Nada's Invitation to Dinner

[Guest guest]

I was going through a strong streak regarding Nada, and now she's back in my

head.

She recently invited me to her engagement dinner. I got two invitations in the

mail. And I would have liked to experience that event with her as if we were on

normal terms.... but it really bothers me that she is SO FAR from acknowledging

the truth!! I was very clear with her that we are on postal mail only contact

until she can talk with me about the things she has said and done. So WTF? I

guess it is to be expected... and I'm having trouble pin-pointing the reason why

this upsets me... given that I know she doesn't understand that I have feelings.

Also, we were doing alright with postal mail... exchanging a little bit a

niceness, and I guess I was more optimistic about where that was going than I

should have been. So there is part of me trying to figure out how to respond...

and part of me that just wants to withdraw and not write for a long time.

Neither part is winning though. I feel like I want to continue having mail

contact with her - it's been working for me, and yet.... I'm SO tired of having

to say " No. Let me remind you in a gentle, non-triggering way that I too, have

feelings that are worth considering. " Arrrggghhh!!

Thank you everyone for listening.

[Guest guest]

, the hardest part of our transformation is accepting our BP parent for

who they are. We so want them to meet our needs, but they never will. Our

refusal to accept this hard truth causes us all great pain and anger. We all

struggle with this, even those of us that have been traveling this path for a

while. I still get angry at my mother. It gets better if you do the work.

>

> I was going through a strong streak regarding Nada, and now she's back in my

head.

>

> She recently invited me to her engagement dinner. I got two invitations in the

mail. And I would have liked to experience that event with her as if we were on

normal terms.... but it really bothers me that she is SO FAR from acknowledging

the truth!! I was very clear with her that we are on postal mail only contact

until she can talk with me about the things she has said and done. So WTF? I

guess it is to be expected... and I'm having trouble pin-pointing the reason why

this upsets me... given that I know she doesn't understand that I have feelings.

>

> Also, we were doing alright with postal mail... exchanging a little bit a

niceness, and I guess I was more optimistic about where that was going than I

should have been. So there is part of me trying to figure out how to respond...

and part of me that just wants to withdraw and not write for a long time.

Neither part is winning though. I feel like I want to continue having mail

contact with her - it's been working for me, and yet.... I'm SO tired of having

to say " No. Let me remind you in a gentle, non-triggering way that I too, have

feelings that are worth considering. " Arrrggghhh!!

>

> Thank you everyone for listening.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I agree. You didn't break her and you can't fix her. Its very painful to

accept that our own mother has this mental illness, and even more bewilderingly

painful to accept that the nature of this illness is that she will not see the

damage she does.

Those with pds are not likely to ever accept personal responsibility for their

own words and behaviors, and will probably never go into therapy or try to

change. We resist accepting this knowledge, because it means the loss of hope.

Its only human to cling to hope. But you can eventually gain peace through

accepting that in the case of pd, that change is not very likely to happen.

-Annie

> >

> > I was going through a strong streak regarding Nada, and now she's back in my

head.

> >

> > She recently invited me to her engagement dinner. I got two invitations in

the mail. And I would have liked to experience that event with her as if we were

on normal terms.... but it really bothers me that she is SO FAR from

acknowledging the truth!! I was very clear with her that we are on postal mail

only contact until she can talk with me about the things she has said and done.

So WTF? I guess it is to be expected... and I'm having trouble pin-pointing the

reason why this upsets me... given that I know she doesn't understand that I

have feelings.

> >

> > Also, we were doing alright with postal mail... exchanging a little bit a

niceness, and I guess I was more optimistic about where that was going than I

should have been. So there is part of me trying to figure out how to respond...

and part of me that just wants to withdraw and not write for a long time.

Neither part is winning though. I feel like I want to continue having mail

contact with her - it's been working for me, and yet.... I'm SO tired of having

to say " No. Let me remind you in a gentle, non-triggering way that I too, have

feelings that are worth considering. " Arrrggghhh!!

> >

> > Thank you everyone for listening.

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Yes, change is very unlikely to happen and when it does, it rarely looks like we

imagined it would. I have seen cases where the BP actually does get the help

they need. You would think everything would be wonderful and everyone would be

happy. However, I have noticed that families do not adjust easily to the change

that they thought they wanted so much. This is the norm.

When the BP gets better, the dysfunction in other family members becomes more

apparent. I have seen some families get much worse when the BP gets the help

they need. Divorce happens a lot and children often don't know how to act

around this knew stranger in their mothers body. It is no heavenly utopia by

any means. Imagine one day you BP parent all of a sudden setting healthy

boundaries and having a stronger sense of self.

So be careful what you wish for; you are likely to be disappointed when you get

it. At least now you know what to expect, so accept it; embrace it. Is the

grass really greener on the other side?

