boundary issues with a (pushy) friend

[Guest guest]

It may help me to share some issues that came up for me, as a parent and a

friend.

Because I have difficulties feeling good about saying no. Or protecting myself

from folks who want to " help " me.

Yesterday afternoon our son had his December piano concert. A very eager friend

of mine, F, expressed a strong interest in attending. I, too, wanted to invite

her so she could be part of the experience. It is always neat when someone WANTS

to come to a kid's performance. I have challenges with this friend, who wants

to be included in my life, more than I am able to include her. Partly because I

need to focus my life in order to deal with a potential move. Partly because she

is very pushy, and I tend to be a people pleaser.

(Back story : Son's teacher is an older woman, so devoted that she is getting

another degree in music education at the university. She has fewer young

students these days, and our son seems to be her best student currently. The

rest of the program was " thin, " but enjoyable.

The past two years I've felt our son could/should be moving on to a new

teacher,so as to be challenged more. But looking for the good, I was not sure it

would be the best to have him go to the next level. The convenience of a teacher

in the neighborhood, combined with my respect for her commitment to her work,

and what she HAS been able to do for our son, had me staying with the tried and

true.

Then I had health matter come up this same time last year, and all year we've

been under threat of moving... so it seemed very natural to NOT engage a new

teacher at this time.)

Last night, enter my friend, F. A simple concert, with her family to listen to a

concert, with our son as the attraction.

But. I was not prepared for my friend to judge the caliber of my son's teacher.

The expression on F's face said it all: " Don't you realize your son needs a new

teacher? " ... The first words out of her mouth were, " Have you heard of

Mergatroyd (another teacher, who is on her side of town)? " She had in mind a

" better " teacher, who is male, and yes, who likely would be a great fit for our

son. If we were staying.

Because I was unwilling to back up my gut response with action that would shut

my friend down, I stayed open and listened. I guess I let her be, in the way my

father would let my nada be. And with each sentence F uttered I so wanted to

use my defenses. But I stayed thoughtful and the farther we went the more

suprised I got! It bothered me that F had found our piano teacher inadequate,

and was saying so in the teacher's house. Finally I had to take my friend out on

the porch to tell her how uncomfortable that made me. I did not state the

obvious, I am the parent and did not ask for her advice. I was being polite when

I said, " Yes I have heard about Mergatroyd, " I've heard his name before.

When I look back, I KNEW I might not want to hear what she wanted to say as soon

as I saw her face, and watched her preparing to speak (sort of like watching

nada actually). Why do I allow folks to say what they need to say, and not

protect myself? Maybe because it was a public setting, not my own home.

I wish I had a script in my mind to speak when I saw the judgment on her face.

I'd have said immediately. " You see that there is a range of skills this early

in the year. "

And if she did speak the words, " Have you heard of Mergatroyd? You should get

your son together with him. " I would have said, " If that is something seriously

on your mind, let us discuss it later, when we have both had a chance to see if

it is a realistic option. "

Or more simply, " Let us save that for another time, that is more appropriate. "

But by letting her be, I got to see just how far she would go. I found out later

she went up to my husband to say the same thing, but my husband bless his heart,

took it a lot less seriously. He told her that was up to our son. Thinking she

would get the message to let it go.

But, she took the next step! When she saw my son again, she asked him (he

was lounging bored in a chair)... wouldn't he like to try out a new teacher (and

right in the same room as our teacher!). I was there when she asked him. My one

bit of snarkiness came out then (the real HS).. I looked at our son, and said,

" He doesn't look very interested, does he? " My dry observing self needed to

come out at some time. All the words that wanted to come out of me before that

moment had been on hold because I did not want to be rude!!!

I was blown away by her asking our son.. as if I were not doing my job. But

then, today I realized that is exactly what she heard DH say to her. Oh well,

I am doing the best I can with what I have! If I had only been able to laugh!

Instead, this whole situation left me anxious and ashamed. Two attitudes I did

not need.

