Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, though I understand why some of you use that name!) I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. some of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the fact is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, and somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her in which I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and able to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the rest. I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental illness will not be bound by it anymore. that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that is sick, crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether it is true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for me. I am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything she should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so she clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates that she sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to learn the truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove her wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she believes it all with a fierce conviction. so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 For what it is worth, I consider " nada " to be a term for a female parent who acts the way our parents act, not a name. " Mom " is a name you might call your parent. " Nada " is more in the same category as " woman " - a way to describe a person, not something to call her. I agree that at least some nadas do try their best. Unfortunately, that doesn't mean they do a good job though. They just don't have the ability to raise children in a reasonable way. At 01:23 PM 12/27/2011 Meikjn wrote: >a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the >term Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect >her as my mother, though I understand why some of you use that >name!) > >I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the >time. some of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a >loving mother. the fact is that all of us are a mixture of good >bad, irrational, rational, and somewhere in-between. my long >term goal is a relationship with her in which I feel >validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and >able to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and >ignore the rest. > >I have a personal belief that in the next life people with >mental illness will not be bound by it anymore. > >that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and >maintain a relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > >I use the term on this message board because here is where I >dump my feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part >of her that is sick, crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I >have a mother too. > >Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > >I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face >whether it is true or not. I really do believe she tried to do >what she could for me. I am no longer willing to take it for >granted that she did everything she should, or that could be >done, but that is not the same thing. > >her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. >so she clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity >dictates that she sees things in me that are only her >projections, than I need to learn the truth, and believe it, >and I am working towards not trying to prove her wrong anymore, >because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she >believes it all with a fierce conviction. > >so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. -- Katrina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 Hi Meikjn, As per my recent long post, I do agree to some point, with your comments here re Nadas & Mother. While my mother has caused copious amounts of grief for myself..herself and other FOO, I believe she is some a victim of her own abandonment & marital circumstances (my Fada, as previously said, was THE ring-leader.but then HIS mother, my much disliked Grandma was very bad also) and now the resulting behavior of mom's sociopathic son. I think she is stuck. She did make some progress over the years in the amount of healing info I sent her, the therapy I arranged for her etc. but brother has never grown up nor forgotten his Fade's severe treatment of him.so he also, clings to Mom.but takes and sucks the life from her. He is also violent so she remains afraid of him and has now lost my emotional support which she clung to and took for granted. She is also an enabler and blamer as she is not strong enough to face her own imperfections so she blames MOSTLY ME..the one who was there for her the MOST! She very rarely blames my 2 brothers for abandonment or abusive behavior. I am the one expected to FIX the family...she actually told me this many times... I want to keep Nada/Mom at a healthy distance, but will be there for her IF and when she needs helps as she declines with age. The big question is, will my brother LET ME HAVE ANY PART in this now? Will they forbid me helping Mom as she declines and dies? This will be tough for me. Please, anyone comment on this issue if you can. My Mother stood as important in my past because she was the ONLY one in my FOO who showed glimmers of affection.at times..this is why I still will talk to her. She deserves that much. I deserve to be healthy as well. So.to find that balance from here forward. Thank you.. Twyla From: WTOAdultChildren1 [mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ] On Behalf Of Meikjn Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 11:23 AM To: WTOAdultChildren1 Subject: thoughts on the term NADA a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, though I understand why some of you use that name!) I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. some of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the fact is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, and somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her in which I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and able to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the rest. I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental illness will not be bound by it anymore. that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that is sick, crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether it is true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for me. I am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything she should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so she clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates that she sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to learn the truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove her wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she believes it all with a fierce conviction. so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 Using the term, nada, is in some ways clinical for me, and it helps others who read to know that my mom is the BP in our particular family. My father I call dad, or father, and for others it is clear he is the non-BP codependent. I notice, those rare times when I cross-post and share my family of origin concerns, after sharing here, or reposting on my blog, that if I use the term nada in that share, folks will either resonate with the word and wonder where it comes from, or they will rankle at my " dehumanizing " my nada. I can relate to that actually, and so I carefully edit out the term nada, so as to get more neutral and helpful feedback. I think there are plusses and minuses to using special language for a borderline parent. It does tend to objectify them, and even stigmatize them. In the recovery forum where I do my 12-step work we are careful not to discuss people in terms of their diagnosis. Our forum likely has folks who have this very diagnosis, and in not labeling one another, we are a lot less likely to trigger each other. I might refer to my mom, in that forum, as dysfunctional. Or a dry drunk. That seems to be both descriptive enough of the behavior, but less of a judgment, and I tend to get more helpful responses when others perceive me as attempting to be respectful. They may have exactly the kind of mom or dad that we here call nada or fada.... but for them to see me referring to my parent with neutrality helps them better hear what I have to say. Words have power. Best, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 I hope I was clear, I did not mean to say that this WTO forum encourages folks with BP to join its ranks. Here I think we have agreed we need a safe place, even a BP-free zone in which to avoid being retriggered as we seek understanding and healing. In some other forums that I belong to, I am quite sure there are BP folks who are using the 12-steps to help them be more honest with themselves. Sometimes I may even interact with them. > > I think there are plusses and minuses to using special language for a borderline parent. It does tend to objectify them, and even stigmatize