Can fleas drive away the spouse/family of an AdultChild?

[Guest guest]

Thanks again for all the insight and compassion posted here -- I do a lot

more reading than posting!

Quick summary -- I grew up with an alcoholic " Waif " nada, my older sister

ran away as soon as she could and then my dad left when he couldn't handle

it anymore, so I was the sole caretaker of my nada for some crucial years

(around ages 9-12) before my dad did get custody of me. But I was " hooked "

and tried to care for my nada up until I married my first wife (at age 28

-- I was scared of marriage).

Well, what seems to have come of this is that I seem to have more fleas

than I've ever seen on a cat or dog!

I'm in my second marriage (11 years) with four teen-20's stepsons, two

daughters from this marriage (6 and 10), and two teenage daughters from my

first marriage (they live with their mom nearby).

The relationship with my current wife started 26 years ago (when I was in

college, long before my first marriage) where I (flea time) became very

empathic with her unhappiness in her first marriage and I tried to " rescue "

her emotionally. A lot of that worked, but when push-came-to-shove I was

too scared to actually make the moves needed to support her through a

divorce and be with her. But we really never stopped loving each other/out

emotional connection. My first marriage was more my own

" biological/societal " clock ticking and satisfying everyone else's needs

that I get married, live in the suburbs and start a family. But 10 years

of repressing everything led to what was probably a true breakdown and I

got divorced. Then ended up back with my current wife who had also

eventually divorced.

Our marriage has been rocky dealing with our past expectations of each

other, but also I can see now, looking back, that for some reason in this

marriage the fleas reproduced and took more and more control over my

emotions. I had more anger from buried resentments, I repressed my own

needs/opinions, I withdrew emotionally more and more. And I have always

had a hard time having a relationship with the children -- I would do great

when they were little (in some ways I'm still a little kid myself), but as

they needed a more substantial emotional relationship I had no idea how to

do that. In my own nomenclature, I could not " picture " that relationship

in my head, so it has been nearly impossible for me to be a very involved

dad.

Currently we are separated and have only recently discovered the world of

BPD. I have been working through support as an AdultChild of an Alcoholic,

and a really great Celebrate Recovery program (Christian 12-step/recovery

program for just about any hangups/issues/addictions), but a lot of damage

has been done in this marriage, and to the kids. I do honestly believe

that I really just have a serious flea " infestation " and a lot of history

of not dealing with them, my wife tends to think that I have BPD and NPD --

but the fact that (as is said here in the group) I can recognize a lot of

this now, I am seeking treatment and tailoring my existing support along

these lines, says to me that I am, at worst, a " borderline " Borderline.

:-)

But, my wife, who exhausted herself physically and emotionally during our

marriage (and it got worse as time went on) making up for my serious

deficiencies in being a husband and father, has had enough. She's all but

ready for a divorce. If we were not committed and believing Christians,

she would have divorced me some years ago, and I think that I would have

emotionally withdrawn by using divorce as an escape. But despite our

beliefs, she really feels that she and the kids will be a lot healthier

with as little of me as possible. And in many ways I understand this --

though it is very painful.

All of this to say -- has anyone out there gone through a similar

situation? If so -- how did it work out? Do you have any advice?

Thanks!!!!!

Dana

[Guest guest]

Hi Dana,

There are sister Groups at WTO to this one for those who are in chosen

relationships with a person with bpd. There is a " staying " group, an

" undecided " group, and a " divorcing " group.

This Group is about dealing with *unchosen* relationships with a bpd parent or

sibling(s).

There are also sister Groups at WTO specifically for the parents of children

with bpd, and grandparents of grandkids with bpd. There are unique and

specific issues involved with each set of circumstances, because the

relationship dynamics / power dynamics are so different in chosen vs unchosen

relationships.

I think you will get more responses specific to your marriage situation from

members of those sister Groups. And like I posted earlier, if you have a lot of

bpd fleas but you have the personal insight to acknowledge this, the courage to

accept responsibility for your own behaviors, then getting therapy and staying

in therapy, learning how to self-monitor and develop healthier ways of dealing

with your feelings is crucial in order to begin your journey toward having

healthier relationships with your own children.

I hope that helps.