In my analyzing and reanalyzing (because this really got my self-esteem in the

dirt), I even wished I had been completely honest and set a boundary for future

boundary breachings, " It feels to me like you are assuming my parental duties. "

Part of me felt insulted by her plan; like I wanted to smart back and say, " you

think I have not thought about working with another teacher? " I'd actually been

trying to get my husband on board with this same plan, to find a different

teacher.... It was like she was getting right into our family underpants. Like

I was not doing enough for our son. Some folks have radar for that. Like nada.

Here is my angry speaking: I can't stand it when people try to fix me

(or my family) as if I don't have the wherewithal to do our life right. F is

not a professional in the music community. She may have been acting out of

concern, but she " forgot " we might be moving in May. In fact we have to always

be thinking about how far in advance our family can plan. And it is just months

at a time, ever since last March! She was surprised when I shared that was a

very real reality. I was thinking, Damn is she playing stupid on me? I came

just shy of telling her, " I am sorry, but I am too nice to go and switch

teachers mid year. " She is one of those entitled people who makes her decisions

and does not care what others think.

In hindsight I can see why MY delayed reaction was so strong. I was trying too

hard to be loving in my behavior, but clueless about how to do so and also

detach. I literally felt like I was being bull-dozed by someone taller and

bigger than I.... who was using her " love " and " care " to push her way more into

my life, my decisions, and this got me to question my judgment. She did not do

it to me, I did.

F really did hone in on an area where I've already held ambivalence for a while.

And I let her come in close and did not push her away. I feel shame at that.

Best

[Guest guest]

,

I've been there, that deer in headlights moment with someone, where you know you

could be saying something, but just can't. I'm also a recovering people

pleaser.

I've challenged myself to become ruthless in my middle age and less and less try

to be nice. (It doesn't always work. The deer many times wins.) Not that I'm

mean, I'm just to the point. I just feel like, if I don't say exactly what I

mean (instead of what I think would make the other person happy), my boundaries

are going to get all trampled.

You really were trapped though, and how obnoxious of F to insist on discussing

this in the teacher's own home. Sheesh! I'm sure your son's teacher heard.

It stinks when someone puts you in a position like that, where you'd like to

defend your position but shouldn't have to....it's none of her business.

One thing you said, " She is one of those entitled people who makes her decisions

and does not care what others think " -- I have said that about others and

thought they were selfish people who didn't care about others. I even discussed

a particular situation about someone I felt was entitled with my T. In talking

with my T, I realized I was actually jealous of this person and wished *I* could

make decisions without caring what others thought. That's one of my lifelong

hurts.

Because, again, as a people pleaser, that's what i was raised to do: care a LOT

about what others think and if it might disturb, bother, or offend anyone in the

least, then I wouldn't do it.

I'm not saying you're jealous of F. But I'm not sure I agree that people who

make their own decisions and don't care what others think about them are so bad,

you know?

Fiona

>

> It may help me to share some issues that came up for me, as a parent and a

friend.

>

> Because I have difficulties feeling good about saying no. Or protecting myself

from folks who want to " help " me.

>

> Yesterday afternoon our son had his December piano concert. A very eager

friend of mine, F, expressed a strong interest in attending. I, too, wanted to

invite her so she could be part of the experience. It is always neat when

someone WANTS to come to a kid's performance. I have challenges with this

friend, who wants to be included in my life, more than I am able to include her.

Partly because I need to focus my life in order to deal with a potential move.

Partly because she is very pushy, and I tend to be a people pleaser.

>

> (Back story : Son's teacher is an older woman, so devoted that she is getting

another degree in music education at the university. She has fewer young

students these days, and our son seems to be her best student currently. The

rest of the program was " thin, " but enjoyable.

>

> The past two years I've felt our son could/should be moving on to a new

teacher,so as to be challenged more. But looking for the good, I was not sure it

would be the best to have him go to the next level. The convenience of a teacher

in the neighborhood, combined with my respect for her commitment to her work,

and what she HAS been able to do for our son, had me staying with the tried and

true.

>

> Then I had health matter come up this same time last year, and all year we've

been under threat of moving... so it seemed very natural to NOT engage a new

teacher at this time.)

>

> Last night, enter my friend, F. A simple concert, with her family to listen to

a concert, with our son as the attraction.

