The fear of incest with BP Mom. CAREFUL POTENTIAL TRIGGER

[Guest guest]

Hello all,

Please beware that this might be a big trigger for a lot of people. I do not

want to offend anyone, or hurt anyone, by bringing up this sensitive topic.

I don't even know if I'll ever have the guts to post it.

I want to share something with you that I have been carrying for a long long

time.

I realised clearly this afternoon for the first time, that I not only was afraid

of my BP Mom as a kid, on an emotional and physical level, but I have

experienced a fear of her crossing the line on a sexual level.

This is hard for me to share, so I apologize for not finding the right words. I

started talking about this with my therapist, but I had to move a few months

ago, and we haven't resumed our sessions yet.

I just remember clearly the fear that she was going to cross the line, that she

was going to do something inapropriate.

Some of my memories are blurred, but this particular feeling, this particular

fear, is very clear. The feeling that I had to watch her, or I could be " used " .

Part of me wants to share my story, but another just feels so ashamed and

embarassed, and I just feel like at the end, I am going to hurt other people's

feeling by sharing this.

I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear that you were

going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is this something that

*can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

If this topic is offensive and needs to be removed from the board, I apologize

in advance. And please feel free to remove this post then.

I am just so confused and hurt and lost.

Thanks

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Feel free to express yourself. If you write " potential trigger " then the

warning is issued. This very situation was on Boardwalk Empire last Sunday.

I am fortunate to not have this problem but I believe you will find other

who have shared your concerns.

> **

>

>

> Hello all,

>

> Please beware that this might be a big trigger for a lot of people. I do

> not want to offend anyone, or hurt anyone, by bringing up this sensitive

> topic.

> I don't even know if I'll ever have the guts to post it.

> I want to share something with you that I have been carrying for a long

> long time.

> I realised clearly this afternoon for the first time, that I not only was

> afraid of my BP Mom as a kid, on an emotional and physical level, but I

> have experienced a fear of her crossing the line on a sexual level.

>

> This is hard for me to share, so I apologize for not finding the right

> words. I started talking about this with my therapist, but I had to move a

> few months ago, and we haven't resumed our sessions yet.

>

> I just remember clearly the fear that she was going to cross the line,

> that she was going to do something inapropriate.

> Some of my memories are blurred, but this particular feeling, this

> particular fear, is very clear. The feeling that I had to watch her, or I

> could be " used " .

>

> Part of me wants to share my story, but another just feels so ashamed and

> embarassed, and I just feel like at the end, I am going to hurt other

> people's feeling by sharing this.

>

> I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear that

> you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is this

> something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

> If this topic is offensive and needs to be removed from the board, I

> apologize in advance. And please feel free to remove this post then.

> I am just so confused and hurt and lost.

>

> Thanks

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Coralie,

Please do not feel bad for posting this. Yes it is a recurring trait of

borderline mothers, and has been discussed on this forum from time to time.

Congratulations on having the courage to face this issue and begin healing.

Please check out this website, which will give you an intro to the issue and

validation that it occurs:

http://mdsa-online.org/

--Charlotte

>

> Hello all,

>

> Please beware that this might be a big trigger for a lot of people. I do not

want to offend anyone, or hurt anyone, by bringing up this sensitive topic.

> I don't even know if I'll ever have the guts to post it.

> I want to share something with you that I have been carrying for a long long

time.

> I realised clearly this afternoon for the first time, that I not only was

afraid of my BP Mom as a kid, on an emotional and physical level, but I have

experienced a fear of her crossing the line on a sexual level.

>

> This is hard for me to share, so I apologize for not finding the right words.

I started talking about this with my therapist, but I had to move a few months

ago, and we haven't resumed our sessions yet.

>

> I just remember clearly the fear that she was going to cross the line, that

she was going to do something inapropriate.

> Some of my memories are blurred, but this particular feeling, this particular

fear, is very clear. The feeling that I had to watch her, or I could be " used " .

>

> Part of me wants to share my story, but another just feels so ashamed and

embarassed, and I just feel like at the end, I am going to hurt other people's

feeling by sharing this.

>

> I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear that you

were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is this something that

*can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

> If this topic is offensive and needs to be removed from the board, I apologize

in advance. And please feel free to remove this post then.

> I am just so confused and hurt and lost.

>

> Thanks

>

[Guest guest]

> I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear

> that you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is

> this something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

I liked the subject title because it felt real. I know you, I, and any other

person might be raw around this, but it's real, plenty real. A person crossing

boundaries can't distinguish sexual behavior from verbal behavior to the point

of _they can_ except they refuse to show consciousness. Does that make sense?

