bpd and add

[Guest guest]

I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I realize that

my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always disorganized to the

point of chaos when I was growing up. She really, really struggled to start or

finish anything.

I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the connections

between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or have any resources

to suggest?

I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother was. Now

I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my disorganization is

learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how much is add/brain

related.

I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

HC

[Guest guest]

I think, just based my own personal experience and from what I've read (I'm not

a psychologist) that borderline pd can exist independently of attention deficit

disorder, and vice-versa. They don't necessarily occur together, but can occur

together.

The reason I think that is because my nada was definitely borderline pd

(diagnosed twice, by two different therapists) but she was also hyper-organized,

perfectionistic and rigidly controlling, which are traits of

obsessive-compulsive *personality disorder* (which is confusingly not the same

thing as obsessive-compulsive disorder.)

OCPD is sort of the opposite of ADD.

She was a professional book-keeper/accountant and ran our household like it was

a hospital or something. Everything had to be organized and cleaned to her

exact specifications and we would get screamed at, shamed and punished for not

folding the towels, making the bed or cleaning the kitchen " the right way " .

Mess, disorder and noise made her nervous and upset. Wherever my mother lived,

it was always so neat and clean and (to me) lacking in warmth and individuality

that it looked sterile, like a story display or something; like nobody actually

lived there.

Nada was still doing her own bill-paying until rather late in her life, until

the senile dementia became more severe, and she was totally obsessed with her

finances, monitoring her accounts, changing banks to get the best CD rates, etc.

My hyper-controlling nada was more of a " Queen " and " Witch " type of BPD. Was

your nada more of a " Waif " or a " Hermit " type of BPD, perhaps?

-Annie

>

> I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I realize

that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always disorganized to

the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really, really struggled to start

or finish anything.

>

> I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the connections

between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or have any resources

to suggest?

>

> I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother was.

Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my disorganization

is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how much is add/brain

related.

>

> I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

>

> HC

>

[Guest guest]

HC, I just looked up reason for ADD on line. There's a lot of good info

there. As a child I had to go to summer school every summer for

" reading comprehension " problems. I now know it to be ADD. I'm 58 yrs. old

and

just recently discovered that I have ADD. The summer school classes I had

to go to for 11 yrs of my childhood did me no good whatsoever!!! My last

year of summer school, my parents made me go to a speed reading class!!!

God bless, I couldn't retain anything reading slow, now I've been sent

for SPEED READING!!! What a nightmare that was for me. However, if it was

something I was actually interested in I could absorb it quickly, which I

am still able to do. If I'm not interested, forget it, I can't learn it

or understand it. Laurie

In a message dated 7/18/2012 12:08:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

anuria-67854@... writes:

I think, just based my own personal experience and from what I've read (I'm

not a psychologist) that borderline pd can exist independently of

attention deficit disorder, and vice-versa. They don't necessarily occur

together,

but can occur together.

The reason I think that is because my nada was definitely borderline pd

(diagnosed twice, by two different therapists) but she was also

hyper-organized, perfectionistic and rigidly controlling, which are traits of

obsessive-compulsive *personality disorder* (which is confusingly not the same

thing

as obsessive-compulsive disorder.)

OCPD is sort of the opposite of ADD.

She was a professional book-keeper/accountant and ran our household like

it was a hospital or something. Everything had to be organized and cleaned

to her exact specifications and we would get screamed at, shamed and

punished for not folding the towels, making the bed or cleaning the kitchen

" the

right way " . Mess, disorder and noise made her nervous and upset. Wherever my

mother lived, it was always so neat and clean and (to me) lacking in

warmth and individuality that it looked sterile, like a story display or

something; like nobody actually lived there.

Nada was still doing her own bill-paying until rather late in her life,

until the senile dementia became more severe, and she was totally obsessed

with her finances, monitoring her accounts, changing banks to get the best CD

rates, etc.

My hyper-controlling nada was more of a " Queen " and " Witch " type of BPD.

Was your nada more of a " Waif " or a " Hermit " type of BPD, perhaps?

-Annie

>

> I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really, really

struggled to start or finish anything.

>

> I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or have

any resources to suggest?

>

> I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother

was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how much

is

add/brain related.

>

> I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

>

> HC

>

[Guest guest]

Hi HC,

Bpd and npd can both look like adhd even when they aren't (so can trauma,

stress, and lack of adequate sleep). Adhd is largely about weak attentional and

executive controls (difficulty activating or maintaining attention and

organizing one's own mental processes, making decisions, setting goals and

organizing actions to achieve them.)

I think people with bpd and npd sometimes have weak executive controls just

because they have other priorities--like attending to emotional needs or getting

narcissistic supply, so skills like weighing pros and cons of decisions or

crafting a plan of action just get neglected and remain stunted. Npds sometimes

feel they shouldn't have to actually apply any effort to achieve their

goals--everything should be handed to them--so you do see a lot of abandoned

projects--and bpds will tend to give things up once they become disillusioned

with the new activity as a cure-all for their emotional distress.

Impulsivity can also be a core part of adhd, and I think bpd and npd people can

be impulsive for similar reasons as those for having weak executive controls.

Restraining their impulses just doesn't seem important to them (because they

feel entitled to act on whatever they are feeling anyway), and therefore they

can't be bothered to learn how. I guess what I'm saying is people with adhd

differ in their neurocognitive functioning. People with bpd and npd, on the

other hand, are sometimes just lazy. They are like people with fully

functioning legs who can't be bothered to learn to walk and just crawl their

whole lives. This isn't to say there aren't other people with bpd/npd who

aren't highly focused and achievement oriented. Some are.

I notice a lot of commonalities with students who seem to have indications of

emerging bpd or npd and students with diagnosed adhd--they can get very fidgety

and are easily bored, stir up drama, or behave impulsively. However, there is a

different quality to how they go about this, though. Students with npd/bpd

traits still seem much less " spacey " and more purposeful in their affect when

they are bored and off-task than kids with adhd. Also, they will usually

immediately go about seeking some kind of source of supply, soothing, or

connection to someone important when bored. It isn't random at all. Kids with

adhd may turn their attention to almost anything--the wallpaper, their paper,

something in their backpack.

