How Do You Tell Them? Or Don't You?

[Guest guest]

Hello,

I've just read 'Understanding The Borderline Mother' and have know now that both

mum and sister are BPD. I don't know whether I can pretend not to know, and also

my sister has 2 young boys, so I think it would be unfair not to say anything.

Especially because my sister is probably BPD because she was the all-bad child

when we were really young. She then bullied me until recently, when I told her

that I no-longer wanted a relationship with her. My was fine with this bullying,

and it was her lack of understanding that finally (I'm 36) led me to this

website

HALELUJA!

Any feedback on how to approach this tricky subject would be appreciated

Many thanks,

RM

[Guest guest]

That's the million-dollar question: what do you do when you suspect that a

relative or a friend has borderline pd, and may be abusing or neglecting his or

her children?

Its easier if the issue is just between yourself and the friend/relative with

bpd and there are no children involved on either side. Then, its just a matter

of deciding for yourself whether you can tolerate limited contact with

boundaries firmly in place, or whether you need to go No Contact either

temporarily or permanently.

Telling someone that you think they have a mental illness usually doesn't go

over very well, and can even make things much, much worse.

It usually works better to simply decide, on your own, how you are going to

respond to their abusive, dysfunctional behaviors.

If you decide that you need to remain in some contact, then, you'll be choosing

which boundaries to set. For example, you are on the phone with your bpd mom

and she starts saying ugly, untrue things about your husband. So, your boundary

might go something like, " Mom, I'm not going to listen to you when you say

ugly, untrue things about my husband. I'm going to hang up now. Perhaps we can

talk again later when there is something else you wish to discuss with me. " or

" I can hear that you are upset, but I can't talk with you when you are crying

and hysterical; I truly don't know how to help you. I'm going to hang up now,

and we can talk again later when you are calm. " or " I hear how upset you are,

mother, but I am not trained or experienced to help you if you are feeling

suicidal. I'm going to hang up the phone now and I want you to call 911; the

operator will stay on the line with you until the ambulance arrives. The

ambulance will be there much more quickly than I can and the paramedics will

know how to help you. "

But when there are minor children in the picture, that's a truly enormous

decision to make. If you have actually witnessed or know of serious emotional

or physical abusive behaviors toward the children or serious physical/emotional

neglect of the children more than once, if the bpd parent is also a substance

abuser or the parent is subjecting his or her children to frequent changes of

sexual partners in the home (a possible indicator of sexual abuse of the

children) I would consider calling in a report to Child Protective Services.

But if there is no other relatively mentally healthy adult in the home who can

take full responsibility for the children, and the children have no place to go

except into foster care, then that could end up being even worse for them.

Its so hard to know what to do that will actually be in the best interest of

minor children when you suspect they are being abused or neglected by their own

parent(s).

I wish I had something more insightful and helpful to say, I truly do.

I guess the only thing you can do is to keep a journal and start noting dates,

times, places, etc. that you believe indicate that the children are being abused

or neglected. Or perhaps talk to those who may have the ability to intervene,

such as the spouse or ex-spouse, as long as that individual is relatively safe,

responsible and mentally healthy, or I guess the last resort is to collect your

evidence and make a report to CPS.

-Annie

>

> Hello,

> I've just read 'Understanding The Borderline Mother' and have know now that

both mum and sister are BPD. I don't know whether I can pretend not to know, and

also my sister has 2 young boys, so I think it would be unfair not to say

anything. Especially because my sister is probably BPD because she was the

all-bad child when we were really young. She then bullied me until recently,

when I told her that I no-longer wanted a relationship with her. My was fine

with this bullying, and it was her lack of understanding that finally (I'm 36)

led me to this website

> HALELUJA!

> Any feedback on how to approach this tricky subject would be appreciated

> Many thanks,

> RM

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Annie and Everyone else too,

I'm finding that it's a difficult thing to come to terms with, although I knew

something was definitely wrong for a long time - I just didn't know what it was?

Now it's both a blessing to finally know and also a curse - because, you wish it

wasn't true and that everything was normal. If I tell my mum, I'm afraid that

she won't be able to deal with it - and that she'll say It's me who's mentally

ill!..The other thing is that my mum isn't nearly so bad now, apart from the odd

flare-up. She is guarded though, but acts confused and plays the victim when

confronted. If I tell her, she might find it easier to cut me off completely? So

do I tell one without the other?