A nada who crosses boundaries must know it somewhere in her person. We're

spiritual beings in a physical body - and she must know it somewhere. So

somewhere, she knows she's pushing you, being pokey, dangerous, difficult, scary

- and that kind of knowing doesn't say " Oh whoops, wait, this is a sexual zone,

I'd better curb my behavior and clean all that up. " It continues into the sexual

life too. We're beings with genitals and longing, and desires to honor one

another - and those desires as children have to be seen as respectful.

It literally takes a very mature, delightful, genuinely authentic person who has

done the work, to respond appropriately at all to sexuality - and the majority

of us haven't finished that work by the time we have children. We would do as

good as we can, but still maybe we cringe a little when something's messy, or we

enforce the tribal belief " You just shouldn't rub there like that. "

So we're all kind of leaving difficult signals with every one, age and gender

regardless... The BPD however, is clueless. Rakes over the entire area as if to

seed it with herself. " This is mine " , and then flops it around like a Barbie

Doll, hits it on the bed, or dresses it too roughly. The nada that cooes and

treats a persons sexuality as anything irregular is crazy! She has her own human

body, gift of the Goddess, she has every challenge to mature and honor herself

and others as the rest of us. She doesn't get a free pass to do all things and

everything to anyone. She never had pass to do that.

[Guest guest]

Hi Coralie,

I second Charlotte, et al. This is a topic that takes tremendous strength

and courage to address.

Pds lack any sort of respect for boundaries of any kind, with anyone,

anytime, ever.

They percieve boundaries as challenges to be won, not compromises to be

respected.

There is an oh-huh, nuhn-uhn, oppositional quality to their interaction

with others, that at its least malevolent (and its still bad...) is

simply cruel, at its worst criminal, but always sadistic, even when the

person they are harming is themself. My own Nada liked to tell me she was

thinking about suicide, (I was nine at the time, but if I told anyone,

she'd know I had betrayed her, and she'd feel soooooo hurt she just

wouldn't know what to do.) This is classic sadistic mind killing behavior,

cruel, sadistic, double bind, totally reprehensible and morally bankrupt.

They *like* to make others afraid, and uncomfortable, it feeds their sense

of power and control, gives them opportunities to manipulate and jerk

people around, and that is what all interactions are about to them. They

are terrorists. They are sadistic. Seeing others in uncomfortable, or

double bind situations gives them a thrill and satisfaction unparalleled by

any other sensation known to them.They *want *to hurt you. They want you to

*know* they enjoy it, and that you are helpless to stop it.

Crossing boundaries of incest, whether actualized physically, or

insidiously staying in the emotional realm, is a gross violation of a

childs rights, and a parents responsibilities.

All BPDs know that they don't have to actually commit an act, for the

affects of the *implications *of the act to have affect. An example would

be the threat of a spanking being enough to make a little child cry. The

lascivious look flashed briefly by an adult care-giver, leaving the

bathroom door open while showering, and asking a child to " hand me a

towel, " wandering around in underwear and high heels, a bathrobe left

untied, having an adolescent child apply suntan lotion to an adult, and so

on, are all instances of emotional incest.

For a child to feel profoundly uncomfortable, and deeply frightened and

confused by such behaviors is perfectly understandable. It is the intent of

the BPD to do so.

On her last visit with my adult son, my Nada answered the door in her

underpants, then casually tried to put on her jeans in front of him - we

were both bolting back out the door. He further told me of instances when

she had shared grossly inappropriately sexual info., with him, because it

was " the truth " and he " needed " to hear it. She loves to preface her

brutality with " You're not going to want to hear this, but... " or " you

need to hear the truth... " just before she bludgeons one with lies

constructed to destroy ones sense of self, or trust in a loved one.

Once we are made *afraid* of a potential situation, the situation itself

doesn't need to occur* in-flagrant* for its affects to be experienced, to

some degree, through anticipation Sexual teasing, enticement,

embarrassment, etc., are all forms of emotional incest, that while

unprosecutable, may be no less damaging.

No form of sexual abuse of a child is ok. Ever. Making a child fearful

of sexual misconduct is never ok either.

It is such a difficult topic, I hope you will arm yourself with all the

tools and protection you can search out, and know that you are well thought

of, held in whole and healing light, and cared for, here in Oz. We are with

you, we are all healing together.

Hoping you find Respite, and Peace,

Sunspot

On Thu, Dec 8, 2011 at 12:50 PM, charlottehoneychurch <

charlottehoneychurch@...> wrote:

> **

>

>

> Dear Coralie,

>

> Please do not feel bad for posting this. Yes it is a recurring trait of

> borderline mothers, and has been discussed on this forum from time to time.

> Congratulations on having the courage to face this issue and begin healing.

