Guest guest Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Congratulations to both of you on your weight loss! Not an easy feat! It takes a lot of saying " no " and a lot of determination! check this out. the diabetes doc called to day after I faxed in my last 2 weeks of numbers and he called to day to tell me to go down to 12 twice a day. well all ready done that a week ago and told him so. to night my sugar 2 hours after dinner was 135 and I checked it 3 times. it wasn't off more then 5 either way. so decided to ride my no where bike for 30 minutes to bring it down some before bed. checked it a bit ago and it was in the 70's all 3 times I rechecked it. how can that ride of only 30 minutes bring my sugar down to the 70's that fast? I took my insulin at 5-15. when my sugar gets in the 70's like that I feel bad and I have some chest pain. I told the saw bones I have had some loe readings in the 70's and 80's over the past month. not that many 70's, but mainly they happen right after I have rode my bike. all day to day my numbers has been in the 90's. actually 11 of the last 13 have been in the 90's and this is taking 12 units morning and evening. I'm starting to think that maybe I don't need the insulin any more if I continue the bike riding and taking the 2000 met Forman a day. maybe when I go see him on the eighth of June I will ask him this very thing. I can't stop riding my bike if I wish to lose weight. I would rather the insulin stop then the exercise. I guess we will find out in one week. this is why I test about eight to ten times a day. the lows like the 70's just make me feel really bad. I check before I start my ride and then I test again 30 minutes after I stop. is it better to check right as I finish the exercise or is waiting 30 minutes as I do ok? I have cut my portions down. was talking to a fitness fellow and he said if I'm riding my no where bike for 2 hours a day and only losing 2 pounds in 2 weeks, then he thinks I was still eating to many calories. so I have even cut them down more and we will soon see. I now do one hour on the no where bike of the morning and the second hour around 2 pm. I think this works better for me then the way I was doing it for a few weeks. if I wake up in the middle of the night I will check my sugar again to see where it is. storming like mad here and it sure was way hot to day. heat and cool air mixing it up together is why we have storms going on as I speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Estelle, It is great to hear from you. I have been thinking of you and wondering how you have been doing-and by some miracle, you show up!!! Congrats on the weight los! I remember what a struggle it has been for you and so glad to hear you are doing so well. Keep it up girl! _____ From: blind-diabetics [mailto:blind-diabetics ] On Behalf Of Estelnalissi Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2012 5:42 PM To: blind-diabetics Subject: You are a wonder and so is this list Dear Danny, As a type 2 who has struggled for years to conquer my craving for food in order to stay well, understanding how difficult it can be to lose weight, I applaud your success and appreciate the way you explained specifically how your weight loss affected your insulin requirements. I used to read this list from under a blanket of shame, saying little, not wanting to broadcast my failures. Lately the conversations seem more encouraging and accepting and less terrifying. I don't feel too guilty about my inability to cope to make a peep. For the past year I've greatly increased the percentage of days I eat healthily and I've lost 20 pounds. My need to get better is overcoming my grief at not being able to eat the way I love to. Thank you all for having the courage to discuss your challenges as well as your successes. I care about all of you, and your wonderful community makes me feel less alone. Thank you, Dave, for maintaining this list for so many years, and for sharing wisdom without being pedantically judgmental. You've got a loyal bunch of contributors who feel free to express themselves. Pat, Mark, Cy, , Betty, , ... all of you! Your candor and the time you take to share your experiences means more than you can imagine. Always with love, Lissi check this out. the diabetes doc called to day after I faxed in my last 2 weeks of numbers and he called to day to tell me to go down to 12 twice a day. well all ready done that a week ago and told him so. to night my sugar 2 hours after dinner was 135 and I checked it 3 times. it wasn't off more then 5 either way. so decided to ride my no where bike for 30 minutes to bring it down some before bed. checked it a bit ago and it was in the 70's all 3 times I rechecked it. how can that ride of only 30 minutes bring my sugar down to the 70's that fast? I took my insulin at 5-15. when my sugar gets in the 70's like that I feel bad and I have some chest pain. I told the saw bones I have had some loe readings in the 70's and 80's over the past month. not that many 70's, but mainly they happen right after I have rode my bike. all day to day my numbers has been in the 90's. actually 11 of the last 13 have been in the 90's and this is taking 12 units morning and evening. I'm starting to think that maybe I don't need the insulin any