response to the low wage arcticle

[Guest guest]

Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

(united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of $30

an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is talking

about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are not

able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job for

low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do this

for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for the

love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our bills

and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my roommate

till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career you

need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet married

and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids and a

wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year less

than I would need to support them, and thats based on my girlfriends

salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on Pt.

care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our ambulances

ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International EMS

Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less than

some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people out

of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000,000 to

" fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to the

choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of you

off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just piss

and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets put

together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby group

here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know what

they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and I

truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and dont

understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m not

complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most of

our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service to

service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

Chris

[Guest guest]

read the message. it starts with saying bad things about the union. then wants

to start one. not very thoughtful

________________________________

To: texasems-l

Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 9:02:23 PM

Subject: response to the low wage arcticle

Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

(united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of $30

an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is talking

about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are not

able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job for

low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do this

for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for the

love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our bills

and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my roommate

till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career you

need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet married

and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids and a

wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year less

than I would need to support them, and thats based on my girlfriends

salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on Pt.

care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our ambulances

ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International EMS

Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less than

some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people out

of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000, 000 to

" fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to the

choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of you

off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just piss

and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets put

together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby group

here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know what

they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and I

truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and dont

understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m not

complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most of

our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service to

service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

Chris

[Guest guest]

oh crap. i thought that i was responding to a friends email. please dont email

me. it was my opinion. nothing

more.

________________________________

To: texasems-l

Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 9:02:23 PM

Subject: response to the low wage arcticle

Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

(united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of $30

an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is talking

about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are not

able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job for

low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do this

for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for the

love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our bills

and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my roommate

till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career you

need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet married

and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids and a

wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year less

than I would need to support them, and thats based on my girlfriends

salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on Pt.

care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our ambulances

ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International EMS

Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less than

some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people out

of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000, 000 to

" fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to the

choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of you

off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just piss

and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets put

together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby group

here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know what

they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and I

truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and dont

understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m not

complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most of

our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service to

service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Prepare to be beaten. I have brought up similiar and some feel we

are paid to much and others argued that I thought we were worth a

whole lot more than we are. Some feel we should only do this for

free. Owners argued they would go broke. Some argued we are not

educated enough to be paid more.

So there we are to divided to ever go forward. Sadly I think in the

big picture we are broken. Perhaps in small areas we can make it

right.

Happily I am with a progressive county paying every hour on duty (no

free hours), Paramedics $18, EMT-I $15, EMT-B $13, plus overtime and

great benefits. I have even heard rumor we got a 10% raise starting

January.

Renny

>

> Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of

$30

> an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is

talking

> about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are

not

> able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job

for

> low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do

this

> for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for

the

> love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our

bills

> and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my

roommate

> till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career

you

> need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet

married

> and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids

and a

> wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year

less

> than I would need to support them, and thats based on my

girlfriends

> salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

> do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on

Pt.

> care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our

ambulances

> ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International

EMS

> Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less

than

> some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people

out

> of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000,000

to

> " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to

the

> choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of

you

> off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just

piss

> and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets

put

> together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby

group

> here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know

what

> they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and

I

> truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and

dont

> understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

>

>

> P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m

not

> complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most

of

> our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service

to

> service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

>

>

> Chris

>

[Guest guest]

How long have you been a medic?

________________________________

To: texasems-l

Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 9:50:46 PM

Subject: Re: response to the low wage arcticle

Prepare to be beaten. I have brought up similiar and some feel we

are paid to much and others argued that I thought we were worth a

whole lot more than we are. Some feel we should only do this for

free. Owners argued they would go broke. Some argued we are not

educated enough to be paid more.

So there we are to divided to ever go forward. Sadly I think in the

big picture we are broken. Perhaps in small areas we can make it

right.

Happily I am with a progressive county paying every hour on duty (no

free hours), Paramedics $18, EMT-I $15, EMT-B $13, plus overtime and

great benefits. I have even heard rumor we got a 10% raise starting

January.

Renny

>

> Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of

$30

> an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is

talking

> about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are

not

> able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job

for

> low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do

this

> for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for

the

> love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our

bills

> and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my

roommate

> till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career

you

> need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet

married

> and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids

and a

> wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year

less

> than I would need to support them, and thats based on my

girlfriends

> salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

> do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on

Pt.

