SHBG & thyroid? (Hollis)

[Guest guest]



Hollis... seeing you mentioning your SHBG being high?

I did see this about a thyroid connection...It's just a clip

from a pdf file and thought you might want to check it out,

no idea of whether it's of any help or not.

http://www.andrologyjournal.org/cgi/reprint/9/3/215.pdf

''Hyperthyroidism is usually associated

with high SHBG levels that return to normal values

after treatment while hypothyroid patients have low or

normal SHBG levels.''

Dee

----- Original Message -----

> my SHBG is WAY too high -- so, evidently, quite a bit was making its way down my throat despite my best intentions that it not. I'm going to switch to transdermally and see if that brings the SHBG down.

[Guest guest]

Dee,In my case, it's not a matter of being hyperthyroid: i'm clearly hyPO.It's true that my free T4 and T3 are nice and high now, but i exhibit nosigns of hyperthyroidism. (And if it IS because of my thyroid supplementation,i frankly would rather just up my E2 rather than lowering those thyroid levels!)I really think it's a matter of the delivery method of my estradiol. Here's what Reiss says about this: " The surge of SHBG is especially dramatic after you take estrogen bymouth. Please remember this: oral estrogen, primarily in the form of pills, proceeds from your mouth down in to the digestive tract. From there it is carried, as a high tide of estrogen, directly to the liver. Theliver now thinks there is way to much estrogen in your system. Thealarm goes off. Out swarm the sex hormone-binding globulins like aSWAT team.Thus, if you take estrogen in this way, you don't receive the full benefitof the dosage. You actually need more, because the higher SHBG hasbound up more of the ciruclating estrogen in your body, whether you produced it in your ovaries or took it orally. In other words, the SHBGcancels out more of the estrogen along with other hormones.This does not happen, or happens to a much, much smaller degreewhen you take esrogen in other forms, such as topical gel or patch. " I'm hoping that this is the case with me -- that it's a regular portion ofmy emu oil-based sublingual E2 going down my throat and making thatfirst pass that's raising the SHBG. My total T level and free T levels AREtoo low (though, unfortunately, my DHT levels are high, explains in partmy continuing hair loss), which would go along with the high SHBG.After i switch to transdermal application, i'll retest and find out if i'm right.Of course, it could be explained by my E2 being too high, as well. Buti'll try this switch first before i consider lowering my estradiol. My lastE2 test showed something like 240 on Day 3, but with my really highSHBG i doubt i'm getting much of that into the cells. My next testing i'mgetting a FREE E2 done. I'm really, really curious to see what it is.Hollis Hollis... seeing you mentioning your SHBG being high? I did see this about a thyroid connection.. .It's just a clip from a pdf file and thought you might want to check it out, no idea of whether it's of any help or not. http://www.androlog yjournal. org/cgi/reprint/ 9/3/215.pdf ''Hyperthyroidism is usually associated with high SHBG levels that return to normal values after treatment while hypothyroid patients have low or normal SHBG levels.'' Dee ----- Original Message ----- > my SHBG is WAY too high -- so, evidently, quite a bit was making its way down my throat despite my best intentions that it not. I'm going to switch to transdermally and see if that brings the SHBG down.

[Guest guest]



Excellent points Hollis.

I believe that as well and why I don't do the oral for my own hormones. But for 'me' the sublingual seems to work with it going directly into the blood stream and it does act differently (from how I feel) than when I tried the straight oral.

I dunno.. maybe I keep in under my tongue longer? or the amt of saliva? as it definitely does increase for me where I could swish it around if I wanted to and do sometimes. So it's getting all over the mucuous membranes of the mouth. *grin*...Or maybe with yours being emu oil based it's different, who knows? *Knock on wood so far I feel ok*.

You'll have to forgive me with me losing so much with my computer crash, I couldn't remember if you were hyper or hypo with the thyroid. DUH... my brain I swear went into a fog too along with it. But I too would try to increase my E.. before I'd mess around with the thyroid if things are in good shape there. But wasn't that odd in that paper

http://www.andrologyjournal.org/cgi/reprint/9/3/215.pdf for them to say that 'hypo' thyroiders usually show a 'lower' SHBG level which would mean there'd be 'more' of the active hormone? That confused me.

One other thing I'm curious about is that with all I've read etc. I've rarely seen 'estrogen' talked about with SHBG levels ...and I've never had my own done either (never thought to ask) but definitely have with the T. That's what I thought the SHBG was mainly for.