-Annie

>

> Thanks again for all the insight and compassion posted here -- I do a lot

> more reading than posting!

>

> Quick summary -- I grew up with an alcoholic " Waif " nada, my older sister

> ran away as soon as she could and then my dad left when he couldn't handle

> it anymore, so I was the sole caretaker of my nada for some crucial years

> (around ages 9-12) before my dad did get custody of me. But I was " hooked "

> and tried to care for my nada up until I married my first wife (at age 28

> -- I was scared of marriage).

>

> Well, what seems to have come of this is that I seem to have more fleas

> than I've ever seen on a cat or dog!

>

> I'm in my second marriage (11 years) with four teen-20's stepsons, two

> daughters from this marriage (6 and 10), and two teenage daughters from my

> first marriage (they live with their mom nearby).

>

> The relationship with my current wife started 26 years ago (when I was in

> college, long before my first marriage) where I (flea time) became very

> empathic with her unhappiness in her first marriage and I tried to " rescue "

> her emotionally. A lot of that worked, but when push-came-to-shove I was

> too scared to actually make the moves needed to support her through a

> divorce and be with her. But we really never stopped loving each other/out

> emotional connection. My first marriage was more my own

> " biological/societal " clock ticking and satisfying everyone else's needs

> that I get married, live in the suburbs and start a family. But 10 years

> of repressing everything led to what was probably a true breakdown and I

> got divorced. Then ended up back with my current wife who had also

> eventually divorced.

>

> Our marriage has been rocky dealing with our past expectations of each

> other, but also I can see now, looking back, that for some reason in this

> marriage the fleas reproduced and took more and more control over my

> emotions. I had more anger from buried resentments, I repressed my own

> needs/opinions, I withdrew emotionally more and more. And I have always

> had a hard time having a relationship with the children -- I would do great

> when they were little (in some ways I'm still a little kid myself), but as

> they needed a more substantial emotional relationship I had no idea how to

> do that. In my own nomenclature, I could not " picture " that relationship

> in my head, so it has been nearly impossible for me to be a very involved

> dad.

>

> Currently we are separated and have only recently discovered the world of

> BPD. I have been working through support as an AdultChild of an Alcoholic,

> and a really great Celebrate Recovery program (Christian 12-step/recovery

> program for just about any hangups/issues/addictions), but a lot of damage

> has been done in this marriage, and to the kids. I do honestly believe

> that I really just have a serious flea " infestation " and a lot of history

> of not dealing with them, my wife tends to think that I have BPD and NPD --

> but the fact that (as is said here in the group) I can recognize a lot of

> this now, I am seeking treatment and tailoring my existing support along

> these lines, says to me that I am, at worst, a " borderline " Borderline.

> :-)

>

> But, my wife, who exhausted herself physically and emotionally during our

> marriage (and it got worse as time went on) making up for my serious

> deficiencies in being a husband and father, has had enough. She's all but

> ready for a divorce. If we were not committed and believing Christians,

> she would have divorced me some years ago, and I think that I would have

> emotionally withdrawn by using divorce as an escape. But despite our

> beliefs, she really feels that she and the kids will be a lot healthier

> with as little of me as possible. And in many ways I understand this --

> though it is very painful.

>

> All of this to say -- has anyone out there gone through a similar

> situation? If so -- how did it work out? Do you have any advice?

>

> Thanks!!!!!

>

> Dana

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Ahhh -- thank you.

I sent the link to the " undecided " group to my wife, but she feels that she

has her hands full with taking care of the family and no time to get into

it.

Since these groups are really for the family-of BP sufferers, how

appropriate would it be for me (as an AdultChild-of) to join?

And thank *you* for all of the feedback that you provide to so many here.

Dana

On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 11:52 AM, anuria67854 wrote:

> **

>

>

> Hi Dana,

>

> There are sister Groups at WTO to this one for those who are in chosen

> relationships with a person with bpd. There is a " staying " group, an

> " undecided " group, and a " divorcing " group.

>

> This Group is about dealing with *unchosen* relationships with a bpd

> parent or sibling(s).

