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Every time I see her I know I shouldn't. I know it will only turn into a fight.

Yesterday i saw her for the first time since July because she insisted that we

meet because after I told her I have one more class to take before becoming a

college grad so, we " had to celebrate " . Normally she is very difficult or nearly

impossible to make plans with, so I told her I had a 2 hour window of time 2

days later, which normally would NEVER work for her. Somehow she magically had

time and could make it. She met me after my last final and brought cupcakes like

she used to make me when I was little. I was doing great of being there but very

attached. Even when she talked about how she couldnt get a job because she has

had health problems and was in multiple hospitals last month (news to me).

Apparently the potential employers could access her health records through her

SSN. When I asked why she told no one she was in the hospital she said " why

burden everyone with her problems?what could they do " and " What's the worst that

could happen? I died? " Basically she sounded batshit crazy. The icing on the

cake was when she asked If i would ever spend another holiday with her again in

sad puppy dog voice and I calmly said " no, Last Christmas (and many before this

there were problems too but I used last year as an example) we got into a fight

and I spent the day home alone and crying. I don't want to do that this year and

I am not ready to spend another holiday with you. " She looked at me with

confused eyes and asked what we were even fighting about. She could not even

remember yelling at me on Christmas in the street because I had accidently put

$4 instead of $2 in the parking ticket machine. Anyway, she comes out with the

fact that she read a book with me in it- an ex-boyfriend decided to write a

memoir when a bunch of things went terribly wrong in his life at the same time

including our relationship and self publish it and put it on amazon. I thought

about suing him at the time because a good portion of it is slander, but I

ultimately decided that it was poorly written and just plain mean book that no

one would take seriously or read. And if anyone actually did read it they

wouldnt know it was me in the book and was not worth my money to do anything

about this shitty book. Well I made the mistake 2 years ago of telling my nada

about it when our relationship was on a 5 month positive upswing and I was

really distraught about all these personal details and false facts being out

there about me. BAD IDEA. THis was before a bunch of things happened reminding

me that she will use anything I tell her against me.

So I am sitting next to her in shock for a second because I don't even know what

she is talking about. And she starts talking about how hurtful it was to HER to

read all those things about me and it's on AMAZON for EVERYONE to read. I wanted

to kill her. I could not believe after everything I had told her, she had hunted

down this book, bought it, supporting the other person by buying it and read it.

The book itself was a huge invasion of privacy and the fact that my nada had

read it and taken it all at face value and just used it to hurt me by bringing

up the most random minute things to point out how i was a " bad person " was just

devastating. I asked her for advice and instead she turned it into a way to

violate my privacy again. It honestly made me sick to my stomach and wanted to

throw up. I told her she is a bad person who needs to reevaluate her actions

and relationships and maybe then she could understand why no one would even want

to visit her in the hospital. She smiled and said that's not true. Then i left

and threw away her stupid cupcakes. A few minutes later she left a voicemail-

asking where I went and maybe I went to go catch my train but to have a good

time on break and on my pending trip to Central America and she loves me. She

said it so normal as if nothing had just happened. Meanwhile I am still reeling

and depressed all over again about this stupid book I managed to forget about

for the past 2 years and how malicious my mother is.

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((((()))))

I'm so sorry you had to go through that. I recall many similar incidents, in

which my nada would attack me emotionally and then act like nothing had just

happened. Its freaking crazy-making. Its like being hit by a hit-and-run

driver who then denies having run you down. I think there are serious

cognitive issues going on with those with bpd; their hold on reality is

genuinely compromised.

All we can do is learn, *try* to learn from these experiences, that nada is one

very messed-up individual who may actually feel entitled to hurt you and may

even enjoy setting you up to be hurt, shamed or degraded. Recognizing the

reality for what it is, can then help us to create the emotional distance needed

to ensure our safety starting now and into the future.

For those who feel they must remain in contact, then I suggest keeping the

exchanges with nada on a very, very, VERY superficial level. Never tell her

anything important about your feelings, your life, your hopes and dreams.

