Creepy, Clingy Sibling after Nada died

[Guest guest]

OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my doorstep, and

stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka set boundaries and eventually had

to go NC; he is the " golden boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64 yrs old, he has

lived with nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and totally clueless. He

lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before he showed up, I had gotten a

call from his friend that he was coming out to see me -- but my brother didn't

bother to tell me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see if he would call

and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC for about 5 years, and

I just couldn't make myself call him. I sent a one-line email -- Is it true

you're coming to see me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At that very moment,

instead of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had done 5 years of

therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight, I instead FROZE. I

actually asked what day he'd be arriving. What the hell is wrong with me??? I

still can't believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to pre-therapy

days. I answered the door and let him stay and let him tell me how long he was

staying.

Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2 mo after nada

died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been ripped away. He followed me around

the house, the yard, a store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to the

point I bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my partner, and he

did it to my friend -- all females. He wouldn't do anything by himself, had no

ideas of his own, and was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was wondering

out loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being forthright, I acted

passive aggressively and told him I had to be at the office each day and my

partner was busy everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided to

leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his imbecilic behavior

during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was

such a very steep and slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank

God I called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find myself again.

I have 2 MAJOR fears:

1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape the bpd

nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist to try to figure out my

regressed behavior!!!

2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my doorstep to cling to

me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF COURSE - history repeats itself, and he

is searching for a replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for 2 weeks. And I

still can't bring myself to pick up the phone and tell him that he cannot come

back! What's wrong with me? I am ashamed that I actually but this

dysfunctional mess ahead of my current partner, our life together, and myself.

Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding (really now, what normal

adult can take a quick look into bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment I heard that he

was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and hopefully go away.

As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do without you???

S.

[Guest guest]

(((((S)))))

Please don't beat yourself up too much. Nobody is perfect. This whole process

is a learning experience, and we make mistakes, and we can learn from our

mistakes.

It just shows how incredibly strong the influence of our childhood conditioning

is; when something triggers us, our subconscious (which has absorbed all this

negative training and conditioning for nearly two decades) can just do an

end-run around our logical, rational part of our brain...

but we can learn to block that end run.

That's great that you have access to a therapist. It occurs to me that maybe

you could bring up the idea of some role-playing exercises with your therapist.

Its a way of practicing how to handle certain situations ahead of time so you

can remain more

" in the moment " and more in control of your subconscious triggers.

For example, your therapist plays the role of you. You play the role of your

brother. You phone your therapist and say, " I'm coming over. " Then your

therapist can say various things as a response, for you to observe. You can

play the role of your brother and follow your therapist around the room very

closely; your therapist can demonstrate various ways of handling that very odd,

intrusive, and inappropriate behavior.

Then, you switch roles; you play yourself, and your therapist plays the part of

your brother. And you get to try some of the different ways of handling his

behaviors.

(Your brother sounds extremely dysfunctional to me; is he functional enough to

work and earn a living or is he not socialized enough to work?)

So, again... learning new ways of relating to people that we've spent a lifetime

relating to in a certain way... takes time.

You can do this, its just that it takes as long as it takes to get the train up

to speed from a dead stop, so to speak.

-Annie

>

> OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my doorstep, and

stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka set boundaries and eventually had

to go NC; he is the " golden boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64 yrs old, he has

lived with nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and totally clueless. He

lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before he showed up, I had gotten a

call from his friend that he was coming out to see me -- but my brother didn't

bother to tell me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see if he would call

and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC for about 5 years, and

I just couldn't make myself call him. I sent a one-line email -- Is it true

you're coming to see me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At that very moment,

instead of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had done 5 years of

therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight, I instead FROZE. I

actually asked what day he'd be arriving. What the hell is wrong with me??? I

still can't believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to pre-therapy

days. I answered the door and let him stay and let him tell me how long he was

staying.

>

> Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2 mo after nada

died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been ripped away. He followed me around

the house, the yard, a store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to the

point I bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my partner, and he

did it to my friend -- all females. He wouldn't do anything by himself, had no

ideas of his own, and was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was wondering

out loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being forthright, I acted

passive aggressively and told him I had to be at the office each day and my

partner was busy everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided to

leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his imbecilic behavior

during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was

such a very steep and slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank

God I called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find myself again.

>

> I have 2 MAJOR fears:

> 1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape the bpd

nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist to try to figure out my

regressed behavior!!!