more if I continue the bike riding and taking the 2000 met Forman a day. maybe when I go see him on the eighth of June I will ask him this very thing. I can't stop riding my bike if I wish to lose weight. I would rather the insulin stop then the exercise. I guess we will find out in one week. this is why I test about eight to ten times a day. the lows like the 70's just make me feel really bad. I check before I start my ride and then I test again 30 minutes after I stop. is it better to check right as I finish the exercise or is waiting 30 minutes as I do ok? I have cut my portions down. was talking to a fitness fellow and he said if I'm riding my no where bike for 2 hours a day and only losing 2 pounds in 2 weeks, then he thinks I was still eating to many calories. so I have even cut them down more and we will soon see. I now do one hour on the no where bike of the morning and the second hour around 2 pm. I think this works better for me then the way I was doing it for a few weeks. if I wake up in the middle of the night I will check my sugar again to see where it is. storming like mad here and it sure was way hot to day. heat and cool air mixing it up together is why we have storms going on as I speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Estelle, I have little to do with the good things happening on the list. But thank you for your kind words nonetheless. Like any good company, or institution, or organization, it's the people who make the difference. I'm pleased to be a part of this list just to hear about all these success stories! Way to go with the weight loss! And way to go for taking a bold step and stepping out of the shadows to speak up! Dave ~~ Now available: THE ATTACHÉ! -- From Desert Breeze Publishing ~~ Visit: http://www.authordavidbond.com Upcoming releases: A TIME TO BUILD -- June, 2012 SWEET MUSIC -- October, 2012 A TIME TO HEAL -- February, 2013 OUT OF THE DESERT -- July, 2013 A TIME TO DANCE -- November, 2013 check this out. the diabetes doc called to day after I faxed in my last 2 weeks of numbers and he called to day to tell me to go down to 12 twice a day. well all ready done that a week ago and told him so. to night my sugar 2 hours after dinner was 135 and I checked it 3 times. it wasn't off more then 5 either way. so decided to ride my no where bike for 30 minutes to bring it down some before bed. checked it a bit ago and it was in the 70's all 3 times I rechecked it. how can that ride of only 30 minutes bring my sugar down to the 70's that fast? I took my insulin at 5-15. when my sugar gets in the 70's like that I feel bad and I have some chest pain. I told the saw bones I have had some loe readings in the 70's and 80's over the past month. not that many 70's, but mainly they happen right after I have rode my bike. all day to day my numbers has been in the 90's. actually 11 of the last 13 have been in the 90's and this is taking 12 units morning and evening. I'm starting to think that maybe I don't need the insulin any more if I continue the bike riding and taking the 2000 met Forman a day. maybe when I go see him on the eighth of June I will ask him this very thing. I can't stop riding my bike if I wish to lose weight. I would rather the insulin stop then the exercise. I guess we will find out in one week. this is why I test about eight to ten times a day. the lows like the 70's just make me feel really bad. I check before I start my ride and then I test again 30 minutes after I stop. is it better to check right as I finish the exercise or is waiting 30 minutes as I do ok? I have cut my portions down. was talking to a fitness fellow and he said if I'm riding my no where bike for 2 hours a day and only losing 2 pounds in 2 weeks, then he thinks I was still eating to many calories. so I have even cut them down more and we will soon see. I now do one hour on the no where bike of the morning and the second hour around 2 pm. I think this works better for me then the way I was doing it for a few weeks. if I wake up in the middle of the night I will check my sugar again to see where it is. storming like mad here and it sure was way hot to day. heat and cool air mixing it up together is why we have storms going on as I speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Thanks, Excelle, for your encouragement! Danny Come and follow Jesus, and He will make you fishers of men. What a deal! You catch’em, and He’ll clean’em! From: blind-diabetics [mailto:blind-diabetics ] On Behalf Of Estelnalissi Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2012 8:42 PM To: blind-diabetics Subject: You are a wonder and so is this list Dear Danny, As a type 2 who has struggled for years to conquer my craving for food in order to stay well, understanding how difficult it can be to lose weight, I applaud your success and appreciate the way you explained specifically how your weight loss affected your insulin requirements. I used to read this list from under a blanket of shame, saying little, not wanting to broadcast my failures. Lately the conversations seem more encouraging and accepting and less terrifying. I don't feel too guilty about my inability to cope to make a peep. For the past year I've greatly increased the percentage of days I eat healthily and I've lost 20 pounds. My need