was this normal?

[Guest guest]

So I was just reading a letter to an advice column and the responses and it got

me thinking. The letter was from a concerned grandmother whose daughter dumps

her young son on her for babysitting every weekend while she goes out with

friends and gets hammered. Many responders thought the mother was

irresponsible. And then a memory surfaced for me, during summers my mother

would leave me with my grandparents (hers) for weeks, often 2-3 weeks! One

year when I was sick constantly with mono, she drove me up there and left me for

a week or two also rather than have me be " at home alone " so much - but yet she

never took me to other doctors for a second opinion or seemed to have much

concern that I was constantly sick. Anyway, I don't mean to make this about

health care which could be a post all on its own, but is it normal for a parent

to drop their kid off for that long with grandparents? I am now wondering,

what the heck was she doing while I was gone for so long? Did she need a

vacation from being a parent?

Eliza

[Guest guest]

I notice a few parents in my older daughter's (13 yo) class do that: they'll

drop their kids off with family for the whole summer or part of it.

I wonder as well if they need a break from parenting. Sometimes, to be honest, I

wouldn't mind dropping my teen off with someone else for a bit. Lately, esp,

it's difficult to even have a conversation with her.

I'm sure there are situations where the kids love it and the parents are

relieved to have their kids supervised by loving people who are safe people for

their kids.

Did you like going to your grandparents' house? I don't know if your mother was

a single parent, if she felt overwhelmed...?

>

> So I was just reading a letter to an advice column and the responses and it

got me thinking. The letter was from a concerned grandmother whose daughter

dumps her young son on her for babysitting every weekend while she goes out with

friends and gets hammered. Many responders thought the mother was

irresponsible. And then a memory surfaced for me, during summers my mother

would leave me with my grandparents (hers) for weeks, often 2-3 weeks! One

year when I was sick constantly with mono, she drove me up there and left me for

a week or two also rather than have me be " at home alone " so much - but yet she

never took me to other doctors for a second opinion or seemed to have much

concern that I was constantly sick. Anyway, I don't mean to make this about

health care which could be a post all on its own, but is it normal for a parent

to drop their kid off for that long with grandparents? I am now wondering,

what the heck was she doing while I was gone for so long? Did she need a

vacation from being a parent?

>

> Eliza

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Fiona, overall I was okay with going to my grandparents but I was lonely -

there were no other kids and nothing to do there. Also to add to the fun my

mother and her sister told me that her sister got molested by my an uncle and

that my grandparents didn't do anything about it. They told me, just be careful

not to be alone with him - and this is someone who often visited my

grandparents. So that was pretty icky. But yeah...my nada probably did need a

break. She was more of a nada with less emotional control when I was young, so

maybe she did need a break to collect herself. I was a meek and trouble-free

kid though I occasionally pointed out that she was wrong about something when it

was really important - this made her explode of course. In a way being at my

grandparents was a break for me, but life was empty either way. Pretty sad,

huh? Glad I'm not a kid anymore.

Eliza

>

> I notice a few parents in my older daughter's (13 yo) class do that: they'll

drop their kids off with family for the whole summer or part of it.

>

> I wonder as well if they need a break from parenting. Sometimes, to be honest,

I wouldn't mind dropping my teen off with someone else for a bit. Lately, esp,

it's difficult to even have a conversation with her.

>

> I'm sure there are situations where the kids love it and the parents are

relieved to have their kids supervised by loving people who are safe people for

their kids.

>

> Did you like going to your grandparents' house? I don't know if your mother

was a single parent, if she felt overwhelmed...?

>

[Guest guest]

I would be sent to an elderly great-aunt's for about a week each summer starting

when I was 6 years old up until I was 10 or so, and it was nice to have a break

from nada. But like you experienced, it was kind of lonely; there were no other

kids to play with, and I was afraid of my aunt when I was smaller. I was afraid

of all adults, really; particularly women. I thought that sooner or later my

aunt would explode, and scream at me and hit me like nada did, so I was on my

best behavior. This aunt never did rage at me, she was very even tempered and

sweet, liked kids and was good with them, so eventually I grew to trust her

more.

It just occurred to me that I was always alone at my Aunt's, so I wonder if my

little Sister stayed home with our nada or if she got sent somewhere else? I'll

have to ask her.

