Guest guest Posted October 7, 2001 Report Share Posted October 7, 2001 LOL... ya... " Non-alcoholic beer is for non-alcoholics " . Better watch out for that NyQuill too next time you get the flu. -----Original Message----- From: Jurasin I honestly could care less what they think, in fact have been tempted to go to a meeting and crack open and O'douls because you know that little trace amount of alcohol will set off a binge, right, just like OJ that has been in the fridge for 3 days. Fuck 'em! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2001 Report Share Posted October 7, 2001 I've gone to the drive-though liquor store (what a concept!) to buy cigarettes. That felt funny too. -----Original Message-----From: Tomboy Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2001 8:25 PMTo: 12-step-free ; 12-step-free Subject: RE: (unknown)I am in Canada , so we don't have liquor isles in stores *but* I do feel guilty for even *looking* into a liquor store. I don't even have to walk into the store. I always worry that someone from AA will see me glancing into the store. I don't know if I could ever actually walk into one. Hmmm maybe I should do that, just walk into a liquor store and maybe that will get rid of some of the brainwashing and fear , ie no meetings=drink=die blah blah blah and also the idea that I don't have any control over drinking.Sigh....Tom Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2001 Report Share Posted October 7, 2001 I've gone to the drive-though liquor store (what a concept!) to buy cigarettes. That felt funny too. -----Original Message-----From: Tomboy Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2001 8:25 PMTo: 12-step-free ; 12-step-free Subject: RE: (unknown)I am in Canada , so we don't have liquor isles in stores *but* I do feel guilty for even *looking* into a liquor store. I don't even have to walk into the store. I always worry that someone from AA will see me glancing into the store. I don't know if I could ever actually walk into one. Hmmm maybe I should do that, just walk into a liquor store and maybe that will get rid of some of the brainwashing and fear , ie no meetings=drink=die blah blah blah and also the idea that I don't have any control over drinking.Sigh....Tom Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2001 Report Share Posted October 7, 2001 I've gone to the drive-though liquor store (what a concept!) to buy cigarettes. That felt funny too. -----Original Message-----From: Tomboy Sent: Sunday, October 07, 2001 8:25 PMTo: 12-step-free ; 12-step-free Subject: RE: (unknown)I am in Canada , so we don't have liquor isles in stores *but* I do feel guilty for even *looking* into a liquor store. I don't even have to walk into the store. I always worry that someone from AA will see me glancing into the store. I don't know if I could ever actually walk into one. Hmmm maybe I should do that, just walk into a liquor store and maybe that will get rid of some of the brainwashing and fear , ie no meetings=drink=die blah blah blah and also the idea that I don't have any control over drinking.Sigh....Tom Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2001 Report Share Posted October 7, 2001 But then I'm the kinda guy to answer the door butte ass naked with a joint in my mouth when the Jahovah's Witnesses come knockin'!!! --- Jurasin schematic2001@...> wrote: > I honestly could care less what they think, in fact > have been tempted to go to a meeting and crack open > and O'douls because you know that little trace > amount > of alcohol will set off a binge, right, just like OJ > that has been in the fridge for 3 days. Fuck 'em! > > > I'm curious... of those of you who now > occasionally > > drink, how long did it > > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just > be > > able to enjoy a drink or > > two - maybe even a few too many on a special > > occasion - without worrying > > what others will think? > > Once I get a couple down that red light to stop > never > comes on and I usually wake up going " what > happened? " > I have to take special measures to make sure I don't > tie one on. But still, I'd cheers them and offer to > buy them one! > > J > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Pape > > > > I reget > > using it now since if they ever see me with a > drink > > again (even though I have no future plans on doing > > so) > > they'll think " Oh God he's relapsed, boo hoo, " > since > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2001 Report Share Posted October 7, 2001 But then I'm the kinda guy to answer the door butte ass naked with a joint in my mouth when the Jahovah's Witnesses come knockin'!!! --- Jurasin schematic2001@...> wrote: > I honestly could care less what they think, in fact > have been tempted to go to a meeting and crack open > and O'douls because you know that little trace > amount > of alcohol will set off a binge, right, just like OJ > that has been in the fridge for 3 days. Fuck 'em! > > > I'm curious... of those of you who now > occasionally > > drink, how long did it > > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just > be > > able to enjoy a drink or > > two - maybe even a few too many on a special > > occasion - without worrying > > what others will think? > > Once I get a couple down that red light to stop > never > comes on and I usually wake up going " what > happened? " > I have to take special measures to make sure I don't > tie one on. But still, I'd cheers them and offer to > buy them one! > > J > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Pape > > > > I reget > > using it now since if they ever see me with a > drink > > again (even though I have no future plans on doing > > so) > > they'll think " Oh God he's relapsed, boo hoo, " > since > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2001 Report Share Posted October 7, 2001 But then I'm the kinda guy to answer the door butte ass naked with a joint in my mouth when the Jahovah's Witnesses come knockin'!!! --- Jurasin schematic2001@...