Hollis/Emla Cream

[Guest guest]

Hollis – Did you try the Capsaicin cream?

nne

From: VulvarDisorders

[mailto:VulvarDisorders ] On Behalf Of hgz

Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 11:50 PM

To: VulvarDisorders

Subject: RE: Hollis/Emla Cream - read if you have vaginal pain

Thanks, nne. That polyoxyethylene makes it a

no-no for me. If i need a

numbing agent, i guess it'll be the lidocaine in emu oil i

had compounded for the

capsaicin treatment that never happened. . . .

Hollis

On

the tube and on the box it says – Lidocaine 25mg, Prilocaine 25 mg, carbomer,

polyoxyethylene hydrated castor oil, sodium hydroxide, water

That’s

it …

nne

From: VulvarDisorders@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:VulvarDisor

ders@yahoogroups .com] On Behalf Of hgz

Sent: Friday, June 06, 2008 2:32 PM

To: VulvarDisorders@ yahoogroups. com

Subject: RE: Emla Cream - read if you have vaginal pain

nne,

Is

that the complete ingredient listing you gave? Are there really no

preservative/

inert ingredients in addition?

Hollis

On

Wed, Jun 4, 2008 at 11:41 PM, millburytimes wrote:

I

just wanted to tell everyone that I got the Emla Cream (made by AstraZeneca)

that I sent away for to Canada and paid $36.00 for. I later found out that I

could have gotten a prescription for it and pay $10 co-pay at my local

pharmacy. Anyway it is made of 25mg of Lidocaine and 25mg of Prilocaine mixed

with hydrated castor oil and sodium hydroxide. This product is sold over the

counter in Canada, England and other European countries. The box it was

packaged in was really strange as the writing was Arabic and it said it was

made it Israel. The tube itself was written in English and said it was made by

AstraZeneca on the front but on the back where it listed the ingredients it

said it was made by AstraZeneca, Sweden. AstraZeneca is an American

manufacturer also, which is where the American product is made. Drug companies

have manufacturing plants all over the world.

Anyway,

what I like the most about the cream is that it is very thin consistency. You

just put your finger on the top of the tube and you get enough to spread all

over the genital area. I usually have to put my finger on the top about three

times because my pain is to touch and that covers the whole area including the

part with hair. The Lidocaine gel I had before was very thick and you had to

use a lot of it to cover. The Emla cream is much better – I can see that this

tube will last a long time, because you barely use anything. When you first put

it on, it burns for about a minute then goes away. It helps with the pain

almost completely and lasts for about six hours. So if you have really

excessive bad pain in the vaginal, perineum area, this gel will really help

you. If you don’t have a doctor to get a prescription, then pay the money to

get it from Canada – it is well worth it.

nne

[Guest guest]