to get better is overcoming my grief at not being able to eat the way I love to. Thank you all for having the courage to discuss your challenges as well as your successes. I care about all of you, and your wonderful community makes me feel less alone. Thank you, Dave, for maintaining this list for so many years, and for sharing wisdom without being pedantically judgmental. You've got a loyal bunch of contributors who feel free to express themselves. Pat, Mark, Cy, , Betty, , ... all of you! Your candor and the time you take to share your experiences means more than you can imagine. Always with love, Lissi check this out. the diabetes doc called to day after I faxed in my last 2 weeks of numbers and he called to day to tell me to go down to 12 twice a day. well all ready done that a week ago and told him so. to night my sugar 2 hours after dinner was 135 and I checked it 3 times. it wasn't off more then 5 either way. so decided to ride my no where bike for 30 minutes to bring it down some before bed. checked it a bit ago and it was in the 70's all 3 times I rechecked it. how can that ride of only 30 minutes bring my sugar down to the 70's that fast? I took my insulin at 5-15. when my sugar gets in the 70's like that I feel bad and I have some chest pain. I told the saw bones I have had some loe readings in the 70's and 80's over the past month. not that many 70's, but mainly they happen right after I have rode my bike. all day to day my numbers has been in the 90's. actually 11 of the last 13 have been in the 90's and this is taking 12 units morning and evening. I'm starting to think that maybe I don't need the insulin any more if I continue the bike riding and taking the 2000 met Forman a day. maybe when I go see him on the eighth of June I will ask him this very thing. I can't stop riding my bike if I wish to lose weight. I would rather the insulin stop then the exercise. I guess we will find out in one week. this is why I test about eight to ten times a day. the lows like the 70's just make me feel really bad. I check before I start my ride and then I test again 30 minutes after I stop. is it better to check right as I finish the exercise or is waiting 30 minutes as I do ok? I have cut my portions down. was talking to a fitness fellow and he said if I'm riding my no where bike for 2 hours a day and only losing 2 pounds in 2 weeks, then he thinks I was still eating to many calories. so I have even cut them down more and we will soon see. I now do one hour on the no where bike of the morning and the second hour around 2 pm. I think this works better for me then the way I was doing it for a few weeks. if I wake up in the middle of the night I will check my sugar again to see where it is. storming like mad here and it sure was way hot to day. heat and cool air mixing it up together is why we have storms going on as I speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 Thanks, ! You are so right about commitment and determination, which I find to be easier than I expected. I believe it is easier because I now really want to loose weight. I think I wanted to loose weight before now as long as I didn’t have to do anything different or have to give up anything. Actually wanting to do something is tremendously important! Danny Come and follow Jesus, and He will make you fishers of men. What a deal! You catch’em, and He’ll clean’em! From: blind-diabetics [mailto:blind-diabetics ] On Behalf Of armando del gobbo Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2012 9:03 PM To: blind-diabetics Subject: Re: You are a wonder and so is this list Congratulations to both of you on your weight loss! Not an easy feat! It takes a lot of saying " no " and a lot of determination! check this out. the diabetes doc called to day after I faxed in my last 2 weeks of numbers and he called to day to tell me to go down to 12 twice a day. well all ready done that a week ago and told him so. to night my sugar 2 hours after dinner was 135 and I checked it 3 times. it wasn't off more then 5 either way. so decided to ride my no where bike for 30 minutes to bring it down some before bed. checked it a bit ago and it was in the 70's all 3 times I rechecked it. how can that ride of only 30 minutes bring my sugar down to the 70's that fast? I took my insulin at 5-15. when my sugar gets in the 70's like that I feel bad and I have some chest pain. I told the saw bones I have had some loe readings in the 70's and 80's over the past month. not that many 70's, but mainly they happen right after I have rode my bike. all day to day my numbers has been in the 90's. actually 11 of the last 13 have been in the 90's and this is taking 12 units morning and evening. I'm starting to think that maybe I don't need the insulin any more if I continue the bike riding and taking the 2000 met Forman a day. maybe when I go see him on the eighth of June I will ask him this very thing. I can't stop riding my bike if I wish to lose weight. I would rather the insulin stop then the exercise. I guess we will find out in one week. this is why I test about eight to ten times a day. the lows like the 70's just make me feel really bad. I check before I start my ride and then I test again 30 minutes after I stop. is it better to check right as I finish the exercise