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Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask.

The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy – implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful.

The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters??? There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction.

There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other.

No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

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Ms. NissenThank you so very much for so beautifully putting how MANY teachers who do their job feel when they read such awful things about teachers. too many people like to group all teachers, parents together. If the child is considered an INDIVIDUAL, then so does every one else. Again , thank you!!!!!!!!Subject: Clusters and SchoolsTo: sList Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why

someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask. The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy – implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters??? There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other.

No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

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My child was and still is very fortunate to have had some awesome teachers and support staff. Sure, there were bumps in the road, however, communication and mutual respect were and still is important. Many parents decide to do home schooling if they are not happy and that is their decision. I myself did not have the strength, funds, etc to do so. I commend the teachers that decide that teaching especially for our children is for them. I love my job and many teachers still love theirs. Its difficult out there not only for we parents and our children but also for the teachers and support staff. A little sugar goes a long way.

To: sList Sent: Thu, February 10, 2011 10:00:08 AMSubject: Re: Clusters and Schools

Ms. NissenThank you so very much for so beautifully putting how MANY teachers who do their job feel when they read such awful things about teachers. too many people like to group all teachers, parents together. If the child is considered an INDIVIDUAL, then so does every one else. Again , thank you!!!!!!!!

Subject: Clusters and SchoolsTo: sList Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask.

The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy – implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful.

The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters??? There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction.

There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade

parents????

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There are indeed some very good ESE teachers and support staff in Broward

County, or for that matter anywhere in the Country. I have been honored to know

many of them.

However, because of tenure and a shortage of ESE teachers there are way too many

ESE teachers (and staff) that should have chosen another profession.

Steve Moyer

> >

> >

> >>

> >>Subject: Clusters and Schools

> >>To: sList

> >>Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

> >>

> >>

> >> 

> >>Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without

asking -

> >>what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses

> >>to gain additional training.  In addition, Im not sure I understand how a

parent

> >>knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster

ie,  is

> >>there a CABA, who - if anyone -  is trained in ABA and/or Verbal

Behavior, 

> >>SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism

endorsement?  Im

> >>not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of  IEP

> >>drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep.  In

addition,

> >>drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if  they ask.

> >>

> >>          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA

> >>because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1

second,

> >>it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any therapy †" implemented

for that

> >>many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. 

> >>

> >>          The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of

> >>implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. 

Are you

> >>aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???

 There are

> >>certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of

> >>instruction.

> >>

> >>          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have

a driving

> >>force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying and

being

> >>verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the spectrum

have

> >>specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often individualized

and

> >>what works for one certainly may not work for another.  Educating our

children

> >>is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to be successful is to

learn

> >>from each other.  No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or

cyber/verbal

> >>abuse.  Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than

parents? 

> >>How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

> >>

> >>

> >

> >

>

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I work in Broward public schools, but not in the cluster. Before my niece with ASD was placed we visited two clusters i Broward. We met with teachers and simply asked them how long they had been working with autism and what lead her to choose this field. I do not see anything wrong with this. I do not mind if anyone ask me about my experience. I don;t see a doctor or a dentist without knowing how long they have had their practice and what their specialty is, so why would I not ask the teachers?

I do not understand the discussion related to teachers not knowing the IEP goals because it is the teachers who write the IEP goals. Everybody who has attended an IEP meeting knows that the classroom teacher shows up with goals already written. At the end of the IEP it is the teacher who goes over the goals and tells us if the goals are mastered or not. So I do not know why we are discussing this. Yesterday the progress reports came home, so we know if there is progress on the goals or not. Who sent your progress report home? Wasn't it the teacher?

The autism endorsement is effective as of next school year. Teachers who have worked full time in a cluster for the last 2 years automatically qualifies for the endorsement, so I don't know if this will change anything. Some, I understand, have taken college classes to get the endorsement.

The autism coach and the ESE specialist both attend monthly meetings with the district They bring the information back to the cluster teachers and discuss it in team meetings. I believe they are well informed.

I have never heard of a principal who has denied a teacher to take a day off to attend a workshop. The district and the union would meet with the principal if this was the case.

The teachers do not decide what curriculum to use. The curriculum is determined strictly by the district. The teachers are expected to attend workshops to gain insight in the curriculum. Teachers are generally very interested in attending these workshops.

ABA is a major part of the cluster's philosophy. For example, reinforcing students rather than punishing them, taking data on behaviors, errorless learning etc. are components of the ABA science, and this has been a part of the clusters for years. However, ABA therapy is not done in the cluster classroom. Teachers are not Certified Behavioral Analysts, and unless they have extensive training in this method, they will not provide the students with ABA therapy. If your teacher says she has received training in ABA I would sincerely ask what training and how is she applying itwith your child. If she says she is providing ABA therapy, I would go and observe her. I have my doubts that this is happening, but I hope I am wrong.

I think it is the teacher's job to prepare and plan good lessons for the children, autism or not. I also think that the women who work in clusters year after year are informed and dedicated to kids with autism. After all, they chose to get an education in special education. Most of the list member here don't even come close to that. Who here has college classes in special education or autism?

Subject: Clusters and SchoolsTo: sList Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask.

The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy – implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful.

The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters??? There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction.

There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade

parents????