-Annie

[Guest guest]

Hi Annie, so it sounds like this going off to visit elder relatives for a few

weeks isn't such a weird thing then. And like you I was on my best behavior for

the same reasons. I think it was a good thing to have the experience of being

in a home where no one was out of control emotionally, just to know it was

possible.

Eliza

>

> I would be sent to an elderly great-aunt's for about a week each summer

starting when I was 6 years old up until I was 10 or so, and it was nice to have

a break from nada. But like you experienced, it was kind of lonely; there were

no other kids to play with, and I was afraid of my aunt when I was smaller. I

was afraid of all adults, really; particularly women. I thought that sooner or

later my aunt would explode, and scream at me and hit me like nada did, so I was

on my best behavior. This aunt never did rage at me, she was very even tempered

and sweet, liked kids and was good with them, so eventually I grew to trust her

more.

>

> It just occurred to me that I was always alone at my Aunt's, so I wonder if my

little Sister stayed home with our nada or if she got sent somewhere else? I'll

have to ask her.

>

> -Annie

>

[Guest guest]

ick, no that is NOT NORMAL to put your child in the proximity of a child

molester among adults whom they know damn well are not going to protect her, and

then act like it was *your* responsibility to protect yourself...that is highly

abnormal, according to the therapists whom I have told about what my mother did

to me (same thing, the molester was my grandfather i was sent to stay with).

So your mom just slid right out of the gray area, she didn't act in your best

interest and she put you in harm's way, so clearly these 'vacations' were for

her benefit and not yours.

I think it's normal if the child is going to enjoy the stay and be safe and

adequately taken care of. Not so in your case, you were not safe around that

guy, and your mom seems to have had a glaring lack of concern.

--- Iatopn WTOAdultChildren1 , " eliza92@... " wrote:

>

> Hi Fiona, overall I was okay with going to my grandparents but I was lonely -

there were no other kids and nothing to do there. Also to add to the fun my

mother and her sister told me that her sister got molested by my an uncle and

that my grandparents didn't do anything about it. They told me, just be careful

not to be alone with him - and this is someone who often visited my

grandparents. So that was pretty icky. But yeah...my nada probably did need a

break. She was more of a nada with less emotional control when I was young, so

maybe she did need a break to collect herself. I was a meek and trouble-free

kid though I occasionally pointed out that she was wrong about something when it

was really important - this made her explode of course. In a way being at my

grandparents was a break for me, but life was empty either way. Pretty sad,

huh? Glad I'm not a kid anymore.

>

> Eliza

>

>

> >

> > I notice a few parents in my older daughter's (13 yo) class do that: they'll

drop their kids off with family for the whole summer or part of it.

> >

> > I wonder as well if they need a break from parenting. Sometimes, to be

honest, I wouldn't mind dropping my teen off with someone else for a bit.

Lately, esp, it's difficult to even have a conversation with her.

> >

> > I'm sure there are situations where the kids love it and the parents are

relieved to have their kids supervised by loving people who are safe people for

their kids.

> >

> > Did you like going to your grandparents' house? I don't know if your mother

was a single parent, if she felt overwhelmed...?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

LLell1, thanks for the validation...yeah my nada often put me in positions where

it was up to me to protect myself while still a kid. My grandfather stayed in

touch and good terms with his brother for his entire life. It was never clear

that my grandfather even knew, but my grandmother definitely did - and my aunt

never got any justice and she too seemed to accept the cover up. They acted

like they were doing me a big favor " warning " me once I reached puberty to watch

out! Speaking of father's day, same thing, she spent all this time telling me

what a monster he was (and he actually was an unsavory guy) and then sent me off

to visitations with him while telling me she was afraid he'd kidnap me. I got

so scared I'd be sick for days before a visit but she still said I had to see

him. Oh the memories.

Eliza

>

>

> ick, no that is NOT NORMAL to put your child in the proximity of a child

molester among adults whom they know damn well are not going to protect her, and

then act like it was *your* responsibility to protect yourself...that is highly

abnormal, according to the therapists whom I have told about what my mother did

to me (same thing, the molester was my grandfather i was sent to stay with).