> Please check out this website, which will give you an intro to the issue

> and validation that it occurs:

>

> http://mdsa-online.org/

>

> --Charlotte

>

>

>

> >

> > Hello all,

> >

> > Please beware that this might be a big trigger for a lot of people. I do

> not want to offend anyone, or hurt anyone, by bringing up this sensitive

> topic.

> > I don't even know if I'll ever have the guts to post it.

> > I want to share something with you that I have been carrying for a long

> long time.

> > I realised clearly this afternoon for the first time, that I not only

> was afraid of my BP Mom as a kid, on an emotional and physical level, but I

> have experienced a fear of her crossing the line on a sexual level.

> >

> > This is hard for me to share, so I apologize for not finding the right

> words. I started talking about this with my therapist, but I had to move a

> few months ago, and we haven't resumed our sessions yet.

> >

> > I just remember clearly the fear that she was going to cross the line,

> that she was going to do something inapropriate.

> > Some of my memories are blurred, but this particular feeling, this

> particular fear, is very clear. The feeling that I had to watch her, or I

> could be " used " .

> >

> > Part of me wants to share my story, but another just feels so ashamed

> and embarassed, and I just feel like at the end, I am going to hurt other

> people's feeling by sharing this.

> >

> > I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear that

> you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is this

> something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

> > If this topic is offensive and needs to be removed from the board, I

> apologize in advance. And please feel free to remove this post then.

> > I am just so confused and hurt and lost.

> >

> > Thanks

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Coralie,

I just wanted you to know that you are not the only one who experienced

inappropriate sexual boundary violation from your nada, as a child.

Mine committed a form of rape against me that was so traumatic for me that it

literally changed the course of my life; I became trauma-bonded to nada and

alienated from my own self because of this quasi-rape. And yes, it was

terrifying, cruel, and the intent was to shame me into a state of near

non-existence.

This is why I am a big proponent of educating the public in general and children

in particular to understand that there is something called personality disorder,

and this is what personality disorder sounds like and looks like, compared to

what mentally healthy behaviors look like and sound like. My mother was too

mentally ill to be raising a child, yet she was left alone with me and my little

Sister every day because she was high-functioning enough to " pass " as normal in

public.

Anyway, I wanted you to understand that you are not alone.

And Thanks for listing the link to the site about mother/daughter sexual abuse.

> > >

> > > Hello all,

> > >

> > > Please beware that this might be a big trigger for a lot of people. I do

> > not want to offend anyone, or hurt anyone, by bringing up this sensitive

> > topic.

> > > I don't even know if I'll ever have the guts to post it.

> > > I want to share something with you that I have been carrying for a long

> > long time.

> > > I realised clearly this afternoon for the first time, that I not only

> > was afraid of my BP Mom as a kid, on an emotional and physical level, but I

> > have experienced a fear of her crossing the line on a sexual level.

> > >

> > > This is hard for me to share, so I apologize for not finding the right

> > words. I started talking about this with my therapist, but I had to move a

> > few months ago, and we haven't resumed our sessions yet.

> > >

> > > I just remember clearly the fear that she was going to cross the line,

> > that she was going to do something inapropriate.

> > > Some of my memories are blurred, but this particular feeling, this

> > particular fear, is very clear. The feeling that I had to watch her, or I

> > could be " used " .

> > >

> > > Part of me wants to share my story, but another just feels so ashamed

> > and embarassed, and I just feel like at the end, I am going to hurt other

> > people's feeling by sharing this.

> > >

> > > I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear that

> > you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is this

> > something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

> > > If this topic is offensive and needs to be removed from the board, I

> > apologize in advance. And please feel free to remove this post then.

> > > I am just so confused and hurt and lost.

> > >

> > > Thanks

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

this is a post I'll be re-reading many times. I can't believe what I'm reading

as some of my most confusing and shameful memories are recounted here. my Mom

did these things. I'm shaking as I type this, and my mind goes blank as the

memories start to flash. the more blatant ones I've worked on in therapy for

years, but now I realize there are so many subtle moments that still

happen...even now, I freeze...even thinking of them makes me freeze. The thing

that convinces me how horribly wrong it all was is imagining doing those things

to my children. then I see. I'm only just beginning to see how pervasive the

damage was.

thank you for being so brave to post this. you've made me feel less alone. and

I hope this forum can help you to feel less alone.

~Debbie

> > >

> > > Hello all,

> > >

> > > Please beware that this might be a big trigger for a lot of people. I do

> > not want to offend anyone, or hurt anyone, by bringing up this sensitive

> > topic.

> > > I don't even know if I'll ever have the guts to post it.

> > > I want to share something with you that I have been carrying for a long

> > long time.