>

> But. I was not prepared for my friend to judge the caliber of my son's

teacher. The expression on F's face said it all: " Don't you realize your son

needs a new teacher? " ... The first words out of her mouth were, " Have you heard

of Mergatroyd (another teacher, who is on her side of town)? " She had in mind

a " better " teacher, who is male, and yes, who likely would be a great fit for

our son. If we were staying.

>

> Because I was unwilling to back up my gut response with action that would shut

my friend down, I stayed open and listened. I guess I let her be, in the way my

father would let my nada be. And with each sentence F uttered I so wanted to

use my defenses. But I stayed thoughtful and the farther we went the more

suprised I got! It bothered me that F had found our piano teacher inadequate,

and was saying so in the teacher's house. Finally I had to take my friend out on

the porch to tell her how uncomfortable that made me. I did not state the

obvious, I am the parent and did not ask for her advice. I was being polite when

I said, " Yes I have heard about Mergatroyd, " I've heard his name before.

>

> When I look back, I KNEW I might not want to hear what she wanted to say as

soon as I saw her face, and watched her preparing to speak (sort of like

watching nada actually). Why do I allow folks to say what they need to say, and

not protect myself? Maybe because it was a public setting, not my own home.

>

> I wish I had a script in my mind to speak when I saw the judgment on her

face. I'd have said immediately. " You see that there is a range of skills

this early in the year. "

>

> And if she did speak the words, " Have you heard of Mergatroyd? You should

get your son together with him. " I would have said, " If that is something

seriously on your mind, let us discuss it later, when we have both had a chance

to see if it is a realistic option. "

>

> Or more simply, " Let us save that for another time, that is more appropriate. "

>

> But by letting her be, I got to see just how far she would go. I found out

later she went up to my husband to say the same thing, but my husband bless his

heart, took it a lot less seriously. He told her that was up to our son.

Thinking she would get the message to let it go.

>

> But, she took the next step! When she saw my son again, she asked him (he

was lounging bored in a chair)... wouldn't he like to try out a new teacher (and

right in the same room as our teacher!). I was there when she asked him. My one

bit of snarkiness came out then (the real HS).. I looked at our son, and said,

" He doesn't look very interested, does he? " My dry observing self needed to

come out at some time. All the words that wanted to come out of me before that

moment had been on hold because I did not want to be rude!!!

>

> I was blown away by her asking our son.. as if I were not doing my job. But

then, today I realized that is exactly what she heard DH say to her. Oh well,

I am doing the best I can with what I have! If I had only been able to laugh!

Instead, this whole situation left me anxious and ashamed. Two attitudes I did

not need.

>

> In my analyzing and reanalyzing (because this really got my self-esteem in

the dirt), I even wished I had been completely honest and set a boundary for

future boundary breachings, " It feels to me like you are assuming my parental

duties. " Part of me felt insulted by her plan; like I wanted to smart back

and say, " you think I have not thought about working with another teacher? " I'd

actually been trying to get my husband on board with this same plan, to find a

different teacher.... It was like she was getting right into our family

underpants. Like I was not doing enough for our son. Some folks have radar for

that. Like nada.

>

> Here is my angry speaking: I can't stand it when people try to fix

me (or my family) as if I don't have the wherewithal to do our life right. F

is not a professional in the music community. She may have been acting out of

concern, but she " forgot " we might be moving in May. In fact we have to always

be thinking about how far in advance our family can plan. And it is just months

at a time, ever since last March! She was surprised when I shared that was a

very real reality. I was thinking, Damn is she playing stupid on me? I came

just shy of telling her, " I am sorry, but I am too nice to go and switch

teachers mid year. " She is one of those entitled people who makes her decisions

and does not care what others think.

>

> In hindsight I can see why MY delayed reaction was so strong. I was trying

too hard to be loving in my behavior, but clueless about how to do so and also

detach. I literally felt like I was being bull-dozed by someone taller and

bigger than I.... who was using her " love " and " care " to push her way more into

my life, my decisions, and this got me to question my judgment. She did not do

it to me, I did.