I hope you don't think I'm nutz. *Grin* but this is what one testing place says about SHBG...and why I always thought it was for T. alone.

Formal name: SHBG: Sex Hormone Binding Globulin

Also known as: Testosterone-estrogen Binding Globulin (TeBG)

But I do know I've seen it mentioned before with estrogen (and makes some sense) but only ran across it a few times.. so it's interesting that you know what yours is for estrogen.

I sure wish you luck with your new regimen. Hugs honDee~

RE: SHBG & thyroid? (Hollis)

Dee,

In my case, it's not a matter of being hyperthyroid: i'm clearly hyPO.

It's true that my free T4 and T3 are nice and high now, but i exhibit no

signs of hyperthyroidism. (And if it IS because of my thyroid supplementation,

i frankly would rather just up my E2 rather than lowering those thyroid levels!)

I really think it's a matter of the delivery method of my estradiol.

Here's what Reiss says about this:

"The surge of SHBG is especially dramatic after you take estrogen by

mouth. Please remember this: oral estrogen, primarily in the form of

pills, proceeds from your mouth down in to the digestive tract. From

there it is carried, as a high tide of estrogen, directly to the liver. The

liver now thinks there is way to much estrogen in your system. The

alarm goes off. Out swarm the sex hormone-binding globulins like a

SWAT team.

Thus, if you take estrogen in this way, you don't receive the full benefit

of the dosage. You actually need more, because the higher SHBG has

bound up more of the ciruclating estrogen in your body, whether you

produced it in your ovaries or took it orally. In other words, the SHBG

cancels out more of the estrogen along with other hormones.

This does not happen, or happens to a much, much smaller degree

when you take esrogen in other forms, such as topical gel or patch."

I'm hoping that this is the case with me -- that it's a regular portion of

my emu oil-based sublingual E2 going down my throat and making that

first pass that's raising the SHBG. My total T level and free T levels ARE

too low (though, unfortunately, my DHT levels are high, explains in part

my continuing hair loss), which would go along with the high SHBG.

After i switch to transdermal application, i'll retest and find out if i'm right.

Of course, it could be explained by my E2 being too high, as well. But

i'll try this switch first before i consider lowering my estradiol. My last

E2 test showed something like 240 on Day 3, but with my really high

SHBG i doubt i'm getting much of that into the cells. My next testing i'm

getting a FREE E2 done. I'm really, really curious to see what it is.

Hollis



Hollis... seeing you mentioning your SHBG being high?

I did see this about a thyroid connection.. .It's just a clip

from a pdf file and thought you might want to check it out,

no idea of whether it's of any help or not.

http://www.androlog yjournal. org/cgi/reprint/ 9/3/215.pdf

''Hyperthyroidism is usually associated

with high SHBG levels that return to normal values

after treatment while hypothyroid patients have low or

normal SHBG levels.''

Dee

----- Original Message -----

> my SHBG is WAY too high -- so, evidently, quite a bit was making its way down my throat despite my best intentions that it not. I'm going to switch to transdermally and see if that brings the SHBG down.

[Guest guest]



HI again Hollis..

Just FYI here's a good paper on SHBG & our hormones.

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/reprint/85/12/4476.pdf

Dee

(PS: I just hate those doggone PDF Files. LOL)

[Guest guest]