So, I think there can be an overlap of symptoms, and certainly people with bpd

and npd can have adhd as much as anyone else. On the other hand, I seem to

remember that adhd is a diagnosis of exclusion--it's inattentiveness without

another recognizable cause.

My mother was also extremely disorganized--although she would periodically go

into flurries of organization. I never had any models or guidance at home in

how to be an organized person, and although I'm now usually quite organized, I

feel like lack of models for daily living is part of the bpd/npd legacy. It was

hard to learn how to organized my life and took me a long time. At the same

time, disorganization in my environment tends to make me really anxious--the

house always fell totally apart before my mom had psychotic breaks. So

sometimes when I'm really busy with other things and I should just let some

minor detail go, I can't because the anxiety is too troubling.

Trauma symptoms felt to me a lot like adhd in myself. I felt really scattered

and in a fog (exactly like those adult adhd commercials) until I dealt with more

of the trauma in therapy. Medication also helped, incidentally. It allowed me

to stay focused enough that I gained some self-esteem through being able to

achieve more and also helped me to get more done in therapy. I don't think I

have any adhd symptoms anymore at all.

It can be really hard to tease the two apart.

Take care,

Ashana

[Guest guest]

Oh yeah. I understand that problem, big time. I can force myself if I really,

really, really have to, but it takes a herculean effort and only after god only

knows how much procrastinating first.

Thanks for your response.

HC

> >

> > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really, really

> struggled to start or finish anything.

> >

> > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or have

> any resources to suggest?

> >

> > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother

> was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how

much is

> add/brain related.

> >

> > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> >

> > HC

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Annie,

Yes my mother was more the waif type, though she had increasing episodes of

queen and witch as she aged.

That is so interesting what you say about ADD and OCPD being sort of opposites,

because i have long thought that my sister has OCPD and now I know I have ADD.

I've always thought of us as being opposites in our personalities and behaviors.

Communicating for us is a nightmare. We basically just can't do it and I've

recently come to accept it.

This whole ADD thing is really new to me and it is making me rethink so many

things.

HC

> >

> > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I realize

that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always disorganized to

the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really, really struggled to start

or finish anything.

> >

> > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or have

any resources to suggest?

> >

> > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother was.

Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my disorganization

is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how much is add/brain

related.

> >

> > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> >

> > HC

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Ash,

Thank you for this thoughtful reply. I know what you mean about the teasing

apart part. I had a lot of trauma to work through and a lot of anxiety and

grief to go with it. I knew there was no point in pursuing the ADD question

until I was out the other end of that, because there is so much overlap in the

symptomatology. PTSD looks a lot like ADHD.

A disorganized environment makes me really anxious too, but until pretty

recently it made me even MORE anxious to attempt to deal with it.

If I find something interesting/stimulating, my attention is riveted. If I

don't, I glaze over. It is a source of frustration for me and actually hurtful

to some people. There are certain people that as much as I want to tune into, I

can not. It has something to do with the way they speak and how long it takes

for their ideas to come out.

Did you think at one time that you had ADD or ADHD? Is that what you were

taking medication for?

>

> Hi HC,

>

> Bpd and npd can both look like adhd even when they aren't (so can trauma,

stress, and lack of adequate sleep). Adhd is largely about weak attentional and

executive controls (difficulty activating or maintaining attention and

organizing one's own mental processes, making decisions, setting goals and

organizing actions to achieve them.)

>

> I think people with bpd and npd sometimes have weak executive controls just

because they have other priorities--like attending to emotional needs or getting

narcissistic supply, so skills like weighing pros and cons of decisions or

crafting a plan of action just get neglected and remain stunted. Npds sometimes

feel they shouldn't have to actually apply any effort to achieve their

goals--everything should be handed to them--so you do see a lot of abandoned

projects--and bpds will tend to give things up once they become disillusioned

with the new activity as a cure-all for their emotional distress.

>

> Impulsivity can also be a core part of adhd, and I think bpd and npd people

can be impulsive for similar reasons as those for having weak executive

controls. Restraining their impulses just doesn't seem important to them

(because they feel entitled to act on whatever they are feeling anyway), and

therefore they can't be bothered to learn how. I guess what I'm saying is

people with adhd differ in their neurocognitive functioning. People with bpd

and npd, on the other hand, are sometimes just lazy. They are like people with

fully functioning legs who can't be bothered to learn to walk and just crawl

their whole lives. This isn't to say there aren't other people with bpd/npd who

aren't highly focused and achievement oriented. Some are.

>

> I notice a lot of commonalities with students who seem to have indications of

emerging bpd or npd and students with diagnosed adhd--they can get very fidgety

and are easily bored, stir up drama, or behave impulsively. However, there is a

different quality to how they go about this, though. Students with npd/bpd

traits still seem much less " spacey " and more purposeful in their affect when

they are bored and off-task than kids with adhd. Also, they will usually

immediately go about seeking some kind of source of supply, soothing, or

connection to someone important when bored. It isn't random at all. Kids with

adhd may turn their attention to almost anything--the wallpaper, their paper,

something in their backpack.

>

> So, I think there can be an overlap of symptoms, and certainly people with bpd

and npd can have adhd as much as anyone else. On the other hand, I seem to

remember that adhd is a diagnosis of exclusion--it's inattentiveness without

another recognizable cause.

>

> My mother was also extremely disorganized--although she would periodically go

into flurries of organization. I never had any models or guidance at home in

how to be an organized person, and although I'm now usually quite organized, I

feel like lack of models for daily living is part of the bpd/npd legacy. It was

hard to learn how to organized my life and took me a long time. At the same

time, disorganization in my environment tends to make me really anxious--the

house always fell totally apart before my mom had psychotic breaks. So

sometimes when I'm really busy with other things and I should just let some

minor detail go, I can't because the anxiety is too troubling.

>

> Trauma symptoms felt to me a lot like adhd in myself. I felt really scattered

and in a fog (exactly like those adult adhd commercials) until I dealt with more

of the trauma in therapy. Medication also helped, incidentally. It allowed me

to stay focused enough that I gained some self-esteem through being able to

achieve more and also helped me to get more done in therapy. I don't think I

have any adhd symptoms anymore at all.

