Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

[Guest guest]

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Even I want to know. I have been recommended to give it a try as opposed to Tomatis but before dumping money, I want first hand experience.

 

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

__

[Guest guest]

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

 

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

 

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.sally To: mb12valtrex Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Sally:what was the intensity of training your son did with Fast Forward---I mean howmany hours each day for howmany days each week for howmany months?Thanks.Ratan Singh, Phone: 91 141 4022609, 098281 99856, mail: ratanpsych@..., Consultant in Nutritional & Neuro-behavioural Psychology, Jaipur Hospital- Certificate in Food & Nutrition; Diploma in Nutrition and Health Education; Life Member, Nutrition Soc. of India; Member ISOM- Author of "Nutrition & Supplements in Major Mental Illnesses";- M.A. (Psychol), Postgraduate Diploma in Medical & Social Psychology, Ph.D.;- Certified Behavior Therapist (from late Prof. J. Wolpe's Unit, Temple Univ Med School, USA);- www.RegainMentalHealth.com/ www.jaipurmart.com/trade/meditationandhealthTo: mb12valtrex From: saverkamp@...Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 20:06:06 -0700Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.sally To: mb12valtrex Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

How and where do I find this Sent from my iPhone

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.sally To: mb12valtrex Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

=

[Guest guest]

Ratan,I think it was an hour a day (not sure about that) but it was everyday and he did it for about 6 months. Then we did Fast Forward 2 for another 3 months, maybe. Not as many results from that.It was very hard at the time: plenty of meltdowns, avoidance tactics, etc. He was on anxiety meds at the time.Life is so much better now, he has come a long way and is doing fairly well (no more meds) and continues to improve.sally To: mb12valtrex Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 7:47 AM Subject: RE: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Sally:what was the intensity of training your son did with Fast Forward---I mean howmany hours each day for howmany days each week for howmany months?Thanks.Ratan Singh, Phone: 91 141 4022609, 098281 99856, mail: ratanpsych@..., Consultant in Nutritional & Neuro-behavioural Psychology, Jaipur Hospital- Certificate in Food & Nutrition; Diploma in Nutrition and Health Education; Life Member, Nutrition Soc. of India; Member ISOM- Author of "Nutrition & Supplements in Major Mental Illnesses";- M.A. (Psychol), Postgraduate Diploma in Medical & Social Psychology, Ph.D.;- Certified Behavior Therapist (from late Prof. J. Wolpe's Unit, Temple Univ Med School, USA);- www.RegainMentalHealth.com/ www.jaipurmart.com/trade/meditationandhealthTo: mb12valtrex From: saverkamp@...Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 20:06:06 -0700Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.sally To: mb12valtrex Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

What is Fast Forward? Is it something like AIT?

>

> We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.

>

> My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did

not do as much.

>

> I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer

than normal.

>

>

> sally

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: mb12valtrex

> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM

> Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

>

>

> Â

> Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

>

[Guest guest]

http://www.innovative-therapies.com/fastforward.htmThere are other website about it also.sally To: mb12valtrex Sent: Monday, May 28, 2012 7:34 PM Subject:

Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

What is Fast Forward? Is it something like AIT?

>

> We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.

>

> My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

>

> I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.

>

>

> sally

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: mb12valtrex

> Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM

> Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

>

>

> Â

> Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Sally,DS has a similar problem. Still his receptive language is far better than expressive language. Plus, he doesn't like to put on headphones (or helmet) so I am not too sure if I go Fast Forward way, how to work it out.

Thanks,Noel

 

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.

After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.

sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

 

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

 

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

 

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Hi noel,We have considered fastforward but haven't tried it yet bc of the cost. I have a friend who tried it with her 8 or 9 yr old with minor auditory processing issues. She said she didn't see much. I recently ordered earobics...have read about it in the past and recently discussed with a speech therapist...it is "only" 60 to 90 dollars so much better than the fastforward cost...i will still consider fastforward down the road if my son's auditory processing doesn't resolve...i think biomedical has been helping it alot over the past year so want to wait to see if fastforward is still necessary in a year...my son also had helmet/earphone issues a year ago but this has greatly improved...i wouldn't try fastforward until this resolves or you could be throwing alot of cash out the window. -- Sent from my Palm Pre

Thanks Sally,DS has a similar problem. Still his receptive language is far better than expressive language. Plus, he doesn't like to put on headphones (or helmet) so I am not too sure if I go Fast Forward way, how to work it out.

Thanks,Noel

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.

After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.

sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Hi ,Honestly, cost is not an issue. Not that I am a millionaire but I can earn money down the line, the time lost now can not be earned. My concern is, I don't find scientific proof for this stuff, even the articles published on this stuff looks to me like statistics tweaked to show positive results and hence the snake oil.

I wonder how do you figure out if DS has auditory processing issues? I would be happy if you could be little didactic (if your time permits)I will look into eaerobics. I recently met an OT offering Tomatis ($8000 for 30 sessions, in NY) and she was explaining me as if this is THE solution to all problems and I was in my mind, you have no idea of my education and my homework,, just an example how some people try to make money out of your situation, just so annoying.