>

> So your mom just slid right out of the gray area, she didn't act in your best

interest and she put you in harm's way, so clearly these 'vacations' were for

her benefit and not yours.

>

> I think it's normal if the child is going to enjoy the stay and be safe and

adequately taken care of. Not so in your case, you were not safe around that

guy, and your mom seems to have had a glaring lack of concern.

>

[Guest guest]

Wow. That just poleaxes me with shock and horror: to deliberately send your

child to stay with a known molester/child rapist (or even to send your child

where he or she is highly likely to encounter a known molester because s/he is a

regular visitor to the household.

But to relay to your terrified child in detail what is very likely going to

happen to her, beforehand... just plumbs the depths of sadism, in my book. I

have a hard time even comprehending that a mother could inflict that level of

emotional torture, although I believe its true.

I guess its hard to accept that there are such sadistic monsters among us that

appear on the surface to be human beings.

I just cannot wrap my mind around such actions from a mother.

Its got to be an indication of psychopathy. A psychopath can enjoy torturing

other living things to death sometimes, just because they're bored and have

nothing better to do. Or, perhaps out of a sense of entitlement to get

" payback " . But then, again, how a mother can feel such intense resentment toward

or hatred for her own child that she would do such a thing, send her own child

to be raped, is just beyond understanding. Its such a profound betrayal of

everything " motherhood " is supposed to mean.

I'm so sorry this has happened to any members here. I wish there was a magic

wand that could erase the hurt and see justice done. I guess all any of us can

do is go forward, try to heal as best we can, and not silently let this happen

to other children whenever humanly possible.

-Annie

>

> LLell1, thanks for the validation...yeah my nada often put me in positions

where it was up to me to protect myself while still a kid. My grandfather

stayed in touch and good terms with his brother for his entire life. It was

never clear that my grandfather even knew, but my grandmother definitely did -

and my aunt never got any justice and she too seemed to accept the cover up.

They acted like they were doing me a big favor " warning " me once I reached

puberty to watch out! Speaking of father's day, same thing, she spent all

this time telling me what a monster he was (and he actually was an unsavory guy)

and then sent me off to visitations with him while telling me she was afraid

he'd kidnap me. I got so scared I'd be sick for days before a visit but she

still said I had to see him. Oh the memories.

>

> Eliza

[Guest guest]

You know the weird part Annie? In the mental list I have of wounds and

outrages, being sent up there for weeks where I might encounter Uncle X was

hardly on the list! I just took things at face value that they were warning me

of a danger - represented as a loving act. And oddly enough I think they truly

saw it that way. The levels of denial and lies run deep in my family. The

concept that it was their job to make sure I was never put at risk or had to be

in fear of molestation....never entered my mind for a long time. That

brainwashing is powerful stuff.

I'm with you I wish that not even one more child should ever have to be raised

by crazy people.

Eliza

>

> Wow. That just poleaxes me with shock and horror: to deliberately send your

child to stay with a known molester/child rapist (or even to send your child

where he or she is highly likely to encounter a known molester because s/he is a

regular visitor to the household.

>

> But to relay to your terrified child in detail what is very likely going to

happen to her, beforehand... just plumbs the depths of sadism, in my book. I

have a hard time even comprehending that a mother could inflict that level of

emotional torture, although I believe its true.

>

> I guess its hard to accept that there are such sadistic monsters among us that

appear on the surface to be human beings.

>

> I just cannot wrap my mind around such actions from a mother.

>

> Its got to be an indication of psychopathy. A psychopath can enjoy torturing

other living things to death sometimes, just because they're bored and have

nothing better to do. Or, perhaps out of a sense of entitlement to get

" payback " . But then, again, how a mother can feel such intense resentment toward

or hatred for her own child that she would do such a thing, send her own child

to be raped, is just beyond understanding. Its such a profound betrayal of

everything " motherhood " is supposed to mean.

>

> I'm so sorry this has happened to any members here. I wish there was a magic

wand that could erase the hurt and see justice done. I guess all any of us can

do is go forward, try to heal as best we can, and not silently let this happen

to other children whenever humanly possible.

>

> -Annie

[Guest guest]

" Go play with the nice doggie, honey. He has rabies, so, don't let him get

close enough to you to bite you, OK? Just pet him very carefully. "

That's about the level of insanity we're talking about here. Not just in your

case, but in other posts here where the bpd mother sent her child to the

molester's house to stay for a while.

