Feeling Stuck

[Guest guest]

I'm on my own, finally living away from home. It's a huge relief.

But of course, as I'm sure many of you have experienced, the effects of the

phone calls are still as intense. My parents insist on calling me daily. If they

don't hear from me one day they freak out. I moved out to be on my own, but if

they need to hear every single detail of my day, every day, it just doesn't

work.

I don't want to become more and more enmeshed with them as I try and move on

with my own life. Part of me thinks it's terribly cruel to just not call someone

who has legit abandonment fears. I feel like I need a good enough excuse to not

call but I don't know what that could be. I really could put aside 5 minutes/day

to call if I wanted to. If I don't call, they'll take it personally and they

KNOW that I do have the time to call. I don't know how to set the limit to not

call AND to give them a sufficient reason why I can't call. I hate to lie, but I

also can't give them no reason at all and just not call. Being " too busy " one

night just isn't enough. They'll read right through it.

So I'm stuck between continuing to walk on eggshells in order to maintain their

sanity (and therefore, my sanity...see a problem?!), or risking a lot and hoping

they won't explode and that I won't freak out from guilt by not calling one

night. I really don't want to go on enmeshed like this, but I also don't know

how to slowly let go, in a way that preserves my sanity.

[Guest guest]

It sounds like they are setting the boundaries around when you will be calling.

Maybe if you set up the details of the next call each time you could start

spacing them out.

" I'll be working late (or going out with friends, etc.), so I won't call

tomorrow but will do so Friday, when I get home around 6. "

Maybe this way, you will be able to satisfy their needs concerning not being

abandoned, yet putting you in the driver's seat about being master of your time.

And if they call early and yell at you, you have the high road of " I told you I

would call at x time. It is not x time yet so you have no reason to be upset

with me. "

This will be tricky for you, but on the bright side you are on your own, a huge

step in itself. Now you need to set boundaries about your personal time: with

your parents, your peers, bosses, etc. Might as well start now--it gets easier.

There is an Irish saying " Begin as you mean to go on. " Not setting boundaries

until later tends to cause more agitation: they get angry that you are changing

the rules.

Good luck! & happy housewarming!

>

> I'm on my own, finally living away from home. It's a huge relief.

>

> But of course, as I'm sure many of you have experienced, the effects of the

phone calls are still as intense. My parents insist on calling me daily. If they

don't hear from me one day they freak out. I moved out to be on my own, but if

they need to hear every single detail of my day, every day, it just doesn't

work.

>

> I don't want to become more and more enmeshed with them as I try and move on

with my own life. Part of me thinks it's terribly cruel to just not call someone

who has legit abandonment fears. I feel like I need a good enough excuse to not

call but I don't know what that could be. I really could put aside 5 minutes/day

to call if I wanted to. If I don't call, they'll take it personally and they

KNOW that I do have the time to call. I don't know how to set the limit to not

call AND to give them a sufficient reason why I can't call. I hate to lie, but I

also can't give them no reason at all and just not call. Being " too busy " one

night just isn't enough. They'll read right through it.

>

> So I'm stuck between continuing to walk on eggshells in order to maintain

their sanity (and therefore, my sanity...see a problem?!), or risking a lot and

hoping they won't explode and that I won't freak out from guilt by not calling

one night. I really don't want to go on enmeshed like this, but I also don't

know how to slowly let go, in a way that preserves my sanity.

>

[Guest guest]

I wish I had done something about this sooner. I let my Nada decide how often

we would talk. Most of the time she was jobless, so she expected an hour a day,

almost every day. She got a job for 4 years, and during that time, she was

content with once a week. When I suggested she was calling too much, she

attacked me, threatening to disown me (oh please don't!).

Eventually, after being tortured for years from this, after the ringing of the

phone made my stomach turn and I would get diarrhea after talking to her, I lost

it. I screamed at her and now I'm pretty much NC.

Part of the problem was, I didn't have enough going on in my life. I didn't

have a boyfriend. I didn't go out a lot. I didn't have a ton of hobbies. As

far as she was concerned, if I was not at work, I needed to give her whatever

time she wanted.

I recommend *getting more busy for real*. THEN, just be straight with them.