them. In the recovery forum where I do my 12-step work we are careful not to discuss people in terms of their diagnosis. THAT TWELVE-STEP forum likely has folks who have this very diagnosis, and in not labeling one another, we are a lot less likely to trigger each other. > > I might refer to my mom, in that forum, as dysfunctional. Or a dry drunk. That seems to be both descriptive enough of the behavior, but less of a judgment, and I tend to get more helpful responses when others perceive me as attempting to be respectful. They may have exactly the kind of mom or dad that we here call nada or fada.... but for them to see me referring to my parent with neutrality helps them better hear what I have to say. > > Words have power. > > Best, > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 One of the greatest benefits I receive here is labeling. Inorder to garner objectivity and learning to discern the patterns of the BPD. FOG is another label that is tremendously empowering. So is Oz, and sending her monkeys and gaslighting. I have been slaughtered in my core by the person most significant to me and that has resonated for the 48 years I have been alive. From studies we know that BPD nadas implemented our training of their misbehaviors from infancy. I make no apologizes to anyone who hasn't had that. Lucky for them but I'm deeply scarred and all by myself trying to make sense and gain a healthier perspective. I had a friend's mother who told me my mother was a dry drunk. It wasn't until my sister was diagnosed BPD that I even knew my mother had been diagnosed. 6 months after I first learned my family had BPD my beautiful sixteen year old daughter was diagnosed. The term dry drunk didn't at all capture and help explain the depth of craziness that was going on. I do not think it is a help at all if really its BPD. It is all so toxic until we can learn it and give ourselves back the choices to take ourselves off the rollercoaster. That is not disrespectful to BPD mothers, it is helpful and supportive to the children. I am against anyone saying it's disrespectful here in this forum. Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 Meikjn, Twyla and , wow, this is one of the reasons I withdrew from this board for a while, I never dis-inrolled, but I needed some time away, partly because I felt like I WAS objectifying my mom. As much as I hate the things she does in nada mode, my mom, can be loving and I don't feel like these are fakeries on her part. I can find grace for her in my heart and balancing between protecting my son and myself from her nada antics and maintaining good boundaries is one of the most difficult juggling acts in the world. I often tell people that I cannot multi task, but that is only true of trying to type up this note and say talk on the phone at the same time. A good receptionist I do not make! I am however AMAZING at multitasking my feelings about my mom/nada, difficult people and FOO. Where nadas and fades operate in black and white thinking, I feel like my life is almost entirely made of shades of grey. Anytime I worry that I may be too much like her, I can look to that and how I can see the good in people including my mom and not just " throw the baby out with the bathwater " Thanks so much for this thread. I found it very validating of my experience up to now. C > > Hi Meikjn, > > > > As per my recent long post, I do agree to some point, with your comments > here re Nadas & Mother. While my mother has caused copious amounts of grief > for myself..herself and other FOO, I believe she is some a victim of her own > abandonment & marital circumstances (my Fada, as previously said, was THE > ring-leader.but then HIS mother, my much disliked Grandma was very bad also) > and now the resulting behavior of mom's sociopathic son. I think she is > stuck. > > > > She did make some progress over the years in the amount of healing info I > sent her, the therapy I arranged for her etc. but brother has never grown up > nor forgotten his Fade's severe treatment of him.so he also, clings to > Mom.but takes and sucks the life from her. He is also violent so she > remains afraid of him and has now lost my emotional support which she clung > to and took for granted. She is also an enabler and blamer as she is not > strong enough to face her own imperfections so she blames MOSTLY ME..the one > who was there for her the MOST! She very rarely blames my 2 brothers for > abandonment or abusive behavior. I am the one expected to FIX the > family...she actually told me this many times... > > > > I want to keep Nada/Mom at a healthy distance, but will be there for her IF > and when she needs helps as she declines with age. The big question is, > will my brother LET ME HAVE ANY PART in this now? Will they forbid me > helping Mom as she declines and dies? This will be tough for me. Please, > anyone comment on this issue if you can. > > > > My Mother stood as important in my past because she was the ONLY one in my > FOO who showed glimmers of affection.at times..this is why I still will talk > to her. She deserves that much. > > > > I deserve to be healthy as well. So.to find that balance from here forward. > > > > > > Thank you.. > > > > Twyla > > > > From: WTOAdultChildren1 > [mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ] On Behalf Of Meikjn > Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 11:23 AM > To: WTOAdultChildren1 > Subject: thoughts on the term NADA > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term Nada.(I > don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, though I > understand why some of you use that name!) > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. some of > my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the fact is > that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, and > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her in which > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and able to > see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the rest. > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental illness > will not be bound by it anymore. > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that is sick, > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether it is > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for me. I am > no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything she should, > or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so she > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates that she > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to learn the > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove her > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 I use the term nada only on this group as shorthand to just let the reader know that I'm writing about my mother who might have BPD and/or NPD and hoarding. " Nada " doesn't have all those details, but it I think it gets the basics across. The one disadvantage I see to the way we use this term on the board is that it is easy to generalize to this archetypal nada and speak as if we all have the same mother. Sometimes the similarities are so great it seems that way! But there are important differences too and sometimes I find it hard to get help for the areas where my nada is significantly different from the archetypal nada of the group. Eliza Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 I'll add that when I first heard the word 'nada' I thought it a delightfully rebellious term--it gave me the power to deny her dysfunctional 'mothering' as anything that resembled nurturing. Since then I have discovered an added benefit. Saying 'nada' instead of the emotionally charged word 'mother' allows me a buffer when describing my feelings. I think it is helping me detach--I can talk about the evil nada as much as I need to, while preserving the memories of a cherished mother, too. > > I use the term nada only on this group as shorthand to just let the reader know that I'm writing about my mother who might have BPD and/or NPD and hoarding. " Nada " doesn't have all those details, but it I think it gets the basics across. The one disadvantage I see to the way we use this term on the board is that it is easy to generalize to this archetypal nada and speak as if we all have the same mother. Sometimes the similarities are so great it seems that way! But there are important differences too and sometimes I find it hard to get help for the areas where my nada is significantly different from the archetypal nada of the group. > > Eliza > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 I haven't posted in a while, but have been reading occasionally. I wanted to comment on this thread about the use of the word " nada " . I completely understand how some KOs, who might have more functional BPD mothers or maybe weren't as badly scarred or abused (which feels blasphemous for me to say, because I don't intend to invalidate anyone at all) but I mean to say perhaps they are able to have some semblance of a relationship with their mother, and the word " nada " feels like a label to objectify. I can totally understand that. However, my nada was