> wrote: > I honestly could care less what they think, in fact > have been tempted to go to a meeting and crack open > and O'douls because you know that little trace > amount > of alcohol will set off a binge, right, just like OJ > that has been in the fridge for 3 days. Fuck 'em! > > > I'm curious... of those of you who now > occasionally > > drink, how long did it > > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just > be > > able to enjoy a drink or > > two - maybe even a few too many on a special > > occasion - without worrying > > what others will think? > > Once I get a couple down that red light to stop > never > comes on and I usually wake up going " what > happened? " > I have to take special measures to make sure I don't > tie one on. But still, I'd cheers them and offer to > buy them one! > > J > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Pape > > > > I reget > > using it now since if they ever see me with a > drink > > again (even though I have no future plans on doing > > so) > > they'll think " Oh God he's relapsed, boo hoo, " > since > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 > Interesting thought. I feel that way too. I even feel guilty just walking > down the liquor aisle in the store. I'm more worried about what other people > who know me will think - even those who drink themselves and are > non-steppers. > > I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did it > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink or > two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying > what others will think? Good question, IMO! I guess how long it takes to stop worrying about what others will think has a lot to do with how self-conscious you are. Also, your dependency on others will effect how much you worry about what they think of you. I used to be very self-conscious, and in fact used alcohol, like I think many people do, to alleviate that worry of what others thought. Then quit drinking (in AA) and became very self-conscious again, because the " tool " that alleviated that was gone, and very dependent on other people too, because I was taught to, as well as becoming dependent on others for transportation and all kinds of things. Being dependent on others required me to behave in a fashion that caused other people to like me, to put up with me, and to help me. Since others (especially in AA) are controlling, I had to behave and say (and even think) as they wanted. Becoming free from those controlling people and more trusting of myself (my ability to do things that benefitted me, and my ability to make good decisions for myself) helped me not to worry about other people's opinions. About some things, I am still not " allowed " to do certain things that I think would be good for me (like driving to the store) and have to depend on others. I choose to depend on people who do not force their beliefs and opinions on me. Anyone else, I disregard. I started drinking again 8 months after leaving AA, after realizing that it would not kill me, and that I can control, that anyone can control, drinking. That was an interesting time - with a lot of guilt and self-doubt reemerging. I dealt with that stuff as it came... and after a year or so, the guilt, doubt, self- consciousness are gone. I don't remember how long that took... some of those things went away quickly, others didn't until I faced them. I think the self-consciousness was one of the first things I was able to " get over " , because I became more and more confident in myself as I proved to myself that XA and more importantly I had been wrong (because I believed XA). All the guilt went away, too, except in one instance that I can think of - a person to whom I made stupid, ridiculous promises (that I would never drink again, to my dearest friend)... I still have a hard time getting past that... I would be past it now, if I would just say, " look, I was brainwashed when I made that promise, and it was a mistake for me to make that promise. I made a lot of mistakes at that time and there were many errors in my thinking. " I know he would fogive me, it is just a hard thing to do. He doesn't seem to be an expert in addiction or anything, but he does seem to believe that abstinence is the only solution. I am keeping this guilty feeling for no reason other than fear (self-consciousness is also a form of fear), and I need to do something about it, so thanks for getting me thinking about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 > Interesting thought. I feel that way too. I even feel guilty just walking > down the liquor aisle in the store. I'm more worried about what other people > who know me will think - even those who drink themselves and are > non-steppers. > > I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did it > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink or > two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying > what others will think? Good question, IMO! I guess how long it takes to stop worrying about what others will think has a lot to do with how self-conscious you are. Also, your dependency on others will effect how much you worry about what they think of you. I used to be very self-conscious, and in fact used alcohol, like I think many people do, to alleviate that worry of what others thought. Then quit drinking (in AA) and became very self-conscious again, because the " tool " that