> > > I realised clearly this afternoon for the first time, that I not only

> > was afraid of my BP Mom as a kid, on an emotional and physical level, but I

> > have experienced a fear of her crossing the line on a sexual level.

> > >

> > > This is hard for me to share, so I apologize for not finding the right

> > words. I started talking about this with my therapist, but I had to move a

> > few months ago, and we haven't resumed our sessions yet.

> > >

> > > I just remember clearly the fear that she was going to cross the line,

> > that she was going to do something inapropriate.

> > > Some of my memories are blurred, but this particular feeling, this

> > particular fear, is very clear. The feeling that I had to watch her, or I

> > could be " used " .

> > >

> > > Part of me wants to share my story, but another just feels so ashamed

> > and embarassed, and I just feel like at the end, I am going to hurt other

> > people's feeling by sharing this.

> > >

> > > I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear that

> > you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is this

> > something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

> > > If this topic is offensive and needs to be removed from the board, I

> > apologize in advance. And please feel free to remove this post then.

> > > I am just so confused and hurt and lost.

> > >

> > > Thanks

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hello everyone,

From the bottom of my heart, thank you. Thank you for responding the way you

did. If there was one person out there that would understand me, I would have

felt a million times better, but to read that there are many of you who

*understands* in your guts what I am talking about makes a big difference in my

life.

I wanted to remove this post, I dont even know if one can do this on here,

because I thought this was gonna be grotesque, disgusting for some, just plain

shameful.

But there are people out there who *know* what I am talking about. And so I feel

like now my story can stands, it doesn't have to hide.

My Mom liked to walk around naked. She was almost the hyper sexual member of the

family. And everyone else was fordidden to be. As a teenager, she flew into

rages when the " problem " of my sexuality would arise.

But that is almost another topic. By biggest fear, would be to be swallowed by

her, to disapear entirely. To disapear in the face of what she wanted at one

particular time.

I realise now, that I have felt the threat, clearly, I have felt what she

wanted, and it is almost like I was there watching the cloud of a storm grow and

grow, and I was afraid I would be ungulfed by it. But then it didn't happen.

When I remember these moments of incestual sexual tension -I don't know how to

label this- I didn't feel like I was with my Mom, I felt like I was with my Mom

turning into a child, who is needy and wants candy, and wants to be soothed.

I remember in my bones the feeling of freezing. Like my body was lifeless, my

limbs were jelly. I was ready to get out of my body, almost. I was ready to

watch this from the outside.

When I started remembering these difficult memories, it would be like life got

sucked out of me. I would just sit somewhere and let the storm pass.

I couldn't make sense of how deeply these memories affected me, because

" nothing " happend, from what I remembered, but it felt like it did. And

sometimes I thought I was going crazy.

Reading your posts, makes me realise there was more to my BP Mom's behaviour

that was inapropriate. Other things that I have laughed about, anecdotal stuff,

but in retrospect, I am not sure it was totally appropriate for kids.

During the week ends, my BP Mom would often try on clothes on Sundays. She would

ask my brother and I to sit on my parents' bed. (My Dad was often working

weekends)

And we'd lay on the bed, and had to rate how different pairs of jeans looked on

her. We spent hours doing that, no joke. The big focus was how my Mom's butt

looked like. She would try on jeans, and then with different types of belts. And

always, the question was " And my butt, how does my butt look like? " ... it would

go on and on.

I guess this relate more to the Narcissitic traits she exhibited, but still,

maybe a little weird family routine to have!

I thank you all for your support. I didn't feel brave posting about it, maybe a

little, but mostly I felt incredibly embarrassed. So thank you for not making me

feel like I was not out of line.

Your warmth and understanding, it means the world.

C-

[Guest guest]

Hi C,

I'm really glad you had the courage to post! This is a really tough,

painful, and confusing topic.

Bets Regards,

Sunspot

> **

>

>

> Hello everyone,

>

> From the bottom of my heart, thank you. Thank you for responding the way

> you did. If there was one person out there that would understand me, I

> would have felt a million times better, but to read that there are many of

> you who *understands* in your guts what I am talking about makes a big

> difference in my life.

> I wanted to remove this post, I dont even know if one can do this on here,

> because I thought this was gonna be grotesque, disgusting for some, just

> plain shameful.

> But there are people out there who *know* what I am talking about. And so

> I feel like now my story can stands, it doesn't have to hide.

>

> My Mom liked to walk around naked. She was almost the hyper sexual member

> of the family. And everyone else was fordidden to be. As a teenager, she

> flew into rages when the " problem " of my sexuality would arise.

>

> But that is almost another topic. By biggest fear, would be to be

> swallowed by her, to disapear entirely. To disapear in the face of what she

> wanted at one particular time.