> care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our

ambulances

> ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International

EMS

> Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less

than

> some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people

out

> of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000, 000

to

> " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to

the

> choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of

you

> off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just

piss

> and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets

put

> together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby

group

> here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know

what

> they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and

I

> truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and

dont

> understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

>

>

> P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m

not

> complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most

of

> our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service

to

> service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

>

>

> Chris

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Spen I dont disagree with you I don`t have any doubt in my mind that

> people will try and beat me down for saying all that, and I dont

> disagree that some people do think we should do this for free.

> Again in my opinion I cant help but want to change things even more

> when I here people say that we are just " ambulance drivers. " Will

> companies go out of business, probably but historically when

> industries have united (steel workers, meat packers, etc.) the

> companies that lost out the most were the ones that treated

> employees without respect anyway. now I realize that statement in

> itself is bold and may have crossed lines but sometimes the truth

> hurts (as I speak about afew private companies that I have been

> associated with in the past and not about anyone directly on this

> list for the most part I don`t have to name names). Anyone that

> works in the Houston area can tell you that EMS companies come and

> go like crazy down there, sadly many of those companies are run by

> the same people, they will go out of business and start a new

> company sometimes in the same month using the same equipment with a

> different paint scheme. these are the same companies that are

> chaining the doors without telling employees before hand no final

> paychecks, no two weeks notice just shutting down for no apparent

> reason. Upton Sinclair helped Change a whole industry by pointing

> out the horrors associated with it, I am not necessarily comparing

> our situation to that one but my point is as long as things are

> accepted as " the norm " then things are not going to change. Public

> education can do a world of good for any cause " The jungle " is a

> great example of that, but you have to have people who are

> dedicated to it. Here is a test Next time you are in public ask

> someone what they think Paramedics, EMT`s and Firefighters make

> hourly I was surprised to here people answer that question with 45

> to 55k a year as a base rate. People really dont know we make so

> little. Are we worth more YES!! people will argue that but I`m

> sorry in my opinion those people are wrong and they will suffer in

> the end. Paramedics and EMT`s are not expendable the education is

> getting harder and harder and this will never be a career field

> unless we get paid more it will continue to be a stepping stone to

> nursing or med school etc. Shoot I know many many paramedics who

> only do this to make money while they are in college. Spen I ask

> you not to take this email as a direct attack on you cause it truly

> isnt for the most part I agree with your reply I dont want this to

> be one of those oh so famous Texasems-l topics that ends up be about

> something completely different. I really want it to spark

> something in our community that may move us closer it`s going to be

> long and its going to be tough but I think it`s way to important to

> not be addressed.

>

>

> - Chris

>

> P.S. Upton Sinclair Wrote " The Jungle " a Novel written in 1906 about

> the working conditions in the meat packing industry in the

> Northeast, the book was a huge " wake up call " and eventually helped

> create the FDA and Meat Inspection Act. The down side at least in

> my opinion is that Upton Sinclair was a socialist and advocated an

> American Socialist Revolution. But you guys get my Point I think!!

>

>

>> Prepare to be beaten. I have brought up similiar and some feel we

>> are paid to much and others argued that I thought we were worth a

>> whole lot more than we are. Some feel we should only do this for

>> free. Owners argued they would go broke. Some argued we are not

>> educated enough to be paid more.

>> So there we are to divided to ever go forward. Sadly I think in the

>> big picture we are broken. Perhaps in small areas we can make it

>> right.

>>

>> Happily I am with a progressive county paying every hour on duty (no

>> free hours), Paramedics $18, EMT-I $15, EMT-B $13, plus overtime and

>> great benefits. I have even heard rumor we got a 10% raise starting

>> January.

>>

>> Renny

>>

>>

>> >

>> > Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

>> > (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of

>> $30

>> > an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is

>> talking

>> > about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are

>> not

>> > able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job

>> for

>> > low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do

>> this

>> > for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for

>> the

>> > love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

>> > because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our

>> bills

>> > and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

>> > enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my

>> roommate

>> > till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

>> > industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career

>> you

>> > need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet

>> married

>> > and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids

>> and a

>> > wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year

>> less

>> > than I would need to support them, and thats based on my

>> girlfriends

>> > salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

>> > do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on

>> Pt.

>> > care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our

>> ambulances

>> > ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International

>> EMS

>> > Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

>> > else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less

>> than

>> > some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people

>> out

>> > of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000,000

>> to

>> > " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to

>> the

>> > choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of

>> you

>> > off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just

>> piss

>> > and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets

>> put

>> > together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby

>> group

>> > here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know

>> what

>> > they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and

>> I

>> > truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

>> > Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and

>> dont

>> > understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

>> >

>> >

>> > P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

>> > company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m

>> not

>> > complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most

>> of

>> > our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

>> > survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service

>> to

>> > service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

>> >

>> >

>> > Chris

>> >

>>

>>

>>

>

[Guest guest]

Yes Texas does have an EMS Assocation and yes we do lobby but with

fewer then 300 members in a state with 50,000 +/- certified EMS

Providers it is hard to get anyone to listen!