>

> It can be really hard to tease the two apart.

>

> Take care,

> Ashana

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Heartfulcourage, Dear Laurie, Dear Annie,

What you wrote really speaks to me. 

I first heard about ADD few months ago, I didn't know what it was. I googled it

and what I read really estonished me because it looks similar to the hard

struggle I am going through for so many years now.

For me everything is hard. I have three children and if one pops up in the room

and speaks to me, then it stops what I was doing and then I can't remember. 

If someone interrupts me when I speak then " oups ! " All what I was saying is

forgotten.

Even when I am alone at home I have to concentrate hard to finish something,

sometimes I am stopped by the phone ringing or simply by my thoughts flying

away, or I just go to the toilets and then I don't finish what I was doing

before because when I left the bathroom I just got attracted to do something

else and I have forgotten what I was doing before going was not finished.

The hardest is to answer to letters and e-mails. I always remember of them when

I can't do it, and then I forget again. There are friends waiting for my answer

and I never remember to write to them when I am at the computer.

The most hard for me is to deal with all administrative papers.

Now let's speak about my BDP mother. How was she ? Just the contrary. Annie

reminded me so well about my mother in her letter.

I hated to go in her house because it looks like an hotel. Unpersonnal and too

much clean. She used to throw many things to the dust bin (she burned my

belongings few times without my consent). She has no couch in her living room,

only a big wood table and straight wood chairs.

I hated to stay at her home. I would take a shower and then as I know how she

is, really tidy the place. Then when I would be out she would with her husband

run into the bathroom " to clean " ! :-) They were looking at me like the stranger

in the house (not to be rude I would say " the pig " which in French means someone

dirty). 

One day I washed the dishes she was so angry after me because there was some

water on the floor. She never allowed me again to do it.

The way she washes the dishes is unbelievable. She use some paper towel and wash

them as well as they look clean, and only after she will wash them in the water.

When I was five she had in her kitchen an aluminium sink. She would dry it with

a towel until it shines. It is a kind of a cleaning dictature, and I never beard

it. 

My house is very familial, with children, people from outside say that there is

" quite a mess " but for me it is just " life " :-)

My mother was a queen and later a witch type too. 

Take very good care of yourselves.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage heartfulcourage@...>

À : WTOAdultChildren1

Envoyé le : Mercredi 18 juillet 2012 21h27

Objet : Re: bpd and add

 

Oh yeah. I understand that problem, big time. I can force myself if I really,

really, really have to, but it takes a herculean effort and only after god only

knows how much procrastinating first.

Thanks for your response.

HC

> >

> > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really, really

> struggled to start or finish anything.

> >

> > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or have

> any resources to suggest?

> >

> > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother

> was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how

much is

> add/brain related.

> >

> > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> >

> > HC

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Heartfulcourage, if you actually notice that your environment is disorganized,

I'd be suspicious of an ADD diagnosis.

Ash, I agree with everything you said. I'm not a clinician, but I have several

adult friends with ADD, and there's a very specific vibe they all have.

Sometimes I can't remember which of them had which crazy adventure. They quit

their jobs every six months with no idea what to do next, their relationships

last three weeks or less, and they miss every flight they book because they

start packing 10 minutes after it's left. They try desperately to remember to

take their Adderall every day, but they still forget. They're funny and

charming and have no emotional problems, but spending time with them somehow

makes me think of a kitten chasing six rubber balls in a bathtub. They're

cognitively incapable of planning or thinking more than 20 minutes into the

future. It's very disabling, but nothing to do with emotions.

I was diagnosed with ADD in college. One PhD, and one stable career (and no

missed flights) later, I'm convinced I didn't and don't have it. I do have a

very hard time with focused attention, I space out constantly, and

procrastinate. These aren't cognitive deficits, they're problems with staying

in the present moment. My attention doesn't bounce off the walls randomly, it

retreats from what's in front of me. I now think that this is actually

dissociation, which puts it in the PTSD realm. Mood stabilizers improve those

symptoms, but ADD meds don't.

For what it's worth, my nada is on the OCD end of things. (I also have some OCD

symptoms, in fact. So much for ADD.) Another borderline I knew was a slob and

lived in chaos, but that was because she was living crisis to crisis and didn't

have time to clean up the mess.

> >

> > Hi HC,

> >

> > Bpd and npd can both look like adhd even when they aren't (so can trauma,

stress, and lack of adequate sleep). Adhd is largely about weak attentional and

executive controls (difficulty activating or maintaining attention and

organizing one's own mental processes, making decisions, setting goals and

organizing actions to achieve them.)

> >

> > I think people with bpd and npd sometimes have weak executive controls just

because they have other priorities--like attending to emotional needs or getting

narcissistic supply, so skills like weighing pros and cons of decisions or

crafting a plan of action just get neglected and remain stunted. Npds sometimes

feel they shouldn't have to actually apply any effort to achieve their

goals--everything should be handed to them--so you do see a lot of abandoned

projects--and bpds will tend to give things up once they become disillusioned

with the new activity as a cure-all for their emotional distress.

> >

> > Impulsivity can also be a core part of adhd, and I think bpd and npd people

can be impulsive for similar reasons as those for having weak executive

controls. Restraining their impulses just doesn't seem important to them

(because they feel entitled to act on whatever they are feeling anyway), and

therefore they can't be bothered to learn how. I guess what I'm saying is

people with adhd differ in their neurocognitive functioning. People with bpd

and npd, on the other hand, are sometimes just lazy. They are like people with

fully functioning legs who can't be bothered to learn to walk and just crawl

their whole lives. This isn't to say there aren't other people with bpd/npd who

aren't highly focused and achievement oriented. Some are.

> >

> > I notice a lot of commonalities with students who seem to have indications

of emerging bpd or npd and students with diagnosed adhd--they can get very

fidgety and are easily bored, stir up drama, or behave impulsively. However,

there is a different quality to how they go about this, though. Students with

npd/bpd traits still seem much less " spacey " and more purposeful in their affect

when they are bored and off-task than kids with adhd. Also, they will usually

immediately go about seeking some kind of source of supply, soothing, or

connection to someone important when bored. It isn't random at all. Kids with

adhd may turn their attention to almost anything--the wallpaper, their paper,

something in their backpack.