Tell them every day phone calls are too much for you. You are grown up now and

you do not need to be checking in with your parents. Then YOU decide how much

is enough. I would recommend twice a week (for now). Tell them you will call

them on Wednesday and Sunday. Period. They will cry, but I am telling you,

setting boundaries once you move out is *so much easier* than waiting another 15

years. Trust me on this!

Or if that's too much go to every other day. Find a way to make yourself

busier. Volunteering, joining a softball league, meetup.com groups, anything!

Being more busy will help them to understand that you're not calling as much.

But as for the excuse: " Every day is too much for me. I'm a grown adult. I

need my space. " Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. If harranguing starts? " OK, sorry

you're upset. Gotta go now. " CLICK.

[Guest guest]

Only you can figure out what's going to work in your situation; you're the only

one with all the info.

But here's a suggestion: maybe try just telling them the truth but couch it in

" I " statements. Something like:

" Mom and Dad, from now on I'm going to call you every (Sunday) at (10AM) and we

can catch up with each other then. See, when I call you every day, I don't feel

as grown up and independent as I should be feeling. I'm an adult now, and I

need to trust myself more, and I need to be making my own decisions. When I

talk to you every day, it feels to me like I'm " reporting " to you and getting

your " permission " to have made this or that decision. So, its not you, its me:

I need to feel more responsible and independent now. So, I'll talk to you on

Sunday! Love you, bye. "

You're not being mean or hateful, your boundary is very reasonable; you're just

asserting your right to your own privacy and space and respect as an adult. AND

you are not asking their permission to do this, you're telling them that from

now on you will call them once a week.

What it boils down to is that your bpd parents don't like you being an adult;

they want you reporting in every day like you are still a child because, yes,

they fear abandonment.

You are not responsible for their feelings. Your parents are responsible for

handling their own feelings; they can always seek therapy for themselves if

they're having trouble with feelings of abandonment. That's what therapy is

for. You are not their therapist, you are not 9 years old, and its

inappropriate of them to require you to submit to them a minute-by-minute report

of your life each day.

So, anyway... maybe presenting your boundary in the form of " I " statements will

help. If it resonates with you, give it a shot. Its your call.

-Annie

>

> I'm on my own, finally living away from home. It's a huge relief.

>

> But of course, as I'm sure many of you have experienced, the effects of the

phone calls are still as intense. My parents insist on calling me daily. If they

don't hear from me one day they freak out. I moved out to be on my own, but if

they need to hear every single detail of my day, every day, it just doesn't

work.

>

> I don't want to become more and more enmeshed with them as I try and move on

with my own life. Part of me thinks it's terribly cruel to just not call someone

who has legit abandonment fears. I feel like I need a good enough excuse to not

call but I don't know what that could be. I really could put aside 5 minutes/day

to call if I wanted to. If I don't call, they'll take it personally and they

KNOW that I do have the time to call. I don't know how to set the limit to not

call AND to give them a sufficient reason why I can't call. I hate to lie, but I

also can't give them no reason at all and just not call. Being " too busy " one

night just isn't enough. They'll read right through it.

>

> So I'm stuck between continuing to walk on eggshells in order to maintain

their sanity (and therefore, my sanity...see a problem?!), or risking a lot and

hoping they won't explode and that I won't freak out from guilt by not calling

one night. I really don't want to go on enmeshed like this, but I also don't

know how to slowly let go, in a way that preserves my sanity.

>

[Guest guest]

they have each other, you are the one that is alone. I wouldn't worry about

their 'abandonment issues' or maintaining their sanity...they have each other to

turn to for support.

take care of yourself, and you can always change any limits you set if it

doesn't work, that is your prerogatve.

if you can't stand talking once a day, change to every three days. if that

drives you up the wall, move it back to once a week or once a month or never.

it's ALL up to you.

>

> I'm on my own, finally living away from home. It's a huge relief.

>

> But of course, as I'm sure many of you have experienced, the effects of the

phone calls are still as intense. My parents insist on calling me daily. If they

don't hear from me one day they freak out. I moved out to be on my own, but if

they need to hear every single detail of my day, every day, it just doesn't

work.