> 2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my doorstep to cling

to me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF COURSE - history repeats itself, and

he is searching for a replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

>

> I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for 2 weeks. And I

still can't bring myself to pick up the phone and tell him that he cannot come

back! What's wrong with me? I am ashamed that I actually but this

dysfunctional mess ahead of my current partner, our life together, and myself.

Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding (really now, what normal

adult can take a quick look into bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

>

> He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment I heard that he

was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and hopefully go away.

>

> As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do without you???

> S.

>

[Guest guest]

S.,

Please don't be too disappointed in yourself. I don't think

you've forgotten all your therapy. It sounds to me like you were

overtaken by a change in circumstances combined with a surprise

event. I can understand why you weren't thinking clearly enough

to tell your brother " no " . Besides the surprise of it all,

perhaps you were hoping somewhere inside that your brother might

be changing for the better with your nada gone? If he doesn't

also have BPD, there is a chance of that happening although

maybe not a large one this late in his life.

It also sounds to me like your brother has totally lost his

anchor in life. If he was totally enmeshed with your nada for

all those years he probably has no clue how to be himself. Some

men go to pieces when their mother dies even when the

relationship is normal and healthy. For a man enmeshed as the

golden child of a BPD mother, it must be even worse. Hopefully

he's figured out that you're not going to be his replacement

anchor. If not, you'll be better-prepared the next time he tries

to invite himself to visit. If you get a plan in place for that

possibility now, you won't be caught so much by surprise. You

should definitely make it clear to him now that showing up on

your doorstep without advance notice is unacceptable. If he

tells you he wants to visit again, you could offer to help him

find a hotel room nearby and suggest ways to entertain himself

along with telling him which days or evenings you'll be

available to do something with him, making it clear that your

life is not going to revolve around his visit. Beyond that, I

think it makes a difference whether you want a relationship with

him and whether or not you think he has BPD himself.

At 12:27 PM 10/21/2011 S wrote:

>OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my

>doorstep, and stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka

>set boundaries and eventually had to go NC; he is the " golden

>boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64 yrs old, he has lived with

>nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and totally

>clueless. He lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before

>he showed up, I had gotten a call from his friend that he was

>coming out to see me -- but my brother didn't bother to tell

>me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see if he would

>call and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC

>for about 5 years, and I just couldn't make myself call him. I

>sent a one-line email -- Is it true you're coming to see

>me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At that very moment, instead

>of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had done 5

>years of therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight,

>I instead FROZE. I actually asked what day he'd be

>arriving. What the hell is wrong with me??? I still can't

>believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to

>pre-therapy days. I answered the door and let him stay and let

>him tell me how long he was staying.

>

>Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2

>mo after nada died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been

>ripped away. He followed me around the house, the yard, a

>store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to the point I

>bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my

>partner, and he did it to my friend -- all females. He

>wouldn't do anything by himself, had no ideas of his own, and

>was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was wondering out

>loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being

>forthright, I acted passive aggressively and told him I had to

>be at the office each day and my partner was busy

>everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided to

>leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his

>imbecilic behavior during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right

>back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was such a very steep and

>slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank God I

>called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find

>myself again.

>

>I have 2 MAJOR fears:

>1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape

>the bpd nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist

>to try to figure out my regressed behavior!!!

>2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my

>doorstep to cling to me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF

>COURSE - history repeats itself, and he is searching for a

>replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

>

>I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for

>2 weeks. And I still can't bring myself to pick up the phone

>and tell him that he cannot come back! What's wrong with

>me? I am ashamed that I actually but this dysfunctional mess

>ahead of my current partner, our life together, and

>myself. Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding

>(really now, what normal adult can take a quick look into

>bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

>

>He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment

>I heard that he was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and

>hopefully go away.

>

>As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do

>without you???

>S.

--

Katrina

[Guest guest]

Annie,

Thanks for responding.

Unbelievably, my brother was able to hold a job and retired after 33 yrs or so

at the same company. But he never had a life. You could set your watch by his

comings and goings - and he did that to avoid " upsetting " nada. I know that

he's totally lost since her death only 2 months ago. But I hadn't realized that

he would come here expecting me to be his only entertainment. And so

creepy/clingy.

Your suggestion of role playing with my therapist is a good one. Never did that

before. I expect that it would be very challenging since I feel so defeated at

the moment. Ha - at this point, I believe that I would " flunk " when it's my

turn to be me. But that is the whole point of going to therapy - I just have to

learn and practice what I need to do. I have to lose this trapped and helpless

feeling.