> I realise now, that I have felt the threat, clearly, I have felt what she

> wanted, and it is almost like I was there watching the cloud of a storm

> grow and grow, and I was afraid I would be ungulfed by it. But then it

> didn't happen.

>

> When I remember these moments of incestual sexual tension -I don't know

> how to label this- I didn't feel like I was with my Mom, I felt like I was

> with my Mom turning into a child, who is needy and wants candy, and wants

> to be soothed.

>

> I remember in my bones the feeling of freezing. Like my body was lifeless,

> my limbs were jelly. I was ready to get out of my body, almost. I was ready

> to watch this from the outside.

> When I started remembering these difficult memories, it would be like life

> got sucked out of me. I would just sit somewhere and let the storm pass.

>

> I couldn't make sense of how deeply these memories affected me, because

> " nothing " happend, from what I remembered, but it felt like it did. And

> sometimes I thought I was going crazy.

>

> Reading your posts, makes me realise there was more to my BP Mom's

> behaviour that was inapropriate. Other things that I have laughed about,

> anecdotal stuff, but in retrospect, I am not sure it was totally

> appropriate for kids.

>

> During the week ends, my BP Mom would often try on clothes on Sundays. She

> would ask my brother and I to sit on my parents' bed. (My Dad was often

> working weekends)

> And we'd lay on the bed, and had to rate how different pairs of jeans

> looked on her. We spent hours doing that, no joke. The big focus was how my

> Mom's butt looked like. She would try on jeans, and then with different

> types of belts. And always, the question was " And my butt, how does my butt

> look like? " ... it would go on and on.

> I guess this relate more to the Narcissitic traits she exhibited, but

> still, maybe a little weird family routine to have!

>

> I thank you all for your support. I didn't feel brave posting about it,

> maybe a little, but mostly I felt incredibly embarrassed. So thank you for

> not making me feel like I was not out of line.

> Your warmth and understanding, it means the world.

>

> C-

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you for posting this and having the courage to bring this topic up. I have

thought about this over the past couple of years a lot --the way my borderline

mother's behavior was often inappropriate in a sexual manner. It makes sense:

neediness and boundary crossing manifesting itself in yet another way. Since you

took the risk of sharing, I wanted to share back:

Â

Two messed up examples that make me cringe:

My mom was obsessed with my weight (surprise surprise: three cheers to the

borderline obsession with others' appearances). I was a ballet dancer, all of 90

pounds tops during my late teen years, but she was so worried I was getting fat.

She used to make me pull down my pants and panties and turn around so she could

stare at my ass and see if my ass cheeks were hanging on my thighs. Then she

would make me stand there as she spent a long time telling me all about what she

saw: if I was fat, if one butt cheek was hanging down, etc. So there I am at 18

pants down with my mom staring away. Nice.

Another scenerio: after beating the sh*t out of me sometimes she would then want

to snuggle or have me spend the night with her so she could " play spoons. "

Nothing " sexual " strictly speaking, but all that cuddling. GROSS!!

So you aren't alone.

Love and hugs,

crockett

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Friday, December 9, 2011 9:40 AM

Subject: Re: The fear of incest with BP Mom. CAREFUL

POTENTIAL TRIGGER

Â

> I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear

> that you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is

> this something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

I liked the subject title because it felt real. I know you, I, and any other

person might be raw around this, but it's real, plenty real. A person crossing

boundaries can't distinguish sexual behavior from verbal behavior to the point

of _they can_ except they refuse to show consciousness. Does that make sense?

A nada who crosses boundaries must know it somewhere in her person. We're

spiritual beings in a physical body - and she must know it somewhere. So

somewhere, she knows she's pushing you, being pokey, dangerous, difficult, scary

- and that kind of knowing doesn't say " Oh whoops, wait, this is a sexual zone,

I'd better curb my behavior and clean all that up. " It continues into the sexual

life too. We're beings with genitals and longing, and desires to honor one

another - and those desires as children have to be seen as respectful.

It literally takes a very mature, delightful, genuinely authentic person who has

done the work, to respond appropriately at all to sexuality - and the majority

of us haven't finished that work by the time we have children. We would do as

good as we can, but still maybe we cringe a little when something's messy, or we

enforce the tribal belief " You just shouldn't rub there like that. "

So we're all kind of leaving difficult signals with every one, age and gender

regardless... The BPD however, is clueless. Rakes over the entire area as if to

seed it with herself. " This is mine " , and then flops it around like a Barbie

Doll, hits it on the bed, or dresses it too roughly. The nada that cooes and

treats a persons sexuality as anything irregular is crazy! She has her own human

body, gift of the Goddess, she has every challenge to mature and honor herself

and others as the rest of us. She doesn't get a free pass to do all things and

everything to anyone. She never had pass to do that.

