Re: I have some questions...

[Guest guest]

I can't answer all your questions, but to start: raw milk and butter cannot be

legally shipped across state lines--where are you? You should request raw

milk/butter sources to be emailed to you PRIVATELY as we do not want more

farmers to get in trouble or shut down by the government. Organic Valley butter

is just okay--for pasteurized butter I prefer the Vermont Butter and Cheese Co.

cultured over the Organic Valley stuff (tastes better too).

I would be careful about putting a growing, active 15 year old on any kind of

fast. The nutritional requirements for growth are ENORMOUS during the teenage

years and I would personally be nervous about it. Others on this list might

have more ideas about this. It does sound like the source of the problem is

digestive. I look forward to hearing what others have to say about the acne.

[Guest guest]

At 05:03 PM 5/6/2002 +0000, you wrote:

>5. I have a challenging case for you. Acne. What can be done for it?

>I have a 15 year old (or at least he will be in a couple of weeks)

>who has acne. It's pretty bad. Periodically he gets constipated for

>no apparent reason (we don't think it's because of anything he ate,

>his diet is pretty consistent). Whenever he gets constipated, an

>ordeal that usually lasts for a week and usually occurs once a month,

>he also gets dandruff (which is not mild by any means) and very, very

>bad breath that is not due to dental hygiene

A lot of people that have bad acne (especially adults, I'm not sure about

teens) have problems with gluten -- I've heard lots of stories about it

clearing up for people when they stopped grains in their diets. It

certainly worked for our family: both of us had miscellaneous " red bumps "

(and I had pretty bad rosacea) and it totally cleared up. But I break out

if I get ANY gluten. The problem with gluten is that it exists in trace

amounts in LOTS of foods. But you can try him on a " no grain " (no barley,

wheat, spelt, oats, etc., whole fermented or otherwise) for about a week

and see if it helps: avoid anything processed, canned or packaged. If he

has a gluten problem, this can also cause the other symptoms you mention.

It can also cause bloating and achiness in the abdomen, fuzzy thinking,

anger and depression (of course, so can being a teenager!).

It is also possible for milk products to cause the same kinds of symptoms

for some people, and he's been eating a lot of those too.

Some people think starches in general cause the problem, so you can try

that too: cut down on ALL starches for a week.

The diet we used to figure out what was bugging us was to go a week eating

only meat and non-starchy vegies for a week. That settled everything down.

Then add one food back at a time: Eggs, milk, potatoes, other starches -- a

day or two between each (or more). Keep a food diary and see how the

symptoms relate to what he's eating. Typically food intolerance or

digestion symptoms show up several hours to a couple of days AFTER you eat

the food, so the connection isn't always obvious.

Heidi Schuppenhauer

Trillium Custom Software Inc.

heidis@...

[Guest guest]

2lbs a week is way, way too much liver. There is such a thing as

vitamin A toxicity, even though mainstream healthcare people are too

paranoid about it and most people don't get enough vitamin A. And

yes, it occurs even with natural vitamin A. Also, the liver does

filter toxins, and while it's worth taking in some toxins to get the

nutrients in liver, you don't want to overdo it. A normal-sized

serving of liver once a week is plenty. Going by the USDA database,

2lbs per week would come out to about 6 times the RDA every day, and

that's conventional liver -- I would think grassfed would be much

higher in vitamin A as the animal would take in more carotenes.

After I find out where to get the food items I want and

> start eating them, his/our diet will consist mostly of: organic

grass-

> fed liver (I suspect he will eat around two pounds a week), dairy,

> eggs, and sometimes meat as the staple of our diet; commercial

market

> (feedlot raised) beef heart; fermented grains; things cooked in

> coconut oil; more vegetables than we are eating right now (both

> fermented and unfermented); and Azomite (several tablespoons a day

> for each of us in our drinking water), high vitamin cod liver oil,

> and Kelp as supplements.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/7/2002 5:24:37 AM Central Daylight Time,

s.fisher22@... writes:

> ***While the liver does *filter* toxins, it doesn't *store* them. There

> could potentially be some toxins that are being processed in the liver at

> the time of slaughter, but it's not a *storehouse* of toxins. So i see this

> as a non-issue, especially with grass-fed.

>

>

If we agree that the liver doesn't store " toxins " why are so many people

interested in " cleaning " it? What's dirty about your liver?