I guess I should also take your advice and put my recent behavior in the " we all

make mistakes " category. That sure is kinder than being so mad at myself. His

visit certainly triggered those old " I've been run over by a truck " feelings.

OK, will see how the therapy goes. Gotta get over this -- again.

Thanks again for writing.

S.

> >

> > OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my doorstep,

and stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka set boundaries and eventually

had to go NC; he is the " golden boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64 yrs old, he

has lived with nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and totally clueless.

He lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before he showed up, I had gotten a

call from his friend that he was coming out to see me -- but my brother didn't

bother to tell me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see if he would call

and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC for about 5 years, and

I just couldn't make myself call him. I sent a one-line email -- Is it true

you're coming to see me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At that very moment,

instead of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had done 5 years of

therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight, I instead FROZE. I

actually asked what day he'd be arriving. What the hell is wrong with me??? I

still can't believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to pre-therapy

days. I answered the door and let him stay and let him tell me how long he was

staying.

> >

> > Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2 mo after

nada died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been ripped away. He followed me

around the house, the yard, a store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to

the point I bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my partner,

and he did it to my friend -- all females. He wouldn't do anything by himself,

had no ideas of his own, and was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was

wondering out loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being forthright,

I acted passive aggressively and told him I had to be at the office each day and

my partner was busy everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided

to leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his imbecilic behavior

during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was

such a very steep and slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank

God I called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find myself again.

> >

> > I have 2 MAJOR fears:

> > 1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape the bpd

nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist to try to figure out my

regressed behavior!!!

> > 2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my doorstep to cling

to me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF COURSE - history repeats itself, and

he is searching for a replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

> >

> > I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for 2 weeks. And

I still can't bring myself to pick up the phone and tell him that he cannot come

back! What's wrong with me? I am ashamed that I actually but this

dysfunctional mess ahead of my current partner, our life together, and myself.

Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding (really now, what normal

adult can take a quick look into bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

> >

> > He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment I heard that

he was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and hopefully go away.

> >

> > As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do without you???

> > S.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for answering.

I think that being NC for about 5 years helped me to let down my guard. As

though avoiding the situation made it better. I have to be ready the next time

that he tries to come for a visit. Have a plan, and practice saying it.

Actually, I'd better work on a preemptive plan - work up my courage to tell him

" no " BEFORE he dreams up another trip. I just can't let him enmesh into my

life!!! We was TOTALLY enmeshed in nada's life - as though they were one

person. So he must be really hurting now. I don't know if he's bpd, but he is

sure narcissistic! Everything, every day revolved around him. He wasn't

inquisitive at all about my life.

YOu have a good (but very scary) point about me being his replacement anchor.

I'm sure that somewhere deep down inside, without thinking the words, he will

try to make me just that. Boy, does that give me the willies. Will get help

from my therapist about that one. Everything about his behavior on this trip

spelled out that that's exactly how he sees me. Ugh.

You've given me a lot to think about and prepare for.

Boy, I know this is fantasy thinking, but I'd sure like to snap my fingers and

have all of this just disappear. Oh well, one can dream...

Thanks again,

S.

WTOAdultChildren1 , Katrina wrote:

>

> S.,

> Please don't be too disappointed in yourself. I don't think

> you've forgotten all your therapy. It sounds to me like you were

> overtaken by a change in circumstances combined with a surprise

> event. I can understand why you weren't thinking clearly enough

> to tell your brother " no " . Besides the surprise of it all,

> perhaps you were hoping somewhere inside that your brother might

> be changing for the better with your nada gone? If he doesn't

> also have BPD, there is a chance of that happening although

> maybe not a large one this late in his life.

>

> It also sounds to me like your brother has totally lost his

> anchor in life. If he was totally enmeshed with your nada for

> all those years he probably has no clue how to be himself. Some

> men go to pieces when their mother dies even when the

> relationship is normal and healthy. For a man enmeshed as the

> golden child of a BPD mother, it must be even worse. Hopefully

> he's figured out that you're not going to be his replacement

> anchor. If not, you'll be better-prepared the next time he tries

> to invite himself to visit. If you get a plan in place for that

> possibility now, you won't be caught so much by surprise. You

> should definitely make it clear to him now that showing up on

> your doorstep without advance notice is unacceptable. If he

> tells you he wants to visit again, you could offer to help him

> find a hotel room nearby and suggest ways to entertain himself

> along with telling him which days or evenings you'll be

> available to do something with him, making it clear that your

> life is not going to revolve around his visit. Beyond that, I

> think it makes a difference whether you want a relationship with

> him and whether or not you think he has BPD himself.