>

> I don't want to become more and more enmeshed with them as I try and move on

with my own life. Part of me thinks it's terribly cruel to just not call someone

who has legit abandonment fears. I feel like I need a good enough excuse to not

call but I don't know what that could be. I really could put aside 5 minutes/day

to call if I wanted to. If I don't call, they'll take it personally and they

KNOW that I do have the time to call. I don't know how to set the limit to not

call AND to give them a sufficient reason why I can't call. I hate to lie, but I

also can't give them no reason at all and just not call. Being " too busy " one

night just isn't enough. They'll read right through it.

>

> So I'm stuck between continuing to walk on eggshells in order to maintain

their sanity (and therefore, my sanity...see a problem?!), or risking a lot and

hoping they won't explode and that I won't freak out from guilt by not calling

one night. I really don't want to go on enmeshed like this, but I also don't

know how to slowly let go, in a way that preserves my sanity.

>

[Guest guest]

" As far as she was concerned, if I was not at work, I needed to give her

whatever time she wanted. "

Wow, yes, that's how my mother is. Sometimes I wonder if I got married, a full

time job, and kids just to get away from her. I don't think I did, but it

worked out well in that way.

My brother is single, so she assumes he should move in with her so she's not

alone. She can't imagine that he would like to develop a life of his own.

>

> I wish I had done something about this sooner. I let my Nada decide how often

we would talk. Most of the time she was jobless, so she expected an hour a day,

almost every day. She got a job for 4 years, and during that time, she was

content with once a week. When I suggested she was calling too much, she

attacked me, threatening to disown me (oh please don't!).

>

> Eventually, after being tortured for years from this, after the ringing of the

phone made my stomach turn and I would get diarrhea after talking to her, I lost

it. I screamed at her and now I'm pretty much NC.

>

> Part of the problem was, I didn't have enough going on in my life. I didn't

have a boyfriend. I didn't go out a lot. I didn't have a ton of hobbies. As

far as she was concerned, if I was not at work, I needed to give her whatever

time she wanted.

>

> I recommend *getting more busy for real*. THEN, just be straight with them.

Tell them every day phone calls are too much for you. You are grown up now and

you do not need to be checking in with your parents. Then YOU decide how much

is enough. I would recommend twice a week (for now). Tell them you will call

them on Wednesday and Sunday. Period. They will cry, but I am telling you,

setting boundaries once you move out is *so much easier* than waiting another 15

years. Trust me on this!

>

> Or if that's too much go to every other day. Find a way to make yourself

busier. Volunteering, joining a softball league, meetup.com groups, anything!

>

> Being more busy will help them to understand that you're not calling as much.

But as for the excuse: " Every day is too much for me. I'm a grown adult. I

need my space. " Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. If harranguing starts? " OK, sorry

you're upset. Gotta go now. " CLICK.

>

[Guest guest]

I should preface this by saying that I have a deep resentment streak in me from

parents who did exactly the same thing, and this sometimes surfaced in

less-than-socially-correct ways, especially when I was in late adolescence and

my frontal cortex had not fully developed enough to harness my impulse control.

What I did: I lied my pants off. I created an entirely fictional list of

extracurricular activities that simply made it impossible for me to comply with

their demands. As far as my parents were concerned, I was at bible study. I was

volunteering in the neonatal intensive care unit. I was fostering elderly dogs

that needed to be shuttled to regular medical appointments. As far as my parents

were concerned, I was the pious doormat they always wanted, when in reality I

was either at the gym or a frat party (ah, college!) This was only made possible

by the fact that my college was over ten hours away from them and they had

absolutely no way of knowing what the actual truth was. End result: they were

happy, I was happy.

I should add that to this day I have a clear conscience about lying to them as

much as I did. I wouldn't have survived as an individual otherwise. Lying made

it a level playing ground. They lied to me for my entire life, so clearly the

truth--the actual truth--doesn't interest them, scares them, or threatens their

worldview somehow. I was at a stage in my life that hearing their negative

comments about my *actual* experiences would have threatened my development as a

person. I had to maintain at least a superficial relationship with them as they

were still paying a small portion of my tuition. So, I lied. A lot.