Belinda

[Guest guest]

>>>>>2lbs a week is way, way too much liver. There is such a thing as

vitamin A toxicity, even though mainstream healthcare people are too

paranoid about it and most people don't get enough vitamin A. And

yes, it occurs even with natural vitamin A.

****I was thinking the same thing - that 2 lbs. sounds like a lot for 1

week. OTOH, vitamin A toxicity varies greatly among individuals, it's hard

to know how much is too much for a specific person. Also, according to the

authors of the Nutritional Desk Reference, vit A toxicity could be way

overrated. One study gave 283 participants 300,000 IU/day for 2 years and no

toxicity signs occurred!

>>>>>Also, the liver does

filter toxins, and while it's worth taking in some toxins to get the

nutrients in liver, you don't want to overdo it.

***While the liver does *filter* toxins, it doesn't *store* them. There

could potentially be some toxins that are being processed in the liver at

the time of slaughter, but it's not a *storehouse* of toxins. So i see this

as a non-issue, especially with grass-fed.

>>>>>>>Going by the USDA database,

2lbs per week would come out to about 6 times the RDA every day, and

that's conventional liver -- I would think grassfed would be much

higher in vitamin A as the animal would take in more carotenes.

******It depends on the species. Apparently the vit. A content can vary

drastically between species. I posted the vit A content of various species

liver's recently and recall that one sampling of pork liver from Holland had

an incredibly high vit A content, although i don't recall the exact amount.

But i do think that grass-fed would be a factor as well.

Suze Fisher

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

> It depends on the species. Apparently the vit. A content can vary

> drastically between species. I posted the vit A content of various species

> liver's recently and recall that one sampling of pork liver from Holland

had

> an incredibly high vit A content, although i don't recall the exact

amount.

> But i do think that grass-fed would be a factor as well.

Yes. Absolutely. ...and no matter how cheap they have it on sale for at

Whole Foods or Trader Joes *DON'T EVER* eat polar bear liver...especially

two pounds...whether it's grassfed or not... ;-)

Seriously though. Species and diet do both play a huge role. A single

normal sized serving of liver from a polar bear is generally enough to

induce acute vitamin A toxicity... There's supposedly something like

9,000,000 IU of Vit A in 8 oz of polar bear liver!

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/7/2002 12:30:39 PM Central Daylight Time,

bdcarr@... writes:

> > ***While the liver does *filter* toxins, it doesn't *store* them.

>

> If we agree that the liver doesn't store " toxins " why are so many people

> interested in " cleaning " it? What's dirty about your liver?

>

> *********I wondered about the liver not storing toxins too, because I have

> done many liver cleanses and can tell you the stuff that came out of my

> liver was very toxic. But I quicky realized that my liver (like many

> industrialized, previously SAD people) wasn't working properly, was

> congested and was storing toxins. This should not be the case with a

> grass-fed cow (but I wouldn't trust that it is not the case with cows fed

> antibiotics, hormones, toxic grains, etc)

>

> So, I figure in a more ideal senerio, the liver would not store toxins, but

> in humans who eat, breath, and soak in toxins at an unnatural rate and who

> don't eat the nutrients needed for healthy liver and bowel function - the

> liver probably gets overloaded and can't filter like it should and ends up

> storing the backlog.

>

> I know that in the nutrition programs I have done where you are detoxifying

> the body and cells with good nutrition, it is frequently the case to do

> regular liver cleanses to help flush out the toxins that are dumping at a

> faster than normal rate (and quantity). When this is not done, people don't

> progress as well.

>

> Barb

How do you know the stuff came out of your liver? What tells you that? I

know I'm being argumentative but the idea of my body being dirty just really

rubs me the wrong way.

Belinda

[Guest guest]

As someone suggested already, try to get him off all

grains. I've noticed that grains, in all forms, cause

constipation in me, which is then reflected in new

breakouts. Nuts, sugary fruits and vegetable do the

same to me.