>

> There are also sister Groups at WTO specifically for the parents of

> children with bpd, and grandparents of grandkids with bpd. There are unique

> and specific issues involved with each set of circumstances, because the

> relationship dynamics / power dynamics are so different in chosen vs

> unchosen relationships.

>

> I think you will get more responses specific to your marriage situation

> from members of those sister Groups. And like I posted earlier, if you have

> a lot of bpd fleas but you have the personal insight to acknowledge this,

> the courage to accept responsibility for your own behaviors, then getting

> therapy and staying in therapy, learning how to self-monitor and develop

> healthier ways of dealing with your feelings is crucial in order to begin

> your journey toward having healthier relationships with your own children.

>

> I hope that helps.

>

> -Annie

>

>

> >

> > Thanks again for all the insight and compassion posted here -- I do a lot

> > more reading than posting!

> >

> > Quick summary -- I grew up with an alcoholic " Waif " nada, my older sister

> > ran away as soon as she could and then my dad left when he couldn't

> handle

> > it anymore, so I was the sole caretaker of my nada for some crucial years

> > (around ages 9-12) before my dad did get custody of me. But I was

> " hooked "

> > and tried to care for my nada up until I married my first wife (at age 28

> > -- I was scared of marriage).

> >

> > Well, what seems to have come of this is that I seem to have more fleas

> > than I've ever seen on a cat or dog!

> >

> > I'm in my second marriage (11 years) with four teen-20's stepsons, two

> > daughters from this marriage (6 and 10), and two teenage daughters from

> my

> > first marriage (they live with their mom nearby).

> >

> > The relationship with my current wife started 26 years ago (when I was in

> > college, long before my first marriage) where I (flea time) became very

> > empathic with her unhappiness in her first marriage and I tried to

> " rescue "

> > her emotionally. A lot of that worked, but when push-came-to-shove I was

> > too scared to actually make the moves needed to support her through a

> > divorce and be with her. But we really never stopped loving each

> other/out

> > emotional connection. My first marriage was more my own

> > " biological/societal " clock ticking and satisfying everyone else's needs

> > that I get married, live in the suburbs and start a family. But 10 years

> > of repressing everything led to what was probably a true breakdown and I

> > got divorced. Then ended up back with my current wife who had also

> > eventually divorced.

> >

> > Our marriage has been rocky dealing with our past expectations of each

> > other, but also I can see now, looking back, that for some reason in this

> > marriage the fleas reproduced and took more and more control over my

> > emotions. I had more anger from buried resentments, I repressed my own

> > needs/opinions, I withdrew emotionally more and more. And I have always

> > had a hard time having a relationship with the children -- I would do

> great

> > when they were little (in some ways I'm still a little kid myself), but

> as

> > they needed a more substantial emotional relationship I had no idea how

> to

> > do that. In my own nomenclature, I could not " picture " that relationship

> > in my head, so it has been nearly impossible for me to be a very involved

> > dad.

> >

> > Currently we are separated and have only recently discovered the world of

> > BPD. I have been working through support as an AdultChild of an

> Alcoholic,

> > and a really great Celebrate Recovery program (Christian 12-step/recovery

> > program for just about any hangups/issues/addictions), but a lot of

> damage

> > has been done in this marriage, and to the kids. I do honestly believe

> > that I really just have a serious flea " infestation " and a lot of history

> > of not dealing with them, my wife tends to think that I have BPD and NPD

> --

> > but the fact that (as is said here in the group) I can recognize a lot of

> > this now, I am seeking treatment and tailoring my existing support along

> > these lines, says to me that I am, at worst, a " borderline " Borderline.

> > :-)

> >

> > But, my wife, who exhausted herself physically and emotionally during our

> > marriage (and it got worse as time went on) making up for my serious

> > deficiencies in being a husband and father, has had enough. She's all but

> > ready for a divorce. If we were not committed and believing Christians,

> > she would have divorced me some years ago, and I think that I would have

> > emotionally withdrawn by using divorce as an escape. But despite our

> > beliefs, she really feels that she and the kids will be a lot healthier

> > with as little of me as possible. And in many ways I understand this --

> > though it is very painful.

> >

> > All of this to say -- has anyone out there gone through a similar

> > situation? If so -- how did it work out? Do you have any advice?