or is waiting 30 minutes as I do ok? I have cut my portions down. was talking to a fitness fellow and he said if I'm riding my no where bike for 2 hours a day and only losing 2 pounds in 2 weeks, then he thinks I was still eating to many calories. so I have even cut them down more and we will soon see. I now do one hour on the no where bike of the morning and the second hour around 2 pm. I think this works better for me then the way I was doing it for a few weeks. if I wake up in the middle of the night I will check my sugar again to see where it is. storming like mad here and it sure was way hot to day. heat and cool air mixing it up together is why we have storms going on as I speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2012 Report Share Posted May 31, 2012 here is a success story in the making! I look at weight lost as a swing. for example, if you hadn't of lost the 20 in one year, then you may have gained the same 20 in the past year. of course we can't know this for sure, but I still look at it as a 40 pound swing! 20 lost, isn't 20 gained. the food addiction to me is one of the hardest addictions to beat. like Sir. Dave always says, diabetes control is a 24 7 and so is the food addiction as well. food is all around us and the temptations are out the roof! show me a celebration that food isn't involved? lots of folks can be a over eater. you don't have to be huge in weight to be a over eater. I know folks who don't have a weight problem and yet they can and do at times over eat. probably if the truth was known, over half of the folks in this country are over eaters. we think we got to be served a huge plate at most restaurants or they are cheating us for the money it cost us. more bang for the buck is how we think. more isn't always the right choice, but quality should be. we Americans have been programmed over the years by our folks and our grandparents, but now we see it for what it really is and we each must take responsibility of our own choices and attitudes. we got to all stop blaming it all on the way we were raised or blaming it on society. for many years my attitude was I didn't care what any one thought and I ate what ever I felt like eating and I ate it when ever I felt like having it. I didn't care if my health issues up the road around the corner was going to not only effect me, but as well have an effect on you. now you might think how could my unhealthy ways have anything to do with you? the fact is, you have to pay more taxes in order to cover the health cost for folks like me who made bad choices in years past. more then likely bad eating habits will lead to health issues that could cause me to stop working and then having to live off of other tax payers. If I can't work any more do to my bad health, then you and others must work and pay more taxes to pay for my health care. there is a big chance none of this would have happened if all those many years in my past I would have made better choices when it came to my health. now as much as I hated to admit it back then, but will embrace it to day, is exercise is where it all starts! If you or me was dead set on over eating what ever and when ever, then we could probably keep our weight down by doing more exercise in a day. like maybe 3 or 4 hours a day. most working people who also are raising families don't have the time for 4 hours every day of exercise. most folks come home from work and running kids here and there and they are simply to tired to poot, much less exercise! over eating and having a I don't care attitude about our health when we are young is simply a selfish way of thinking. not giving a care to who will pay our medical bills when the bad choices catch up with us is a selfish way to think. It's not fair to those around us who do care about there health and do the right things to make better choices. I never would have admitted back then that I had a attitude as this, but the truth is no matter how I wish to say it, I actually was a very selfish person and only thought of me and what I thought made me happy. this is so dain sad because I wasn't the only person who felt this way and still a lot of folks still feel this way. I can look back now on how it was for me in those days and why I never could stick to making better choices? I now know that I continued to do it my way and in only my strength and doing the same things hoping for different results. I blamed it on every one and everything in those days, but never did I or would I have pointed the finger of blame back at my self. now for 3 months I'm doing it the right way. I am in control of my over eating, I'm in control of my daily exercise, I'm in control of my daily choices that does effect my to morrows and what is the biggest reason for my attitude now? It was and still is Prayer! I've been a born again Christian since I was 19, but lots of back sliding did I do and Prayer wasn't for a long time a top need in my life. I fell on my face all those different times I tried to over come my addiction to over eating because I was trying to do it in just my strength only. it never worked and never had a chance of working simply because I wasn't taking my weaknesses to the Lord in Prayer. Who best to tell your weakness to then the one that made you? who is best