Would I do it again? At this stage in my life, no. I have no need for them and I

actually am a strong advocate for honesty. If I were still dependent on them in

some way, maybe. As has been said here before, you can't rationalize with

irrational people. In a similar vein, I believe you have no obligation to be

truthful with liars.

In effect, our BPD parents are lying to us, habitually. We're not ugly or

stupid. People won't think you're an axe-murderer because your chinos aren't

pressed. A ringing telephone does not mean someone died, and the one car that

trundles past your home daily is not likely to be the flashpoint for rural

America's epidemic of drive-by shootings. You don't get HIV from toilet seats.

Not all women wear dresses to church. Disagreeing with your parents does not

mean you've been brainwashed. If your parents are anything like mine, they are

fine, upstanding, unrelenting liars.

Okay, I've gone on too long (there's that resentment streak again), but bottom

line: save yourself first. If that means lying, this lone voice in the

wilderness will support you.

> >

> > I'm on my own, finally living away from home. It's a huge relief.

> >

> > But of course, as I'm sure many of you have experienced, the effects of the

phone calls are still as intense. My parents insist on calling me daily. If they

don't hear from me one day they freak out. I moved out to be on my own, but if

they need to hear every single detail of my day, every day, it just doesn't

work.

> >

> > I don't want to become more and more enmeshed with them as I try and move on

with my own life. Part of me thinks it's terribly cruel to just not call someone

who has legit abandonment fears. I feel like I need a good enough excuse to not

call but I don't know what that could be. I really could put aside 5 minutes/day

to call if I wanted to. If I don't call, they'll take it personally and they

KNOW that I do have the time to call. I don't know how to set the limit to not

call AND to give them a sufficient reason why I can't call. I hate to lie, but I

also can't give them no reason at all and just not call. Being " too busy " one

night just isn't enough. They'll read right through it.

> >

> > So I'm stuck between continuing to walk on eggshells in order to maintain

their sanity (and therefore, my sanity...see a problem?!), or risking a lot and

hoping they won't explode and that I won't freak out from guilt by not calling

one night. I really don't want to go on enmeshed like this, but I also don't

know how to slowly let go, in a way that preserves my sanity.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

The abandonment issues of a grown woman are not your problem!!!!!!

Live your life - make a beautiful life for yourself. Work your ass off at it

and follow your dreams. Your nada made her choices and let her wallow in

them.

Good luck XOXO

> **

>

>

> " As far as she was concerned, if I was not at work, I needed to give her

> whatever time she wanted. "

>

> Wow, yes, that's how my mother is. Sometimes I wonder if I got married, a

> full time job, and kids just to get away from her. I don't think I did, but

> it worked out well in that way.

>

> My brother is single, so she assumes he should move in with her so she's

> not alone. She can't imagine that he would like to develop a life of his

> own.

>

>

>

> >

> > I wish I had done something about this sooner. I let my Nada decide how

> often we would talk. Most of the time she was jobless, so she expected an

> hour a day, almost every day. She got a job for 4 years, and during that

> time, she was content with once a week. When I suggested she was calling too

> much, she attacked me, threatening to disown me (oh please don't!).

> >

> > Eventually, after being tortured for years from this, after the ringing

> of the phone made my stomach turn and I would get diarrhea after talking to

> her, I lost it. I screamed at her and now I'm pretty much NC.

> >

> > Part of the problem was, I didn't have enough going on in my life. I

> didn't have a boyfriend. I didn't go out a lot. I didn't have a ton of

> hobbies. As far as she was concerned, if I was not at work, I needed to give

> her whatever time she wanted.

> >

> > I recommend *getting more busy for real*. THEN, just be straight with

> them. Tell them every day phone calls are too much for you. You are grown up

> now and you do not need to be checking in with your parents. Then YOU decide

> how much is enough. I would recommend twice a week (for now). Tell them you

> will call them on Wednesday and Sunday. Period. They will cry, but I am

> telling you, setting boundaries once you move out is *so much easier* than

> waiting another 15 years. Trust me on this!

> >

> > Or if that's too much go to every other day. Find a way to make yourself

> busier. Volunteering, joining a softball league, meetup.com groups,

> anything!