> >

> > Thanks!!!!!

> >

> > Dana

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Well, I'm not sure. Like I said in my earlier post, the discussions here are

focused on dealing with unchosen relationships with borderline pd / narcissistic

pd parents and other relatives; this Group is for the non-pd offspring of bpd

parents.

Are those issues you are facing yourself, and want to explore with this Group?

-Annie

> > >

> > > Thanks again for all the insight and compassion posted here -- I do a lot

> > > more reading than posting!

> > >

> > > Quick summary -- I grew up with an alcoholic " Waif " nada, my older sister

> > > ran away as soon as she could and then my dad left when he couldn't

> > handle

> > > it anymore, so I was the sole caretaker of my nada for some crucial years

> > > (around ages 9-12) before my dad did get custody of me. But I was

> > " hooked "

> > > and tried to care for my nada up until I married my first wife (at age 28

> > > -- I was scared of marriage).

> > >

> > > Well, what seems to have come of this is that I seem to have more fleas

> > > than I've ever seen on a cat or dog!

> > >

> > > I'm in my second marriage (11 years) with four teen-20's stepsons, two

> > > daughters from this marriage (6 and 10), and two teenage daughters from

> > my

> > > first marriage (they live with their mom nearby).

> > >

> > > The relationship with my current wife started 26 years ago (when I was in

> > > college, long before my first marriage) where I (flea time) became very

> > > empathic with her unhappiness in her first marriage and I tried to

> > " rescue "

> > > her emotionally. A lot of that worked, but when push-came-to-shove I was

> > > too scared to actually make the moves needed to support her through a

> > > divorce and be with her. But we really never stopped loving each

> > other/out

> > > emotional connection. My first marriage was more my own

> > > " biological/societal " clock ticking and satisfying everyone else's needs

> > > that I get married, live in the suburbs and start a family. But 10 years

> > > of repressing everything led to what was probably a true breakdown and I

> > > got divorced. Then ended up back with my current wife who had also

> > > eventually divorced.

> > >

> > > Our marriage has been rocky dealing with our past expectations of each

> > > other, but also I can see now, looking back, that for some reason in this

> > > marriage the fleas reproduced and took more and more control over my

> > > emotions. I had more anger from buried resentments, I repressed my own

> > > needs/opinions, I withdrew emotionally more and more. And I have always

> > > had a hard time having a relationship with the children -- I would do

> > great

> > > when they were little (in some ways I'm still a little kid myself), but

> > as

> > > they needed a more substantial emotional relationship I had no idea how

> > to

> > > do that. In my own nomenclature, I could not " picture " that relationship

> > > in my head, so it has been nearly impossible for me to be a very involved

> > > dad.

> > >

> > > Currently we are separated and have only recently discovered the world of

> > > BPD. I have been working through support as an AdultChild of an

> > Alcoholic,

> > > and a really great Celebrate Recovery program (Christian 12-step/recovery

> > > program for just about any hangups/issues/addictions), but a lot of

> > damage

> > > has been done in this marriage, and to the kids. I do honestly believe

> > > that I really just have a serious flea " infestation " and a lot of history

> > > of not dealing with them, my wife tends to think that I have BPD and NPD

> > --

> > > but the fact that (as is said here in the group) I can recognize a lot of

> > > this now, I am seeking treatment and tailoring my existing support along

> > > these lines, says to me that I am, at worst, a " borderline " Borderline.

> > > :-)

> > >

> > > But, my wife, who exhausted herself physically and emotionally during our

> > > marriage (and it got worse as time went on) making up for my serious

> > > deficiencies in being a husband and father, has had enough. She's all but

> > > ready for a divorce. If we were not committed and believing Christians,

> > > she would have divorced me some years ago, and I think that I would have

> > > emotionally withdrawn by using divorce as an escape. But despite our

> > > beliefs, she really feels that she and the kids will be a lot healthier

> > > with as little of me as possible. And in many ways I understand this --

> > > though it is very painful.

> > >

> > > All of this to say -- has anyone out there gone through a similar

> > > situation? If so -- how did it work out? Do you have any advice?

> > >

> > > Thanks!!!!!