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Teachers are supposed to write the IEP goals with the IEP team and the most important members of that team are the parents. No goals should be written without the parents. Many parents are happy to let their children's teachers write the goals because either they do not know that they are supposed to be part of that process, or they do not care.

The autism endorsement is a joke. It is a 120 question test that anyone who has ever been around or worked with an autistic person could pass. I am fortunate that my son's ESE teacher is highly qualified and also trained in ABA. She has a MA in special education and is currently working towards her Ph.D. She has spent her last three Saturdays at a seminar in Broward getting training in ABA and plans on pursuing this further. I think that any teacher who works with ESE students should have a minimum of a MA and should be paid accordingly. I think many teachers who work with special needs kids would love to go back to school to pursue graduate degrees but sadly they are not paid enough to be able to afford this. There is only about a $2,000.00 a year difference between a teacher with a MA and a teacher with a BA and that salary differential is hardly a motivating factor for teachers, many of whom already devote much of their off duty lives to children other than their own.

I cringe when I hear certain parents speak of teachers as if they were scum, even if some of them are, because the vast majority of teachers are working very hard to raise other people's kids. I know about some of the horror stories about restraints and seclusion and we must make sure we make our voices heard by advocating for the most vulnerable of the population; special needs kids, set an example of professionalism and respect, and then make sure we are voting for people who will better our children's lives. Don't forget prayer, lots of prayer. I should have mentioned that first!

Clusters and Schools

To: sList

Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask.

The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy – implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful.

The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters??? There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction.

There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade

parents????

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i am new to this group and I want to make friends before I make enemies. I just

don't agree with a teacher's point of view all the time.I have a 6 year old

child who is in a cluster program.

You are right to assume that the best way a parent can find out about the

experience and qualifications of a specific teacher is to simply ask. It is

public knowledge and you as a parent have a right to know and ask.

I assume nothing when it comes to education. I have asked directly if the

teacher has seen my son's IEP and have received the answer, no. If a parent can

learn anything about Broward schools, it is to assume nothing. So, why must

parents ask for a copy of the IEP before the meeting? And when it is asked it is

tradtional to give it to the parent no more than A day before. And if according

to the law the parent is a part of the development of his child's IEP, it should

automatically be given to the parent with a sufficent amount of time to review

it. It takes time for me to digest food. The same goes for IEP's. I don't like

to be taken advantage of.

I'm sorry to say, your concept regarding why " children learn a lot " using ABA id

not completely accurate. ABA is initially done so the child can learn. In other

words, autism requires a 1:1 relationship where the child will focus on the

single person giving the instruction. Basically, the child will not learn in a

group setting, not because he is use to ABA instruction, but because that is the

only way, unlike typical children,he will learn. He needs to be engaged and he

only does this in the 1:1. Present thinking and it can easily be

demonstrated,ABA does not require a humongus amout of hours per day. I would

guess most outside therapy uses about 10 hours per day.Your final sentense in

the paragraph holds no agua, I mean, no water.I find no logic in it: " Any

therapy implemented for that many hours [amount not stated]and that intensity is

bound to be successful " Right!!!

Your suggestion that parents who feel the school is providing less than

necessary and a parent should consider a private school. Such an opinion is in

fact contrary to federal law. You should look up the full meaning of the acronim

FAPE. Essentially it states that school budgets are secondary to providing the

appropriate instruction in order to meet the child's needs. Also your assumption

that " schools " cannot afford this " luxury " lacks any substance because you

failed to mention what specifically is the luxury. I must say using such general

and undiscriptive words or terms reminds me of the language in most IEP's, not

measurable which is also a federal mandate.

Are we still amigos?

>

> I’m not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know †" without

asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses to gain additional training.  In addition, I’m not sure I understand

how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism

cluster †" ie,  is there a CABA, who †" if anyone -  is trained in ABA

and/or Verbal Behavior,  SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who †" if anyone

has the autism endorsement?  I’m not sure why someone would assume that

teachers do not have copies of  IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops

with access on easyiep.  In addition, drafts of IEP’s are available to

parents before the meeting if  they ask.

>           The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons †" one is that it is

implemented 1:1 †" second, it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any

therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be

sucessful. 

>           The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis.  Are

you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???

 There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery

of instruction.

>           There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a

driving force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying and

being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the spectrum

have specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often individualized

and what works for one certainly may not work for another.  Educating our

children is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to be successful

is to learn from each other.  No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or

cyber/verbal abuse.  Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order

than parents?  How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

>

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Hola Cheryl,

Mutual respect goes both ways. As soon as a parent introduces a advocate to the

mix, the school's respect usually takes a backseat position. Oh, by the way, no

more honey.

ito

> >

> >

> >>

> >>Subject: Clusters and Schools

> >>To: sList

> >>Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

> >>

> >>

> >> 

> >>Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without

asking -

> >>what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses

> >>to gain additional training.  In addition, Im not sure I understand how a

parent

> >>knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster

ie,  is

> >>there a CABA, who - if anyone -  is trained in ABA and/or Verbal

Behavior, 

> >>SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism

endorsement?  Im

> >>not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of  IEP

> >>drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep.  In

addition,

> >>drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if  they ask.

> >>

> >>          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA

> >>because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1

second,

> >>it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any therapy †" implemented

for that

> >>many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. 

> >>

> >>          The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of

> >>implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. 

Are you

> >>aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???

