Re: (Slightly OT) Workplace Bully Crisis (and Long, sorry)

[Guest guest]

Im sorry this is happening but you are dealing with it quite well u have learnt

how to deal with this issue and I believe your doing the right thing. For that

nauseated feeling in your tummy and take a few big breaths like one does in yoga

and try to breath it out thats what I do when Im triggered

------------------------------

On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:43 AM AEST charlottehoneychurch wrote:

>Hi List-eners,

>

>I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to get some

perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly recommends

it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

>

>I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about difficulties with

long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think that, as KOs, we

might be more susceptible than most people to workplace bullying. I think that

may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a crisis now with a very

severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my position under difficult

circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

>

>I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my career,

but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a bully of

the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say, of the

'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at below a

level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when I've

dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two years of

having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters into my

own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover the

other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a true

bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only did she

not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of what she

pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a difficult

emotional atmosphere

that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else. Which

prejudiced my other position.

>

>I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched workplace

bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully coach at the

national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really validated me and

said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I realized, that a

non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two years. Also as

a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no notice.

>

>And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized, in my

gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me out of

the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit instead, but

with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist. Well, after

that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to need some

serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the subject of

the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several weeks off.

UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that I run my

department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for a fact

that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

>

>But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid, I was

exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

>

>And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

>

>The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own customers

will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for my exit,

and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only power she

has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but there have

been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to blame her,

not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the KO/kid thing.

I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

>

>She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by the

way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more money

than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO used

to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned. There

is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am having a

very hard time managing these intense emotions.

>

>My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying to use

that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't know if I

*can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk out on

her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

>

>Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to give

input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a workplace

bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully seeks to

dominate by force and threat.

>

>Cheers,

>A very unhappy Charlotte

>

[Guest guest]

Oh wow Charlotte, big hugs and sympathy to you. I've experienced workplace

bullying too and it is awful because it hits at the source of your stability.

I know growing up as a KO led me to not react to warning signs and to stay in a

bad situation longer than I should have - sounds like it did for you too. As a

kid the one thing we learn very very well is to ENDURE painful and upsetting

circumstances we have no control over for years on end. The idea of

encountering bad circumstances or people and immediately reacting and leaving

feels alien, not allowed, cowardly even. But normal people would and do just

high-tail it out of those situations without a second thought. Give yourself

permission to leave perhaps even faster than you've already planned - you've

endured enough.

Lobster

>

> >Hi List-eners,

> >

> >I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to get some

perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly recommends

it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

> >

> >I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about difficulties with

long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think that, as KOs, we

might be more susceptible than most people to workplace bullying. I think that

may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a crisis now with a very

severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my position under difficult

circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

> >

> >I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my career,

but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a bully of

the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say, of the

'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at below a

level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when I've

dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two years of

having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters into my

own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover the

other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a true

bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only did she

not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of what she

pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a difficult

emotional atmosphere

> that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else. Which

prejudiced my other position.

> >

> >I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched

workplace bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully

coach at the national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really

validated me and said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I

realized, that a non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two

years. Also as a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no

notice.

> >

> >And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized, in my

gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me out of

the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit instead, but

with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist. Well, after

that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to need some

serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the subject of

the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several weeks off.

UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that I run my

department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for a fact

that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

> >

> >But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid, I was

exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

> >

> >And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

> >

> >The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own customers

will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for my exit,

and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only power she

has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but there have

been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to blame her,

not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the KO/kid thing.

I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

> >

> >She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by the

way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more money

than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO used

to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned. There

is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am having a

very hard time managing these intense emotions.

> >

> >My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying to use

that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't know if I

*can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk out on

her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

> >

> >Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to give

input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a workplace

bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully seeks to

dominate by force and threat.

> >

> >Cheers,

> >A very unhappy Charlotte

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Charlotte,

I feel for you in this situation and think you have done a wonderful job of

trying to get support for yourself in this incredibly difficult situation which

speaks to your healing. I am impressed. Unfortunately (or fortunately, rather) I

do not have experience with workplace bullying, but I do know that I have a lot

of stress and anxiety related to work because of the way I grew up, like you

with no stability or consistency and always with the threat of financial doom.

When I return from vacation for two weeks I have anxiety because I have been

away and I am not sure that something for which I would be in trouble has

happened. Now I am dealing with anxiety because my boss is retiring and the

person who will take her place, while I have no problem with her, has expressed

many imo racist viewpoints, ie Congress will never support Obama because he is

black. If I have a problem with a colleague is it because they are black, she

will ask me. (I work in a predominately african american workplace, and I am

not black).