> > >

> > > Dana

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Well, I definitely has a BPD (and alcoholic) nada -- mostly a " waif " but

some " hermit " (from the Borderling Mother book). She passed away just

about 10 years ago, and I only recently have realized what BPD is and the

affects on the children of such a mother (and of her alcoholism), and I can

see many feelings/thinking patterns in myself that are a result of being

brought up by her, and that explains a lot of the difficulties in my adult

relationships.

So -- I am here to see how other adult-children cope with the " fleas " and

try to be relieved of the burden of said fleas. There's a part of me that

would truly be just fine withdrawing and isolating from most emotional

contact with others, because that's the " default " and in some ways it makes

life a lot less complicated/stressful. But it's also not realistic when I

am a husband and father, and I do desire to live a more normal life, for my

benefit and the benefit of others.

Dana

On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 10:09 PM, anuria67854 wrote:

> **

>

>

> Well, I'm not sure. Like I said in my earlier post, the discussions here

> are focused on dealing with unchosen relationships with borderline pd /

> narcissistic pd parents and other relatives; this Group is for the non-pd

> offspring of bpd parents.

>

> Are those issues you are facing yourself, and want to explore with this

> Group?

>

> -Annie

>

>

> > > >

> > > > Thanks again for all the insight and compassion posted here -- I do

> a lot

> > > > more reading than posting!

> > > >

> > > > Quick summary -- I grew up with an alcoholic " Waif " nada, my older

> sister

> > > > ran away as soon as she could and then my dad left when he couldn't

> > > handle

> > > > it anymore, so I was the sole caretaker of my nada for some crucial

> years

> > > > (around ages 9-12) before my dad did get custody of me. But I was

> > > " hooked "

> > > > and tried to care for my nada up until I married my first wife (at

> age 28

> > > > -- I was scared of marriage).

> > > >

> > > > Well, what seems to have come of this is that I seem to have more

> fleas

> > > > than I've ever seen on a cat or dog!

> > > >

> > > > I'm in my second marriage (11 years) with four teen-20's stepsons,

> two

> > > > daughters from this marriage (6 and 10), and two teenage daughters

> from

> > > my

> > > > first marriage (they live with their mom nearby).

> > > >

> > > > The relationship with my current wife started 26 years ago (when I

> was in

> > > > college, long before my first marriage) where I (flea time) became

> very

> > > > empathic with her unhappiness in her first marriage and I tried to

> > > " rescue "

> > > > her emotionally. A lot of that worked, but when push-came-to-shove I

> was

> > > > too scared to actually make the moves needed to support her through a

> > > > divorce and be with her. But we really never stopped loving each

> > > other/out

> > > > emotional connection. My first marriage was more my own

> > > > " biological/societal " clock ticking and satisfying everyone else's

> needs

> > > > that I get married, live in the suburbs and start a family. But 10

> years

> > > > of repressing everything led to what was probably a true breakdown

> and I

> > > > got divorced. Then ended up back with my current wife who had also

> > > > eventually divorced.

> > > >

> > > > Our marriage has been rocky dealing with our past expectations of

> each

> > > > other, but also I can see now, looking back, that for some reason in

> this

> > > > marriage the fleas reproduced and took more and more control over my

> > > > emotions. I had more anger from buried resentments, I repressed my

> own

> > > > needs/opinions, I withdrew emotionally more and more. And I have

> always

> > > > had a hard time having a relationship with the children -- I would do

> > > great

> > > > when they were little (in some ways I'm still a little kid myself),

> but

> > > as

> > > > they needed a more substantial emotional relationship I had no idea

> how

> > > to

> > > > do that. In my own nomenclature, I could not " picture " that

> relationship

> > > > in my head, so it has been nearly impossible for me to be a very

> involved

> > > > dad.

> > > >

> > > > Currently we are separated and have only recently discovered the

> world of

> > > > BPD. I have been working through support as an AdultChild of an

> > > Alcoholic,

> > > > and a really great Celebrate Recovery program (Christian

> 12-step/recovery

> > > > program for just about any hangups/issues/addictions), but a lot of

> > > damage

> > > > has been done in this marriage, and to the kids. I do honestly

> believe

> > > > that I really just have a serious flea " infestation " and a lot of

> history

> > > > of not dealing with them, my wife tends to think that I have BPD and

> NPD

> > > --

> > > > but the fact that (as is said here in the group) I can recognize a

> lot of

> > > > this now, I am seeking treatment and tailoring my existing support

> along

> > > > these lines, says to me that I am, at worst, a " borderline "

> Borderline.

