Guest guest Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 Hi all has anyone of you been in the situation where their nada has used the " grandparent " card by saying that " their love is the most important love and nothing can replace a graendparents love " etc etc etc, making you question your actions. i have been no contact with my nada for 3 years and diallowed my children to see her mainly for the reason if she cant have a civilised and healthy relationship with me and my spouse there is no way it would be healthy for anyones well being to see her,,,especailly my kids. i know what she is capable and i do not trust her...hell i am living proof of her over the top love antics to sudden withdrawl of it to rejection of me. i truly believe bpds are living in a different reality. any thoughts are welcome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 I would call it lying. I had a whole passel of pd grandparents and step grandparents. I only miss the 2 who were marginally sane. I haven't been even remotely in this situation (no kids, no contact with bpd mom), but I think it goes with the idea that the best lie is one said with conviction. There is no replacement for someone who really cares for a child, is consistently kind, warm, supportive, and loves the child for who they are. Anyone else is expendable. Take care, Ashana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 I'd call it delusional and an attempt to get what she wants by any means necessary. Stand strong and don't give in to the FOG. Loving grandparents are special, but a nada is not a loving grandparent. Having a grandparent's love is not the most important thing and grandparents can be replaced by other loving adults in a child's life. At 11:13 PM 08/10/2012 m19728 wrote: >Hi all has anyone of you been in the situation where their nada >has used the " grandparent " card by saying that " their love is >the most important love and nothing can replace a graendparents >love " etc etc etc, making you question your actions. i have >been no contact with my nada for 3 years and diallowed my >children to see her mainly for the reason if she cant have a >civilised and healthy relationship with me and my spouse there >is no way it would be healthy for anyones well being to see >her,,,especailly my kids. i know what she is capable and i do >not trust her...hell i am living proof of her over the top love >antics to sudden withdrawl of it to rejection of me. i truly >believe bpds are living in a different reality. any thoughts >are welcome! > -- Katrina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 10, 2012 Report Share Posted August 10, 2012 I agree with your take on just how extreme, dangerous and traumatizing bpd behaviors can be, and how much shockingly devastating emotional damage a bpd parent can do to their children. It genuinely puzzles me why bpd isn't considered a MUCH more serious mental illness than it is already, because of the bpd tendency to break with reality under stress. The term " borderline " was originally chosen because it was thought at the time that the disorder was on the " border " between neurosis and psychosis, and at least as far as my own nada's behaviors were concerned, I truly believe that was an accurate way of describing them. I truly believe that my nada was not firmly connected with reality about half the time. She really believed a lot of untrue, really negative things about other people and no real facts could sway her; that's called " paranoia " and " fixed delusional thinking. " Paranoia and delusional thinking are *part of* having a psychotic disorder, but it takes having hallucinations before a formal diagnosis of psychosis can be given. Me personally, I don't think my mother was mentally healthy enough to have been left alone to raise babies and small children unsupervised. She tried, but everything stressed her out and upset her, and she just couldn't handle being a parent. As a result my little Sister and I were severely traumatized by our nada's rages and the physical abuse and emotional abuse she doled out, nada's inconsistency and unpredictability, her perfectionism and other pd traits. No normal, relatively mentally healthy parent would leave their child alone with a pedophile as a babysitter because the child would be in great danger of being sexually abused; In my admittedly extreme view, I don't think children should be left alone with a moderately to severely-affected, untreated Cluster B pd parent because the children are in equally great danger of being emotionally or physically abused. And as we have read, the abuse really can be that bad: knife-wielding, terrorizing-the-child-to-the-point-of-ptsd level of bad. I think some individuals with bpd are at " pedophile level " of toxic, and yet mothers in particular with moderate to severe bpd are routinely left alone with their kids because " moms love their kids and wouldn't hurt them. " Well, the hundreds and hundreds of posts at this Group (and other Groups I belong to) that detail incidents of life-threatening acts of abuse, emotional and physical neglect and emotional torture aimed at their own children by bpd parents, would seem to contradict that belief. -Annie > > Hi all has anyone of you been in the situation where their nada has used the " grandparent " card by saying that " their love is the most important love and nothing can replace a graendparents love " etc etc etc, making you question your actions. i have been no contact with my nada for 3 years and diallowed my children to see her mainly for the reason if she cant have a civilised and healthy relationship with me and my spouse there is no way it would be healthy for anyones well being to see her,,,especailly my kids. i know what she is capable and i do not trust her...hell i am living proof of her over the top love antics to sudden withdrawl of it to rejection of me. i truly believe bpds are living in a different reality. any thoughts are welcome! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 11, 2012 Report Share Posted August 11, 2012 Saying one loves someone else and showing thier love has to go hand in hand for me. I think too many times I listened to the BPD rubbish and didn't pay attention to the actions. I think that it actions are the key. I would make a list of how they show love towards the grands. You might be surprised at what you find. > > Hi all has anyone of you been in the situation where their nada has used the " grandparent " card by saying that " their love is the most important love and nothing can replace a graendparents love " etc etc etc, making you question your actions. i have been no contact with my nada for 3 years and diallowed my children to see her mainly for the reason if she cant have a civilised and healthy relationship with me and my spouse there is no way it would be healthy for anyones well being to see her,,,especailly my kids. i know what she is capable and i do not trust her...hell i am living proof of her over the top love antics to sudden withdrawl of it to rejection of me. i truly believe bpds are living in a different reality. any thoughts are welcome! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 11, 2012 Report Share Posted August 11, 2012 Annie, I like that you don't sugar coat things!! Keep it up. You hit the nail on the head. > > > > Hi all has anyone of you been in the situation where their nada has used the " grandparent " card by saying that " their love is the most important love and nothing can replace a graendparents love " etc etc etc, making you question your actions. i have been no contact with my nada for 3 years and diallowed my children to see her mainly for the reason if she cant have a civilised and healthy relationship with me and my spouse there is no way it would be healthy for anyones well being to see her,,,especailly my kids. i know what she is capable and i do not trust her...hell i am living proof of her over the top love antics to sudden withdrawl of it to rejection of me. i truly believe bpds are living in a different reality. any thoughts are welcome! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 11, 2012 Report Share Posted August 11, 2012 thankyou all, i agree with all your posts and i am certain nada will not be coming around my family...even if she tries (which she has) until there is not a healthy relationship between me and her no way she will see my kids. Being a grandparent i believe is a privlege and not a right.thanks again > > > > Hi all has anyone of you been in the situation where their nada has used the " grandparent " card by saying that " their love is the most important love and nothing can replace a graendparents love " etc etc etc, making you question your actions. i have been no contact with my nada for 3 years and diallowed my children to see her mainly for the reason if she cant have a civilised and healthy relationship with me and my spouse there is no way it would be healthy for anyones well being to see her,,,especailly my kids. i know what she is capable and i do not trust her...hell i am living proof of her over the top love antics to sudden withdrawl of it to rejection of me. i truly believe bpds are living in a different reality. any thoughts are welcome! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 11, 2012 Report Share Posted August 11, 2012 Thank you. It frustrates and bewilders me to no end, to read the opinions and conclusions of the general psychiatric community AND of authors who write about bpd, that on the one hand bpd is now considered a serious neurological disorder (recent research utilizing real-time brain MRI scanning supports this conclusion) which the person with bpd has little control over due to it being a biological/organic brain-wiring problem (in the same way that Axis I disorders or mental retardation are beyond the patient's willpower to control) ... and at the very same time, just sort of ignore the corollary idea of how profoundly wrong and *DANGEROUS* it is to leave a vulnerable, helpless, trusting child in the care of someone WITH A SEVERE NEUROLOGICAL DISORDER who is highly impulsive, who can't control their roller-coaster emotions, who is easily triggered into stress or rage which then triggers paranoid and/or delusional ideation, or suicidal ideation, or self-harming behaviors; someone who cannot relate to her child as an individual, separate human being, cannot empathize with her child's needs and feelings and instead relates to her child as an object or an appendage, using the child like a pacifier to soothe the bpd's feelings of abandonment, or using the child as a human punching bag or a target to relieve the bpd's anger and stress!!!??? This is crazy-making to me. The whole issue of a person with moderate to severe untreated bpd being left alone or virtually alone: unsupervised/unmonitored to care for a child, just raises all kinds of ethical and moral issues with me. In my opinion, its the very same moral and ethical violation as leaving the child alone with a pedophile parent. They can't have it both ways: the psychiatric community and bpd apologists can't say on the one hand that the condition is neurological/organic and therefor not under the bpd's control, and then deny or just ignore the very real issue of child endangerment RE those very same bpd behaviors. That's both illogical and just... callous and irresponsible, in my opinion. OK, that's my soapbox rant for this week. -Annie > > Annie, I like that you don't sugar coat things!! Keep it up. You hit the nail on the head. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 11, 2012 Report Share Posted August 11, 2012 I think some of the people who work with mentally ill people come to feel so much connection with them that they can't see or don't care about the damage those mentally ill people are doing. " The poor BPD feels abandoned. She's mistreating her children because she's hurting inside. We need to help her feel better about herself and prevent her from feeling abandoned. " They lose track of the fact that her children are innocent victims who should be protected. At 02:28 PM 08/11/2012 anuria67854 wrote: >Thank you. It frustrates and bewilders me to no end, to read >the opinions and conclusions of the general psychiatric >community AND of authors who write about bpd, that on the one >hand bpd is now considered a serious neurological disorder >(recent research utilizing real-time brain MRI scanning >supports this conclusion) which the person with bpd has little >control over due to it being a biological/organic brain-wiring >problem (in the same way that Axis I disorders or mental >retardation are beyond the patient's willpower to control) ... >and at the very same time, just sort of ignore the corollary >idea of how profoundly wrong and *DANGEROUS* it is to leave a >vulnerable, helpless, trusting child in the care of someone >WITH A SEVERE NEUROLOGICAL DISORDER who is highly impulsive, >who can't control their roller-coaster emotions, who is easily >triggered into stress or rage which then triggers paranoid >and/or delusional ideation, or suicidal ideation, or >self-harming behaviors; someone who cannot relate to her child >as an individual, separate human being, cannot empathize with >her child's needs and feelings and instead relates to her child >as an object or an appendage, using the child like a pacifier >to soothe the bpd's feelings of abandonment, or using the child >as a human punching bag or a target to relieve the bpd's anger >and stress!!!??? > >This is crazy-making to me. The whole issue of a person with >moderate to severe untreated bpd being left alone or virtually >alone: unsupervised/unmonitored to care for a child, just >raises all kinds of ethical and moral issues with me. In my >opinion, its the very same moral and ethical violation as >leaving the child alone with a pedophile parent. > >They can't have it both ways: the psychiatric community and bpd >apologists can't say on the one hand that the condition is >neurological/organic and therefor not under the bpd's control, >and then deny or just ignore the very real issue of child >endangerment RE those very same bpd behaviors. That's both >illogical and just... callous and irresponsible, in my opinion. > >OK, that's my soapbox rant for this week. > >-Annie -- Katrina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 11, 2012 Report Share Posted August 11, 2012 It's not the same people. Judges make decisions about placement of children, not social workers or psychologists. Social workers and psychologists make recommendations, but it's not their call. It's a legal issue determined by a judge in family court who would usually prefer to be presiding over a different kind of case in a different court. The social worker involved in my case was none too pleased when I was returned to my parents. She did not make that decision. A judge did. Take care, Ashana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 12, 2012 Report Share Posted August 12, 2012 I'd call it delusional thinking. And I'd never allow it. My daughter was 5 when my mother said something nasty about me to her- nada didn't realize I was right there in the hallway listening. Yes, I was lurking because I had a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach: I was noticing nada " winding up " into her nasty self. We were supposed to stay the night, and it was bedtime, but I packed us up and we left, without any further discussion. I was NC for 10 full years beginning that night, and I didn't even know bpd/npd had names in those days. I only knew I HAD TO Protect my daughter. I agree with Annie- pd's are dangerous, and very damaging to children. > > > > Hi all has anyone of you been in the situation where their nada has used the " grandparent " card by saying that " their love is the most important love and nothing can replace a graendparents love " etc etc etc, making you question your actions. i have been no contact with my nada for 3 years and diallowed my children to see her mainly for the reason if she cant have a civilised and healthy relationship with me and my spouse there is no way it would be healthy for anyones well being to see her,,,especailly my kids. i know what she is capable and i do not trust her...hell i am living proof of her over the top love antics to sudden withdrawl of it to rejection of me. i truly believe bpds are living in a different reality. any thoughts are welcome! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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