Noel

 

Hi noel,We have considered fastforward but haven't tried it yet bc of the cost. I have a friend who tried it with her 8 or 9 yr old with minor auditory processing issues. She said she didn't see much. I recently ordered earobics...have read about it in the past and recently discussed with a speech therapist...it is " only " 60 to 90 dollars so much better than the fastforward cost...i will still consider fastforward down the road if my son's auditory processing doesn't resolve...i think biomedical has been helping it alot over the past year so want to wait to see if fastforward is still necessary in a year...my son also had helmet/earphone issues a year ago but this has greatly improved...i wouldn't try fastforward until this resolves or you could be throwing alot of cash out the window. 

-- Sent from my Palm Pre

 

Thanks Sally,DS has a similar problem. Still his receptive language is far better than expressive language. Plus, he doesn't like to put on headphones (or helmet) so I am not too sure if I go Fast Forward way, how to work it out.

Thanks,Noel

 

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.

After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.

sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

 

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

 

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

 

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Noel,I'm not but I do wish to comment. Our son used to have approximately 4 second delay in his response to a verbal request (based upon daily data collection in our intensive therapy program).In the past year and a half that has gone away. Sometimes he takes a bit longer to process the verbal input before he acts- particularly when it's late, and he's tired. Our behaviorist descibed what was happening as an auditory professing issue. We did not pursue actual testing, although this can be done ( it's a little too similar to the EEG and I hope to not have tob relive that one!) When we first had his hearing checked at Duke Childrens Hospital, they had the technology in house to test the brain's response to sound. I'll bet they still do.Hope this helps!Sent from my iPhoneOn May 31, 2012, at

9:30 AM, Noel Mathur wrote:

Hi ,Honestly, cost is not an issue. Not that I am a millionaire but I can earn money down the line, the time lost now can not be earned. My concern is, I don't find scientific proof for this stuff, even the articles published on this stuff looks to me like statistics tweaked to show positive results and hence the snake oil.

I wonder how do you figure out if DS has auditory processing issues? I would be happy if you could be little didactic (if your time permits)I will look into eaerobics. I recently met an OT offering Tomatis ($8000 for 30 sessions, in NY) and she was explaining me as if this is THE solution to all problems and I was in my mind, you have no idea of my education and my homework,, just an example how some people try to make money out of your situation, just so annoying.

Noel

Hi noel,We have considered fastforward but haven't tried it yet bc of the cost. I have a friend who tried it with her 8 or 9 yr old with minor auditory processing issues. She said she didn't see much. I recently ordered earobics...have read about it in the past and recently discussed with a speech therapist...it is "only" 60 to 90 dollars so much better than the fastforward cost...i will still consider fastforward down the road if my son's auditory processing doesn't resolve...i think biomedical has been helping it alot over the past year so want to wait to see if fastforward is still necessary in a year...my son also had helmet/earphone issues a year ago but this has greatly improved...i wouldn't try fastforward until this resolves or you could be throwing alot of cash out the window.

-- Sent from my Palm Pre

Thanks Sally,DS has a similar problem. Still his receptive language is far better than expressive language. Plus, he doesn't like to put on headphones (or helmet) so I am not too sure if I go Fast Forward way, how to work it out.

Thanks,Noel

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.

After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.

sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Just for clarification we have not used fast forwardSent from my iPhone

Noel,I'm not but I do wish to comment. Our son used to have approximately 4 second delay in his response to a verbal request (based upon daily data collection in our intensive therapy program).In the past year and a half that has gone away. Sometimes he takes a bit longer to process the verbal input before he acts- particularly when it's late, and he's tired. Our behaviorist descibed what was happening as an auditory professing issue. We did not pursue actual testing, although this can be done ( it's a little too similar to the EEG and I hope to not have tob relive that one!) When we first had his hearing checked at Duke Childrens Hospital, they had the technology in house to test the brain's response to sound. I'll bet they still do.Hope this helps!Sent from my iPhoneOn May 31, 2012, at

9:30 AM, Noel Mathur wrote:

Hi ,Honestly, cost is not an issue. Not that I am a millionaire but I can earn money down the line, the time lost now can not be earned. My concern is, I don't find scientific proof for this stuff, even the articles published on this stuff looks to me like statistics tweaked to show positive results and hence the snake oil.

I wonder how do you figure out if DS has auditory processing issues? I would be happy if you could be little didactic (if your time permits)I will look into eaerobics. I recently met an OT offering Tomatis ($8000 for 30 sessions, in NY) and she was explaining me as if this is THE solution to all problems and I was in my mind, you have no idea of my education and my homework,, just an example how some people try to make money out of your situation, just so annoying.