alleviated that was gone, and very dependent on other people too, because I was taught to, as well as becoming dependent on others for transportation and all kinds of things. Being dependent on others required me to behave in a fashion that caused other people to like me, to put up with me, and to help me. Since others (especially in AA) are controlling, I had to behave and say (and even think) as they wanted. Becoming free from those controlling people and more trusting of myself (my ability to do things that benefitted me, and my ability to make good decisions for myself) helped me not to worry about other people's opinions. About some things, I am still not " allowed " to do certain things that I think would be good for me (like driving to the store) and have to depend on others. I choose to depend on people who do not force their beliefs and opinions on me. Anyone else, I disregard. I started drinking again 8 months after leaving AA, after realizing that it would not kill me, and that I can control, that anyone can control, drinking. That was an interesting time - with a lot of guilt and self-doubt reemerging. I dealt with that stuff as it came... and after a year or so, the guilt, doubt, self- consciousness are gone. I don't remember how long that took... some of those things went away quickly, others didn't until I faced them. I think the self-consciousness was one of the first things I was able to " get over " , because I became more and more confident in myself as I proved to myself that XA and more importantly I had been wrong (because I believed XA). All the guilt went away, too, except in one instance that I can think of - a person to whom I made stupid, ridiculous promises (that I would never drink again, to my dearest friend)... I still have a hard time getting past that... I would be past it now, if I would just say, " look, I was brainwashed when I made that promise, and it was a mistake for me to make that promise. I made a lot of mistakes at that time and there were many errors in my thinking. " I know he would fogive me, it is just a hard thing to do. He doesn't seem to be an expert in addiction or anything, but he does seem to believe that abstinence is the only solution. I am keeping this guilty feeling for no reason other than fear (self-consciousness is also a form of fear), and I need to do something about it, so thanks for getting me thinking about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 > Interesting thought. I feel that way too. I even feel guilty just walking > down the liquor aisle in the store. I'm more worried about what other people > who know me will think - even those who drink themselves and are > non-steppers. > > I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did it > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink or > two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying > what others will think? Good question, IMO! I guess how long it takes to stop worrying about what others will think has a lot to do with how self-conscious you are. Also, your dependency on others will effect how much you worry about what they think of you. I used to be very self-conscious, and in fact used alcohol, like I think many people do, to alleviate that worry of what others thought. Then quit drinking (in AA) and became very self-conscious again, because the " tool " that alleviated that was gone, and very dependent on other people too, because I was taught to, as well as becoming dependent on others for transportation and all kinds of things. Being dependent on others required me to behave in a fashion that caused other people to like me, to put up with me, and to help me. Since others (especially in AA) are controlling, I had to behave and say (and even think) as they wanted. Becoming free from those controlling people and more trusting of myself (my ability to do things that benefitted me, and my ability to make good decisions for myself) helped me not to worry about other people's opinions. About some things, I am still not " allowed " to do certain things that I think would be good for me (like driving to the store) and have to depend on others. I choose to depend on people who do not force their beliefs and opinions on me. Anyone else, I disregard. I started drinking again 8 months after leaving AA, after realizing that it would not kill me, and that I can control, that anyone can control, drinking. That was an interesting time - with a lot of guilt and self-doubt reemerging. I dealt with that stuff as it came... and after a year or so, the guilt, doubt, self- consciousness are gone. I don't remember how long that took... some of those things went away quickly, others didn't until I faced them. I think the self-consciousness was one of the first things I was able to " get over " , because I became more and more confident in myself as I proved to myself that XA and more importantly I had been wrong (because I believed XA). All the guilt went away, too, except in one instance that I can think of - a person to whom I made stupid, ridiculous promises (that I would never drink again, to my dearest friend)... I still have a hard time getting past that... I would be past it now, if I would just say, " look, I was brainwashed when I made that promise, and it was a mistake for me to make that promise. I made a lot of mistakes at that time and there were many errors in my thinking. " I know he would fogive me, it is just a hard thing to do. He doesn't seem to be an expert in addiction or anything, but he does seem to believe that abstinence is the only solution. I am keeping this guilty feeling for no reason other than fear (self-consciousness is also a form of fear), and I need to do