Dee,This SHBG business IS confusing! I had trouble interpreting that article, in all honesty,but my understanding is that there's any inverse relationship between SHBG and thehormones it " carries, " so that the higher the SHBG, the less active form of the hormonesthere are. So, for me, having a very high SHBG means that, in all likelihood, only asmall percentage of my rather high Day 3 E2 is actually bio-active. Getting my freeE2 tested will confirm whether or not that's true. But it sure is true for my free T, whichis too low.And about what SHBG does bind. . . Here's a quote from Reiss again (Natural HormoneBalance, p. 38): " Estrogen's chapeone is the sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG). When your estrogenlevel goes too high. . . .your liver can produce up to three times the normal amount ofSHBG.The problem is that this special protein doesn't just bind up some of the excess estrogen.It also binds -- and inactivates -- some of the other important hormones, such asthyroid hormone, human growth hormone, and testosterone. " To make it more complicated, he writes: " The interplay between SHBG ad hormones can be quite complex. Technically, eachhormone has its own specific sex hormone-binding globulin, but they are all affecteddirectly or indirectly by the estrogen level and how estrogen is administered. " And Vliet's definition just says, " A carrier protein in the bloodstream (made in theliver) that binds or carries estrogen, testosterone, progesterone to provide a reservoir of hormones ready for release into the free fraction to become the activeform. " No mention of its interplay with thyroid or HGH.So, know wonder you're confused. So am I! Despite what the test descriptionyou cited says, as far as i know there's only one SHBG test. . . . Hollis Excellent points Hollis. I believe that as well and why I don't do the oral for my own hormones. But for 'me' the sublingual seems to work with it going directly into the blood stream and it does act differently (from how I feel) than when I tried the straight oral. I dunno.. maybe I keep in under my tongue longer? or the amt of saliva? as it definitely does increase for me where I could swish it around if I wanted to and do sometimes. So it's getting all over the mucuous membranes of the mouth. *grin*...Or maybe with yours being emu oil based it's different, who knows? *Knock on wood so far I feel ok*. You'll have to forgive me with me losing so much with my computer crash, I couldn't remember if you were hyper or hypo with the thyroid. DUH... my brain I swear went into a fog too along with it. But I too would try to increase my E.. before I'd mess around with the thyroid if things are in good shape there. But wasn't that odd in that paper http://www.androlog yjournal. org/cgi/reprint/ 9/3/215.pdf for them to say that 'hypo' thyroiders usually show a 'lower' SHBG level which would mean there'd be 'more' of the active hormone? That confused me. One other thing I'm curious about is that with all I've read etc. I've rarely seen 'estrogen' talked about with SHBG levels ...and I've never had my own done either (never thought to ask) but definitely have with the T. That's what I thought the SHBG was mainly for. I hope you don't think I'm nutz. *Grin* but this is what one testing place says about SHBG...and why I always thought it was for T. alone. Formal name: SHBG: Sex Hormone Binding Globulin Also known as: Testosterone- estrogen Binding Globulin (TeBG) But I do know I've seen it mentioned before with estrogen (and makes some sense) but only ran across it a few times.. so it's interesting that you know what yours is for estrogen. I sure wish you luck with your new regimen. Hugs hon Dee~ RE: SHBG & thyroid? (Hollis) Dee, In my case, it's not a matter of being hyperthyroid: i'm clearly hyPO. It's true that my free T4 and T3 are nice and high now, but i exhibit no signs of hyperthyroidism. (And if it IS because of my thyroid supplementation, i frankly would rather just up my E2 rather than lowering those thyroid levels!) I really think it's a matter of the delivery method of my estradiol. Here's what Reiss says about this: " The surge of SHBG is especially dramatic after you take estrogen by mouth. Please remember this: oral estrogen, primarily in the form of pills, proceeds from your mouth down in to the digestive tract. From there it is carried, as a high tide of estrogen, directly to the liver. The liver now thinks there is way to much estrogen in your system. The alarm goes off. Out swarm the sex hormone-binding globulins like a SWAT team. Thus, if you take estrogen in this way, you don't receive the full benefit of the dosage. You actually need more, because the higher SHBG has bound up more of the ciruclating estrogen in your body, whether you produced it in your ovaries or took it orally. In other words, the SHBG cancels out more of the estrogen along with other hormones. This does not happen, or happens to a much, much smaller degree when you take esrogen in other forms, such as topical gel or patch. " I'm hoping that this is the case with me -- that it's a regular portion of my emu oil-based sublingual E2 going down my throat and making that first pass that's raising the SHBG. My total T level and free T levels ARE too low (though, unfortunately, my DHT levels are high, explains in part my continuing hair loss), which would go along with the high SHBG. After i switch to transdermal application, i'll retest and find out if i'm right. Of course, it could be explained by my E2 being too high, as well. But i'll try this switch first before i consider lowering my estradiol. My last E2 test showed something like 240 on Day 3, but with my really high SHBG i doubt i'm getting much of that into the cells. My next testing i'm getting a FREE E2 done. I'm really, really curious to see what it is. Hollis  Hollis... seeing you mentioning your SHBG being high? I did see this about a thyroid connection.. .It's just a clip from a pdf file and thought you might want to check it out, no idea of whether it's of any help or not. http://www.androlog yjournal. org/cgi/reprint/ 9/3/215.pdf ''Hyperthyroidism is usually associated with high SHBG levels that return to normal values after treatment while hypothyroid patients have low or normal SHBG levels.'' Dee ----- Original Message ----- > my SHBG is WAY too high -- so, evidently, quite a bit was making its way down my throat despite my best intentions that it not. I'm going to switch to transdermally and see if that brings the SHBG down.