My sister isn't talking to me and her husband asked me not to contact her, after

we (sis and me) had an argument on the 'phone a few weeks ago. I respect sister

and husbands wishes for no contact. Sisters husband thankfully is a really nice

guy and I think he struggles with my sister sometimes.

I want to tell him because it would help him to know and then perhaps

(hopefully?) my sister and he can get the right sort of help?

My sister has had various counseling in the past, but I don't think they have

diagnosed her with BPD. As for the boys, I know that my sister shouts at them a

lot, but I'm hoping that that is all it is. She did attend a parenting class,

which of course is great - so I just hope that it's just me that she vents her

anger on?

Q. If you remove yourself out of the BPD's life (my sister), does that person

get angry with someone else instead? Do they have a NEED to rage at someone?

My sister identifies with the eldest boy because she says he has to be in charge

and know what is going on. Sister is controlling too, so I guess they have a few

power struggles? She says the youngest one is like me, quiet and

easy-going....But she bullied me, so..?

I feel really sad about it all. I was just plain old angry and confused when I

found this site a few weeks ago. Now I realize that mum and sister are damaged

and although between them they made my life awful, which I know I didn't deserve

- no one does, I just want to try to make things better - otherwise it may just

carry on - like the way my mum passed it on to my sister - through relentless

abuse - physical and then more emotional.

I keep thinking about sending them each a book about BPD, then they can either

read it or throw it away and probably blame me anyway! But at least then they'll

know the truth.

I have read 'Understanding the Borderline Mother' but not 'Walking On Eggshells'

- so maybe the answers are in there???

Thanks for reading, please let me know what you think.

RB xx.

[Guest guest]

Hi Annie,

Thanks this all sounds like sound advice! I need to figure out the setting

boundaries and like you say how to respond to their abusive dysfunctional

behaviours or whether to go no-contact. My head is in a real spin about it all.

As I was reading the book on Personality Disorders I even thought that

ex-boyfriends and friends have Personality Disorders, and it's like a filter has

been removed from my eyes/mind and I can see more clearly. It's a lot to take in

and I want to find out more, but I also feel scared and vulnerable like I did

when I was a child. I guess those feelings got buried a long time ago, but not

completely.

I'm getting married in July and want to just be looking forward to that. It was

mums reaction to me suggesting that I didn't want to invite my sister that led

to me finding this site. Any tips on how deal with the feelings as well as the

BPD's? Perhaps the journal would be good for this too!

I probably need a therapist! I'm also not sure if I'm CPSD? As I feel very

wobbly emotionally at the moment, but trying to stay positive and focus on my

lovely daughter and husband-to-be. I feel so angry with mum, then I read one of

her nice emails and think how lovely she is. I think this is the hardest thing

I've ever had to deal with - as I'm sure everyone on this site can understand.

Sorry it's all a bit me me me! Hope alls well with you?

xxRB

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Tuesday, 17 April 2012, 5:08

Subject: Re: How Do You Tell Them? Or Don't You?

Â

That's the million-dollar question: what do you do when you suspect that a

relative or a friend has borderline pd, and may be abusing or neglecting his or

her children?

Its easier if the issue is just between yourself and the friend/relative with

bpd and there are no children involved on either side. Then, its just a matter

of deciding for yourself whether you can tolerate limited contact with

boundaries firmly in place, or whether you need to go No Contact either

temporarily or permanently.

Telling someone that you think they have a mental illness usually doesn't go

over very well, and can even make things much, much worse.

It usually works better to simply decide, on your own, how you are going to

respond to their abusive, dysfunctional behaviors.

If you decide that you need to remain in some contact, then, you'll be choosing

which boundaries to set. For example, you are on the phone with your bpd mom

and she starts saying ugly, untrue things about your husband. So, your boundary

might go something like, " Mom, I'm not going to listen to you when you say

ugly, untrue things about my husband. I'm going to hang up now. Perhaps we can

talk again later when there is something else you wish to discuss with me. " or

" I can hear that you are upset, but I can't talk with you when you are crying

and hysterical; I truly don't know how to help you. I'm going to hang up now,

and we can talk again later when you are calm. " or " I hear how upset you are,

mother, but I am not trained or experienced to help you if you are feeling

suicidal. I'm going to hang up the phone now and I want you to call 911; the

operator will stay on the line with you until the ambulance arrives. The

ambulance will be there

much more quickly than I can and the paramedics will know how to help you. "

But when there are minor children in the picture, that's a truly enormous

decision to make. If you have actually witnessed or know of serious emotional

or physical abusive behaviors toward the children or serious physical/emotional

neglect of the children more than once, if the bpd parent is also a substance

abuser or the parent is subjecting his or her children to frequent changes of

sexual partners in the home (a possible indicator of sexual abuse of the

children) I would consider calling in a report to Child Protective Services.