So, while you obviously have good reason to be having a ton of anxiety, issues

related to the severe bullying which is triggering (to say the least), I also

think that ask KOs we are super threatened by perceived threats to our

livelihood. I have never felt like I have had anyone to fall back on and

supported myself since I was a teenager, usually by working multiple jobs (which

I also think helped me not deal with the trauma from growing up, working all the

time). The fear when it comes to my livelihood seems almost feral (as do most

of my responses to foo issues at times).

Again, I regret that you have to go through this and hope others will have more

practical advice for you. Please keep us in the loop.

Jaleo

[Guest guest]

I agree, Charlotte: it doesn't make you a bad person, or cowardly, or unethical

to leave a bad work environment earlier than you originally planned to,

particularly since you have carefully arranged for your clients to be taken care

of already. You have gone far beyond the call of duty, it seems to me, in

making sure that everything will run smoothly in your absence so, as far as I'm

concerned you could say, " buh-bye " to this nasty boss at any time, free and

clear, with NO " FOG' " .

I found myself in that position once: having a for-real sadistic bully for a

boss. I tried to please her and make it work out, but the bullying got so bad

that it was having a negative impact on my health. I had to go on anti-anxiety

meds. But with a great deal of luck and help I managed to get myself

transferred out of there and into a really great new department.

It was one of the very, very few times in my life that I let myself really enjoy

sweet victory: I openly displayed to her how happy I was to escape. I'd

thwarted her: she'd been trying to make me quit, and we both knew it. Ha! If

you've ever seen up close and in person a tiger or other large predator behind

the bars of its cage, snarling with fury that it can't get at you and tear your

throat out... that's what her face looked like for a moment; then her mask

settled back into place.

You are the only one who can know what *you*, personally, can and can't live

with, but in my own opinion you could just walk out of there tomorrow completely

guilt free, and smiling.

-Annie

> >

> > >Hi List-eners,

> > >

> > >I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to get

some perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly

recommends it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

> > >

> > >I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about difficulties

with long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think that, as KOs,

we might be more susceptible than most people to workplace bullying. I think

that may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a crisis now with a

very severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my position under

difficult circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

> > >

> > >I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my

career, but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a

bully of the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say,

of the 'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at

below a level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when

I've dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two

years of having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters

into my own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover

the other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a

true bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only

did she not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of

what she pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a

difficult emotional atmosphere

> > that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else.

Which prejudiced my other position.

> > >

> > >I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched

workplace bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully

coach at the national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really

validated me and said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I

realized, that a non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two

years. Also as a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no

notice.

> > >

> > >And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized, in

my gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me out

of the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit instead,

but with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist. Well,

after that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to need some

serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the subject of

the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several weeks off.

UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that I run my

department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for a fact

that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

> > >

> > >But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid, I

was exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

> > >

> > >And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

> > >

> > >The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own customers

will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for my exit,

and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only power she

has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but there have

been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to blame her,

not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the KO/kid thing.

I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

> > >

> > >She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by the

way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more money

than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO used

to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned. There

is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am having a

very hard time managing these intense emotions.

> > >

> > >My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying to

use that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't know

if I *can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk out on

her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

> > >

> > >Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to

give input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a

workplace bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully

seeks to dominate by force and threat.

> > >

> > >Cheers,

> > >A very unhappy Charlotte

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much to all of you! Annie, I think your story speaks to the

remarkable versatility and stamina that we have as KOs. I think that we are

more survivors than we give ourselves credit for!! It helps encourage me that I

too can get OUT, and have a right too. And Jaleo, your description of the

self-support instinct as 'feral' is really harrowing. I love it. I too have

been supporting myself since I was a teenager (though my FOO posed as if they

were supporting me, so noone knew, not even me). I am still paying off the

huge, huge debt that I incurred while doing that. What happened is that the

bully played on that fear, and used it to harm me in a misguided effort to keep

'control'. Just because I am very sensitive to having my financial support

taken away, that does not eliminate the bullying. That's what I kindof have to

explain to myself.

I actually had deleted this post for fear of exposure, looks like you guys are

on email option or caught it in just a few seconds!! Thanks for the

encouragement; it was much needed.