something about it, so thanks for getting me thinking about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 In a message dated 10/7/01 9:46:18 PM Central Daylight Time, phxphun1@... writes: << I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did it take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink or two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying what others will think? >> I stopped the chronic (25+ years) " getting drunk " back in early March of this year; prior to that I drank at least twice a week until (usually) I passed out. Yuck. Then my thinking sort of shifted, and I realized that the belief that I could not have a drink without " getting drunk " was self-perpetuating... I started having 1-2 drinks and then stopping. The funny thing is, so many, many times over the years, I only enjoyed that first 1 or 2, and kept on drinking even when I was really hungry and wanted dinner instead... but I so believed in the myths attached to it that I lived them out. Also I knew if I " quit " it would have to be " forever " , so I always drank like it was the last time I'd ever taste alcohol. Now, if I want one, I have one. If there is some reason not to have another, (driving, too late at night on a work day, etc) I just don't have it. About a month into this, my cat died suddenly, and I knew I wanted to drink LOTS and I did. Didn't help, of course, but I did it deliberately, by choice. A very different feeling than feeling " out of control " or " powerless " . A few times I have had a small amount more than I intended, so I remind myself that I have to be aware of what I drink, JUST LIKE any other person who ingests alcohol does. As to " what others might think " , it took a few months before I mentioned this to my family, and I still wouldn't feel too comfortable drinking around them (too much history there); my friends are quite pleased, as they can make plans with me now and know I won't cancel because of a hangover! -Sambee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 In a message dated 10/7/01 9:46:18 PM Central Daylight Time, phxphun1@... writes: << I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did it take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink or two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying what others will think? >> I stopped the chronic (25+ years) " getting drunk " back in early March of this year; prior to that I drank at least twice a week until (usually) I passed out. Yuck. Then my thinking sort of shifted, and I realized that the belief that I could not have a drink without " getting drunk " was self-perpetuating... I started having 1-2 drinks and then stopping. The funny thing is, so many, many times over the years, I only enjoyed that first 1 or 2, and kept on drinking even when I was really hungry and wanted dinner instead... but I so believed in the myths attached to it that I lived them out. Also I knew if I " quit " it would have to be " forever " , so I always drank like it was the last time I'd ever taste alcohol. Now, if I want one, I have one. If there is some reason not to have another, (driving, too late at night on a work day, etc) I just don't have it. About a month into this, my cat died suddenly, and I knew I wanted to drink LOTS and I did. Didn't help, of course, but I did it deliberately, by choice. A very different feeling than feeling " out of control " or " powerless " . A few times I have had a small amount more than I intended, so I remind myself that I have to be aware of what I drink, JUST LIKE any other person who ingests alcohol does. As to " what others might think " , it took a few months before I mentioned this to my family, and I still wouldn't feel too comfortable drinking around them (too much history there); my friends are quite pleased, as they can make plans with me now and know I won't cancel because of a hangover! -Sambee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 In a message dated 10/7/01 9:46:18 PM Central Daylight Time, phxphun1@... writes: << I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did it take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink or two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying what others will think? >> I stopped the chronic (25+ years) " getting drunk " back in early March of this year; prior to that I drank at least twice a week until (usually) I passed out. Yuck. Then my thinking sort of shifted, and I realized that the belief that I could not have a drink without " getting drunk " was self-perpetuating... I started having 1-2 drinks and then stopping. The funny thing is, so many, many times over the years, I only enjoyed that first 1 or 2, and kept on drinking even when I was really hungry and wanted dinner instead... but I so believed in the myths attached to it that I lived them out. Also I knew if I " quit " it would have to be " forever " , so I always drank like it was the last time I'd ever taste alcohol. Now, if I want one, I have one. If there is some reason not to have another, (driving, too late at night on a work day, etc) I just don't have it. About a month into this, my cat died suddenly, and I knew I wanted to drink LOTS and I did. Didn't help, of course, but I did it deliberately, by choice. A very different feeling than feeling " out of control " or " powerless " . A few times I have had a small amount more than I intended, so I remind myself that I have to be aware of what I drink, JUST LIKE any other person who ingests alcohol does. As to " what others might think " , it took a few months before I mentioned this to my family, and I still wouldn't feel too comfortable drinking around them (too much history there); my