never a mother. The only emotions I can connect with her are bad ones. My entire life she either ignored me, controlled me, used me, abused me, or required me to be her constant validation. I have no good memories of her. Even things that could be considered somewhat pleasant are stained with the true motive behind them. The craziness behind them. I was a child and responsible for her feelings at all times. It was my responsibility to make her feel better so she wouldn't kill herself. She gave birth to me, but she was never a mother. It took me a lot of therapy to grieve for being motherless and come to terms with the reality of my truly abusive and terrifying childhood. Some of us NEED the word " nada " so we can objectively look at our situation and the effects it has had on us. We don't mean it in a harmful or disrespectful way, but instead so we can come to terms with our own reality. I don't mind at all if you want to call her Mom or Mother or whatever you feel is appropriate; we are all here to validate each other, remember. And I don't think anyone on here should judge another for the term they choose to use to describe the person who gave birth to them. I think, in terms of this conversation, that we all need to remember that we are all in different stages of recovery and growth, and that we are here to validate each other. Oddly enough, using the term " nada " actually helped me in terms of viewing my mother. It helped me disconnect emotionally and understand her illness, which in turn gave me some empathy for her. I'm sorry to say that's the most of an emotion that I have for her. For me it's like saying that you love your rapist. I certainly have empathy for everything she's been through and the trap of an illness she's stuck in, but I don't love her. But you wouldn't love someone who molested you either. Okay, back to my point, let's remember that we are here to validate each other; and let's allow each other to use the terms they need to to get through and deal with this illness in their family. - > > I use the term nada only on this group as shorthand to just let the reader know that I'm writing about my mother who might have BPD and/or NPD and hoarding. " Nada " doesn't have all those details, but it I think it gets the basics across. The one disadvantage I see to the way we use this term on the board is that it is easy to generalize to this archetypal nada and speak as if we all have the same mother. Sometimes the similarities are so great it seems that way! But there are important differences too and sometimes I find it hard to get help for the areas where my nada is significantly different from the archetypal nada of the group. > > Eliza > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 Like many of us, I feel strongly about this thread. To build in particular on what Alfdancer says--my nada actually was one of those who was intimately abusive. Because of that, just the terms 'Mom' and 'Mother' are, for me, actually ptsd triggers. It's so strong that I don't even like songs or TV shows that use those words. I realize that may sound a little extreme, but it happens to be my personal truth. Since a central aspect of borderline abuse is often masking and hiding that abuse from the child, a central aspect of recovery can be to discover and express one's own truth and experiences. On this board, it's important that we all support each other in that endeavor. One very necessary part of this Truth, for most of us, involves the use of the word nada. To say that using the term is disrespectful is to deny the perception and feelings of other KOs, and for that reason I don't think it's anything we should be doing here on the list. Anyone is free to use whatever term is most true and comfortable for them, but I think we need to be careful about making any kind of moral judgments about each others' actions (ie, use of the word 'nada' or whatever else word is best for you). Thanks, Charlie > > > > I use the term nada only on this group as shorthand to just let the reader know that I'm writing about my mother who might have BPD and/or NPD and hoarding. " Nada " doesn't have all those details, but it I think it gets the basics across. The one disadvantage I see to the way we use this term on the board is that it is easy to generalize to this archetypal nada and speak as if we all have the same mother. Sometimes the similarities are so great it seems that way! But there are important differences too and sometimes I find it hard to get help for the areas where my nada is significantly different from the archetypal nada of the group. > > > > Eliza > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 Charlie and , I am in complete agreement with your comments. and if that seems contradictory to my earlier post, I would like to explain that when I said I had to distance myself from this board for a bit, it was because I felt I had gone too far into objectifying my nada/mom to the point where it felt unhealthy, FOR ME. That is key, it was my standard and mine alone that I was holding myself to. As stated earlier, we are all in our own state of recovery and none of us should hold another to their own standards. I was merely expressing my common concern for myself and glad to see others were kinda at the same point in their own healing process. I can't sit here and say I will NEVER go NC with my nada. She pushed me pretty close to it just last month. I also can't say that I won't ever get caught up in her FOG again. I shy away from all or none statements. They just smack of black and white thinking to me and kinda make my skin crawl. C > > > > > > I use the term nada only on this group as shorthand to just let the reader know that I'm writing about my mother who might have BPD and/or NPD and hoarding. " Nada " doesn't have all those details, but it I think it gets the basics across. The one disadvantage I see to the way we use this term on the board is that it is easy to generalize to this archetypal nada and speak as if we all have the same mother. Sometimes the similarities are so great it seems that way! But there are important differences too and sometimes I find it hard to get help for the areas where my nada is significantly different from the archetypal nada of the group. > > > > > > Eliza > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 27, 2011 Report Share Posted December 27, 2011 I have never used the term " NADA " in my posts simply because I personally feel I would only be doing it because it is lingo I have come across and not something that means anything to me. So I use " borderline mother " or sometimes just my " mother. " My point though is that no one has ever challenged me about it and likewise, I think the use of NADA is fantastic even if I myself don't use it. And maybe I will one day, who knows? The point is I have never felt like I HAD to use the term and no one has ever suggested I stop using the word " mother " so why shouldn't people use whatever they want? Everyone on this board has had their fill of being told what to do by their non-parents. Let's not bring that here. peace out, Crockett ________________________________ To: WTOAdultChildren1 Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 9:48 PM Subject: Re: thoughts on the term NADA  Like many of us, I feel strongly about this thread. To build in particular on what Alfdancer says--my nada actually was one of those who was intimately abusive. Because of that, just the terms 'Mom' and 'Mother' are, for me, actually ptsd triggers. It's so strong that I don't even like songs or TV shows that use those words. I realize that may sound a little extreme, but it happens to be my personal truth. Since a central aspect of borderline abuse is often masking and hiding that abuse from the child, a central aspect of recovery can be to discover and express one's own truth and experiences. On this board, it's important that we all support each other in that endeavor. One very necessary part of this Truth, for most of us, involves the use of the word nada. To say that using the term is disrespectful is to deny the perception and feelings of other KOs, and for that reason I don't think it's anything we should be doing here on the list. Anyone is free to use whatever term is most true and comfortable for them, but I think we need to be careful about making any kind of moral judgments about each others' actions (ie, use of the word 'nada' or whatever else word is best for you). Thanks, Charlie > > > > I use the term nada only on this group as shorthand to just let the reader know that I'm writing about my mother who might have BPD and/or NPD and hoarding. " Nada " doesn't have all those details, but it I think it gets the basics across. The one disadvantage I see to the way we use this term on the board is that it is easy to generalize to this archetypal nada and speak as if we all have the same mother. Sometimes the similarities are so great it seems that way! But there are important differences too and sometimes I find it hard to get help for the areas where my nada is significantly different from the archetypal nada of the group. > > > > Eliza > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 For anyone that doesn't know, it was my post in which Meikjn was referring in the original post for this thread. I wrote " (I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, though I understand why some of you use that name!) " in one of my recent posts just as an explanation as to why I don't refer to her as " Nada. " I wasn't even sure if it NEEDED explanation, but I'm new to this forum and have only posted a couple times, and all of the posts I've read have referred to their mom's as Nada, so I guess I just wanted to clarify why I was choosing not to. I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone and I'm very sorry if I did. We're all here for support and healing and I definitely do not mean to upset anyone EVER by my comments or posts. Meikjn, I didn't mean for it to sound like it's disrespectful to use that term, I just meant that in my personal experiences with my mom and dealing with all her BPD issues, using that term just felt wrong for ME. I have absolutely no problem with others using it, because I know it helps them target and deal with their feelings a little better than by referring to them as " Mom. " The name " mom " has a very personal feeling behind it and if your mother didn't fulfill that role in your life, I don't blame you for using " nada. " I can also understand how some of you use it as a way to differentiate between your mother as the BPD " nada " and as your mom that cares for you and loves you, and I respect that. I guess I just only refer to her as mom because the way I see it, whether I'm talking about her good, motherly qualities or her cruel, BPD qualities, they're all rolled up into one person: my mother. Someone from this forum sent me an email saying something along the lines of if I don't call my mom " nada " when talking about her on this forum then I must not have been very scarred or affected by her BPD actions and basically that it must not be " that bad " if I can still call her mom. I found that very disrespectful and hurtful. This person doesn't know my situation and has no idea what I've been through. I've been VERY damaged and scarred by her actions and the way she treats me. I've dealt with it for a long time completely by myself (I had no other family or close friends at the time to rely on or support me) and it has not been easy. I'm in intensive therapy and working through a lot of issues and repercussions of my mom's BPD. So please don't think that by using " mom " instead of " nada " that I'm any better off than anyone else in this group or that my issues aren't as " severe, " because they certainly are. I stick with the term " mom " because that's what she is, despite the awful things she's put me through and that term makes it more personal to me. It reminds me, in my own little way, that she IS my mother and that I'm not just talking about some person with a mental illness. Again, so sorry if I offended anyone with my original comment on this topic. I was just trying to explain myself. I do NOT thing anyone is being disrespectful to their parents by using that term. To each his/her own > ** > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. some > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the fact > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, and > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her in which > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and able > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the rest. > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental illness > will not be bound by it anymore. > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that is sick, > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether it is > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for me. I > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything she > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so she > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates that she > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to learn the > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove her > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 I was also not offended, and think that, if we continue to be open to accepting each other's needs for using different terms, that it was a good discussion to have. It's more than a discussion of a term but how we see our BPD parent and how we cope with understanding their harmful behavior, on one hand, and their loving behavior, on the other. I had previously mentioned that if someone's mother was more high-functioning or if the damage wasn't too severe that they might not use this term 'nada'. I stated that it felt very blasphemous to even suggest that because I don't want to invalidate anyone. I certainly didn't mean to validate you, and if I did so, I sincerely apologize. We have all been through hell. I suppose I phrased it poorly, but I was just trying to suggest that we each have different levels and kinds of relationships with our BPD parent that may or may not allow us to be emotionally or physically close to them. I didn't email you personally, so I don't think you are referring to me, but all the same, if I invalidated you, that was the furthest thing from my intent. I say use whatever term helps you heal. That's the most important thing--for us all to heal. > > > ** > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. some > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the fact > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, and > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her in which > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and able > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the rest. > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental illness > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that is sick, > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether it is > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for me. I > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything she > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so she > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates that she > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to learn the > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove her > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 OK, and *wow* No one here is supposed to be emailing you. Sometimes it is done, but usually in a gesture of support only. The fact someone here felt justified in contacting you to make judgments on whether or not you belong here was simply an abuse of membership. Please send a copy of the email to our moderators so that it may be dealt with appropriately. After all the abuse we KO's (kid's of) have been subjected to, it is *so very important* that we deal with *each other* in a respectful manner. We are not required to agree, but we can show each other respect while we voice our opinion! Often we discuss things here that can activate each other's fear or resentment buttons. I found the whole " to use NADA or mom " discussion invaluable, as it made me think about when I use both terms and the behaviors behind both of them. It helped me define my growth toward detachment over this past year. Personally, I am glad you inadvertently opened the door. > > > ** > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. some > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the fact > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, and > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her in which > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and able > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the rest. > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental illness > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that is sick, > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether it is > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for me. I > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything she > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so she > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates that she > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to learn the > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove her > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 First let me say I'm not offended by any of the posts here. Second, I think it's up to us as individuals to decide what we call our parents. If the words " mom, mother, dad, father " work for you, so be it. And if " nada & fada " work, then that is fine too IMO. As for my situation, the woman who birthed me is my nada. She was not a real mother in the sense that she should have been. She was deeply, personally, cruel to me 95% of the time and threatened to kill me on more than one occasion. I actually remember thinking I'd never be an adult... wouldn't live to see it. So for me, nada works. I do not call her mom or mother because I do not have any respect for her. Whereas most mothers who do give off that air of being a real mom, yep, have all kinds of respect for them (and fathers too!) That's the