friends........

[Guest guest]

janice,

thanks for what you said; I have been doing a lot of thinking about my

'friendships' within AA.......in fact friendship was a word that I

always felt was a little inappropriate for some reason, but couldn't

think of a better one; however there are a couple of people that I would

like to stay in contact with, but still don't know whether that will

happen or not. One I knew before, in different circumstances, which puts

a slightly different basis to it.....one that I enjoy discussing

ordinary 'life stuff' with; not endless program speak and so on, so that

may survive; but apart from that, the others that I would have

considered myself to be reasonably close to, well, I have been

wondering........in actual fact the only thing we have - had! - in

common WAS AA: there is no other 'tie' so I don't see that lasting. Sad

in a way, but that's what I think will happen.

One thing that I am still very unsure of is the 'what to say'

scenario.........at the moment I feel quite strongly that I do NOT want

to discuss or explain myself as to why I am 'no longer at

meetings'........but am just waiting for the questions, whch I know will

appear sooner or later. I am still very much in the midst of sorting

myself out, and have no desire to hassle myself ...nor do I feel the

need to justify myself; but I also know that they will not understand.

Having had a bit of anxiety and 'what if I think I should go back to

meetings? " the other night, I know that this kind of thing - ie the

'don't you think you ought to/you know what will happen if you don't/

(and even worse, the " Well, I'm ONLY speaking for myself, but I know

what would happen to me if....... " (I so hate that cop-out 'only

speaking for myself' shit which is in fact just the opposite, with bells

on!) - all that would just give me head hassle that I don't need at the

moment(never do, come to that, but am not feeling particularly wonderful

at the moment, a bit vulnerable and mixed up)

So, not sure about all that. Would be interested to hear more

experiences from you lot.........

M.

[Guest guest]

I dumped a lot of my AA friends when I saw them off their meds!

[Guest guest]

M -

I have been telling the truth - That I accidently found the "aadeprogramming" site, and that I went into it out of curiosity - Actually, so I could blast those anti-AA commies with my love of AA, how it saved me shit. I read a couple of messages on the site, one of which referred to the "aakills" site. Again, curiosity got the best of me. What I read about how AA really worked was absolutely the truth, and there was no denying any of it. I was pretty shellshocked, but that was the end of AA for me. My two closest "friends" are not speaking to me. A voice mail message was left on my phone yesterday from one of them who said she had to "detatch with love", among other crap. She called me this morning to tell me she was sorry that she left such a message on voice mail, but I have to understand that this is a rough time of year for her. I asked what that had to do with our supposed friendship. Started talking about being in a "delicate" way...I stopped her mid-sentence, told her that it was obvious she wasn't my friend, and hung up on her (after telling her I was doing so). Haven't heard from her since, and probably won't. It's becoming more and more apparent to me that more than a few of these people live for the program and don't know how (and don't want) to relate to anyone outside of it. I have heard over and over that AA ruins an "alcoholic's" drinking. A little common sense ruins AA.

Janice

CB wrote: janice,thanks for what you said; I have been doing a lot of thinking about my'friendships' within AA.......in fact friendship was a word that Ialways felt was a little inappropriate for some reason, but couldn'tthink of a better one; however there are a couple of people that I wouldlike to stay in contact with, but still don't know whether that willhappen or not. One I knew before, in different circumstances, which putsa slightly different basis to it.....one that I enjoy discussingordinary 'life stuff' with; not endless program speak and so on, so thatmay survive; but apart from that, the others that I would haveconsidered myself to be reasonably close to, well, I have beenwondering........in actual fact the only thing we have - had! - incommon WAS AA: there is no other 'tie' so I don't see that lasting. Sadin a way, but that's what I think will happen.One thing that I am still very unsure of is the 'what to say'scenario.........at the moment I feel quite strongly that I do NOT wantto discuss or explain myself as to why I am 'no longer atmeetings'........but am just waiting for the questions, whch I know willappear sooner or later. I am still very much in the midst of sortingmyself out, and have no desire to hassle myself ...nor do I feel theneed to justify myself; but I also know that they will not understand.Having had a bit of anxiety and 'what if I think I should go back tomeetings?" the other night, I know that this kind of thing - ie the'don't you think you ought to/you know what will happen if you don't/(and even worse, the "Well, I'm ONLY speaking for myself, but I knowwhat would happen to me if......." (I so hate that cop-out 'onlyspeaking for myself' shit which is in fact just the opposite, with bellson!) - all that would just give me head hassle that I don't need at themoment(never do, come to that, but am not feeling particularly wonderfulat the moment, a bit vulnerable and mixed up)So, not sure about all that. Would be interested to hear moreexperiences from you lot.........M.