Noel

Hi noel,We have considered fastforward but haven't tried it yet bc of the cost. I have a friend who tried it with her 8 or 9 yr old with minor auditory processing issues. She said she didn't see much. I recently ordered earobics...have read about it in the past and recently discussed with a speech therapist...it is "only" 60 to 90 dollars so much better than the fastforward cost...i will still consider fastforward down the road if my son's auditory processing doesn't resolve...i think biomedical has been helping it alot over the past year so want to wait to see if fastforward is still necessary in a year...my son also had helmet/earphone issues a year ago but this has greatly improved...i wouldn't try fastforward until this resolves or you could be throwing alot of cash out the window.

-- Sent from my Palm Pre

Thanks Sally,DS has a similar problem. Still his receptive language is far better than expressive language. Plus, he doesn't like to put on headphones (or helmet) so I am not too sure if I go Fast Forward way, how to work it out.

Thanks,Noel

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.

After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.

sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

Check out Vital Sounds listening therapy. It's less expensive than most and portable - you can do it at home or anywhere. You do have to do it through an SLP or OT who is trained, though. It was very effective for my two children.RuthSent from my iPad

Noel,I'm not but I do wish to comment. Our son used to have approximately 4 second delay in his response to a verbal request (based upon daily data collection in our intensive therapy program).In the past year and a half that has gone away. Sometimes he takes a bit longer to process the verbal input before he acts- particularly when it's late, and he's tired. Our behaviorist descibed what was happening as an auditory professing issue. We did not pursue actual testing, although this can be done ( it's a little too similar to the EEG and I hope to not have tob relive that one!) When we first had his hearing checked at Duke Childrens Hospital, they had the technology in house to test the brain's response to sound. I'll bet they still do.Hope this helps!Sent from my iPhoneOn May 31, 2012, at

9:30 AM, Noel Mathur wrote:

Hi ,Honestly, cost is not an issue. Not that I am a millionaire but I can earn money down the line, the time lost now can not be earned. My concern is, I don't find scientific proof for this stuff, even the articles published on this stuff looks to me like statistics tweaked to show positive results and hence the snake oil.

I wonder how do you figure out if DS has auditory processing issues? I would be happy if you could be little didactic (if your time permits)I will look into eaerobics. I recently met an OT offering Tomatis ($8000 for 30 sessions, in NY) and she was explaining me as if this is THE solution to all problems and I was in my mind, you have no idea of my education and my homework,, just an example how some people try to make money out of your situation, just so annoying.

Noel

Hi noel,We have considered fastforward but haven't tried it yet bc of the cost. I have a friend who tried it with her 8 or 9 yr old with minor auditory processing issues. She said she didn't see much. I recently ordered earobics...have read about it in the past and recently discussed with a speech therapist...it is "only" 60 to 90 dollars so much better than the fastforward cost...i will still consider fastforward down the road if my son's auditory processing doesn't resolve...i think biomedical has been helping it alot over the past year so want to wait to see if fastforward is still necessary in a year...my son also had helmet/earphone issues a year ago but this has greatly improved...i wouldn't try fastforward until this resolves or you could be throwing alot of cash out the window.

-- Sent from my Palm Pre

Thanks Sally,DS has a similar problem. Still his receptive language is far better than expressive language. Plus, he doesn't like to put on headphones (or helmet) so I am not too sure if I go Fast Forward way, how to work it out.

Thanks,Noel

Noel,My son did not seem to understand what was said to him. This was particularly apparent in telephone conversations. He would just not respond when the person on the phone asked him questions. He did not seem to understand what they were asking.

After Fast Forward, his second grade teacher noticed that he was laughing at jokes in her class and was more engaged. Fast Forward did not solve all his problems but it did help him.

sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 6:00 AM Subject: Re: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Could you please elaborate on 'auditory problem' and how it helped him.How did you guys figure that out, in terms of symptoms and if you had a diagnosis from ENT?Thanks in advance.

We did Fast Forward and Fast Forward 2 about 10 years ago.My son really had an auditory problem and it helped him. Fast Forward 2 did not do as much.

I remember the cost was about $1,800 or $2,000. It took several months, longer than normal.sally

To: mb12valtrex

Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 4:15 PM Subject: Can anyone share their experience with Fast Forward?

Has anyone done Fast ForwRd?

[Guest guest]

,

Have you seen this area improve while you have tried to reduce oxalate in your

child?

Years ago research done on cats found altered evoked auditory potentials when

vitamin B6 was made deficient. B6 deficiencies raise body levels of oxalate

because of how the deficiency impairs the same enzyme that is broken in the

genetic disease, primary hyperoxaluria. There are something like 21 studies

looking at the benefits of B6 therapy in autism.

I don't know how familiar people here are with what has been studied about

oxalate's effects on neurons. I've put a study below which is a review of that

area, because this has been studied quite a bit.

Scientists wanted to understand the neurotoxicity that develops from using a

cancer drug called oxaliplatin. (One of our listmates on TLO said this week

that her mom had used this drug for cancer, and developed neurotoxicity and

serious bladder pain, as well.)