> >

> > So, I think there can be an overlap of symptoms, and certainly people with

bpd and npd can have adhd as much as anyone else. On the other hand, I seem to

remember that adhd is a diagnosis of exclusion--it's inattentiveness without

another recognizable cause.

> >

> > My mother was also extremely disorganized--although she would periodically

go into flurries of organization. I never had any models or guidance at home in

how to be an organized person, and although I'm now usually quite organized, I

feel like lack of models for daily living is part of the bpd/npd legacy. It was

hard to learn how to organized my life and took me a long time. At the same

time, disorganization in my environment tends to make me really anxious--the

house always fell totally apart before my mom had psychotic breaks. So

sometimes when I'm really busy with other things and I should just let some

minor detail go, I can't because the anxiety is too troubling.

> >

> > Trauma symptoms felt to me a lot like adhd in myself. I felt really

scattered and in a fog (exactly like those adult adhd commercials) until I dealt

with more of the trauma in therapy. Medication also helped, incidentally. It

allowed me to stay focused enough that I gained some self-esteem through being

able to achieve more and also helped me to get more done in therapy. I don't

think I have any adhd symptoms anymore at all.

> >

> > It can be really hard to tease the two apart.

> >

> > Take care,

> > Ashana

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe. I

experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have been

taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief. Perhaps you

should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am glad that

you are now in your own home with your three children and that it does feel like

home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and " home like " than

sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or

have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how

much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive in

time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some internet....and

forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again ! 

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere, always

about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago that my

mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was supersticious, she

asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth time with 20 minuts, so

that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's house,

which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was 12 to live

with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays to my

mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like such a

struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I am so

scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just don't know

how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage heartfulcourage@...>

À : WTOAdultChildren1

Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

 

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe. I

experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have been

taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief. Perhaps you

should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am glad that

you are now in your own home with your three children and that it does feel like

home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and " home like " than

sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this or

have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and how

much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Hmmmmm. Interesting. I used to dissociate the messiness out of awareness to

avoid anxiety. Now I don't and it still makes me anxious, but much less so

since I have been on medication. I am finding that the more I do something

about it, the better I feel. Go figure.

HC

> > >

> > > Hi HC,

> > >

> > > Bpd and npd can both look like adhd even when they aren't (so can trauma,

stress, and lack of adequate sleep). Adhd is largely about weak attentional and

executive controls (difficulty activating or maintaining attention and

organizing one's own mental processes, making decisions, setting goals and

organizing actions to achieve them.)

> > >

> > > I think people with bpd and npd sometimes have weak executive controls

just because they have other priorities--like attending to emotional needs or

getting narcissistic supply, so skills like weighing pros and cons of decisions

or crafting a plan of action just get neglected and remain stunted. Npds

sometimes feel they shouldn't have to actually apply any effort to achieve their

goals--everything should be handed to them--so you do see a lot of abandoned

projects--and bpds will tend to give things up once they become disillusioned

with the new activity as a cure-all for their emotional distress.

> > >

> > > Impulsivity can also be a core part of adhd, and I think bpd and npd

people can be impulsive for similar reasons as those for having weak executive

controls. Restraining their impulses just doesn't seem important to them

(because they feel entitled to act on whatever they are feeling anyway), and

therefore they can't be bothered to learn how. I guess what I'm saying is

people with adhd differ in their neurocognitive functioning. People with bpd

and npd, on the other hand, are sometimes just lazy. They are like people with

fully functioning legs who can't be bothered to learn to walk and just crawl

their whole lives. This isn't to say there aren't other people with bpd/npd who

aren't highly focused and achievement oriented. Some are.

> > >

> > > I notice a lot of commonalities with students who seem to have indications

of emerging bpd or npd and students with diagnosed adhd--they can get very

fidgety and are easily bored, stir up drama, or behave impulsively. However,

there is a different quality to how they go about this, though. Students with

npd/bpd traits still seem much less " spacey " and more purposeful in their affect

when they are bored and off-task than kids with adhd. Also, they will usually

immediately go about seeking some kind of source of supply, soothing, or

connection to someone important when bored. It isn't random at all. Kids with

adhd may turn their attention to almost anything--the wallpaper, their paper,

something in their backpack.

> > >

> > > So, I think there can be an overlap of symptoms, and certainly people with

bpd and npd can have adhd as much as anyone else. On the other hand, I seem to

remember that adhd is a diagnosis of exclusion--it's inattentiveness without

another recognizable cause.

> > >

> > > My mother was also extremely disorganized--although she would periodically

go into flurries of organization. I never had any models or guidance at home in

how to be an organized person, and although I'm now usually quite organized, I

feel like lack of models for daily living is part of the bpd/npd legacy. It was

hard to learn how to organized my life and took me a long time. At the same

time, disorganization in my environment tends to make me really anxious--the

house always fell totally apart before my mom had psychotic breaks. So

sometimes when I'm really busy with other things and I should just let some

minor detail go, I can't because the anxiety is too troubling.

> > >

> > > Trauma symptoms felt to me a lot like adhd in myself. I felt really

scattered and in a fog (exactly like those adult adhd commercials) until I dealt

with more of the trauma in therapy. Medication also helped, incidentally. It

allowed me to stay focused enough that I gained some self-esteem through being

able to achieve more and also helped me to get more done in therapy. I don't

think I have any adhd symptoms anymore at all.

> > >

> > > It can be really hard to tease the two apart.

> > >

> > > Take care,

> > > Ashana

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Natacha, don't be scared! You're a smart, confident woman........You've

just never had anyone tell u that. Children of Borderlines have been

trained to feel insecure......for no reason other then to meet the needs of the

sick ones that tell us that we are unworthy. You are fabulous. Go for

the job. Smile and know that we are all behind you! Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 11:38:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

daszkelnatacha@... writes:

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that

here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive

in time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some

internet....and forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again !