friends are quite pleased, as they can make plans with me now and know I won't cancel because of a hangover! -Sambee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 This is very simikar to the way I am trying to deal with my drinking. Instead of thinking of myself as different, which is how I behaved before I first quit, I think of myself as anybody else. I am someone, who has responsabilities. Because of these responsibilities, I can not drink all the time. On top of that, it does not make sense to get drunk everytime I drink. This actually made getrting drunk boring for me. It was no longer a special occasion, it was like ecvery other day. These are the thoughts that steppers have historically feared. Since the beginning of the temperance movement, they have disliked, even hated those who have decided to moderate their usage, even go above and beyond the call, and then keeping it " under control " . This destroys their entire basis for even existing. >From: SamBeeJ@... >Reply-To: 12-step-free >To: 12-step-free >Subject: Re: (unknown) >Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 18:19:44 EDT > >In a message dated 10/7/01 9:46:18 PM Central Daylight Time, >phxphun1@... writes: > ><< I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did >it > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink >or > two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying > what others will think? >> > > I stopped the chronic (25+ years) " getting drunk " back in early March of >this >year; prior to that I drank at least twice a week until (usually) I passed >out. >Yuck. Then my thinking sort of shifted, and I realized that the belief that >I >could not have a drink without " getting drunk " was self-perpetuating... I >started having 1-2 drinks and then stopping. The funny thing is, so many, >many times over the years, I only enjoyed that first 1 or 2, and kept on >drinking even when I was really hungry and wanted dinner instead... but I >so believed in the myths attached to it that I lived them out. Also I knew >if >I " quit " it would have to be " forever " , so I always drank like it was the >last >time I'd ever taste alcohol. Now, if I want one, I have one. If there is >some >reason not to have another, (driving, too late at night on a work day, etc) >I >just don't have it. About a month into this, my cat died suddenly, and I >knew >I wanted to drink LOTS and I did. Didn't help, of course, but I did it >deliberately, >by choice. A very different feeling than feeling " out of control " or > " powerless " . > A few times I have had a small amount more than I intended, so I remind >myself that I have to be aware of what I drink, JUST LIKE any other person >who ingests alcohol does. > As to " what others might think " , it took a few months before I mentioned >this to my family, and I still wouldn't feel too comfortable drinking >around >them (too much history there); my friends are quite pleased, as they can >make plans with me now and know I won't cancel because of a hangover! > -Sambee _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 This is very simikar to the way I am trying to deal with my drinking. Instead of thinking of myself as different, which is how I behaved before I first quit, I think of myself as anybody else. I am someone, who has responsabilities. Because of these responsibilities, I can not drink all the time. On top of that, it does not make sense to get drunk everytime I drink. This actually made getrting drunk boring for me. It was no longer a special occasion, it was like ecvery other day. These are the thoughts that steppers have historically feared. Since the beginning of the temperance movement, they have disliked, even hated those who have decided to moderate their usage, even go above and beyond the call, and then keeping it " under control " . This destroys their entire basis for even existing. >From: SamBeeJ@... >Reply-To: 12-step-free >To: 12-step-free >Subject: Re: (unknown) >Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 18:19:44 EDT > >In a message dated 10/7/01 9:46:18 PM Central Daylight Time, >phxphun1@... writes: > ><< I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did >it > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink >or > two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying > what others will think? >> > > I stopped the chronic (25+ years) " getting drunk " back in early March of >this >year; prior to that I drank at least twice a week until (usually) I passed >out. >Yuck. Then my thinking sort of shifted, and I realized that the belief that >I >could not have a drink without " getting drunk " was self-perpetuating... I >started having 1-2 drinks and then stopping. The funny thing is, so many, >many times over the years, I only enjoyed that first 1 or 2, and kept on >drinking even when I was really hungry and wanted dinner instead... but I >so believed in the myths attached to it that I lived them out. Also I knew >if >I " quit " it would have to be " forever " , so I always drank like it was the >last >time I'd ever taste alcohol. Now, if I want one, I have one. If there is >some >reason not to have another, (driving, too late at night on a work day, etc) >I >just don't have it. About a month into this, my cat died suddenly, and I >knew >I wanted to drink LOTS and I did. Didn't help, of course, but I did it >deliberately, >by choice. A very different feeling than feeling " out of control " or > " powerless " . > A few times I have had a small amount more than I intended, so I remind >myself that I have to be aware of what I drink, JUST LIKE any other person >who ingests alcohol does. > As to " what others might think " , it took a few months