 There are

> >>certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of

> >>instruction.

> >>

> >>          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have

a driving

> >>force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying and

being

> >>verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the spectrum

have

> >>specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often individualized

and

> >>what works for one certainly may not work for another.  Educating our

children

> >>is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to be successful is to

learn

> >>from each other.  No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or

cyber/verbal

> >>abuse.  Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than

parents? 

> >>How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

> >>

> >>

> >

> >

>

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Hola ,

What you say is correct. The mechanics are set up that demonstrates a beginning

and end to the process. Unfortunately where real disagreement comes into play

are the specifics, measurable goals, for example.

The District's approach to ABA is lacking in specifics. They need to take a more

specific approach to using it with all children with delays. You did present

some misconceptions about ABA. First of all, I don't think the common practice

of instruction requires a person with a BACA or any degree for that matter. They

could probably find college students who are majoring in behavorial science or

the like to do the instruction. The important part of this approach is to have a

qualified person supervise the instructors. There is also the misguided

perception that like Lovaas, it will require 40 hours of instruction per week.

Ouch!! I am not going to pay taxes for that either! The actual costs may not be

as high as the District. The District should stop opposing a needed service

because of its costs when in reality the know nothing about behavorial

modification nor how much it costs. After all they are educators and not

behavorialists. One other point. Using something that is based on something else

is meaningless and has the potential of doing harm.The District use to say and

may still say, that the STAR Program is based on ABA. This is incorrect. If you

look at the STAR Program itself you will see one of its components is ABA. But

the District drops that component and states it is based on ABA.

>

>

>

> Subject: Clusters and Schools

> To: sList

> Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking

- what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses

to gain additional training.  In addition, Im not sure I understand how a

parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster

ie,  is there a CABA, who - if anyone -  is trained in ABA and/or Verbal

Behavior,  SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism

endorsement?  Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have

copies of  IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on

easyiep.  In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the

meeting if  they ask.

>           The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is

implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any

therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be

successful. 

>           The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis.  Are

you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???

 There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery

of instruction.

>           There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a

driving force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying and

being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the spectrum

have specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often individualized

and what works for one certainly may not work for another.  Educating our

children is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to be successful

is to learn from each other.  No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or

cyber/verbal abuse.  Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order

than parents?  How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

>

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Share on other sites

We all have our points of view and certainly we have to respect them, while being able to disagree with some of them and present arguments without getting into a fight or making enemies.

, I do agree with you in the points you write about.  I moved from land this past summer and currently I have a 5 year old in a cluster program.  One of the things that I learned the hard way while going through the process of changing states, is that assuming anything in the Broward school district won't get your child what FAPE stands for.  And while I did not agree with their assestment, of my son's skills, and the placement they decided, we still were able to talk and hear each other points of view.  The schools certainly think that they hold the upper hand and very often try to impose it giving any number of reasons or excuses, but as parents we are in the position to show them that our opinion should also count, that is very important because nobody knows our children better than us. A special ed teacher, a case manager and an Autism Supervisor tought me that.  And this can be done in a very civil and respectful way.

As parents we need to be able to ask and be informed about the qualifications of the teachers involved in our kids education, and a letter sent to the parents, almost at the beginning of the year, from the school states that the No Child Left Behind Act of 2002, established that the school will provide information regarding school teacher qualifications and paraprofessionals involved in your kids education in a timely manner upon request.

Currently I am not worried about the knowledge, commitment and dedication of the teachers in the cluster, but instead of the teachers and other support staff that don't interact on a regular basis with our kids and whose focus is the teaching of typical kids.  I had the surprise of hearing a gen ed teacher involved in my son's IEP ask why he could not behave and give the attention to her that another child with Autism was giving her.  I think that the minimum these other teachers and staff should know is that there are not 2 Autistic kids that are or act the same.  That they are individuals, and as different in their needs and learning styles as night and day.  If they don't know the basics how can we expect that other children in the school will understand the differences and be willing to include our kids? 

We are still amigos, .  I can only hope that everybody feels the same.

Carolina

Sent From My HTC EVO

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AMEN, !!!

Gabi

> >

> > I’m not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know †" without

asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses to gain additional training.  In addition, I’m not sure I understand

how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism

cluster †" ie,  is there a CABA, who †" if anyone -  is trained in ABA

and/or Verbal Behavior,  SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who †" if anyone

has the autism endorsement?  I’m not sure why someone would assume that

teachers do not have copies of  IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops

with access on easyiep.  In addition, drafts of IEP’s are available to

parents before the meeting if  they ask.

> >           The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons †" one is that it is

implemented 1:1 †" second, it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any

therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be

sucessful. 

> >           The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis.  Are

you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???

 There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery

of instruction.

> >           There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have

a driving force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying

and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the

spectrum have specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often

individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. 

Educating our children is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to

be successful is to learn from each other.  No one learns well from ridicule,

attack, or cyber/verbal abuse.  Is there a reason why teachers are held to a

higher order than parents?  How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

> >

>

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Hi,

I do not understand what you mean with regards to the "real disagreements". Who disagrees on the goal?

How can "college students" provide ABA therapy in the schools? I assume ABA therapy would run every day as part of the curriculum. Are you expecting college students to be employed by Broward Schools? Would students enrolled in daytime college classes be able to hold a daytime job? The school system continues to cut the budget, and right now there are not even enough staffmembers (assistants or teachers) the way it is.