>

> F really did hone in on an area where I've already held ambivalence for a

while. And I let her come in close and did not push her away. I feel shame at

that.

>

> Best

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

Your friend violated so many unwritten rules of social etiquette that I am not

surprised you became activated on so many levels.

You sound a lot like me, raised to be polite above all else. Yet the BPD's and

other boundary-crossers in our lives do not hold back out of a sense of

politeness.

While you are reeling from all the " stuff " this evening brought up for you,

please consider this from an objective point of view:

-You asked her to the concert as a FRIEND, not asking for critique or mentor.

-She stepped out of her role as friend when she made it her mission to

shame/cajole/manipulate all 3 of you into changing teachers. She wasn't going to

let it go until she got you to see things HER way.

-Her actions (in another's home, none the less) were completely inappropriate

social behavior.

-You do not owe this person *any* explanations about who teaches your son, what

plans you and DH have in the future, or your parenting skills (which I think are

right on target, btw).

Instead of dwelling on all the stuff she got stirred up, maybe you should

rethink the value of this friendship.

Remember, no one can make you feel inferior without your permission.

>

> It may help me to share some issues that came up for me, as a parent and a

friend.

>

> Because I have difficulties feeling good about saying no. Or protecting myself

from folks who want to " help " me.

>

> Yesterday afternoon our son had his December piano concert. A very eager

friend of mine, F, expressed a strong interest in attending. I, too, wanted to

invite her so she could be part of the experience. It is always neat when

someone WANTS to come to a kid's performance. I have challenges with this

friend, who wants to be included in my life, more than I am able to include her.

Partly because I need to focus my life in order to deal with a potential move.

Partly because she is very pushy, and I tend to be a people pleaser.

>

> (Back story : Son's teacher is an older woman, so devoted that she is getting

another degree in music education at the university. She has fewer young

students these days, and our son seems to be her best student currently. The

rest of the program was " thin, " but enjoyable.

>

> The past two years I've felt our son could/should be moving on to a new

teacher,so as to be challenged more. But looking for the good, I was not sure it

would be the best to have him go to the next level. The convenience of a teacher

in the neighborhood, combined with my respect for her commitment to her work,

and what she HAS been able to do for our son, had me staying with the tried and

true.

>

> Then I had health matter come up this same time last year, and all year we've

been under threat of moving... so it seemed very natural to NOT engage a new

teacher at this time.)

>

> Last night, enter my friend, F. A simple concert, with her family to listen to

a concert, with our son as the attraction.

>

> But. I was not prepared for my friend to judge the caliber of my son's

teacher. The expression on F's face said it all: " Don't you realize your son

needs a new teacher? " ... The first words out of her mouth were, " Have you heard

of Mergatroyd (another teacher, who is on her side of town)? " She had in mind

a " better " teacher, who is male, and yes, who likely would be a great fit for

our son. If we were staying.

>

> Because I was unwilling to back up my gut response with action that would shut

my friend down, I stayed open and listened. I guess I let her be, in the way my

father would let my nada be. And with each sentence F uttered I so wanted to

use my defenses. But I stayed thoughtful and the farther we went the more

suprised I got! It bothered me that F had found our piano teacher inadequate,

and was saying so in the teacher's house. Finally I had to take my friend out on

the porch to tell her how uncomfortable that made me. I did not state the

obvious, I am the parent and did not ask for her advice. I was being polite when

I said, " Yes I have heard about Mergatroyd, " I've heard his name before.

>

> When I look back, I KNEW I might not want to hear what she wanted to say as

soon as I saw her face, and watched her preparing to speak (sort of like

watching nada actually). Why do I allow folks to say what they need to say, and

not protect myself? Maybe because it was a public setting, not my own home.

>

> I wish I had a script in my mind to speak when I saw the judgment on her

face. I'd have said immediately. " You see that there is a range of skills

this early in the year. "

>

> And if she did speak the words, " Have you heard of Mergatroyd? You should

get your son together with him. " I would have said, " If that is something

seriously on your mind, let us discuss it later, when we have both had a chance

to see if it is a realistic option. "

>

> Or more simply, " Let us save that for another time, that is more appropriate. "

>

> But by letting her be, I got to see just how far she would go. I found out

later she went up to my husband to say the same thing, but my husband bless his

heart, took it a lot less seriously. He told her that was up to our son.