Louis N. Molino, Sr. CET

FF/NREMT/FSI/EMSI

Typed by my thumbs on my iPhone.

> Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of $30

> an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is talking

> about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are not

> able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job for

> low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do this

> for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for the

> love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our bills

> and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my roommate

> till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career you

> need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet married

> and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids and a

> wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year less

> than I would need to support them, and thats based on my girlfriends

> salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

> do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on Pt.

> care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our ambulances

> ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International EMS

> Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less than

> some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people out

> of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000,000 to

> " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to the

> choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of you

> off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just piss

> and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets put

> together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby group

> here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know what

> they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and I

> truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and dont

> understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

>

>

> P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m not

> complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most of

> our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service to

> service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

>

>

> Chris

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Speaking of that will I get a renewal notice?

Thanks

Renny Spencer

>

> > Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> > (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of

$30

> > an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is

talking

> > about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are

not

> > able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job

for

> > low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do

this

> > for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for

the

> > love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> > because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our

bills

> > and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> > enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my

roommate

> > till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> > industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career

you

> > need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet

married

> > and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids

and a

> > wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year

less

> > than I would need to support them, and thats based on my

girlfriends

> > salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

> > do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be

on Pt.

> > care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our

ambulances

> > ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International

EMS

> > Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> > else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less

than

> > some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people

out

> > of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get

$700,000,000,000 to

> > " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching

to the

> > choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of

you

> > off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just

piss

> > and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets

put

> > together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby

group

> > here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know

what

> > they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and

I

> > truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> > Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and

dont

> > understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

> >

> >

> > P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> > company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m

not

> > complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most

of

> > our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> > survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service

to

> > service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

> >

> >

> > Chris

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

First how does my time in EMS apply to my statement in regards to the

responses I got when I posted on the subject of wages here on this

site?

> >

> > Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> > (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of

> $30

> > an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is

> talking

> > about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are

> not

> > able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job

> for

> > low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do

> this

> > for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for

> the

> > love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> > because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our

> bills

> > and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> > enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my

> roommate

> > till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> > industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career

> you

> > need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet

> married

> > and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids

> and a

> > wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year

> less

> > than I would need to support them, and thats based on my

> girlfriends

> > salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than

I

> > do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on

> Pt.

> > care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our

> ambulances

> > ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International

> EMS

> > Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> > else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less

> than

> > some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people

> out

> > of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000,

000

> to

> > " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to

> the

> > choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of

> you

> > off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just

> piss

> > and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets

> put

> > together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby

> group

> > here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know

> what

> > they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and

> I

> > truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> > Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and

> dont

> > understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

> >

> >

> > P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> > company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m

> not

> > complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most

> of

> > our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> > survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service

> to

> > service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

> >

> >

> > Chris

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Been certified and working as an EMT since 2001

-Chris

Sent from my iPhone

How long have you been a medic?

________________________________

To: texasems-l

Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 9:50:46 PM

Subject: Re: response to the low wage arcticle

Prepare to be beaten. I have brought up similiar and some feel we

are paid to much and others argued that I thought we were worth a

whole lot more than we are. Some feel we should only do this for

free. Owners argued they would go broke. Some argued we are not

educated enough to be paid more.

So there we are to divided to ever go forward. Sadly I think in the

big picture we are broken. Perhaps in small areas we can make it

right.

Happily I am with a progressive county paying every hour on duty (no

free hours), Paramedics $18, EMT-I $15, EMT-B $13, plus overtime and

great benefits. I have even heard rumor we got a 10% raise starting

January.

Renny

>

> Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of

$30

> an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is

talking

> about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are

not

> able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job

for

> low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do

this

> for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for

the

> love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our

bills

> and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my

roommate

> till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career

you

> need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet

married

> and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids

and a

> wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year

less

> than I would need to support them, and thats based on my

girlfriends

> salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

> do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on

Pt.

> care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our

ambulances

> ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International

EMS

> Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less

than

> some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people

out

> of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000, 000

to

> " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to

the

> choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of

you

> off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just

piss

> and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets

put

> together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby

group

> here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know

what

> they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and

I

> truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and

dont

> understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

>

>

> P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m

not

> complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most

of

> our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service

to

> service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

>

>

> Chris

>

[Guest guest]

You are right that it will take us all working together to make a

difference. EMSAT is trying, but with less than 1% of the certified EMS

personnel in membership, it is very difficult to accomplish much. The

cost of membership is very low, but we still do not get aboard and so we

continue to support the status quo. As long as we keep doing what we are

doing, we will continue to get what we have been getting and the shaft

often hurts.

