Geee, mom, why WOULDN'T I want you talking to my son?!?

[Guest guest]

Hey KO's

After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do this

NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her from

having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now she

thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting back at

her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows what

twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to involve

my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was sad

because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why she

and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I won't

be judged.

C

[Guest guest]

You do have enough to worry about without her drama. Good luck!

> **

>

>

> Hey KO's

>

> After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

> this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

> from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL

> SERVICE!!! Now she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as

> a way of getting back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a

> visit for god knows what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head.

> Maybe for her trying to involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument

> too. Telling him that she was sad because I had never let her talk to my

> husband and THAT was the reason why she and I had been yelling at each

> other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of wondering what lies and shit

> she was pouring into his ears?

>

> If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

> already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

> enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I

> don't have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all

> my other bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money

> after not working for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to

> working full time as a Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing

> people just three hours in a day which only happens once every other week.

> I don't have a million and one other things I have to sort out figure out

> because I have a young, grieving son that misses his daddy depending on me.

>

> Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

> won't be judged.

>

> C

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, your nada is acting like a nut job. Life has pushed you to the wall, and

anyone in their right mind knows that now is not the time to try to push buttons

or boundaries.

That said, ignore her as much as you can and concentrate on you and your son. If

contact with her is at all destabilizing for either of you, then use that if you

need a reason to go LC/NC.

Feel free to vent anytime.

>

> Hey KO's

>

> After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do this

NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her from

having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now she

thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting back at

her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows what

twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to involve

my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was sad

because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why she

and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

>

> If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

>

> Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I won't

be judged.

>

> C

>

[Guest guest]

(((((Carla)))))

I'm so sorry that in your time of grief and anxiety, your nada is making

everything worse by making it all about HER. Its one of the big, gaping holes

in the bpd person's character makeup, that they will turn anything and

everything around and make it about their own self and their needs. Even though

" lack of empathy " is not a bpd trait, it is a trait of narcissistic pd. And I

wonder if the DSM is right about that, myself. I see the bpd's total focus on

their own needs and feelings as being rather blatantly lacking in empathy and

rather blatantly narcissistic.

I think borderline pd is basically narcissism, but with the addition of having a

broken emotional " rheostat " ; that causes the emotional dysregulation and the

tendency toward high impulsivity and the tendency toward transient delusional

thinking and paranoia (which is what your nada's accusations against you are

sounding like to me: delusional, paranoid ideation.)

You know what will work best for you, in your situation, but I personally see

nothing wrong about taking a " time out " from your nada, aka temporary No

Contact, for as long as you need to. You have the right to allow yourself to

mourn, to focus on your child's needs (and protect him from his grandmother's

bizarre, untrue confabulations) and figure out what your future plans will be.

You don't need nada-drama on top of all that.

I'm so sorry for your loss and for the unnecessary additional hurt that your

nada is piling on you.

-Annie

>

> Hey KO's

>

> After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do this

NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her from

having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now she

thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting back at

her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows what

twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to involve

my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was sad

because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why she

and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

>

> If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

>

> Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I won't

be judged.

>

> C

>

[Guest guest]

what I really need is a way to express to her that I do not have the time or the

energy to coddle her every paranoid assumption. I know her and I know to what

she was referring to when she left the message, and tho I COULD call her and

tell her that I had just turned off my phone while I was out earlier at the

movies and never turned it back on, I feel that would just feed into her belief

that i have to sooth her every misconception. Oh, and I need a way to say it

without it dripping in sarcasm and with too many big words, because this

triggers her too. I can't use too many big words because this is me showing off

and belittling her LACK of education and vocabulary. It has nothing at all to do

with the fact that I was and still am an avid reader and I love words! To say

nothing of the fact that she should be PROUD of this and not intimidated by it.

& #128544;GRRRR

I just took my son to see the new movie, Hugo, yesterday, and the little girl in

the movie, Isabella reminds me of me at that age. I just loved learning new

words and using them. I had a classmate tell me in third grade that I used too

many big words and she just didn't understand me! I don't ever remeber that

making me self conscience about using them tho. I think it just made me explain

them to her. LOL can we say closet teacher?

> >

> > Hey KO's

> >

> > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now

she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting

back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows

what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to

involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was

sad because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why

she and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

> >

> > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

> >

> > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

won't be judged.