> > >

> > > I was going through a strong streak regarding Nada, and now she's back in

my head.

> > >

> > > She recently invited me to her engagement dinner. I got two invitations in

the mail. And I would have liked to experience that event with her as if we were

on normal terms.... but it really bothers me that she is SO FAR from

acknowledging the truth!! I was very clear with her that we are on postal mail

only contact until she can talk with me about the things she has said and done.

So WTF? I guess it is to be expected... and I'm having trouble pin-pointing the

reason why this upsets me... given that I know she doesn't understand that I

have feelings.

> > >

> > > Also, we were doing alright with postal mail... exchanging a little bit a

niceness, and I guess I was more optimistic about where that was going than I

should have been. So there is part of me trying to figure out how to respond...

and part of me that just wants to withdraw and not write for a long time.

Neither part is winning though. I feel like I want to continue having mail

contact with her - it's been working for me, and yet.... I'm SO tired of having

to say " No. Let me remind you in a gentle, non-triggering way that I too, have

feelings that are worth considering. " Arrrggghhh!!

> > >

> > > Thank you everyone for listening.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Personally, I would be grateful to have my mother consider my feelings. If she

were able to back-step and say " I thought about what I did... " it would be a

different game.Â

I have to laugh when you say a " stronger sense of self " because that's all Nada

thinks about is herself!! But, I know what you mean.... you mean she finally has

a sense of control over herself. I would hope that those adult family members

would have enough insight to realize that they have been affected by the abuse

inflicted by the BPD, and of course they are dysfunctional! They probably don't

feel safe actually trusting the person, would be my guess. I can certainly

imagine having a hard time with that if my Nada ever did change.

________________________________

To: WTOAdultChildren1

Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 1:34 PM

Subject: Re: Nada's Invitation to Dinner

Â

Yes, change is very unlikely to happen and when it does, it rarely looks like we

imagined it would. I have seen cases where the BP actually does get the help

they need. You would think everything would be wonderful and everyone would be

happy. However, I have noticed that families do not adjust easily to the change

that they thought they wanted so much. This is the norm.

When the BP gets better, the dysfunction in other family members becomes more

apparent. I have seen some families get much worse when the BP gets the help

they need. Divorce happens a lot and children often don't know how to act

around this knew stranger in their mothers body. It is no heavenly utopia by

any means. Imagine one day you BP parent all of a sudden setting healthy

boundaries and having a stronger sense of self.

So be careful what you wish for; you are likely to be disappointed when you get

it. At least now you know what to expect, so accept it; embrace it. Is the

grass really greener on the other side?

> > >

> > > I was going through a strong streak regarding Nada, and now she's back in

my head.Â

> > >

> > > She recently invited me to her engagement dinner. I got two invitations in

the mail. And I would have liked to experience that event with her as if we were

on normal terms.... but it really bothers me that she is SO FAR from

acknowledging the truth!! I was very clear with her that we are on postal mail

only contact until she can talk with me about the things she has said and done.

So WTF? I guess it is to be expected... and I'm having trouble pin-pointing the

reason why this upsets me... given that I know she doesn't understand that I

have feelings.

> > >

> > > Also, we were doing alright with postal mail... exchanging a little bit a

niceness, and I guess I was more optimistic about where that was going than I

should have been. So there is part of me trying to figure out how to respond...

and part of me that just wants to withdraw and not write for a long time.

Neither part is winning though. I feel like I want to continue having mail

contact with her - it's been working for me, and yet.... I'm SO tired of having

to say " No. Let me remind you in a gentle, non-triggering way that I too, have

feelings that are worth considering. " Arrrggghhh!!

> > >

> > > Thank you everyone for listening.Â

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

After about 3 months of therapy, my nada seemed to be miraculously cured.

Sister was nearly crying with happiness, she said it was like a kind of miracle.

Nada was just being sweet, and not being chronically irritable, mean, critical,

whiny, demanding, and spewing vicious verbal abuse at Sister; she was treating

Sister as kindly as she treats neighbors and friends: like a human being instead

of like a rather stupid robot slave.

But then, one day Sister was a little late picking nada up for some appointment

or other, and that triggered nada into a " category 5 " meltdown rage-tantrum at

Sister. Nada called Sister every ugly name in the book. Literally screamed at

Sister that there was nothing wrong with nada, that nada had only gone into

therapy because we forced her to, she had been the perfect mother to us, that

Sister and I were liars, we told lies about her and were being hateful and mean

to her, and she didn't need therapy, she only went to learn how to deal with us.

Etc.