> > > > :-)

> > > >

> > > > But, my wife, who exhausted herself physically and emotionally

> during our

> > > > marriage (and it got worse as time went on) making up for my serious

> > > > deficiencies in being a husband and father, has had enough. She's

> all but

> > > > ready for a divorce. If we were not committed and believing

> Christians,

> > > > she would have divorced me some years ago, and I think that I would

> have

> > > > emotionally withdrawn by using divorce as an escape. But despite our

> > > > beliefs, she really feels that she and the kids will be a lot

> healthier

> > > > with as little of me as possible. And in many ways I understand this

> --

> > > > though it is very painful.

> > > >

> > > > All of this to say -- has anyone out there gone through a similar

> > > > situation? If so -- how did it work out? Do you have any advice?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks!!!!!

> > > >

> > > > Dana

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

As a fellow KO, (adult kid of a bpd parent) then you will probably get some

benefit from reading and sharing here. We each have to find our own path to a

healthier relationship with our bpd parent or relative; there isn't any one way

or best way to do that.

Some of us want or need to remain in contact with our bpd parent or relative, so

such KOs learn how to set and maintain reasonable adult boundaries with their

bpd loved one. Other KOs find that they need to go No Contact either

temporarily or permanently to preserve their own emotional health or protect

their children from abusive bpd grandparents.

Its hard to accept that its not possible to make a loved one with bpd/npd change

even though we badly want them to, keep trying to help them change, and keep

hoping that if we just try harder they will want to treat us better. Its hard

to give up that hope, but the desire to change has to come from inside the

individual, herself/himself. But the good news is that we do have the power to

change our own selves.

In my own case, one of my " flea " behaviors as a teen and young person was to

have a quick temper and be easily angered over small things. But I was able to

perceive that that was hurting other people's feelings and that made me feel

remorseful. Acting like that made me feel bad about myself. When it dawned on

me that having an ugly temper was behaving just like my borderline

pd/narcissistic pd mother, it was a kind of epiphany for me. I sure as hell

did NOT want to be anything like her, so I decided to just not do that anymore.

I started consciously just holding back, and not spewing out a vitriolic retort

or an ugly, sarcastic comment. I grew to understand that I could not and cannot

control my feelings, but I sure as hell CAN control my behaviors. I accepted

that just because I *have* a feeling doesn't mean I have to act on it, and I

have the ability to control my behaviors *in spite of* my feelings.

It took me a long time to realize that and a lot of other similar things on my

own, and I think I could have progressed much more rapidly in therapy.

But my circumstances /background /culture or family-of-origin dynamic was that

psychology and psychiatry were a lot of hogwash and about as useful as going to

a witch-doctor, and that only slavering, screaming, psychotic, insane people

need to see a " shrink. " Other messages pounded into me: if you were

intelligent you could work out your own problems, and it wasn't OK to talk about

family problems with anyone outside the family. Can you imagine a more

restrictive, isolating, self-defeating, anti-healing mind-set?

So, that's part of my own journey. And I'm still journeying, even though my

bpd/npd mother or " nada " recently passed away, and my sweet but

enabling/enmeshed " dishrag " dad has been gone a long time.

-Annie

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks again for all the insight and compassion posted here -- I do

> > a lot

> > > > > more reading than posting!

> > > > >

> > > > > Quick summary -- I grew up with an alcoholic " Waif " nada, my older

> > sister

> > > > > ran away as soon as she could and then my dad left when he couldn't

> > > > handle

> > > > > it anymore, so I was the sole caretaker of my nada for some crucial

> > years

> > > > > (around ages 9-12) before my dad did get custody of me. But I was

> > > > " hooked "

> > > > > and tried to care for my nada up until I married my first wife (at

> > age 28

> > > > > -- I was scared of marriage).