Thinking she would get the message to let it go.

>

> But, she took the next step! When she saw my son again, she asked him (he

was lounging bored in a chair)... wouldn't he like to try out a new teacher (and

right in the same room as our teacher!). I was there when she asked him. My one

bit of snarkiness came out then (the real HS).. I looked at our son, and said,

" He doesn't look very interested, does he? " My dry observing self needed to

come out at some time. All the words that wanted to come out of me before that

moment had been on hold because I did not want to be rude!!!

>

> I was blown away by her asking our son.. as if I were not doing my job. But

then, today I realized that is exactly what she heard DH say to her. Oh well,

I am doing the best I can with what I have! If I had only been able to laugh!

Instead, this whole situation left me anxious and ashamed. Two attitudes I did

not need.

>

> In my analyzing and reanalyzing (because this really got my self-esteem in

the dirt), I even wished I had been completely honest and set a boundary for

future boundary breachings, " It feels to me like you are assuming my parental

duties. " Part of me felt insulted by her plan; like I wanted to smart back

and say, " you think I have not thought about working with another teacher? " I'd

actually been trying to get my husband on board with this same plan, to find a

different teacher.... It was like she was getting right into our family

underpants. Like I was not doing enough for our son. Some folks have radar for

that. Like nada.

>

> Here is my angry speaking: I can't stand it when people try to fix

me (or my family) as if I don't have the wherewithal to do our life right. F

is not a professional in the music community. She may have been acting out of

concern, but she " forgot " we might be moving in May. In fact we have to always

be thinking about how far in advance our family can plan. And it is just months

at a time, ever since last March! She was surprised when I shared that was a

very real reality. I was thinking, Damn is she playing stupid on me? I came

just shy of telling her, " I am sorry, but I am too nice to go and switch

teachers mid year. " She is one of those entitled people who makes her decisions

and does not care what others think.

>

> In hindsight I can see why MY delayed reaction was so strong. I was trying

too hard to be loving in my behavior, but clueless about how to do so and also

detach. I literally felt like I was being bull-dozed by someone taller and

bigger than I.... who was using her " love " and " care " to push her way more into

my life, my decisions, and this got me to question my judgment. She did not do

it to me, I did.

>

> F really did hone in on an area where I've already held ambivalence for a

while. And I let her come in close and did not push her away. I feel shame at

that.

>

> Best

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

On the one hand, your friend was expressing out loud a view that you yourself

were considering: that at this point in time your son's current teacher might

have taken your son as far as she can and its time to expose your son to a

different teacher now who can take him to the next level.

On the other hand, the *way* your friend expressed her opinion was quite

grindingly obnoxious, overbearing, and downright rude.

So its kind of a conundrum; I don't have any insightful advice on how to handle

that particular situation, except to perhaps express to this friend in private

that in the future you would appreciate her discussing her opinions RE your

parenting choices with you in private, and that you found her behavior toward

the teacher and toward your family inappropriate, and shockingly rude.

If she's a decent (non-pd) human being, she'll understand that her behavior

genuinely upset you and she'll apologize, and try to observe and respect your

boundary in the future.

But if she's generally kind of obnoxious and pushy and rude, then, possibly its

time to re-think including her in your " good friend " category of friends?

It smacked me between the eyes when I realized as an adult that one of my

childhood best friends that I remained friends with as an adult, was a little

clone of my nada, and treated me about the same as nada did; she was bossy, felt

entitled to order me about, and demanded that all our interactions/visits be on

her terms. When I " woke up " to my nada's behaviors being abnormal and

disordered, it became clearer to me that I had been allowing myself to tolerate

that behavior in other people as well; probably because being mistreated had

become my " normal. "

-Annie

>

> It may help me to share some issues that came up for me, as a parent and a

friend.

>

> Because I have difficulties feeling good about saying no. Or protecting myself

from folks who want to " help " me.