[Guest guest]

I have posted this here before but it was a long time ago. My mum used to

" tweak " my breasts when i started developing. It was creepy. When i told her

to stop she would say in a mocking voice " shut up! " She wouldn't accept she was

doing anything wrong. She also became obsessed with " threads of cotton " which

hung from the crotch of my jeans! She would always be groping between my legs

saying there was a thread of cotton there. The last time she did it I was 39

years old! She would not accept even then that what she was doing was violating

me. She dismissed me as usual, saying " come off it, we're mother and daughter " .

She used to ask my Dad - who was the stereotypical " dishrag " Dad - to buy my

bras for me. This carried on until I was in my twenties. One day, my Dad came

into where I lived at the time (a hostel) and asked one of the young girls (one

of my peers) if I still lived there. He then went on to tell her he wanted to

speak to me " about some brassieres " ...i nearly died when she told me! But

sadly, i knew it was true. a) Because my Dad used the term " brassieres " ,

He regularly said and did things which were inappropriate and c) My nada had

probably told him to come in and say it and he wouldn't not do something she'd

told him to do.

It does your head in doesn't it????

>

> Thank you for posting this and having the courage to bring this topic up. I

have thought about this over the past couple of years a lot --the way my

borderline mother's behavior was often inappropriate in a sexual manner. It

makes sense: neediness and boundary crossing manifesting itself in yet another

way. Since you took the risk of sharing, I wanted to share back:

>  

> Two messed up examples that make me cringe:

>

>

> My mom was obsessed with my weight (surprise surprise: three cheers to the

borderline obsession with others' appearances). I was a ballet dancer, all of 90

pounds tops during my late teen years, but she was so worried I was getting fat.

She used to make me pull down my pants and panties and turn around so she could

stare at my ass and  see if my ass cheeks were hanging on my thighs. Then she

would make me stand there as she spent a long time telling me all about what she

saw: if I was fat, if one butt cheek was hanging down, etc. So there I am at 18

pants down with my mom staring away. Nice.

>

>

> Another scenerio: after beating the sh*t out of me sometimes she would then

want to snuggle or have me spend the night with her so she could " play spoons. "

Nothing " sexual " strictly speaking, but all that cuddling. GROSS!!

>

> So you aren't alone.

>

>

> Love and hugs,

>

> crockett

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: WTOAdultChildren1

> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2011 9:40 AM

> Subject: Re: The fear of incest with BP Mom. CAREFUL

POTENTIAL TRIGGER

>

>

>  

> > I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear

> > that you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is

> > this something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

>

> I liked the subject title because it felt real. I know you, I, and any other

person might be raw around this, but it's real, plenty real. A person crossing

boundaries can't distinguish sexual behavior from verbal behavior to the point

of _they can_ except they refuse to show consciousness. Does that make sense?

>

> A nada who crosses boundaries must know it somewhere in her person. We're

spiritual beings in a physical body - and she must know it somewhere. So

somewhere, she knows she's pushing you, being pokey, dangerous, difficult, scary

- and that kind of knowing doesn't say " Oh whoops, wait, this is a sexual zone,

I'd better curb my behavior and clean all that up. " It continues into the sexual

life too. We're beings with genitals and longing, and desires to honor one

another - and those desires as children have to be seen as respectful.

>

> It literally takes a very mature, delightful, genuinely authentic person who

has done the work, to respond appropriately at all to sexuality - and the

majority of us haven't finished that work by the time we have children. We would

do as good as we can, but still maybe we cringe a little when something's messy,

or we enforce the tribal belief " You just shouldn't rub there like that. "

>

> So we're all kind of leaving difficult signals with every one, age and gender

regardless... The BPD however, is clueless. Rakes over the entire area as if to

seed it with herself. " This is mine " , and then flops it around like a Barbie

Doll, hits it on the bed, or dresses it too roughly. The nada that cooes and

treats a persons sexuality as anything irregular is crazy! She has her own human

body, gift of the Goddess, she has every challenge to mature and honor herself

and others as the rest of us. She doesn't get a free pass to do all things and

everything to anyone. She never had pass to do that.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

That is sooooo creepy!

> **

>

>

> I have posted this here before but it was a long time ago. My mum used to

> " tweak " my breasts when i started developing. It was creepy. When i told

> her to stop she would say in a mocking voice " shut up! " She wouldn't accept

> she was doing anything wrong. She also became obsessed with " threads of

> cotton " which hung from the crotch of my jeans! She would always be groping

> between my legs saying there was a thread of cotton there. The last time

> she did it I was 39 years old! She would not accept even then that what she

> was doing was violating me. She dismissed me as usual, saying " come off it,

> we're mother and daughter " . She used to ask my Dad - who was the

> stereotypical " dishrag " Dad - to buy my bras for me. This carried on until

> I was in my twenties. One day, my Dad came into where I lived at the time

> (a hostel) and asked one of the young girls (one of my peers) if I still

> lived there. He then went on to tell her he wanted to speak to me " about

> some brassieres " ...i nearly died when she told me! But sadly, i knew it

> was true. a) Because my Dad used the term " brassieres " , He regularly

> said and did things which were inappropriate and c) My nada had probably

> told him to come in and say it and he wouldn't not do something she'd told

> him to do.