--Charlie

>

> Dear Charlotte,

>

> I feel for you in this situation and think you have done a wonderful job of

trying to get support for yourself in this incredibly difficult situation which

speaks to your healing. I am impressed. Unfortunately (or fortunately, rather) I

do not have experience with workplace bullying, but I do know that I have a lot

of stress and anxiety related to work because of the way I grew up, like you

with no stability or consistency and always with the threat of financial doom.

>

> When I return from vacation for two weeks I have anxiety because I have been

away and I am not sure that something for which I would be in trouble has

happened. Now I am dealing with anxiety because my boss is retiring and the

person who will take her place, while I have no problem with her, has expressed

many imo racist viewpoints, ie Congress will never support Obama because he is

black. If I have a problem with a colleague is it because they are black, she

will ask me. (I work in a predominately african american workplace, and I am

not black).

>

> So, while you obviously have good reason to be having a ton of anxiety, issues

related to the severe bullying which is triggering (to say the least), I also

think that ask KOs we are super threatened by perceived threats to our

livelihood. I have never felt like I have had anyone to fall back on and

supported myself since I was a teenager, usually by working multiple jobs (which

I also think helped me not deal with the trauma from growing up, working all the

time). The fear when it comes to my livelihood seems almost feral (as do most

of my responses to foo issues at times).

>

> Again, I regret that you have to go through this and hope others will have

more practical advice for you. Please keep us in the loop.

>

> Jaleo

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Charlie,

I missed your original post, but I am sorry you are going through this. Bullies

are known to prey on people they perceive as vulnerable in some way--and really

everyone has some vulnerability, so it's usually not too hard for them to find a

victim. Feeling you need to make sure you can support yourself is certainly one

vulnerability--whether it's because you have kids to support, or a sick parent,

or just feel there's no one else to fall back on. I'm definitely with you on

that.

My principal last year was a bully and singled me out because I didn't have

permanent status yet, although she periodically bullied a lot of people. It was

amazing how much my stress level decreased when she finally went ahead and just

fired me. I felt absolutely freed up and able just to concentrate on the job.

The irony is that she then found another position.

I think one thing that tends to enter into a bullying victim's mind is the

belief that you should be able to do something about the bullying, but in many

cases there isn't much recourse and definitely no way of satisfying the

bully--because the bullying is providing too great a reward to stop.

The myths in our culture tend to blame the victim--you should be able to stand

up to a bully and get them to back down, or the bully has singled you out

because you are in some way defective. But this just isn't true.

At the same time, I have no doubt that you are a highly competent person and can

find another job in a bully-free environment.

Take care,

Ashana

[Guest guest]

What's the worse that can happen - she will fire you? You are leaving anyway.

I would forward her threatening email to Human Resources and tell them you are

unable to return to work for your last few weeks due to the retaliation

behaviour of your supervisor. Tell HR you find her behaviour very threatening

and unprofessional.

I would use some other people as references. If your supervisor felt it was

okay to send the email, it is obviously okay for you to forward it to HR or

other colleagues. Good luck with your situation.

>

> >Hi List-eners,

> >

> >I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to get some

perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly recommends

it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

> >

> >I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about difficulties with

long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think that, as KOs, we

might be more susceptible than most people to workplace bullying. I think that

may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a crisis now with a very

severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my position under difficult

circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

> >

> >I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my career,

but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a bully of

the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say, of the

'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at below a

level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when I've

dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two years of

having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters into my

own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover the

other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a true

bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only did she

not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of what she

pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a difficult

emotional atmosphere

> that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else. Which

prejudiced my other position.

> >

> >I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched

workplace bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully

coach at the national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really

validated me and said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I

realized, that a non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two

years. Also as a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no

notice.

> >

> >And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized, in my

gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me out of

the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit instead, but

with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist. Well, after

that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to need some

serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the subject of

the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several weeks off.

UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that I run my

department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for a fact

that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

> >

> >But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid, I was

exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

> >

> >And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

> >

> >The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own customers

will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for my exit,

and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only power she

has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but there have

been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to blame her,

not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the KO/kid thing.

I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

> >

> >She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by the

way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more money

than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO used

to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned. There

is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am having a

very hard time managing these intense emotions.

> >

> >My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying to use

that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't know if I

*can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk out on

her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

> >

> >Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to give

input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a workplace

bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully seeks to

dominate by force and threat.

> >

> >Cheers,

> >A very unhappy Charlotte

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Ouch this is stressful! I'm glad you're getting out and I do agree that going

sooner than later could be a helpful option. I too was bullied at more than one

job and ultimately every good work-place bullying book will tell you to just

leave.