>

> Yesterday afternoon our son had his December piano concert. A very eager

friend of mine, F, expressed a strong interest in attending. I, too, wanted to

invite her so she could be part of the experience. It is always neat when

someone WANTS to come to a kid's performance. I have challenges with this

friend, who wants to be included in my life, more than I am able to include her.

Partly because I need to focus my life in order to deal with a potential move.

Partly because she is very pushy, and I tend to be a people pleaser.

>

> (Back story : Son's teacher is an older woman, so devoted that she is getting

another degree in music education at the university. She has fewer young

students these days, and our son seems to be her best student currently. The

rest of the program was " thin, " but enjoyable.

>

> The past two years I've felt our son could/should be moving on to a new

teacher,so as to be challenged more. But looking for the good, I was not sure it

would be the best to have him go to the next level. The convenience of a teacher

in the neighborhood, combined with my respect for her commitment to her work,

and what she HAS been able to do for our son, had me staying with the tried and

true.

>

> Then I had health matter come up this same time last year, and all year we've

been under threat of moving... so it seemed very natural to NOT engage a new

teacher at this time.)

>

> Last night, enter my friend, F. A simple concert, with her family to listen to

a concert, with our son as the attraction.

>

> But. I was not prepared for my friend to judge the caliber of my son's

teacher. The expression on F's face said it all: " Don't you realize your son

needs a new teacher? " ... The first words out of her mouth were, " Have you heard

of Mergatroyd (another teacher, who is on her side of town)? " She had in mind

a " better " teacher, who is male, and yes, who likely would be a great fit for

our son. If we were staying.

>

> Because I was unwilling to back up my gut response with action that would shut

my friend down, I stayed open and listened. I guess I let her be, in the way my

father would let my nada be. And with each sentence F uttered I so wanted to

use my defenses. But I stayed thoughtful and the farther we went the more

suprised I got! It bothered me that F had found our piano teacher inadequate,

and was saying so in the teacher's house. Finally I had to take my friend out on

the porch to tell her how uncomfortable that made me. I did not state the

obvious, I am the parent and did not ask for her advice. I was being polite when

I said, " Yes I have heard about Mergatroyd, " I've heard his name before.

>

> When I look back, I KNEW I might not want to hear what she wanted to say as

soon as I saw her face, and watched her preparing to speak (sort of like

watching nada actually). Why do I allow folks to say what they need to say, and

not protect myself? Maybe because it was a public setting, not my own home.

>

> I wish I had a script in my mind to speak when I saw the judgment on her

face. I'd have said immediately. " You see that there is a range of skills

this early in the year. "

>

> And if she did speak the words, " Have you heard of Mergatroyd? You should

get your son together with him. " I would have said, " If that is something

seriously on your mind, let us discuss it later, when we have both had a chance

to see if it is a realistic option. "

>

> Or more simply, " Let us save that for another time, that is more appropriate. "

>

> But by letting her be, I got to see just how far she would go. I found out

later she went up to my husband to say the same thing, but my husband bless his

heart, took it a lot less seriously. He told her that was up to our son.

Thinking she would get the message to let it go.

>

> But, she took the next step! When she saw my son again, she asked him (he

was lounging bored in a chair)... wouldn't he like to try out a new teacher (and

right in the same room as our teacher!). I was there when she asked him. My one

bit of snarkiness came out then (the real HS).. I looked at our son, and said,

" He doesn't look very interested, does he? " My dry observing self needed to

come out at some time. All the words that wanted to come out of me before that

moment had been on hold because I did not want to be rude!!!

>

> I was blown away by her asking our son.. as if I were not doing my job. But

then, today I realized that is exactly what she heard DH say to her. Oh well,

I am doing the best I can with what I have! If I had only been able to laugh!

Instead, this whole situation left me anxious and ashamed. Two attitudes I did

not need.

>

> In my analyzing and reanalyzing (because this really got my self-esteem in

the dirt), I even wished I had been completely honest and set a boundary for

future boundary breachings, " It feels to me like you are assuming my parental

duties. " Part of me felt insulted by her plan; like I wanted to smart back

and say, " you think I have not thought about working with another teacher? " I'd

actually been trying to get my husband on board with this same plan, to find a

different teacher.... It was like she was getting right into our family

underpants. Like I was not doing enough for our son. Some folks have radar for

that. Like nada.