>

> It does your head in doesn't it????

>

>

> >

> > Thank you for posting this and having the courage to bring this topic

> up. I have thought about this over the past couple of years a lot --the way

> my borderline mother's behavior was often inappropriate in a sexual manner.

> It makes sense: neediness and boundary crossing manifesting itself in yet

> another way. Since you took the risk of sharing, I wanted to share back:

> > Â

> > Two messed up examples that make me cringe:

> >

> >

> > My mom was obsessed with my weight (surprise surprise: three cheers to

> the borderline obsession with others' appearances). I was a ballet dancer,

> all of 90 pounds tops during my late teen years, but she was so worried I

> was getting fat. She used to make me pull down my pants and panties and

> turn around so she could stare at my ass and see if my ass cheeks were

> hanging on my thighs. Then she would make me stand there as she spent a

> long time telling me all about what she saw: if I was fat, if one butt

> cheek was hanging down, etc. So there I am at 18 pants down with my mom

> staring away. Nice.

> >

> >

> > Another scenerio: after beating the sh*t out of me sometimes she would

> then want to snuggle or have me spend the night with her so she could " play

> spoons. " Nothing " sexual " strictly speaking, but all that cuddling. GROSS!!

> >

> > So you aren't alone.

> >

> >

> > Love and hugs,

> >

> > crockett

> >

> >

> >

> > ________________________________

> >

> > To: WTOAdultChildren1

> > Sent: Friday, December 9, 2011 9:40 AM

> > Subject: Re: The fear of incest with BP Mom. CAREFUL

> POTENTIAL TRIGGER

> >

> >

> > Â

> > > I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear

> > > that you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is

> > > this something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

> >

> > I liked the subject title because it felt real. I know you, I, and any

> other person might be raw around this, but it's real, plenty real. A person

> crossing boundaries can't distinguish sexual behavior from verbal behavior

> to the point of _they can_ except they refuse to show consciousness. Does

> that make sense?

> >

> > A nada who crosses boundaries must know it somewhere in her person.

> We're spiritual beings in a physical body - and she must know it somewhere.

> So somewhere, she knows she's pushing you, being pokey, dangerous,

> difficult, scary - and that kind of knowing doesn't say " Oh whoops, wait,

> this is a sexual zone, I'd better curb my behavior and clean all that up. "

> It continues into the sexual life too. We're beings with genitals and

> longing, and desires to honor one another - and those desires as children

> have to be seen as respectful.

> >

> > It literally takes a very mature, delightful, genuinely authentic person

> who has done the work, to respond appropriately at all to sexuality - and

> the majority of us haven't finished that work by the time we have children.

> We would do as good as we can, but still maybe we cringe a little when

> something's messy, or we enforce the tribal belief " You just shouldn't rub

> there like that. "

> >

> > So we're all kind of leaving difficult signals with every one, age and

> gender regardless... The BPD however, is clueless. Rakes over the entire

> area as if to seed it with herself. " This is mine " , and then flops it

> around like a Barbie Doll, hits it on the bed, or dresses it too roughly.

> The nada that cooes and treats a persons sexuality as anything irregular is

> crazy! She has her own human body, gift of the Goddess, she has every

> challenge to mature and honor herself and others as the rest of us. She

> doesn't get a free pass to do all things and everything to anyone. She

> never had pass to do that.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

my Nada seems obsessed with my appearance. it is the only thing she compliments

genuinely. I am thin and tall, I feel like she is always checking me out

whenever we get together. she says things like " you look so good " with too much

admiration, not lust really, but like she deserves credit or something. she

used to buy all of my clothes. she would buy me tight pants, and shirts that

were not my favorite thing in the world, and make comments like " If only I had

that body... " etc. it always felt weird. I know this sounds benign but those of

us with Nadas know it is never quite right. sometimes she would comment on the

stretch marks on my thighs at inopportune times. it is all very embarrassing.