But if there is no other relatively mentally healthy adult in the home who can

take full responsibility for the children, and the children have no place to go

except into foster care, then that could end up being even worse for them.

Its so hard to know what to do that will actually be in the best interest of

minor children when you suspect they are being abused or neglected by their own

parent(s).

I wish I had something more insightful and helpful to say, I truly do.

I guess the only thing you can do is to keep a journal and start noting dates,

times, places, etc. that you believe indicate that the children are being abused

or neglected. Or perhaps talk to those who may have the ability to intervene,

such as the spouse or ex-spouse, as long as that individual is relatively safe,

responsible and mentally healthy, or I guess the last resort is to collect your

evidence and make a report to CPS.

-Annie

>

> Hello,

> I've just read 'Understanding The Borderline Mother' and have know now that

both mum and sister are BPD. I don't know whether I can pretend not to know, and

also my sister has 2 young boys, so I think it would be unfair not to say

anything. Especially because my sister is probably BPD because she was the

all-bad child when we were really young. She then bullied me until recently,

when I told her that I no-longer wanted a relationship with her. My was fine

with this bullying, and it was her lack of understanding that finally (I'm 36)

led me to this website

> HALELUJA!

> Any feedback on how to approach this tricky subject would be appreciated

> Many thanks,

> RM

>

[Guest guest]

Agreed Annie.

In my experience it is less than productive to tell a BP they are, or

that you think they are. It will be ammunition against you for years.

Even a T , should they choose therapy, often has a hard time convincing

them that there is indeed a problem, or a need for change.

On the subject of a mom with minor children, it is a tough one. As KO s

, we all lived through the stuff. I am particularly sensistive to the

idea that children of BP moms are always neglected and abused to some

extent. Sadly, though, the type of abuse we suffered is not readily

recognized. If it were up to me, any mom with BP would be required to

have a social worker assigned, and have a safety plan, and to be in

therapy. Otherwise, children would be better off , well hell, anywhere.

The official world, courts, sw, and such, do not recognize BP for the

cruel , biting thing it is to those forced to live around it. I can

understand that, since they have so many horrible abuse cases, the

constant biting bullshit we deal with takes a back seat.

It is a conundrum.

Doug

> >

> > Hello,

> > I've just read 'Understanding The Borderline Mother' and have know

now that both mum and sister are BPD. I don't know whether I can pretend

not to know, and also my sister has 2 young boys, so I think it would be

unfair not to say anything. Especially because my sister is probably BPD

because she was the all-bad child when we were really young. She then

bullied me until recently, when I told her that I no-longer wanted a

relationship with her. My was fine with this bullying, and it was her

lack of understanding that finally (I'm 36) led me to this website

> > HALELUJA!

> > Any feedback on how to approach this tricky subject would be

appreciated

> > Many thanks,

> > RM

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi there. From your language usage, it sounds as though you're not in the

'States? I'm not sure what the laws are like where you are, but here in the

U.S., proving mental/emotional child abuse is pretty difficult, I think.

Physical child abuse is much easier. So, that might be something to consider;

whether or not the law of the land is on your side or not. Because I agree with

other posters--there's probably no point in telling your sister that you think

she's BPD. Most BPDs won't EVER admit it or get help for it.

>

> Hello,

> I've just read 'Understanding The Borderline Mother' and have know now that

both mum and sister are BPD. I don't know whether I can pretend not to know, and

also my sister has 2 young boys, so I think it would be unfair not to say

anything. Especially because my sister is probably BPD because she was the

all-bad child when we were really young. She then bullied me until recently,

when I told her that I no-longer wanted a relationship with her. My was fine

with this bullying, and it was her lack of understanding that finally (I'm 36)

led me to this website

> HALELUJA!

> Any feedback on how to approach this tricky subject would be appreciated

> Many thanks,

> RM

>