Always remind yourself that your open, trusting heart is not safe with your

nada. Instead, just let her talk about herself; that should take up a whole

lunch. But if nada turns nasty, cut the call or lunch short. Refuse to

participate in being interrogated; you can say " That topic is not on the table

for discussion " , or if nada begins to pepper you with questions, then, oops!

Gee, gotta go. 'Bye nada.

Its hard to wrap our minds around the idea that at this point in our lives (as

adults) we have to take over the reins, we have to be the " driver " now in our

relationship with our mentally ill parent(s), because they were never actually

qualified to " drive " in the first place.

But the truth is that you are in charge now; if you choose to remain in contact,

YOU get to call the shots. You get to say " no " , or just leave if nada begins

acting abusively toward you, and you can do it calmly, politely, and

assertively. You're the adult now.

Isn't that great?!

-Annie

>

> Every time I see her I know I shouldn't. I know it will only turn into a

fight. Yesterday i saw her for the first time since July because she insisted

that we meet because after I told her I have one more class to take before

becoming a college grad so, we " had to celebrate " . Normally she is very

difficult or nearly impossible to make plans with, so I told her I had a 2 hour

window of time 2 days later, which normally would NEVER work for her. Somehow

she magically had time and could make it. She met me after my last final and

brought cupcakes like she used to make me when I was little. I was doing great

of being there but very attached. Even when she talked about how she couldnt get

a job because she has had health problems and was in multiple hospitals last

month (news to me). Apparently the potential employers could access her health

records through her SSN. When I asked why she told no one she was in the

hospital she said " why burden everyone with her problems?what could they do " and

" What's the worst that could happen? I died? " Basically she sounded batshit

crazy. The icing on the cake was when she asked If i would ever spend another

holiday with her again in sad puppy dog voice and I calmly said " no, Last

Christmas (and many before this there were problems too but I used last year as

an example) we got into a fight and I spent the day home alone and crying. I

don't want to do that this year and I am not ready to spend another holiday with

you. " She looked at me with confused eyes and asked what we were even fighting

about. She could not even remember yelling at me on Christmas in the street

because I had accidently put $4 instead of $2 in the parking ticket machine.

Anyway, she comes out with the fact that she read a book with me in it- an

ex-boyfriend decided to write a memoir when a bunch of things went terribly

wrong in his life at the same time including our relationship and self publish

it and put it on amazon. I thought about suing him at the time because a good

portion of it is slander, but I ultimately decided that it was poorly written

and just plain mean book that no one would take seriously or read. And if anyone

actually did read it they wouldnt know it was me in the book and was not worth

my money to do anything about this shitty book. Well I made the mistake 2 years

ago of telling my nada about it when our relationship was on a 5 month positive

upswing and I was really distraught about all these personal details and false

facts being out there about me. BAD IDEA. THis was before a bunch of things

happened reminding me that she will use anything I tell her against me.

> So I am sitting next to her in shock for a second because I don't even know

what she is talking about. And she starts talking about how hurtful it was to

HER to read all those things about me and it's on AMAZON for EVERYONE to read. I

wanted to kill her. I could not believe after everything I had told her, she had

hunted down this book, bought it, supporting the other person by buying it and

read it. The book itself was a huge invasion of privacy and the fact that my

nada had read it and taken it all at face value and just used it to hurt me by

bringing up the most random minute things to point out how i was a " bad person "

was just devastating. I asked her for advice and instead she turned it into a

way to violate my privacy again. It honestly made me sick to my stomach and

wanted to throw up. I told her she is a bad person who needs to reevaluate her

actions and relationships and maybe then she could understand why no one would

even want to visit her in the hospital. She smiled and said that's not true.

Then i left and threw away her stupid cupcakes. A few minutes later she left a

voicemail- asking where I went and maybe I went to go catch my train but to have

a good time on break and on my pending trip to Central America and she loves me.

She said it so normal as if nothing had just happened. Meanwhile I am still

reeling and depressed all over again about this stupid book I managed to forget

about for the past 2 years and how malicious my mother is.

