MSG

[Guest guest]

At 09:35 PM 5/2/2002 +0000, you wrote:

>Not the same. In the body, glutamine is synthesized from glutamate

>(salt of glutamic acid) and ammonia via glutamine synthetase (enzyme).

>While ingestion of free glutamic acid or glutamate can affect the

>brain like MSG (monosodium glutamate), free glutamine does not. It is

>used as fuel for the immune system, gut epithilium, muscle and brain.

:

You seem to know your chemistry, would you mind a question?

My office mate has a HORRIBLE time with MSG, it gives her bad shoulder

pains. Now, I don't use MSG in cooking (I cook the office meals), but she

seems to have this reaction when I use vinegar or wine in any cooked dish.

I read something once to the effect that vinegar can react to foods to

create MSG? And soy can do the same thing? The same vinegar, plain on a

salad, is ok for her.

Is MSG that pervasive, and if so, is there anywhere I can get a list of

foods that MIGHT create it while cooking?

Heidi Schuppenhauer

Trillium Custom Software Inc.

heidis@...

[Guest guest]

--snip--

> :

>

> You seem to know your chemistry, would you mind a question?

>

> My office mate has a HORRIBLE time with MSG, it gives her bad

shoulder

> pains. Now, I don't use MSG in cooking (I cook the office meals),

but she

> seems to have this reaction when I use vinegar or wine in any cooked

dish.

> I read something once to the effect that vinegar can react to foods

to

> create MSG? And soy can do the same thing? The same vinegar, plain

on a

> salad, is ok for her.

>

> Is MSG that pervasive, and if so, is there anywhere I can get a list

of

> foods that MIGHT create it while cooking?

>

Any predigested protein will contain some free glutamate. Acids used

in cooking can accomplish this but I would imagine it produces a

rather small amount of glutamate. Soy won't " react " with food to

produce glutamate, but soy protein itself will contain glutamic acid

(as will most proteins). It only becomes a problem when the glutamic

acid is freed from the protein complex through fermentation or

acidulation. This free glutamate can then be rapidly absorbed and in

susceptible individuals, cross the blood brain barrier, enter the

brain and act as an excitotoxin on certain neurons. Susceptibility is

determined by overall health (tissue integrity) which can be

influenced by hydration. Since a classic symptom of dehydration is

tight painful " shoulders " between neck and shoulder, the sensitivity

and pain may be alleviated by better hydration. If you are referring

to pain in the shoulder itself (like the bursa), I can't offer any

explanation.

Portland, OR

[Guest guest]

> I was at a health food store and ran across a book that was about

MSG. I

> can't remember the name or who it was by. It was maybe 100 pages

or so long.

> It had a fairly extensive list and explained why certain foods

cause

> problems. We were in the same position. I thought I had removed

all the msg

> containing foods but my son kept getting sick. After reading his

book I

> realized we were eating peas and mushrooms. Once I pulled them out

we didn't

> have any more problems.

Hi ,

The book you may be referring to could be by L. Blaylock,

M.D., " Excitoxins: The Taste that Kills " . Does that title ring any

bells? I have a list of all the MSG items. Would you like me to send

you a copy of a one page summery of the book? You can write to me and

let me know. I know the book is available from Price-Pottenger if you

want to buy it.

Sorry I didn't get this information to you sooner, but my husband

and I have been moving from one house to another. What a lot of work!

When the pictures is hung on the walls I will feel like we are home

again.

Sheila

[Guest guest]

I've been trying to figure it out myself. I'm not even sure that it is MSG

that is the problem: when you ferment something you get all kinds of

chemicals. My officemate is VERY sensitive to SOMETHING in our food, and it

seems to more or less coincide with the MSG foods. I keep reacting to foods

that I'm pretty sure don't have gluten, but probably do have MSG of some

sort. But some of the items she reacts to don't make sense except as some

kind of chemical reaction: she can eat the hamburger we get, and she can

eat vinegar, but she can't eat hamburger with vinegar in the sauce, cooked.

But meat with lemon juice is OK. Meat+Vinegar does something. So does

meat+wine (marinade). I was hoping someone here might know the chemistry.

It could be another chemical, like formaldyhde. Cooking creates all kinds

of compounds, as per the Acetylmide issue.

Peas and mushrooms and tomatoes have a LOT less MSG than soy sauce and the

others, and it may be more " bound up " . From reading it seems that the

" free " glutamates going directly into the bloodstream cause most of the

problem.

http://www.msgfacts.com/chart.html

As for fermented foods helping: I'm kind of wondering about the " food

combining " thing. The Japanese use a lot of MSG: they also eat a lot of

fermented foods with their meals. Maybe the pickles (or the lactic acid)

neutralizes the MSG somehow. Or having good bacteria in your gut is

protective, or if your gut is healed (thicker) it doesn't get into your

bloodstream as much?

Anyway, I have the same reactions you describe to soy sauce, and so does my

husband. But not to parmesan cheese! So there's got to be more to it ...

-- Heidi

At 09:54 PM 5/10/2002 -0500, you wrote:

>This list seams unrelated. I have MSG problems and do have trouble with

>hydrolyzed vegetable/soy protein, some soy sauce, and some soy products.

>Some brands of tofu are fine and others I'm running to the bathroom. When

>I'm not using my kefir I seem to have more problems with legumes all

>together. (gas, cramps, constipated, stiff neck and groggy headache

>feeling. Lately I've been using fermented and cultured foods often and it

>has reduced much of my problem with MSG even.

>

>I eat mushrooms, nutritional yeast, peas, corn and tamari sauce with no

>problem. I always buy the cultured tamari.

>

>Rondi

>

>

> >Several years ago my son had terrible reactions to msg. Here are some

> of the

> >foods we had to avoid as they can contain msg...(after three years on the NT

> >diet almost none of these foods affect him anymore). It's my understanding

> >there different kinds of msg, some that occurs naturally and some that are

> >chemically created.

> >

> >hydrolyzed soy protein

> >autolyzed yeast

> >natural flavor

> >soy sauce

> >tamari

> >corn

> >peas

> >mushrooms

> >modified food starch

> >nutritional yeast

>

>

>