In oxaliplatin, oxalate is used as the delivery system for platinum. Platinum,

not the oxalate, is the active part against the cancer.

Toxicologists found out that the neurotoxicity from this drug came from the

oxalate it released into the blood. You can see in the abstract below, that

what the oxalate altered was leading to decreased cellular metabolism in the

nerve and new problems with axoplasmatic transport and problems with sodium

channels in the nerve that stem from oxalate's disruption of calcium within the

nerve.

The role oxalate takes in the delays of processing and how it contributes to

confusions in brain processing in autism has yet to be studied, but at least now

we have a feel for the prevalence of oxalate issues in autism. The commonness of

being high in oxalate in autism was studied in Poland and published this last

year in the European Journal of Paediatric Neurology. I've put its abstract

below.

The study contains a chart where oxalate in blood and urine was measured in 36

children with autism selected to have the least obvious risk for having an

oxalate problem. They were compared to 60 control children. (By low risk, I

mean these children were not on a special diet that might have increased

oxalate, they did not have a diagnosis of bowel inflammation, they had not

recently been on antibiotics, they had no seizures, and they came from families

with no risks of kidney stones.)

Only one autism child's values in blood and urine overlapped in both areas with

ANY of the 60 control children. That one child was just on the very outer edge

of the control children. The remaining 35 out of 36 children with autism were

higher than all the control children in blood or urine. The children with autism

as a group were three times higher in blood and two and a half times higher in

urine than the healthy controls.

This study tells us that despite the assumptions of many people who never test

their autism patients for oxalate, oxalate is by no means a " fringe " issue in

autism.

The studies of how oxalate effects neurons makes sense of why, when we started

the Autism Oxalate Project, we kept hearing from parents about how their

children improved neurologically in areas like speech, complex thinking, gross

and fine motor tasks, and especially sociability (the key improvement noted by

parents in a survey). Many parents reported that they saw a big change in their

child's ability to initiate action, whether motor skills (like speech) or even

thought.

The science to explain these changes exists, but a lot of practitioners don't

know the science in this area. That happened because some leaders in the DAN!

movement thought oxalate couldn't be an issue in autism because there was no

increased reports of kidney stones. They sent out the message to the doctors

that there was no point in looking at it further except in patients that had

urinary complaints, and many doctors thought there was no reason to test for

oxalate, so they never did.

That is specifically why the EJPN study looked to see if children with autism

were at increased risk for kidney stones or if that had anything to do with who

would end up being high in oxalate. It didn't.

In order to get an objective look at this issue, our project sought out a

scientific team that would have the highest qualifications in the world for

looking at this. Because of their previous work in studying pediatric oxalate

issues in children with kidney disease we found a team from Poland had the

perfect track record we needed. We talked to them about what needed to be

studied, and after doing their own pilot study where they were astonished at the

results, they secured their own funding to do this study.

The study employed a test used by nephrologists to assess risk of kidney stones,

the BRI index, which this team had used in a previous huge study of normal

children. This test showed that despite their very high levels of oxalate in

urine and blood, the children with autism had no increased risk for developing

kidney stones...but they were VERY high in oxalate.

Because of those orginal comments from leadership many doctors are still not

looking at the scientific issues and haven't considered the implications of this

study from Poland. (If your doctor has been " down " about looking at the oxalate

issue, ask him what he knows about the study from Poland or if he is aware how

oxalate contributes to neurotoxicity, bowel disease, metabolic disruptions,

mitochondrial dysfunction, etc.)

I look forward to the day when we can use assessment tools like Fast Forward or

other tests of neuronal function to establish what changes as oxalate levels are

reduced. I hope those here will be encouraged by the progress that is being

made scientifically in this area.

Cancer Treat Rev. 2008 Jun;34(4):368-77. Epub 2008 Feb 20.

A review on oxaliplatin-induced peripheral nerve damage.

Argyriou AA, Polychronopoulos P, Iconomou G, Chroni E, Kalofonos HP.

Source

Department of Neurology, EMG Laboratory, University of Patras Medical School,

Rion-Patras, Greece.

Abstract

Platinum compounds are a class of chemotherapy agents that posses a broad

spectrum of activity against several solid malignancies. Oxaliplatin (OXL) is a

third-generation organoplatinum compound with significant activity mainly

against colorectal cancer (CRC). Peripheral neuropathy is a well recognized

toxicity of OXL, usually resulting in dose modification. OXL induces two types

of peripheral neuropathy; acute and chronic. The acute oxaliplatin-induced

peripheral neuropathy (OXLIPN) may be linked to the rapid chelation of calcium

by OXL-induced oxalate and OXL is capable of altering the voltage-gated sodium

channels through a pathway involving calcium ions. On the other hand, decreased

cellular metabolism and axoplasmatic transport resulting from the accumulation

of OXL in the dorsal root ganglia cells is the most widely accepted mechanism of

chronic oxaliplatin-induced peripheral neuropathy (OXLIPN). As a result, OXL

produces a symmetric, axonal, sensory distal primary neuronopathy without motor

involvement. The incidence of OXLIPN is usually related to various risk factors,

including treatment schedule, dosage, cumulative dose and time of infusion. The

assessment of OXLIPN is primarily based on neurologic clinical examination and

quantitative methods, such as nerve conduction study. To date, several

neuroprotective agents including thiols, neurotrophic factors, anticonvulsants

and antioxidants have been tested for their ability to prevent OXLIPN. However,

the clinical data are still controversial. We herein review and discuss the

pathogenesis, incidence, risk factors, diagnosis, characteristics and management

of OXLIPN. We also highlight areas of future research.