No, not yet. It got put on hold when my practitioner (and i, too) felt that i was dealing withLichens Planus. But now that my vestibule is looking dramatically better i'm wondering if it would be ok to try -- and i'm going to ask about it at my next appointment.HollisHollis – Did you try the Capsaicin cream? nne From: VulvarDisorders@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:VulvarDisor ders@yahoogroups .com] On Behalf Of hgz Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 11:50 PM To: VulvarDisorders@ yahoogroups. com Subject: RE: Hollis/Emla Cream - read if you have vaginal pain Thanks, nne. That polyoxyethylene makes it a no-no for me. If i need a numbing agent, i guess it'll be the lidocaine in emu oil i had compounded for the capsaicin treatment that never happened. . . . Hollis On the tube and on the box it says – Lidocaine 25mg, Prilocaine 25 mg, carbomer, polyoxyethylene hydrated castor oil, sodium hydroxide, water That’s it … nne From: VulvarDisorders@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:VulvarDisor ders@yahoogroups .com] On Behalf Of hgz Sent: Friday, June 06, 2008 2:32 PM To: VulvarDisorders@ yahoogroups. com Subject: RE: Emla Cream - read if you have vaginal pain nne, Is that the complete ingredient listing you gave? Are there really no preservative/ inert ingredients in addition? Hollis I just wanted to tell everyone that I got the Emla Cream (made by AstraZeneca) that I sent away for to Canada and paid $36.00 for. I later found out that I could have gotten a prescription for it and pay $10 co-pay at my local pharmacy. Anyway it is made of 25mg of Lidocaine and 25mg of Prilocaine mixed with hydrated castor oil and sodium hydroxide. This product is sold over the counter in Canada, England and other European countries. The box it was packaged in was really strange as the writing was Arabic and it said it was made it Israel. The tube itself was written in English and said it was made by AstraZeneca on the front but on the back where it listed the ingredients it said it was made by AstraZeneca, Sweden. AstraZeneca is an American manufacturer also, which is where the American product is made. Drug companies have manufacturing plants all over the world. Anyway, what I like the most about the cream is that it is very thin consistency. You just put your finger on the top of the tube and you get enough to spread all over the genital area. I usually have to put my finger on the top about three times because my pain is to touch and that covers the whole area including the part with hair. The Lidocaine gel I had before was very thick and you had to use a lot of it to cover. The Emla cream is much better – I can see that this tube will last a long time, because you barely use anything. When you first put it on, it burns for about a minute then goes away. It helps with the pain almost completely and lasts for about six hours. So if you have really excessive bad pain in the vaginal, perineum area, this gel will really help you. If you don’t have a doctor to get a prescription, then pay the money to get it from Canada – it is well worth it. nne

[Guest guest]



Hollis.. did a biopsy show up as LP (lichen planus) ? Just wondering if after all this time that is the first time it's been mentioned? Or why your physician feels it might be that. If that's what it is in the end, I'd be furious to know it was overlooked or misdiagnosed. *sigh*..

Hugs Dee

----- Original Message ----- From: hgz

No, not yet. It got put on hold when my practitioner (and i, too) felt that i was dealing with Lichens Planus. ..........

[Guest guest]

Dee,I never did have a biopsy. And, yes, it was only quite recently that the idea of havingLP or LS was brought up. But then again, i didn't see a vulvar specialist until this lastyear. Kellogg suspected LP when she first saw me last summer (some signs of loss ofarchitecture in the 11 - 12 o'clock areas) and immediately wanted to do a biopsy, but i, not wanting one, struck a deal with her: if, after 3 months of capsaicin (which is a main reason i was seeing her; i REALLY didn't think i had LP or LS) didn't work to alleviate the extreme vascular irritation she saw with the colposcope, then i'd do the biopsy. Then, before i could get back to see her again (had to cancel because of a terribly severe set-back last September in my sound sensitivity that i'm still dealing with) i totally freaked out when i noticed fusion of my inner labia. In a phone call she said, from my description, that it did sound like LP and/or LS, but that she really couldn't proceed without a biopsy. She told me to continue with the Traumeel protocol i had started --tablets ground finely and mixed with my emu oil, which she said had anti-inflammatory properties and, basically, hope for the best. I didn't see any change and, when i did finally get back to see her about five months ago for my second visit, i fully expected to start with a steroid protocol. (I had written her a letter worthy of a lawyer stating my casefor her making an exception to her practice's rule about biopsies before lichoid treatmentdue to my extreme hypersensitivity to being even " bonked, " let a lone cut into. . . whichshe went for, with the provision that i sign a release statement, which was fine by me!) But when she looked at my vestibule she said that she couldn't believe how great my skin was and that she wouldn't even want to DO a biopsy! I still feel that there IS some fusion on oneside, but the other has unfused. feels that any fusion process is minor and withinthe realm of " normal " . . . and that if there is any lichoid process at work, it's very minor. So, apparently, the Traumeel really did help.I'm keeping a close eye on my inner labia (hmmm. . . that sounds a little strange) andwhile i wish that the still mildly fused side would unfurl, as it were, it doesn't seem to beprogressing. And i'm thrilled that the other side did release.And i never did start the capsaicin. When i reported the fusion to her, said no way.But at my upcoming visit at the beginning of July i'm going to see if it's now an option again.Hollis Hollis.. did a biopsy show up as LP (lichen planus) ? Just wondering if after all this time that is the first time it's been mentioned? Or why your physician feels it might be that. If that's what it is in the end, I'd be furious to know it was overlooked or misdiagnosed. *sigh*.. Hugs Dee ----- Original Message ----- From: hgz No, not yet. It got put on hold when my practitioner (and i, too) felt that i was dealing with Lichens Planus. ..........