I have no doubt you will survive finally even if things change quickly as you

sound resourseful, sharp and ambitious. Keep going! If it's any consolation my

previous workplace bully actually got herself fired shortly after I left. Enough

staff had left abruptly and on bad terms because of her that it finally ended.

I also logged a lengthy file of emails, meetings and occurrances for which she

proved herself to be incompetent and dishonest. On my departure I submitted it

to the company whistleblower program and eventually something was done. I was

already gone but it made me feel good that I might have helped future and

existing employees who she might have victimized.

Always remember it's ok to just up and go when your gut tells you so! These

crazy workplace bullies are far, far too common!

[Guest guest]

From so much I have read, we KO's do not speak up when we are abused the first

time in relationships. We are so use to adapting around a situation, trying to

be a team player, that bully personalities see our vulnerability and push at us.

And most often these experiences encourage us to withdraw from people in future

situations, so that we can head off being hurt again the same way. But

withdrawal is not a good answer either.

> On Sun, Jul 22, 2012 10:43 AM AEST charlottehoneychurch wrote:

>

> >Hi List-eners,

> >

> >I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to get some

perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly recommends

it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

> >

> >I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about difficulties with

long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think that, as KOs, we

might be more susceptible than most people to workplace bullying. I think that

may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a crisis now with a very

severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my position under difficult

circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

> >

> >I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my career,

but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a bully of

the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say, of the

'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at below a

level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when I've

dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two years of

having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters into my

own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover the

other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a true

bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only did she

not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of what she

pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a difficult

emotional atmosphere

> that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else. Which

prejudiced my other position.

> >

> >I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched

workplace bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully

coach at the national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really

validated me and said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I

realized, that a non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two

years. Also as a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no

notice.

> >

> >And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized, in my

gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me out of

the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit instead, but

with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist. Well, after

that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to need some

serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the subject of

the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several weeks off.

UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that I run my

department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for a fact

that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

> >

> >But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid, I was

exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

> >

> >And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

> >

> >The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own customers

will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for my exit,

and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only power she

has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but there have

been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to blame her,

not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the KO/kid thing.

I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

> >

> >She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by the

way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more money

than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO used

to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned. There

is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am having a

very hard time managing these intense emotions.

> >

> >My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying to use

that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't know if I

*can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk out on

her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

> >

> >Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to give

input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a workplace

bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully seeks to

dominate by force and threat.

> >

> >Cheers,

> >A very unhappy Charlotte

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks echo--and here is an update for everyone. I made the necessary changes

in the workplace (ie, gave notice of resignation), and from the reaction that

ensued, I realized my boss was a narcissist. The lesson from this is--KOs,

trust your instincts!!!

The reason it all hit me was that she was so extremely hypersensitive to the

quitting being some kindof 'accusation' of her competence (even though I made

none, explicitly), and that I realized that, in four years, never once had she

admitted ANY mistake, or made ANY apology. To anyone. That I had seen.

I then realized that for four years, I have been a puppet on strings. I've had

problems with social isolation, drinking too much on occasion and eating too

much ALWAYS, wanting to hide constantly, feeling unattractive and out of control

of my appearance, feeling despair and hopelessness, not being able to CHOOSE

when I did things--such as laundry or work tasks--because I was busy recovering

from whatever the latest pain was she had inflicted. But because she was

masking it, and because I was so USED to Cluster B (npd/borderline/histrionic)

pain techniques, I did not recognize it. When I finally quit my job with the

'bully', only then did I realize that it was the bully who had been pulling all

these strings.

I had for some time felt fear every time I had to ask her for my paycheck (for,

she makes you ask her EVERY month), fear every time I had to ask her for any

expenses (she does not keep a standing procedure, you have to beg her for

everything, every time), fear every time I DARED to be late because I was sick

(she gave me migraines)...all this time. I thought I was just being triggered

because I was raised by a narcissist. But. I was bring triggered, because she

WAS a narcissist. Ding ding ding!!!

The lesson here is that if someone is making you sick and miserable, if you are

feeling physical discomfort at the idea of interacting with someone, you do not

have to automatically assume it is PTSD triggering, or some kindof weakness on

your part. It might just mean, you've found another borderline or npd. And,

it's ok to trust that instinct. I wish I had sooner.