>

> Here is my angry speaking: I can't stand it when people try to fix

me (or my family) as if I don't have the wherewithal to do our life right. F

is not a professional in the music community. She may have been acting out of

concern, but she " forgot " we might be moving in May. In fact we have to always

be thinking about how far in advance our family can plan. And it is just months

at a time, ever since last March! She was surprised when I shared that was a

very real reality. I was thinking, Damn is she playing stupid on me? I came

just shy of telling her, " I am sorry, but I am too nice to go and switch

teachers mid year. " She is one of those entitled people who makes her decisions

and does not care what others think.

>

> In hindsight I can see why MY delayed reaction was so strong. I was trying

too hard to be loving in my behavior, but clueless about how to do so and also

detach. I literally felt like I was being bull-dozed by someone taller and

bigger than I.... who was using her " love " and " care " to push her way more into

my life, my decisions, and this got me to question my judgment. She did not do

it to me, I did.

>

> F really did hone in on an area where I've already held ambivalence for a

while. And I let her come in close and did not push her away. I feel shame at

that.

>

> Best

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Have you thought at all about how you came to allow this person to be a part of

your life to begin with?

I don't think you owe her any discussion about the matter. If you don't like

people giving you unsolicited advice, you are free to say so. (Though I

understand the frozen, deer-in-headlights feeling...I have SO been there!)

" I hear your concern. I am capable of making decisions for my family, and I am

not interested in your advice about this matter right now. "

> >

> > It may help me to share some issues that came up for me, as a parent and a

friend.

> >

> > Because I have difficulties feeling good about saying no. Or protecting

myself from folks who want to " help " me.

> >

> > Yesterday afternoon our son had his December piano concert. A very eager

friend of mine, F, expressed a strong interest in attending. I, too, wanted to

invite her so she could be part of the experience. It is always neat when

someone WANTS to come to a kid's performance. I have challenges with this

friend, who wants to be included in my life, more than I am able to include her.

Partly because I need to focus my life in order to deal with a potential move.

Partly because she is very pushy, and I tend to be a people pleaser.

> >

> > (Back story : Son's teacher is an older woman, so devoted that she is

getting another degree in music education at the university. She has fewer

young students these days, and our son seems to be her best student currently.

The rest of the program was " thin, " but enjoyable.

> >

> > The past two years I've felt our son could/should be moving on to a new

teacher,so as to be challenged more. But looking for the good, I was not sure it

would be the best to have him go to the next level. The convenience of a teacher

in the neighborhood, combined with my respect for her commitment to her work,

and what she HAS been able to do for our son, had me staying with the tried and

true.

> >

> > Then I had health matter come up this same time last year, and all year

we've been under threat of moving... so it seemed very natural to NOT engage a

new teacher at this time.)

> >

> > Last night, enter my friend, F. A simple concert, with her family to listen

to a concert, with our son as the attraction.

> >

> > But. I was not prepared for my friend to judge the caliber of my son's

teacher. The expression on F's face said it all: " Don't you realize your son

needs a new teacher? " ... The first words out of her mouth were, " Have you heard

of Mergatroyd (another teacher, who is on her side of town)? " She had in mind

a " better " teacher, who is male, and yes, who likely would be a great fit for

our son. If we were staying.

> >

> > Because I was unwilling to back up my gut response with action that would

shut my friend down, I stayed open and listened. I guess I let her be, in the

way my father would let my nada be. And with each sentence F uttered I so

wanted to use my defenses. But I stayed thoughtful and the farther we went the

more suprised I got! It bothered me that F had found our piano teacher

inadequate, and was saying so in the teacher's house. Finally I had to take my

friend out on the porch to tell her how uncomfortable that made me. I did not

state the obvious, I am the parent and did not ask for her advice. I was being

polite when I said, " Yes I have heard about Mergatroyd, " I've heard his name

before.