>

>

> At 12:27 PM 10/21/2011 S wrote:

> >OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my

> >doorstep, and stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka

> >set boundaries and eventually had to go NC; he is the " golden

> >boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64 yrs old, he has lived with

> >nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and totally

> >clueless. He lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before

> >he showed up, I had gotten a call from his friend that he was

> >coming out to see me -- but my brother didn't bother to tell

> >me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see if he would

> >call and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC

> >for about 5 years, and I just couldn't make myself call him. I

> >sent a one-line email -- Is it true you're coming to see

> >me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At that very moment, instead

> >of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had done 5

> >years of therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight,

> >I instead FROZE. I actually asked what day he'd be

> >arriving. What the hell is wrong with me??? I still can't

> >believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to

> >pre-therapy days. I answered the door and let him stay and let

> >him tell me how long he was staying.

> >

> >Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2

> >mo after nada died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been

> >ripped away. He followed me around the house, the yard, a

> >store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to the point I

> >bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my

> >partner, and he did it to my friend -- all females. He

> >wouldn't do anything by himself, had no ideas of his own, and

> >was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was wondering out

> >loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being

> >forthright, I acted passive aggressively and told him I had to

> >be at the office each day and my partner was busy

> >everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided to

> >leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his

> >imbecilic behavior during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right

> >back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was such a very steep and

> >slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank God I

> >called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find

> >myself again.

> >

> >I have 2 MAJOR fears:

> >1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape

> >the bpd nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist

> >to try to figure out my regressed behavior!!!

> >2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my

> >doorstep to cling to me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF

> >COURSE - history repeats itself, and he is searching for a

> >replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

> >

> >I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for

> >2 weeks. And I still can't bring myself to pick up the phone

> >and tell him that he cannot come back! What's wrong with

> >me? I am ashamed that I actually but this dysfunctional mess

> >ahead of my current partner, our life together, and

> >myself. Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding

> >(really now, what normal adult can take a quick look into

> >bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

> >

> >He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment

> >I heard that he was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and

> >hopefully go away.

> >

> >As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do

> >without you???

> >S.

>

> --

> Katrina

>

[Guest guest]

I hope that will work for you; I understand entirely about subconscious

conditioning and subconscious triggers which cause a person to just respond

automatically without even thinking about it. This affects me mostly in the

trying-to-diet-and-not-overeat area.

I have to be more fully conscious and in-the-moment when it comes to eating.

Although I am not a psychologist, I am fascinated by psychology and read about

the various personality disorders, research in the area of psychology, etc., and

it seems to me that possibly your brother has some of the symptoms of " schizoid

personality disorder " and " dependent personality disorder " . Whether he does or

not, he is the only one who can decide if he wants to change his behaviors and

seek therapy to help him do so.

(But unless *he* is distressed by his own behaviors, he probably will not seek

therapy.)

All you can do is decide how you wish to respond to his behaviors if you find

them either annoying or completely intolerable. That's all any of us can do,

really; as adults we have the *right* and the *power* to decide what we will and

will not tolerate.

We KOs are up against a steep barrier to do this. First we have to be aware of

and accept the very idea that we DO have both the right and the power to

determine our own wants, needs, and behaviors. We actually have the right to

say " No " and it does not make me or you (or anyone) a bad person to say " No "

sometimes, *particularly* to someone who has been chronically abusive to us (or

to a behavior that is harmful to us, like overeating or substance abuse.)

Then, learning to exercise this power and wield it positively and confidently

takes time... sometimes a lot of time. But we just have to keep trying.

-Annie

> > >

> > > OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my doorstep,

and stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka set boundaries and eventually

had to go NC; he is the " golden boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64 yrs old, he

has lived with nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and totally clueless.

He lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before he showed up, I had gotten a

call from his friend that he was coming out to see me -- but my brother didn't

bother to tell me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see if he would call

and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC for about 5 years, and

I just couldn't make myself call him. I sent a one-line email -- Is it true

you're coming to see me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At that very moment,

instead of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had done 5 years of

therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight, I instead FROZE. I

actually asked what day he'd be arriving. What the hell is wrong with me??? I

still can't believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to pre-therapy

days. I answered the door and let him stay and let him tell me how long he was

staying.