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere,

always about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago

that my mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was

supersticious, she asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth time

with 20

minuts, so that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's

house, which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was 12

to

live with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays

to my mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like

such a struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I

am so scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just

don't know how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage _heartfulcourage@..._

(mailto:heartfulcourage@...) >

À : _WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 )

Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe.

I experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have

been taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief.

Perhaps you should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am

glad that you are now in your own home with your three children and that it

does feel like home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and

" home like " than sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this

or have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my

mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and

how much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Guest guest]

Dear Laurie,

You give me tears in my eyes !

Oh Laurie, I want so much to believe you.

Thank you for your kind, conforting words.

I feel so unworthy inside. She has broken me inside, during fourty years :-(

I will do my best. I promise you. I know I have many talents, but I am broken

inside.

Thank you all, I love you all !

Oh, what a awfull Borderland we have all lived in !

I want my kind true loving mummy I never had in all my life ! OMG ! Why we never

received this unconditional love ? This is so unfair !

Oh, I love you all ! You are like my mummies ! <3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3

Natacha

________________________________

De : " Kotchteddy@... " Kotchteddy@...>

À : WTOAdultChildren1

Envoyé le : Samedi 21 juillet 2012 0h25

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

 

Natacha, don't be scared! You're a smart, confident woman........You've

just never had anyone tell u that. Children of Borderlines have been

trained to feel insecure......for no reason other then to meet the needs of the

sick ones that tell us that we are unworthy. You are fabulous. Go for

the job. Smile and know that we are all behind you! Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 11:38:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

daszkelnatacha@... writes:

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that

here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive

in time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some

internet....and forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again !

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere,

always about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago

that my mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was

supersticious, she asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth time

with 20

minuts, so that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's

house, which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was 12

to

live with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays

to my mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like

such a struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I

am so scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just

don't know how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage _heartfulcourage@..._

(mailto:heartfulcourage@...) >

À : _WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 )

Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe.

I experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have

been taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief.

Perhaps you should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am

glad that you are now in your own home with your three children and that it

does feel like home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and

" home like " than sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this

or have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my

mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and

how much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Guest guest]

HC,

I took a long-acting stimulant as part of a mix of medications for depression.

(I didn't react well to SSRIs which are more commonly used and needed another

approach.) It helped a surprising amount--especially given the extremely low

dose I was taking. It made the world suddenly a lot more interesting. It was

like everything came out in color. I found myself looking at flowers I'd never

noticed before. I also got a lot more done both at work and at home.

I continued to take it after I stopped taking all other medications for

depression because it seemed to help with focus in a way that was different than

just depression-fog. I have no idea if I ever had adhd. I had a lot of

indications of it when I was younger, but there were just so many other

issues--including just that school was so incredibly boring to me and I didn't

find I needed to pay attention only intermittently to keep up until I was in

about 10th grade.

I can really relate to having difficulty staying focused on conversations even

when they are with people I really care about. I used to be an absolute expert

in giving the appearance of paying attention while I was a million miles away.

It doesn't happen anymore though. I don't know why. I don't think I probably

have any indication of adhd anymore at all, except I still hate paperwork of any

kind...My girlfriend actually said recently that I'm the most focused person

she's ever met.

Take care,

Ashana

[Guest guest]

Sweetie, and I do mean sweetie, you are so worthy. I can remember be

" broken " , and didn't even know at the time that there was actually a word

(broken) for how I felt. We were broken. Just knowing that can bring us

back to 'health'. You sound like a very loving person. That says it

all. You know how to love, but have never been shown love. Believe

me, you have so much to offer. The world needs people like you. We are

all broken in some way. Loving each others brokenness is what it's all

about; that's how we help each other. Love & stuff, Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 6:52:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

daszkelnatacha@... writes:

Dear Laurie,

You give me tears in my eyes !

Oh Laurie, I want so much to believe you.

Thank you for your kind, conforting words.

I feel so unworthy inside. She has broken me inside, during fourty years

:-(

I will do my best. I promise you. I know I have many talents, but I am

broken inside.

Thank you all, I love you all !

Oh, what a awfull Borderland we have all lived in !

I want my kind true loving mummy I never had in all my life ! OMG ! Why we

never received this unconditional love ? This is so unfair !

Oh, I love you all ! You are like my mummies !

<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3

Natacha

________________________________

De : " _Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) "

_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) >

À : _WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 )

Envoyé le : Samedi 21 juillet 2012 0h25

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Natacha, don't be scared! You're a smart, confident woman........You've

just never had anyone tell u that. Children of Borderlines have been

trained to feel insecure......for no reason other then to meet the needs

of the

sick ones that tell us that we are unworthy. You are fabulous. Go for

the job. Smile and know that we are all behind you! Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 11:38:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) writes:

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that

here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive

in time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some

internet....and forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again !

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere,

always about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago

that my mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was

supersticious, she asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth

time with 20

minuts, so that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's

house, which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was

12 to

live with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays

to my mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like

such a struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I

am so scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just

don't know how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage __heartfulcourage@..._

(mailto:_heartfulcourage@...) _

(mailto:_heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:heartfulcourage@...) ) >

À : __WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) )

Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe.

I experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have

been taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief.

Perhaps you should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am

glad that you are now in your own home with your three children and that

it

does feel like home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and

" home like " than sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this

or have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my

mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and

how much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Guest guest]

Dear Laurie,

Thank you so much for your kind words :-) They are always so sweet in my heart !

I want to share something incredible which happened to me today : While doing

something, I just realized that for first time, I was acting in a way to protect

myself, not to expose myself directly, and doing this in this situation, it was

the very first time in my life, I never managed before !

And you know what I thought : After these awfull 40 years alone and broken, this

is my first step to curing from my pain, my first step to a better life !!!!

I have read many books in the last years and learned a lot about them, and they

helped them somehow, but this site is gold for me : You, and all the other

supporting members, you are giving to me something my mother never gave to me,

and somehow, this caring you all give to me is starting to cure me from inside

!!!!