before I mentioned >this to my family, and I still wouldn't feel too comfortable drinking >around >them (too much history there); my friends are quite pleased, as they can >make plans with me now and know I won't cancel because of a hangover! > -Sambee _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2001 Report Share Posted October 8, 2001 This is very simikar to the way I am trying to deal with my drinking. Instead of thinking of myself as different, which is how I behaved before I first quit, I think of myself as anybody else. I am someone, who has responsabilities. Because of these responsibilities, I can not drink all the time. On top of that, it does not make sense to get drunk everytime I drink. This actually made getrting drunk boring for me. It was no longer a special occasion, it was like ecvery other day. These are the thoughts that steppers have historically feared. Since the beginning of the temperance movement, they have disliked, even hated those who have decided to moderate their usage, even go above and beyond the call, and then keeping it " under control " . This destroys their entire basis for even existing. >From: SamBeeJ@... >Reply-To: 12-step-free >To: 12-step-free >Subject: Re: (unknown) >Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 18:19:44 EDT > >In a message dated 10/7/01 9:46:18 PM Central Daylight Time, >phxphun1@... writes: > ><< I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did >it > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink >or > two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying > what others will think? >> > > I stopped the chronic (25+ years) " getting drunk " back in early March of >this >year; prior to that I drank at least twice a week until (usually) I passed >out. >Yuck. Then my thinking sort of shifted, and I realized that the belief that >I >could not have a drink without " getting drunk " was self-perpetuating... I >started having 1-2 drinks and then stopping. The funny thing is, so many, >many times over the years, I only enjoyed that first 1 or 2, and kept on >drinking even when I was really hungry and wanted dinner instead... but I >so believed in the myths attached to it that I lived them out. Also I knew >if >I " quit " it would have to be " forever " , so I always drank like it was the >last >time I'd ever taste alcohol. Now, if I want one, I have one. If there is >some >reason not to have another, (driving, too late at night on a work day, etc) >I >just don't have it. About a month into this, my cat died suddenly, and I >knew >I wanted to drink LOTS and I did. Didn't help, of course, but I did it >deliberately, >by choice. A very different feeling than feeling " out of control " or > " powerless " . > A few times I have had a small amount more than I intended, so I remind >myself that I have to be aware of what I drink, JUST LIKE any other person >who ingests alcohol does. > As to " what others might think " , it took a few months before I mentioned >this to my family, and I still wouldn't feel too comfortable drinking >around >them (too much history there); my friends are quite pleased, as they can >make plans with me now and know I won't cancel because of a hangover! > -Sambee _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2001 Report Share Posted October 9, 2001 --- cynthia kipp cyndijk@...> wrote: > Hi, I just found you guys after surfing last night. > I > am looking for a different point of view. Sunday I > will have 10 years of sobriety and I have been going > to meetings for most of those ten years. The last > couple of years I've been finding it increasingly > difficult to make myself go to meetings and I quit > calling my sponsor too. Now for the first time > since > I've been sober, I will not celebrate my sobriety at > a > meeting. I don't feel it's right since I haven't > been > going and working the program. I am about to go get my first one-year coin and keytags, and don't feel terribly guilty about not having been to a meeting since my 6-month coin... (Which means I need to quickly go pick up my overdue 9 month coin, before my birthday...) I figure what the heck, I'll accumulate a bit of status for use in arguments... But then, I never was very good at feeling guilty... I guess my point is just that you don't have to feel guilty about it, whichever thing you choose to do. The truth is, nobody but you and a few neurotic steppers even care if you are at the meeting. > I do feel God wanted > me to get sober and I do feel AA has helped. I had > to > break down some defenses in order to be honest with > myself. But I've had problems with the way the > steps > don't deal with a woman's perspective. I have been > lucky enough to find meetings that are pretty > flexible > and open to discussions about life, not just > drinking. Sounds good to me. > But, I have always beat myself up and looking at my > defects doesn't help my self esteem. And now that I > haven't been going to meetings, I've been feeling > guilty and wondering what's wrong with me. And I > think the guilt is bullshit. I am afraid of > isolating > myself and I don't want to stop growing spiritually. You don't have to stop growing. In fact, it sounds like you are starting a new phase of some real growth. Some of the greatest learning happens when you outgrow stereotypes and canned images, and are left saying, " Now I don't know who or what I am... " > > I am not a religious person so that narrows it down. > > Don't do churches. But any suggestions and > perspectives would be more than welcome. Thanks, > Cyndi > The SMART meetings also come to mind. They are a fun bunch of people in this town. --Or I should say, one out of three is especially that way. Shop around. Groups seem to have personalities as different as people. Of the 3 SMART meetings I hit here, one is boring, and one is neutral, and one is fun. But anyway, I like SMART because you can really tell the truth without someone having a heart attack over you " confusing the newcomers... " Or you not properly appreciating the genius of Bill . Have a good day. __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2001 Report Share Posted October 9, 2001 --- cynthia kipp cyndijk@...