada at her home either. Nope. Too risky. Freaking out / becoming hysterical or over-reacting over even gentle criticism given out of concern for her health is a way of *preventing* others (you in particular) from even thinking about expressing your real feelings or your concerns about her, *ever*. If she's found that it works, she'll keep doing it. -Annie > > > > Do you think " precious " might be ego/self esteem? They def are looking for > > it. Maybe its narcissistic supply. . . > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 Hi Annie, I should have provided a bit more context. The comment about the roaches and the stove is relevant from a time period of a few years ago. Since she moved five years ago she's been living roach free using a cleaner kitchen. Her problems with over-acceptance filth and insects though in general have always existed and seem to be part of some mental problem that is not dementia and not BPD. I've spent quite a bit of time researching on what happens in hoarding situations and her situation would have to be far worse than it is today before she would be declared incompetent. That is both good and bad...glad she's not worse, but she's definitely not living healthily either. And you are probably remembering the ant situation - as far as I know that has not been ongoing according to my aunt. " Freaking out / becoming hysterical or over-reacting over even gentle criticism given out of concern for her health is a way of *preventing* others (you in particular) from even thinking about expressing your real feelings or your concerns about her, *ever*. If she's found that it works, she'll keep doing it. " You are on the money. But here's the deal...if I push her on anything with persistence she literally threatens to go NC with me and she means it. It's not like I ever haven't pushed it - I'm not spineless. I was very assertive with her just a month ago about something and had no success at all. Forgive me Annie if that comes off defensive but I just want to set the record straight. If she goes NC with me, then I can't help her at all - and maybe ultimately that's how it is going work out but I am choosing my battles. Eliza > > That's very sad, but in my opinion if that is the situation: if your nada is living in filth, if her kitchen (and probably the rest of her home as well) is swarming with cockroaches, if she is no longer taking care of herself properly by not preparing food in minimally clean, sanitary conditions, then its possible that your nada has more than " just " bpd; she may no longer be rational. It could be that she is in the early stages of dementia. > > You may want to make an appointment just for yourself to consult with Social Services, or have a consultation with your nada's doctor, or even your own doctor or therapist, and discuss your concerns with them and learn what your nada's options are. > > But I agree with you; I wouldn't be eating any food prepared by nada at her home either. Nope. Too risky. > > Freaking out / becoming hysterical or over-reacting over even gentle criticism given out of concern for her health is a way of *preventing* others (you in particular) from even thinking about expressing your real feelings or your concerns about her, *ever*. If she's found that it works, she'll keep doing it. > > -Annie > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2011 Report Share Posted October 15, 2011 You're the one at the front lines of the " battle " , so to speak, so you get to pick and choose which battles to fight, for sure. If its essential to you to remain in contact with your nada no matter what, though, that does give the power balance to your nada. If she knows that you will always back off if she threatens to go No Contact with you, then, that's the dynamic; that's your reality. After my dad died, my nada insisted on living by herself and would not consider moving in with any of her friends or our relatives who were open to the idea of having a roommate or housemate to share expenses and provide companionship. Nada also refused the idea of relocating to a retirement community even though she was no longer able to drive and would have benefitted from the transportation services and social activities at such communities. She refused to hire a part-time caregiver or even a part-time driver and insisted that her friends, and our relatives and Sister provide her with transportation and other services, for free. My nada is a very controlling individual, wants everything her own way, and feels entitled to have things her own way, always. It is very hard to reason with someone like that. But each case, each individual and each parent-child relationship is different. I guess my nada was more afraid of being ignored or afraid of abandonment than yours is. When Sister and I went No Contact with our nada, she became willing to go into therapy in order to regain contact. Even though in the long run the therapy didn't do any good, it did establish that Sister and I were willing to play " hardball " with our nada. We had never really stood up to her before in a meaningful way like that, and when we finally did, I think it surprised the hell out of nada. But now that my nada has Alzheimer's and Sister is basically nada's guardian and has nada's power of attorney, and nada is safely ensconced in a nice residential care home that specializes in Alzheimer's patients, the power-balance issue is a moot point. -Annie > > > > That's very sad, but in my opinion if that is the situation: if your nada is living in filth, if her kitchen (and probably the rest of her home as well) is swarming with cockroaches, if she is no longer taking care of herself properly by not preparing food in minimally clean, sanitary conditions, then its possible that your nada has more than " just " bpd; she may no longer be rational. It could be that she is in the early stages of dementia. > > > > You may want to make an appointment just for yourself to consult with Social Services, or have a consultation with your nada's doctor, or even your own doctor or therapist, and discuss your concerns with them and learn what your nada's options are. > > > > But I agree with you; I wouldn't be eating any food prepared by nada at her home either. Nope. Too risky. > > > > Freaking out / becoming hysterical or over-reacting over even gentle criticism given out of concern for her health is a way of *preventing* others (you in particular) from even thinking about expressing your real feelings or your concerns about her, *ever*. If she's found that it works, she'll keep doing it. > > > > -Annie > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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