I've also had other symptoms you described... until

recently. Is your son's tongue coated? Mine has been

as long as I can remember it (I am 31). With time, I

think, it got worse. Then I became aware of bad breath

associated from it, and brushing, flossing, and tongue

scraping didn't help much (it helped, but it didn't

last the whole day). Recently, I noticed that my

tongue is much clearer (from very significantly to

dramatically). Bad breath disappeared, even when I

don't brush or floss. I tried to correlate with

something I started to do recently or changed dosage

or frequency, etc.). My best guess is drinking lemon

juice in warm water upon rising. Doing a search on

" bile lemon water " (without quotes) will yeild some

info on what this does. Basically, it stimulates gall

bladder to excrete bile, protects liver cells and has

a slight laxative action. I also drink magnesium

citrate powder (bought in bulk in a health food store)

disolved in a boiling water. This, or maybe the lemon

drink, or both, improved my bowel performance a lot

(frequency, ease, smell, color, etc.)

I don't know if there's one thing that does the job or

more than one, but avoiding foods I mentioned keeps me

mostly breakout free and drinking the lemon drink and

taking Mg (most likely, the lemon drink) cleared my

tongue and removed bad breath and improved my

complexion.

If he's going to eat that much liver, then there's

probably no need to supplement with vitamin A. But I

would still like to mention that large doses (200,000

- 300,000 IU a day) have been reported helpful.

Roman

--- belscb <belscb@...> wrote:

> 5. I have a challenging case for you. Acne. What can

> be done for it?

> I have a 15 year old (or at least he will be in a

> couple of weeks)

> who has acne. It's pretty bad. Periodically he gets

> constipated for

> no apparent reason (we don't think it's because of

> anything he ate,

> his diet is pretty consistent). Whenever he gets

> constipated, an

> ordeal that usually lasts for a week and usually

> occurs once a month,

> he also gets dandruff (which is not mild by any

> means) and very, very

> bad breath that is not due to dental hygiene. Here

> is pretty much

> what he has been eating for the past 4 months: no

> sugar, no white

> flour, only fermented whole grains, free-range eggs,

> grass fed beef

> (the fat is his favorite part I think), the organic

> valley dairy I

> mentioned above (cheese and butter), a fairly low

> vitamin cod liver

> oil, and a fair amount of a variety of both

> fermented and unfermented

> vegetables. After I find out where to get the food

> items I want and

> start eating them, his/our diet will consist mostly

> of: organic grass-

> fed liver (I suspect he will eat around two pounds a

> week), dairy,

> eggs, and sometimes meat as the staple of our diet;

> commercial market

> (feedlot raised) beef heart; fermented grains;

> things cooked in

> coconut oil; more vegetables than we are eating

> right now (both

> fermented and unfermented); and Azomite (several

> tablespoons a day

> for each of us in our drinking water), high vitamin

> cod liver oil,

> and Kelp as supplements. He gets plenty of exercise

> and is outside a

> lot. What would ya'll suggest for this perplexing

> (at least for me)

> situation? He doesn't eat anything bad, and

> fortunately he'll eat

> anything I tell him to happily, no matter how it

> tastes. His

> acupressure for his liver are always hurting (we're

> thinking that

> means something's not going perfectly well with his

> liver). He has

> gone on a liver cleansing fast before, but the

> results were only

> temporary (lasted less than 10 days). I have

> recently come up with a

> new hypothesis. I think perhaps something is not

> functioning

> perfectly in his intestines. Maybe there is a build

> up of toxins in

> his intestines that his liver is constantly trying

> to cleanse him of.

> That would explain his liver ailment, his

> constipation and his body

> trying to get rid of all his toxins through the

> skin. That would also

> explain his dandruff, acne, and bad breath wouldn't

> it? Also, I

> suspect that hormones have something to do with the

> acne, and clogged

> intestines causing clogged liver couldn't be very

> good for hormones

> or the skin. I plan for him to do an

> intestine-cleansing 8 day fast

> using fresh vegetable juices, fermented vegetable

> juices, a potent

> pro-biotic, Azomite, flax (which he uses to no avail

> whenever he gets

> constipated), chlorella (for protein and

> chlorophyll) bone broth, and

> around 1000 calories worth of coconut oil (for no

> other reason than

> for the extra calories—is this oil acceptable for a

> fast? He usually

> eats around 5000-6000 calories a day. Would coconut

> oil hinder the

> purpose of the fast?). Would this be a good fast for

> cleansing the

> intestines? Does he need to clean his intestines?

> What do YOU think?