[Guest guest]



HI Hollis.

I've gotcha and understand now. I can't blame you for not wanting a biopsy 'unless' there is some suspicion of vulvar cancer with a specific spot or lesion that simply will not heal and is chronic (if so you'd bet I'd do one in a NY Heartbeat) .. but if LS or LP is suspected many physicians will treat 'as if' first anyway and an experienced doctor usually can tell by the looks. (perhaps not to differentiate between LS & LP but treatments are basically the same.... EXCEPT.. LS is external where you can see it all.. and LP can be external 'and' 'internal' and often with a yellowish discharge.. and if so then a steroid suppository is needed inside the vagina to keep the vaginal vault from fusing together, (talk about that closing up YIKES)...

Typical protocol is the strongest steroid like the topical generic clobetasol, (since those conditions start at the basement level and need a steroid that's the most potent to reach that level).. and with minimal usage, but there is nothing better in the world that I've ever found that will release those adhesions (fusing) than the 'estradiol'... or Estrace (brand name)...

So if you've got that I sure would be using it hon... It definitely worked for me after my 'frilly's were solidly fused like that for 3 years and it still released those adhesions, and soooo so many others that have LS. I've collected hundreds of testimonys over the years to it's effect and I've read so many articles that talk about it being used for unfusing labial adhesions even in kids and in a recent Cont. Med. Ed Class I see where they're teaching it 'finally', and it's used topically with little or no systemic absorption.

Also have you checked around the anal area for discoloration or that white/greyish color to the skin? (sort of like wet crinkled cigarette paper look) It's known to go there as well, they call it a figure 8 pattern... as it can rim the front and/or the back side. Just know it can be controlled and that skin return to normal if it is hon. (the good ol' E & T again) *smile*

Glad to hear the traumeel is working for you and hope if you do try to Capsacin it helps... ...except.... I will say that IF it is LS or LP.... anything that could cause more trauma to the tissue is really bad news and can cause even more scar tissue (called the Koebner phenomenon, well known with LS) .... that includes any surgery (why it is rarely suggested for LS) or the overuse and abuse of the steroids, or abuse of the intravaginal yeast meds and I would think esp. the Capsaicin since that can irritate too.

In one way I wish it were LS as that can be fairly well contained and life be normal again as far as that V pain if it is that, I just wish all the other things going on with you could be so easily controlled.

I too have told a doctor I'd sign a release of liability when I first had a hard time getting my hormones without a mammogram.... still have never had one and won't but that's just 'me'... but TG he gave them to me. Doesn't even question me now. *grin*

Glad you're with Kellogg Spadt too... from everything I've ever heard about her, she's great and the people seem to love her. It's rare to not hear some negatives about almost all physicians, but I don't think I ever have about her.

Take care hon and be sure to let us know how things go.

Hugs

Dee ~

[Guest guest]