> >

> > C

> >

>

[Guest guest]

A friend of mine who is actually has very mild bpd had a great suggestion when

my nada was off on a roll. Stop expecting her to act like a rational person

because she isn't and won't. Realize she will act and say things very

inapproiate. There's nothing you can do about it.

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2011 6:34 AM

Subject: Re: Geee, mom, why WOULDN'T I want you talking to

my son?!?

Â

what I really need is a way to express to her that I do not have the time or the

energy to coddle her every paranoid assumption. I know her and I know to what

she was referring to when she left the message, and tho I COULD call her and

tell her that I had just turned off my phone while I was out earlier at the

movies and never turned it back on, I feel that would just feed into her belief

that i have to sooth her every misconception. Oh, and I need a way to say it

without it dripping in sarcasm and with too many big words, because this

triggers her too. I can't use too many big words because this is me showing off

and belittling her LACK of education and vocabulary. It has nothing at all to do

with the fact that I was and still am an avid reader and I love words! To say

nothing of the fact that she should be PROUD of this and not intimidated by it.

& #128544;GRRRR

I just took my son to see the new movie, Hugo, yesterday, and the little girl in

the movie, Isabella reminds me of me at that age. I just loved learning new

words and using them. I had a classmate tell me in third grade that I used too

many big words and she just didn't understand me! I don't ever remeber that

making me self conscience about using them tho. I think it just made me explain

them to her. LOL can we say closet teacher?

> >

> > Hey KO's

> >

> > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now

she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting

back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows

what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to

involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was

sad because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why

she and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

> >

> > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

> >

> > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

won't be judged.

> >

> > C

> >

>

[Guest guest]

(((Carla))) I'm so sorry. It really is all about them, them, them. No matter

the occasion, it's them time.

Even now, in your grief, she can't give you space or give you a freaking break

from the accusations and analysis on why you're keeping (protecting is more like

it!!) your son from her.

I agree with you; NC/LC is your only hope for turning down the stress. You've

already got more than enough on your plate.

I wish you clarity of mind and peace. You sound like an amazing person and an

extraordinary mom. You will get through this; it's going to be rough, but you

will.

>

> Hey KO's

>

> After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do this

NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her from

having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now she

thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting back at

her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows what

twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to involve

my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was sad

because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why she

and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

>

> If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

>

> Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I won't

be judged.

>

> C

>

[Guest guest]

How about: " Mom, I need a " time out " . I just need very badly to be alone for a

while, with my child, and really just think about my husband and cry and be with

him in thought, and remember him with our son: so I won't be returning your

calls for a while. I'll call you when I'm ready to be with you again. I know

you will understand that I need this time alone very much. Thank you for

understanding. " And repeat like a broken record; no further explanation, no

defending and no persuading. You are making a statement, not making a request.

(You could mention a time frame, such as " ... so I won't be returning your calls

for a couple of weeks. " ... which hopefully would prevent nada's

fear-of-abandonment from stampeding and calling the police to come " check on

you " every hour.)

Our nadas program us to feel an overpowering sense of responsibility to cater to

them, put their needs first and nurture them (or they train us to fear them and

obey them) starting when we are tiny. We are literally brainwashed from birth

to never, ever stand up to our nada; they make us afraid to: either afraid of

" hurting her " by infusing us with Obligation and Guilt, or we literally FEAR

her displeasure, fear " making her mad. " Nadas sometimes engineer it so that

their child becomes literally dependent on them financially and never grows up

emotionally, insuring that their adult child will never leave nada. (Good

illustration of this in the old film, " Now, Voyager. " )

NO other person in our lives has this degree of power over us, that our own

mother has. Its just a tragedy and a crime that our mothers were/are mentally

ill and misuse their power.

If nothing else works for you, then, my suggestion is to get angry. Anger can

make us act to protect ourselves, instead of being paralyzed by fear or by

misplaced, inappropriate feelings of guilt and responsibility. And if you can't

get angry on your own behalf, maybe you can access your anger on behalf of your

son, who doesn't deserve to be exposed to a toxic grandnada who would try to

alienate him from either of his parents.

I hope that this very sad time will be bearable for you, a little more bearable,

if you have some time to yourselves, just you and your boy. My heart goes out

to you.

-Annie

> > >

> > > Hey KO's

> > >

> > > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now

she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting

back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows

what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to

involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was

sad because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why

she and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

> > >

> > > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

> > >

> > > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

won't be judged.