PMID:

18281158

1. Br Med J. 1975 May 10;2(5966):312-3.

Progressive peripheral neuropathy in patient with primary hyperoxaluria.

Moorhead PJ, DJ, Timperley WR.

In a patient suffering from primary hyperoxaluria with oxalosis a progressive

peripheral neuropathy was associated with intra-axonal deposition of

microcrystals of calcium oxalate. Probably his neuropathy was the result of

mechanical obstruction of axoplasmic flow.

PMCID: PMC1681919

PMID: 48397 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

1. Eur J Paediatr Neurol. 2011 Sep 10. [Epub ahead of print]

A potential pathogenic role of oxalate in autism.

Konstantynowicz J, Porowski T, Zoch-Zwierz W, Wasilewska J, Kadziela-Olech H,

Kulak W, Owens SC, Piotrowska-Jastrzebska J, Kaczmarski M.

Department of Pediatrics and Developmental Disorders, Medical University of

Bialystok, Poland.

BACKGROUND: Although autistic spectrum disorders (ASD) are a strongly genetic

condition certain metabolic disturbances may contribute to clinical features.

Metabolism of oxalate in children with ASD has not yet been studied. AIM: The

objective was to determine oxalate levels in plasma and urine in autistic

children in relation to other urinary parameters. METHOD: In this

cross-sectional

study, plasma oxalate (using enzymatic method with oxalate oxidase) and

spontaneous urinary calcium oxalate (CaOx) crystallization (based on the

Bonn-Risk-Index, BRI) were determined in 36 children and adolescents with ASD

(26

boys, 10 girls) aged 2-18 years and compared with 60 healthy non-autistic

children matched by age, gender and anthropometric traits. RESULTS: Children

with

ASD demonstrated 3-fold greater plasma oxalate levels [5.60 (5th-95th

percentile:

3.47-7.51)] compared with reference [(1.84 (5th-95th percentile: 0.50-4.70)

& #956;mol/L (p < 0.05)] and 2.5-fold greater urinary oxalate concentrations

(p < 0.05). No differences between the two groups were found in urinary pH,

citraturia, calciuria or adjusted CaOx crystallization rates based on BRI.

Despite significant hyperoxaluria no evidence of kidney stone disease or

lithogenic risk was observed in these individuals. CONCLUSIONS: Hyperoxalemia

and

hyperoxaluria may be involved in the pathogenesis of ASD in children. Whether

this is a result of impaired renal excretion or an extensive intestinal

absorption, or both, or whether Ox may cross the blood brain barrier and disturb

CNS function in the autistic children remains unclear. This appears to be the

first report of plasma and urinary oxalate in childhood autism.

Copyright © 2011 European Paediatric Neurology Society. Published by Elsevier

Ltd. All rights reserved.

PMID: 21911305 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

1. J Nutr. 1993 Jan;123(1):20-6.

Brainstem auditory evoked potential interwave intervals are prolonged in vitamin

B-6-deficient cats.

Buckmaster PS, Holliday TA, Bai SC, QR.

Department of Surgery, School of Veterinary Medicine, University of California,

95616.

Vitamin B-6 deficiency has been reported to produce behavioral,

neurophysiological and neuropathological abnormalities in a variety of species.

In this investigation we used brainstem auditory evoked potentials (BAEP) to

determine if vitamin B-6 deficiency in cats affected peripheral and brainstem

auditory pathways. Brainstem auditory evoked potentials were recorded from

growing cats as they developed vitamin B-6 deficiency, which was confirmed using

clinical, hematological and urinary criteria. The BAEP interwave intervals

measured from early (wave 1 or 1N) to late waves (5N) or from middle (wave 3) to

late waves increased significantly, whereas interwave intervals from early to

middle waves did not differ significantly. These results indicate that vitamin

B-6 deficiency affects one or more structures of the brainstem that generate the

later parts of the BAEP. The finding of prolonged interwave intervals in vitamin

B-6-deficient animals is consistent with slowed axonal conduction velocity

secondary to defective myelination. Recording BAEP provided a noninvasive means

of detecting effects of vitamin B-6 deficiency on specific parts of the central

nervous system.

PMID: 8421226 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

>

> Noel,

>

> I'm not but I do wish to comment. Our son used to have approximately 4

second delay in his response to a verbal request (based upon daily data

collection in our intensive therapy program).In the past year and a half that

has gone away. Sometimes he takes a bit longer to process the verbal input

before he acts- particularly when it's late, and he's tired.