>

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,

Sorry you went through this. The other thing that's interesting, these

people will fight so hard to see people who don't want to be with them?

Isn't that interesting? I consider myself an average person. I don't want

people around me who don't want to be around me but they do. And we can

feel obligated to see them when they want to see us. It's really very

crazy. In other words they don't want to see us to make us happy they know

we don't want to be there so why do they want to see us???? The only answer

I have is this: they are like vampires who want to feed on us. They want

attention and to feel their power when they get us to react.

On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 12:51 PM, anuria67854 wrote:

> **

>

>

> ((((()))))

>

> I'm so sorry you had to go through that. I recall many similar incidents,

> in which my nada would attack me emotionally and then act like nothing had

> just happened. Its freaking crazy-making. Its like being hit by a

> hit-and-run driver who then denies having run you down. I think there are

> serious cognitive issues going on with those with bpd; their hold on

> reality is genuinely compromised.

>

> All we can do is learn, *try* to learn from these experiences, that nada

> is one very messed-up individual who may actually feel entitled to hurt you

> and may even enjoy setting you up to be hurt, shamed or degraded.

> Recognizing the reality for what it is, can then help us to create the

> emotional distance needed to ensure our safety starting now and into the

> future.

>

> For those who feel they must remain in contact, then I suggest keeping the

> exchanges with nada on a very, very, VERY superficial level. Never tell her

> anything important about your feelings, your life, your hopes and dreams.

> Always remind yourself that your open, trusting heart is not safe with your

> nada. Instead, just let her talk about herself; that should take up a whole

> lunch. But if nada turns nasty, cut the call or lunch short. Refuse to

> participate in being interrogated; you can say " That topic is not on the

> table for discussion " , or if nada begins to pepper you with questions,

> then, oops! Gee, gotta go. 'Bye nada.

>

> Its hard to wrap our minds around the idea that at this point in our lives

> (as adults) we have to take over the reins, we have to be the " driver " now

> in our relationship with our mentally ill parent(s), because they were

> never actually qualified to " drive " in the first place.

>

> But the truth is that you are in charge now; if you choose to remain in

> contact, YOU get to call the shots. You get to say " no " , or just leave if

> nada begins acting abusively toward you, and you can do it calmly,

> politely, and assertively. You're the adult now.

>

> Isn't that great?!

>

> -Annie

>

>

>

> >

> > Every time I see her I know I shouldn't. I know it will only turn into a

> fight. Yesterday i saw her for the first time since July because she

> insisted that we meet because after I told her I have one more class to

> take before becoming a college grad so, we " had to celebrate " . Normally she

> is very difficult or nearly impossible to make plans with, so I told her I

> had a 2 hour window of time 2 days later, which normally would NEVER work

> for her. Somehow she magically had time and could make it. She met me after

> my last final and brought cupcakes like she used to make me when I was

> little. I was doing great of being there but very attached. Even when she

> talked about how she couldnt get a job because she has had health problems

> and was in multiple hospitals last month (news to me). Apparently the

> potential employers could access her health records through her SSN. When I

> asked why she told no one she was in the hospital she said " why burden

> everyone with her problems?what could they do " and " What's the worst that

> could happen? I died? " Basically she sounded batshit crazy. The icing on

> the cake was when she asked If i would ever spend another holiday with her

> again in sad puppy dog voice and I calmly said " no, Last Christmas (and

> many before this there were problems too but I used last year as an

> example) we got into a fight and I spent the day home alone and crying. I

> don't want to do that this year and I am not ready to spend another holiday

> with you. " She looked at me with confused eyes and asked what we were even

> fighting about. She could not even remember yelling at me on Christmas in

> the street because I had accidently put $4 instead of $2 in the parking

> ticket machine. Anyway, she comes out with the fact that she read a book

> with me in it- an ex-boyfriend decided to write a memoir when a bunch of

> things went terribly wrong in his life at the same time including our

> relationship and self publish it and put it on amazon. I thought about

> suing him at the time because a good portion of it is slander, but I

> ultimately decided that it was poorly written and just plain mean book that

> no one would take seriously or read. And if anyone actually did read it

> they wouldnt know it was me in the book and was not worth my money to do

> anything about this shitty book. Well I made the mistake 2 years ago of

> telling my nada about it when our relationship was on a 5 month positive

> upswing and I was really distraught about all these personal details and

> false facts being out there about me. BAD IDEA. THis was before a bunch of

> things happened reminding me that she will use anything I tell her against

> me.