Back to square one for Sister and me. Nada continued with her psychologist for

about 2 years, and never made that breakthrough of accepting personal

responsibility. She is elderly, though, and its probably due to a lifetime of

this mindset that she was incapable of change. Plus, as it turned out (we

didn't know at the time) our nada also very likely had the earlier stages of

Alzheimer's disease, an organic brain deterioration, possibly for years. Its

only been in the last 6 months that our nada began showing symptoms of advanced

Alzheimer's. From my point of view, the only difference between bpd and

Alzheimer's are the active and vivid hallucinations, and the change from

high-functioning (covert abuse) to low-functioning (overt abuse, to strangers as

well as to us.)

That's great and inspiring to know that some with bpd can actually stay in

therapy, gain personal insight, and learn to modify or manage their skewed bpd

thought processes and reactions.

But so far, I think you're the only member I've ever encountered who has

actually personally known a parent with bpd (more than one?) who voluntarily

went into therapy, accepted a diagnosis of bpd, stayed in therapy, and made

substantial and real progress toward recovery.

From the Groups I've been in, those members who have bpd parents who actually do

go in and receive a proper diagnosis and stay in therapy and recover are...

extremely rare.

But it appears that there is a greater chance of recovery when the patient is

diagnosed earlier in life and gets the right kind of psychotherapy and perhaps

meds. There are more posts about kids who show signs of recovery at the groups

for the support of non-pd parents raising a child with bpd. (or the

child-version of a bpd diagnosis.)

-Annie

> > > >

> > > > I was going through a strong streak regarding Nada, and now she's back

in my head.

> > > >

> > > > She recently invited me to her engagement dinner. I got two invitations

in the mail. And I would have liked to experience that event with her as if we

were on normal terms.... but it really bothers me that she is SO FAR from

acknowledging the truth!! I was very clear with her that we are on postal mail

only contact until she can talk with me about the things she has said and done.

So WTF? I guess it is to be expected... and I'm having trouble pin-pointing the

reason why this upsets me... given that I know she doesn't understand that I

have feelings.

> > > >

> > > > Also, we were doing alright with postal mail... exchanging a little bit

a niceness, and I guess I was more optimistic about where that was going than I

should have been. So there is part of me trying to figure out how to respond...

and part of me that just wants to withdraw and not write for a long time.

Neither part is winning though. I feel like I want to continue having mail

contact with her - it's been working for me, and yet.... I'm SO tired of having

to say " No. Let me remind you in a gentle, non-triggering way that I too, have

feelings that are worth considering. " Arrrggghhh!!

> > > >

> > > > Thank you everyone for listening.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

I find it ironic that I will never meet my nada's needs either. It creates this

horrible impasse where neither one of us can win, regardless of whether we both

get healthy through therapy.

How do you have a relationship with someone that you don't like, that doesn't

like you, but that you are thrown together through genetics? I've asked my nada

to agree to disagree, but her lack of control over her emotions means that

eventually she blurts out what she really feels and the cycle starts all over

again.

I know I'm the only one that can break the cycle, but I also know that settings

those boundaries hurts her. I'm sure I'm not the only one here that it hurts

knowing that I'm hurting my parent. Not only do I care, I care too much!

Damn I hate this disease!

AnnieL

> >

> > I was going through a strong streak regarding Nada, and now she's back in my

head.

> >

> > She recently invited me to her engagement dinner. I got two invitations in

the mail. And I would have liked to experience that event with her as if we were

on normal terms.... but it really bothers me that she is SO FAR from

acknowledging the truth!! I was very clear with her that we are on postal mail

only contact until she can talk with me about the things she has said and done.

So WTF? I guess it is to be expected... and I'm having trouble pin-pointing the

reason why this upsets me... given that I know she doesn't understand that I

have feelings.

> >

> > Also, we were doing alright with postal mail... exchanging a little bit a

niceness, and I guess I was more optimistic about where that was going than I

should have been. So there is part of me trying to figure out how to respond...

and part of me that just wants to withdraw and not write for a long time.

Neither part is winning though. I feel like I want to continue having mail

contact with her - it's been working for me, and yet.... I'm SO tired of having

to say " No. Let me remind you in a gentle, non-triggering way that I too, have

feelings that are worth considering. " Arrrggghhh!!

> >

> > Thank you everyone for listening.

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I think you're the only member I've ever encountered who has actually personally

known a parent with bpd (more than one?) who voluntarily went into therapy,

accepted a diagnosis of bpd, stayed in therapy, and made substantial and real

progress toward recovery.

Actually, come to think of it, I have never known a parent of adult children get

better in therapy. Just in case there were still some people out there with an

ounce of hope. Like you said, it is more common in younger adults and teens to

take full advantage of therapy.

But for those who still insist in holding on to hope, I am sure there must be a

BP parent with adult children somewhere out there who got better in therapy.

Statistically speaking, there has to be at least one out there somewhere.

On the flip side, look at all us adult children getting the help we need. That

is exciting!