>

> Our behaviorist descibed what was happening as an auditory professing issue.

We did not pursue actual testing, although this can be done ( it's a little too

similar to the EEG and I hope to not have tob relive that one!) When we first

had his hearing checked at Duke Childrens Hospital, they had the technology in

house to test the brain's response to sound. I'll bet they still do.

> Hope this helps!

>

>

>

> Sent from my iPhone

[Guest guest]

,Wow - very interesting!Yes. The change took place during the period between our first OAT test and the second. The first OAT showed high oxalates and the second did not. We did supplement with 200 mg B6 daily after the first OAT. He self selects a low oxalate diet but was clearly creating endegenous oxalate The other things that I think affected this were reducing noise sensitivity with magnesium - Epsom salts and mg taurate- treating parasites and adding vinpocetine.Thanks for citing these studies. You are always a weath of knowledge (and pertinent studies to back it up).Thanks!! Sent from my iPhoneOn May 31, 2012, at 2:10 PM, ""

wrote:

,

Have you seen this area improve while you have tried to reduce oxalate in your child?

Years ago research done on cats found altered evoked auditory potentials when vitamin B6 was made deficient. B6 deficiencies raise body levels of oxalate because of how the deficiency impairs the same enzyme that is broken in the genetic disease, primary hyperoxaluria. There are something like 21 studies looking at the benefits of B6 therapy in autism.

I don't know how familiar people here are with what has been studied about oxalate's effects on neurons. I've put a study below which is a review of that area, because this has been studied quite a bit.

Scientists wanted to understand the neurotoxicity that develops from using a cancer drug called oxaliplatin. (One of our listmates on TLO said this week that her mom had used this drug for cancer, and developed neurotoxicity and serious bladder pain, as well.)

In oxaliplatin, oxalate is used as the delivery system for platinum. Platinum, not the oxalate, is the active part against the cancer.

Toxicologists found out that the neurotoxicity from this drug came from the oxalate it released into the blood. You can see in the abstract below, that what the oxalate altered was leading to decreased cellular metabolism in the nerve and new problems with axoplasmatic transport and problems with sodium channels in the nerve that stem from oxalate's disruption of calcium within the nerve.

The role oxalate takes in the delays of processing and how it contributes to confusions in brain processing in autism has yet to be studied, but at least now we have a feel for the prevalence of oxalate issues in autism. The commonness of being high in oxalate in autism was studied in Poland and published this last year in the European Journal of Paediatric Neurology. I've put its abstract below.

The study contains a chart where oxalate in blood and urine was measured in 36 children with autism selected to have the least obvious risk for having an oxalate problem. They were compared to 60 control children. (By low risk, I mean these children were not on a special diet that might have increased oxalate, they did not have a diagnosis of bowel inflammation, they had not recently been on antibiotics, they had no seizures, and they came from families with no risks of kidney stones.)

Only one autism child's values in blood and urine overlapped in both areas with ANY of the 60 control children. That one child was just on the very outer edge of the control children. The remaining 35 out of 36 children with autism were higher than all the control children in blood or urine. The children with autism as a group were three times higher in blood and two and a half times higher in urine than the healthy controls.

This study tells us that despite the assumptions of many people who never test their autism patients for oxalate, oxalate is by no means a "fringe" issue in autism.

The studies of how oxalate effects neurons makes sense of why, when we started the Autism Oxalate Project, we kept hearing from parents about how their children improved neurologically in areas like speech, complex thinking, gross and fine motor tasks, and especially sociability (the key improvement noted by parents in a survey). Many parents reported that they saw a big change in their child's ability to initiate action, whether motor skills (like speech) or even thought.

The science to explain these changes exists, but a lot of practitioners don't know the science in this area. That happened because some leaders in the DAN! movement thought oxalate couldn't be an issue in autism because there was no increased reports of kidney stones. They sent out the message to the doctors that there was no point in looking at it further except in patients that had urinary complaints, and many doctors thought there was no reason to test for oxalate, so they never did.

That is specifically why the EJPN study looked to see if children with autism were at increased risk for kidney stones or if that had anything to do with who would end up being high in oxalate. It didn't.

In order to get an objective look at this issue, our project sought out a scientific team that would have the highest qualifications in the world for looking at this. Because of their previous work in studying pediatric oxalate issues in children with kidney disease we found a team from Poland had the perfect track record we needed. We talked to them about what needed to be studied, and after doing their own pilot study where they were astonished at the results, they secured their own funding to do this study.

The study employed a test used by nephrologists to assess risk of kidney stones, the BRI index, which this team had used in a previous huge study of normal children. This test showed that despite their very high levels of oxalate in urine and blood, the children with autism had no increased risk for developing kidney stones...but they were VERY high in oxalate.