> wrote: > Hi, I just found you guys after surfing last night. > I > am looking for a different point of view. Sunday I > will have 10 years of sobriety and I have been going > to meetings for most of those ten years. The last > couple of years I've been finding it increasingly > difficult to make myself go to meetings and I quit > calling my sponsor too. Now for the first time > since > I've been sober, I will not celebrate my sobriety at > a > meeting. I don't feel it's right since I haven't > been > going and working the program. I am about to go get my first one-year coin and keytags, and don't feel terribly guilty about not having been to a meeting since my 6-month coin... (Which means I need to quickly go pick up my overdue 9 month coin, before my birthday...) I figure what the heck, I'll accumulate a bit of status for use in arguments... But then, I never was very good at feeling guilty... I guess my point is just that you don't have to feel guilty about it, whichever thing you choose to do. The truth is, nobody but you and a few neurotic steppers even care if you are at the meeting. > I do feel God wanted > me to get sober and I do feel AA has helped. I had > to > break down some defenses in order to be honest with > myself. But I've had problems with the way the > steps > don't deal with a woman's perspective. I have been > lucky enough to find meetings that are pretty > flexible > and open to discussions about life, not just > drinking. Sounds good to me. > But, I have always beat myself up and looking at my > defects doesn't help my self esteem. And now that I > haven't been going to meetings, I've been feeling > guilty and wondering what's wrong with me. And I > think the guilt is bullshit. I am afraid of > isolating > myself and I don't want to stop growing spiritually. You don't have to stop growing. In fact, it sounds like you are starting a new phase of some real growth. Some of the greatest learning happens when you outgrow stereotypes and canned images, and are left saying, " Now I don't know who or what I am... " > > I am not a religious person so that narrows it down. > > Don't do churches. But any suggestions and > perspectives would be more than welcome. Thanks, > Cyndi > The SMART meetings also come to mind. They are a fun bunch of people in this town. --Or I should say, one out of three is especially that way. Shop around. Groups seem to have personalities as different as people. Of the 3 SMART meetings I hit here, one is boring, and one is neutral, and one is fun. But anyway, I like SMART because you can really tell the truth without someone having a heart attack over you " confusing the newcomers... " Or you not properly appreciating the genius of Bill . Have a good day. __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2001 Report Share Posted October 9, 2001 --- cynthia kipp cyndijk@...> wrote: > Hi, I just found you guys after surfing last night. > I > am looking for a different point of view. Sunday I > will have 10 years of sobriety and I have been going > to meetings for most of those ten years. The last > couple of years I've been finding it increasingly > difficult to make myself go to meetings and I quit > calling my sponsor too. Now for the first time > since > I've been sober, I will not celebrate my sobriety at > a > meeting. I don't feel it's right since I haven't > been > going and working the program. I am about to go get my first one-year coin and keytags, and don't feel terribly guilty about not having been to a meeting since my 6-month coin... (Which means I need to quickly go pick up my overdue 9 month coin, before my birthday...) I figure what the heck, I'll accumulate a bit of status for use in arguments... But then, I never was very good at feeling guilty... I guess my point is just that you don't have to feel guilty about it, whichever thing you choose to do. The truth is, nobody but you and a few neurotic steppers even care if you are at the meeting. > I do feel God wanted > me to get sober and I do feel AA has helped. I had > to > break down some defenses in order to be honest with > myself. But I've had problems with the way the > steps > don't deal with a woman's perspective. I have been > lucky enough to find meetings that are pretty > flexible > and open to discussions about life, not just > drinking. Sounds good to me. > But, I have always beat myself up and looking at my > defects doesn't help my self esteem. And now that I > haven't been going to meetings, I've been feeling > guilty and wondering what's wrong with me. And I > think the guilt is bullshit. I am afraid of > isolating > myself and I don't want to stop growing spiritually. You don't have to stop growing. In fact, it sounds like you are starting a new phase of some real growth. Some of the greatest learning happens when you outgrow stereotypes and canned images, and are left saying, " Now I don't know who or what I am... " > > I am not a religious person so that narrows it down. > > Don't do churches. But any suggestions and > perspectives would be more than welcome. Thanks, > Cyndi > The SMART meetings also come to mind. They are a fun bunch of people in this town. --Or I should say, one out of three is especially that way. Shop