> > >

> > > C

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I think this is excellent advice, its like the " radical acceptance " thing I've

heard of. So its accepting that nada is not capable of being empathetic and

putting your needs first, and its about prioritizing your own needs (and your

child's needs) ANYWAY.

Its being able to say to yourself, " Nada's feelings are hurt, but, its not my

job to make her feel better. Asking for time for myself is not wrong, I need to

have this time to mourn and grieve. I have done nothing wrong, and so there is

nothing to feel guilty about. Nada is an adult who can take care of herself, I

am NOT responsible for parenting my nada. My child DOES depend on me and that

is normal and natural for me to parent him. Nada's dysfunction is neither

normal nor natural. My child needs me now, and I need time to heal. "

Its like swimming up a waterfall in difficulty level to shed inappropriate,

misplaced feelings of guilt and responsibility, but its possible. I wish you

the best of luck with this.

-Annie

> > >

> > > Hey KO's

> > >

> > > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now

she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting

back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows

what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to

involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was

sad because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why

she and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

> > >

> > > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

> > >

> > > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

won't be judged.

> > >

> > > C

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Gosh, who in the world needs therapy with a group like all of YOU to seek advice

and comfort from? That is said with absolute sincerity. Although, my son and I

are going into counseling after the holidays, having all of you as a sounding

board about the nada specific drama is like they say on the Master Card

commercials, priceless.

As angry as I get over the crap my nada pulls, I am moving toward radical

acceptance in my philosophy too. I think that such a step has to be tempered

with strong boundaries and the patience of a saint, and I aint no saint! LOL

WTO is where I have my hissy fit about it when it is even more than I can bear,

and I can bear an awful lot, under normal circumstances. Right now, my tolerance

for this kind of behavior is pretty slim. I feel like this is where I can shout

out how I REALLY feel in that moment and what I would REALLY like to say, as

ugly as that can sometimes be. I rarely ever take anything but the best option

available to me. I always think things thru before I speak or act and choose

what I feel is the wisest course of action. Kind of like an extreme version of

counting to ten before you speak or act.

These things I know right now. It has been more than twelve hours since she left

the message and I have made NO attempt to call her back and I don't know when I

WILL call her. I haven't even looked at my phone, which still has the ringer

turned off. I figured that she needs some time to cool off and I need to script

out what I will say to her (and pray that my call goes straight to voicemail!) I

am expecting NO important calls today and have no intention of answering calls

from anyone until I am ready.

I get to do at least one fun thing today, I get to go put titles on the super 8

movies that my husband made when he was a child that I am having transfered over

to DVD! I have no intention of letting my nada ruin that for me and if that

means I don't turn my ringer back on for the rest of the day, so be it.

Thanks to all of you for your kind and wise words, I have found much help from

each of you that I can put into action.

C.

> >

> > Hey KO's

> >

> > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now

she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting

back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows

what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to

involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was

sad because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why

she and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

> >

> > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

> >

> > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

won't be judged.

> >

> > C

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hey all,

I went to a lecture a couple of months ago about " difficult people " and bpd

given by a psychiatrist researcher. He told us that the new DSM coming out may

vary likely merge npd into the bpd spectrum. Interesting.

Away from the Fire

> > >

> > > Hey KO's

> > >

> > > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now

she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting

back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows

what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to

involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was

sad because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why

she and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

> > >

> > > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

> > >

> > > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

won't be judged.

> > >

> > > C

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I decided to NOT return nadas call from Tuesday evening. I decided that I would

just put her in time out, contact wise until further notice. I don't owe her any

explanations, and like I said earlier, I feel like explaining to her how wrong

her thought process was in jumping to this latest conclusion, is just enabling

her to continue to depend on ME to calm her mind when she has upset herself by

making assumptions.

Well, after not returning her call from Tuesday evening, nada just called and

left a message that I just shouldn't pay any attention to her and that she

understood if I needed a break, but that she loved hearing from me and would

love to be able to talk to my son. Apparently me putting her in " time out " has

had a desired effect. ;-)

C

> >

> > Hey KO's

> >

> > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to do

this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept her

from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL SERVICE!!! Now

she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as a way of getting

back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a visit for god knows

what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head. Maybe for her trying to

involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument too. Telling him that she was

sad because I had never let her talk to my husband and THAT was the reason why

she and I had been yelling at each other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of

wondering what lies and shit she was pouring into his ears?