It is my very first step and I saw it today and I thought : " OMG ! I AM

PROTECTING MYSELF ! I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE IT ! "

I love you Laurie !!!! Thank you so much for your kind support !!!!

Have a Beautiful and Blessed Week !!!!

Natacha

XXXXX

________________________________

De : " Kotchteddy@... " Kotchteddy@...>

À : WTOAdultChildren1

Envoyé le : Lundi 23 juillet 2012 2h00

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

 

Sweetie, and I do mean sweetie, you are so worthy. I can remember be

" broken " , and didn't even know at the time that there was actually a word

(broken) for how I felt. We were broken. Just knowing that can bring us

back to 'health'. You sound like a very loving person. That says it

all. You know how to love, but have never been shown love. Believe

me, you have so much to offer. The world needs people like you. We are

all broken in some way. Loving each others brokenness is what it's all

about; that's how we help each other. Love & stuff, Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 6:52:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

daszkelnatacha@... writes:

Dear Laurie,

You give me tears in my eyes !

Oh Laurie, I want so much to believe you.

Thank you for your kind, conforting words.

I feel so unworthy inside. She has broken me inside, during fourty years

:-(

I will do my best. I promise you. I know I have many talents, but I am

broken inside.

Thank you all, I love you all !

Oh, what a awfull Borderland we have all lived in !

I want my kind true loving mummy I never had in all my life ! OMG ! Why we

never received this unconditional love ? This is so unfair !

Oh, I love you all ! You are like my mummies !

<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3

Natacha

________________________________

De : " _Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) "

_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) >

À : _WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 )

Envoyé le : Samedi 21 juillet 2012 0h25

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Natacha, don't be scared! You're a smart, confident woman........You've

just never had anyone tell u that. Children of Borderlines have been

trained to feel insecure......for no reason other then to meet the needs

of the

sick ones that tell us that we are unworthy. You are fabulous. Go for

the job. Smile and know that we are all behind you! Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 11:38:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) writes:

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that

here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive

in time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some

internet....and forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again !

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere,

always about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago

that my mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was

supersticious, she asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth

time with 20

minuts, so that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's

house, which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was

12 to

live with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays

to my mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like

such a struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I

am so scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just

don't know how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage __heartfulcourage@..._

(mailto:_heartfulcourage@...) _

(mailto:_heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:heartfulcourage@...) ) >

À : __WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) )

Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe.

I experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have

been taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief.

Perhaps you should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am

glad that you are now in your own home with your three children and that

it

does feel like home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and

" home like " than sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this

or have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my

mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and

how much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Guest guest]

Hi Natasha, The book that actually gave me the " tools " I needed to get my

life back is called " Boundaries " by Dr.'s Cloud & Townsend. It will teach

you everything we never learned growing up! Boy, that sounds wierd, but

it's true. The disfunctional ways we were taught and thought were

" normal " will be exposed and made clear to you . I highly recommend the

book.

It changed my life. Bless you. Laurie

In a message dated 7/22/2012 8:19:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

daszkelnatacha@... writes:

Dear Laurie,

Thank you so much for your kind words :-) They are always so sweet in my

heart !

I want to share something incredible which happened to me today : While

doing something, I just realized that for first time, I was acting in a way

to protect myself, not to expose myself directly, and doing this in this

situation, it was the very first time in my life, I never managed before !

And you know what I thought : After these awfull 40 years alone and

broken, this is my first step to curing from my pain, my first step to a better

life !!!!

I have read many books in the last years and learned a lot about them, and

they helped them somehow, but this site is gold for me : You, and all the

other supporting members, you are giving to me something my mother never

gave to me, and somehow, this caring you all give to me is starting to cure

me from inside !!!!

It is my very first step and I saw it today and I thought : " OMG ! I AM

PROTECTING MYSELF ! I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE IT ! "

I love you Laurie !!!! Thank you so much for your kind support !!!!

Have a Beautiful and Blessed Week !!!!

Natacha

XXXXX

________________________________

De : " _Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) "

_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) >

À : _WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 )

Envoyé le : Lundi 23 juillet 2012 2h00

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Sweetie, and I do mean sweetie, you are so worthy. I can remember be

" broken " , and didn't even know at the time that there was actually a word

(broken) for how I felt. We were broken. Just knowing that can bring us

back to 'health'. You sound like a very loving person. That says it

all. You know how to love, but have never been shown love. Believe

me, you have so much to offer. The world needs people like you. We are

all broken in some way. Loving each others brokenness is what it's all

about; that's how we help each other. Love & stuff, Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 6:52:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) writes:

Dear Laurie,

You give me tears in my eyes !

Oh Laurie, I want so much to believe you.

Thank you for your kind, conforting words.

I feel so unworthy inside. She has broken me inside, during fourty years

:-(

I will do my best. I promise you. I know I have many talents, but I am

broken inside.

Thank you all, I love you all !

Oh, what a awfull Borderland we have all lived in !

I want my kind true loving mummy I never had in all my life ! OMG ! Why we

never received this unconditional love ? This is so unfair !

Oh, I love you all ! You are like my mummies !

<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3

Natacha

________________________________

De : " __Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) "

__Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) >

À : __WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) )

Envoyé le : Samedi 21 juillet 2012 0h25

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Natacha, don't be scared! You're a smart, confident woman........You've

just never had anyone tell u that. Children of Borderlines have been

trained to feel insecure......for no reason other then to meet the needs

of the

sick ones that tell us that we are unworthy. You are fabulous. Go for

the job. Smile and know that we are all behind you! Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 11:38:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

__daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:_daszkelnatacha@...) _

(mailto:_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) ) writes:

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that

here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive

in time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some

internet....and forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again !

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere,

always about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago

that my mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was

supersticious, she asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth

time with 20

minuts, so that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's

house, which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was

12 to

live with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays

to my mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like

such a struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I

am so scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just

don't know how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage ___heartfulcourage@..._

(mailto:__heartfulcourage@...) _

(mailto:__heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:_heartfulcourage@...) )

_

(mailto:__heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:_heartfulcourage@...) _

(mailto:_heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:heartfulcourage@...) ) )

>

À : ___WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) ) _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) ) )

Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe.

I experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have

been taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief.

Perhaps you should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am

glad that you are now in your own home with your three children and that

it

does feel like home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and

" home like " than sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this

or have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my

mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and

how much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Guest guest]

Dear Laurie,

Thank you so much for this information. I am sure this book will be very

helpful, because it is always so hard for me to say " no " , I am always scared

that people will stop loving me.

I have not enough money for now to buy this book, but I have selected it on

Amazon and put it in my basket for the very next time I could buy books there !

God bless you Laurie, Have a Beautiful Week !!!! :-)

Natacha

XXXXX

________________________________

De : " Kotchteddy@... " Kotchteddy@...>

À : WTOAdultChildren1

Envoyé le : Lundi 23 juillet 2012 17h21

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

 

Hi Natasha, The book that actually gave me the " tools " I needed to get my

life back is called " Boundaries " by Dr.'s Cloud & Townsend. It will teach

you everything we never learned growing up! Boy, that sounds wierd, but

it's true. The disfunctional ways we were taught and thought were

" normal " will be exposed and made clear to you . I highly recommend the

book.

It changed my life. Bless you. Laurie

In a message dated 7/22/2012 8:19:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

daszkelnatacha@... writes:

Dear Laurie,

Thank you so much for your kind words :-) They are always so sweet in my

heart !

I want to share something incredible which happened to me today : While

doing something, I just realized that for first time, I was acting in a way

to protect myself, not to expose myself directly, and doing this in this

situation, it was the very first time in my life, I never managed before !

And you know what I thought : After these awfull 40 years alone and

broken, this is my first step to curing from my pain, my first step to a better

life !!!!

I have read many books in the last years and learned a lot about them, and

they helped them somehow, but this site is gold for me : You, and all the

other supporting members, you are giving to me something my mother never

gave to me, and somehow, this caring you all give to me is starting to cure

me from inside !!!!

It is my very first step and I saw it today and I thought : " OMG ! I AM

PROTECTING MYSELF ! I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE IT ! "

I love you Laurie !!!! Thank you so much for your kind support !!!!

Have a Beautiful and Blessed Week !!!!

Natacha

XXXXX

________________________________

De : " _Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) "

_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) >

À : _WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 )

Envoyé le : Lundi 23 juillet 2012 2h00

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Sweetie, and I do mean sweetie, you are so worthy. I can remember be

" broken " , and didn't even know at the time that there was actually a word

(broken) for how I felt. We were broken. Just knowing that can bring us

back to 'health'. You sound like a very loving person. That says it

all. You know how to love, but have never been shown love. Believe

me, you have so much to offer. The world needs people like you. We are

all broken in some way. Loving each others brokenness is what it's all

about; that's how we help each other. Love & stuff, Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 6:52:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) writes:

Dear Laurie,

You give me tears in my eyes !

Oh Laurie, I want so much to believe you.

Thank you for your kind, conforting words.

I feel so unworthy inside. She has broken me inside, during fourty years

:-(

I will do my best. I promise you. I know I have many talents, but I am

broken inside.

Thank you all, I love you all !

Oh, what a awfull Borderland we have all lived in !

I want my kind true loving mummy I never had in all my life ! OMG ! Why we

never received this unconditional love ? This is so unfair !

Oh, I love you all ! You are like my mummies !

<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3

Natacha

________________________________

De : " __Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) "

__Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) >

À : __WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) )

Envoyé le : Samedi 21 juillet 2012 0h25

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Natacha, don't be scared! You're a smart, confident woman........You've

just never had anyone tell u that. Children of Borderlines have been

trained to feel insecure......for no reason other then to meet the needs

of the

sick ones that tell us that we are unworthy. You are fabulous. Go for

the job. Smile and know that we are all behind you! Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 11:38:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

__daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:_daszkelnatacha@...) _

(mailto:_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) ) writes:

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that

here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive

in time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some

internet....and forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again !

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere,

always about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago

that my mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was

supersticious, she asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth

time with 20

minuts, so that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's

house, which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was

12 to

live with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays

to my mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like

such a struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I

am so scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just

don't know how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage ___heartfulcourage@..._

(mailto:__heartfulcourage@...) _

(mailto:__heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:_heartfulcourage@...) )

_

(mailto:__heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:_heartfulcourage@...) _

(mailto:_heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:heartfulcourage@...) ) )

>

À : ___WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) ) _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) ) )

Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe.

I experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have

been taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief.

Perhaps you should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am

glad that you are now in your own home with your three children and that

it

does feel like home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and

" home like " than sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this

or have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my

mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and

how much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> >

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Guest guest]

Hi sweetie, Oh my goodness! the one thing we never learned how to do was

say " NO " . We became people pleasers. I was not allowed to say no, ever.

Children are to be seen and not heard, was the theme in our home. Don't

cry, don't express feelings, oh, dear, the list goes on and on. Just get

the book. I'll write u later as to tid bits in it that will inspire you.

love & stuff, Laurie

In a message dated 7/23/2012 6:28:34 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

daszkelnatacha@... writes:

Dear Laurie,

Thank you so much for this information. I am sure this book will be very

helpful, because it is always so hard for me to say " no " , I am always scared

that people will stop loving me.

I have not enough money for now to buy this book, but I have selected it

on Amazon and put it in my basket for the very next time I could buy books

there !

God bless you Laurie, Have a Beautiful Week !!!! :-)

Natacha

XXXXX

________________________________

De : " _Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) "

_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) >

À : _WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 )

Envoyé le : Lundi 23 juillet 2012 17h21

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Hi Natasha, The book that actually gave me the " tools " I needed to get my

life back is called " Boundaries " by Dr.'s Cloud & Townsend. It will teach

you everything we never learned growing up! Boy, that sounds wierd, but

it's true. The disfunctional ways we were taught and thought were

" normal " will be exposed and made clear to you . I highly recommend the

book.

It changed my life. Bless you. Laurie

In a message dated 7/22/2012 8:19:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) writes:

Dear Laurie,

Thank you so much for your kind words :-) They are always so sweet in my

heart !

