Guest guest Posted May 9, 2002 Report Share Posted May 9, 2002 First of all thank you ine for the light bulb suggestion. I was able to get the temperature up. It worked great. I need some idea of what good whey smells like. Mine smells a little sour but not a sour (bad) milk smell, not foul. Is this what it should smell like? Thanks again. Blair _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 30, 2006 Report Share Posted April 30, 2006 Essentially any whey product will give you the same benefits as Immunopro - or will make you horribly sick from it after a big rush of relief for an hour or two - if you take enough of it. For those who don't need to spend tons of money for someone to put groceries in capsules for them, you can find sweet whey powder in the baking section at many supermarkets - it is a very common ingredient in muffins, etc. People who really want relief of symptoms would be well advised to get plasma cysteine determined by Great Smokies labs (note that cystine is a different compound and not relevant) and if the result is low take things like whey and eat lots of sulfury foods like onions, garlic, asparagus, broccoli, cabbage, eggs and other dairy products. If the result is high then avoid these things scrupulously. Andy > > i was wondering if anybody knows how different the amino acid content > and make up of this product (which is said to be made from whey) differs > from the undenatured why products like Immunopro. > > http://jarrow.com/product.php?prodid=194 > > could this product gives us a similar benefit to Immunopro? > > thanks > bill > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 30, 2006 Report Share Posted April 30, 2006 Hi, Bill. I'm not able to tell from the website how this product is made. Since it doesn't specifically say that it is nondenatured or native whey protein, I suspect that it is a byproduct of cheesemaking, and as such most of its cysteine is present as the oxidized form cystine. The significance of this is that the liver cells do not import cystine readily. I believe this is one reason for the difference in response that many PWCs have reported between the nondenatured products, such as RenewPro, ImmunoPro Rx, and now The True Whey and the other whey protein products, which are all byproducts of cheeemaking, so that the protein has been heated and acid-treated, which oxidized cysteine to cystine. In addition, the native whey protein products contain lactoferrin, immunoglobulins, and immune peptides, which the others do not, and these can also be beneficial. Rich > > i was wondering if anybody knows how different the amino acid content > and make up of this product (which is said to be made from whey) differs > from the undenatured why products like Immunopro. > > http://jarrow.com/product.php?prodid=194 > > could this product gives us a similar benefit to Immunopro? > > thanks > bill > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 are there any workable pill forms? i don't have the energy to mix the powders. jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 you mean chew it? you think it would stay down? janel@... writes: > You can just take the powder straight from the jar, just keep it in your > mouth with a tiny bit of water then swallow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 Hi Rich, can you tell me if making tradition kefir from organic store bought milk makes the right kind of whey? No one here so far, has been able to answer that. Re: another whey question Hi, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 There must be hundreds of whey protein products on the market. Personally, I am a little skeptical that the undenatured products are as much better as they claim to be. Immunocal's PDR (http://www.drugs. com/PDR/Immunocal_Powder_Sachets.html) summarizes its mechanism as " a cysteine delivery system " . In contrast to the earlier post it actually touts the cystine form as an advantage: " ...the cysteine remains as the stable form cystine (2 molecules of cysteine linked by disulfide bond) and glutamylcystine " . " The disulphide bond in cystine is pepsin and trypsin resistant but may be split by heat, low pH or mechanical stress releasing free cysteine. When subject to heat or shearing forces (inherent in most extraction processes), the fragile disulfide bonds within the peptides are broken and the bioavailablility of cysteine is greatly diminished. " Immunepro is a different product but it is interesting to see its high -end competitor advertised this way. My own experience is that even regular health-food-store varieties (e. g. Solgar) have immune activity. I noticed my skin would clear of acne within a few days of taking the stuff. The effect was dramatic and repeatable. Unfortunately I would also develop a nasty eczematic rash after a few weeks. No eczema with Immunepro or Immunocal. For this reason I prefer the " non-denatured " products. I think much of the perceived differences are due to marketing (they need to differentiate their products somehow) although they do seem to be of higher quality. I wouldn't completely rule out regular whey if you can tolerate it and cost is a factor. Also, the product you linked to was in tablet form. Everyone is different but I saw benefit at one full scoop daily -- too much for tablet form. > > i was wondering if anybody knows how different the amino acid content > and make up of this product (which is said to be made from whey) differs > from the undenatured why products like Immunopro. > > http://jarrow.com/product.php?prodid=194 > > could this product gives us a similar benefit to Immunopro? > > thanks > bill > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 You can just take the powder straight from the jar, just keep it in your mouth with a tiny bit of water then swallow. Nelly Re: Re: another whey question are there any workable pill forms? i don't have the energy to mix the powders. jim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 1, 2006 Report Share Posted May 1, 2006 Hi, bumblesquat.] As I've written here in the past, in my opinion, the Immunocal folks have the cysteine-cystine story backwards in their promotional material for Immunocal. First, let me say that Dr. Gustavo Bounous, who is the main researcher behind Immunocal, is really responsible for discovering the benefits of nondenatured whey protein for the immune system. Unfortunately, he got his biochemistry backward when he tried to explain it, and that misconception has continued into the Immunocal promotional materials. The fact is that when the whey proteins come out of the cow, they are in the chemically reduced, non-denatured state. In that state, the cysteine is present as cysteine, not cystine. This is the best form for use by the calf, and it's also the best form for use by a human body. The liver cells are able to readily import cysteine. However, they do not import cystine (the oxidized form) well. Cystine must first go to the kidneys and be recycled back into the blood, partly as cysteine, and the liver is then able to import it to make glutathione. When whey protein is derived as a byproduct of cheesemaking (which uses the casein and butterfat or curd fraction of the milk), the whey has been subjected to pasteurization and acid treating in the cheesemaking process, and this denatures the proteins (changes their shape or fragments them) and oxidizes the cysteine to cystine. Dr. Bounous originally used nondenatured whey protein in his animal experiments, and found it to be very potent for helping the immune system. However, when his work was commercialized as Immunocal, the only economic, high-volume source of whey protein they could find was cheesemaking byproduct. They used a filtration process on it to remove a lot of the damaged protein and non-protein fractions, and the dried product is called a whey protein isolate. They decided to call it " undenatured, " which is really a misnomer, because a protein cannot really be undenatured after it has been denatured. They have really only filtered out most of the damaged proteins. However, the overall process used to make the whey protein isolates eliminates the lactoferrin, the immunoglobulins and the immune peptides as well as oxidizing cysteine to cystine. I don't mean to say that whey protein isolates cannot be helpful. They clearly can. The are more concentrated in cystine than the cheaper bulk whey protein sold in the large white plastic jars. However, they do not contain cysteine in its original chemically reduced form, which is most directly useable by the liver for making glutathione. Some PWCs are not able to tolerate the nondenatured whey protein products (RenewPro, ImmunePro Rx, and The True Whey), because they are too potent, and they do better on the whey protein isolates. But there clearly are differences between these categories of products, and it isn't just advertising hype. Rich > > > > i was wondering if anybody knows how different the amino acid > content > > and make up of this product (which is said to be made from whey) > differs > > from the undenatured why products like Immunopro. > > > > http://jarrow.com/product.php?prodid=194 > > > > could this product gives us a similar benefit to Immunopro? > > > > thanks > > bill > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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