[Guest guest]

"She called me this morning to tell me she was sorry that she left such a message on voice mail, but I have to understand that this is a rough time of year for her."

I have a couple of ex-NA/AA friends that left "the rooms" before I did. For Dee, the last straw was when she went through surgery on a vertabrae in her neck, and the Dr. put her on narcotic pain meds after surgery.

Dee decided to take them as prescribed (this time, she hadn't taken prescribed meds in the past) since the pain was so bad. One of her "support group" called her and told Dee that she couldn't talk to her as long as she was "on drugs". The reason given was that it made this girl "want to use".

The stupidity of this is obvious, but was compounded by the fact that noone thought to try and support Dee through her surgery, or even glance at the "In Times of Illness" pamphlet. Everyone just parted like the red sea because of their amazing, program supported, self-centered bullshit.

Re: friends........

M - I have been telling the truth - That I accidently found the "aadeprogramming" site, and that I went into it out of curiosity - Actually, so I could blast those anti-AA commies with my love of AA, how it saved me shit. I read a couple of messages on the site, one of which referred to the "aakills" site. Again, curiosity got the best of me. What I read about how AA really worked was absolutely the truth, and there was no denying any of it. I was pretty shellshocked, but that was the end of AA for me. My two closest "friends" are not speaking to me. A voice mail message was left on my phone yesterday from one of them who said she had to "detatch with love", among other crap. She called me this morning to tell me she was sorry that she left such a message on voice mail, but I have to understand that this is a rough time of year for her. I asked what that had to do with our supposed friendship. Started talking about being in a "delicate" way...I stopped her mid-sentence, told her that it was obvious she wasn't my friend, and hung up on her (after telling her I was doing so). Haven't heard from her since, and probably won't. It's becoming more and more apparent to me that more than a few of these people live for the program and don't know how (and don't want) to relate to anyone outside of it. I have heard over and over that AA ruins an "alcoholic's" drinking. A little common sense ruins AA. Janice CB wrote: janice,thanks for what you said; I have been doing a lot of thinking about my'friendships' within AA.......in fact friendship was a word that Ialways felt was a little inappropriate for some reason, but couldn'tthink of a better one; however there are a couple of people that I wouldlike to stay in contact with, but still don't know whether that willhappen or not. One I knew before, in different circumstances, which putsa slightly different basis to it.....one that I enjoy discussingordinary 'life stuff' with; not endless program speak and so on, so thatmay survive; but apart from that, the others that I would haveconsidered myself to be reasonably close to, well, I have beenwondering........in actual fact the only thing we have - had! - incommon WAS AA: there is no other 'tie' so I don't see that lasting. Sadin a way, but that's what I think will happen.One thing that I am still very unsure of is the 'what to say'scenario.........at the moment I feel quite strongly that I do NOT wantto discuss or explain myself as to why I am 'no longer atmeetings'........but am just waiting for the questions, whch I know willappear sooner or later. I am still very much in the midst of sortingmyself out, and have no desire to hassle myself ...nor do I feel theneed to justify myself; but I also know that they will not understand.Having had a bit of anxiety and 'what if I think I should go back tomeetings?" the other night, I know that this kind of thing - ie the'don't you think you ought to/you know what will happen if you don't/(and even worse, the "Well, I'm ONLY speaking for myself, but I knowwhat would happen to me if......." (I so hate that cop-out 'onlyspeaking for myself' shit which is in fact just the opposite, with bellson!) - all that would just give me head hassle that I don't need at themoment(never do, come to that, but am not feeling particularly wonderfulat the moment, a bit vulnerable and mixed up)So, not sure about all that. Would be interested to hear moreexperiences from you lot.........M.