> > > > >

> > > > > Well, what seems to have come of this is that I seem to have more

> > fleas

> > > > > than I've ever seen on a cat or dog!

> > > > >

> > > > > I'm in my second marriage (11 years) with four teen-20's stepsons,

> > two

> > > > > daughters from this marriage (6 and 10), and two teenage daughters

> > from

> > > > my

> > > > > first marriage (they live with their mom nearby).

> > > > >

> > > > > The relationship with my current wife started 26 years ago (when I

> > was in

> > > > > college, long before my first marriage) where I (flea time) became

> > very

> > > > > empathic with her unhappiness in her first marriage and I tried to

> > > > " rescue "

> > > > > her emotionally. A lot of that worked, but when push-came-to-shove I

> > was

> > > > > too scared to actually make the moves needed to support her through a

> > > > > divorce and be with her. But we really never stopped loving each

> > > > other/out

> > > > > emotional connection. My first marriage was more my own

> > > > > " biological/societal " clock ticking and satisfying everyone else's

> > needs

> > > > > that I get married, live in the suburbs and start a family. But 10

> > years

> > > > > of repressing everything led to what was probably a true breakdown

> > and I

> > > > > got divorced. Then ended up back with my current wife who had also

> > > > > eventually divorced.

> > > > >

> > > > > Our marriage has been rocky dealing with our past expectations of

> > each

> > > > > other, but also I can see now, looking back, that for some reason in

> > this

> > > > > marriage the fleas reproduced and took more and more control over my

> > > > > emotions. I had more anger from buried resentments, I repressed my

> > own

> > > > > needs/opinions, I withdrew emotionally more and more. And I have

> > always

> > > > > had a hard time having a relationship with the children -- I would do

> > > > great

> > > > > when they were little (in some ways I'm still a little kid myself),

> > but

> > > > as

> > > > > they needed a more substantial emotional relationship I had no idea

> > how

> > > > to

> > > > > do that. In my own nomenclature, I could not " picture " that

> > relationship

> > > > > in my head, so it has been nearly impossible for me to be a very

> > involved

> > > > > dad.

> > > > >

> > > > > Currently we are separated and have only recently discovered the

> > world of

> > > > > BPD. I have been working through support as an AdultChild of an

> > > > Alcoholic,

> > > > > and a really great Celebrate Recovery program (Christian

> > 12-step/recovery

> > > > > program for just about any hangups/issues/addictions), but a lot of

> > > > damage

> > > > > has been done in this marriage, and to the kids. I do honestly

> > believe

> > > > > that I really just have a serious flea " infestation " and a lot of

> > history

> > > > > of not dealing with them, my wife tends to think that I have BPD and

> > NPD

> > > > --

> > > > > but the fact that (as is said here in the group) I can recognize a

> > lot of

> > > > > this now, I am seeking treatment and tailoring my existing support

> > along

> > > > > these lines, says to me that I am, at worst, a " borderline "

> > Borderline.

> > > > > :-)

> > > > >

> > > > > But, my wife, who exhausted herself physically and emotionally

> > during our

> > > > > marriage (and it got worse as time went on) making up for my serious

> > > > > deficiencies in being a husband and father, has had enough. She's

> > all but

> > > > > ready for a divorce. If we were not committed and believing

> > Christians,

> > > > > she would have divorced me some years ago, and I think that I would

> > have

> > > > > emotionally withdrawn by using divorce as an escape. But despite our

> > > > > beliefs, she really feels that she and the kids will be a lot

> > healthier

> > > > > with as little of me as possible. And in many ways I understand this

> > --

> > > > > though it is very painful.

> > > > >

> > > > > All of this to say -- has anyone out there gone through a similar

> > > > > situation? If so -- how did it work out? Do you have any advice?

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks!!!!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Dana

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

>

> All of this to say -- has anyone out there gone through a similar

> situation? If so -- how did it work out? Do you have any advice?

A lot of people with BPD parents end up with unhappy personal relationships

later in life, too...either due to our own fleas or to the fact that we are

attracted to BPD behaviors, or both.

The very best thing you can do to overcome these patterns is to find yourself a

therapist who is familiar with BPD and how it affects families.

I wish you the best.

Sveta