I borrowed the Star books,( level 1 and level 2) from her teacher.Some of the skills could be taught using ABA therapy, and some of the skills are functional and need to be taught in a natural way (bathroom routines, for example).Where do I see that"one of the components is ABA", like you said?

Subject: Re: Clusters and SchoolsTo: sList Date: Saturday, February 12, 2011, 5:01 PM

Hola ,What you say is correct. The mechanics are set up that demonstrates a beginning and end to the process. Unfortunately where real disagreement comes into play are the specifics, measurable goals, for example.The District's approach to ABA is lacking in specifics. They need to take a more specific approach to using it with all children with delays. You did present some misconceptions about ABA. First of all, I don't think the common practice of instruction requires a person with a BACA or any degree for that matter. They could probably find college students who are majoring in behavorial science or the like to do the instruction. The important part of this approach is to have a qualified person supervise the instructors. There is also the misguided perception that like Lovaas, it will require 40 hours of instruction per week. Ouch!! I am not going to pay taxes for that either! The actual costs may not be as high as the

District. The District should stop opposing a needed service because of its costs when in reality the know nothing about behavorial modification nor how much it costs. After all they are educators and not behavorialists. One other point. Using something that is based on something else is meaningless and has the potential of doing harm.The District use to say and may still say, that the STAR Program is based on ABA. This is incorrect. If you look at the STAR Program itself you will see one of its components is ABA. But the District drops that component and states it is based on ABA. > > > > Subject: Clusters and Schools> To: sList > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > >  > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the

meeting if they ask. >          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy â€" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. >          The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. >          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a

driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????>

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Hola Ann,

I do not completely understand your last paragraph about the parents of spectrum

children.Perhaps it is a language thing. But my experience as a teacher going

back 30 years tells me that teachers were always grading parents of children

with behavior problems.No reason to think it is different today. In fact, with

typical parents we would find the same behaviors from the parents we found with

the children. But spectrum parents are a different story and should be

segregated from typical parents beause the circumstamces are different.You can't

trace sensory behavior to the parents. I'm really not sure what you were trying

to say.

ito

>

> I’m not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know †" without

asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses to gain additional training. In addition, I’m not sure I understand

how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism

cluster †" ie, is there a CABA, who †" if anyone - is trained in ABA

and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who †" if anyone

has the autism endorsement? I’m not sure why someone would assume that

teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops

with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEP’s are available to

parents before the meeting if they ask.

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons †" one is that it is

implemented 1:1 †" second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any

therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be

sucessful.Â

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are

you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters??? Â

There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery

of instruction.

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a

driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and

being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum

have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized

and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our

children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful

is to learn from each other. No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or

cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order

than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????

>

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Share on other sites

As a general rule written goals are not specific and therefore not measurable. I

once had an English teacher who told me that when you write a paragraph or

composition you have to assume the reader knows nothing about the topic. If a

court judge was to review the goals chances are he would need a lot of

clarification for each of the written goal. I like to use this hypothetical

example of a long term goal: " will take several steps forward " and "

will take 10 steps forward. " The first goal is typical of a Team's goal. The

second goal is measurable. When you don't adequately describe a goal, it is

mastered anytime you choose. In the previous menioned goal, what is the meaning

of the word, " several " ? Let me see. It will be many at the annual IEP. How

convenient!

If one assumes that ABA should be taught in the schools, you have to go outside

of the school environment in order to see how it is accompolished. I know of one

facility that uses college students all the time. Whether they are fulltime or

parttime, I don't know. I do know that setting up a schedule using students is

done if a system is set up. What college kid doesn't look for a parttime job and

if he could find one in his major area of study, great!

I don't support any program for children on the spectrum unless it can be

individualized for each child. We keep forgetting these children are as

different as two snow flakes. I have seen children learn proper bathroom

etiquette without the visual effects. Remember , although autistic children are

visual learners, don't forget they develop an extensive receptive language.

I was told a couple of years ago by a school behaviorist that the cluster

program is based on ABA.

The subject of proper ABA in Broward Schools may be beyond our ability to change

things. If the federal lawsuit decides in favor of ABA in the schools, school

budgets won't be an issue.

ito

> >

> >

> > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>

> > Subject: Clusters and Schools

> > To: sList

> > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

> >

> >

> > ÂÂ

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without

asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand

how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism

cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or

Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the

autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do

not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access

on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the

meeting if they ask.

> >          The fact is that children learn a lot

through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is

that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a

week. Any therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely

- is bound to be successful.ÂÂ

> >          The fact is that a public school does

not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and

on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints

of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that

specialize in this delivery of instruction.

> >          There is no doubt that parents of

spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children.ÂÂ

However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a

solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those

learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may

not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The

only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No

one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a

reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be

if teachers could grade parents????

> >

>

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Share on other sites

Hola Jess,

I really don't think ESE parents, as a whole,have any serious complaints about

teachers in general. The parent's only complaint is teachers are told what to

teach and how to teach it. And by the way, none of this will you find in the

IEP, especially how to teach it.

>

>

> Subject: Clusters and Schools

> To: sList

> Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Â

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without

asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how

a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism

cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or

Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the

autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not

have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on

easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the

meeting if they ask.