--Charlie

> >

> > >Hi List-eners,

> > >

> > >I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to get

some perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly

recommends it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

> > >

> > >I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about difficulties

with long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think that, as KOs,

we might be more susceptible than most people to workplace bullying. I think

that may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a crisis now with a

very severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my position under

difficult circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

> > >

> > >I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my

career, but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a

bully of the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say,

of the 'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at

below a level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when

I've dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two

years of having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters

into my own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover

the other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a

true bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only

did she not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of

what she pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a

difficult emotional atmosphere

> > that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else.

Which prejudiced my other position.

> > >

> > >I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched

workplace bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully

coach at the national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really

validated me and said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I

realized, that a non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two

years. Also as a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no

notice.

> > >

> > >And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized, in

my gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me out

of the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit instead,

but with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist. Well,

after that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to need some

serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the subject of

the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several weeks off.

UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that I run my

department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for a fact

that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

> > >

> > >But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid, I

was exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

> > >

> > >And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

> > >

> > >The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own customers

will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for my exit,

and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only power she

has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but there have

been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to blame her,

not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the KO/kid thing.

I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

> > >

> > >She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by the

way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more money

than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO used

to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned. There

is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am having a

very hard time managing these intense emotions.

> > >

> > >My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying to

use that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't know

if I *can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk out on

her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

> > >

> > >Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to

give input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a

workplace bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully

seeks to dominate by force and threat.

> > >

> > >Cheers,

> > >A very unhappy Charlotte

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Charlie,

I am happy you have resolved your bully situation. I hope that your health

starts to get better as a result. You are nothing without your health. I know as

I am having problems with my eyesight in my left eye and driving is becoming

difficult now.

Anyway, I wanted to get your opinion on something. I had a boss that made my

life miserable in my last job. He would make me work 24/7. I could never take my

vacation. He would make me do tasks that were not needed and alienated the

client (who was internal). He would make me tell him everything I knew before a

meeting then not let me speak in the meeting. He would use what I told him like

it was his own idea. When he interviewed me, he would assault me with questions

and then not give you enough time to answer anyone question before throwing

another question at you. It seemed like he wanted to " see what you were made of "

and if you would push back on him in the interview. It was like he thrived on

this conflict. Would someone like him be considered a bully? Keep in mind, we

were working for a highly political culture where everyone was stabbing each

other in the back and people were trying to hold onto their jobs. I lost my job

shortly after I spoke to Human Resources about the things my boss was doing and

I insisted on taking my two weeks vacation at the end of the year as originally

scheduled in April of that same year.

Thanks, R

> > >

> > > >Hi List-eners,

> > > >

> > > >I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to get

some perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly

recommends it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

> > > >

> > > >I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about difficulties

with long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think that, as KOs,

we might be more susceptible than most people to workplace bullying. I think

that may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a crisis now with a

very severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my position under

difficult circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

> > > >

> > > >I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my

career, but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a

bully of the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say,

of the 'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at

below a level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when

I've dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two

years of having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters

into my own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover

the other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a

true bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only

did she not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of

what she pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a

difficult emotional atmosphere

> > > that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else.

Which prejudiced my other position.

> > > >

> > > >I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched

workplace bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully

coach at the national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really

validated me and said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I

realized, that a non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two

years. Also as a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no

notice.

> > > >

> > > >And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized,

in my gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me

out of the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit

instead, but with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist.

Well, after that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to

need some serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the

subject of the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several

weeks off. UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that

I run my department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for

a fact that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

> > > >

> > > >But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid, I

was exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

> > > >

> > > >And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

> > > >

> > > >The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own

customers will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for

my exit, and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only

power she has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but

there have been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to

blame her, not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the

KO/kid thing. I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

> > > >

> > > >She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by

the way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more

money than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO

used to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned.

There is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am

having a very hard time managing these intense emotions.

> > > >

> > > >My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying to

use that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't know

if I *can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk out on

her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

> > > >

> > > >Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to

give input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a

workplace bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully

seeks to dominate by force and threat.

> > > >

> > > >Cheers,

> > > >A very unhappy Charlotte

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

If I may chime in here? It is possible this boss might be a corporate sociopath.

They're more common than you'd think. He definitely sounds like my old boss and

no communication technique will ever change their behaviours. Those types seem

to thrive in environments where back-stabbing and ladder climbing is the norm.

Perhaps being let go was a blessing in disguise although I'm sure it was

stressful. I hope you were able to find a more suitable job with less

back-stabbing and bullying. That's no place for you!

Hugs, HF.