very frank truth. Not trying to be offensive at all, just sharing my 2 cents. Respect is something I give to everyone until they prove to me they don't deserve it, then no, I am not going to be rude per say but to say I still respect that person? no. I do not respect nada. I do completely understand that she is ill and needs help, however, that's not my job. There is only one person in this world I have any control over, and that's me. I can't force anyone else to do anything they don't want to do, and no one else can control me either. I tried to help nada and for so long thought I was but I was simply allowing her to control me... I wasn't helping myself. I simply do not have any respect for anyone who continuously abuses children to the level my nada did. Sorry, but that is my 2 cents. So please do not feel required to call your parents by any name/label/title you don't personally feel comfortable with, but for those of us who do chose to use the words nada & fada... please understand that is our way of dealing with our own situations as no two stories/situations are alike. Much love to all, Mia > > > > OK, and *wow* > > No one here is supposed to be emailing you. Sometimes it is done, but usually in a gesture of support only. The fact someone here felt justified in contacting you to make judgments on whether or not you belong here was simply an abuse of membership. Please send a copy of the email to our moderators so that it may be dealt with appropriately. > > After all the abuse we KO's (kid's of) have been subjected to, it is *so very important* that we deal with *each other* in a respectful manner. We are not required to agree, but we can show each other respect while we voice our opinion! > > Often we discuss things here that can activate each other's fear or resentment buttons. I found the whole " to use NADA or mom " discussion invaluable, as it made me think about when I use both terms and the behaviors behind both of them. It helped me define my growth toward detachment over this past year. Personally, I am glad you inadvertently opened the door. > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my mother, > > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. some > > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the fact > > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, and > > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her in which > > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and able > > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the rest. > > > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental illness > > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that is sick, > > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether it is > > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for me. I > > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything she > > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so she > > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates that she > > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to learn the > > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove her > > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is wrong. she > > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2011 Report Share Posted December 28, 2011 Just my two cents, Names have always been a particularly special way my Nada used to hurt. My Nadas most favorite " pet " name for me, from about the age of 5, was " dirty little bitch, " sometimes alternated with " filthy little bitch, " " fucking princess, " and on, and on. Since the moment I told her, in my teen years, that it made me uncomfortable to be referred to by an ootsy- cutsey childhood nickname, she has taken particular pleasure in calling me by that name well past my middle years, embarrassing me with it every opportunity she found. Mothers do not do these things. I acknowledge that she conceived, bore, and raised me. She did the best she was capable of doing. She was never my " Mother " Sunspot > First let me say I'm not offended by any of the posts here. Second, I > think it's up to us as individuals to decide what we call our parents. > If the words " mom, mother, dad, father " work for you, so be it. And > if " nada & fada " work, then that is fine too IMO. > > As for my situation, the woman who birthed me is my nada. She was not > a real mother in the sense that she should have been. She was deeply, > personally, cruel to me 95% of the time and threatened to kill me on > more than one occasion. I actually remember thinking I'd never be an > adult... wouldn't live to see it. So for me, nada works. I do not > call her mom or mother because I do not have any respect for her. > Whereas most mothers who do give off that air of being a real mom, > yep, have all kinds of respect for them (and fathers too!) That's the > very frank truth. Not trying to be offensive at all, just sharing my > 2 cents. > > Respect is something I give to everyone until they prove to me they > don't deserve it, then no, I am not going to be rude per say but to > say I still respect that person? no. I do not respect nada. > > I do completely understand that she is ill and needs help, however, > that's not my job. There is only one person in this world I have any > control over, and that's me. I can't force anyone else to do anything > they don't want to do, and no one else can control me either. I tried > to help nada and for so long thought I was but I was simply allowing > her to control me... I wasn't helping myself. I simply do not have any > respect for anyone who continuously abuses children to the level my > nada did. Sorry, but that is my 2 cents. > > So please do not feel required to call your parents by any > name/label/title you don't personally feel comfortable with, but for > those of us who do chose to use the words nada & fada... please > understand that is our way of dealing with our own situations as no > two stories/situations are alike. > > Much love to all, > > Mia > > > > On Wed, Dec 28, 2011 at 11:01 PM, echobabe_is_free > wrote: > > > > > > > > OK, and *wow* > > > > No one here is supposed to be emailing you. Sometimes it is done, but > usually in a gesture of support only. The fact someone here felt justified > in contacting you to make judgments on whether or not you belong here was > simply an abuse of membership. Please send a copy of the email to our > moderators so that it may be dealt with appropriately. > > > > After all the abuse we KO's (kid's of) have been subjected to, it is *so > very important* that we deal with *each other* in a respectful manner. We > are not required to agree, but we can show each other respect while we > voice our opinion! > > > > Often we discuss things here that can activate each other's fear or > resentment buttons. I found the whole " to use NADA or mom " discussion > invaluable, as it made me think about when I use both terms and the > behaviors behind both of them. It helped me define my growth toward > detachment over this past year. Personally, I am glad you inadvertently > opened the door. > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my > mother, > > > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. > some > > > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the > fact > > > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, > and > > > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her > in which > > > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and > able > > > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the > rest. > > > > > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental > illness > > > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > > > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > > > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that > is sick, > > > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether > it is > > > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for > me. I > > > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything > she > > > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so > she > > > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates > that she > > > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to > learn the > > > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove > her > > > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is > wrong. she > > > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Unfortunately I didn't save the message I got, so I can't send it to the moderators. I'm sorry! I wish I had thought of that before, but I just blew it off and deleted it. I was upset and offended at first, but I just realize someone was probably just upset by whatever I said and that was their way of letting me know. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, I just don't think that was the proper way of expressing them. But no hard feelings Wow, I really feel for some of you guys. All this time I've been complaining about my relationship with my mom and depressed, anxious, upset 95% of the time I'm around her. But at least I can say I had a mother in my life, and I know she loved me and cared for me to the best of her ability. Some of you can't say that and that's so sad. It's sad how much BPD can take over a person, to the point that it completely damages their ability to parent a child. With my mom, she took care of me, gave me just about everything I could ever ask for, supported me (but only if I was doing everything SHE wanted, in HER way, otherwise there was no support) and she loved me almost to a fault. Her " love " was manifested and expressed as control. Control over every single aspect of my life from where I went to school, to who I was allowed to talk to and be friends with, all the way to if/when I was allowed to leave the house for what amount of time and even where I slept in the house (which was in her room for my entire life until I went away to college). She is controlling, manipulative, downright cruel most of the time, kept me from having close friends and family members my whole life and she says it's all because she " loves " me and is trying to " protect " me, but even despite all her flaws, she was and still is there for me and does her best to care for me. I guess I need to consider myself lucky that it's not worse than it is. I do love an respect her as a mother, but when I look at her BP side, I can't help but feel nothing but hatred because of how much she's messed me up. > ** > > > Just my two cents, > > Names have always been a particularly special way my Nada used to hurt. > My Nadas most favorite " pet " name for me, from about the age of 5, was > " dirty little bitch, " sometimes alternated with " filthy little bitch, " > " fucking princess, " and on, and on. Since the moment I told her, in my > teen years, that it made me uncomfortable to be referred to by an ootsy- > cutsey childhood nickname, she has taken particular pleasure in calling me > by that name well past my middle years, embarrassing me with it every > opportunity she found. Mothers do not do these things. > > I acknowledge that she conceived, bore, and raised me. She did the best > she was capable of doing. > She was never my " Mother " Sunspot > > > > > > First let me say I'm not offended by any of the posts here. Second, I > > think it's up to us as individuals to decide what we call our parents. > > If the words " mom, mother, dad, father " work for you, so be it. And > > if " nada & fada " work, then that is fine too IMO. > > > > As for my situation, the woman who birthed me is my nada. She was not > > a real mother in the sense that she should have been. She was deeply, > > personally, cruel to me 95% of the time and threatened to kill me on > > more than one occasion. I actually remember thinking I'd never be an > > adult... wouldn't live to see it. So for me, nada works. I do not > > call her mom or mother because I do not have any respect for her. > > Whereas most mothers who do give off that air of being a real mom, > > yep, have all kinds of respect for them (and fathers too!) That's the > > very frank truth. Not trying to be offensive at all, just sharing my > > 2 cents. > > > > Respect is something I give to everyone until they prove to me they > > don't deserve it, then no, I am not going to be rude per say but to > > say I still respect that person? no. I do not respect nada. > > > > I do completely understand that she is ill and needs help, however, > > that's not my job. There is only one person in this world I have any > > control over, and that's me. I can't force anyone else to do anything > > they don't want to do, and no one else can control me either. I tried > > to help nada and for so long thought I was but I was simply allowing > > her to control me... I wasn't helping myself. I simply do not have any > > respect for anyone who continuously abuses children to the level my > > nada did. Sorry, but that is my 2 cents. > > > > So please do not feel required to call your parents by any > > name/label/title you don't personally feel comfortable with, but for > > those of us who do chose to use the words nada & fada... please > > understand that is our way of dealing with our own situations as no > > two stories/situations are alike. > > > > Much love to all, > > > > Mia > > > > > > > > On Wed, Dec 28, 2011 at 11:01 PM, echobabe_is_free > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, and *wow* > > > > > > No one here is supposed to be emailing you. Sometimes it is done, but > > usually in a gesture of support only. The fact someone here felt > justified > > in contacting you to make judgments on whether or not you belong here was > > simply an abuse of membership. Please send a copy of the email to our > > moderators so that it may be dealt with appropriately. > > > > > > After all the abuse we KO's (kid's of) have been subjected to, it is > *so > > very important* that we deal with *each other* in a respectful manner. We > > are not required to agree, but we can show each other respect while we > > voice our opinion! > > > > > > Often we discuss things here that can activate each other's fear or > > resentment buttons. I found the whole " to use NADA or mom " discussion > > invaluable, as it made me think about when I use both terms and the > > behaviors behind both of them. It helped me define my growth toward > > detachment over this past year. Personally, I am glad you inadvertently > > opened the door. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > > > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my > > mother, > > > > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > > > > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. > > some > > > > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. > the > > fact > > > > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, > > and > > > > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her > > in which > > > > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human > and > > able > > > > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the > > rest. > > > > > > > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental > > illness > > > > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > > > > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and > maintain a > > > > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > > > > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump > my > > > > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that > > is sick, > > > > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > > > > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > > > > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether > > it is > > > > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for > > me. I > > > > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything > > she > > > > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > > > > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so > > she > > > > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates > > that she > > > > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to > > learn the > > > > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove > > her > > > > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is > > wrong. she > > > > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > > > > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Hi Your mothers Love may seem like love because thats all you know. In my experience that type of love is not love at all but in my opinion abuse. A loving person helps the object of their love to grow and to they help them " follow their bliss " . A loving person is supportive and concerned with the others happiness and comfort. I was stuck for a long time invested in the illusion my parents loved me. They were my worst enemies and they were out for themselves and they exploited me. I dont know you or your mother but i might examine what love means and is to you. I am not uncomfortable 95 percent of the time around people who love me. Something may be amiss. Sent from my mobile device. > Unfortunately I didn't save the message I got, so I can't send it to the > moderators. I'm sorry! I wish I had thought of that before, but I just blew > it off and deleted it. I was upset and offended at first, but I just > realize someone was probably just upset by whatever I said and that was > their way of letting me know. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, I > just don't think that was the proper way of expressing them. But no hard > feelings > > Wow, I really feel for some of you guys. All this time I've been > complaining about my relationship with my mom and depressed, anxious, upset > 95% of the time I'm around her. But at least I can say I had a mother in my > life, and I know she loved me and cared for me to the best of her ability. > Some of you can't say that and that's so sad. It's sad how much BPD can > take over a person, to the point that it completely damages their ability > to parent a child. With my mom, she took care of me, gave me just about > everything I could ever ask for, supported me (but only if I was doing > everything SHE wanted, in HER way, otherwise there was no support) and she > loved me almost to a fault. Her " love " was manifested and expressed as > control. Control over every single aspect of my life from where I went to > school, to who I was allowed to talk to and be friends with, all the way to > if/when I was allowed to leave the house for what amount of time and even > where I slept in the house (which was in her room for my entire life until > I went away to college). She is controlling, manipulative, downright cruel > most of the time, kept me from having close friends and family members my > whole life and she says it's all because she " loves " me and is trying to > " protect " me, but even despite all her flaws, she was and still is there > for me and does her best to care for me. I guess I need to consider myself > lucky that it's not worse than it is. I do love an respect her as a mother, > but when I look at her BP side, I can't help but feel nothing but hatred > because of how much she's messed me up. > > > >> ** >> >> >> Just my two cents, >> >> Names have always been a particularly special way my Nada used to hurt. >> My Nadas most favorite " pet " name for me, from about the age of 5, was >> " dirty little bitch, " sometimes alternated with " filthy little bitch, " >> " fucking princess, " and on, and on. Since the moment I told her, in my >> teen years, that it made me uncomfortable to be referred to by an ootsy- >> cutsey childhood nickname, she has taken particular pleasure in calling me >> by that name well past my middle years, embarrassing me with it every >> opportunity she found. Mothers do not do these things. >> >> I acknowledge that she conceived, bore, and raised me. She did the best >> she was capable of doing. >> She was never my " Mother " Sunspot >> >> >> >> >>> First let me say I'm not offended by any of the posts here. Second, I >>> think it's up to us as individuals to decide what we call our parents. >>> If the words " mom, mother, dad, father " work for you, so be it. And >>> if " nada & fada " work, then that is fine too IMO. >>> >>> As for my situation, the woman who birthed me is my nada. She was not >>> a real mother in the sense that she should have been. She was deeply, >>> personally, cruel to me 95% of the time and threatened to kill me on >>> more than one occasion. I actually remember thinking I'd never be an >>> adult... wouldn't live to see it. So for me, nada works. I do not >>> call her mom or mother because I do not have any respect for her. >>> Whereas most mothers who do give off that air of being a real mom, >>> yep, have all kinds of respect for them (and fathers too!) That's the >>> very frank truth. Not trying to be offensive at all, just sharing my >>> 2 cents. >>> >>> Respect is something I give to everyone until they prove to me they >>> don't deserve it, then no, I am not going to be rude per say but to >>> say I still respect that person? no. I do not respect nada. >>> >>> I do completely understand that she is ill and needs help, however, >>> that's not my job. There is only one person in this world I have any >>> control over, and that's me. I can't force anyone else to do anything >>> they don't want to do, and no one else can control me either. I tried >>> to help nada and for so long thought I was but I was simply allowing >>> her to control me... I wasn't helping myself. I simply do not have any >>> respect for anyone who continuously abuses children to the level my >>> nada did. Sorry, but that is my 2 cents. >>> >>> So please do not feel required to call your parents by any >>> name/label/title you don't personally feel comfortable with, but for >>> those of us who do chose to use the words nada & fada... please >>> understand that is our way of dealing with our own situations as no >>> two stories/situations are alike. >>> >>> Much love to all, >>> >>> Mia >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Dec 28, 2011 at 11:01 PM, echobabe_is_free >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> OK, and *wow* >>>> >>>> No one here is supposed to be emailing you. Sometimes it is done, but >>> usually in a gesture of support only. The fact someone here felt >> justified >>> in contacting you to make judgments on whether or not you belong here was >>> simply an abuse of membership. Please send a copy of the email to our >>> moderators so that it may be dealt with appropriately. >>>> >>>> After all the abuse we KO's (kid's of) have been subjected to, it is >> *so >>> very important* that we deal with *each other* in a respectful manner. We >>> are not required to agree, but we can show each other respect while we >>> voice our opinion! >>>> >>>> Often we discuss things here that can activate each other's fear or >>> resentment buttons. I found the whole " to use NADA or mom " discussion >>> invaluable, as it made me think about when I use both terms and the >>> behaviors behind both of them. It helped me define my growth toward >>> detachment over this past year. Personally, I am glad you inadvertently >>> opened the door. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>>> ** >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term >>>>>> Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my >>> mother, >>>>>> though I understand why some of you use that name!) >>>>>> >>>>>> I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. >>> some >>>>>> of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. >> the >>> fact >>>>>> is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, >>> and >>>>>> somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her >>> in which >>>>>> I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human >> and >>> able >>>>>> to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the >>> rest. >>>>>> >>>>>> I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental >>> illness >>>>>> will not be bound by it anymore. >>>>>> >>>>>> that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and >> maintain a >>>>>> relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. >>>>>> >>>>>> I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump >> my >>>>>> feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that >>> is sick, >>>>>> crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. >>>>>> >>>>>> Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. >>>>>> >>>>>> I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether >>> it is >>>>>> true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for >>> me. I >>>>>> am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything >>> she >>>>>> should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. >>>>>> >>>>>> her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so >>> she >>>>>> clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates >>> that she >>>>>> sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to >>> learn the >>>>>> truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove >>> her >>>>>> wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is >>> wrong. she >>>>>> believes it all with a fierce conviction. >>>>>> >>>>>> so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Your description of your mother's hyper-controlling treatment of you DOES sound very abusive, to me. Minimizing or even denying abuse we experience is a coping mechanism, as in " Oh, it wasn't so bad, what my mother/father did to me. " Children/teens utilize this coping mechanism to survive and not fall into suicidal despair because minors have NO power to change their situation, but as an adult it becomes counter-productive: denial and minimizing keeps us from acting in self-protective ways: keeps us trapped in the negative, abusive situation. Plus, there is the factor of " this is all I know; so this is what " love " is " ; children have no objectivity, no way of comprehending that what they are experiencing is in fact abuse or neglect. Keeping a child " tethered on a short leash " , virtually isolating the child and being hyper-controlling of every aspect of the child's existence IS abusive; it does damage. That is not love, its possessiveness; its being treated as an object, a thing with no feelings or opinions, needs, or rights of your own. Thing is, when a parent is blatantly physically or sexually abusive to the child, or blatantly negligent, there is at least some small hope that the abuse will be recognized by someone outside the family and the child will be rescued. But children who are " only " subjected to covert emotional torture by a parent who is charming and perhaps even beloved or revered by those outside the home ? Well, those poor kids are just basically screwed. -Annie > > > > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > > > > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my > > > mother, > > > > > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. > > > some > > > > > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. > > the > > > fact > > > > > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, > > > and > > > > > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her > > > in which > > > > > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human > > and > > > able > > > > > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the > > > rest. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental > > > illness > > > > > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > > > > > > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and > > maintain a > > > > > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > > > > > > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump > > my > > > > > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that > > > is sick, > > > > > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > > > > > > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether > > > it is > > > > > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for > > > me. I > > > > > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything > > > she > > > > > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > > > > > > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so > > > she > > > > > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates > > > that she > > > > > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to > > > learn the > > > > > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove > > > her > > > > > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is > > > wrong. she > > > > > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > > > > > > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 (((((Sunspot))))) I meant to reply to your post earlier, Sunspot: what your mother did, calling her own little child those shockingly ugly, hateful names... that is so blatantly abusive and openly hostile. I wish she'd been caught treating you like that, such behavior should be a big huge waving red flag that a child is in serious trouble in the " care " of such an individual. You are right: women who actually want children and want to be a mother... real mothers do not revile and torment their children as you were. The deliberate, repetitive use of an unwanted, humiliating pet name for you to mock you and hurt your feelings, is so passive-aggressive and even sadistic. I agree with you; in a very real sense you did not actually have a Mother. -Annie > > Just my two cents, > > Names have always been a particularly special way my Nada used to hurt. > My Nadas most favorite " pet " name for me, from about the age of 5, was > " dirty little bitch, " sometimes alternated with " filthy little bitch, " > " fucking princess, " and on, and on. Since the moment I told her, in my > teen years, that it made me uncomfortable to be referred to by an ootsy- > cutsey childhood nickname, she has taken particular pleasure in calling me > by that name well past my middle years, embarrassing me with it every > opportunity she found. Mothers do not do these things. > > I acknowledge that she conceived, bore, and raised me. She did the best > she was capable of doing. > She was never my " Mother " Sunspot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 Sunspot, this name calling is one of the worst things I've read on this board. You deserved better. It triggered me a bit too. Warning, the below memories are vile and not for the faint of heart. I remember being called " tramp " at the age of about 12 by nada, she also called me a 'bitch' a lot, and my two older brothers used the term " bitch sister " instead of my name. Also, my NPD brother used to scream these obscenities in my face, an inch away at the top of his lungs. It got so bad that he used to stream it all together, like " Are you on your rag again, you f*cking PMS bitch, you little c*unt. You're a f*ucking whore and you're f*cked and everything you do is f*cked " .... on and on the tirades went. I think he learned that nada could care less about this behaviour so it continued. He's a disgusting and vile excuse for a human. One of his girlfriends told me he strangled her, and nada knew about this yet says/does nothing. He was a teenager at the time. Nada only cared if something affected her directly. The name calling coupled with the physical violence was too much and I moved out at age 16 and starved. It sad but true, I don't know why that just made me giggle but somehow I'd rather be hungry living in poverty than be subjected to that kind of abuse. Yet these are the same people (FOO) who can't figure out why I want NO CONTACT with them...... it's all a bit too much sometimes. > > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > > > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my > > mother, > > > > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > > > > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. > > some > > > > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the > > fact > > > > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, > > and > > > > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her > > in which > > > > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and > > able > > > > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the > > rest. > > > > > > > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental > > illness > > > > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > > > > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > > > > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > > > > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > > > > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that > > is sick, > > > > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > > > > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > > > > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether > > it is > > > > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for > > me. I > > > > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything > > she > > > > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > > > > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so > > she > > > > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates > > that she > > > > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to > > learn the > > > > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove > > her > > > > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is > > wrong. she > > > > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > > > > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 (((((Hellfireblonde))))) That kind of treatment descends to the level of criminal child neglect and abuse, in my opinion, or ought to; If I were a DA or judge, your nada and psycho-brother would have done some jail time. Truly, I can see how running away from home and being in danger of starvation would feel preferable to chronic, severe neglect and abuse by a nada and brother. I'm glad you survived; you must have a highly resilient core. -Annie > > > > > > > > > > > ** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > a recent post talked about how it is not respectful to use the term > > > > > > Nada.(I don't call her nada, I still see her and respect her as my > > > mother, > > > > > > though I understand why some of you use that name!) > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree. sometimes. it is wrong to call a person Nada all the time. > > > some > > > > > > of my mother is her illness, and some of her is a loving mother. the > > > fact > > > > > > is that all of us are a mixture of good bad, irrational, rational, > > > and > > > > > > somewhere in-between. my long term goal is a relationship with her > > > in which > > > > > > I feel validated(not by her because she can't offer that), human and > > > able > > > > > > to see the parts that are likable in myself and her, and ignore the > > > rest. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have a personal belief that in the next life people with mental > > > illness > > > > > > will not be bound by it anymore. > > > > > > > > > > > > that is one reason I want to heal as well as establish and maintain a > > > > > > relationship with my mother in spite of NADA. > > > > > > > > > > > > I use the term on this message board because here is where I dump my > > > > > > feelings and seek my revenge on NADA. Nada is the part of her that > > > is sick, > > > > > > crewel, manipulative, and abusive. but I have a mother too. > > > > > > > > > > > > Nada is the BP in my mother, and not the parts I like. > > > > > > > > > > > > I would never accuse her of being a crappy mom to her face whether > > > it is > > > > > > true or not. I really do believe she tried to do what she could for > > > me. I > > > > > > am no longer willing to take it for granted that she did everything > > > she > > > > > > should, or that could be done, but that is not the same thing. > > > > > > > > > > > > her delusions keep her semi-sane. without them she has nothing. so > > > she > > > > > > clings to them at the expense of all else. if her sanity dictates > > > that she > > > > > > sees things in me that are only her projections, than I need to > > > learn the > > > > > > truth, and believe it, and I am working towards not trying to prove > > > her > > > > > > wrong anymore, because I can't. because she can't admit she is > > > wrong. she > > > > > > believes it all with a fierce conviction. > > > > > > > > > > > > so Nada and Mother both exist in the same person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.