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is

implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any

therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be

successful.Â

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are

you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters??? Â

There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery

of instruction.

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a

driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and

being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum

have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized

and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our

children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful

is to learn from each other.Â

> No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there

a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be

if teachers could grade parents????

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hola ,I was wondering if you had any suggestions on how to teach these skills in the course of the day? Please keep in mind that there specials, lunch time, speech and other functions that occur on a daily basis. Also, how many hours of 1:1 do you think would really benefit your child?I'm only asking because as a parent of a wonderful little boy with autism, I've found that many teachers are open to my suggestions about what works best with my son and what he needs to make progress. After all, who knows more about the children than the parents? How are your suggestions received during your IEP meetings?MarvaSent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®Sender: sList Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 00:56:44 -0000To: <sList >ReplyTo: sList Subject: Re: Clusters and Schools Hola Jess,I really don't think ESE parents, as a whole,have any serious complaints about teachers in general. The parent's only complaint is teachers are told what to teach and how to teach it. And by the way, none of this will you find in the IEP, especially how to teach it.> > > Subject: Clusters and Schools> To: sList > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training.  In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie,  is there a CABA, who - if anyone -  is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior,  SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement?  Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of  IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep.  In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if  they ask. >           The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful.  >           The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis.  Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. >           There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another.  Educating our children is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. > No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse.  Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents?  How would it be if teachers could grade parents????>

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Hola Jess,

I can't find your response to this posting. Luckily I have a copy.

First, I didn't intend to make a " blanket statement " and imply that all goals

written by the team are not specific and unmeasurable. What I should have said

is that most goals are written that way. I have heard a lot of parents complain

about these goals. If you like I can post on the this board a word for word goal

that everyonr refuses to change, I'll let you be the judge.

You are correct about the two goals stated. One is bad and the other is worse.

I'm glad you brought up the frequency issue.Why must it be 4 out of 5 times and

80% in the same sentence? Now that's asinine. In other words the goal is for the

child to make mistakes. The goal should be 100% but you might master the goal

short of perfection.

I am comfortable with students/teachers doing the actual ABA instruction as long

as it is supervised appropriately.

Jess, I should get you to go to my next IEP........

ito

> > >

> > >

> > > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>

> > > Subject: Clusters and Schools

> > > To: sList

> > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

> > >

> > >

> > > ÂÂ

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without

asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand

how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism

cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or

Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the

autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do

not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access

on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the

meeting if they ask.

> > >          The fact is that children learn a lot

through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is

that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a

week. Any therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely

- is bound to be successful.ÂÂ

> > >          The fact is that a public school does

not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and

on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints

of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that

specialize in this delivery of instruction.

> > >          There is no doubt that parents of

spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children.ÂÂ

However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a

solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those

learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may

not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The

only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No

one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a

reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be

if teachers could grade parents????

> > >

> >

>

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Share on other sites

,

many of our assistants are currently college students. They take classes in the evening. However, I can't imagine Broward School's hiring assistants part time.

It is impossible to compare the school district with a small, private therapist company. Human resources, payroll, benefits, union, FBI clearance, faculty meetings, training...Did you think that these assistants would work only during the reading block? Even if the district would be interested, I can't think of anyone who would like to get up at 6 am to work only two hours for $9.00 an hour. ABA would be implemented during our 2 hour reading block.

You say that "the school's budget won't be an issue" if ABA becomes a curriculum. You missed my point. Well, if ABA becomes the curriculum, then the teachers would be using ABA during the reading block. It would not be done by an assistant. ABA would not be in addition to what they do now, but rather instead of what they do. This would not at all cost anything once it is implemented in the classroom. The only cost factor would be the initial training. This year most teachers have had to attend training in math since we now have adopted a new math program. It will cost much less to train cluster teachers in ABA , so I do not see that being a problem. Most teachers attend a couple of trainings every school year anyway.

Here is where you missed my point: When I mentioned the budget, I was referring to hiring part time assistants (which is your idea). Are you even aware of the crises we are facing next year? Have you read what Gov. is suggesting? The clusters are already crowded. The behavior specialists have been moved, ESE specialists are part time classroom teachers, special teachers are being laid off, media centers are being closed and you think Broward Public schools will hire part time assistants for the clusters?

By the way, you did not answer my question regarding the "one component that is ABA" in the STAR program. I am waiting for you to please tell me this.

Subject: Re: Clusters and SchoolsTo: sList Date: Tuesday, February 15, 2011, 12:50 AM

As a general rule written goals are not specific and therefore not measurable. I once had an English teacher who told me that when you write a paragraph or composition you have to assume the reader knows nothing about the topic. If a court judge was to review the goals chances are he would need a lot of clarification for each of the written goal. I like to use this hypothetical example of a long term goal: " will take several steps forward" and " will take 10 steps forward." The first goal is typical of a Team's goal. The second goal is measurable. When you don't adequately describe a goal, it is mastered anytime you choose. In the previous menioned goal, what is the meaning of the word, "several"? Let me see. It will be many at the annual IEP. How convenient!If one assumes that ABA should be taught in the schools, you have to go outside of the school environment in order to see how it is accompolished. I know of one facility that

uses college students all the time. Whether they are fulltime or parttime, I don't know. I do know that setting up a schedule using students is done if a system is set up. What college kid doesn't look for a parttime job and if he could find one in his major area of study, great!I don't support any program for children on the spectrum unless it can be individualized for each child. We keep forgetting these children are as different as two snow flakes. I have seen children learn proper bathroom etiquette without the visual effects. Remember , although autistic children are visual learners, don't forget they develop an extensive receptive language.I was told a couple of years ago by a school behaviorist that the cluster program is based on ABA.The subject of proper ABA in Broward Schools may be beyond our ability to change things. If the federal lawsuit decides in favor of ABA in the schools, school budgets won't be an

issue.ito> > > > > > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>> > Subject: Clusters and Schools> > To: sList > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there

a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask. > >          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy â€" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. > >