Bob

Dr. Bob Folden, EMT-B

So much information, so little knowledge, and even less wisdom!

wrote:

>

> Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of $30

> an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is talking

> about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are not

> able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job for

> low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do this

> for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for the

> love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our bills

> and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my roommate

> till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career you

> need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet married

> and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids and a

> wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year less

> than I would need to support them, and thats based on my girlfriends

> salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

> do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on Pt.

> care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our ambulances

> ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International EMS

> Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less than

> some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people out

> of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000,000 to

> " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to the

> choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of you

> off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just piss

> and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets put

> together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby group

> here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know what

> they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and I

> truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and dont

> understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

>

> P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m not

> complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most of

> our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service to

> service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

>

> Chris

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

EMSAT is not a union, but is a professional association. There is a big

difference.

Bob

Dr. Bob Folden, EMT-B

So much information, so little knowledge, and even less wisdom!

eric bynum wrote:

>

> oh crap. i thought that i was responding to a friends email. please

> dont email me. it was my opinion. nothing

> more.

>

>

>

> ________________________________

> From: <aggiesrwe03@...

> <mailto:aggiesrwe03%40yahoo.com>>

> To: texasems-l <mailto:texasems-l%40yahoogroups.com>

> Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 9:02:23 PM

> Subject: response to the low wage arcticle

>

> Just my two cents but I think it is incredibly sad that the UAW

> (united autoworkers) are making somewhere in the neighborhood of $30

> an hour to watch robots build cars, and now the government is talking

> about giving them more money. Where is our bailout? If we are not

> able to work people die. I`m not saying people wont do this job for

> low wages all of us on this list are proof that people will do this

> for low wages most of us don`t do it for the money we do it for the

> love of the job. What i`m talking about is not being able to work

> because we just don`t make enough to feed our families, pay our bills

> and put gas in our tank. I can remember in recent past not having

> enough gas to get to work and having to borough money from my roommate

> till payday, and I am paid on the high end of the scale for this

> industry. It is ridiculous that if you choose this as a career you

> need to work 3 or 4 jobs to make it!!! I`m lucky I am not yet married

> and have no children and I live " comfortably " but if I had Kids and a

> wife I can say for a fact that I`m making about $10,000 a year less

> than I would need to support them, and thats based on my girlfriends

> salary and mine combined (she makes almost $12 an hour more than I

> do). I know from time to time we don`t all agree whether it be on Pt.

> care, or clinical process, or even what color to paint our ambulances

> ETC. but maybe its time to get together and talk International EMS

> Workers Union? Now I love what I do and don`t want to do anything

> else but it is getting a little silly that we literally make less than

> some Mcs employee`s, when SOME bankers have screwed people out

> of money for years can run to the US Gvt. and get $700,000,000, 000 to

> " fix " there own screw up. now I know i`m pretty much preaching to the

> choir for some of you and i`m sure this is going to piss some of you

> off but it`s time we step up and do something rather than just piss

> and moan. Contact me offlist if you have ideas on solutions lets put

> together a plan and follow through I know there is an EMS lobby group

> here in Texas (EMSAT I think but I may be confused?) and I know what

> they do is tough but they just cant do it all they need help! and I

> truly believe we need to fix the problem everywhere not just in

> Texas. So what do you think? am I right, Wrong, too young and dont

> understood politics well enough, what? Give me some feedback.

>

> P.S. I would like to add I have the luxury of working for a GREAT

> company and I do make a good living by our industry standard I`m not

> complaining about individual companies pay rate I know that most of

> our services really do try and pay as much as they can and still

> survive, the problem in my opinion is industry wide not a service to

> service problem. we can only pay waht we make.

>

> Chris

>

>

[Guest guest]

While the " pay " issue frequently appears on this List, many do not appreciate

the source of the dilemma. The " payers " are generally responsible for most

EMS revenues, which in turn allow for greater flexibility in establishing

salaries, wages and benefits. Yet, I don't see EMS workers demanding that

Medicare

and third party payers increase reimbursement rates. One cannot pay what one

does not possess.