You're right, no child should be left in the care of someone who would thrust

her child into the cage with the rabid dog, and tell her to just be careful.

Honey. Dearest.

Its beyond mind boggling, into the dementia realm. And its ghastly.

-Annie

> >

> > Wow. That just poleaxes me with shock and horror: to deliberately send your

child to stay with a known molester/child rapist (or even to send your child

where he or she is highly likely to encounter a known molester because s/he is a

regular visitor to the household.

> >

> > But to relay to your terrified child in detail what is very likely going to

happen to her, beforehand... just plumbs the depths of sadism, in my book. I

have a hard time even comprehending that a mother could inflict that level of

emotional torture, although I believe its true.

> >

> > I guess its hard to accept that there are such sadistic monsters among us

that appear on the surface to be human beings.

> >

> > I just cannot wrap my mind around such actions from a mother.

> >

> > Its got to be an indication of psychopathy. A psychopath can enjoy torturing

other living things to death sometimes, just because they're bored and have

nothing better to do. Or, perhaps out of a sense of entitlement to get

" payback " . But then, again, how a mother can feel such intense resentment toward

or hatred for her own child that she would do such a thing, send her own child

to be raped, is just beyond understanding. Its such a profound betrayal of

everything " motherhood " is supposed to mean.

> >

> > I'm so sorry this has happened to any members here. I wish there was a magic

wand that could erase the hurt and see justice done. I guess all any of us can

do is go forward, try to heal as best we can, and not silently let this happen

to other children whenever humanly possible.

> >

> > -Annie

>

[Guest guest]

I can understand that it was incidental to you but as an adult it is proof that

you need in order to validate your gut instinct that she was vacationing from

being a parent like you said, because that is such a high level of risk and she

did not care. Bless your heart, I have to say, that makes my heart heavy.

> >

> > Wow. That just poleaxes me with shock and horror: to deliberately send your

child to stay with a known molester/child rapist (or even to send your child

where he or she is highly likely to encounter a known molester because s/he is a

regular visitor to the household.

> >

> > But to relay to your terrified child in detail what is very likely going to

happen to her, beforehand... just plumbs the depths of sadism, in my book. I

have a hard time even comprehending that a mother could inflict that level of

emotional torture, although I believe its true.

> >

> > I guess its hard to accept that there are such sadistic monsters among us

that appear on the surface to be human beings.

> >

> > I just cannot wrap my mind around such actions from a mother.

> >

> > Its got to be an indication of psychopathy. A psychopath can enjoy torturing

other living things to death sometimes, just because they're bored and have

nothing better to do. Or, perhaps out of a sense of entitlement to get

" payback " . But then, again, how a mother can feel such intense resentment toward

or hatred for her own child that she would do such a thing, send her own child

to be raped, is just beyond understanding. Its such a profound betrayal of

everything " motherhood " is supposed to mean.

> >

> > I'm so sorry this has happened to any members here. I wish there was a magic

wand that could erase the hurt and see justice done. I guess all any of us can

do is go forward, try to heal as best we can, and not silently let this happen

to other children whenever humanly possible.

> >

> > -Annie

>

[Guest guest]

I spent the better part of every summer with older family members. It was

my safe refuge and blessing, and probably the reason I'm not an axe

murderer. They had never had children of their own, so dealing with me was a

bit of an enigma, but there wasn't a cruel or unkind bone in their bodies.

That being said, they were also passive, naive, and avoidant, kind of like

Pollyanna marrying a sweet natured, very deaf, Mr. Magoo, and I realized, at

a very early age that among the three of us, I was about 4) that I was more

on aware of the dangers and pitfalls around us than they were. I knew that I

would be the one to recognize danger first. and as soon as I could took

precautions to protect* them*. I answered the phone, the front door, and

managed the front desk at their business, and dealt with deliveries. It

wasn't that they didn't do these things when I wasn't there, but that they

were oblivous to the delivery guy who would occasionally walk out the back

door with product under his jacket, or way too people who would " forget " to

pay their bills, yet demand additional services. This was a very very small

town, and some issues had to be dealt with carefully, or avoided altogether,

but I took it all on like a pit bull. My great aunt recounted one affable

but negligent customer saying, " well, schools out, I recken she'll (me) be

coming soon, I guess I better pay my bill.) I was twelve.