> Please tell me! It's so confusing to me. One day the

> sweat underneath

> his armpits (which is present in large amounts)

> doesn't even stink,

> and next week it smells like…well…let's just say

> " unacceptable. " I

> have never smelled anything so bad before. One day

> his breath

> stays " neutral " and is not affected by brushing or

> anything, the next

> week his breath is worse than my father's breath was

> when he was

> dying of cancer. His breath is not affected AT ALL

> bv hygiene. One

> time he went two weeks without brushing and not one

> person noticed

> until he got constipated. After he got constipated

> he brushed his

> teeth four or five times a day and the bad breath

> would not leave.

> It's so confusing! What could be wrong!? I need your

> wisdom. How ever

> much you have, it has just got to be more than mine.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

At 06:25 AM 5/7/2002 -0400, you wrote:

>. Also, according to the

>authors of the Nutritional Desk Reference, vit A toxicity could be way

>overrated. One study gave 283 participants 300,000 IU/day for 2 years and

>no toxicity signs occurred!

Did they use retinol or beta carotene?

[Guest guest]

At 06:25 AM 5/7/2002 -0400, you wrote:

>. Also, according to the

>authors of the Nutritional Desk Reference, vit A toxicity could be way

>overrated. One study gave 283 participants 300,000 IU/day for 2 years and

>no toxicity signs occurred!

>>>>>Did they use retinol or beta carotene?

*****I'm certain it was retinoid. beta carotene is one of the precursors but

is not generally referred to as 'vit a.' it does not convert at an

equivalent amount, anyway so they would have to specifically state how many

IUs or mgs beta carotene.

Suze Fisher

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

> ***While the liver does *filter* toxins, it doesn't *store* them. There

> could potentially be some toxins that are being processed in the liver at

> the time of slaughter, but it's not a *storehouse* of toxins. So i see

this

> as a non-issue, especially with grass-fed.

>

>

>>>>>>>If we agree that the liver doesn't store " toxins " why are so many

people

interested in " cleaning " it? What's dirty about your liver?

*******Belinda,

First let's identify what we mean by toxins...i'm assuming we're all

referring to xenobiotics (foreign compounds) as opposed to " bio toxins "

which are produced from biological sources such as tannins, venom, etc?

either way, the liver's primary role vis-a-vis xenobiotics and bio toxins,

as i understand it, is to *process* them, not *store* them. i probably

shouldn't have said it doesn't store toxins carte blanche though, because in

cases of severe liver impairment it's possible that it can't do it's normal

job of processing fat-soluble toxins that are transported to fat tissue

(mainly adipose and fatty parts of bone) for storage and water-soluble

toxins to the kidneys for excretion. which brings up the point that bone

broths may actually be a far more likely source of fat-soluble toxins than

liver. Secondly, a liver that is so diseased that it can no longer carry out

it's functions of *processing* xenobiotics/bio toxins will not likely pass

meat inspection. i think i recall reading that a large percentage of

feedlot steer liver is rejected for this reason.

So, as far as liver *cleanses* go, my understanding is that they are often

liver 'supporters,' 'builder's' and 'repairers' more so than 'flushers' in

that they often support and improve liver function. when liver function is

improved it can do a better job of processing/destroying xenobiotics/bio

toxins that enter the system. People often do seem to 'flush' out gall

stones, though, which are composed of cholesterol and or bile pigments. But

i don't think that in general, a liver cleanse is analogous to a street

sweeper that sweeps all the debris (xenobiotics, toxins) off the street. i'm

a bit of a neophyte on liver cleanses though, so perhaps someone else who's

much more familiar with the mechanism at work can explain it better.

Suze Fisher

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

> At 06:25 AM 5/7/2002 -0400, you wrote:

> >. Also, according to the

> >authors of the Nutritional Desk Reference, vit A toxicity could be way

> >overrated. One study gave 283 participants 300,000 IU/day for 2 years and

> >no toxicity signs occurred!

>

> >>>>>Did they use retinol or beta carotene?

>

>

> *****I'm certain it was retinoid. beta carotene is one of the precursors

but

> is not generally referred to as 'vit a.' it does not convert at an

> equivalent amount, anyway so they would have to specifically state how

many

> IUs or mgs beta carotene.

Isn't 300,000 IU per day of retinol the medical dose that's used for acne

sometimes? I don't think the dose is sustained for a very long time when

used that way, but I'm not sure...

[Guest guest]

--- Kroyer <skroyer@...> wrote:

> Isn't 300,000 IU per day of retinol the medical dose

> that's used for acne

> sometimes? I don't think the dose is sustained for

> a very long time when

> used that way, but I'm not sure...