The costs of providing EMS continue to spiral upward. Among them are

technology costs, education costs, compliance costs, insurance costs and all

peripheral expenses. The only thing that's been trending downward for the past

20 years

has been reimbursement, when adjusted for inflation. Unlike automobile

manufacturers, the increasing cost of providing EMS cannot be passed through to

EMS

consumers because the payers have effectively capped the reimbursement.

Thus, EMS workers are subsidizing these cost increases in the form of

suppressed wages. Think about this when your service purchases the newest

generation

monitor/defibrillator that costs $40,000 each. EMS suppliers are able to pass

through the increasing costs of their next generation products, however, EMS

services are generally unable to recover these cost increases in the form of

higher user fees.

As far as EMS associations go, their success rests with their leaderships

ability to identify and define issues of " common " interest, meaning those issues

that will either benefit or harm everyone regardless of their provider

affiliation. For example, if a new rule was proposed that would require all EMS

certification-holders to pay a $10,000 annual recertification fee, I suspect

that

EMSAT's membership would soar if the association could effectively communicate

that it was taking point on the issue. Conversely, if the association engages

in or promotes " take it or leave it " issues or those issues that only affect

part of the EMS constituency, it will remain relatively small and ineffective.

Bob Kellow

**************

Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try

the NEW AOL.com. (http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp & amp;icid=aolcom40vanity & amp;

ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002)

[Guest guest]

In general well stated Bob and I also agree with 98% of your thought but I

would add that 27 years ago in New Jersey the State charged nothing for EMT

testing, nothing for your certificate nor your wallet card and even sent you

that coveted first patch for you then EMT-A course. Mine was the last class that

got that free patch, 2 or 3 years later no more farmable wall certificate,

in time nothing but the card etc. Oh and there are of course fees.

The EMS Association in New Jersey has not seen any significant increase in

=Membership in the years since 1981 in fact they likely have lost Members.

The apathy is the one thing I can't figure out.

Louis N. Molino, Sr., CET

FF/NREMT-B/FSI/EMSI

Freelance Consultant/Trainer/Author/Journalist/Fire Protection Consultant

LNMolino@...

(Cell Phone)

(Home Phone)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Office)

(IFW/TFW/FSS Fax)

" A Texan with a Jersey Attitude "

" Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds

discuss people " Eleanor Roosevelt - US diplomat & reformer (1884 - 1962)

The comments contained in this E-mail are the opinions of the author and the

author alone. I in no way ever intend to speak for any person or

organization that I am in any way whatsoever involved or associated with unless

I

specifically state that I am doing so. Further this E-mail is intended only for

its

stated recipient and may contain private and or confidential materials

retransmission is strictly prohibited unless placed in the public domain by the

original author.

In a message dated 11/26/2008 1:44:52 P.M. Central Standard Time,

als79@... writes:

While the " pay " issue frequently appears on this List, many do not

appreciate

the source of the dilemma. The " payers " are generally responsible for most

EMS revenues, which in turn allow for greater flexibility in establishing

salaries, wages and benefits. Yet, I don't see EMS workers demanding that

Medicare

and third party payers increase reimbursement rates. One cannot pay what one

does not possess.

The costs of providing EMS continue to spiral upward. Among them are

technology costs, education costs, compliance costs, insurance costs and all

peripheral expenses. The only thing that's been trending downward for the

past 20 years

has been reimbursement, when adjusted for inflation. Unlike automobile

manufacturers, the increasing cost of providing EMS cannot be passed through

to EMS

consumers because the payers have effectively capped the reimbursement.

Thus, EMS workers are subsidizing these cost increases in the form of

suppressed wages. Think about this when your service purchases the newest

generation

monitor/defibrillator that costs $40,000 each. EMS suppliers are able to

pass

through the increasing costs of their next generation products, however, EMS

services are generally unable to recover these cost increases in the form of

higher user fees.

As far as EMS associations go, their success rests with their leaderships

ability to identify and define issues of " common " interest, meaning those

issues

that will either benefit or harm everyone regardless of their provider

affiliation. For example, if a new rule was proposed that would require all

EMS

certification-holders to pay a $10,000 annual recertification fee, I suspect

that

EMSAT's membership would soar if the association could effectively

communicate

that it was taking point on the issue. Conversely, if the association

engages

in or promotes " take it or leave it " issues or those issues that only affect

part of the EMS constituency, it will remain relatively small and

ineffective.

Bob Kellow

**************

Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try

the NEW AOL.com.

(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp & amp;icid=aolcom40vanity & amp;

ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002)

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

**************Life should be easier. So should your homepage. Try the NEW

AOL.com.

(http://www.aol.com/?optin=new-dp & icid=aolcom40vanity & ncid=emlcntaolcom00000002)