         The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. > >          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for

another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????> >>

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,

I think some type of approved ABA Program should be used when you can verify that the developmentally delayed child is having a problem and cannot progress in the same program as his peers in general ed. Language Arts and Math come to mind first. Perhaps it means scrapping parts of STAR or TEACHE. They sure as all would not share the same status as they do now.

They would have to go through the same clearence as partitme employees go through. If you have enough students you can fill up any schedule. I can't imagine any student who has the opportunity to work parttime in their field of study would not take advantage of an opportunity to do so.

As far as ABA and STAR goes what I wanted to say that f you go to the web site for the complete STAR Program you will find ABA is a component of the commplete system. The last time I looked I noticed that price of the program depended on accepting the whole package or a part of it. Obviously Broward opted for the part and not the whole. I couple of years ago while Alec was in pre-k, a school behaviorist noted that the STAR Program was based on ABA. I haven't seen her lately so I can only imagine the District won't let the horse out of the barn, so to speak.

Another option would be to contract the services outside and bring in "visitors" to each school.

Subject: Re: Clusters and SchoolsTo: sList Date: Tuesday, February 15, 2011, 12:50 AM

As a general rule written goals are not specific and therefore not measurable. I once had an English teacher who told me that when you write a paragraph or composition you have to assume the reader knows nothing about the topic. If a court judge was to review the goals chances are he would need a lot of clarification for each of the written goal. I like to use this hypothetical example of a long term goal: " will take several steps forward" and " will take 10 steps forward." The first goal is typical of a Team's goal. The second goal is measurable. When you don't adequately describe a goal, it is mastered anytime you choose. In the previous menioned goal, what is the meaning of the word, "several"? Let me see. It will be many at the annual IEP. How convenient!If one assumes that ABA should be taught in the schools, you have to go outside of the school environment in order to see how it is accompolished. I know of one facility that

uses college students all the time. Whether they are fulltime or parttime, I don't know. I do know that setting up a schedule using students is done if a system is set up. What college kid doesn't look for a parttime job and if he could find one in his major area of study, great!I don't support any program for children on the spectrum unless it can be individualized for each child. We keep forgetting these children are as different as two snow flakes. I have seen children learn proper bathroom etiquette without the visual effects. Remember , although autistic children are visual learners, don't forget they develop an extensive receptive language.I was told a couple of years ago by a school behaviorist that the cluster program is based on ABA.The subject of proper ABA in Broward Schools may be beyond our ability to change things. If the federal lawsuit decides in favor of ABA in the schools, school budgets won't be an

issue.ito> > > > > > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>> > Subject: Clusters and

Schools> > To: sList > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that

teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask. > >          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy â€" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. > >          The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you

aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. > >          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a

reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????> >>

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You know something jess, you are right about making blanket statements about how

the School Team writes goals. Perhaps if I was more specific and actually posted

an annual goal and let you decide if it is measurable. What do you say?

ito

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>

> > > > Subject: Clusters and Schools

> > > > To: sList

> > > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >  

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without

asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher

chooses to gain additional training.  In addition, Im not sure I understand

how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism

cluster ie,  is there a CABA, who - if anyone -  is trained in ABA and/or

Verbal Behavior,  SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the

autism endorsement?  Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do

not have copies of  IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access

on easyiep.  In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the

meeting if  they ask.

> > > >           The fact is that children learn a

lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is

that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a

week.  Any therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely

- is bound to be successful. 

> > > >           The fact is that a public school

does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity

and on a 1:1 basis.  Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial

constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools

that specialize in this delivery of instruction.

> > > >           There is no doubt that parents of

spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. 

However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a

solution.  Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles.  Those

learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may

not work for another.  Educating our children is a two-way street.  The

only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other.  No

one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse.  Is there a

reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents?  How would it be

if teachers could grade parents????

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

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I'm sorry I have taken so long to return your posting. More often than not a

child on the spectrum has a difficult focusing on an individual. Once this is

accompolished it tends to be a very long road to actually focusing

independently. When a teacher prompts for redirection it establishes a 1:1

relationship. Some children will not engage unless it is 1:1.In other words,

some children will not learn unless it is 1:1. But you have to go beyond this

ratio. You have to use scientificaly based procedures. In my opinion it is not

enough to use ABA based therapies or models. " Based " means nothing.

You know, parents use private therapy in doing ABA. The school will not offer it

becaquse they don't have a system containing qualified therapists. In a way if a

child had the appropriate ABA Therapy, you could almost do away with setting

goals in an IEP.The whole ABA process is goal oriented. When a child " masters " a

goal he goes on to a new one. Presently a cluster child is a slave of the

program is not allowed to progress on his own because he has a class program to

follow.