At their home I was afraid of other people being allowed to cause harm

or reak havoc. At my parents home I was afraid of my parents.

Most of my childhood imagination play had to do with surviving disaster,

finding safe places to reorganize and thrive, and I read all of the

survival, gardening, how to books and articles I could get ahold of. As an

adult I have wrestled with issues of anxiety, depression, and irregular

sleep patterns, but manage these issues with covert home improvement

projects. I've been known to tear out walls, lay tile, and paint in the wee

hours of the mourning. (oops-freudian typo ! ) 2 to 4 in the morning are

the safest times for me, all the fighting was usually over with by then,

and I could sort things out.

The issue of child endangerment addressed in earlier posts is too much

and too close to home for me to respond to right now, I am appalled,

disgusted, enraged and infuriated. I wish I could go back in time for all of

us...

Sunspot

[Guest guest]

Llell1, I didn't mean to give the wrong impression - incidental isn't the word

I'd use to describe it. Just that because I was lucky enough that nothing bad

did happen that in my list of effed up stuff I have to recover from it's lower

down. Writing about it here has helped me to see it in a new light though.

Also to realize that I wasn't able to see my grandparents in the same positive

light after that - knowing they did nothing after my aunt was molested really

tarnished them for me. On one hand it was good that I knew, on the other hand

11 or 12 seems pretty early to have to know such things especially about

relatives who'd been a safe haven before.

Thanks to you and everyone for your sympathy. Not many places one can talk

about these kind of things.

Eliza

>

> I can understand that it was incidental to you but as an adult it is proof

that you need in order to validate your gut instinct that she was vacationing

from being a parent like you said, because that is such a high level of risk and

she did not care. Bless your heart, I have to say, that makes my heart heavy.

[Guest guest]

Wow, Sunspot, it's like you didn't have a childhood. You were too busy raising

the adults.

I hope you're making up now for lost time.

Fiona

>

> I spent the better part of every summer with older family members. It was

> my safe refuge and blessing, and probably the reason I'm not an axe

> murderer. They had never had children of their own, so dealing with me was a

> bit of an enigma, but there wasn't a cruel or unkind bone in their bodies.

> That being said, they were also passive, naive, and avoidant, kind of like

> Pollyanna marrying a sweet natured, very deaf, Mr. Magoo, and I realized, at

> a very early age that among the three of us, I was about 4) that I was more

> on aware of the dangers and pitfalls around us than they were. I knew that I

> would be the one to recognize danger first. and as soon as I could took

> precautions to protect* them*. I answered the phone, the front door, and

> managed the front desk at their business, and dealt with deliveries. It

> wasn't that they didn't do these things when I wasn't there, but that they

> were oblivous to the delivery guy who would occasionally walk out the back

> door with product under his jacket, or way too people who would " forget " to

> pay their bills, yet demand additional services. This was a very very small

> town, and some issues had to be dealt with carefully, or avoided altogether,

> but I took it all on like a pit bull. My great aunt recounted one affable

> but negligent customer saying, " well, schools out, I recken she'll (me) be

> coming soon, I guess I better pay my bill.) I was twelve.

> At their home I was afraid of other people being allowed to cause harm

> or reak havoc. At my parents home I was afraid of my parents.

> Most of my childhood imagination play had to do with surviving disaster,

> finding safe places to reorganize and thrive, and I read all of the

> survival, gardening, how to books and articles I could get ahold of. As an

> adult I have wrestled with issues of anxiety, depression, and irregular

> sleep patterns, but manage these issues with covert home improvement

> projects. I've been known to tear out walls, lay tile, and paint in the wee

> hours of the mourning. (oops-freudian typo ! ) 2 to 4 in the morning are

> the safest times for me, all the fighting was usually over with by then,

> and I could sort things out.

> The issue of child endangerment addressed in earlier posts is too much

> and too close to home for me to respond to right now, I am appalled,

> disgusted, enraged and infuriated. I wish I could go back in time for all of

> us...

> Sunspot

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

* It ain't the monsters under the bed. . .* we were,to our Nadas and

Fadas, nothing more than theatrical props for their own weird form of BPD

theater.