Because of those orginal comments from leadership many doctors are still not looking at the scientific issues and haven't considered the implications of this study from Poland. (If your doctor has been "down" about looking at the oxalate issue, ask him what he knows about the study from Poland or if he is aware how oxalate contributes to neurotoxicity, bowel disease, metabolic disruptions, mitochondrial dysfunction, etc.)

I look forward to the day when we can use assessment tools like Fast Forward or other tests of neuronal function to establish what changes as oxalate levels are reduced. I hope those here will be encouraged by the progress that is being made scientifically in this area.

Cancer Treat Rev. 2008 Jun;34(4):368-77. Epub 2008 Feb 20.

A review on oxaliplatin-induced peripheral nerve damage.

Argyriou AA, Polychronopoulos P, Iconomou G, Chroni E, Kalofonos HP.

Source

Department of Neurology, EMG Laboratory, University of Patras Medical School, Rion-Patras, Greece.

Abstract

Platinum compounds are a class of chemotherapy agents that posses a broad spectrum of activity against several solid malignancies. Oxaliplatin (OXL) is a third-generation organoplatinum compound with significant activity mainly against colorectal cancer (CRC). Peripheral neuropathy is a well recognized toxicity of OXL, usually resulting in dose modification. OXL induces two types of peripheral neuropathy; acute and chronic. The acute oxaliplatin-induced peripheral neuropathy (OXLIPN) may be linked to the rapid chelation of calcium by OXL-induced oxalate and OXL is capable of altering the voltage-gated sodium channels through a pathway involving calcium ions. On the other hand, decreased cellular metabolism and axoplasmatic transport resulting from the accumulation of OXL in the dorsal root ganglia cells is the most widely accepted mechanism of chronic oxaliplatin-induced peripheral neuropathy (OXLIPN). As a result, OXL produces a symmetric, axonal,

sensory distal primary neuronopathy without motor involvement. The incidence of OXLIPN is usually related to various risk factors, including treatment schedule, dosage, cumulative dose and time of infusion. The assessment of OXLIPN is primarily based on neurologic clinical examination and quantitative methods, such as nerve conduction study. To date, several neuroprotective agents including thiols, neurotrophic factors, anticonvulsants and antioxidants have been tested for their ability to prevent OXLIPN. However, the clinical data are still controversial. We herein review and discuss the pathogenesis, incidence, risk factors, diagnosis, characteristics and management of OXLIPN. We also highlight areas of future research.

PMID:

18281158

1. Br Med J. 1975 May 10;2(5966):312-3.

Progressive peripheral neuropathy in patient with primary hyperoxaluria.

Moorhead PJ, DJ, Timperley WR.

In a patient suffering from primary hyperoxaluria with oxalosis a progressive

peripheral neuropathy was associated with intra-axonal deposition of

microcrystals of calcium oxalate. Probably his neuropathy was the result of

mechanical obstruction of axoplasmic flow.

PMCID: PMC1681919

PMID: 48397 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

1. Eur J Paediatr Neurol. 2011 Sep 10. [Epub ahead of print]

A potential pathogenic role of oxalate in autism.

Konstantynowicz J, Porowski T, Zoch-Zwierz W, Wasilewska J, Kadziela-Olech H,

Kulak W, Owens SC, Piotrowska-Jastrzebska J, Kaczmarski M.

Department of Pediatrics and Developmental Disorders, Medical University of

Bialystok, Poland.

BACKGROUND: Although autistic spectrum disorders (ASD) are a strongly genetic

condition certain metabolic disturbances may contribute to clinical features.

Metabolism of oxalate in children with ASD has not yet been studied. AIM: The

objective was to determine oxalate levels in plasma and urine in autistic

children in relation to other urinary parameters. METHOD: In this cross-sectional

study, plasma oxalate (using enzymatic method with oxalate oxidase) and

spontaneous urinary calcium oxalate (CaOx) crystallization (based on the

Bonn-Risk-Index, BRI) were determined in 36 children and adolescents with ASD (26

boys, 10 girls) aged 2-18 years and compared with 60 healthy non-autistic

children matched by age, gender and anthropometric traits. RESULTS: Children with

ASD demonstrated 3-fold greater plasma oxalate levels [5.60 (5th-95th percentile:

3.47-7.51)] compared with reference [(1.84 (5th-95th percentile: 0.50-4.70)

& #956;mol/L (p < 0.05)] and 2.5-fold greater urinary oxalate concentrations

(p < 0.05). No differences between the two groups were found in urinary pH,

citraturia, calciuria or adjusted CaOx crystallization rates based on BRI.

Despite significant hyperoxaluria no evidence of kidney stone disease or

lithogenic risk was observed in these individuals. CONCLUSIONS: Hyperoxalemia and

hyperoxaluria may be involved in the pathogenesis of ASD in children. Whether

this is a result of impaired renal excretion or an extensive intestinal

absorption, or both, or whether Ox may cross the blood brain barrier and disturb

CNS function in the autistic children remains unclear. This appears to be the

first report of plasma and urinary oxalate in childhood autism.