I'm not sure I answered your question.

ito

> >

> > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>

> > Subject: Clusters and Schools

> > To: sList

> > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >  

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know -

without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that

teacher chooses to gain additional training.  In addition, Im not sure I

understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in

an autism cluster ie,  is there a CABA, who - if anyone -  is trained in ABA

and/or Verbal Behavior,  SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has

the autism endorsement?  Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do

not have copies of  IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on

easyiep.  In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the

meeting if  they ask.

> >           The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal

Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is

implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any

therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be

successful. 

> >           The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury

of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis.  Are

you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???

 There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery

of instruction.

> >           There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have

a driving force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying

and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the

spectrum have specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often

individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. 

Educating our children is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to

be successful is to learn from each other. 

> > No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse.  Is

there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents?  How would

it be if teachers could grade parents????

> >

>

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Share on other sites

Hi,ito. What are "the scientifically based procedures"? Where can I get info for this? The reason I ask you because my son's teacher told me multiple times about his poor focus ,how he is easily distracted in a group as the same time he is doing good on 1:1 and she doesn't know what to do about it. She said " I can't ". And I don't know what to tell her . She is the cluster teacher, right? She ever gave me a hint to get him medication . Can you help me with this issue?

Thanks!

Lin

To: sList From: juan_papidedos@...Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 20:45:41 +0000Subject: Re: Clusters and Schools

I'm sorry I have taken so long to return your posting. More often than not a child on the spectrum has a difficult focusing on an individual. Once this is accompolished it tends to be a very long road to actually focusing independently. When a teacher prompts for redirection it establishes a 1:1 relationship. Some children will not engage unless it is 1:1.In other words, some children will not learn unless it is 1:1. But you have to go beyond this ratio. You have to use scientificaly based procedures. In my opinion it is not enough to use ABA based therapies or models. "Based" means nothing.You know, parents use private therapy in doing ABA. The school will not offer it becaquse they don't have a system containing qualified therapists. In a way if a child had the appropriate ABA Therapy, you could almost do away with setting goals in an IEP.The whole ABA process is goal oriented. When a child "masters" a goal he goes on to a new one. Presently a cluster child is a slave of the program is not allowed to progress on his own because he has a class program to follow.I'm not sure I answered your question.ito> > > > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>> > Subject: Clusters and Schools> > To: sList > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask. > >          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy â€" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. > >          The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. > >          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. > > No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????> >>

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,No, you didn't answer my question. I also didn't understand a few things. What do u mean "prompt for redirection?"And are u saying that cluster teachers are not qualified to do ABA or that the county does not have qualified therapists?You said that cluster kids are slaves to the class program. There are many parents (more often that not) that want their children to be given the general education curriculum. I think you should let them know at your next IEP meeting that you want your child on an alternative curriculum. Remember that all children are different and some do well with the school curriculum while others need more intensive instruction. MarvaSent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®Sender: sList Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 20:45:41 -0000To: <sList >ReplyTo: sList Subject: Re: Clusters and Schools I'm sorry I have taken so long to return your posting. More often than not a child on the spectrum has a difficult focusing on an individual. Once this is accompolished it tends to be a very long road to actually focusing independently. When a teacher prompts for redirection it establishes a 1:1 relationship. Some children will not engage unless it is 1:1.In other words, some children will not learn unless it is 1:1. But you have to go beyond this ratio. You have to use scientificaly based procedures. In my opinion it is not enough to use ABA based therapies or models. " Based " means nothing.You know, parents use private therapy in doing ABA. The school will not offer it becaquse they don't have a system containing qualified therapists. In a way if a child had the appropriate ABA Therapy, you could almost do away with setting goals in an IEP.The whole ABA process is goal oriented. When a child " masters " a goal he goes on to a new one. Presently a cluster child is a slave of the program is not allowed to progress on his own because he has a class program to follow.I'm not sure I answered your question.ito> > > > From: Ann Nissen <forautistickids@>> > Subject: Clusters and Schools> > To: sList > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training.  In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie,  is there a CABA, who - if anyone -  is trained in ABA and/or Verbal Behavior,  SMILE,  Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement?  Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of  IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep.  In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if  they ask. > >           The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week.  Any therapy †" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful.  > >           The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and on a 1:1 basis.  Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. > >           There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children.  However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution.  Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles.  Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another.  Educating our children is a two-way street.  The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. > > No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse.  Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order than parents?  How would it be if teachers could grade parents????> >>

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See response below

To: "sList " <sList >Sent: Fri, February 25, 2011 3:34:23 PMSubject: Re: Re: Clusters and Schools

,No, you didn't answer my question. I also didn't understand a few things. What do u mean "prompt for redirection?"

Perhaps "prompted" wasn't a good word to use. But if the child isn't paying attention which is usually the case the teacher needs to get his attention so that he will start engaging with the teacgher.And are u saying that cluster teachers are not qualified to do ABA or that the county does not have qualified therapists?

BothYou said that cluster kids are slaves to the class program. There are many parents (more often that not) that want their children to be given the general education curriculum. I think you should let them know at your next IEP meeting that you want your child on an alternative curriculum.

I am not really sure if I follow you. The law states that a child should be educated in the general ed curriculum whenever possible. This means you have to put him in the general ed class and very often this should be done with appropriate support. We will soon request that my son be put in a general ed class with support. Although many will say, how is this possible. I suggest the doubtors look up how autistic children may be included in the general ed classroom. After all, it is the law. I don't want my child on an alternative curriculum. Every effort should be made for all children to meet the Standards. This is another disadvantage of clusters. They ignore for the most part, the Standards.