> >

> > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than I am

already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't have

enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my son, I don't

have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage and all my other

bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make money after not working

for the past three years knowing that I cannot go back to working full time as a

Massage therapist because my hands ache after seeing people just three hours in

a day which only happens once every other week. I don't have a million and one

other things I have to sort out figure out because I have a young, grieving son

that misses his daddy depending on me.

> >

> > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know I

won't be judged.

> >

> > C

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I don't know your situation but it sounds like you now have the upper hand,

which she is giving you in order to get you to re engage, thus the game

continues on and on. Just an observation. I know I have been in this type

of interaction many times and it's very intoxicating when I've felt I have

the upper hand.

> **

>

>

> I decided to NOT return nadas call from Tuesday evening. I decided that I

> would just put her in time out, contact wise until further notice. I don't

> owe her any explanations, and like I said earlier, I feel like explaining

> to her how wrong her thought process was in jumping to this latest

> conclusion, is just enabling her to continue to depend on ME to calm her

> mind when she has upset herself by making assumptions.

>

> Well, after not returning her call from Tuesday evening, nada just called

> and left a message that I just shouldn't pay any attention to her and that

> she understood if I needed a break, but that she loved hearing from me and

> would love to be able to talk to my son. Apparently me putting her in " time

> out " has had a desired effect. ;-)

>

> C

>

>

> > >

> > > Hey KO's

> > >

> > > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to

> do this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept

> her from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL

> SERVICE!!! Now she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as

> a way of getting back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a

> visit for god knows what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head.

> Maybe for her trying to involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument

> too. Telling him that she was sad because I had never let her talk to my

> husband and THAT was the reason why she and I had been yelling at each

> other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of wondering what lies and shit

> she was pouring into his ears?

> > >

> > > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than

> I am already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't

> have enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my

> son, I don't have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage

> and all my other bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make

> money after not working for the past three years knowing that I cannot go

> back to working full time as a Massage therapist because my hands ache

> after seeing people just three hours in a day which only happens once every

> other week. I don't have a million and one other things I have to sort out

> figure out because I have a young, grieving son that misses his daddy

> depending on me.

> > >

> > > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know

> I won't be judged.

> > >

> > > C

> > >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Actually, that makes sense to me. I have started thinking of all the Cluster B

pds as basically " narcissism " , and its the " extras " or optional dysfunctional

traits that define the individual disorder. So borderline pd is narcissism with

the added ingredients of (a) only a tentative hold on reality ( " schizophrenia

lite " ) and ( emotional dysregulation. Histrionic pd is narcissism with sexual

acting out, and antisocial pd is narcissism with the absence of a conscience (a

sense of right and wrong.)

I know I am oversimplifying, but it has seemed to me for a long time now that

narcissism is the underlying common factor of all the Cluster B pds: " its

always, ALWAYS, all about ME. "

-Annie

>

> Hey all,

>

> I went to a lecture a couple of months ago about " difficult people " and bpd

given by a psychiatrist researcher. He told us that the new DSM coming out may

vary likely merge npd into the bpd spectrum. Interesting.

>

> Away from the Fire

[Guest guest]

LOL, yeah, well, I wrote that one before she called the NEXT TWO TIMES that day

and left alternately testy and whiney messages. I finally called her tonight on

my way to dinner with family and put it on speaker and had my son talk to her

too. I let my son tell her about all the stuff he has been doing and she knew

that I was listening too. :-) HA I even kept it on speaker while I was the one

talking and had no intention of letting her be alone in my ear.

I essentially put her in time out for almost three days straight and did not

call her at all yesterday. When she left that first message, I am sure that she

thought her conciliatory demeanor would have me calling her right away. I still

was not ready to talk and I was pretty busy, cause here in CO, we got over a

foot of snow in less than 24 hours, so I was out shoveling snow. I know better

than to jump on the phone too quickly. I knew that I needed time to figure out

what I was going to say or do. When the second call came, just under two hours

later, it was like you could just read the subtext. " I apologized, now WHY

aren't you on the phone calling me and telling me it's all gonna be okay! " I

realized that the first call was her trying to get me to re-engage, just like

you said. I was glad I had been too busy to return her call right away, so i

could see her ploy for what it really was.

> > > >

> > > > Hey KO's

> > > >

> > > > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want to

> > do this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had kept

> > her from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL

> > SERVICE!!! Now she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from her as

> > a way of getting back at her for attacking me while she was out here for a

> > visit for god knows what twisted ass reason she has made up in her head.