I want to share something incredible which happened to me today : While

doing something, I just realized that for first time, I was acting in a

way

to protect myself, not to expose myself directly, and doing this in this

situation, it was the very first time in my life, I never managed before !

And you know what I thought : After these awfull 40 years alone and

broken, this is my first step to curing from my pain, my first step to a

better

life !!!!

I have read many books in the last years and learned a lot about them, and

they helped them somehow, but this site is gold for me : You, and all the

other supporting members, you are giving to me something my mother never

gave to me, and somehow, this caring you all give to me is starting to

cure

me from inside !!!!

It is my very first step and I saw it today and I thought : " OMG ! I AM

PROTECTING MYSELF ! I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE IT ! "

I love you Laurie !!!! Thank you so much for your kind support !!!!

Have a Beautiful and Blessed Week !!!!

Natacha

XXXXX

________________________________

De : " __Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) "

__Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) >

À : __WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) )

Envoyé le : Lundi 23 juillet 2012 2h00

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Sweetie, and I do mean sweetie, you are so worthy. I can remember be

" broken " , and didn't even know at the time that there was actually a word

(broken) for how I felt. We were broken. Just knowing that can bring us

back to 'health'. You sound like a very loving person. That says it

all. You know how to love, but have never been shown love. Believe

me, you have so much to offer. The world needs people like you. We are

all broken in some way. Loving each others brokenness is what it's all

about; that's how we help each other. Love & stuff, Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 6:52:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

__daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:_daszkelnatacha@...) _

(mailto:_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) ) writes:

Dear Laurie,

You give me tears in my eyes !

Oh Laurie, I want so much to believe you.

Thank you for your kind, conforting words.

I feel so unworthy inside. She has broken me inside, during fourty years

:-(

I will do my best. I promise you. I know I have many talents, but I am

broken inside.

Thank you all, I love you all !

Oh, what a awfull Borderland we have all lived in !

I want my kind true loving mummy I never had in all my life ! OMG ! Why we

never received this unconditional love ? This is so unfair !

Oh, I love you all ! You are like my mummies !

<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3<3

Natacha

________________________________

De : " ___Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:__Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:__Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) ) _

(mailto:__Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) ) "

___Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:__Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:__Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) ) _

(mailto:__Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:_Kotchteddy@...) _

(mailto:_Kotchteddy@..._ (mailto:Kotchteddy@...) ) ) >

À : ___WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) ) _

(mailto:__WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 ) _

(mailto:_WTOAdultChildren1 _

(mailto:WTOAdultChildren1 ) ) )

Envoyé le : Samedi 21 juillet 2012 0h25

Objet : Re: Re: bpd and add

Natacha, don't be scared! You're a smart, confident woman........You've

just never had anyone tell u that. Children of Borderlines have been

trained to feel insecure......for no reason other then to meet the needs

of the

sick ones that tell us that we are unworthy. You are fabulous. Go for

the job. Smile and know that we are all behind you! Laurie

In a message dated 7/20/2012 11:38:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

___daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:__daszkelnatacha@...) _

(mailto:__daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:_daszkelnatacha@...) ) _

(mailto:__daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:_daszkelnatacha@...) _

(mailto:_daszkelnatacha@..._ (mailto:daszkelnatacha@...) ) ) writes:

Dear Hc,

Thank you for your kind message :-)

I didn't know that medication for ADD exists ! I should seek about that

here.

Another consequence of this for me is that I am late at every meeting. For

example this morning I woke up two hours before to be sure I would arrive

in time. But I had so much time left then that I did a little some

internet....and forgot the time ! And then I arrived late again !

There is I think another reason for me that I am always late everywhere,

always about with 20 minuts. I was so estonished to discover few years ago

that my mother had falsified my birthdate with exactely 20 minuts !

When she gave birth, I was born on a 13th at 0H00. As she was

supersticious, she asked the doctor if it was possible to advance my birth

time with 20

minuts, so that I would be born on 12th at 23H40 ! And he accepted !

I am always late everywhere with exactely 20 minuts, just like if it was a

silent protestation against the ugly lie she attended against me !

Isn't it incredible ?

I had the chance in my childhood that I grew up in my Grand-Mother's

house, which was quite like mine of today :-) My mother left us when I was

12 to

live with her friend. Later when I was a student I was going for holidays

to my mother's home, and never ever felt at home there !

I am so sorry for you that you experience similar things. Life is like

such a struggle to finish anything....or even to start it !

In few months I will have to find a work, and I am so scared about this. I

am so scared to be late. Here people are so judgemental with me. They just

don't know how it is !

Have a beautiful weekend and take very good care of yourself.

Natacha

XXXX

________________________________

De : heartfulcourage ____heartfulcourage@..._

(mailto:___heartfulcourage@...) _

(mailto:___heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:__heartfulcourage@...)

) _

(mailto:___heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:__heartfulcourage@...)

_ (mailto:__heartfulcourage@..._ (mailto:_heartfulcourage@...)

) )

_

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Envoyé le : Vendredi 20 juillet 2012 17h08

Objet : Re: bpd and add

Hi Natacha,

I sooooooo understand the struggles with your attention that you describe.

I experience all of those things too. Just in the very short time I have

been taking medication for ADD, I have experienced significant relief.

Perhaps you should consider this for yourself.

I am sorry your mother's home did not feel like a home to you and I am

glad that you are now in your own home with your three children and that

it

does feel like home, even if it is disorganized. Better disorganized and

" home like " than sterile and unwelcoming as far as I am concerned.

HC

> > >

> > > I am being treated for ADD. The more I learn about it, the more I

> > realize that my nada likely had it too. Our home and lives were always

> > disorganized to the point of chaos when I was growing up. She really,

really

> > struggled to start or finish anything.

> > >

> > > I am not bpd (thank goodness), but this has me wondering about the

> > connections between add and bpd. Does anyone know anything about this

or have

> > any resources to suggest?

> > >

> > > I also tend to be disorganized, but not to the same level as my

mother

> > was. Now I am also trying to sort out in my own mind how much of my

> > disorganization is learned and due to the environment I grew up in and

how much is

> > add/brain related.

> > >

> > > I welcome insights and experiences about these things.

> > >

> > > HC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

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> >

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