Yes, it is. It's sometimes reduced to about 100,000 to

200,000 IU and taken for quite a long time.

Roman

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/8/2002 6:16:09 PM Central Daylight Time,

bianca3@... writes:

> How do you know the stuff came out of your liver? What tells you that? I

>

> know I'm being argumentative but the idea of my body being dirty just

> really

> rubs me the wrong way.

>

> Belinda

>

>

>

>

>

>

> *****If you ever want to see the kind of gunk that is in people's body,

> visit a hospital ward and ask to sit in on some surgeries. You will see

> the most amazing distensions and junk that people accumulate. Same thing

> with autopsies. Or even a good intestinal cleanse.

>

> Bianca

>

I don't need to see surgeries, we butcher I see plenty of " gunk " . My question

was how a person doing a " liver cleanse " knows that this stuff was in the

liver and not just passing thru because of the new diet.

Belinda being annoying

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/8/2002 8:15:26 PM Central Daylight Time,

brberg@... writes:

> >******That's okay :-)

> >I think other folks have answered your question. As an aside people who

> >don't change their diets often do liver cleanses as well.

>

> Actually, I think that what she meant by " new diet " was the stuff consumed

> as part of the liver cleanse. Remember how Aajounus claimed that the stones

>

> passed during a liver cleanse were just a mixture of bile and the epsom

> salts consumed during the cleanse (or something like that)? If someone does

>

> enough of that sort of liver cleanse, will the stones eventually stop

> coming

> out

That's exactly what I meant. My question's not been answered because it can't

be. There is no way you can know that the " gunk " came from your liver,

through it perhaps but not necessarily from the liver. I would figure the

feeling of your liver doing more is the result of it having to do more. It

would seem a fast puts a strain on your liver as it must process more nasties

than normal.

Belinda

[Guest guest]

On Tue, 7 May 2002 17:29:58 EDT bilherbs@... writes:

How do you know the stuff came out of your liver? What tells you that? I

know I'm being argumentative but the idea of my body being dirty just

really

rubs me the wrong way.

Belinda

*****If you ever want to see the kind of gunk that is in people's body,

visit a hospital ward and ask to sit in on some surgeries. You will see

the most amazing distensions and junk that people accumulate. Same thing

with autopsies. Or even a good intestinal cleanse.

Bianca

[Guest guest]

How do you know the stuff came out of your liver? What tells you that? I

know I'm being argumentative but the idea of my body being dirty just really

rubs me the wrong way.

Belinda

Belinda,

Right before I did my first liver flush, I had been exposed to massive amounts

of pesticides, paint and new carpet toxins along with a mercury filling being

drilled on, a hep B vaccine (with mercury in it), several rounds of antibiotics

and lots of ibruprofen. My liver was shutting down and was very congested. I

worked with a nutritionist who has been doing liver flushes and other detox

programs with people for many years (cured herself of brain tumors and uterine

cancer as well as helping lot of others with incurable diseases). She had lots

of experience with what typically happens during these flushes and what comes

out. After I described to her what occured with my flush, she said it appeared

that I had an extremely congested liver. I would rather not get to descriptive

on a big list like this, but besides seeing and smelling what came out the day

after the flush, I also had various pains and sensations in my liver which

indicated to me that there was a lot of activity in my liver because of the

flush procedure. I think this first flush probably saved my life and the

subsequent ones have just helped get me healthier and healthier. I'm about to do

the Dr. Schulze version of a liver gall/bladder flush.

Sometimes after a flush, I could feel gall stones moving through my bile duct

(and then see them in the toilet when they came out). Other times I would feel

pains in my liver and then the toilet would have a different color stones (and

smaller). My nutritionist said these were probably stones which were in the

liver rather than the gall bladder. I would also get out what she called

" gravel " - she said this comes from the liver as well. Not sure about how she

knows this exactly.

In my case, my liver could not keep up with the extreme amount of toxins I was

exposed to at once (on top of the normal, everyday toxins I was exposed to).

Plus, I have another body problem which makes my internal organs not work quite

up to par with how they should. So for me, helping my organs out by periodic

cleansing has meant the difference between being quite ill to gradually getting

my life back.

Maybe your body isn't " dirty " . Mine was and needs extra help to detoxify itself.