equipped to make you work better and feel better about your self then he who put you together? he was always sitting right there on his throne just waiting on me to fall on my face enough times that I would finally give up self and have no where else to turn. I had to hit rock bottom and realize that I didn't have the strength of my own to over come my addiction to over eating and lack of the desire to have better health. he knew all this, but he wanted me to figure it out by my self and then come to him with the answers that he all ready knew were so. out of control sugars caused the heart attack I had that done 25% damage to my heart. out of control sugar caused my A fib problem to get really bad and all most took me out. A racing heart caused me to go code blue and for 26 minutes they jumped up and down on me to get the ticker to ticking again so I could live on. out of control sugar caused my triglycerides to now be over 1400. only 1300 higher then they should be. who knows but God what else high out of control sugar has done to me? I had a A1C of over 13 and this is a huge big deal! all this was caused from a bad attitude that I only cared for no one and who it hurt. this was even caused from not really giving a flying flip about my self, much less others. I have no answer for you or even my self that made me think for many years how I could lose weight and have better health if I done nothing to help my self to achieve these things. talking about some day loosing weight and exercising is only talk and any one can open there mouth and talk the talk. we can read books and study hard on how to do things the right way to achieve good health, but if we just talk about how to do it and nothing other then just talk? well talk is cheap with out action. those who change there attitude and make better choices in there daily life is those who show them self and the world around them that they can actually walk! the talk. It isn't easy and I'm not going to blow smoke up your back side making you think it is. it is truly a 24 7 struggle that requires strength from above in order to be a success. you and I and so many more like us are simply weak when it comes to temptations and addictions that we face each day of life. we only give in to the temptations because of our weakness and this is true because we don't trust in he who made us and can help us with the temptation. I know not all believe and trust in the Lord Jesus that I do and for you that feel there is no God? well I can only Pray for you to find out before you leave this world there truly is and he has all the answers you need. God knows all about temptations of this world because Satan is the one who throws those temptations in our face. he walks to and fro seeking out who he can destroy by temptation and in my opinion we can't over come or fight off temptation with out the strength we can have from Jesus. over eating and not exercising is 2 choices in our daily walk through life that we got to have control of with a grate attitude. where did I get my grate attitude? from Prayer is where. only one other time in my life did I set out to drop extra weight and I did drop 85 pounds back in 1989. I didn't keep it off because I never set down and had a one on one talk with God about my attitude. I not only gained it all back, but added as much with it when the dust settled. I know I will be a success this time. I know my attitude and my strength isn't my own that is fueling me to keep on keeping on. I've rode my no where bike for 3 solid months every day and not missed not even one day. I can't miss unless it is out of my control. I have over ate maybe 3 meals out of the past 3 months. I do write it down and I as well write down how it made me feel. I don't ever tie 2 meals together that are both over eating meals. I'm not perfect and I will trip up from time to time, but I don't allow my self to continuing tripping until I finally fall and don't get up for a long time. I didn't beat my self up when I did eat more then I should have those 3 times. I picked my self up and continued on with my grate attitude. I know how to forgive my self and let it go. God forgives us as well and also lets it go. tripping up and falling now and again could be just a reminder to us not to forget he who we have to trust and have faith in to carry us through, but I'm thinking we got to meet him half way. we got to show him we trust him enough to do our part. When the going gets tough! and it always will, then the strong get going! and we get strong by Prayer and that strength that only comes to us from God who we go meet in Prayer and leave with all the strength we need each day to get the job done. now don't forget and this is very important to know! Satan wishes for you to fall and stay down. he will try to temp you with over eating and skipping exercise or stopping before you get your total ride or walk in for that day. this is when you got to tell Satan to get behind you and out of your face in the name of Jesus! I can assure you he will do exactly as you say and the rest is a piece of cake. God will never send you, where his Grace won't protect you! I use to think that only eating right was the ticket and exercise was just a added onus. well I now know they are both very