> > So I am sitting next to her in shock for a second because I don't even

> know what she is talking about. And she starts talking about how hurtful it

> was to HER to read all those things about me and it's on AMAZON for

> EVERYONE to read. I wanted to kill her. I could not believe after

> everything I had told her, she had hunted down this book, bought it,

> supporting the other person by buying it and read it. The book itself was a

> huge invasion of privacy and the fact that my nada had read it and taken it

> all at face value and just used it to hurt me by bringing up the most

> random minute things to point out how i was a " bad person " was just

> devastating. I asked her for advice and instead she turned it into a way to

> violate my privacy again. It honestly made me sick to my stomach and wanted

> to throw up. I told her she is a bad person who needs to reevaluate her

> actions and relationships and maybe then she could understand why no one

> would even want to visit her in the hospital. She smiled and said that's

> not true. Then i left and threw away her stupid cupcakes. A few minutes

> later she left a voicemail- asking where I went and maybe I went to go

> catch my train but to have a good time on break and on my pending trip to

> Central America and she loves me. She said it so normal as if nothing had

> just happened. Meanwhile I am still reeling and depressed all over again

> about this stupid book I managed to forget about for the past 2 years and

> how malicious my mother is.

> >

>

>

>

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On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 1:36 PM, Millicent Kunstler <

millicentkunstler@...> wrote:

> ,

>

> Sorry you went through this. The other thing that's interesting, these

> people will fight so hard to see people who don't want to be with them?

> Isn't that interesting? I consider myself an average person. I don't want

> people around me who don't want to be around me but they do. And we can

> feel obligated to see them when they want to see us. It's really very

> crazy. In other words they don't want to see us to make us happy they know

> we don't want to be there so why do they want to see us???? The only answer

> I have is this: they are like vampires who want to feed on us. They want

> attention and to feel their power when they get us to react.

>

>

> On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 12:51 PM, anuria67854 wrote:

>

>> **

>>

>>

>> ((((()))))

>>

>> I'm so sorry you had to go through that. I recall many similar incidents,

>> in which my nada would attack me emotionally and then act like nothing had

>> just happened. Its freaking crazy-making. Its like being hit by a

>> hit-and-run driver who then denies having run you down. I think there are

>> serious cognitive issues going on with those with bpd; their hold on

>> reality is genuinely compromised.

>>

>> All we can do is learn, *try* to learn from these experiences, that nada

>> is one very messed-up individual who may actually feel entitled to hurt you

>> and may even enjoy setting you up to be hurt, shamed or degraded.

>> Recognizing the reality for what it is, can then help us to create the

>> emotional distance needed to ensure our safety starting now and into the

>> future.

>>

>> For those who feel they must remain in contact, then I suggest keeping

>> the exchanges with nada on a very, very, VERY superficial level. Never tell

>> her anything important about your feelings, your life, your hopes and

>> dreams. Always remind yourself that your open, trusting heart is not safe

>> with your nada. Instead, just let her talk about herself; that should take

>> up a whole lunch. But if nada turns nasty, cut the call or lunch short.

>> Refuse to participate in being interrogated; you can say " That topic is not

>> on the table for discussion " , or if nada begins to pepper you with

>> questions, then, oops! Gee, gotta go. 'Bye nada.

>>

>> Its hard to wrap our minds around the idea that at this point in our

>> lives (as adults) we have to take over the reins, we have to be the

>> " driver " now in our relationship with our mentally ill parent(s), because

>> they were never actually qualified to " drive " in the first place.