> > Maybe for her trying to involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument

> > too. Telling him that she was sad because I had never let her talk to my

> > husband and THAT was the reason why she and I had been yelling at each

> > other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of wondering what lies and shit

> > she was pouring into his ears?

> > > >

> > > > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more than

> > I am already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I don't

> > have enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for my

> > son, I don't have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my mortgage

> > and all my other bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to make

> > money after not working for the past three years knowing that I cannot go

> > back to working full time as a Massage therapist because my hands ache

> > after seeing people just three hours in a day which only happens once every

> > other week. I don't have a million and one other things I have to sort out

> > figure out because I have a young, grieving son that misses his daddy

> > depending on me.

> > > >

> > > > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I know

> > I won't be judged.

> > > >

> > > > C

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

She is quite the annoying lady! Good luck with this one. :-)

> **

>

>

> LOL, yeah, well, I wrote that one before she called the NEXT TWO TIMES

> that day and left alternately testy and whiney messages. I finally called

> her tonight on my way to dinner with family and put it on speaker and had

> my son talk to her too. I let my son tell her about all the stuff he has

> been doing and she knew that I was listening too. :-) HA I even kept it on

> speaker while I was the one talking and had no intention of letting her be

> alone in my ear.

>

> I essentially put her in time out for almost three days straight and did

> not call her at all yesterday. When she left that first message, I am sure

> that she thought her conciliatory demeanor would have me calling her right

> away. I still was not ready to talk and I was pretty busy, cause here in

> CO, we got over a foot of snow in less than 24 hours, so I was out

> shoveling snow. I know better than to jump on the phone too quickly. I knew

> that I needed time to figure out what I was going to say or do. When the

> second call came, just under two hours later, it was like you could just

> read the subtext. " I apologized, now WHY aren't you on the phone calling me

> and telling me it's all gonna be okay! " I realized that the first call was

> her trying to get me to re-engage, just like you said. I was glad I had

> been too busy to return her call right away, so i could see her ploy for

> what it really was.

>

>

> > > > >

> > > > > Hey KO's

> > > > >

> > > > > After the argument I outlined in an earlier post (REALLY, you want

> to

> > > do this NOW!?!?!) and the crap about nada telling everyone that I had

> kept

> > > her from having a closer relationship with MY husband AT HIS MEMORIAL

> > > SERVICE!!! Now she thinks I am withholding contact with my son from

> her as

> > > a way of getting back at her for attacking me while she was out here

> for a

> > > visit for god knows what twisted ass reason she has made up in her

> head.

> > > Maybe for her trying to involve my twelve year old son in THAT argument

> > > too. Telling him that she was sad because I had never let her talk to

> my

> > > husband and THAT was the reason why she and I had been yelling at each

> > > other. Gee, why wouldn't I want the stress of wondering what lies and

> shit

> > > she was pouring into his ears?

> > > > >

> > > > > If she is going to keep up this crap and stress me out even more

> than

> > > I am already stressed out then I am just gonna have to go LC or NC. I

> don't

> > > have enough to deal with....I don't have to find health insurance for

> my

> > > son, I don't have to figure out if I have enough money to pay my

> mortgage

> > > and all my other bills, I don't have to figure out what I can do to

> make

> > > money after not working for the past three years knowing that I cannot

> go

> > > back to working full time as a Massage therapist because my hands ache

> > > after seeing people just three hours in a day which only happens once

> every

> > > other week. I don't have a million and one other things I have to sort

> out

> > > figure out because I have a young, grieving son that misses his daddy

> > > depending on me.

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks KO's I just needed to vent this one out to you all where I

> know

> > > I won't be judged.

> > > > >

> > > > > C

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

You know, you may have something here. My wonderful sister did not marry a BPD,

but I'm 99% certain she married a Histrionic. His pattern is to be the center of

attention in all social situations, he does not understand any form of delayed

gratification. Substance abuse is his main areas of excess. The sex thing is

another story, and one not mine to discuss or diagnosis.

But yes, Narcissism seems to be the Hallmark of all the Cluster B's.

> >

> > Hey all,

> >

> > I went to a lecture a couple of months ago about " difficult people " and bpd

given by a psychiatrist researcher. He told us that the new DSM coming out may

vary likely merge npd into the bpd spectrum. Interesting.

> >

> > Away from the Fire

>