Copyright © 2011 European Paediatric Neurology Society. Published by Elsevier

Ltd. All rights reserved.

PMID: 21911305 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

1. J Nutr. 1993 Jan;123(1):20-6.

Brainstem auditory evoked potential interwave intervals are prolonged in vitamin

B-6-deficient cats.

Buckmaster PS, Holliday TA, Bai SC, QR.

Department of Surgery, School of Veterinary Medicine, University of California,

95616.

Vitamin B-6 deficiency has been reported to produce behavioral,

neurophysiological and neuropathological abnormalities in a variety of species.

In this investigation we used brainstem auditory evoked potentials (BAEP) to

determine if vitamin B-6 deficiency in cats affected peripheral and brainstem

auditory pathways. Brainstem auditory evoked potentials were recorded from

growing cats as they developed vitamin B-6 deficiency, which was confirmed using

clinical, hematological and urinary criteria. The BAEP interwave intervals

measured from early (wave 1 or 1N) to late waves (5N) or from middle (wave 3) to

late waves increased significantly, whereas interwave intervals from early to

middle waves did not differ significantly. These results indicate that vitamin

B-6 deficiency affects one or more structures of the brainstem that generate the

later parts of the BAEP. The finding of prolonged interwave intervals in vitamin

B-6-deficient animals is consistent with slowed axonal conduction velocity

secondary to defective myelination. Recording BAEP provided a noninvasive means

of detecting effects of vitamin B-6 deficiency on specific parts of the central

nervous system.

PMID: 8421226 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

>

> Noel,

>

> I'm not but I do wish to comment. Our son used to have approximately 4 second delay in his response to a verbal request (based upon daily data collection in our intensive therapy program).In the past year and a half that has gone away. Sometimes he takes a bit longer to process the verbal input before he acts- particularly when it's late, and he's tired.

>

> Our behaviorist descibed what was happening as an auditory professing issue. We did not pursue actual testing, although this can be done ( it's a little too similar to the EEG and I hope to not have tob relive that one!) When we first had his hearing checked at Duke Childrens Hospital, they had the technology in house to test the brain's response to sound. I'll bet they still do.

> Hope this helps!

>

>

>

> Sent from my iPhone

[Guest guest]

Hi all

I can say that my son has had big improvements with FAST FORWORD, but can say if

all these have stuck. He has recently had an auditory processing test, 2 years

after finishing Fast Forward, as well as many other auditory programs (sound

therapies) and it was a dismal 5% of normal 100%, but I am sure that the would

have been close to 0% before. AFter doing Therapeutic Listening, EASe, a bit

of bone conduction Samonas (but not every day!!) and Fast Forword The biggest

gains were from Fast Forward.

My advice would be to get it tested before starting a sound therapy program

according to where you kid is on the developmental tree (how bad it is). I have

been told by Petra Rubacek, Sydney (Samonas. She also does some primitive reflex

and neuro board/balance/hemishperical work. ) my son would need it every day for

2 years to get it to stick. She rents the cd's (not a lot of $$ is req). I wish

someone told me this to start with. This seems like a worthwhile exercise. You

can always up the anti after 6months of air conduction, and do bone conduction

with same program and person if they are not improving, as she tests them every

6 months. This seems much rigorous than the OT's handing out things like

Therapeutic Listening, and by the time you get to the end, that's it.(which we

have done). My daughter has started but only just, so I can't say for sure.

(she is not as bad as my son).

My 2 cents worth is that Fast Forword is a finishing up tool, it is really

really hard work, if they have not done any sound therapy previously. For us it

didn't go long enough to continue to make (processing) improvements as my sons

processing was bad, but he could respond if someone spoke to him after the

program, and still can as long as no background sound. His language has been

the thing to continue improve after, while all other things stalled. We are

looking into the Auditory Integration Training, for my son now at our Doctors

suggestion, as it lower down the developmental tree that both Samonas and Fast

Forward.

By the way there is a really good article in

Cutting-Edge-Therapies-Autism-2010-2011- Chapter 59 that explains the different

Sound therapies in a developmental tree. No one has done that to me before, and

it is useful to get tested, and find where your child fits, and chose a program

accordingly.

Hope this helps. No vested interests

son 9 ASD

Daughter 6

> >

> > Noel,

> >

> > I'm not but I do wish to comment. Our son used to have approximately 4

second delay in his response to a verbal request (based upon daily data

collection in our intensive therapy program).In the past year and a half that

has gone away. Sometimes he takes a bit longer to process the verbal input

before he acts- particularly when it's late, and he's tired.

> >

> > Our behaviorist descibed what was happening as an auditory professing issue.

We did not pursue actual testing, although this can be done ( it's a little too

similar to the EEG and I hope to not have tob relive that one!) When we first

had his hearing checked at Duke Childrens Hospital, they had the technology in

house to test the brain's response to sound. I'll bet they still do.

> > Hope this helps!

> >

> >

> >

> > Sent from my iPhone

>