>>

>> But the truth is that you are in charge now; if you choose to remain in

>> contact, YOU get to call the shots. You get to say " no " , or just leave if

>> nada begins acting abusively toward you, and you can do it calmly,

>> politely, and assertively. You're the adult now.

>>

>> Isn't that great?!

>>

>> -Annie

>>

>>

>>

>> >

>> > Every time I see her I know I shouldn't. I know it will only turn into

>> a fight. Yesterday i saw her for the first time since July because she

>> insisted that we meet because after I told her I have one more class to

>> take before becoming a college grad so, we " had to celebrate " . Normally she

>> is very difficult or nearly impossible to make plans with, so I told her I

>> had a 2 hour window of time 2 days later, which normally would NEVER work

>> for her. Somehow she magically had time and could make it. She met me after

>> my last final and brought cupcakes like she used to make me when I was

>> little. I was doing great of being there but very attached. Even when she

>> talked about how she couldnt get a job because she has had health problems

>> and was in multiple hospitals last month (news to me). Apparently the

>> potential employers could access her health records through her SSN. When I

>> asked why she told no one she was in the hospital she said " why burden

>> everyone with her problems?what could they do " and " What's the worst that

>> could happen? I died? " Basically she sounded batshit crazy. The icing on

>> the cake was when she asked If i would ever spend another holiday with her

>> again in sad puppy dog voice and I calmly said " no, Last Christmas (and

>> many before this there were problems too but I used last year as an

>> example) we got into a fight and I spent the day home alone and crying. I

>> don't want to do that this year and I am not ready to spend another holiday

>> with you. " She looked at me with confused eyes and asked what we were even

>> fighting about. She could not even remember yelling at me on Christmas in

>> the street because I had accidently put $4 instead of $2 in the parking

>> ticket machine. Anyway, she comes out with the fact that she read a book

>> with me in it- an ex-boyfriend decided to write a memoir when a bunch of

>> things went terribly wrong in his life at the same time including our

>> relationship and self publish it and put it on amazon. I thought about

>> suing him at the time because a good portion of it is slander, but I

>> ultimately decided that it was poorly written and just plain mean book that

>> no one would take seriously or read. And if anyone actually did read it

>> they wouldnt know it was me in the book and was not worth my money to do

>> anything about this shitty book. Well I made the mistake 2 years ago of

>> telling my nada about it when our relationship was on a 5 month positive

>> upswing and I was really distraught about all these personal details and

>> false facts being out there about me. BAD IDEA. THis was before a bunch of

>> things happened reminding me that she will use anything I tell her against

>> me.

>> > So I am sitting next to her in shock for a second because I don't even

>> know what she is talking about. And she starts talking about how hurtful it

>> was to HER to read all those things about me and it's on AMAZON for

>> EVERYONE to read. I wanted to kill her. I could not believe after

>> everything I had told her, she had hunted down this book, bought it,

>> supporting the other person by buying it and read it. The book itself was a

>> huge invasion of privacy and the fact that my nada had read it and taken it

>> all at face value and just used it to hurt me by bringing up the most

>> random minute things to point out how i was a " bad person " was just

>> devastating. I asked her for advice and instead she turned it into a way to

>> violate my privacy again. It honestly made me sick to my stomach and wanted

>> to throw up. I told her she is a bad person who needs to reevaluate her

>> actions and relationships and maybe then she could understand why no one

>> would even want to visit her in the hospital. She smiled and said that's

>> not true. Then i left and threw away her stupid cupcakes. A few minutes

>> later she left a voicemail- asking where I went and maybe I went to go

>> catch my train but to have a good time on break and on my pending trip to

>> Central America and she loves me. She said it so normal as if nothing had

>> just happened. Meanwhile I am still reeling and depressed all over again

>> about this stupid book I managed to forget about for the past 2 years and

>> how malicious my mother is.

>> >

>>

>>

>>

>

>

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