> >

> > When I look back, I KNEW I might not want to hear what she wanted to say as

soon as I saw her face, and watched her preparing to speak (sort of like

watching nada actually). Why do I allow folks to say what they need to say, and

not protect myself? Maybe because it was a public setting, not my own home.

> >

> > I wish I had a script in my mind to speak when I saw the judgment on her

face. I'd have said immediately. " You see that there is a range of skills

this early in the year. "

> >

> > And if she did speak the words, " Have you heard of Mergatroyd? You should

get your son together with him. " I would have said, " If that is something

seriously on your mind, let us discuss it later, when we have both had a chance

to see if it is a realistic option. "

> >

> > Or more simply, " Let us save that for another time, that is more

appropriate. "

> >

> > But by letting her be, I got to see just how far she would go. I found out

later she went up to my husband to say the same thing, but my husband bless his

heart, took it a lot less seriously. He told her that was up to our son.

Thinking she would get the message to let it go.

> >

> > But, she took the next step! When she saw my son again, she asked him

(he was lounging bored in a chair)... wouldn't he like to try out a new teacher

(and right in the same room as our teacher!). I was there when she asked him.

My one bit of snarkiness came out then (the real HS).. I looked at our son, and

said, " He doesn't look very interested, does he? " My dry observing self needed

to come out at some time. All the words that wanted to come out of me before

that moment had been on hold because I did not want to be rude!!!

> >

> > I was blown away by her asking our son.. as if I were not doing my job. But

then, today I realized that is exactly what she heard DH say to her. Oh well,

I am doing the best I can with what I have! If I had only been able to laugh!

Instead, this whole situation left me anxious and ashamed. Two attitudes I did

not need.

> >

> > In my analyzing and reanalyzing (because this really got my self-esteem in

the dirt), I even wished I had been completely honest and set a boundary for

future boundary breachings, " It feels to me like you are assuming my parental

duties. " Part of me felt insulted by her plan; like I wanted to smart back

and say, " you think I have not thought about working with another teacher? " I'd

actually been trying to get my husband on board with this same plan, to find a

different teacher.... It was like she was getting right into our family

underpants. Like I was not doing enough for our son. Some folks have radar for

that. Like nada.

> >

> > Here is my angry speaking: I can't stand it when people try to

fix me (or my family) as if I don't have the wherewithal to do our life right.

F is not a professional in the music community. She may have been acting out of

concern, but she " forgot " we might be moving in May. In fact we have to always

be thinking about how far in advance our family can plan. And it is just months

at a time, ever since last March! She was surprised when I shared that was a

very real reality. I was thinking, Damn is she playing stupid on me? I came

just shy of telling her, " I am sorry, but I am too nice to go and switch

teachers mid year. " She is one of those entitled people who makes her decisions

and does not care what others think.

> >

> > In hindsight I can see why MY delayed reaction was so strong. I was trying

too hard to be loving in my behavior, but clueless about how to do so and also

detach. I literally felt like I was being bull-dozed by someone taller and

bigger than I.... who was using her " love " and " care " to push her way more into

my life, my decisions, and this got me to question my judgment. She did not do

it to me, I did.

> >

> > F really did hone in on an area where I've already held ambivalence for a

while. And I let her come in close and did not push her away. I feel shame at

that.

> >

> > Best

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Fiona for so much clear validating. I really do need it spelled out, for

when I am the deer in the headlights, all I know is that something felt real bad

and I am more likely to personalize it and have it wake me up in the wee hours

of the night.

It really helped me to see that she was indeed the rude one. I did nothing

wrong, and I have nothing to be ashamed of. That said, I do not want to shame

HER. I do, however, KNOW that if I ever see someone look at me like that again,

as if they had eaten a bird... (YECCH!) That I will shut them down with a

furrow on my brow. I might even say, " I have the feeling you are about to say

something I have no business overhearing.. if you get my drift? "

And then, I will arch my brow and turn away, whistling. Later, much later, I

will ask such a droll person, casually in conversation when I am buying the

wine, " Want to tell me what you were about to say the other day? "

And I will get to see if they are innocent or not!

Best,