> > >

> > > Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2 mo after

nada died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been ripped away. He followed me

around the house, the yard, a store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to

the point I bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my partner,

and he did it to my friend -- all females. He wouldn't do anything by himself,

had no ideas of his own, and was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was

wondering out loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being forthright,

I acted passive aggressively and told him I had to be at the office each day and

my partner was busy everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided

to leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his imbecilic behavior

during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was

such a very steep and slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank

God I called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find myself again.

> > >

> > > I have 2 MAJOR fears:

> > > 1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape the bpd

nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist to try to figure out my

regressed behavior!!!

> > > 2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my doorstep to

cling to me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF COURSE - history repeats

itself, and he is searching for a replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

> > >

> > > I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for 2 weeks.

And I still can't bring myself to pick up the phone and tell him that he cannot

come back! What's wrong with me? I am ashamed that I actually but this

dysfunctional mess ahead of my current partner, our life together, and myself.

Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding (really now, what normal

adult can take a quick look into bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

> > >

> > > He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment I heard

that he was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and hopefully go away.

> > >

> > > As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do without you???

> > > S.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

S,

Just reading your posting and Annie's reply. I totally empathize with your

situation. I think Annie's suggestion to role play to practice what you'll say

to your brother is a good idea. I just may use it myself. I agree you shouldn't

beat yourself up. These old roles and familial expectations are hard to change

and I think there is a dormant automatic setting in all of us that makes us

instinctively want to " help " and " accept " family as they are. But as we know,

sometimes that is not safe or what is best.

My MIL is BP and we hadn't seen her for nearly three years when about two years

ago she called and said she'd purchased airline tickets to come see " her kids "

(four of them, all not wanting to see her because of her witch, queen and now

even waif behaviors)for a week between Thanksgiving and Christmas, and needed to

stay with some of us as she didn't have money enough for a hotel. She even tried

to get one of us to lend her a car. She ended up staying with an old friend and

visiting some of us while here. She lives about 2,000 miles away all year. It

was really awkward and she made it clear she would rather stay with " her kids " ,

even though she had imposed herself, never asked when a good time was or told us

she was coming until after she bought tickets. Then the very next year she

called mid October to announce she had again bought airline tickets and would be

visiting again mid November. This time she wanted to stay with her kids and

asked that we figure it out amoung ourselves. She even had the nerve to complain

that she couldn't afford a rental car and wished she could borrow one of ours.

We all said no on the car but did house her among three of us (my husband and

kids and I were one of the houses).

She stayed with us for 3 days. I spend the most time with her as it is not has

difficult for me as she is not my nada, but it is only 24 hours before she has

worn out her welcome and her true colors emerge.

Man is she hard to take and soooo tiring and critical and negative and sucks

your energy! She has burned a lot of bridges and our kids can only take her in

small doses.

Well this September she called after about a year of not seeing her. One of her

grandkids (not our child) was getting married in the fall and she had bought

tickets and was coming for a week and wanted to stay with us. Here we go! Why

don't we just say NO???? She stayed with us for 4 days and her old friend for 4.

It was so difficult and draining and unpleasant. She now wants to come back in

three months for another family " event " and we know she will call to stay here.

We need to say NO! But will we?

I so get your dilema. I may just role play saying no to work up the courage!

> > >

> > > OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my doorstep,

and stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka set boundaries and eventually

had to go NC; he is the " golden boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64 yrs old, he

has lived with nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and totally clueless.

He lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before he showed up, I had gotten a

call from his friend that he was coming out to see me -- but my brother didn't

bother to tell me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see if he would call

and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC for about 5 years, and

I just couldn't make myself call him. I sent a one-line email -- Is it true

you're coming to see me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At that very moment,

instead of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had done 5 years of

therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight, I instead FROZE. I

actually asked what day he'd be arriving. What the hell is wrong with me??? I

still can't believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to pre-therapy

days. I answered the door and let him stay and let him tell me how long he was

staying.

> > >

> > > Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2 mo after

nada died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been ripped away. He followed me

around the house, the yard, a store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to

the point I bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my partner,

and he did it to my friend -- all females. He wouldn't do anything by himself,

had no ideas of his own, and was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was

wondering out loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being forthright,

I acted passive aggressively and told him I had to be at the office each day and

my partner was busy everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided

to leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his imbecilic behavior

during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was

such a very steep and slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank

God I called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find myself again.

> > >

> > > I have 2 MAJOR fears:

> > > 1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape the bpd

nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist to try to figure out my

regressed behavior!!!

> > > 2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my doorstep to

cling to me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF COURSE - history repeats

itself, and he is searching for a replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

> > >

> > > I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for 2 weeks.