I don't think it is an odd thing at all to periodically take measures to

facilitate detox - animals do it all the time instinctually. Some people need it

more than others I'm sure. We may be on opposite ends of the spectrum.

One other thing though...this nutritionist who helped me is the most healthy,

energetic, happy 65 year old I've ever come across. She is certain that her

flushes and detoxing is responsible for curing her cancer and giving her such

good health and energy. There are so many people who have had great results with

this that it is hard to ignore.

Barb

[Guest guest]

Roman-

>I've read that people who allegedly got sick after

>eating polar bear liver actually got sick due to

>cadmium (if I remember correctly) toxicity, not

>Vitamin A.

How come polar bear liver had (has?) so much cadmium?

-

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 8 May 2002 20:31:26 EDT bilherbs@... writes:

I don't need to see surgeries, we butcher I see plenty of " gunk " . My

question

was how a person doing a " liver cleanse " knows that this stuff was in the

liver and not just passing thru because of the new diet.

Belinda being annoying

******That's okay :-)

I think other folks have answered your question. As an aside people who

don't change their diets often do liver cleanses as well.

Bianca

[Guest guest]

>From: bianca3@...

>I don't need to see surgeries, we butcher I see plenty of " gunk " . My

>question

>was how a person doing a " liver cleanse " knows that this stuff was in the

>

>liver and not just passing thru because of the new diet.

>******That's okay :-)

>I think other folks have answered your question. As an aside people who

>don't change their diets often do liver cleanses as well.

Actually, I think that what she meant by " new diet " was the stuff consumed

as part of the liver cleanse. Remember how Aajounus claimed that the stones

passed during a liver cleanse were just a mixture of bile and the epsom

salts consumed during the cleanse (or something like that)? If someone does

enough of that sort of liver cleanse, will the stones eventually stop coming

out?

_________________________________________________________________

Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com

[Guest guest]

On Thu, 09 May 2002 01:13:25 +0000 " Berg " <brberg@...>

writes:

Actually, I think that what she meant by " new diet " was the stuff

consumed

as part of the liver cleanse. Remember how Aajounus claimed that the

stones

passed during a liver cleanse were just a mixture of bile and the epsom

salts consumed during the cleanse (or something like that)? If someone

does

enough of that sort of liver cleanse, will the stones eventually stop

coming

out?

****** Aajonus isn't the only one who has made that claim. The problem in

my style of liver flush is that I don't use Epsom salts. And the quick

answer to that claim is so obvious it is not even funny, examine what

comes out. In my case we used to filter the stools and it was fairly easy

to distinguish what was what. And yes, provided you clean up your diet,

the stones will eventually stop coming out.

[Guest guest]

>>>>>>>> It

would seem a fast puts a strain on your liver as it must process more

nasties

than normal.

********Pity the poor muslims worldwide who fast for a *month* during

Ramadan. They must all be walking around sickly and with impaired livers

Fasting is *not* unhealthy, IMO. among other reasons, it's so common

throughout nature that it makes no sense to me that it would be unhealthy.

you have to consider that NOT EATING is actually a great burdern taken OFF

the liver since it must manufacture bile to emulsify fats and must process

all nutrients entering the body - this is a *major* part of it's function.

By NOT eating, you are letting it spend it's energy to do 'housecleaning.'

As bianca mentioned (i think), the main circumstance i'd be concerned about

in fasting, is if the person had an inordinately high accumulation of drugs

or other chemicals that would put an unusually large burden on the liver to

detoxify them. but there's always slow and gentle cleansing...

Suze Fisher

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

That's exactly what I meant. My question's not been answered because it can't

be. There is no way you can know that the " gunk " came from your liver,

through it perhaps but not necessarily from the liver. I would figure the

feeling of your liver doing more is the result of it having to do more. It

would seem a fast puts a strain on your liver as it must process more nasties

than normal.

Belinda

*****Belinda,

It is really quite easy to know when the " gunk " came from your liver (at least

for someone who is pretty in tune with their body). I'm probably not being very

effective in telling you how I knew when something was coming out of my liver. I

actually think it is something you have to experience many times before you have

certaintly about it (or be someone who has counseled people through enough

cleanses to know what is going on). None of the liver cleanses I did involved

fasting. In fact, I've never fasted (it would have been too detoxifying for me).