around. Groups seem to have personalities as different as people. Of the 3 SMART meetings I hit here, one is boring, and one is neutral, and one is fun. But anyway, I like SMART because you can really tell the truth without someone having a heart attack over you " confusing the newcomers... " Or you not properly appreciating the genius of Bill . Have a good day. __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 10, 2001 Report Share Posted October 10, 2001 > In a message dated 10/7/01 9:46:18 PM Central Daylight Time, > phxphun1@y... writes: > > << I'm curious... of those of you who now occasionally drink, how long did it > take you to lose the self-consciousness and just be able to enjoy a drink or > two - maybe even a few too many on a special occasion - without worrying > what others will think? >> > > I stopped the chronic (25+ years) " getting drunk " back in early March of > this > year; prior to that I drank at least twice a week until (usually) I passed > out. > Yuck. Then my thinking sort of shifted, and I realized that the belief that I > could not have a drink without " getting drunk " was self- perpetuating... I > started having 1-2 drinks and then stopping. The funny thing is, so many, > many times over the years, I only enjoyed that first 1 or 2, and kept on > drinking even when I was really hungry and wanted dinner instead... but I > so believed in the myths attached to it that I lived them out. Also I knew if > I " quit " it would have to be " forever " , so I always drank like it was the > last > time I'd ever taste alcohol. Now, if I want one, I have one. If there is some > reason not to have another, (driving, too late at night on a work day, etc) I > just don't have it. About a month into this, my cat died suddenly, and I knew > I wanted to drink LOTS and I did. Didn't help, of course, but I did it > deliberately, > by choice. A very different feeling than feeling " out of control " or > " powerless " . > A few times I have had a small amount more than I intended, so I remind > myself that I have to be aware of what I drink, JUST LIKE any other person > who ingests alcohol does. > As to " what others might think " , it took a few months before I mentioned > this to my family, and I still wouldn't feel too comfortable drinking around > them (too much history there); my friends are quite pleased, as they can > make plans with me now and know I won't cancel because of a hangover! > -Sambee I am sorry about your cat. They are nice, and soft, and sorely missed when they are gone. Nice that you learned to moderate. That is something we should all be taught much earlier, but instead we are taught that it is probable we can't control our drinking... stupid bullshit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2001 Report Share Posted October 14, 2001 --- Pape mpape_1@...> wrote: > >> I'm a spiritual guy. I believe spirituality is > >> always > >> a good thing, and I firmly believe everyone needs > >> God > >> in their lives whether they're going through > rough > >> times, or having the best of times. The thing is > >> though, all of us have spiritual power whether we > >> realize it or not. God given stuff. We just need > to > >> learn how to use it. Sorry Matt, it sounded to me as if you were making factual statements, i.e. " everyone needs God " , " all of us have spiritual power " , " God given stuff " , etc. It sounded slightly dogmatic and proselytetic to me. Actually, I was raised in a secular family and never really understood how people can believe so firmly in the unknown. The only place I had religion shoved down my throat was at AA/NA, but wait, they aren't religious! I'm sorry I was offensive. J > > Are you serious??? I do not believe in god, > >have no spirituality, nor do I want any. And I'm > >happy with that. I see this as being the same as > AA > >dogma. Excuse me while I barf! > > > > J > > No, i just said that for shits and giggles. Gee whiz > paul if I mention video games are you going to turn > your nose up to that too? I'm sorry for pushing my > beliefs on you, wait a minute, I didn't. Nevermind. > Unless a non-religious person is being cocky and > thinking they're better than me because they don't > follow the " establishment " I don't think less of > them > to try to " convert " them. I'm sure religion was > shoved down your throat and pressed on you for a > while, and all in all was a bad experience for you. > I'm sorry if it was. If you're going to critisize my > point of view, especially on a discussion list of > all > things, do it construtively or shut up. > > Matt > > ===== > I am the Game and I make the rules! > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 31, 2001 Report Share Posted October 31, 2001 Oops! That one was supposed to go just to Netty, but my dumb ass just sent my personal shit to 400 people. Good goin' . __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 31, 2001 Report Share Posted October 31, 2001 Oops! That one was supposed to go just to Netty, but my dumb ass just sent my personal shit to 400 people. Good goin' . __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 31, 2001 Report Share Posted October 31, 2001 Oops! That one was supposed to go just to Netty, but my dumb ass just sent my personal shit to 400 people. Good goin' . __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 1, 2001 Report Share Posted November 1, 2001 > Oops! That one was supposed to go just to Netty, but > my dumb ass just sent my personal shit to 400 people. > Good goin' . Dont worry Pal. Ive been doing it fr years unti. I realized all the steppers reading it! P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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