> >

> > Thank you for posting this and having the courage to bring this topic up. I

have thought about this over the past couple of years a lot --the way my

borderline mother's behavior was often inappropriate in a sexual manner. It

makes sense: neediness and boundary crossing manifesting itself in yet another

way. Since you took the risk of sharing, I wanted to share back:

> >  

> > Two messed up examples that make me cringe:

> >

> >

> > My mom was obsessed with my weight (surprise surprise: three cheers to the

borderline obsession with others' appearances). I was a ballet dancer, all of 90

pounds tops during my late teen years, but she was so worried I was getting fat.

She used to make me pull down my pants and panties and turn around so she could

stare at my ass and  see if my ass cheeks were hanging on my thighs. Then she

would make me stand there as she spent a long time telling me all about what she

saw: if I was fat, if one butt cheek was hanging down, etc. So there I am at 18

pants down with my mom staring away. Nice.

> >

> >

> > Another scenerio: after beating the sh*t out of me sometimes she would then

want to snuggle or have me spend the night with her so she could " play spoons. "

Nothing " sexual " strictly speaking, but all that cuddling. GROSS!!

> >

> > So you aren't alone.

> >

> >

> > Love and hugs,

> >

> > crockett

> >

> >

> >

> > ________________________________

> > From: <SANDRADAVIS7@>

> > To: WTOAdultChildren1

> > Sent: Friday, December 9, 2011 9:40 AM

> > Subject: Re: The fear of incest with BP Mom. CAREFUL

POTENTIAL TRIGGER

> >

> >

> >  

> > > I would like to know, have some of you felt that same fear? A fear

> > > that you were going to be used in ways that would be inapropriate? Is

> > > this something that *can* happen with bordeline type of behaviour?

> >

> > I liked the subject title because it felt real. I know you, I, and any other

person might be raw around this, but it's real, plenty real. A person crossing

boundaries can't distinguish sexual behavior from verbal behavior to the point

of _they can_ except they refuse to show consciousness. Does that make sense?

> >

> > A nada who crosses boundaries must know it somewhere in her person. We're

spiritual beings in a physical body - and she must know it somewhere. So

somewhere, she knows she's pushing you, being pokey, dangerous, difficult, scary

- and that kind of knowing doesn't say " Oh whoops, wait, this is a sexual zone,

I'd better curb my behavior and clean all that up. " It continues into the sexual

life too. We're beings with genitals and longing, and desires to honor one

another - and those desires as children have to be seen as respectful.

> >

> > It literally takes a very mature, delightful, genuinely authentic person who

has done the work, to respond appropriately at all to sexuality - and the

majority of us haven't finished that work by the time we have children. We would

do as good as we can, but still maybe we cringe a little when something's messy,

or we enforce the tribal belief " You just shouldn't rub there like that. "

> >

> > So we're all kind of leaving difficult signals with every one, age and

gender regardless... The BPD however, is clueless. Rakes over the entire area as

if to seed it with herself. " This is mine " , and then flops it around like a

Barbie Doll, hits it on the bed, or dresses it too roughly. The nada that cooes

and treats a persons sexuality as anything irregular is crazy! She has her own

human body, gift of the Goddess, she has every challenge to mature and honor

herself and others as the rest of us. She doesn't get a free pass to do all

things and everything to anyone. She never had pass to do that.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

,

You really said it for me. The " it's not real and you can't call me on it

behavior " because " they " do it unconsciously. Therefore, diaster averted

because no harm can be done if they don't realize it. What a setup this is. My

nada has this excuse ready at all times if she's confronted by her own behavior.

Sick, sick, sooo f***ing sick.

Also my Mother was obsessed with weight and hotness. She was the smallest and

therefore the hottest.

After months of being bedridden with a high risk pregnancy from morning sickness

and not gaining weight. When I gave birth I kept the weight on. So I was 130

lbs. gasp! My nada seldom did anything for me but she did send me a piece of

clothing for Christmas. It was mohair(I am deathly allergic) and was a size

extra small. When I said I was offended she told me that she was doing it for

me because some obscure neighbor. who has always been overweight, was at Kmart

when she was buying it and my nada didn't want to embarrass me.

A year later while we visiting from Calf., we were leaving the NJ shore. I was

with my year old daughter in an extremely small changing room when my nada

barged in. I was like WTF in my head. She had to insert herself in that room

just to see my nakedness and I guess, examine my rolls of fat. She had no need

to be there she just wanted to stare openly at me! It was seriously smaller than

an airline bathroom! All while I was trying to pull a wet bathing suit off my 1

year old.

She has flirted with my boyfriends when I was a teen, outrageously flirted with

my sister's husband.

My most often heard adomishment growing up was that I'd be pregnant by the time

I was sixteen. I was so scared of boys because of her there wasn't a chance.

I am sure she knows damn well when she's taking me prisoner and she derives some

sick satisfaction from it and from my helplessness.

Exactly why I stay NC and on the opposite side of the country from her.

Sue