When you fast or make diet changes that are causing the body to detox more, then

lots more toxins are passing through your liver and your liver is having to do a

lot more work. But when you do a specific gallbladder/liver cleanse, you are

specifically causing the gallbladder and liver to contract and squeeze out

matter (whether this be in the form of stones or gravel or whatever). There is

quite a different feeling from having your liver work harder because you are

detoxing and having it flush out stones/content. I think to really know when

these incidents are occuring you'd have to have been pretty sick and toxic and

paying close attention to what is going on in your body (like how a chronically

ill person gets because they are desperately trying to get well and rather than

paying attention to all the fun things in life like work, play, people...they

are sucked into paying attention to what is going on in their body and trying to

figure it out so they can get well :-)).

After every gall bladder/liver flush I have done I experienced significant

improvement in my health and energy. But the first few brought on VERY intense

healing crises. One interesting thing I experienced with my cleansing

experiences was that my body was able/willing to let go of more cellular toxins

after I did a liver cleanse. My nutritionist explained this by saying that if

the organs of elimination are blocked or over worked and hence not functioning

well, the body knows not to dump more toxins onto them. When you cleanse the

organs of elimination, you open up the dam and it's like all the cells go " Hey

look...there's a way out now...let's dump more toxins " . I do wish that my body

could speak so clearly to me though! I've seen it happen a lot where people make

a situation worse by detoxing the body/cells without opening up the elimination

organs first - they just recirculate toxins.

Barb

[Guest guest]

Hi (I'm new, too),

You can get grass-fed liver from Peacful Pastures (Tennessee) at

peacefulpastures.com. I belive it's at 2.49lb plus shipping. You

could dehydrate it, but I think it would still have to be

refrigerated. I've been meaning to do this, but I just don't think I

want the smell in the house that long. I know people that do this

for their animals all the time.

<2. Does anybody know of a mail order or internet place where I could

get organic grass-fed liver really, really cheap? The cheapest I have

found so far was Tatonka Buffalo for an estimated $60 for 20 pounds

including shipping. Also, does anybody know of an alternate way of

preserving liver? A way other than freezing? I want to try and take

some liver with me on a hiking trip, but I can't figure out (without

ya'll) a good way to take it along. I was thinking that maybe it

could somehow be dried or something like that. Has anybody tried that

before? I don't care if the end result is gross or not, does it

preserve it? >

I did a series of colonics last summer and it really helped me a

lot. I struggled with IBS for a few years and at the worst times, it

was like having morning breath all the time and I did have some acne

and rosacea outbreaks. Have you thought about Candida as a possible

culprit? I still get some bouts around my monthly cycle. Do men

have monthly hormonal cycles? Maybe a monthly dip or peak in

hormones could be triggering his symptoms.

<5. I have a challenging case for you. Acne. What can be done for it?

I have a 15 year old (or at least he will be in a couple of weeks)

who has acne. It's pretty bad. Periodically he gets constipated for

no apparent reason (we don't think it's because of anything he ate,

his diet is pretty consistent). Whenever he gets constipated, an

ordeal that usually lasts for a week and usually occurs once a month,

he also gets dandruff (which is not mild by any means) and very, very

bad breath that is not due to dental hygiene.>

Best of luck,

[Guest guest]

> <5. I have a challenging case for you. Acne. What can be done for

> it?

> I have a 15 year old (or at least he will be in a couple of weeks)

> who has acne. It's pretty bad.

I can only tell you what worked for me -- of course, have no idea if it

applies to your son. My experience with pimples (it wasn't as bad as

acne) was that they completely disappeared when I went off ALL dairy.

" ALL dairy " for me meant grocery-store pasteurized milk, ice cream, sour

cream, cheese, yogurt, and any dairy in processed foods.

I tried " no dairy " once for a month and noticed no changes. Later, I

committed to a 6-month trial and noticed major changes at about 3-4

months of no dairy.

1) I stopped getting pimples. Now, if I cheat, I get pimples. I go

back to being strict and no pimples!

2) I stopped getting colds. Previously, I had gotten them frequently.

This was purely an experiment. I enjoyed dairy and didn't think I had

any problems with it so I was surprised by the positive changes that came

from avoiding it.

I've since been tested and shown to have a milk allergy. I haven't tried

raw milk, so perhaps I wouldn't have problems with that. I'm going to

try goat's milk kefir soon and hope I can drink that w/out problems.

in MD

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