> > > >

> > > > >Hi List-eners,

> > > > >

> > > > >I'm in a bit of an emotional management crisis and I need to post to

get some perspective. I'm a historic member who's long been NC (and highly

recommends it!!) and who still pops up from time to time.

> > > > >

> > > > >I noticed recently that a few new posters were asking about

difficulties with long term employment or getting along with bosses. I think

that, as KOs, we might be more susceptible than most people to workplace

bullying. I think that may well be a big part of the picture. I am having a

crisis now with a very severe bully-boss who is trying to force me out of my

position under difficult circumstances, EVEN though I already QUIT.

> > > > >

> > > > >I've been fortunate enough to have not yet encountered a bully in my

career, but this one is a doozy. For several years I've had a boss who is a

bully of the 'sabotage' and 'contant critic' variety, and, most notably I'd say,

of the 'withholding resources' variety. She has kept my (Part time!) salary at

below a level that even feeds me, and then has pressured and threatened me when

I've dared to have outside work to try and cover the difference. After two

years of having five dollars at the end of each month, I decided to take matters

into my own hands, and got myself an actually meaningful part time job to cover

the other half of my time. It was at that point that I realized my boss was a

true bully who had been causing me emotional and physcial problems. Not only

did she not support the second job (which, again, I NEED, to EAT, because of

what she pays me), she pressured me and issued veiled threats and made such a

difficult emotional atmosphere

> > > > that I had no energy after my few hours with her to do ANYTHING else.

Which prejudiced my other position.

> > > > >

> > > > >I then realized that she was a bully extraordinnairre. I researched

workplace bullying, bought the book the Bully at Work, and even hired a bully

coach at the national institute of workplace bullying. The coach really

validated me and said it was one of the most severe cases she had ever heard. I

realized, that a non-KO NEVER would have put up with the treament I have for two

years. Also as a note, the last two people in my position quit working with no

notice.

> > > > >

> > > > >And that is what the boss is now trying to drive me to do. I realized,

in my gut, before it actually happened, that she was going to try to force me

out of the position (as a way to keep feeling in control perhaps?) I quit

instead, but with enough notice so that it would not hurt the office I assist.

Well, after that, it became clear that the bully was SO toxic I was going to

need some serious time off if I was to function at all. So (and this is the

subject of the crisis), I sent a message to her that I was going to need several

weeks off. UNPAID. & I gave two weeks' notice for that. I should explain that

I run my department, and I have been keeping it in tip top shape, and I know for

a fact that a few weeks off on my part will not hurt anyone.

> > > > >

> > > > >But the bully could not stand this, because, even though it was unpaid,

I was exerting control over my time. She also, as I said, has been itching for

control since I got a position that actually paid me, and has had her bully

instinct to push me out. So now, on a Saturday night, I have an extremely

threatening email, protesting about the time off, which is meant I guess to

threaten and scare me.

> > > > >

> > > > >And it does--but only because it triggers me. In my foo, my NPD father

withheld approval and resources and it was experienced as a constant existential

threat to me.

> > > > >

> > > > >The truth is, I don't need any money from her, I know that my own

customers will not be prejudiced or harmed because I've been preparing them for

my exit, and I know that my own reputation among my peers is solid. The only

power she has over me is possibly my wish to avoid a 'scandalous' exit--but

there have been so many of those from her office that everyone is starting to

blame her, not me. I am still though triggered and terrified, because of the

KO/kid thing. I've not been able to read the email. I am FREAKED OUT.

> > > > >

> > > > >She can't force me to work for no money! I am not on contact either by

the way. And frankly if push comes to shove I could wait tables and get more

money than she pays me. So why is she able to terrify me just as badly as FOO

used to? I had to order pizza--I couldn't even cook tonight as I had planned.

There is a monster in the pit of my stomach. It is very terrible, and I am

having a very hard time managing these intense emotions.

> > > > >

> > > > >My fear, is what she causes on purpose (I now know), and she is trying

to use that to feel in control again. I know I need to sleep on it--I don't

know if I *can sleep. If I saw her right now I would be inclined to just walk

out on her--which I have never done in my life (but, three people have, to her).

> > > > >

> > > > >Any input (or SUPPORT!!) would be very welcome, and I'd also be glad to

give input on similar stories, since I now understand the main motives of a

workplace bully: the workplace is a finite number of resources which the bully

seeks to dominate by force and threat.

> > > > >

> > > > >Cheers,

> > > > >A very unhappy Charlotte

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>