Dee,I posted on the wonderful LS board when i was going through the stress of all of this.It really is a great group of women there.One of the most shocking/depressing things about the fusing is that this happened afteri had been faithfully using estradiol (twice a day, usually, and still do) plus testosteroneonce a day for OVER A YEAR. So, for me, unfortunately, the e & t did not stop this fusion from developing. Another thing that's just frustrating is that it's not as if i had a photographicjournal of my crotch over time -- no " pre " pictures for comparison's sake. I kept questioningmyself, asking " am i just imagining this? did my inner labia REALLY extend all the way downbefore? (I finally concluded that it had.) But it makes me wish that i had taken pictures earlier,so it would have been absolutely clear to me. I really think that this is somethingthat all vulvar specialists should do routinely -- with permission, of course -- for one's file.I hear you about the capsaicin and my maybe lichenoid tendencies -- and if saysno, then i'll just use the compounded c on another part of my body! Actually, the morei think about it, the more i think it might not be worth tempting fate, even if she wereto give me the all clear (which i have my doubts about). Thanks for the information about that.And my vaginal walls, according to looked even better than the vestibule, so whatever was going on, it seems to have been stopped in its tracks. Or so i hope;i'll find out at the next visit if all this improvement still holds. The improvement,however, has not extending my not having any more pain or discomfort, unfortunately.She feels that i do have vestibulitis (her term) with inflammed glands and messed upmuscles but that i'm not ready for any internal PT at this point. Having her use a children's speculum without much pain during or afterwards was pretty darn thrilling, though.One last thing: when i saw last she had an experienced ob-gyn training with herwho, when i expressed disbelief that my vestibule was that much improved (i have toadmit that i hadn't seen all the improvement that she was raving about; she said thatat the first exam, my skin was REALLY awful and i didn't think it had changed inappearance), piped up and said, " Hollis, if this vulva walked into my office, i'd say it looked absolutely great for a 52 year-old!! " THAT convinced me that wasn't being dillusional or something. . . lol. And i'm glad, too, that i finally started seeing . She's wonderful. Just wish i had done it five years ago before things got so muchworse. Oh, well.Hollis HI Hollis. I've gotcha and understand now. I can't blame you for not wanting a biopsy 'unless' there is some suspicion of vulvar cancer with a specific spot or lesion that simply will not heal and is chronic (if so you'd bet I'd do one in a NY Heartbeat) .. but if LS or LP is suspected many physicians will treat 'as if' first anyway and an experienced doctor usually can tell by the looks. (perhaps not to differentiate between LS & LP but treatments are basically the same.... EXCEPT.. LS is external where you can see it all.. and LP can be external 'and' 'internal' and often with a yellowish discharge.. and if so then a steroid suppository is needed inside the vagina to keep the vaginal vault from fusing together, (talk about that closing up YIKES)... Typical protocol is the strongest steroid like the topical generic clobetasol, (since those conditions start at the basement level and need a steroid that's the most potent to reach that level).. and with minimal usage, but there is nothing better in the world that I've ever found that will release those adhesions (fusing) than the 'estradiol'. .. or Estrace (brand name)... So if you've got that I sure would be using it hon... It definitely worked for me after my 'frilly's were solidly fused like that for 3 years and it still released those adhesions, and soooo so many others that have LS. I've collected hundreds of testimonys over the years to it's effect and I've read so many articles that talk about it being used for unfusing labial adhesions even in kids and in a recent Cont. Med. Ed Class I see where they're teaching it 'finally', and it's used topically with little or no systemic absorption. Also have you checked around the anal area for discoloration or that white/greyish color to the skin? (sort of like wet crinkled cigarette paper look) It's known to go there as well, they call it a figure 8 pattern... as it can rim the front and/or the back side. Just know it can be controlled and that skin return to normal if it is hon. (the good ol' E & T again) *smile* Glad to hear the traumeel is working for you and hope if you do try to Capsacin it helps... ...except... . I will say that IF it is LS or LP.... anything that could cause more trauma to the tissue is really bad news and can cause even more scar tissue (called the Koebner phenomenon, well known with LS) .... that includes any surgery (why it is rarely suggested for LS) or the overuse and abuse of the steroids, or abuse of the intravaginal yeast meds and I would think esp. the Capsaicin since that can irritate too. In one way I wish it were LS as that can be fairly well contained and life be normal again as far as that V pain if it is that, I just wish all the other things going on with you could be so easily controlled. I too have told a doctor I'd sign a release of liability when I first had a hard time getting my hormones without a mammogram... . still have never had one and won't but that's just 'me'... but TG he gave them to me. Doesn't even question me now. *grin* Glad you're with Kellogg Spadt too... from everything I've ever heard about her, she's great and the people seem to love her. It's rare to not hear some negatives about almost all physicians, but I don't think I ever have about her. Take care hon and be sure to let us know how things go. Hugs Dee ~