important and they go hand in hand! they work together as a team and neither can pull the wagon with out the aid of the other. you just try to only do one and not the other and you will fall on your face in the mud. you won't achieve the goals you set for long. you can't do one and skip the other. making good choices when you eat at every meal and snacks, plus daily exercise of no less then 30 minutes starting out is the way you start. do it how ever will work best for you. exercise 3 times in a day for ten minutes each. do this for a week or ten days. add 5 minutes to each and again do it for a week or ten days. try to work up to one hour of exercise at one time and it may take 3 months or longer, but you will get there if you will simply begin. no race of any kind goes any where with out a start. nothing gets built with out starting a foundation. A book is never written with out starting the first chapter. well losing weight is the same way. start with one pound lost as your first goal. don't weigh every day. our weight changes daily and we can actually gain a pound or 2 when we have done everything right. this will only make you mad and wish to give up. only weigh once a week or every 2 weeks. always be dressed or undressed and weigh on the same scales always. best time to weigh is first thing you do when you wake up. set times for exercise each day and try hard to always keep the schedule. if you stay on a schedule, then it is easier to maintain the goals you set. don't set goals that are to high to reach. start low and slow and then build up as you go along. keep notes of everything. how you feel, how you ate, the amount of exercise, plan where you go out to eat and what you will eat before you arrive. when you feel temptation trying to over take you, then Pray and tell God how you are feeling. of course he all ready knows, but he wants us to bring it to him and then he will help us deal with it. we don't have to give in to temptation! God gives us all the tools we need to fight off temptation if we will only put our faith in him. you see? most of my life even as a born again Christian, I never put my whole trust in God to carry me through. I always figured I could do it with using my own strength. we all go through hard times in life for others as well. we can only help those in need if we too have been through the same. our struggles are also tools to help others you will run in to on your life walk. you may all ready know them and you may not, but God is large and in charge! he has your life and your walk through life all ready layed out and all your struggles during life will touch so many others and it all will Glorify his Kingdom! God isn't finished with you or me, or we would have all ready checked out from a life of bad choices. believe he still has a plan for you and trust him to bring you through it. Now go make a difference in some one's life by achieving your own goals. check this out. the diabetes doc called to day after I faxed in my last 2 weeks of numbers and he called to day to tell me to go down to 12 twice a day. well all ready done that a week ago and told him so. to night my sugar 2 hours after dinner was 135 and I checked it 3 times. it wasn't off more then 5 either way. so decided to ride my no where bike for 30 minutes to bring it down some before bed. checked it a bit ago and it was in the 70's all 3 times I rechecked it. how can that ride of only 30 minutes bring my sugar down to the 70's that fast? I took my insulin at 5-15. when my sugar gets in the 70's like that I feel bad and I have some chest pain. I told the saw bones I have had some loe readings in the 70's and 80's over the past month. not that many 70's, but mainly they happen right after I have rode my bike. all day to day my numbers has been in the 90's. actually 11 of the last 13 have been in the 90's and this is taking 12 units morning and evening. I'm starting to think that maybe I don't need the insulin any more if I continue the bike riding and taking the 2000 met Forman a day. maybe when I go see him on the eighth of June I will ask him this very thing. I can't stop riding my bike if I wish to lose weight. I would rather the insulin stop then the exercise. I guess we will find out in one week. this is why I test about eight to ten times a day. the lows like the 70's just make me feel really bad. I check before I start my ride and then I test again 30 minutes after I stop. is it better to check right as I finish the exercise or is waiting 30 minutes as I do ok? I have cut my portions down. was talking to a fitness fellow and he said if I'm riding my no where bike for 2 hours a day and only losing 2 pounds in 2 weeks, then he thinks I was still eating to many calories. so I have even cut them down more and we will soon see. I now do one hour on the no where bike of the morning and the second hour around 2 pm. I think this works better for me then the way I was doing it for a few weeks. if I wake up in the middle of the night I will check my sugar again to see where it is. storming like mad here and it sure was way hot to day. heat and cool air mixing it up together is why we have storms going on as I speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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