It has taken me the better part of 50 years to even begin to " get " this

concept.* We are nothing more than props. *They have about as much

attachment for their children (or anyone else, for that matter) as they

would a fan, satin shoes or a floppy hat with feathers*.* We might be a *

favorite* pair of satin shoes, but none the less, still a prop. We were

just a little trick of stagecraft. Imagine how incongruous it is for the

BPD, when their prop has needs and makes demands! Not behavior one would

expect from a nice potted plant or pair of velvet drapes!

I think this is where their reptilian rage kicks in, when we act " out of

character, " or rather outside of the* supporting character/role *which they

have fantasized and manufactured *for* us. Our own needs come as an angry

surprise to them. They do not responds to our childhood needs out of love

and compassion, or even duty, but because these are photo ops with which to

bolster their own persona. It seems to me, that their bizarre acts of

emotional sadism, sabotage, character assassination, and truth bombs are

attempts to get us to " perform " our role, and to support the

role-of-the-moment they have chosen for them-self. For the BPD, Parenthood

can be taken off and put back on like a costume. Thus we are easily shipped

off to other family members, friends, etc. Sometimes this is a good thing,

sometimes not, sometimes it's a mixed bag.

It seems to me that my own Nada had no solid core of personhood. There

was always an " as if " quality to her behavior. In her interactions with

others, she appeared to me to be acting. She would *appear* to be

compassionate, understanding and forthright, and then later say ugly and

mean spirited things about the person, or use the information her compassion

had elicited to harm the person in some secret, vicious way.

Control, manipulation and revenge seem to be their main motivations in

life. They don't need any other motivations for harming someone else. If

you have your own opinion, preference, comfort level, or issues, than no

holds are barred in their propaganda campaigns to straighten you out.

This has been the long way to coming around to the deeply disturbing

account of Eliza's Nada sending her off to spend time in the proximity of a

known molester. My own Nada would send me into situations wherein she knew I

was in peril of assault, ( she left me in the private care of a physician in

another state, for an implied but unspecified disorder for which I have

never had a satisfactory explanation, but I'm pretty sure I just had a

kidney infection, I was *not *pregnant, I did* not *have an STD, as she has

implied...) without leaving me any money, a way to get home, or way to

contact family or friends. ) This jerk tried to bully me into having sexual

relations, he had also made advances to one of my aunts, and others. When I

told Nada what had happened to me, she laughed and recounted anecdotes of

other peoples encounters and near misses with the molester. When I would ask

her, why, if she knew this was a potential issue, would she place me in

harms way, she would smirk, and say, " well nothing happened did it? " and

imply that somehow things had to be done in this way because of some

character flaw or defect of my own.

My heart aches and rages every time I think of you, being sent off to your

grandparents, who added their own brand of terror to your experience by

failing to defend your aunt.

As I was saying at the beginning of my note, * " It aint the monsters under

the bed we really had to worry about, i*t *was the ones coming in to kiss us

goodnight. " * God help us. Sunspot

[Guest guest]

I agree totally. I think that way too many nadas with Cluster B personality

disorders or combo-packs of pds are unable to relate to their children as the

separate, individual human beings that they are, and instead view them as mere

objects, props, or possessions.

Or, perhaps as extensions of their own self, like an extra arm they grew. Like

you said, it would be bizarre and shocking if somehow your own arm were to

express its own opinion about something.

Anyone who is unable to relate to their own child as the separate, individual

human being that they are should not be raising the child, in my opinion.

And anyone who would deliberately, consciously choose to put their child in

harm's way is depraved and should be arrested. I'm that angry and upset about

women who knowingly expose their child to dangerous people and situations. This

includes women who deliberately make their child sick so the mother can get

sympathy and attention, women who leave their young children alone for days or

weeks at a time to fend for themselves, or leave them to die horrible deaths

from heat stroke in cars, who deny their child medical care, or leave them alone

with known child molesters, who knowingly expose their child to predation by

bullies or to attack by vicious animals... Its all just horrible, sickening,

and criminal, in my opinion.

Some things just really make me want to promote bringing back public floggings,

you know?