And I still can't bring myself to pick up the phone and tell him that he cannot

come back! What's wrong with me? I am ashamed that I actually but this

dysfunctional mess ahead of my current partner, our life together, and myself.

Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding (really now, what normal

adult can take a quick look into bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

> > >

> > > He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment I heard

that he was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and hopefully go away.

> > >

> > > As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do without you???

> > > S.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

Wow - your story is exactly what I'm afraid of -- that I didn't say " no " this

first time, so he will be on my doorstep over and over again. So sorry you're

going through that. Not saying " no " just doesn't make any logical sense, but

your comment: " These old roles and familial expectations are hard to change and

I think there is a dormant automatic setting in all of us that makes us

instinctively want to " help " and " accept " family as they are. " helps me to

understand why saying no is so darned hard to do. I sure hope that role playing

and practicing gets us both past this inability to stand up for ourselves. We

have to quit putting the wants/needs/desires of the sick ones first, and put

ourselves and our immediate families needs first for a change. BPs are just so

darned good at sucking the life out of us - they've got it down to perfection.

I guess that just makes us have to work all the harder to overcome them. One of

the hardest things for me is that I try to reason with him instead of just being

firm. But when will it sink in that I can't reason with someone that's

incapable of reason? Being firm and uncompromising is what would work.

Practice, practice, practice. Good luck to you - I'll be thinking of you as I

practice saying No.

S.

> > > >

> > > > OMG! Less than 2 mo after nada died, my brother showed up on my

doorstep, and stayed for 2 weeks. I am the " bad " child, aka set boundaries and

eventually had to go NC; he is the " golden boy " , aka clueless sibling. At 64

yrs old, he has lived with nada his entire " life " ; totally controlled and

totally clueless. He lives 1,000 miles away. During the week before he showed

up, I had gotten a call from his friend that he was coming out to see me -- but

my brother didn't bother to tell me. I was stunned. I waited a few days to see

if he would call and tell me of his plans, but he never did. I had gone NC for

about 5 years, and I just couldn't make myself call him. I sent a one-line

email -- Is it true you're coming to see me? OMG - he answered back Yes. At

that very moment, instead of saying No Way, instead of behaving as though I had

done 5 years of therapy and gotten my head screwed on pretty straight, I instead

FROZE. I actually asked what day he'd be arriving. What the hell is wrong with

me??? I still can't believe it. My head is reeling. I regressed back to

pre-therapy days. I answered the door and let him stay and let him tell me how

long he was staying.

> > > >

> > > > Now here is the even creepier part. Keep in mind it was only 2 mo after

nada died -- it was as though 1/2 of him had been ripped away. He followed me

around the house, the yard, a store -- wherever I was -- within a foot or so, to

the point I bumped into him if I turned around. And he did it to my partner,

and he did it to my friend -- all females. He wouldn't do anything by himself,

had no ideas of his own, and was just plain CLINGY. After 2 weeks, he was

wondering out loud how long he should stay, and instead of me being forthright,

I acted passive aggressively and told him I had to be at the office each day and

my partner was busy everyday. Since I left him no options to cling, he decided

to leave the next day. BUT, I had TOTALLY LOST myself to his imbecilic behavior

during those 2 weeks. I got sucked right back in to bpd-land. Crap!!! It was

such a very steep and slippery slope! I am so disappointed in myself. Thank

God I called my therapist and set up an appoint -- I have to find myself again.

> > > >

> > > > I have 2 MAJOR fears:

> > > > 1) Have I " forgotten " all of my therapy and hard work to escape the bpd

nightmarish family?. I am going back to my therapist to try to figure out my

regressed behavior!!!

> > > > 2) Is he going to pull this stunt again - showing up on my doorstep to

cling to me and find a surrogate nada?! Well OF COURSE - history repeats

itself, and he is searching for a replacement mother. OH SHIT!!!!!

> > > >

> > > > I am beside myself. I can't go back! But I did - if even for 2 weeks.

And I still can't bring myself to pick up the phone and tell him that he cannot

come back! What's wrong with me? I am ashamed that I actually but this

dysfunctional mess ahead of my current partner, our life together, and myself.

Thank goodness she has been somewhat understanding (really now, what normal

adult can take a quick look into bpd-land and have any understanding of it?).

> > > >

> > > > He's been gone 1 week, and my headache that started the moment I heard

that he was coming is FINALLY starting to lessen and hopefully go away.

> > > >

> > > > As always, thank you all for listening. What would I do without you???

> > > > S.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>