Remember that all children are different and some do well with the school curriculum while others need more intensive instruction.

And how is this determined? Please don't give my child an altered standard test when the test in the first place is not valid for a developmentaly delayed child and no arbitrarily altered test is valid no matter what you do to it to make it work. I would rather have no answer than the wrong answer.Marva

Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®

Sender: sList

Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 20:45:41 -0000

To: <sList >

ReplyTo: sList

Subject: Re: Clusters and Schools

I'm sorry I have taken so long to return your posting. More often than not a child on the spectrum has a difficult focusing on an individual. Once this is accompolished it tends to be a very long road to actually focusing independently. When a teacher prompts for redirection it establishes a 1:1 relationship. Some children will not engage unless it is 1:1.In other words, some children will not learn unless it is 1:1. But you have to go beyond this ratio. You have to use scientificaly based procedures. In my opinion it is not enough to use ABA based therapies or models. "Based" means nothing.You know, parents use private therapy in doing ABA. The school will not offer it becaquse they don't have a system containing qualified therapists. In a way if a child had the appropriate ABA Therapy, you could almost do away with setting goals in an IEP.The whole ABA process is goal oriented. When a child "masters" a goal he goes on to a new one. Presently

a cluster child is a slave of the program is not allowed to progress on his own because he has a class program to follow.I'm not sure I answered your question.ito> > > > From: Ann Nissen

<forautistickids@>> > Subject: Clusters and Schools> > To: sList > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or

Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask. > >          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy â€" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. > >          The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and

on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. > >          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. > > No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order

than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????> >>

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Share on other sites

Lin, I am at a disadvantage in that I don't know your child. Medication is a consideration for a child bouncing off the walls of the classroom. And even then he needs positive behavior modification which the school ignores. You might request your child be reevaluated which a parent can do yearly and the school will request every 3 years. Schools have a terrible record when it comes to behavior modification.

Email me off line.

ito

To: deniseslist Sent: Fri, February 25, 2011 1:02:13 PMSubject: RE: Re: Clusters and Schools

Hi,ito. What are "the scientifically based procedures"? Where can I get info for this? The reason I ask you because my son's teacher told me multiple times about his poor focus ,how he is easily distracted in a group as the same time he is doing good on 1:1 and she doesn't know what to do about it. She said " I can't ". And I don't know what to tell her . She is the cluster teacher, right? She ever gave me a hint to get him medication . Can you help me with this issue? Thanks! Lin

To: sList From: juan_papidedos@...Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 20:45:41 +0000Subject: Re: Clusters and Schools

I'm sorry I have taken so long to return your posting. More often than not a child on the spectrum has a difficult focusing on an individual. Once this is accompolished it tends to be a very long road to actually focusing independently. When a teacher prompts for redirection it establishes a 1:1 relationship. Some children will not engage unless it is 1:1.In other words, some children will not learn unless it is 1:1. But you have to go beyond this ratio. You have to use scientificaly based procedures. In my opinion it is not enough to use ABA based therapies or models. "Based" means nothing.You know, parents use private therapy in doing ABA. The school will not offer it becaquse they don't have a system containing qualified therapists. In a way if a child had the appropriate ABA Therapy, you could almost do away with setting goals in an IEP.The whole ABA process is goal oriented. When a child "masters" a goal he goes on to a

new one. Presently a cluster child is a slave of the program is not allowed to progress on his own because he has a class program to follow.I'm not sure I answered your question.ito> > > > From: Ann Nissen

<forautistickids@>> > Subject: Clusters and Schools> > To: sList > > Date: Thursday, February 10, 2011, 2:07 AM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Im not sure I quite understand how a parent can possibly know - without asking - what the training is of each teacher in a cluster and how that teacher chooses to gain additional training. In addition, Im not sure I understand how a parent knows what the credentials are of the support staff in an autism cluster ie, is there a CABA, who - if anyone - is trained in ABA and/or

Verbal Behavior, SMILE, Visualizing/Verbalizing - who if anyone has the autism endorsement? Im not sure why someone would assume that teachers do not have copies of IEP drafts/final when they all have laptops with access on easyiep. In addition, drafts of IEPs are available to parents before the meeting if they ask. > >          The fact is that children learn a lot through Verbal Behavior and ABA because of several different reasons: one is that it is implemented 1:1 second, it is implemented for many hours in a week. Any therapy â€" implemented for that many hours and that intensely - is bound to be successful. > >          The fact is that a public school does not have the luxury of implementing any therapy program for that intensity and

on a 1:1 basis. Are you aware of the budget cuts and financial constraints of the clusters???  There are certainly very good private schools that specialize in this delivery of instruction. > >          There is no doubt that parents of spectrum children have a driving force unlike parents of typical children. However, cyber bullying and being verbally abusive to teachers is not a solution. Children on the spectrum have specific learning styles. Those learning styles are often individualized and what works for one certainly may not work for another. Educating our children is a two-way street. The only way for our children to be successful is to learn from each other. > > No one learns well from ridicule, attack, or cyber/verbal abuse. Is there a reason why teachers are held to a higher order

than parents? How would it be if teachers could grade parents????> >>

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