-Annie

>

> * It ain't the monsters under the bed. . .* we were,to our Nadas and

> Fadas, nothing more than theatrical props for their own weird form of BPD

> theater.

> It has taken me the better part of 50 years to even begin to " get " this

> concept.* We are nothing more than props. *They have about as much

> attachment for their children (or anyone else, for that matter) as they

> would a fan, satin shoes or a floppy hat with feathers*.* We might be a *

> favorite* pair of satin shoes, but none the less, still a prop. We were

> just a little trick of stagecraft. Imagine how incongruous it is for the

> BPD, when their prop has needs and makes demands! Not behavior one would

> expect from a nice potted plant or pair of velvet drapes!

> I think this is where their reptilian rage kicks in, when we act " out of

> character, " or rather outside of the* supporting character/role *which they

> have fantasized and manufactured *for* us. Our own needs come as an angry

> surprise to them. They do not responds to our childhood needs out of love

> and compassion, or even duty, but because these are photo ops with which to

> bolster their own persona. It seems to me, that their bizarre acts of

> emotional sadism, sabotage, character assassination, and truth bombs are

> attempts to get us to " perform " our role, and to support the

> role-of-the-moment they have chosen for them-self. For the BPD, Parenthood

> can be taken off and put back on like a costume. Thus we are easily shipped

> off to other family members, friends, etc. Sometimes this is a good thing,

> sometimes not, sometimes it's a mixed bag.

> It seems to me that my own Nada had no solid core of personhood. There

> was always an " as if " quality to her behavior. In her interactions with

> others, she appeared to me to be acting. She would *appear* to be

> compassionate, understanding and forthright, and then later say ugly and

> mean spirited things about the person, or use the information her compassion

> had elicited to harm the person in some secret, vicious way.

> Control, manipulation and revenge seem to be their main motivations in

> life. They don't need any other motivations for harming someone else. If

> you have your own opinion, preference, comfort level, or issues, than no

> holds are barred in their propaganda campaigns to straighten you out.

> This has been the long way to coming around to the deeply disturbing

> account of Eliza's Nada sending her off to spend time in the proximity of a

> known molester. My own Nada would send me into situations wherein she knew I

> was in peril of assault, ( she left me in the private care of a physician in

> another state, for an implied but unspecified disorder for which I have

> never had a satisfactory explanation, but I'm pretty sure I just had a

> kidney infection, I was *not *pregnant, I did* not *have an STD, as she has

> implied...) without leaving me any money, a way to get home, or way to

> contact family or friends. ) This jerk tried to bully me into having sexual

> relations, he had also made advances to one of my aunts, and others. When I

> told Nada what had happened to me, she laughed and recounted anecdotes of

> other peoples encounters and near misses with the molester. When I would ask

> her, why, if she knew this was a potential issue, would she place me in

> harms way, she would smirk, and say, " well nothing happened did it? " and

> imply that somehow things had to be done in this way because of some

> character flaw or defect of my own.

> My heart aches and rages every time I think of you, being sent off to your

> grandparents, who added their own brand of terror to your experience by

> failing to defend your aunt.

> As I was saying at the beginning of my note, * " It aint the monsters under

> the bed we really had to worry about, i*t *was the ones coming in to kiss us

> goodnight. " * God help us. Sunspot

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Fiona!

Thanks for the good wishes! I guess most of us missed out on childhood.

Where we all came from, " child " just wasn't safe to be. But then

adolescence, teen, and adult weren't a bag of jelly beans for many of us

either . ~ But, we survived ! ! ! We may be bruised, battered, and a

little monkeyed up, but we survived. We can heal. And thanks to this amazing

forum, we have each others voices when the fog rolls in, and the pain

becomes to great to bear alone. Damn, thats a lot!

Life is Gooooood !

Sunspot[?]

[Guest guest]

No, I understood your meaning, I just wanted to continue to validate you,

because I am in the process of working on that in therapy since my therapist

thinks one of the major ways in which I lacked in childhood was being validated,

probably why I am seeing the need to validate everywhere.

> >

> > I can understand that it was incidental to you but as an adult it is proof

that you need in order to validate your gut instinct that she was vacationing

from being a parent like you said, because that is such a high level of risk and

she did not care. Bless your heart, I have to say, that makes my heart heavy.

>