> >

> > Being more busy will help them to understand that you're not calling as

> much. But as for the excuse: " Every day is too much for me. I'm a grown

> adult. I need my space. " Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. If harranguing starts? " OK,

> sorry you're upset. Gotta go now. " CLICK.

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I agree. If being honest with them doesn't work, then make up some plausible

lies about your time being filled up now.

As an adult, I ended up lying to my nada about my visits to her area: I'd not

tell her my actual arrival and departure dates so that I could have some time

there on my own, without her knowing about it.

If I was honest with her and told her that I wanted to go visit friends or my

Sister or do some exploring on my own, she'd have a meltdown rage-tantrum or

she'd pout and make my entire visit with her miserable.

So, yes, I think WM put it well. Personality-disordered parents use

manipulations like guilt and lying to get their way, so if being honest with

them doesn't work, then, fight fire with fire.

In doing so you are not harming them, you are merely preventing them from

harming you.

-Annie

> > >

> > > I'm on my own, finally living away from home. It's a huge relief.

> > >

> > > But of course, as I'm sure many of you have experienced, the effects of

the phone calls are still as intense. My parents insist on calling me daily. If

they don't hear from me one day they freak out. I moved out to be on my own, but

if they need to hear every single detail of my day, every day, it just doesn't

work.

> > >

> > > I don't want to become more and more enmeshed with them as I try and move

on with my own life. Part of me thinks it's terribly cruel to just not call

someone who has legit abandonment fears. I feel like I need a good enough excuse

to not call but I don't know what that could be. I really could put aside 5

minutes/day to call if I wanted to. If I don't call, they'll take it personally

and they KNOW that I do have the time to call. I don't know how to set the limit

to not call AND to give them a sufficient reason why I can't call. I hate to

lie, but I also can't give them no reason at all and just not call. Being " too

busy " one night just isn't enough. They'll read right through it.

> > >

> > > So I'm stuck between continuing to walk on eggshells in order to maintain

their sanity (and therefore, my sanity...see a problem?!), or risking a lot and

hoping they won't explode and that I won't freak out from guilt by not calling

one night. I really don't want to go on enmeshed like this, but I also don't

know how to slowly let go, in a way that preserves my sanity.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Well put! I am sorry you had to be put into a position of habitual lying to get

what you needed from nada/fada in early adulthood. You shouldn't feel bad about

it at all. It was smart and the only way you could protect your interests in

order to get 100% free and independent of them.

For myself, I was too deeply enmeshed at that age to reason a path out of my

FOO. That's what I beat myself up about today. My early therapy revolved around

letting myself off the hook for the deception and blunders I did to try to

survive in that house of hell called home.

& the only reason I was so hung up on whether I was a liar or not was because

THEY were, and I wanted to distance myself from them as far as possible. No, we

weren't a " perfect family " we didn't " respect each other " and she was not a

" loving, compassionate " mother. Unless there was an audience.

> > >

> > > I'm on my own, finally living away from home. It's a huge relief.

> > >

> > > But of course, as I'm sure many of you have experienced, the effects of

the phone calls are still as intense. My parents insist on calling me daily. If

they don't hear from me one day they freak out. I moved out to be on my own, but

if they need to hear every single detail of my day, every day, it just doesn't

work.

> > >

> > > I don't want to become more and more enmeshed with them as I try and move

on with my own life. Part of me thinks it's terribly cruel to just not call

someone who has legit abandonment fears. I feel like I need a good enough excuse

to not call but I don't know what that could be. I really could put aside 5

minutes/day to call if I wanted to. If I don't call, they'll take it personally

and they KNOW that I do have the time to call. I don't know how to set the limit

to not call AND to give them a sufficient reason why I can't call. I hate to

lie, but I also can't give them no reason at all and just not call. Being " too

busy " one night just isn't enough. They'll read right through it.

> > >

> > > So I'm stuck between continuing to walk on eggshells in order to maintain

their sanity (and therefore, my sanity...see a problem?!), or risking a lot and

hoping they won't explode and that I won't freak out from guilt by not calling

one night. I really don't want to go on enmeshed like this, but I also don't

know how to slowly let go, in a way that preserves my sanity.

> > >

> >

>