[Guest guest]

The reason given was that it made this girl " want to use " .

> The stupidity of this is obvious, but was compounded by the fact

that noone thought to try and support Dee through her surgery, or

even glance at the " In Times of Illness " pamphlet. Everyone just

parted like the red sea because of their amazing, program supported,

self-centered bullshit.

At the NA meeting I attended, one stepper shared how her oldest son -

a teenager - worried about his mother taking meds for an illness. He

was afraid that his mother would relapse and this woman yammered on

how " grateful " she was for her son's support. It is sick how many of

these cultists mentally abuse their children via the " program " .

Sometimes I think that these people like that girl you mentioned need

to go out and " use " again. If these asses are that neurotic without

drugs, perhaps they need to go " back out " . I know...that is

not " spiritual " ...LOL!!!

And to think that I bought into this $hit for so many years. I was

afraid to take allergy meds or cold relievers for about five years

due to this mental BS. So instead I suffered when an allergy attack

came on and put those homeopathic pills under my tongue hoping that

maybe this time they would take effect knowing damned well that I

would just lie in bed and suffer. I know...that is

not " spiritual " ...LOL!!!

http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/aaornatwelvestepcults

[Guest guest]

It is sick how many of these cultists mentally abuse their children via the "program".

Good God, I never thought about that before. I have seen it a blue million times, but never really registered it. My 2nd to last sponsor was one of the worst. One of her kids was so wracked up over fear of her relapsing that it was ridiculous. What was so funny is that this child had no memory of her using. She could only go off of the manufactured, over exaggerated war stories that Judy told. I wonder how much of a case for psychological abuse could be made out of some of this crap? I wonder how long it will be before that issue comes to court, either brought up by a disgruntled spouse, or the child themselves.

I decided that my daughter was not going around the "rooms" about 3 mo. after she was born. 1) There are too many predators. All I needed to do was feel like I was offering my child up for sacrifice to the freaks, like a good little cult member. 2) The kids that I have seen come around the "rooms" with their parents usually end up with a major drug/alcohol problem because they were given a bunch of exaggerated war stories to live up to.

If these asses are that neurotic without drugs, perhaps they need to go "back out". I know...that is not "spiritual"...LOL!!!

Tsk! tsk! Didn't your sponsor teach you that honesty is a spiritual principle, too. You can justify anything with that one. Besides, I agree with you and I am SO SICK of twisted spiritual principles. I want to be a rude, obnoxious, bi*** for a while . Damnit, I've earned the right. LOL!!!

Re: friends........

> The reason given was that it made this girl "want to use". > > The stupidity of this is obvious, but was compounded by the fact > that noone thought to try and support Dee through her surgery, or > even glance at the "In Times of Illness" pamphlet. Everyone just > parted like the red sea because of their amazing, program supported, > self-centered bullshit. > > At the NA meeting I attended, one stepper shared how her oldest son - > a teenager - worried about his mother taking meds for an illness. He > was afraid that his mother would relapse and this woman yammered on > how "grateful" she was for her son's support. It is sick how many of > these cultists mentally abuse their children via the "program". > Sometimes I think that these people like that girl you mentioned need > to go out and "use" again. If these asses are that neurotic without > drugs, perhaps they need to go "back out". I know...that is > not "spiritual"...LOL!!!> > And to think that I bought into this $hit for so many years. I was > afraid to take allergy meds or cold relievers for about five years > due to this mental BS. So instead I suffered when an allergy attack > came on and put those homeopathic pills under my tongue hoping that > maybe this time they would take effect knowing damned well that I > would just lie in bed and suffer. I know...that is > not "spiritual"...LOL!!!> > > > http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/aaornatwelvestepcults> > >

[Guest guest]

THE LUNATIC IS IN MY HEAD/THERE'S SOMEONE IN MY HEAD BUT IT'S NOT ME

Gee thanks, Mr. !

smoke gets in your eyes